Mormonism and Idols

The Problem of Mormon Polytheism and Idolatry

We can actually agree, he knows what modern idolatry looks like, doesn't seem to recognize that the worship of an exalted man from another planet is also idolatry.

Right.

I believe that the verses that speak about that are pertaining to, let's say, it just got really quiet in here. Oh, I feel like….

It's been quiet the whole time.

Has it?

Okay, maybe it's just my voice is so loud and it echoes. The verses that speak about there not being any gods before or after are true because the scriptures pertain to our world and, you know, the first dispensation to the last.

Where Mormon Theology Gets Its Authority

Okay, now, immediately I have to go, and exactly where do you get that?

Right.

We get it from Latter-day Revelation because we're told to believe this because it's the only way we can make this fit with the Bible because the Bible says these things and we believe something different.

So we try to limit it this way, but the problem is, how does that work? So in Isaiah 44, when God says, is there a God besides me? I know not any. On the one hand, you're going to say you're always going to be worshiping your heavenly father, but now you've got a heavenly father who isn't any longer worshiping his heavenly.

Father?

When did that stop? How is that different? Do you mean he doesn't know about this other God in another universe or somewhere else in this galaxy? He doesn't even know. He doesn't even know. How do you make this work?

God says in Isaiah 44, before me there was no God formed, there shall be none after you. Are you saying there is no God formed in this universe? Because remember, according to the book of Abraham, God lives on a planet, the circle is a star named Kolob, but he only organized this.

There had to be something before that for him to be able to organize it. So where did that come from? I mean, there are just so many problems with this idea that we're going to limit scripture so that it's denial of polytheism, a plurality of gods is only relevant to quote unquote this planet as if that would be a category.

I mean, Jeremiah chapter 10, the category was this world and the heavens and everything in it. So now there are Mormons actually buying into multiverse theory so that you can have multiple universes and have different gods out there.

So you've got one God over this universe.

Or maybe like Elohim's dad had one of those pens like a men in black, so he didn't remember at all.

Yeah, I haven't heard that one.

Deuteronomy 4 and the Limits of the “This Earth” Argument

Deuteronomy 4, 35 -39, God says, he is God alone in the heavens above and on the earth below, there is no other. So when Mormons say, well, that's of this earth, what's interesting about that is that they don't really believe that either, that he's the only God of this earth, because they believe there's three gods of this earth, three separate and distinct persons and beings, three separate gods of this earth alone, and then a limitless number before and then coming afterwards.

And so it just doesn't work. And I want to just say this very respectfully to you. When you often see Mormons try to approach, say, a text like Dr. White brought up, Isaiah 43 -10, before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

They'll say things like, well, that's speaking of idols, false gods. I actually have a video we just posted of somebody trying to use that as an answer. What I usually say is just try to patiently say, okay, let's do this.

That's not what God is actually saying there, and you can't fit that in the context of what's going on there. But let's take what your interpretation is right now, your attempt to answer, let's place it into the text for a moment, let's see if it works.

So if God is saying there, he's referring to idols, false gods, idols, let's put it in the text. Before me there was no idol formed, and neither shall there be any idol formed after me, asked the Latter-day Saint.

Have there been any idols created since the time of God speaking that in Isaiah 43 -10? So that interpretation doesn't work. A lot of times you just have to feed their interpretation into the text and ask them, does that make any sense to you?