Apologetics - with special guest Scott Weckerly

Again.

This is Apologetics Live.

To answer your questions, your host from Striving for Eternity Ministries, Andrew

Rappaport.

Good evening.

How are you, Pastor Justin?

Doing great again.

Yeah, for the second time.

Well, we forgot to hit the start button.

So, hello, everybody.

This is Pastor Justin Pierce, Anthony, Dr. Anthony Silvestro, Dentist Dr. Anthony Silvestro.

Not a real doctor.

Not a real doctor.

Pretend one.

He plays one on TV, and sometimes when you're getting political, they play one.

Scott, how do you pronounce your last name?

I don't want to wreck it.

Weckerle.

Weckerle.

See, I almost said Wickerle, so I didn't want to mess it up.

So, we've been having a blast.

I'll tell you what, this has been one crazy week for me.

We actually went to Andrew Rappaport's church on Sunday and got to be a part of his,

how do you call it?

He became an official elder at the church.

That was incredible.

I'm telling you, the pastor, the co -pastor with Andrew there, the man can preach.

I'll tell you what, I just sat and listened to probably, let's see, 9 to 1230.

I listened to three and a half hours of just wonderful, wonderful preaching.

And so, those guys are in store for some great truth.

But we had a blast with that.

We got to go to Hershey Park in Hershey, Pennsylvania.

And I don't know about you guys, but I can't stand chocolate.

So, I got tortured with chocolate.

I'm not a chocolate person at all.

I'm sweet enough as it is.

And then we went to Amish country.

And man, I'll tell you, that was a blast.

So, now we're back.

Yeah.

So, I saw our first question already from Ethan.

Yeah.

Well, first was a comment.

He got tired of us talking about Mike Reed.

Ethan, I'm tired of it too.

I cannot stand talking about it.

I really wish that he and his elders would repent and resign and allow

the people that are attending his cult, be able to leave and go find a real church to go to

and start getting healed from all the abuse that they've taken.

So, yeah, I hope that we can stop talking about this forever at some point here real soon.

And then you also asked the question, what happened last week, which I was actually going to get into.

So, I know Justin, you had a tragedy last week.

And if you wish to share, I'll let you do that here in a few moments.

But Andrew and I were with Scott here out in Boise, Idaho

last week.

And we were there for a long weekend.

And so, what's going on is, for those of you who don't know, not only do I speak for Striving Fraternity Ministries with Andrew,

I also speak for Creation Training Initiative, CTI, with Mike Riddle.

He's a fantastic creation speaker, used to speak for Ancestors in Genesis for years, and

has gone off on his own now, because he's got a heart for teaching and for training people to teach.

One of the things that's plaguing Christianity today, plaguing our churches is we don't have qualified teachers anywhere.

We don't have people who understand basic doctrine, and they're standing up in front of our kids,

barely looking at the lesson ahead of time and trying to teach kids stuff that they really have no business teaching,

honestly.

And so, Mike has set out to change Christian education.

He wants to change it in Christian schools, in churches, everywhere you possibly can.

And the only way we can do that is to get teachers trained.

So, without getting into a whole lot of Mike's background, Mike was the head trainer for

Microsoft worldwide back when they were growing exponentially in the 90s,

late 80s, early 90s, I believe is when he was there, directly reporting to Bill Gates.

He developed a training program to train their engineers worldwide, and constantly was the top trainer

within Microsoft.

He took those principles and brought them to Christianity, and to teach people how to actually teach

properly.

So, Mike brought me on about almost two years ago now into the ministry to train me up into

learning how to train others to teach.

And what this past weekend was we, he flew in around a dozen people

from around the country, of which Scott was one, Andrew was another.

So, let me make sure you guys hear this right.

Andrew was in the audience learning.

This guy was up front teaching them.

I saw a picture of you almost snoring back there, Anthony.

Actually, what it was, is I was paying attention while Mike was giving his teaching on the first day,

and Andrew wasn't paying attention, and he was instead trying to snap.

Pictures of myself and everybody else.

Yeah.

Okay.

So, I want to change the subject, but in a second, we're going to do some

advertisement stuff, but in just a second.

But I want you to think about this.

I saw a whole bunch of controversy going on Facebook.

It got really serious.

I mean, it got to the point where I thought it was going to come to blows over this thing.

What is the deal with you feeding, getting fed by Matt Slick?

What is going on with this?

I mean, it was terrifying.

I thought it was going to come to, there's going to be like a ninja battle thing going on and all that.

I'm joking, by the way.

For the audio portion, this is all facetious.

If you guys don't know, there's been an ongoing war with Matt Slick and Andrew Rappaport for

it seems like years now that Matt Slick has been trying to outdo him,

Andrew, by getting dinner for him.

And then next thing you know, I see this thing, oh, he got him, he got him.

And I.

Thought, oh no, this is not going to go good.

Yeah.

Andrew still doesn't want to admit to it.

So, what happened was Matt actually, you know, Matt Slick is in the Boise area and he had a CARM meeting

on Monday after this following weekend.

So, two of his board members were staying with him all weekend.

And we invited them to come to the course as well to see the type of teaching we do.

And, you know, Matt Slick is a guy who he is, he's not an evolutionist, but he's never studied out

age of the earth stuff.

So, it gave us an opportunity to talk to him a little bit more about age of the earth.

But anyways, he was there at the conference.

I hung out with him most of the day, Saturday and Saturday evening after the conference was over.

Had a great time talking.

I will say Matt Slick is a young earth creationist.

He does believe in young earth.

So, I'm glad to see that.

He's a biblical creationist is what you're saying.

So, he's a biblical creationist, exactly.

He's not a heretic.

So, we're going to get some articles up on his website here real soon that I'll probably coauthor with him or

something so that his position is clearly delineated on there.

But so, what you're bringing up is dinner.

Several of us went out to dinner.

We went to Mongolian Barbecue Place.

And I viewed this as an official striving for eternity event on Saturday evening.

I was there representing Striving for Eternity.

So, I was going to pay for Matt Slick's dinner as part of Striving for Eternity.

Well, Matt beat me to the punch.

And Matt ended up paying.

And so, in paying for my dinner, it really is imputed onto Andrew

that he actually paid for Andrew for dinner.

So, that's what happened.

Yeah, because it was official Striving for Eternity.

Matt beat me.

Ended up being paid for by Carm instead.

So, yeah, that counts.

And I would say that if we take the votes on Facebook, most of the people would agree with me and Matt.

Yeah.

So, that's what happened there.

Yeah.

But in all seriousness, before we get to Scott here, one of the things we've talked

about earlier, I know you're good friends with Sean Wah.

Oh, yeah.

And we are as well.

Love Sean.

Great brother.

Solid guy theologically.

Also, I think has the right view in terms of the understanding of politically what we're supposed to be doing

this November.

And so, we did a show with him back in, I want to say, February or March with Sean.

I'm going to plan on having him again sometime maybe in October before the election.

But I also received another phone call.

Somebody else who is very much on the side of where we would sit is

Pastor Chuck O 'Neill.

And so, you know, Pastor Chuck gave me a phone call, I don't know, three or four days

ago now because he saw comments I made on a Facebook thread.

Like four years ago, there is some Christians who say, you know, I can't vote for, I can't

vote for obviously Biden, right?

I get that.

They also say I can't vote against my conscious and vote for Trump.

They don't like the lesser of two evils argument.

I think it's the correct argument.

I'm not going to talk about that today necessarily.

We're going to do that on some future shows coming up here soon.

But having said all that, he was interested about a comment I made because like four years ago, there were

people that were propping up a guy named Tom Hoefling for president.

And they say he's an ardent anti -abortionist, Christian, all kinds of things.

But the thing that disturbed me four years ago when I was making the arguments for Trump, not really because I

believe he's a Christian, I don't, but because I think he protects the Christian worldview better than the other main candidate at the time, Hillary

Clinton.

I feel the exact same way today, that he is the better of the two options to protect the Christian worldview.

And he's electable.

So that's why I think we as Christians need to vote for Trump.

Having said that, Tom Hoefling was around, people said you need to vote for him.

He seems to be a standup guy.

So the researcher in me decided to research Tom Hoefling.

Nowhere on his page do you see where he goes to church.

Nowhere on his page do you see what his beliefs are as a Christian, nothing.

Like people could research me and it would take them all about 30 seconds to know where I go to church, who my pastor's name is, who

my closest friends are.

I mean, this is not, there's nothing hidden about this.

People know my wife's not a heretic.

They know what she believes.

I mean, people know where we stand.

Well, what's interesting about Tom is that we don't know where he stands.

There's nothing that his page has labeled.

So then I went and researched who his wife was, Sienna Hoefling.

And boy, did I find out some interesting stuff.

She's a Mormon.

And when I told a few other people about this four years ago, and people started sending

messages to Tom Hoefling, Tom refused to answer the questions, at least at the time.

He refused to answer the questions.

And then his wife's Facebook account got deleted, gone.

And it remained deleted for several years.

It wasn't until I saw somebody put something on Tom Hoefling back up maybe a month ago about running

for president again, that I decided to research his page.

Nothing has changed here.

I researched Sienna's page.

It looks like her Facebook was started back up again in May, 2019.

There's nothing prior to that.

And she does nothing but pro -life, which is good, and Trump bashing, which is not

Christian -like whatsoever.

And so it's been interesting.

And as people have been increasingly putting stuff pro -Tom

Hoefling up, there's other guys who've been coming out saying the same things I have.

One of them is Pastor Chuck O 'Neill.

He saw my comment that I wrote in this one thread that his wife's a Mormon.

He hasn't answered to that.

And Chuck ended up calling me, and he put out a letter today, this afternoon.

So you saw that.

I forwarded on a number of pages already.

I think people need to read it.

And if you're going to vote for Tom Hoefling, he needs to answer some questions.

He says he's going to.

One of our friends and brothers in the Lord, Mason Goodnight, who I respect greatly,

he's a Hoefling fan.

He contacted Tom Hoefling himself and spoke to him, and Tom says he's going to come out and answer all the questions that

Chuck O 'Neill put into his letter, which addresses the same concerns I brought up, as well as many others.

So I hope that that's actually going to be the case, and then we'll see what happens from there.

It's a small world, I'll tell you that.

It certainly is.

Yeah, isn't it?

Well, you don't know how small, because my wife's family lives about 10

minutes, 10 miles or so away from the Hoeflings.

