February 1, 2021 Show with Fred Butler on “Royal Deceptions: Exposing the KING JAMES ONLY Conspiracies Against God’s Word”

Iron Sharpens Iron

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

00:04

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

00:10

Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron. This is a radio platform in which pastors,

00:23

Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

00:31

Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us iron sharpens iron so one man sharpens another.

00:38

Matthew Henry said that in this passage we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

00:50

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions and now here's your host

00:59

Chris Arnzen. Good afternoon

01:09

Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

01:20

This is Chris Arnzen, your host at Iron Sharpens Iron Radio wishing you all a happy Monday on this first day of February 2021 and I'm thrilled to get on the program as a guest for the very first time ever, somebody that I've been seeing every single year at the

01:39

G3 conference in Atlanta, Georgia, manning an exhibitors booth for Grace to You Ministries, the media ministry of Dr.

01:48

John MacArthur, the world -renowned pastor, author,

01:54

Bible teacher via radio and television and I'm so glad that I finally have the opportunity for the first time to interview this brother named

02:06

Fred Butler. He is the media ministry or should I say the director and coordinator of volunteer ministries for Grace to You, the media ministry of John MacArthur as I just mentioned and today we are going to address a new book that Fred has written,

02:28

Royal Deceptions, Exposing the King James Only Conspiracies Against God's Word and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time ever to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Fred Butler.

02:40

I'm absolutely thrilled to be here. I feel like I've hit the big time, like I'm on 60

02:47

Minutes or something. Well, that never makes people happy, well actually if you're a leftist, you are more than comfortable being interviewed on 60

02:56

Minutes, you have no fear of any dirt being dug up if you're a leftist, but if you're anybody else, you've got a lot to worry about usually.

03:07

But first of all, tell our listeners, you know, we do have new Christians who are listeners, not all of them necessarily know who

03:16

John MacArthur is, I am sure that 99 .99999 % of our listeners do, but sometimes we have new

03:25

Christians listening and we even have non -Christians listening on occasion who make that evident through the emails that they send in, sometimes even

03:32

Muslims and people who are in aberrant religions and cults and so forth, so they might not all be familiar with him.

03:40

So tell our listeners about John MacArthur and Grace To You briefly. Okay, so Grace To You is the radio ministry of Pastor John MacArthur who has been pastoring

03:52

Grace Community Church in Sun Valley, California for, golly, 52 years or so, 51 years, because I think he started in 1969, if I'm not mistaken, if I'm recalling my history.

04:05

And he has been the sole pastor there for that length of time, and he preaches expositionally through the

04:13

Scriptures, that's what drew me to his ministry a long time ago. And he finished preaching through the entire

04:21

New Testament expositionally back in 2011 with the Gospel of Mark.

04:28

And over the course of at least 40 years, I'm remembering that rightly as well, since about 1978, they've been airing his sermons on radio.

04:40

And so when I first heard John, I think it was from a radio station out of Memphis, Tennessee, on the

04:50

AM side, I can't remember exactly what it was, but then I mostly listened to him through his audio cassettes.

04:59

He was notorious for having lots and lots of audio cassettes, if anybody remembers what those were.

05:06

And they got just spread out all over the United States, they came into my hands as a young man in college, a brand new believer, and I just devoured them, went through the books of Matthew and 1

05:19

Corinthians and Acts, and yeah, just all his sermons he's preached on those various biblical books.

05:27

And great to use his radio ministry, we're now international, all over the world through the internet, primarily right now, but still on radio in many stations, also translated into Spanish down in South America, and we're a lot of Spanish -speaking believers.

05:47

So we have a, God's really blessed us with a great reach with his ministry.

05:53

Amen, he's one of my modern -day heroes, that's for sure. And had him on the program, had the honor and privilege of interviewing him once, would love to get him back on, it seems like a nearly impossible task to accomplish these days.

06:08

But I also have the honor to have his glowing commendation for Iron Trip and Zion Radio adorning my website, and that was truly an honor and privilege to receive that from Dr.

06:23

MacArthur, and I have interviewed many times, in fact, the person who has been interviewed on this program as my guest more than anybody else in the history of Iron Trip and Zion Radio, going back to 2005,

06:38

Phil Johnson. Is it Phil Johnson? That's right, Phil Johnson. And far less frequently, but I'd love to interview him just as frequently, is

06:48

Darrell Bernard Harrison, who is a new staff member there at Grace to You.

06:54

He's a great guy. Yes, and I just received word from his co -host of his podcast,

07:04

Virgil Walker, that he and Darrell Bernard Harrison may be joining me again as my guest very soon.

07:10

So, I hope that comes to fruition. If anybody wants to find out more about Grace to You, go to gty .org,

07:19

gty .org. And before we get into a discussion on the book that I mentioned,

07:27

Royal Deceptions Exposing the King James Only Conspiracies Against God's Word, as you know,

07:34

Fred, we have a tradition here on Iron Trip and Zion Radio. Whenever we interview, at least 99 % of the time, unless for some reason there is a time crunch and we don't have time to do this, but that's a rare occasion, but 99 % of the time when we have a first -time guest on this program, who is a

07:56

Christian, of course, because there are those rare occasions when I interview non -Christians who have something of value to say to the body of Christ, something they've written, or perhaps

08:06

I have a debate on the program and it involves a non -Christian. But whenever I have a Christian on, I like them to give a summary of their salvation testimony, which would include the religious atmosphere, if any, they were raised in, and the providential circumstances our sovereign

08:22

Lord raised up in their lives that drew them to Himself and saved them. So, I'd like you to start with your own story.

08:30

Well, yeah, so, I was raised in a church -attending home in the state of Missouri, so I was around church, but it was a

08:42

Methodist church, so it wasn't really a whole lot of deep doctrinal gospel teaching from there.

08:48

Was it a mainline liberal, was it a real liberal church or something? I think it was a United Methodist church, and so they were,

08:57

I would imagine they probably were liberal, but it was more of like a club kind of atmosphere there.

09:04

You'd come together and you'd have your Sunday morning kind of lecture from the pastor guy.

09:10

We had a strong youth group. We had a female youth director who was the leader, but she did a good job of kind of pulling together kids and keeping them entertained.

09:22

So, I was raised in that. I was just running around game circles and drinking

09:28

Red Punch, as they say, and I came to know the Lord in college after I had left home and got involved in a

09:37

Southern Baptist church that was, it was certainly kind of a seeker -friendly church, but they had some good teaching there.

09:45

In one of the, I think it was the last week of my freshman year, they had a revival service, and I just remember the guy preaching was preaching on false conversions, and it really struck me.

10:00

That's what God used in my life to sort of awaken me, and I remember going back and studying in my dorm room because I had a final the next day in algebra, and I could not concentrate.

10:11

I just kept wondering if I was really saved, and just in the lateness of that night,

10:17

God was pleased to save me and drew me to himself, and from then on,

10:22

I just had a totally different view and perspective on life, and I've been following Christ ever since that time.

10:32

So, from churchianity to biblical Christianity, I guess you could say.

10:39

Now, how did you get a dream job, at least it's a dream job for many, many, many

10:44

Christians, including me, that listen to this program, who love and view

10:54

John MacArthur as one of their modern -day heroes? How did you get a dream job at Grace to You?

11:00

Well, yes, that's certainly a blessing, too. I came out to California.

11:08

I left little Podunk, Arkansas to come out to California, and for me, that was like going to a totally different planet.

11:16

And I started going to Mass Seminary, and at the time,

11:22

I just did not have any work whatsoever. I couldn't get a job as the custodial guy at the church, and I was looking around everywhere to find a job to help pay the bills and have ends meet, and I was actually thinking about returning back home, because in my mind,

11:39

I was thinking, well, if God wanted me out here, he'll provide for me a job to stay out here and to live in high -cost

11:48

Los Angeles. And right when I was getting ready to pull the trigger to come back to Arkansas and maybe go to a different seminary in Memphis or something,

11:57

I got a phone call from a friend that said, hey, they need someone part -time to work out at Grace to You to help put together mail bags or something like that.

12:08

I can't remember exactly what it was, and I'm like, well, yeah, I'll take whatever I could. And so I went out, and I knew

12:14

I had been volunteering there a little bit, but I went out and started working with, at the time, the guy who did my job now, that I do now, who was

12:26

Phil's father -in -law, and I started working for him. So I would come in on the backside of the volunteers who would put together the mass mailings, and I would put them together in mail bags and tag them all up and have them ready for the post office to pick up at the end of the day.

12:43

And it was just something simple like that. And eventually, over the course of time, as I was working there part -time for the most part, when

12:51

I was getting ready to graduate, again, I was going to return back home. And the guy that I was working for was retiring and was going to be moving to Branson, Missouri to work at Silver Dollar City, which was his dream job of all things.

13:06

And so they asked me if I would come on at least full -time for a short while until they could find someone to replace that position, because it's such a key position.

13:15

And I was there with another guy for a while, but then he left and kind of did his thing, and I was left by myself.

13:21

And I had to train these 80 elderly people how to do my job, because I needed the help, you know.

13:28

And they loved it and thought it was great, because they were coming, and they're all members of Grace Church for the most part.

13:36

And they just thought it was wonderful that they had this opportunity to serve the church and to serve the pastor.

13:44

And I guess I did such a good job of organizing that that they kept me around. And the job became just more focused on just the things that I was already training the volunteers to do, and I've been doing that ever since.

14:02

It's been a blessing to be a part of that. I've got, like, at this time, about 120 volunteers that come.

14:09

They haven't been coming because COVID has kind of put a cramp in that, but we still have a handful that come.

14:19

We have sort of restricted a little bit on how many people we can have there and stuff. But right now, it's great.

14:25

It's like having a whole bunch of grandparents. They love me and my family and take care of us.

14:32

Grace to you has restrictions for COVID. I know, it's amazing, isn't it? I wish we could be like the church and be all rebellious against the, you know, we'll do an amendment right.

14:44

But we can't do that at Grace to You. We're kind of limited in what we can do. By the way, do you know my very dear friend, close friend,

14:55

Dr. Doug McMasters, who is currently the pastor of New Hyde Park Baptist Church on Long Island, but was the director,

15:04

I believe, of pastoral outreach, if I'm not mistaken, at Grace to You? Yeah, he answered a letter.

15:10

There would be letters that would come in, and he did a lot of the people calling in or writing in looking to get some advice or counseling about some situation in the church.

15:22

I actually got to work with him some, because he was needing help answering letters. So I got to learn how to write letters to people asking

15:31

Bible questions and that sort of thing. Yeah, he was a great guy. Yes, he is, and I hope he's listening.

15:40

Well, I want to give our listeners our email address right away if they have questions for Fred Butler on the

15:47

King James Only issue, especially the specific areas addressed in his book,

15:54

Exposing the King James Only Conspiracies Against God's Word, which is the subtitle of Royal Deceptions, the title.

16:02

And that's kind of funny to bring up that title after having a nice little chat about Doug McMasters, because his wife's name is

16:10

Royal, so we mean no disrespect. Royal Deceptions has nothing to do with Doug's wife.

16:20

But our email address, if you have a question, is chrisarnsen at gmail .com, chrisarnsen at gmail .com,

16:28

C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com. Please, as always, give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live outside the

16:38

USA. Please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

16:44

Let's say you are a person who fully believes in the King James Only position.

16:51

You are vehemently opposed to our guest's comments today. Or perhaps even more appropriately, to remain anonymous, you're in a church that is

17:04

King James Only, and you are drifting away from that and coming to a more biblically and historically sound understanding of these issues, but you don't want to identify yourself yet as being opposed to or beginning to leave

17:23

King James Onlyism. Perhaps you're even a pastor, and you are beginning to question the

17:31

King James Only position, and your fellow elders, if you have any, or the church that you're in is predominantly

17:40

King James Only. It might even be officially King James Only as far as its identity and their signage and perhaps their constitution or what have you, and you don't want to identify yourself yet because perhaps you're just thinking these things through.

17:58

Well, those are reasons, and I'm sure there are other reasons why you might want to remain anonymous, but please, if it's just a general question on the issues we are addressing, please give us at least your first name, your city and state, and your country of residence, if you live outside the

18:14

USA. Well, first of all, let's talk about the thousand -pound gorilla in the room.

18:24

I'm wondering why you said to yourself, I've got to write a book on the

18:30

King James Only issue because we all know who are

18:35

Reformed, that there is a book that is considered the Bible of King James Only conspiracies and heresies.

18:46

That is the book, The King James Only Controversy by Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, and some might say, what on earth does

18:55

Fred have to say that James didn't already cover in that thoroughly exhaustive book, it at least appears to be, especially when even somebody of the ilk of D .A.

19:06

Carson, who wrote his own book on the issue, said James White's book is better than mine. James White's would be better than mine, too, but mine is mercifully short, and I hit all the salient points that you need to know to have an understanding of this controversy.

19:23

Then, if you want to go and read James' book, you can have at it. But yeah, it's not all that short.

19:32

It is, how many pages is mine? 160, 165 pages.

19:42

Yeah, that's, I think James' is like almost close to 400, right? I can't remember.

19:47

Wow, I don't have it in my hand, but I didn't realize it was that long. I've read it cover to cover, but I don't remember it being that long, but maybe it is.

19:55

I was a King James Only when I read that book, and so I wrote mine, all these angry notes in the margins.

20:04

So when I got myself right thinking and had the opportunity to have James' out of grace one time,

20:11

I think a bunch of us took him out to eat somewhere, and I took that book with me and showed him my notes.

20:17

So I had this humility, this humbling experience of showing him my angry King James Only notes in his book, and he was gracious about it.

20:26

He signed it and everything, and we had a big laugh. Yeah, his book is, what I kind of like in his book, if you want to kind of get an understanding of good, solid textual criticism, the idea of just how we got our

20:39

Bibles, how we got our Greek texts, and all of that, that his book is really going to go into that in a lot of detail.

20:48

For those people who are sort of overwhelmed by such things, my book is designed to kind of give you just an overview of sort of the issues and some answers to the common objections and comments and beliefs that King James Onlyists tend to articulate, and that way you can have a quick reference.

21:14

I put a bibliography in the back where I note some other books that are worth your time and investment.

21:20

If you wanted to dig a little deeper in the topic, you can check out those works. And just so we don't unnecessarily offend many of our listeners who prefer the

21:34

King James Bible above all others, they may be even in a denomination or a fellowship of some kind that insists that all of the pastors only use the

21:49

King James from their pulpits, we have to make sure that we are not vilifying everybody who loves, prefers, and even exclusively uses the

22:00

King James Bible. In fact, I have had a number of guests on this program whose preaching and teaching

22:07

I value very highly who only use the King James version, Dr.

22:12

Joel Beakey, for instance, his denomination where he is a key figure, the

22:20

Heritage Reformed Congregations, unless something has changed, all their pastors must use the

22:27

King James Bible from the pulpits, and there are other denominations whose pastors

22:32

I really enjoy and have developed very close friendships with, like the Free Presbyterian Church of North America, also known as the

22:40

Free Presbyterian Church of Ulster, where it started. And I could go on and on with folks who love and prefer the

22:51

King James Bible and exclusively use it, who would not be guilty of extreme, nutty, and heretical approaches to this whole thing.