He lives in Louisville, Iowa.

And I've known Tom Hoefling for quite a long time, through Facebook and

through his first time he started going out, trying to run for president.

And let's just say the reputation, it could use some

help in his community, regardless of what everybody wants to talk

about, about what, oh, I heard him say this, I heard him say that.

You know, there's, it's a lot to be said for the people that actually know him.

And I don't know that a lot of great information about him.

I just know that the reputation as far as when I started looking into him, when he first started running, because I

lived up in the area, was not the best.

You know, it was a little, you know, of course, I mean, Trump's isn't the best either.

But, you know, I guess my concern, like yours is, if you're trying to look at the lesser of two evils

argument, and you're trying to, you know, say, oh, well, we have to have a perfect candidate.

You're not looking at a biblical perspective when it comes to the government issue.

And we can talk about that all you want.

I mean, brother, I don't know that you came on to talk about that one subject.

So I don't want to, I don't want to monopolize your time on that.

Yeah, no.

And so I wanted to bring it up to the listeners to show that we do have more to talk about than just Pastor Mike Reed,

cult leader Mike Reed, but that we are going to address this topic at some point in the near future on a couple of

different shows.

So look forward to that.

I think those will be some really good shows.

Oh, I'm sorry.

That's what I was just about to say.

Just before we jump in and get started, I do want to introduce everybody.

This is Striving for Eternity, and we're here with Striving for Eternity.

If you want to join in and ask questions, brothers, I assume that we're okay for opening up

questions for anybody wants to ask questions.

So if you want to ask questions, you can go to apologeticslive .com and just click the join in.

And you'll have to go through a little rigmarole to jump in, and we might be able to put you online here and

have a discussion with you if you want to do that.

Let's see.

We've got bills to pay with the stuff that's going on with

Striving for Eternity.

So just the outreach ministries and all the work that Striving for Eternity does, I want to invite you if you

haven't, and if you've kept up on your biblical obligations to God first and the body of

Christ as well, that if you can donate towards Striving for Eternity, we would love to see this ministry

supported as much as possible, as much as you feel that God would lead you to do that.

And if you do it right, we'll give you a prayer cloth that's got a good blessing on it.

I'm joking.

Oh, I had to put that in there.

Double it, and I'll throw some holy water in it.

Oh man, yes, some holy water.

That'll work.

That'll work.

Fresh from the Catholic church.

That's good stuff.

That's good stuff.

Thanks, Justin.

So without further ado, I want to introduce a guest and a good

friend of mine who I really enjoy talking to a lot and look forward to working with

a lot more in the future.

And so anybody who's read my book, On the Origin of Kinds, if you've gone to page

five, I think it is, and you see that there's five people listed in there who I

had read the book ahead of time, not just for editing purposes, grammar -wise, but

for the purpose of content, making sure things were buttoned up properly, that kind of stuff.

People I trusted for that.

My guest is actually one of them.

You'll see his name listed in the book, beginning of the book, as one of the primary reviewers

early on.

It's my only claim to fame.

I've got more than that.

And so where Scott and I met was, it's been seven

or eight years ago now.

It would have been 2014.

2014.

So yeah, okay.

So six and a half years then, six and a half years ago.

We met when Mike Riddle started his five -day creation training course that he does

in the summertime.

Fantastic training course.

It's one where you're not only going to learn about creation and precept apologetics at a lay level and some other current

topics in Christianity that we have known as apologists, you also will have to get up and give like four different presentations

to which you're graded in giving.

It's fantastic in terms of a course.

And so that's where I actually met Scott was we were the attendees of that first ever five -day course

way back in the day.

And it was a wonderful time of learning.

You know, we struck up a friendship.

We had a lot in common and still do.

So I've always said when people ask me who the best apologists are, I get asked

this a lot when I go speak in churches and people expect me to say some of the big names that are out there, you know, that I would

take the such and such and so and so in my corner to be the top apologist.

And I would say, you know what?

That's not true.

You know who I would take?

I would take the nobodies.

I would take people that know how to do this on a street level any day of the week.

And that's who Scott is, right?

One of those guys that can just do it at street level understands precept properly.

And yeah, so I'm very happy and honored to have Scott here.

So I don't want to tell the audience a little bit about yourself here.

Well, I'm good friends with Anthony and I'm honored to be here.

Basically, I accepted Christ when I was in about 10 years old.

And from the time I accepted Christ, I was kind of like the soldier in Scripture that said, Lord, I believe help

my unbelief because I always had some questions.

And so when I got into junior high, I had a youth pastor basically that

introduced me to the works of Josh McDowell and C .S. Lewis.

And so I just devoured that material because it was the kind of thing I was asking questions about.

Can I trust the Bible?

You know, does this make sense or am I just jumping off a bridge with a blind faith?

And so I studied those materials starting in junior high and well into high school.

And when I got into college, I was introduced to the Institute for Creation Research.

Our church at college had one of their speakers come.

And I had no idea that there were PhD scientists out there doing

research of thinking God's thoughts after him of trying to

understand how God was making the world operate.

And so I began to devour those materials.

And so if you don't mind me cutting you off, Scott, we're going to get into some of this apologetic stuff.

What I really want you to talk about right now is you're a drummer, a professional

drummer for a pretty famous guy, especially for people that are into the country music scene.

Yeah, so I've played drums

ever since I was a little kid.

And I went through the public school program of music, playing in a band, marching

band, jazz band, all those things, and went to college and studied jazz as a drummer.

I went to North Texas State, which is one of the top jazz schools in the country.

And I actually went there, actually got a jazz performance degree and moved to Nashville and worked as a

full time musician here for over 26 years.

And one of my main, I've had two main accounts while I've been here in Nashville.

One of them has been with a big band jazz band, which did a lot of convention work and concerts and things

and played four presidential inaugural balls in a row.

Hold on a second.

You played in four presidential inaugural balls?

Yeah, yeah.

Played for Bush Senior, both Clinton inaugurations and W in 2000.

That is fascinating.

I didn't even know that about you.

That's fascinating.

Yeah, of course.

So like in Washington, D .C.

In Washington, D .C., downtown.

When W was elected, I went around looking for souvenirs on the streets from the street vendors.

The last thing I got, I got one of the last T -shirts that, you know,

it was Gore Lieberman and the shirt said, sore loser man.

I've got that T -shirt hanging up downstairs.

Oh, that's great.

Yeah.

But yeah, so it was an honor to do those kinds of things.

But the other main account after I moved to Nashville was I ended up playing with a guy named Ray

Stevens, which he's a comedy guy.

Older folks would recognize him immediately, probably.

Younger folks.

Younger.

Thanks a lot.

So you recognize him, Justin?

Yeah, just a little bit.

I mean, I listen to Ray Stevens like constantly.

Yeah.

So meet his drummer.

There you go.

It's a pleasure to meet you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

So I've played with Ray.

I've done all of Ray's Nashville -based shows, and I say it that way because he spent a couple of, he did two trips out

to Branson, Missouri, where he did a sit down and I didn't play for him then because I didn't need to move to

Branson, you know.

But he always came back to Nashville, and I've done all his Nashville -based shows for over 30 years because I

started when I was two, you know.

So that's a joke, by the way, Justin.

Well, the thing is, I was about two when I started listening.

So anyway, and I still play, I still perform for Ray now.

He has built his own showroom in Nashville.

It's called the Cabaret, spelled R -A -Y, because it's Ray Stevens Cabaret.

And until COVID hit, we were doing over 100 shows a year on the weekends

right here in Nashville, which is just the ideal thing for a musician.

I haven't had to reset my drums for over two years now, you know.

Wow.

Yeah.

So that's been a lot of fun.

And he's been very kind to me, and he's just been wonderful to work with.

So.

Yeah.

That's great.

So Sumerian is asking, what is the major topic tonight?

Well, the major topic is we're talking apologetics with our guest, Scott Weckerle, tonight.

And if anybody has any questions specifically about apologetics, please type them in or come right into the

StreamYard link, and you can come on and ask live at that point.

So as I tell people about Scott and drumming for Ray Stevens, almost

everybody has the same response as what I just read here a moment ago.

Is that the squirrel guy who sings about the squirrels?

Mississippi Squirrel Revival, yes.

We play that song every night.

Every show I've done with Ray, we always finish with, it's me again, Margaret, Mississippi Squirrel.

Everything is beautiful.

And The Streak is the closer.

So I kind of know those by heart.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's great.

So let's jump into apologetics.

Of course, unless somebody has questions about Ray Stevens, please feel free to type in.

But hey, Brad, good to see you tonight, bro.

So, you know, you had it very similar to me, Scott, is that when I first got saved, quickly,

somebody shoved more than a carpenter by Josh McDowell in one hand.

I had C .S. Lewis, who now I know to be a heretic, but had a lot of good, interesting things to

say.

But C .S. Lewis's Mere Christianity shoved in my other hand.

And I read both of those books, really enjoyed them.

But and obviously, you enjoyed a lot of that stuff, too.

Oh, yeah.

Back in the day.

But, you know, we've both kind of gone through a change around six or seven years ago in

terms of apologetics methods.

Yeah, mine was actually about 10 years ago.

A little earlier.

Yeah.

It, you know, of course, through the years I had taught Bible studies and, you know, life groups and Sunday

school classes and things and, you know, had lots of discussions with non -believers

and was always kind of frustrated with the discussions because it just didn't seem to be

getting anywhere.

And so in 2010... The Mississippi Scroll Revival, he pulled it up.

Thank you.

I absolutely had to.

Is that actually going to play?

I'm going to actually have to pull it back off real quick and then...

Okay.

And in 2010, I heard Dr. Jason Lyle present a

live presentation he did, which was kind of a summary of his book called The Ultimate Proof of Creation.

And that was my introduction to presuppositional apologetics.

And it really kind of turned my world upside down because, you know, I had been studying all of the

evidential apologetics for most of my life.

You know, it was my passion on the side.

And when I was introduced to presuppositional apologetics, understanding world views on how,

you know, we all have the same evidence and we look at it differently because of our world view.

That's how we come to different conclusions.

And when I understood the presuppositions that go into a world view and how to use that in

a biblical manner when we're sharing the gospel, it was like the light bulb came

on.

And it put all the evidential apologetics in its proper place.

And it finally all made sense.

So we're going to dive into this one a little bit.

We did have Cindy ask us this question.

Can you explain what that means, apologetics?

Because there's so many names.