23:05

So tell us about specifically the compelling factor of you writing the book that involved conspiracies,

23:15

King James -only conspiracies, against God's Word. Right, right. Well, I'll begin by saying that I'm someone who absolutely loves the

23:24

King James, and it is the work, I believe, primarily of the great

23:30

Reformer William Tyndale, the translators of the King James, pulled heavily from his previous material when he translated the

23:39

New Testament into English. It is Tyndale who gave us beautiful theological terms like mercy seat and Passover.

23:49

I want to say atonement is another one that he might have translated for us into English.

23:56

And so I don't have anything against the King James, and I still have a copy of my original

24:01

King James and refer to it every once in a while when I need to. My focus in this book was primarily to give something of my testimony.

24:13

That's where I came from. When I first got saved, I was saved in a solid

24:18

Bible -believing church, as Bible -believing as it could be there in the Bible Belt. And so I had a really high view of God's Word, and I had a friend of mine who actually was the guy who gave me my first John MacArthur tape, believe it or not, who was also a

24:34

King James onlyist, and he gave me a copy of a book written by a pastor in Oklahoma.

24:41

And the Oklahoma pastor was arguing that the modern versions have been corrupted in some fashion, and they take away from key doctrines of the

24:52

Christian faith, and they've introduced heresies and all this sort of stuff. And I was really compelled by what the guy wrote, a lot of that just because of my immaturity and not being taught like I should be, and just, you know, having a real passion wanting to be a person who upholds the

25:11

Word of God. And I began to just gather together all kinds of materials by people like Peter Ruckman and William Grady, David Cloud, some of these names you might be familiar with.

25:25

Yes. And these, what's that? I said yes, I'm familiar with some of those names, especially

25:30

David Cloud, a very well known figure amongst independent fundamentalist Baptists. Yeah, D .A.

25:36

Waite, and those guys like that. Yes, in fact, I challenged D .A. Waite years ago to debate

25:42

James White on the King James only issue, and after going back and forth for a lengthy period of time,

25:50

Dr. Waite finally agreed to do the debate if there were no cross examinations.

25:57

I said, sorry, that is the life's blood of a debate, because otherwise you're just hearing people give speeches.

26:09

And so that was probably my problem, too, is I don't think when you had someone that would actually challenge my convictions and what

26:17

I was arguing about the Word of God, that I could really answer them well. And, well, at any rate,

26:24

I grew into that, you know, this is what I was thinking and believing, and what really began to change in my mind, believe it or not, was when

26:36

Gail Ripplinger produced her book, published her book, New Age Bible Versions, and I began to read through that, and a lot of the stuff that she was advocating in that book, which is that modern versions are this satanic conspiracy to somehow bring in a new age into the

26:56

Church so that Christians will be welcoming to the Antichrist, was kind of her thesis. I began to look at that, and I'm just like, eh, that doesn't sound...I

27:07

don't see that, really. You know, I was having problems with that. I think, too, also

27:12

I was becoming more grounded in biblical truth, because that, you know, again, comes from listening to Dr.

27:20

MacArthur and R .C. Sproul and other good men, and they were all Calvinistic in their theology.

27:26

And Dr. MacArthur, his favorite translation or version is the

27:31

New American Standard Bible, which... That's correct. In fact, we are going to have to cut away from you right now for our first advertising break, and we'll pick up on Gail Ripplinger when we return from the break, and here we are going to hear a word from the publishers of the

27:49

New American Standard Bible, so don't go away. When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the

28:04

New American Standard Bible were among my very first sponsors. It gives me joy knowing that many scholars and pastors in the

28:13

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio audience have been sticking with or switching to the

28:18

NASB. I'm Dr. Joseph Piper, President and Professor of Systematic and Homiletical Theology at Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary in Taylors, South Carolina, and the

28:29

NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Chuck White of the

28:35

First Trinity Lutheran Church in Tonawanda, New York, and the NASB is my Bible of choice.

28:41

I'm Pastor Anthony Methenia of Christ Church in Radford, Virginia, and the NASB is my

28:46

Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Jesse Miller of Damascus Road Christian Church in Gardnerville, Nevada, and the

28:53

NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Bruce Bennett of Word of Truth Church in Farmerville, Long Island, New York, and the

29:02

NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Rodney Brown of Metro Bible Church in Southlake, Texas, and the

29:11

NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Jim Harrison of Red Mills Baptist Church in Mayapac Falls, New York, and the

29:18

NASB is my Bible of choice. Here's a great way for your church to help keep

29:24

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio on the air. Pastors, are your pew Bibles tattered and falling apart?

29:30

Consider restocking your pews with the NASB, and tell the publishers you heard about them from Chris Arnzen on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

29:39

Go to nasbible .com, that's nasbible .com to place your order.

29:53

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here. If you've watched my Dividing Line webcast often enough, you know

29:58

I have a great love for getting Bibles and other documents vital to my ministry rebound to preserve and ensure their longevity.

30:06

Besides that, they feel so good. I'm so delighted I discovered Post Tenebrous Lux Bible rebinding.

30:13

No radio ad will be long enough to sing their praises sufficiently, but I'll give it a shot. Jeffrey Rice of Post Tenebrous Lux is a remarkably gifted craftsman and artisan.

30:23

All his work is done by hand from the cutting to the pleating of corners to the perimeter stitching.

30:28

Jeffrey uses the finest in buttery soft imported leathers in a wide variety of gorgeous colors like the turquoise goatskin tanned in Italy used for my

30:38

Nestle All -in -28 edition with a navy blue goatskin inside liner and the electric blue goatskin from a

30:44

French tannery used to rebind a Reformation study Bible I used as a gift. The silver gilding he added on the page edges has a stunning mirror finish resembling highly polished chrome.

30:54

Jeffrey will customize your rebinding to your specifications and even emboss your logo into the leather, making whatever he rebinds a one -of -a -kind work of art.

31:05

For more details on Post Tenebrous Lux Bible rebinding, go to ptlbiblerebinding .com.

31:13

That's ptlbiblerebinding .com. Was your business shut down during the

31:31

COVID -19 pandemic, depriving you of earning any money, causing you to default on your rent as you try to survive without income?

31:40

Maybe you've had to close your doors for good. The good news, you thought, was that you purchased business interruption insurance as a part of your business liability policy with a major insurance company who told you they are a good neighbor or that you would be in good hands.

31:59

You filed a claim only to be told that it was denied due to the pandemic exclusion clause.

32:06

The pandemic exclusion? Since 2006, most insurance companies added this clause to enable them to deny your income loss claims in the event of a worldwide pandemic.

32:18

Do not give up. No matter what state you live in, call Buttafuoco & Associates now at 1 -800 -669 -4878.

32:30

Buttafuoco & Associates is a part of a large multi -district litigation, and they are working with lead counsel to bring what they believe will be a successful lawsuit for these claims.

32:40

It is the best way for you to proceed. There's absolutely no risk to you.

32:46

You do not have to pay them out of pocket, and there is no fee unless you recover on your claim.

32:52

You need to call 1 -800 -669 -4878 right now.

32:59

Trust the law firm where the attorneys at one of the largest business firms on Long Island, New York, are sending their own clients for representation during this lawsuit.

33:10

Buttafuoco & Associates. Here to help business owners rebuild their lives in the wake of the pandemic.

33:17

Call 1 -800 -669 -4878. Dr. Tony Costa, Professor of Apologetics and Islam at Toronto Baptist Seminary.