So, you know, so Scott, how would you define apologetics?

Well, apologetics, you know, it comes from the Greek word in the New Testament, apologia,

which means to make a reasoned defense.

And so it's the verse, 2nd Peter, right? 3

.15, 1st Peter 3 .15, where

it says sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense

for the hope that is in you to anybody that asks of you, you know, with gentleness and respect.

And so apologetics is the term that we've coined off of the Greek word apologia.

We're not making an apology for anything.

We don't have to apologize for anything unless you're rude to somebody, you know, but that's why we do it with gentleness and

respect.

That's right.

So that would be the term apologetics.

It's making a reasoned defense.

It's kind of like, you know, the idea of a lawyer in a courtroom.

He's going to defend his client and he's going to give solid reasoning behind his defense.

So that's apologetics.

Yeah, good.

Yeah, good summary of it.

And so in this apologetics, you know, you and I both spent time, you know, obviously

not even knowing one another, but spent time as we make our apologetic, make our defense of the

faith.

Yes, John, you should show up with some chickens.

That always makes the show better.

At KT and Jesus, is Andrew actually watching this?

He comes in and out as we have this on.

He's still very busy in terms of his unpacking.

His move was just made complete a little over a week ago now and is moved to Pennsylvania.

So he's moved and he's unpacking.

He's trying to get up his computer set up for his work.

Now he has his personal computer up already, but the work computers are a lot more

intense in doing.

So he's been working on that, which is why you get two good looking guys and Justin and myself

and Scott as well to hold down the show for Andrew.

You got two incredibly tan guys over here and a guy that looks like a white sheet of paper.

I actually just need to rub in some dirt or something.

I'm outside all the time and I never get as dark as you.

This is my darkest in a while.

I've been outside a lot.

I think COVID has gotten me outside a lot.

You know, everybody still buying into this ridiculous

coronavirus stuff.

I've got to play this.

So we have to give a commentary so that we don't get in trouble by YouTube.

This is the Mississippi Squirrel Revival.

And for those that don't know it, squirrels were not harmed in the

making of this video.

I want to hit this and let it play for a second, just so everybody gets a taste for it.

This is how you do apologetics, guys.

When I was a kid, I'd take a trip every summer down to Mississippi to visit my granny and her auntie.

I'd run barefoot all day long, climbing trees, free as a song.

One day, I happened to catch myself a squirrel.

Well, I stuffed him down in an old shoebox, punched a couple holes in the top.

When Sunday came, I snuck him in the church.

I sat way back in the very last pew, showing him to my good buddy Hugh.

That squirrel got loose, went totally berserk.

What happened next is hard to tell.

Some thought it was heaven, others thought it was hell.

But the fact that something was among us was plain to see.

Oh, man.

The squirrel sang, I surrender all.

The squirrel ran up hard, knew it was coveralls.

There he is!

He said, something got a hold of me!

Yeah!

That day the squirrel went berserk.

In the fierce uprights of church.

In that sleepy little town of Pascagoula.

It was a fight for survival.

That broke out in revival.

They would jump in the pews and shout hallelujah.

Well, a heart went out dancing and screaming.

Some thought he had religion, others thought he had a demon heart.

Thought he had a weedy delusion through the moons.

He fell to his knees to plead and beg, and that squirrel ran out of him.

Pricked his leg unobserved to the other side of the room.

All the way down to the amen pew.

Wish that sister birth a better view.

I always wanted to marry her.

Oh, wow.

Oh, we gotta stop.

Yeah, we might get past the copyright.

Yeah, don't go past the copyright in those two minutes.

Oh, man.

We have to critique the video, don't we?

So that we're still legal.

Well, we did.

We just said that the squirrel was...

The antichrist.

And actually the guy whose coveralls the squirrel ran up,

his name is Buddy Kalb.

And he's actually the guy who wrote the song for Ray.

Oh, really?

Yeah, that's Buddy Kalb.

He's a songwriter, wrote that hit for Ray.

And Buddy is a dear Christian brother.

Loves the Lord.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's cool.

It looks like Sean ended up coming out.

He says his personal favorite is the Shriners Convention.

I don't know that one.

Yeah, that one's kind of wild too.

Boy, where have you been?

Yeah, that was kind of wild too.

Well, man, I'm really glad to meet you.

I've listened to a lot of Ray Stevens' music.

So, I mean, this is a whole different topic, I know.

Just to get to know somebody of your stature and celebrity status.

Well, see, I'm not a celebrity.

I sit behind the guy who's a celebrity.

That's right.

Somebody has to ask for the drummer's signature, right?

Oh, from time to time.

Yeah.

That's good.

I've got a question.

I've got a question.

And dealing with apologetics.

You know, what is the route that you take when you're talking to

a nominal unbeliever?

You know, you're talking about somebody that, you know, not your Dawkins or your Hawkins or anybody else like that with

a celebrity name that's committed to their atheism, to their agnosticism.

Give me a route that you take when you're, let's say you're just talking to somebody that said, do you believe in God?

They say, well, maybe there's a higher authority, but I don't think so.

And I don't know that I've ever seen any evidence for God, blah, blah, blah.

Yeah.

So give me a kind of a route that you might take if you're talking to someone.

I'm not sure with the scenario there.

So if somebody comes up to you and says, you know, I don't believe God exists.

Yeah.

Because, I mean, you're going to hear that.

And I guess the reason I would come from that question is, you know, that's the

life we live in.

That's the America we live in.

That's the world we live in where they've without

any real insight into study, any real research in the study.

Of course, I mean, I don't know if you are, but kind of as a Calvinist, I kind of expect

that they're not going to believe, you know, as a biblical Christian, I expect that they're not going to believe

because of a hard heart, because of that heart, because they're rebelling against God from the get go.

I mean, I believe that comes down from Adam onward.

But even regardless of that, we have the, you know, the apologetic argument, you know, first Peter 3, 15, to

give a reason for the hope.

And so when I, when somebody comes to me and they ask, you know, so what's your evidence for the existence of God?

And they're asking an argument.

They're asking for a reason for the hope.

And they say, well, I don't believe in God.

Can you show me some evidence

or can you give me a reason why I should accept this hope that you're talking about?

So maybe you could kind of elaborate on something along those lines.

Yeah, well, thinking presuppositionally, you know, we know from Romans

1 that everybody knows God, you know, Romans 1 tells us that He has made

Himself known to everyone.

And so when they say they don't believe in God, they're

actually suppressing the truth of what they do know.

And we also know from Romans 2 that God has written, you know, His law into their

conscience.

So the moral law.

And so one way to look at that, you know, they say, well, I don't believe

in God.

And so one way to go at that is to just ask them...

I just drew a blank.

That's it.

Well, I usually like to ask them about the building behind them or anything, right?

And I think that's what's fascinating about presupposition.

One of the things that you really turned me on to was the Stein -Bonson debate or

Bonson -Stein debate back in the day, because this is a guy that clearly was

trying...

In a number of ways, Stein was trying to establish good and evil, right,

within the debate.

And Bonson took him to task for that.

And so why did he do that?

Why did he take him to task?

Well, he took him to task because, you know, he was making lots of knowledge claims

that his worldview couldn't back up.

You know, the fact, you know, and just like Jason Lyle's ultimate proof of creation,

the ultimate proof of creation of God's existence is that if God did not exist,

we couldn't know anything.

You know, the famous saying that, you know, I think, therefore

I am.

Jason Lyle, you know, turns that around and says, but God says, I am,

therefore you think.

Yeah, because we can't, you know, if God didn't exist, there was no way we could know anything.

You know, if we came from goo to the zoo to you, then

you start with all this material matter and then somehow you have to get consciousness.

You have to get the immaterial and you can't get immaterial

things from material things.

It's a big jump that can't happen.

And so you have to start with the immaterial God to end up with immaterial things like a conscience

and, you know, laws of logic, laws of morality, rights, any of those things that we all know

exist and we use all the time.

Yeah.

And that's, and that really is, is how we should sum up precept to anybody as we

teach it.

Right.

It's that there is the primary issue, why we use precept, the primary

issue of the unbeliever is that, is that yes, in a materialistic worldview where nothing,

nothing that's out there can be out there other than the result of material things and

chemical reactions that are just banging right for billions of years, that that

materialism can only breed more materials and that it can't account for the

immaterial, right?

That's the issue is you can't have material account for the immaterial.

And so you can't have an evolutionary worldview account for the immaterial.

Like you just said, laws of logic, ability to reason, ability to trust our senses, absolute morality,

knowledge, truth.

I mean, the list goes on.

We list hundreds of things that you can't account for in a purely materialistic worldview.

On that, I think Chicken Man is on.

Yes.

Let's hear the chicken.

Oops.

Hold on.

Let me get him on it.

I believe he's, he's muted.

All right, here we go.

Here's one dog.

Oh, wait, that's, that's not a chicken.

Oh, he ate a chicken.

He ate the chicken.

I can't believe you.

Oh, there he is.

Oh boy.

So this is living proof that God exists.

We have a chicken and a dog holding an egg.

Chicken dog.

The missing link.

Hmm.

Wow.

So which one is John's closer relative, the chicken or the dog?

Now you're just being mean.

No.

I like chickens.

I wish I had chickens running around my yard.

Hey, honey, what's for dinner?

Hold on one second.

There's a dance for this chicken too.

I remember that dance.

Yeah.

So people are bringing up, uh, Jason Lyle's fractal equations.

Yes.

That's, that's really cool.

I was a math and chemistry double major in school.

I knew about fractals back in the day.

It's, uh, it's fascinating to see, to see fractals and the way that they're, um, kind of built into

mathematics.

So it's a, it's a really neat presentation.

The, uh, Bonson, this is a, this is a great quote.

Yeah, there we go.

I suggest that we can prove the existence of God from the impossibility of the contrary.

One of my favorite quotes.

Um, great quote.

It's one that, uh, I never bring up when I'm teaching precepts because there's a lot of words in there that

can confuse people.

So.

You have to explain that quote a little bit.

It goes over everybody's head.

It does.

Yeah.

So I don't, I, I've learned not to use big words anymore.

And I'll tell you, anybody who's listening, who wants to learn how to teach at some point, get rid of the big words in your

vocabulary.

That's really important.

You know, in all these years as a dentist, I never used the big clinical terms for patients.

I would break it down into really simple words.

And I, and I use those words all the time.