33:44

I'm thrilled to introduce to you a church where I've been invited to speak and have grown to love,

33:50

Hope Reform Baptist Church in Coram, Long Island, New York, pastored by Rich Jensen and Christopher McDowell.

33:56

It's such a joy to witness and experience fellowship with people of God, like the dear saints at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Coram, who have an intensely passionate desire to continue digging deeper and deeper into the unfathomable riches of Christ in his holy word, and to enthusiastically proclaim

34:14

Christ Jesus the King and his doctrines of sovereign grace in Suffolk County, Long Island, and beyond.

34:21

I hope you also have the privilege of discovering this precious congregation and receive the blessing of being showered by their love as I have.

34:30

For more information on Hope Reform Baptist Church, go to hopereformedli .net, that's hopereformedli .net,

34:40

or call 631 -696 -5711, that's 631 -696 -5711.

34:51

Tell the folks at Hope Reform Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island, New York, that you heard about them from Tony Costa on Iron Sharpens Iron.

35:05

Welcome back, if you just tuned us in. Our guest today is Fred Butler, and he is the author of a book we are addressing today,

35:15

Royal Deceptions, Exposing the King James Only Conspiracies Against God's Word.

35:23

If you have a question, our email address is chrisarnsen, at gmail .com, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N, at gmail .com.

35:31

Give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence, if you live outside the

35:39

USA. Please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal or private matter.

35:45

One thing I forgot to mention when I introduced you, Fred, can you tell our listeners about a blog site called

35:54

Hip and Thigh, and please explain the name before I get in trouble. I know,

36:01

I get those things every once in a while too. Um, yeah, Hip and Thigh is basically a

36:08

Hebraism, comes from Judges 15 -8, and it speaks of Samson smiting the

36:16

Philistines hip and thigh. It's actually a King James rendering of that phrase, which

36:22

I thought is just wonderful. And so when I began to blog back in 2005, where a lot of these, one of the chapters in my book really originated was on my blog when

36:34

I was writing this all out. That's the name I gave it, was Hip and Thigh, and I wanted to be smiting theological

36:43

Philistines with my writing. That was sort of my goal. Is it still an active blog site?

36:50

What's that? Is it still active as a blog site? It is. I post up things there occasionally, but just life and raising kids and running around and doing all that stuff with teenagers, it keeps me from writing like it did.

37:08

And so I'm not as, it's not as active as it is. I think the last thing I posted there was the books

37:13

I read for 2020. I would kind of review those. And so I used to do that like all the time, but now that they have

37:21

Twitter and all these other little social media sites, I spend more time doing that because it's quicker, and I can throw out my witticisms and pithy remarks in 280 characters rather than having to write an entire blog post about it.

37:36

But yeah, that's, I would like to revisit that someday. I haven't ever shut it down, and I don't plan to, but I do have other articles archived there if anybody wants to Google that.

37:48

And go there, look, hit the articles. I got stuff on old earth creationism and apologetics and all kinds of different topics.

37:59

Now, when you say you have articles on old earth creationism, are you an old earth creationist? Oh, no, no.

38:05

Okay, I'm glad you clarified that. I'm a biblical creationist. I'm a young earth guy. I do have friends who are old earthers.

38:13

I'm not, but I have great fellowship with them as long as they don't start to get nasty.

38:22

Some people think the old earthers are just victims in this dispute, that they are the ones wrongly being accused of heresy, but they have their members who do their own fair share of that, believe me, who think that we are sending people to hell because we are making the church look moronic since we don't accept the...

38:42

But we believe a dead man rose from the grave. I mean, that alone is going to be making him sound moronic.

38:49

Well, if anybody wants to look into hip and thigh, you can go to hipandthigh .wordpress

38:56

.com, and hip and thigh is spelt with the word and A -N -D in the middle, not the symbol.

39:02

Okay, before the break, you mentioned Gail Ripplinger, I can't remember which way to pronounce it.

39:10

She is one of the more controversial figures in the

39:15

King James only movement, and she is in a unique category of King James onlyists, and we have to make sure that we're not broad brushing all of the

39:27

King James only folks, because I don't even think David Cloud or D .A. Waite would feel comfortable having

39:36

Gail Ripplinger associated with them as a colleague of theirs or something. Would I be right on that?

39:43

Yeah, in fact, when she wrote her book, I remember reading reviews from those guys where they were disavowing her, at least her conspiratorial stuff that she was promoting in it, and I think there was even a writing battle between them, and she'd write some stuff against them, and then they'd write some stuff against her, and it went back and forth like that.

40:07

And since most, and since most, not all, but most King James only folk are independent fundamentalist

40:14

Baptists, Yeah, that's correct. it would be odd for them to have a close affiliation with Gail Ripplinger, because she appears to be speaking in ways that only a charismatic could speak.

40:29

Am I right on that? There seems to be strange things. Extrabiblical revelation.

40:36

Yeah, she was claiming extrabiblical revelation. I thought it was interesting that when she initially wrote her book, she didn't put her full name on the cover.

40:47

Yeah, God and Ripplinger, right? Yeah, well, that's what she called it, but she intentionally hid the fact that she was a woman, and I think that's because you're going to have most independent fundamentalists are going to be extremely complementarian in their views of ministry and all that sort of thing, and she was trying to hide the fact that she was a woman, and because when

41:12

I wrote her, I actually wrote her several times just asking questions and getting the feel about certain biblical texts, and I addressed her as sir, and you know,

41:22

Mr. Ripplinger, and I had no idea I was talking to a lady,

41:27

I guess I've seen her on Twitter here or there, but she's the one who really sort of raised all the crazy stuff about King James Onlyism to symphonic levels, and it's what really got used to sort of open my eyes to think, okay, does

41:43

God really, if he really has like all these heretical people, if they corrupted his

41:50

Bible that bad that you're unable to discover it, and it's only found fixed and frozen in one 17th century translation that you can't change or alter,

42:03

I mean, that's what I was getting from my King James Only guys. D. A. Waite, for instance, he has a whole book on the fourfold superiority of the

42:12

King James, and he was arguing for, well, you know, the reasons why these words are hard to understand is because God wants you to learn how to, you know, be a better reader and to improve your vocabulary, and that there's the

42:29

Bible, though the King James is not that hard to understand or read if you really think about it, and he has all these convoluted arguments on why that's true, and I would look at him like, no, it can be difficult to kind of wrestle through because you're reading

42:45

Elizabethan English. I mean, I'm not saying that, you know, it's so hard you can't understand it, and I think you can still use the

42:52

King James, to suggest that that's the way God spoke, or that's the way

42:58

God wants us to speak, and to keep that sort of, you know, the words were sort of like a reverent indicator that you really honored

43:07

God's word. I just was not seeing that. I just, why would God do that? That was my questions

43:12

I was asking, you know, my other stuff that I was reading and was getting from these people, and eventually

43:18

I began to question this enough that I was breaking away from that whole mindset, and I went to my blog, and I began to write out this material, really addressing the arguments on how

43:32

I had sort of been taught to defend the King James version.