So even when I'm among my colleagues, I use the simple words.

I avoid all the clearer words.

They probably look at me like I'm a schlep or something, but, uh, but I do it on purpose because I want people to actually understand.

What you're saying.

C .S. Lewis was a big fan of that too.

He said he hated words of more than two syllables.

He wanted simple language with great analogy.

Yeah.

Which is probably why he didn't.

Believe in the atonement because it's three syllables.

Oh man.

Every song is funny.

These.

Things come into my head.

It's not often.

Well, you just quoted Bonson there.

And I, I mean, I've read a lot of Bonson.

I really enjoyed the discussion and, and whatnot.

And, you know, presuppositional apologetics from the Ventilion sector sector, you know, Andrew or

Anthony, I'm sorry.

Um, you know, you and I talked about this a little bit and, um, I, I, I lean towards, you know, more of

a Clarkian point of view.

Um, so when I'm doing, you know, presuppositional.

Apologetics, go ahead.

A Clarkian.

Yeah.

Not in my vocabulary.

I know, but, but you, you said.

You're, you've got the doctor.

That's right.

You're a pretend doctor.

Exactly.

So, so he's got a doctorate in, in two, two, two syllables, uh,

language, language usage.

But, um, but if you think about it,

Clark is less than what Van Teal.

So you got less.

So we're, we're doing much better.

So think about this.

When I'm talking with someone and they say, can you prove, give me some evidence for the existence of God?

I don't have to go.

And I, and I do use, uh, every bit of the apologetic approach, but I also, I tend

to, to want to, because we are so, uh, tied in as biblical

Christians tied into the word of God is the final inerrant authority.

And we'll not let up on that.

I can go, yes, I can prove the existence of God.

Genesis one, one, you see in Genesis one, one, it says in the beginning, God, he didn't give you an

argument for God.

He gave you a factual statement about God.

And he gave his own evidential proof in his own factual writings about

himself.

And he didn't ask your opinion, if you like it or not, he said the way he did everything the way he did it.

And this is one of the reasons why I'm a six day creationist is the fact that he claimed about how

he did what he did and when he did it.

And he didn't ask us for our opinion.

And so when I talked to the, the professing atheist, of course, I always find it funny that I meet a

professing atheist that used to be a believer.

They used to believe in God.

They used to be a Christian.

And I always go back to, so when did you change your axiom?

Because the Genesis one is an axiomatic statement in the beginning, God, that

is the foundational axiom for all existence and all life.

When did you change your axiom?

So that's where I, that's where I kind of like go to this a little, you know, just kind of for the,

the information as we're talking about that.

What would you say to someone that says, well, okay, but if

God is, if God is, if God is real and he does exist and why would he allow all this

evil stuff to happen?

I know where you're going to go, but I'm just trying to lead the conversation.

That's leading the witness.

Yeah.

I know, but yeah.

Something I've discovered with that is, is a lot of times it's, it's wise to, you know, before you answer the

question, because it's pretty easy to answer, but to ask the question, you know, is there a

specific reason you've asked that question?

Because a lot of times it's somebody who's hurting and going through something.

And so we don't want to present, we just don't want to give out, you know, a cold mathematic equation kind of thing

when somebody's hurt.

And so we want to take that into account and part of the gentleness and respect of, of,

you know, defending our faith.

So, but that being said, the existence of evil,.

How did you phrase that again?

Just say something along the lines, and I've heard it said many different ways, but I'm going to ask it this way.

If God exists, then how could he allow evil or why does he allow evil into the world?

Yeah.

Yeah.

There's several ways to go about that.

One of the easiest ones is that if God

did not exist and it's, it's a totally, you know, random chance universe, then where do you

get a standard for good and evil?

Because, because if everything has just been, you know, from the goo through the zoo to you

kind of thing, we're just all rearranged pond scum.

And so at that point, what difference does it make what happens to this piece of pond scum or, or this one over here?

You know, there, there is no, there's no foundation.

There's no standard for absolute right and wrong.

And therefore there can't be any evil.

It comes down to personal preference.

Right. That's right.

Which is completely arbitrary.

And one thing I'll say is that I think that, you know, what we're seeing as a product, you know,

socialism and Marxism communism as well.

These isms, they are a by -product of an evolutionary teaching and

anti -God theology because they've, they've made nature, their God.

And so they've made nature, their God, and they're beholden to no one but themselves.

And, you know, of course we know their God is, you know, evolution.

We know that their, their preachers are Darwin and all the other ones, but their apologists

and the ones that carry out the will is the people that we're seeing today that are being

taught the doctrine of the anti -God theology.

And, and it is a theology.

It is that there is no God, but that our God is nature and we are beholden to it.

So we must support it.

We must uphold it.

We must defend it.

You know, that's why you're seeing all the things going on today.

In my opinion that you're seeing in this, in this society is destroying itself because they denied

God, they've turned their back on God and their God is literally the God of this,

this world.

It's literally the world.

Yeah.

To the point that they, that they will have, you know, they will put nature or animals ahead of

human beings.

Romans 1.

Exactly.

Yeah.

So let me actually quote that, right?

Because, you know, we all go to Romans 1 verses 18 to 20 to show that everybody knows

the true God that exists by his creation, the things that he made.

Those who don't profess him suppress the truth about him and their sin.

They're, they're going to be held without excuse, right?

We all, I think we know that we talked about that on this show a lot, but if you keep on reading, starting

in verse 21, it says this for, although they knew God, right?

God is saying for, although they knew they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in

their thinking and their foolish hearts were darkened.

Claiming to be wise, they became fools and exchange the glory of the moral God for images

resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.

So we literally see right there when they don't worship God that we're still made to worship.

So when you don't worship God, you end up worshiping something else.

You end up worshiping something in the creation.

And, uh, and yeah, so we, we see that Romans 1 and while this is probably topic for another show,

it's, it's not by mistake that when that happens in a, in a nation, when people have,

have suppressed the truth about God and started to worship other things like nature,

uh, what ends up happening next is they start to, uh, God gives them up to the lust of their hearts to

impurity, dishonor themselves, dishonor their bodies among themselves.

We continue to Romans 1.

And what do they do?

They, they end up going into sexual morality and homosexuality.

And that literally starts the entire cascade to being turned over to a completely debased

and seared conscience.

So, yeah, it's, it's, it's incredible to, to watch this.

And it's really,.

To watch this happen in our country right here.

Well, you know what I, what I find is amazing is that the atheist, the agnostic, the

God hating former believer, you know, uh, Dan Brown, all these guys, they have

no argument in a, in a pop apocalyptic world

like we're seeing right now.

They have no argument for why things are right, right, or wrong, good or bad, and why things should or should not be

happenings.

I mean, you know, you can't make a should out of an ought.

And so, so they don't have an argument for what's going on other than to say, I just don't like it

because they forfeited the truth about almighty God.

And they've, you know, take, you know, as, as John said a minute ago, they taken an, an approach that

says that they are, um, that they're, you know, they don't

have, they don't have a standard, uh, what is it?

Subjectivism.

Thank you, John.

I saw it in your eyes.

It was subjectivism is, you know, they have a subjective argument that says, you know, my opinion is

valid, but then it makes no sense to say that, that, that there, there is an

absolute right and wrong.

And so they're,.

They're living it out.

Yeah.

Well, what it comes down to is, is the fact that, you know, you asked him, well, why is it wrong?

Is, or how do you,.

Oh, hi, how you doing?

I just fell on my butt.

Flaming on the chickens.

I think he was attacked by the chickens are pushing me around.

Mutant Kung Fu chickens, huh?

Yeah.

Did you see the size of that chicken?

I couldn't believe it.

I mean, KFC would be really impressed by the size of you guys.

Ray Stevens has a song called mutant Kung Fu chickens.

You should look that one up on YouTube.

Now I lost my train of thought.

Um, so anyways, usually, uh, what happens, I hope they

clip that.

Out.

I really do.

Yeah.

We're going to clip that right out of there.

And we're probably going to.

Put that in with no babies.

Anyway.

Uh, what I was going to say is that a lot of the times they'll, whenever they are pushed

to add, I mean, when you ask them, it's like, well, why is it wrong?

Or how do you know that it's right?

Or how do you determine what's, uh,

what is wrong and right, uh, objectively.

And they will always, you know, deny that whole claim about being, there's no such thing as an objective

morality.

Um, and then usually they go by, well, whatever society says, well,

first of all, that's as a fallacy of ad populum.

Um, you can't, you know, society can't, you know, decide that because at one point it was

totally legal to have slavery, or it was also,

uh, justifiable to kill Jews.

So, I mean, and that's what the majority of the people said, and I hate to bring up the whole Hitler argument, but yeah,

um, that's usually what, uh, it comes down to.

And it usually, you know, shuts them up a little bit because you can't, uh,

they can't point to an objective source.

They never can.

I mean, they, they, all they can say is it's my preference.

It's wrong because I don't feel, uh, that it's, uh, it

doesn't, I, it's wrong because I feel that it, it is.

And, and that's, that's what it comes down to.

And so like, just what Jeff Durbin would always say, uh, you know, who was a

Vantillian or who is, uh, he said, uh, so what, you

know, what's, what's wrong with that?

Why is it, uh, acceptable for a, uh,

for Stardust to bump into another Stardust?

You know, what, what, what are you going to do about that?

I mean, it's, it, it really does get them to stop and think, I hope,

uh, that their position has no foundation.

Whatsoever.

Amen.

Well, what would you guys say about the whole Stardust issue?

I mean, you guys have heard, I mean, I'm sure you guys have heard, uh, several of the different, uh,

atheist thinkers that they, they try to now say that, you know, that you are literally Stardust, you

know, who was it that said you had Stardust from one star in one hand and then the other one, you know, don't thank

Jesus.

Don't thank Jesus.

They died for you.

Thank the stars.

Yeah.

Wasn't that Lawrence Krauss?

That was Lawrence Krauss.

Guys, when I heard that, you know, I actually was doing an apologetics teaching at church and I

actually said, I will guarantee you before too long, uh, he's going to be exposed as doing something that will be

blatant, outright sinful and is the reason for, and it did, it showed up within months that

he was, you know, doing what sexually immoral stuff with his staff.

And, um, you know, it was a me too movement kind of, you know, brought that stuff to light.

So I mean,.

Maybe that's not real bad that we got something out of it.

Yeah.

So, so I, I have an apologetics thing here.

Um, where, where did it go?