43:38

I also found myself kind of going on to discussion groups and discussing forums, and talking to the

43:45

King James only is there, listening to their arguments, and how they would challenge me, and from that I just,

43:53

I produced a number of articles just interacting with that material, and it sat there on my website for a number of years, and I had my immediate boss, not

44:07

Phil, but the guy that's my direct manager, had been talking with a lady who was one of our supporters, and she had questions about some stuff she had gotten from David Daniels, who is currently the overseer of Jet Chicks, his tracks and comic book ministry, and he had written a book about defending

44:30

King James -onlyism, and my boss asked me if I had any material that we could maybe send this lady, she's sort of older, and would she be able to, something we could maybe help her with, and my first reaction was like, oh, there's

44:45

James White's book, but James White's book is a little petty, you have to sort of be familiar with the things that he's writing about, and have some concept of what he's talking about, and I just thought, well, maybe

44:59

I could put together my stuff in a PDF or something, and print them out for her, and that idea just turned into the whole idea of, well, maybe

45:08

I could put this in a book format, and Amazon prints stuff, they'll publish your stuff to print as is, you don't have to get a big print run, and have like a thousand books, that you have to kind of eat through before you can get another print run or whatever, but they'll just print as they go, and as they're ordered, and so I had some help from some friends,

45:31

I put together my material, it took me maybe, I don't know, a year and a half to edit this material together, and some sort of readable book, and I had a friend help me put together the cover, and it is what it is today, which you have there probably in your hand.

45:45

Oh, it's a great cover. Yeah, no, that was our first idea, I'm just thinking of King James maybe wearing a tinfoil hat, and my friend within an hour sent me that photograph, that was great.

45:58

Yeah, I think that... It's true, yeah. Yeah, well, there are some, probably a minority of King James onlyists who prefer just referring to that translation or version as the authorized version, because they're not crazy about association with King James either,

46:15

I mean, it is kind of interesting how the majority of the folks who are

46:21

King James onlyists are independent fundamentalist Baptists who despise, many of them despise the

46:27

Reformation and anything associated with it. Yeah, they do, and Calvinism too.

46:33

And so it's ironic that they would cherish a Bible and some of them, and remember,

46:40

I'm saying some of them have as an idol, this Anglican translation when many of them don't even believe that the

46:52

Anglican church was a true, a part of the stream of preserving

47:00

God's people in history, and so it's just odd.

47:07

And of course, there were even Baptist martyrs in England in the year 1611 when the

47:14

Bible came out. And that was overseen by a couple of the translators of that very

47:20

Bible, which is, you know, you think about that and wait a minute, you're a

47:26

Baptist and these guys who translated the Bible that you think is the word of God oversaw, or at least gave the papers to have these two men executed because of their

47:39

Baptist heresies, in quotes. You know, what do you think of that? And that kind of is where the whole idea of conspiracies come into, is that there is just this whole sort of historical revisionist idea that where they tend to gloss over these little problems and these historical events, and they'll try to explain them away.

48:00

And in doing so, they've created a whole alternative view of our scriptures and how it has come down to us.

48:07

And in fact, it's ironic also that they would use similar charges against Calvinists.

48:15

How could you be a Baptist who loves and appreciates the writings of John Calvin when

48:20

John Calvin was no fan of Anabaptists? And one of the charges against Michael Servetus that led to his execution was not only his denial of the

48:33

Trinity, but his denial of infant baptism. And so therefore, you have independent fundamentalist

48:39

Baptists saying, how could you possibly have any use for John Calvin when he did not at all appreciate or hated the concept of believer -only baptism and an independent, autonomous church and so on?

48:55

And the difference is, I'm sure you would agree, is that we love Calvin, those who do, who are typically labeled

49:03

Reformed or Sovereign Grace -believing Christians or a number of nicknames, because we believe what he taught was biblical.

49:12

And you cannot get King James -only -ism in any way, shape, or form from the

49:17

Bible. That's one of the big differences. Yeah, exactly. That's right. Well, tell us why this is such an important issue.

49:28

Number one, you already hinted at this. The first thing that I have always had hurled against me by King James -only -ists is that I am attacking the

49:44

King James Bible. I could clearly remember when I worked for WMCA radio.

49:52

Before I had my own regular talk show, I filled in on occasion for Andy Anderson, who was the host of Talk New York, which later became

50:03

Andy Anderson Live on WMCA 570 AM in New York, an affiliate of Salem Media, the largest

50:11

Christian radio network in the world. I would fill in for Andy on occasion, and I had

50:18

James White on to talk about the King James -only controversy as my guest when I filled in for Andy.

50:23

And the pastor, who I knew, who used the studio to record his own program, that was a pre -recorded program, he was waiting in the lobby to come in when we were finished.

50:38

He was a King James -only -ist, and I was aware of that. And he was livid, and he barged into the studio when the show was over, and he said, how can you keep attacking the

50:50

King James Bible? And I said, how am I attacking the King James Bible when I made it clear that I love it, that the

50:58

Lord has used it to save countless souls, that countless thousands of pastors throughout centuries have used and cherished this version that have led many to Christ?

51:13

It is you that is the only one in this discussion attacking any version or translation.

51:19

You are attacking and vilifying the NASB. And as much as I don't agree with everything in the

51:26

NIV, I still believe it is the Word of God in English. So they attack the

51:33

NIV, they attack the ESV, they attack even the Geneva Bible, they even attack the

51:39

New King James translation. So they're the only ones really in this discussion attacking anything or vilifying anyone because of a translation.

51:49

Am I right? That's correct. And that's probably because he, in his mind, is thinking, well, the

51:56

King James Bible is the Word of God. So by you questioning, you know, the people who have turned that translation into some kind of spiritual idol and that it has problems and that it is something that it's a translation just like any other

52:15

English translation. It's not inspired or it's not, you know, it doesn't come down from heaven like the

52:22

Koran or something. You know, he's thinking that you're attacking the Word of God. That's another division amongst them,

52:29

I believe. In fact, let's pick up on that when we return because right now we've got to go to the midway break, which

52:35

I hope that you folks will be patient with us because the midway break is longer than our normal breaks because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1

52:45

FM in Lake City, Florida, requires of us to have a longer break in the middle of the show because they are required by the

52:51

FCC to localize this show to Lake City, Florida, and they do so by airing their own public service announcements.

53:00

So while they do that, we air our own globally heard commercials. Please use this time wisely and write down as much of the information as possible provided by our advertisers so that you can more frequently patronize them, even if it just means thanking them for sponsoring the show, but try to patronize them as well as much as you can so that they will remain our advertisers and that so we will remain on the air because we absolutely, positively depend upon our advertisers to exist because of the funding that comes from it.

53:29

But also write down questions for Fred Butler on the King James Only conspiracies and our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

53:36

chrisarnson at gmail .com. Don't go away. We'll be right back with Fred Butler after these messages. Chris Arnson, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, announcing a new website with an exciting offer from World Magazine my trusted source for news from a

53:52

Christian perspective. Try World Now at no charge for 90 days by going to getworldnow .com

54:00

that's getworldnow .com I rely on World because I trust the reporting.

54:06

I gain insight from the analysis and World provides clarity to the news stories that really matter.

54:12

I believe you'll also find World to be an invaluable resource to better understand critical topics with a depth that's simply not found in other media outlets.

54:21

Armed with this coverage, World can help you to be a voice of wisdom in your family and your community.

54:27

This trial includes biweekly issues of World Magazine, on scene reporting from World Radio and the fully shareable content of World Digital.

54:36

There's no obligation and no credit card required. Visit getworldnow .com

54:42

today. Also check out World News Group's podcast The World and Everything in It at wng .org

54:50

forward slash podcast. That's W for World, N for News, G for Group, dot org forward slash podcast.

55:10

This is Pastor Bill Sousa, Grace Church at Franklin, here in the beautiful state of Tennessee.

55:16

Our congregation is one of a growing number of churches who love and support

55:21

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio financially. Grace Church at Franklin is an independent, autonomous body of believers which strives to clearly declare the whole counsel of God as revealed in scripture through the person and work of our

55:37

Lord Jesus Christ. And of course, the end for which we strive is the glory of God.