It's okay.

T and Jesus.

Um, I hope you aren't badly hurt to John.

So I just want you to know if you weren't able to watch, this is, this is the unwritten code of guys.

You first see if he was hurt.

The moment you realize he wasn't hurt, then you're allowed to laugh.

So once you see the other guy laughing, then you know, he's okay.

Yeah.

We saw him fall and then he started laughing.

His face turned red and then we knew he was fine.

And so, and so now, now we can make fun of the chicken man, the atomic apologetic

chicken man.

That's, that's the name.

Injuries to pride don't count.

Yeah.

Those don't work.

Those don't count.

So John or Justin, do you have any questions for, for Scott before I start asking him a few?

I'm gonna let you go ahead and ask some and I'll think of some questions.

I got one.

I got one for Scott.

Um, you know, Scott, uh, first of all, thanks for showing up.

I really do appreciate the time and, uh, to kind of break this down.

Um, a lot of the times, whenever I come across an atheist, you know,

basically my foundation, my, my biblical start, my axiom is going to be the word of God.

Now the, the problem is, is that they won't agree with that, with that foundation.

How, uh, how in the world can we convince them of that?

I mean, it basically, you know, they'll always dismiss anything that comes from the word of God.

If you, if you, you say, well, I get that from the Bible or God says that, um,

they're going to automatically dismiss it and just say, well, I don't believe that the Bible is,

you know, the Bible was just written by a bunch of men from the bronze age is what they always claim.

Um, so where do we go from that point?

Well, um, I've often said, you know,.

I'm sorry that you don't, you know, that you don't believe that God's word is true,

but, um, you know, the things that are true are true, whether you and I believe them or not.

And, um, God has revealed himself to us, uh, to be the truth, you know?

And so then I just continue to use scripture because I'm not going to abandon scripture.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's funny.

Votie Bachum was asked that question, right?

He says, give them a Bible verse.

And he goes, what if they tell you they don't believe the Bible?

Just give them a Bible verse, right?

Like for him, that's always fine.

Give them a Bible verse.

And I think there's a scriptural justification for this, right?

We have Hebrews 4, 12, you know, that the word of God is, is sharper than a two edged sword

splitting soul from spirit, bone from marrow.

God's word is what's effectual.

And it's going to, it's going to either draw or repel, but it's always going to be effective.

And so we always trust God's word, whether they,.

Pretend that it doesn't exist or not.

Right.

Um, and thanks.

Those are great answers.

Um, a lot of times though, they always will ask, okay, well, cite me a source

outside the Bible that is not, uh, that, that proves that Jesus existed.

And a lot of times I'll go to like Tatticus.

I go to, uh, Piney, the, the, um, the younger, the younger, and,

you know, I go to the, all these outside sources.

Um, and, and the funny thing is, is that the first thing they do is, Oh, that's not good enough.

You know, I won't accept that one.

That's not, that's not legitimate enough.

And when it comes down to is it, it shows them their heart that they don't want to know

the proof.

They don't want to see the proof.

They want to continue mocking Christians.

They want to continue mocking God.

Um, and so I always wondered, you know, have you ever used outside sources or, or have you,

I know that it can be beneficial, but I think that the Word of God is what, what cuts the soul, you know,

the, yeah.

Yeah.

Right.

Well, the, the, you know,.

A lot of times you're right.

They're not really looking for answers to their question.

And a lot of times you answer the question, they'll just say, okay, well, what about this?

Can you do this?

You know?

And, um, a lot of times it's effective to just say, so, you know, I've, I can give you

sources.

I can give you, you know, we can talk about whatever documentation you want to, but if I answer all of your

questions, will you bow down and worship Him?

That's exactly what I was about to say.

Yeah.

And usually, usually they're going to, they're going to balk at that.

And sometimes they'll outright tell you, no, I would never do that.

Well, then there's no reason to waste either of our time, you know, but that, that really brings out

what their whole motive is.

Yeah.

Are they open to the discussion or are they just trying to change your mind?

Right.

Change your mind or just waste your time and wear you down.

Exactly. Exactly.

One thing that, oh, go ahead.

I'm sorry.

All the times that, uh, that I've asked that question, you know, how much evidence would it take for you to

believe?

How much evidence would it take for you to bow to me?

Every single time I've asked that question, I've gotten nearly the same response.

And it's something to do with, there's not enough evidence, right?

Like, but at least they're honest with you right off the bat.

Yeah.

So you got chicken, brown chickens.

One tastes different.

Is that where you get dark meat from?

Dark meat and light meat.

That's exactly right.

I like the dark meat.

It tastes better, in my.

Opinion.

It's funny, um, somebody, it reminds me of an old joke.

What's the difference between an hamster and a gerbil?

And the answer is, I think the gerbil is light meat.

You think or no?

I'm not going to make any claim.

Just like the 80s.

So, so one thing that I want to kind of walk through, I don't know if anyone can see this on my phone.

Yeah.

I saw that.

Yeah.

Have you guys seen this sign around?

Like, I've seen them all over the country, everywhere I've traveled to, if you just drive around neighborhoods, this sign comes

up.

And, uh, and so I saw it again today, um, on my way to meeting up with, with

Scott here.

So I thought maybe we would walk through some of these things from an, uh, from apologetic standpoint.

So, so this person believes it says we believe black lives matter.

So now Scott, we've addressed this a couple of weeks ago, maybe a month ago, something like this.

What would you say if somebody said black lives matter?

Well, I would ask them to define what they mean, because that's a, um, it's a

loaded term because it has lots of potential meanings.

And so I I'm very big on always trying to get them to define their terms, you know, because if

you're just talking about human beings and lives matter, and just because they're black, they,

their lives matter, just like anybody else's, you know, then that's fine.

I got no problem with that.

But when you're, there's an organization called black lives matter.

And if you go to their website and look at their, um, their mission statement, what they believe and what they want

to accomplish, um, you know, it's a, it's a Marxist anti -Christian,

um, anti -American organization is what it is.

And, you know, you know, when that signs in the yard, I don't know which one they're referring to.

I can take a pretty good guess most of the time, but, you know, I would make, if I was talking with somebody and they

said that I would want.

Them to clarify what they mean.

You know, and you bring up a really interesting apologetics point here because, and this is really good for everybody listening.

I am very careful to not answer questions too fast because I've learned,

I've learned a lot over the years, but especially that almost every question you get asked from an atheist is a loaded question.

Yeah.

They're typically not honest with their questions.

And so it's good for us to ask clarifying questions, make sure we understand exactly what they mean

and exactly what they don't mean before we actually answer.

And so, yes, ask questions.

I'd rather you ask, you know, if I'm training somebody to be an apologist, I would say, ask a question every single

time somebody asks you something, just get into the habit of it.

So you, you know, what you're actually answering.

And that's huge here because you're right.

Black Lives Matter could mean, could be a number of things.

It is a loaded, loaded term.

And obviously, you know, this brings up something we, we talked about a month ago is that, is that this,

this implies racism.

It implies the issue of black versus white.

And, and in a secular worldview, the incorrect worldview in a secular worldview I can

understand why they would have racism issues.

In a Christian worldview, we only have one race.

Like it's, this is a term that doesn't make any sense within a Christian worldview, racism, because we have

one blood, one race.

And so, you know, for us, for as a, as a Christian, when we answer this question, we have to be careful in how we

answer it.

And we have to let somebody, we have to let somebody know that there, if I, if you want me to answer about Black

Lives Matter, let me tell you my position first as a Christian, what God says.

And then I can, I can attempt to answer this within your

incoherent worldview.

And so,.

So that's, that's how I would address something like that.

Yeah.

And the implied racism is there, that's there is we believe Black Lives Matter because

obviously you don't.

Exactly.

Let me ask, let me ask a question on that.

When you're talking about Black Lives Matters, would you, would you make the statement or the claim, would you

ask somebody, say, for example, when they're asking, you know, when they're saying, do you believe that Black Lives Matters?

I mean, I've heard that said many times.

I'll jump in somebody's face and they'll say that.

Would you lead off with something like, can you explain to me how any life matters or, or

why does life matter?

Would you, would you head that direction in an apologetic discussion?

Um, again, yeah.

I mean, when somebody is yelling in your face, it's, it's hard to kind of hard now to do, to do anything substantive, you know?

And so I would just default to saying,.

You know, what do you mean by that?

You know, it's crazy about your question, Justin, is that there was a picture.

I don't remember who put this up.

It might've been Bobby McCreary, uh, or another brother, but somebody put up a picture of an

abortion mill and, and the lady, one of those, one of those death squirts that was

standing there was standing in front of the abortion mill, right in front of the door.

And, and there was a sign next to her.

Guess what that sign said?

Black Lives Matter.

Are you kidding me?

This is, this is insane.

You know, we know the stats.

I think I talked about these a month ago too.

And we did the Black Lives Matter shows, you know, there's, out of all the babies that have been murdered

since 1973, 43 or 44 of them are black.

That's three times the average of what black people are versus versus all people within

society percentage wise.

So you think Black Lives Matter and yet you're killing them at a rate of three to one compared to comparatively.

It's, it really is.

It's, it's crazy.

So, okay.

Next one on the sign, we believe Black Lives Matter.

The next one is no human is illegal.

Yeah.

That's, that's, uh,.

Um, twisting, twisting the phrase.

Obviously they're referring to illegal aliens and, and the laws that we have on the books about coming

here as a legal citizen or legally visiting a country as a foreigner and all countries

have those laws, you know, but to phrase it, to say

no human is illegal implies that you're, you're, again, it's a loaded

phrase.

It's implying that you think someone does not have the right to exist because they're illegal.

And that's, that's not what the laws of this country or any other country is about.

It's about the, the correct, um, way that, that the, you know, the powers the

country has set up for someone to visit another country or, uh, immigrate to that country or whatever.

And so they're again, making it a very aggressive, um, loaded question

to try and make you, you know, be the bad guy again, because

you don't think these people have a right to exist.

And that's, that's not what the, the whole political debate is about.

I want to say that coming from an apologetic standpoint, looking at the gospel, um,

how, how can we can divert or, or shift that vitriol and

argument from, from their standpoint, their worldly point of view, because that's all they've got to

focus on.

That's all they've got in their wheelhouse.

Their entire wheelhouse is hate, anger, vitriol, bitterness.

And they're trying to pull us into that fight so that we just, we get down and dirty

with them.

And we, you know, we, we lay aside the word of God.

Now with that in mind, how do you, how do you shift that argument, that

discussion from black lives matter, blah, blah, blah.

And then the next one, you know, nobody's illegal.

I mean, I've actually heard pastors actually preach that, well, Jesus was an immigrant and he was an illegal

alien and he went to Egypt.

And, and so how can we say that?

And I actually heard that.

And I was like, man, your ex of Jesus is so bad.

I don't even know if you know what the word means.

Please stop preaching.

But, but, but how do you, how do you, you know, when you're talking with somebody and I know it's a,

it's a landmine and it's a war, a battle that we're in right now, but this is the battle we're in.

So being that it's, it's here, how do we, you know, help, you know, somebody to be ready to give

that answer?

You know, say they, you know, tomorrow morning they have, they're all going.

Nuts again.

Tomorrow morning they have, you know, sick John's chickens after him.

That's what it is.

The chickens tear him up.

So how would, how would we give that answer?

Get somebody ready.

Well, one day, one way to do that is, is to talk about how, you know,

in God's eyes, I mean, everybody is important in God's eyes.

And I don't know the passage where Paul talks about, you know, there is no difference, slave and

free and, and.

Yeah.

Well, and that really comes back to the understanding that everyone is made in the image of God.

And so the separation in scripture is, is not among races,

the separation.

And this is interesting too.

So scripture does not speak of, of many races.

There's one race that scripture does speak on the idea of different nationalities, ethnicities,

and whatnot, right?

That's, that's a scriptural concept.

And there are boundaries of nations.

We see that in scripture too.

So we, again, it's really bringing people back to what, what scripture

says.

And, and ultimately we have to trust what Romans once says that people, people know the true God that exists by his

creation.

People, I think, I think even though people believe to a degree that,

that they might be evolved from apes, that in reality, I don't think anybody actually

believes this deep down, right?

Deep down, I think they recognize we're different than the animals and it's only an extreme

rebellion and suppression of the truth.

They turn to idols, they turn to animals and whatnot.

And so I think it's our job to bring them back to gospel truth, gospel centeredness in terms

of how to view life.

And especially I like to be put tongue in cheek.

I like to point people back to the fact that if you believe in, in evolution

you don't believe in God's creating everything and designing everything.

And you don't believe that God designed humans distinct from everything else in creation.

If you don't want to believe that and instead believe in evolution, that means you have to believe that you had out of these,

whatever, whatever their apes or chimpanzees or whatever you want to call our, our

forefathers, so to speak in the evolutionary lines that you would have had four or five different

monkey type species that arose some evolutionarily higher than others.

Look, and I'm sorry, but according to time, life books and a few other resources, many other

resources back in the thirties, forties and fifties and earlier, white people evolved.

Smarter and better than everybody else.

No, you're going to be in big trouble now,.

But this is what the scientists have said, right?

I mean, I agree.

I mean, I'm not saying anything that it's not from my own heart.

This is from these resources.

Look at the subtitle of a Darwin's origin of the species.

That's right.

The preservation of favored races, right?

I mean, he bought into this and that was a hundred years before time.

My books came out with his stuff, but this is where this was a prevailing theory.

And I don't even call it a theory.

It's not a theory.

It's a hypothesis.

It's a, it's a joke, but whatever.

I mean, but it's, it was around for several hundred years by the time Darwin's book came out, that the different

colored people evolved differently.

Right.

And, and by the way, this is no different than the Mormon religion who, you know, the black people

were, were the ones that were burned that, that, that didn't follow properly.

So, you know, this, this, this all comes from, from false worldviews

and we need to, we need to call people out on this stuff.

We need to call scientists out on this stuff.

You can't, you can't pretend to believe in evolution and then somehow explain away what

evolutionary hypothesis has brought about for hundreds of years in terms of, of the speciation of

monkeys into better evolved people versus others.

I'm sorry.

It's just, you can't separate them.

So, okay, let's move on.

So if anybody has any.

Complaints, I'm trying to set this up for you.

It's complaint at Andrew Rappaport.

Slash.

Anthony Silvestro striving for eternity.

The danger with, with my rant is somebody could take that part out of context, right?

Just clip that out and make it sound really horrible.

So I better save this for future use now, this whole show in context.

Otherwise, I'm going to sound like the people that quote Philippians 4 .13 and Jeremiah 29 .11.

I have the power to do anything.

Yeah.

Watch me fly.

Okay.

So if anybody wants to come on and ask any questions, I'll just remind you, Apologetics Live, join in there.

You can come through that.

You can, we'd love to have anybody come in.

If you have any questions, comments, quips, arguments, complaints, or if you want to challenge any one of us,

you know, if you're, you're an atheist and you say, oh, I've got a better argument or whatnot.

It just, we would love to have a discussion with anybody that wants to come in.

So please come on in.

Yes, absolutely.

And you know, there's, there's supposed to be an atheist who, who, who wants to take me to task for my

debates that I've done on this show in, in recent times in the last year, who wants to

prove microevolution, which I don't have a problem with, but they want to prove how that

proves macroevolution.

So as long as they actually show up, this person is going to come onto the show the first Thursday of

September.

And we're, we're all going to get a chance to discuss this issue.

So that should be a lot of fun there.

So KT and Jesus wrote this and he made from one man, every nation of mankind to live in all the face

of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation.

So thank you for, for pulling that up.

And Scott, I don't know if you want to, if you want to talk about this year, KT also wrote a couple comments earlier.

That's a people all came from the Tower of Babel and traveled.

So, so let's, let's lay this out for people scripturally.

Where did all the nations come from?

So we see that, that in the beginning, God created, right?

We got six days of creation.

Perfect.

Adam and Eve sin, Genesis three.

We see that Andrew's flying demon babies and stuff happened in Genesis six and

world is decimated by a flood.

All life dies except those that are on the arc.

So as Noah's coming off the arc with his family, Noah's wife, their three sons, and their three wives, eight people and all the

animals come off the arc.

God repeats.

Now it says for the third time, gives them the dominion mandate.

He gave it twice in Genesis early on, and they gave the dominion mandate now for the third time here in

Genesis nine, as they're coming off the arc, multiply, fill the earth,

you know, subdue it.

And what did they do instead?

It seemed like they congregated somewhere.

Yeah.

And they, they, you know, built this tower.

I'm not sure.

I don't remember exactly what their purpose was to be like God, to reach, I guess, to reach to the

heavens or whatever.

And you know, God said, this is not a good thing.

And so he dispersed them, just divided

them up and gave them different languages.

I mean, instantaneously had different languages and could not understand each other.

And so they went off in their different groups of people and

you know, populated the earth.

Right.

Yeah.

No, perfect.

So that's right.

God came down, confused their languages, spread them all over.

And this is, this is literally the birth of different

religions, different nations, different languages that we literally can trace back to

the tower of Babel.

Now here's what's fascinating too, because we often, and I know you've heard this too, Scott, we've often

heard, and this is the answer right here, right?

We've often heard, well, you know what?

All these religions and so many different societies and nations have,

have a flood story, a flood account in them.

So many have accounts for Adam and Eve or some type of man and woman beginning being deceived by

something like a serpent.

So many different nations have different account, have an account, maybe slightly different

of a worldwide flood and an arc.

So where would all those have come from?

From tower Babel.

Right.

Right.

I mean, this is, and obviously there's, there's been one true recording of it all that has been

preserved by God.

And then there's a bunch of other versions that are not right.

Right.

And they've been.

Altered a little bit as they've been passed down and because God did not preserve them.

And so they've, they've got, some of them got some pretty weird, some weird ones.

Yeah.

I mean,.

One of the arcs was, was just a cube, just a free floating cube.

Right.

But that'd be messy.

Yeah.

Wouldn't it be bad?

I'd hate to be in that thing.

Yeah.

You know, one thing you're talking about the table of nations in Genesis 10.

I don't know if anybody's done any looking into it or not, but gotquestions .com

reasonably a good source for a lot of things.

I don't agree with them on everything, but they go through the table of nations in Genesis 10, and they actually discuss the

fact that you have 70 nations that came out of the line of Shem, Ham, and Japheth

from Genesis 10.

And they look at 26 of the 70 were descendants of Shem, 30 of the nations were

of Ham and 14 out of Japheth.

And if you think about the life expectancy of the first

human beings on earth, you think about their life expectancy and you talk about how it

is that we can biblically talk about where all the

people groups come from, from all over the world as a verse to the evolutionary

model.

And you start talking about the number of people groups and the number of offspring and other children and how

many they're having, the population and whatnot that you see today.

It coincides with what you see with Shem, Ham, Japheth, Noah

and his family and coming out of the ark and it just being eight families

or eight people coming out of this ark.

And it coincides perfectly well, but it doesn't when you start talking about millions and

millions of years of evolution that magically brought

time plus nothing, plus chance creating everything.

And I've had the argument many times that in big bang cosmology, in evolutionary

big bang cosmology, you have to have many different big bangs

to come to where you're at now.

You have to have an explosion of life after everything is magically coming to being

that perfectly fits that life.

Let's just say you had this explosion of life on earth and earth was a giant ball of fire.

How long are they gonna last?

Then you have to have an intellectual explosion and just a

multitude of different things to happen in a random chance universe that

happened without random chance, but was guided.

If you listen to the evolutionists, the atheists, how many times they tell you, but nature just

knew, nature took the course, nature knew that it was going to have to do this, nature figured

out a way.

And you hear all of this baloney and you go, no, you figured out a way to speculate because you want

to suppress the truth and.

Unrighteousness.

Yep.

That's right.

That's good.

Hey, so we believe black lives matter.

No human is illegal.

Oh, here's one of my favorite, favorite ones here.

Love is, wait, hold on one second.

Love.

Okay.

How do you define something by the same term?

Love is love.

Justin is Justin.

John's chickens are John's chickens.

What does that even mean?

What does it mean?

Yeah.

Love is, is love.

Obviously this is a big one that is shouted for anybody who goes to homosexual parades.

You will hear this a lot.

Love is love.

Love is love.

Love is love.

What do they mean by that?

Well, obviously, obviously what they want us to,

to understand is to see it from their way.

They want us to see that love is, uh, is something that they should be allowed to do.

So what they have is love and, uh, and we should leave them alone because.

Love is love, right?

Yeah.

Well, that's, that's so blatantly false.

You know, um, I love my wife.

I love my parents.