55:44

If you live near Franklin, Tennessee, and Franklin is just south of Nashville, maybe 10 minutes, or you are visiting this area, or you have friends and loved ones nearby, we hope you will join us some

55:57

Lord's Day in worshiping our God and Savior. Please feel free to contact me if you have more questions about Grace Church at Franklin.

56:07

Our website is gracechurchatfranklin .org. That's gracechurchatfranklin .org.

56:15

This is Pastor Bill Sousa wishing you all the richest blessings of our

56:21

Sovereign Lord, God, Savior, and King, Jesus Christ, today and always.

56:42

As host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, I frequently get requests from listeners for church recommendations.

56:48

A church I've been strongly recommending as far back as the 1980s is Grace Covenant Baptist Church in Flemington, New Jersey, pastored by Alan Dunn.

56:58

Grace Covenant Baptist Church believes it's God's prerogative to determine how he shall be worshiped and how he shall be represented in the world.

57:06

They believe churches need to turn to the Bible to discover what to include in worship and how to worship

57:12

God in spirit and truth. Grace Covenant Baptist Church endeavors to maintain a

57:17

God -centered focus. Reading, preaching, and hearing the Word of God, singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs, baptism, and communion are the scriptural elements of their corporate worship, performed with faith, joy, and sobriety.

57:32

Discover more about Grace Covenant Baptist Church in Flemington, New Jersey at gcbcnj .squarespace

57:40

.com That's gcbcnj .squarespace .com

57:47

or call them at 908 -996 -7654. That's 908 -996 -7654.

57:57

Tell Pastor Dunn that you heard about Grace Covenant Baptist Church on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. Hi, this is

58:10

John Sampson, pastor of King's Church in Peoria, Arizona. Taking a moment of your day to talk about Chris Arnson and the

58:18

Iron Sharpens Iron podcast. I consider Chris a true friend and a man of high integrity. He's a skilled interviewer who's not afraid to ask the big penetrating questions while always defending the key doctrines of the

58:30

Christian faith. I've always been happy to point people to this podcast, knowing it's one of the very few safe places on the internet where folk won't be led astray.

58:39

I believe this podcast needs to be heard far and wide. This is a day of great spiritual compromise, and yet God has raised

58:46

Chris up for just such a time. And knowing this, it's up to us as members of the body of Christ to stand with such a ministry in prayer and in finances.

58:55

I'm pleased to do so and would like to ask you to prayerfully consider joining me in supporting

59:01

Iron Sharpens Iron financially. Would you consider sending either a one -time gift or even becoming a regular monthly partner with this ministry?

59:09

I know it would be a huge encouragement to Chris if you would. All the details can be found at ironsharpensironradio .com

59:16

where you can click support. That's ironsharpensironradio .com. Iron Sharpens Iron Radio depends upon the financial support of fine

59:33

Christian organizations to remain on the air, like the Historical Bible Society. The Historical Bible Society maintains a collection of Christian books, manuscripts, and Bibles of historical significance spanning nearly a thousand years.

59:48

The mission of HBS is the preservation and public display of ancient scripture, dissemination of scripture, to provide tools equipping believers in Christian apologetics with evidence for the

59:59

Bible's reliability, and to introduce Reformation literature and Christian art to a broader audience.

01:00:06

Since 2004, HBS has toured schools and churches throughout the Northeast United States, reaching thousands of believers and non -believers alike who are hungry for knowledge of the

01:00:17

Bible. HBS's founder, Daniel P. Buttafuoco, attorney at law, is committed to sharing this collection, along with an inspirational historical message that will captivate you and your church.

01:00:30

Come journey through their website, historicalbiblesociety .org. The collection includes a complete 11th century

01:00:37

Bible, an actual page of the Gutenberg Bible from 1455, the first book ever printed, the

01:00:44

Geneva Bible, the 1611 King James Bible, and much, much more. Visit historicalbiblesociety .org

01:00:52

today. Thank you, Daniel P. Buttafuoco, attorney at law, for your faithful support of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

01:01:39

If 2020 has proven anything, it's that Big Pharma, Big Tech, and Big Government knows nothing about how to treat people naturally without poisoning them with synthetic drugs and experimental vaccines.

01:01:50

But what if God has given us a better way? What if we can take the Christian worldview found in the Bible and apply it to health and wellness?

01:01:57

My book, Health for All of Life, does just that. You can find this exciting new book on Amazon. Pick up a copy for yourself and for your friends and family.

01:02:05

Give the gift of health and don't be a dead end to truth. Linbrook Baptist Church on 225

01:02:10

Earl Avenue in Linbrook, Long Island, is teaching God's timeless truths in the 21st century. Our church is far more than a

01:02:16

Sunday worship service. It's a place of learning where the scriptures are studied and the preaching of the gospel is clear and relevant.

01:02:22

It's like a gym where one can exercise their faith through community involvement. It's like a hospital for wounded souls where one can find compassionate people and healing.

01:02:30

We're a diverse family of all ages enthusiastically serving our Lord Jesus Christ in fellowship, play, and together.

01:02:36

Hi, I'm Pastor Bob Walderman and I invite you to come and join us here at Linbrook Baptist Church and see all that a church can be.

01:02:42

Call Linbrook Baptist at 516 -599 -9402. That's 516 -599 -9402 or visit linbrookbaptist .org.

01:02:52

That's linbrookbaptist .org. Every day at thousands of community centers, high schools, middle schools, juvenile institutions, coffee shops, and local hangouts,

01:03:08

Long Island Youth for Christ, staff and volunteers meet with young people who need Jesus. We are rural and urban and we are always about the message of Jesus.

01:03:17

Our mission is to have a noticeable spiritual impact on Long Island, New York by engaging young people in the lifelong journey of following Christ.

01:03:26

Long Island Youth for Christ has been a stalwart bedrock ministry since 1959. We have a world -class staff and a proven track record of bringing consistent love and encouragement to youths in need all over the country and around the world.

01:03:39

Help honor our history by becoming a part of our future. Volunteer, donate, pray, or all of the above.

01:03:46

For details, call Long Island Youth for Christ at 631 -385 -8333.

01:03:53

That's 631 -385 -8333. Or visit liyfc .org.

01:04:02

That's liyfc .org. We are excited to announce another new member of the

01:04:23

Iron Sharpens Iron radio advertising family, Bhanu Gadi, owner of three

01:04:28

New York pharmacies, Lee's Drugs of Floral Park, Long Beach Chemists, and Prescription Center of Long Island in Hempstead.

01:04:37

Bhanu Gadi earned a doctorate in pharmacy degree and is very knowledgeable on the current coronavirus pandemic.

01:04:44

Please contact Dr. Gadi so he and his expert staff can give you proper guidance amid all the contradictory confusion we are all hearing in the media.

01:04:54

To find the pharmacy nearest you, call 516 -354 -2000. That's 516 -354 -2000.

01:05:03

Or order online at leesdrugsrx .com. That's L -E -E -S drugsrx .com.

01:05:13

Don't forget to ask about their discount generic drug program. Greetings in the matchless name of our

01:05:19

Lord Jesus Christ. My name is Bhanu Gadi. I'm a pharmacist in New York, which is the epicenter of the latest crisis the world is going through.

01:05:28

In Psalm 139 verse 14, the psalmist offers praise to the Lord like this.

01:05:34

I praise you because I'm fearfully and wonderfully made and wondrous are your works that my soul knows very well.

01:05:41

He saw God's goodness and mercy, kindness, and the beauty in what

01:05:46

God has designed and he has erupted into praise. In any crisis or problem, brothers and sisters, our only fallback position is to trust

01:05:56

God's design. And once we do, there is nothing for us to do but to erupt in praise to him.