I have three daughters that I love as well, but I do not love each of them in the same way.

In fact, I'd go to jail if I did.

Yes, you will.

And I mean, it's just so easy to.

Point that out.

You know, I know, I know.

You know, it's, it's interesting too.

One of the things that I, I will do with them is I will point them back to how do you define love in the first

place?

You go back to definitions, right?

What's the definition of love?

Um, we can get an idea of it as we read first Corinthians 13 and in other areas in scripture, but

ultimately, and this is what I point out to them.

I said, the only way we can actually define love is, is presuppositionally we can only go back

to the, what was going on between a father, son, and Holy spirit from eternity past.

And that that perfect love between them is what we see, um,

a result of that we see in scripture.

And we see what God says is the greatest manifestation of that in first John four, which is

his son's death in the cross.

And so it's easy to, it's easy to use this line of reasoning with, with homosexuals as you're open or preaching,

or as you're just talking to one -on -one to say, look, this is what love is.

And God manifests that love in his son's death on the cross for sin.

You know what that includes your homosexual sin.

You know, we can, we can tie all that back together really nice.

And, uh, and I'll tell you too, I know a lot of people are intimidated with, with, uh, with all,

with a gay crowd, with homosexuals.

I will promise you that if you just get a chance to talk to them and their

emotions one -on -one or one on a couple, and their emotions died down a little bit, you can have great

conversations with them.

And a lot of them will tell you, they, they recognize it's sin.

Now, most of them don't care, but they recognize it's sin in God's eyes.

They know what God says and believes about it.

Um, there's others who are what they would say are trapped in a lifestyle that they don't know how to get out of.

I've had that.

Uh, that's been told to me before too.

Um, I'm not sure how much I believe it, but it's been told to me, uh, having said that this is the issue,

right?

We, we go back to how.

I think you were going to say something, pastor.

I was just going to ask, um, can you hear me?

Yes.

Um, okay.

I was just going to ask the question, uh, when you're talking, I heard Ray Comfort say that, you know, he doesn't address

their, their homosexuality.

Uh, and maybe he does later on.

I don't want to say that blanket that he does.

Um, but maybe it does later on.

So my question is somebody tells you that they are homosexual.

How do you address the issue?

Do, would you, would, would you say that you address the issue personally?

Um, I figured they brought it up for a reason.

We need to talk about it.

So, um, especially since the Bible does so, but I, you know, maybe you have a

different point of view on that.

Maybe you want to talk.

About that for a minute.

Yeah.

Well, I, I, I'll say this, what I, what I don't do is I'm not going to go up

to somebody and just what I would call poke them in the eye.

Right?

So I'm not going to right off the bat, um, go right after the homosexuality,

especially in a one -on -one conversation like that.

When I'm over there preaching, I'm going to address it as sin, as well as lots of other sins that people commit.

But in a conversation, yeah, you're not going to, you're not going to poke them in the eye with that one sin right off the bat.

Now I'm, I'm always going to bring it up.

I don't believe we should, we should leave it out.

And so, and so what Ray would say is that I witnessed to a homosexual the same way with anybody else.

Have you ever told a lie?

Have you ever stolen anything?

Have you ever lost it?

Right?

So he goes right on down to his normal, um, spiel is his own list.

So for me, I, I'll do similar, but, but I'm going to get to homosexuality.

I'm going to talk about sexual immorality in general.

You know, we can talk about lust because lust is something that is, is equal opportunity.

It doesn't matter, you know, whether you're straight or something else.

Um, so we can bring up lust no matter what, and we can talk about sexual morality and we can define sexual morality

right then and there.

Just talk about it's any type of sex outside of a biblical

marriage, which is one man and one woman is, is sexual morality.

So I'll usually walk into it in this manner, properly explaining, and we'll always end up

speaking on homosexuality.

So, um, from your apologetic standpoint, um,

why is homosexuality wrong or what makes it wrong?

I mean, what makes it as wrong or even more wrong?

You know, like say for example, uh, you know, just a role playing just for a moment, you know, uh, you know,

hi, I'm coming out as whatever.

And, and I, I think it might be right for me.

And I know a friend of mine who's, you know, I don't really agree with him, but he believes that,

you know, pedophilia is okay.

So what makes that wrong and why is it you want to attack us and, and not let us have,

you know, what we feel is our, our lifestyle.

Now, disclaimer, I'm not, I'm just playing the role play part.

So go ahead.

Yeah.

Well, um, I would, I would go back to, uh, Genesis basically,

you know, saying that God created us male and female, and he is the one who invented

marriage, that it's one man and one woman and, um,

you know, anything, any sexual activity outside of that covenantal relationship, he has

declared to be wrong.

And, um, I mean, that's the foundation of it.

And it's not a, you know, a personal, it, it's not a direct attack on anybody else.

And, you know, I mean, I have, you know, we all have the same problem.

You talk about lust.

Um, we all have thoughts and things, you know, action, things that we would like to do that we

should not act on.

And, you know, um, so that makes us no different than homosexual

pedophilia, anything else, you know, it all falls in the same category because it's outside of the one thing

that God has ordained.

Sexual activity to be.

Okay.

Okay.

Um, so I was going to also add that it's,

it goes against entirely what, um, the creation of God is.

I mean, what, I mean, what, it goes against everything of God's creation,

basically what it is.

And so, um, very much what you just said.

And then it's funny is that they always will bring up, you know, well, Jesus never brought up anything about homosexuality.

Um, and then, well, then I usually respond back saying, well, no, actually he defined

what marriage was when he was talking about divorce.

So, I mean, and I've had to bring this up many times where people will say, oh,

well, you know, Jesus never talked about homosexuality.

So it must be okay.

No, he always pointed right back.

He talked about sexual.

Immorality in a general sense, just like you said, which encompasses all of that activity,

you know, and that, you know, the whole idea of, you know, that's a logical fallacy called the argument from

silence that because Jesus did not specifically say the words I'm looking for, that

homosexuality is wrong, does not mean that it was not important enough to,

you know, why are you making, that's what they'll say a lot of times.

Why are you making a big deal out of something that Jesus didn't make a big deal out of?

And that's an argument from silence.

Um, you know, if you use that as a principle, there's a whole lot of things Jesus didn't talk about.

Show me where Jesus said specifically that rape was wrong or pedophilia was wrong or

terrorism was wrong or all these things.

If you're going to go down that path, then all those.

Things have to be okay as well.

Yeah.

Of course I would make the argument to them that the entire Bible is, is the word of God, that Christ is the

logos.

So I would, I would personally point back to that.

I would point back to some of the passages that, uh, my friend, John in Florida, John McKeon's brought up Romans

one and a first Corinthian six verse versus nine through 11.

That's a fantastic passage by the way, because this is a passage where, um, Paul's right at Corinthian church and

saying, and such were some of you, right?

But you were washed.

Um, and you're washing in essentially Christ's blood, right?

That you were, you were washed of this sin.

And so he's acknowledging that there were people in this crowd that once identified as homosexuals that now no longer

identify that way.

So it's a fantastic passage for us to use, but you know, there's, there's one other thing that, that, that's, uh, that's implied

in this issue of homosexuality when they, when they ask about Jesus or,

or make the claim that Jesus never addressed this is, is there something else we

needed to talk about is they're making an assumption.

Not only did Jesus not say something, but they're also making an assumption that this is

okay.

Yeah.

Right.

And so this, yeah.

So this goes back now to, to what we talked about earlier about, about standard of good and evil.

So we, we, we should ask them what is the standard of good and bad in this world?

And now it goes back to God.

Anyway, God is good.

God gets a chance to define, right?

So this, this all gets packaged together.

Be nice.

Um, incidentally, for those of you who want to know, um, Jesus was challenged in Matthew 19 and parallel verse

and Mark 10, um, by the Pharisees regarding, um, uh,

divorce and remarriage.

And that's, those are the passages that, uh, chicken man was, uh, John

was, was talking about earlier is, is, is Jesus defined marriage and how did he define

it?

Well, something Scott just said earlier, he goes back and Jesus quotes directly from Genesis one and

Genesis two, it is definition of marriage.

I'll put it on the line for you.

Thank you.

So yeah, it's, it's, it's all there for us.

And, and, uh, I will also say this for those of you who are in the Cleveland, Ohio area, we are going to

have, so the homosexual parade that normally occurs the first Saturday of June every year

has been moved to September 12th, Saturday, September 12th.

And, uh, there's going to be several people from my church and a sister church, a pastor Austin Hetzler.

Uh, so, uh, people from his church will be joining us.

And, uh, Mike Stockwell is going to be driving back into town.

He was with us for a couple of months.

He's now left for a little bit to visit some other friends.

Yes.

He's got other friends, apparently.

So, uh, so, um, Mike is going to be coming back in a town though, Lord willing, and, uh, going to preach with

us, um, on September 12th.

So if anybody else is, is around, or you need to play, you want to come up to Cleveland, need a place to stay, we'll set up

an air mattress at our house.

And, and, uh, my wife doesn't matter.

We, she doesn't care if we fill the entire house with people.

Um, and she'll feed you all.

She has a great job with that.

And, uh, we'll make sure you at least have a blanket and air mattress and, and we'll go preach all day Saturday.

So, so please come into town and bring some chickens.

You can just, you know, so if you could just let them go right inside the homosexual, uh,

parade.

So there's a parade.

And then they, when the parade, like the drop -off spot, the parade is in the homosexual festival, right

in downtown Cleveland and what we call public square, just this big grassy area.

So.

You could let the chickens run wild in there.

Um, so how are they going to justify allowing this parade to happen, knowing

that they will cause the people with the COVID, we know how

deadly it is.

It's, it's like, I mean, if you're within five miles, you don't have a mask on that's hermetically sealed and you're not in your car,

you're not hiding in six feet apart.

We know that everybody that's in that area is going to die from COVID.

So how are they justifying this?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, sarcasm.

Yeah.

Maybe, maybe it's because they identify the peaceful protest.

Yeah.

Oh, it's a peaceful protest.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So, uh, Tom bone got one of our fellow church guys.

Good to see you.

He's a, it looks like he just joined in a few moments ago.

Uh, Ethan Anthony has been hanging out with Ken Ham too much.

I think that's a compliment.

I'm going to take it that way.

Not sure what he means by that.

Um, my accent is not as cool as his, and I don't have as cool of a beard as Ken Ham, but, but I'll take it as a

compliment, Ethan.

Oh, you're going to be in Cleveland, Ohio next week.

Well, then you should call me, get ahold of me and, uh, and let's meet up at some point if you're going to be there for a little bit.

So I get back home, I think on a Monday and I'll be home for a few weeks at that point.

So it's going to have to teach you how to grow one.

Yeah, no, you know what it is is you have to convince my wife to allow me to have that.

He can grow it.

He can grow a better one than mine.

I grow pretty fast.

It's just, uh, you know, when the wife says, uh, when's it, when are you going to shave that?

Yeah.

That's, that's to get up to do it.

So, yeah, so I don't get, I don't get to, uh, to grow it too much.

And, uh, John McKeon in, uh, in Florida, I know you have an invite already, so I hope you are going to fly up

to Cleveland and spend some time with us and go out preaching.

It'd be great to preach with you again.

I, we met John a couple, it's been two summers ago, right?

Last summer, um, at Ambassadors Academy.

You were on a, on the team that was led by myself and, uh, Mr. Andrew Rappaport.

And, uh, we had a great time, uh, hanging out and whatnot.

So, uh, yeah.

That's a big brother to you.

Yes. Yes.

Who we, who, you know, all joking aside, we do actually miss a little bit, you know, it'd be nice to be popping in the

show every so often.

Okay.

Let's back to our sign.

We believe Black Lives Matter.

No human is illegal.

Love is love.

Now the next one, women's rights are human rights.

What does that mean?

I, I, I'm just reading the sign.

This is your guys' job to figure this out.

Women's rights are human.

I mean, are they, are they making sure we understand women are human?

Yeah, obviously the, the, the surface reading of it is not what's intended.

Yeah, it's not.

Yeah.

You know, women's rights is code for abortion.

Most of the time.

Oh, okay.

Okay.

I can see that.

Um, yeah, of course, then it goes back to if Black Lives Matters, does it mean it matters all the time?

You know, so if, if you're saying women's rights, talking about the abortive rights, didn't that just cancel out the

top part?

Yeah, pretty much.

I mean, that's what I'm thinking.

And of course, then we have to go back to when is it wrong to, to murder a baby?

You know, when is it wrong to murder anybody?

You know, are we talking, you know, subjectively that it's okay, as long as we have a cause?

I mean, that's why the, you saw a truck driver, uh, just a few days ago, got

yanked out of his truck, got beat almost to death.

And then a guy comes around and kicks him in the face, trying to kill him.

I had a couple of reports that they did, but they, but he didn't, um, you know, that, uh,

uh, one lady said, he yelled out all lives matters and she got shot and killed.

Uh, I mean, you have, uh, police officers that are being blinded by lasers

because somebody's life matters.

I can't figure this out.

The moral argument here only with, only withstands, uh,

scrutiny.

If there is a, uh, an absolute moral standard that everybody equally has to submit to,

I, I can't, I don't understand this.

It's, it's driving me crazy just to, to hear that, you know, that women's rights are

human rights.

Is that what that says?

Yeah.

Women's rights are human rights.

Okay.

Right.

Really strange.

Right.

I mean,.

It's vulgar.

It's blasphemy.

You know, I'm sorry.

I'm getting a little mad.

Uh, you know, this, the whole idea that you have, you have, it's okay to murder these babies

because my woman's right is more important than that baby's right.

But black lives matters.

So it's, we have to protect all women everywhere as Harris come, come, uh,

what's my Kamala Harris.

She said, we have to, we, that we have to protect all in every black life matters.

Okay.

Then we're talking about shutting down these abortion clinics because they're murdering babies by the millions.

Yeah.

We're talking about upholding life.

100%.

Yeah.

But obviously they don't mean it because they've never protested in Chicago.

Oh, man.

Yeah. Right. Yeah.

Now here's the real contradiction.

Women's rights are human rights.

What if the aborted baby was female?

Yeah. Ouch. Yeah.

That might be a problem.

So they would say that it's not human.

Yeah.

Well, that's good.

That's going to contradict.

The very next statement on the side.

Yeah.

So let's actually, let's get to that in a moment.

Two things real quick.

Um, so Ethan, uh, Cedarville university, I'm like two and a half to three hours from Cedarville

there.

That's like close to Cincinnati, Ohio.

I'm up in, up in Cleveland.

Um, just got a text message from Justin Peters who said that, uh, asked me if

I've seen this.

Um, so if, for those of you who know, um, who this Cervetus Christie guy is or

service Christie guy, um, he's been a real thorn in the side of a lot of people thinking is exposing

people for being heretics.

And, uh, he doesn't go to church, hasn't gone to church in years, thinks he's above church and pastors and, and

any accountability.

Well, uh, he, I, I got inside word already that, um, there's going to be

something major coming out about him on Monday by none other than Jordan hall.

And so, um, I, I know I'm privy to this, uh, to what's going on.

And, uh, this guy has been doing some pretty not so nice things.

I mean, we know the nice, not, not nice things he's been doing to brothers in Christ, right.

In trying to call out Justin and others, but

when Jordan hall is releasing something about.

Service Christie, just Peter, he put an article out today

regarding, um, uh, he, it was a very, um, surface type thing about service Christie

today.

And, uh, talked about how service Christie, um, went after Jordan and

somehow as story goes, somebody that service Christie knows is good friends with

that works with him.

Um, got into Jordan's inner circle, ended up threatening his wife, kids.

And, uh, Jordan had to take this guy.

Yeah.

Call the police, took this guy to court.

And he's, and this guy has a, has a, uh, Jordan has a restraining order against this guy from his family.

Well, Jordan, uh, told people about that today, put it publicly.

And then he's, he's got more coming out on Monday of some other stuff.

So, um, be on the lookout.

It's it's, this is actually a really big story.

Um, so I I'm thankful for that because I know this guy's been a thorn in a lot of people's sides in his vicious

attacks.

So having said that, okay, let's go back to our sign women's rights or human rights.

We've kind of demolished that a little bit.

The next line on this sign is science is real,

right?

Which was, was my comment was,.

You know, you talked about, well, they don't, uh, they don't consider the, the unborn baby to be human.

And yet they claim they believe science is real.

And what does science tell us that that unborn child is 100 human

from conception.

That's the science.

And so they're contradicting.

Themselves with their sign.

You know, what's interesting is you go to hospital websites, right?

A hospital website.

If you go to the abortion section, it'll, it'll talk about abortions, same hospital website,

go, go to their pregnancy side and guess what hospitals are doing.

They're calling, they're calling this your baby at three weeks, your baby at

six weeks, your baby at two months, your baby at three months.

I mean, go to any page.

I did this for the Cleveland clinic.

One of the most well -renowned, uh, hospitals in the world is right there in Cleveland, Ohio.

And I quoted their website in a sermon I did about two years ago.

They call, they, they call a baby, a baby in the womb from conception on

when they talked to the pregnant.

Female.

I posted, pulled this up, this comment from Angie on YouTube.

Angie says life continues, excuse me, sorry.

Life continues at conception.

Life does not come from death.

And I absolutely love that.

That's excellent.

That is fabulous.

You know, we need to, as biblical Christians, we need to understand where life comes from.

It was breathed.

The breath of life was breathed into Adam and Eve.

And that, that life comes from father and mother through God's, uh, miracle

power of giving life to every single, uh, uh, embryo

from the male and the female side that comes together.

And there is no death there, right?

There is no death there.

That's a fabulous statement.

That's the best statement I think I've heard in forever.

Yeah.

And it's known as the law of biogenesis.

All life comes from previous life.

Exactly.

And that's a fabulous statement because, you know, and, and it really does bring that out.

That's Angie.

That is, you need to coin that and post.

That.

I said this, I said this.

You know what?

And you have proof it's on this show.

You,.

You can trademark this now and we can trace this.

No, Angie H said, boom.

Yeah, that is,.

That is good.

Wait till I try naming it for himself next.

Andrew will try to grab a hold.

Of it.

So you need to, you need to trademark that without a doubt.

Do it really fast.

Yeah.

So, so science is real.

This is, this is astounding to me because presuppositionally, we would say that you,

the people who say science is real are the ones who are evolutionists, right?

That goes, that's a statement that goes hand in hand with evolutionists.

And as a presupp guy, I would say, wait a minute, how do you have the mental faculties in

order to do science in the first place?

Like how do you have an ability to reason and use the laws of logic in order to do science?

Oh, by the way, in order to do science, we must have unchanging laws of nature that

are already established in order to do science in the first place.

Right?

So where does all this stuff come from?

We, as Christians, we're the only ones that can account for science being.

Real because we know where it comes from.

I'm going to throw in here on this one, because, you know, when you say science is real, I'm

going to have to come back with an argument.

Okay.

Yes, I agree.

That doesn't mean scientists are real.

Okay.

Just because a science field is real and absolute, that doesn't mean a

scientist who comes out with a thought based on his, his foundational

worldview, it's an anti -God worldview.

He starts out, his axiom is the same as everyone else's.

We all know God exists and we suppress that truth.

Okay.

So his axiom is just like yours and mine.

And so his, his reason for science is to disprove God and to be able to

prove his, his point of view.

I was actually listening to a Ted talk, uh, when I was up in, uh, Pittsburgh, uh,

Philadelphia, I'm sorry.

I was up in Philadelphia and I'm listening to a Ted talk from a trans

black, uh, man who is arguing for

his, uh, trans identity from birth.

He says he was, uh, genetically created, uh, as a

trans man from birth.

He had the physical body of a man, but he actually was a woman genetically from birth.

And he's using all of this supposed language.

I think this, I, you know, we're going to find this and we're going to find the genome, this it's not ready yet, but maybe in a

hundred or 200 years, we're going to find this.

And I'm given the first foundations.

And here's what he said.

We can't show this as proof anywhere, except if you are in this, in this

room that I work in and there's 15 different computers that are working at a billion,

billion, billion, billion, billion parts per second or nanosecond.

And they are, they are proving this based on our algorithms.

And I'm thinking, do you really have to be that stupid to honestly believe that what he's not saying

is that we just programmed all these computers to say what we want it to say.

And now we've disproven God, you know, science is real scientists are

not, you know, I'm sorry, but it was scientific fact, you know, Anthony, you know, this for

a fact, it was a scientific fact that if you drilled a hole in this, in somebody's head 400 years ago,

the, the, the bad blood would come out and the demons would come out.

It was a scientific fact.