01:06:03

When the whole world is searching for a solution, God in his infinite mercy has given us what we need to address this illness, which can be very serious.

01:06:12

Such is the beauty of his design. Knowing that design, how can we not erupt in praise to our great

01:06:18

God like the psalmist did? May God bless you and give all of us wisdom to see greater things in his design.

01:06:26

Thank you. Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said, give yourself unto reading.

01:06:41

The man who never reads will never be read. He who never quotes will never be quoted.

01:06:47

He who will not use the thoughts of other men's brains proves that he has no brains of his own.

01:06:52

You need to read. Solid Ground Christian Books is a publisher and book distributor who takes these words of the

01:06:59

Prince of Preachers to heart. The mission of Solid Ground Christian Books is to bring back treasures of the past to minister to Christians in the present and future and to publish new titles that address burning issues in the church and the world.

01:07:11

Since its beginning in 2001, Solid Ground has been committed to publish God -centered,

01:07:17

Christ -exalting books for all ages. We invite you to go treasure hunting at solid -ground -books .com.

01:07:24

That's solid -ground -books .com and see what priceless literary gems from the past to present you can unearth from Solid Ground.

01:07:33

Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. And please remember, folks, that solid -ground -books .com

01:07:44

is a premier, a primary, a vital sponsor of this program. We would likely not continue to exist, barring a miracle from God financially, if solid -ground -books .com

01:07:58

had to cancel their advertising campaigns with us. We depend that much on their financial support through their ad campaigns.

01:08:05

So please visit solid -ground -books .com as frequently as you can and purchase from them as generously as you can.

01:08:15

And whatever reason that you purchase gifts, birthdays, wedding anniversaries, retirement parties, baptisms,

01:08:25

I could go on and on, even bereavement gifts for someone that you know who has lost a precious loved one.

01:08:32

There are all reasons we all give gifts. And please make your first stop when trying to select a gift, solid -ground -books .com,

01:08:42

solid -ground -books .com. And remember, please don't only purchase gifts from solid -ground -books .com

01:08:50

for your brothers and sisters in Christ. Remember the lost folks in your life that need good

01:08:55

Christian literature. God very often uses a good, solid, biblically -based book to lead the lost to salvation.

01:09:06

So, or even to lead Christians with aberrant thinking into true biblical orthodoxy.

01:09:15

So, please remember those that you might not ordinarily consider when looking for a good

01:09:21

Christian book, including the lost, as well as your brothers and sisters when you go to solid -ground -books .com.

01:09:28

And always remember to tell them that you heard about them from Chris Arns and an

01:09:34

Iron Sherpins Iron Radio. You're not only going to be doing yourself, or should I say, you're not only going to be doing solid -ground -books .com

01:09:41

a favor by purchasing books from them, and you're not only going to be doing us a favor by keeping an advertiser happy, you're going to be doing yourself an enormous favor because they publish the very finest in Christian literature from the past and present at solid -ground -books .com.

01:09:58

Again, don't forget to tell them that you heard about them from Chris Arns and an Iron Sherpins Iron Radio.

01:10:03

Before we return to our guest today, Fred Butler, and our discussion on his book,

01:10:09

Royal Deceptions, Exposing the King James Only Conspiracies Against God's Word, we just have some important announcements to make.

01:10:17

If you love this show, folks, you do not want it to disappear from the airwaves.

01:10:22

I'm urging you to please, I'm begging you, go to IronSherpinsIronRadio .com, click support, then click, click to donate now.

01:10:31

You could donate instantly with a debit or credit card in that fashion. If you prefer a snail mail, you can send a check made out to IronSherpinsIronRadio to the physical address that appears on the screen when you click support at IronSherpinsIronRadio .com.

01:10:46

You could also advertise with us as long as whatever it is you're promoting, whether it's a special event, a business, a church, a parachurch organization, a professional practice, whatever it is, as long as whatever it is you are promoting is compatible with what we believe.

01:11:03

You don't have to believe identically with me, but you need to be promoting something that's at least compatible with what I believe. I would love to help you launch an ad campaign because we are in urgent need of your advertising dollars.

01:11:13

So send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com and put advertising in the subject line.

01:11:19

Remember, folks, I never want our listeners to siphon money away from the regular giving that they're accustomed to to their own local church in order to give to Iron Sherpa and Zion Radio.

01:11:31

In other words, don't give your church less money that you regularly support them with to give us money.

01:11:39

Don't punish your church financially by blessing us financially. And also, please don't put your family in serious financial jeopardy or financial peril if you're really struggling to survive by giving to Iron Sherpa and Zion Radio.

01:11:52

Those two things are commands of God in the scripture providing for your church and your family. Providing for my radio show is obviously not a command of God.

01:12:00

But if you are financially blessed above and beyond your ability to obey those two commands, you have extra money that's collecting interest, you have extra money that you use for recreational purposes, sporting events, concerts, fine dining, all kinds of things, even

01:12:18

Bible conferences. You have extra money to use for those purposes. I would be more than happy to take some of that money, if not all of it, off your hands to help continue

01:12:27

Iron Sherpa and Zion Radio. So please help us if indeed you love the show and don't want it to disappear. Go to ironsherpanzionradio .com,

01:12:34

click support, then click to donate now. Also, folks, don't forget that this

01:12:43

Wednesday we are having part two of a discussion we began not long ago with Justin Peters of Justin Peters Ministries and Andrew Rappaport of Striving for Eternity on the false prophecies of 2020 and 2021 given by or made by the

01:13:05

Word of Faith movement heretics who are amongst the most dangerous people masquerading as Christians in the 20th and 21st century.

01:13:15

So please make sure you mark your calendar to tune in this Wednesday for our continued discussion on that with Justin Peters.

01:13:26

And Andrew Rappaport. Also, folks, if you are not a member of a local

01:13:33

Bible believing church, a real biblically sound church, and you're having a hard time finding one, no matter where in the on the earth that you live, no matter where on the globe you live,

01:13:44

I may be able to help you find a church, sometimes right around the corner from where you live, as I've done with many people in our audience who didn't even know certain churches existed that were within a minute's drive from their home, or sometimes they didn't know these churches that they knew existed were biblically sound.

01:14:01

So I may be able to help you no matter where on the planet earth you live. I have very extensive lists of biblically sound churches all over the world.

01:14:09

So send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com chrisarnson at gmail .com and put I need a church in the subject line.

01:14:17

I need a church in the subject line at chrisarnson at gmail .com. That's also the email address where you could send in a question for Fred Butler on our discussion today,

01:14:27

Royal Deceptions, Exposing the King James Only Conspiracies Against God's Word.

01:14:33

That's chrisarnson at gmail .com chrisarnson at gmail .com. And you offer six arguments defending

01:14:43

King James Onlyism in your book, Fred, and then you show our listeners, or should

01:14:49

I say your readers, right now you're going to show our listeners how to respond to those arguments or claims.

01:14:56

And we were hinting at one of them before, the belief that God's Word, the Holy Bible, has only been faithfully preserved in one

01:15:05

English translation, the 1611 King James. And there is even a division amongst

01:15:11

King James Onlyists over this. The more sound and rational among them who would be logically consistent with cessationism, in other words, non -charismatic views, which would include many of the independent fundamentalist

01:15:29

Baptists and others, they would not believe that the King James Version is divinely inspired, but just protected from corruption and preserved from corruption by the providence of God from 1611 to our present day in that one translation.

01:15:51

And then you have others who are more on the heretical fringe who actually do believe, even though they're not

01:15:58

Anglicans, that God re -inspired this translation and it is a superior guide for truth,

01:16:07

God -breathed truth, than the actual original languages of Hebrew and Greek.

01:16:13

But if you could tell us about this defense that they have, the

01:16:18

King James Onlyists, one of them, that the belief that God's Word, the Holy Bible, has only been faithfully preserved in one

01:16:27

English translation, the 1611 King James. Tell us about that. Yeah, that's like my first chapter, and that chapter is called the

01:16:35

Exclusivity Argument. And the idea is that when you pick up the King James Bible, 1611, or authorize the

01:16:44

Bible, it is going to be the actual Word of God.

01:16:49

So they're going to claim that the King James 1611 is the

01:16:55

Word of God alone. So if you are, like we were saying before, attacking the

01:17:00

King James or questioning the translation of the King James or the reading of the King James or whatever, well then you are actually attacking the

01:17:10

Word of God. So they equate the translation with the actual Bible, or you know,

01:17:16

God's revelation. And they insist that you must, that's where God's revelation is going to be contained, so you must read that.

01:17:25

When I talked about this in my chapter, I noted D .A.

01:17:30

Waite, who wrote a book on this, and he had four reasons why you should believe that. And he believed that the

01:17:37

King James is superior in its original language -based text of the Hebrew and the Greek. The translators, he translated the

01:17:43

King James, so they had the best translators ever. The technique of how the King James is translated, which was,

01:17:50

I think, in his understanding was more of a literal -to -literal translation, not dynamic equivalents like the

01:17:58

NIV. And then the overall theology of the King James conveys, which he believes it conveys independent fundamental

01:18:07

Baptist theology, which I would agree with at some extent, but it also conveys what

01:18:14

I understand to be the doctrines of grace. Which he would probably reject. But the whole idea there with that exclusivity argument is that you are going to pick up the

01:18:25

King James, that's going to be the only copy of God's Word that you can trust.

01:18:31

So anything that deviates from that in either retranslating something or a different version or something like that, it's going to be, you know, it's not the

01:18:42

Word of God. It's been altered. It's been changed. They'll go so far as to say it's a modern perversion that you have in your hands.

01:18:51

Now, that's not everybody who says that, and they'll try to kind of keep their argument confined to the

01:18:58

Hebrew and Greek texts from which the King James translated. But even when you were to go there, if you're familiar enough with just the transmission of those texts throughout history, you know, it's not completely...

01:19:13

You can't have that absolute, exclusive confidence that these are the only

01:19:19

Greek and Hebrew texts that they are to translate from. There's problems with them just as there is with any copy or any translation that's going to be copied and, you know, from manuscripts that have been passed down to us from generation to generation to generation to generation.

01:19:39

God's preserving it. I believe God's hand is there. He's overseeing his word.

01:19:45

But to claim that it's only found in this one unique translation of the

01:19:52

English language and no other, I just... That's going way too far. And I think it, in a way, puts people in a spiritual bind because you're basically saying that if they read any other translation than the

01:20:06

King James, well then, they're going to be stunted in their spiritual growth or they're not going to be, you know, being able to really know who

01:20:15

God is or they're not going to really be sanctified correctly. And it's a terrible burden you put on people's hearts if they are like,

01:20:24

I've never read a King James, so am I some kind of inferior Christian because I don't have a copy of God's word that I've learned from?

01:20:33

Okay. Not all King James... Go ahead. As I said, not all King James only say that, but that's kind of the direction they go.

01:20:42

Okay. We have an anonymous listener.

01:20:48

Anonymous listener who says, I have been thinking through this issue mainly due to the fact that many of my closest

01:20:56

Christian friends are King James only -ists in one degree or another.

01:21:03

The thing that you have said about D .A. Waite is interesting to me that he believes that the

01:21:10

King James version is more clearly reflective of independent

01:21:16

Baptist thought than other translations. The reason why I find that an odd statement is because of the insistence of translations in the

01:21:27

King James version that are outside of the norm of independent

01:21:32

Baptist practice, such as bishop is being used instead of elder and pastor, and also the fact that the word immerse is never translated for the act of baptism.

01:21:47

If you could respond. Well, I'm understanding what the person is asking or what they're kind of commenting is

01:21:55

I had said about D .A. Waite, he sees the King James is going to reflect his sort of really narrow understanding of independent fundamental

01:22:07

Baptist theology. And, you know, you when you look at the

01:22:13

King James text, it's not going to do that exactly, at least not in his, you know, the way he's trying to articulate it.

01:22:21

Another example is that the original King James, and I picked up a copy from Walmart of all places back in 2011 when they had the 400th anniversary of the translation of the

01:22:34

King James, they had a little cheap paperback version. And if you go to the center margins in the

01:22:41

New Testament, there are references back to the Apocrypha because the original

01:22:46

King James had the Apocrypha in it. Well, a lot of independent fundamental

01:22:51

Baptist don't necessarily know that because their King James does not have a Apocrypha in it.

01:22:57

It just has the Old Testament and New Testament, which we believe and understand to be the canon that God intended for his people to have.

01:23:08

But the original King James had the Apocrypha for many years until after, I can't remember exactly when it was finally removed, but eventually it began to be published without the

01:23:17

Apocrypha. And if you look in the margins, you know, in the little center part where they'd have cross -references and that sort of thing, you'll have like cross -references back to the

01:23:28

Book of Sirach and to Daniel and Bell and the Dragon and, you know, just books like that.

01:23:34

They're in the Apocrypha. Judas, I think, is another one. Well, in D .A.

01:23:40

Waite's view, I mean, I would think that he would believe that, you know, the Apocrypha is not inspired

01:23:46

Scripture and it's not part of the, part of his particular theological worldview.

01:23:52

And so for him to insist that the King James is the Bible that Christians are to use without exception, well, how do you sort of answer some of these little problems within the text, you know, itself?

01:24:05

Like what that person was saying about the use of bishops and things of that nature.

01:24:12

Heck, it's a significant, you know, problem for your position if you're going to argue exclusivity of that translation.

01:24:21

But then you have these little, these little question marks there. There's like, really?

01:24:26

I mean, it doesn't seem like it's saying what you're claiming it's saying, you know, that's where you go with that.

01:24:35

Thank you, Anonymous. And if you privately email me your full name and mailing address, you have just won a free copy of the book we are addressing that Fred has been generous enough to provide for a limited number of listeners who send in questions.

01:24:52

Royal Deceptions, exposing the King James only conspiracies against God's word.

01:24:57

Thank you for the very excellent question. We have Ronald in Eastern Suffolk County, Long Island, who said that King, you said that King James onlyists refer to the

01:25:13

King James as the word of God. Now, I understand that there is a difference between the perfection and inerrancy and infallibility of the original autographs, the original manuscripts.

01:25:26

But don't you consider the NASB, the word of God or other modern translations that you are now defending?

01:25:33

If it is not the word of God, why would you defend them? Ah, yes, he's got his finger on a good point.

01:25:42

When we say that it's the word of God, what the King James onlyist is going to insist, at least this is the way

01:25:49

I would argue when I was a thoroughgoing King James onlyist, is that that Bible most accurately translates the original language text, that the original language text from which it's translated are the preserved

01:26:06

Xerox copies. I mean, you know, you go to a photocopy of Jude's book, it's as if he wrote it yesterday.

01:26:18

That's what the King James only, or the King James translators are translating from. So the

01:26:23

King James onlyist, I believe that that translation is going to reflect, with actual 100 % certainty, what

01:26:33

Jude wrote. And so if you challenge the translation of a certain word or phrase, or if you try to add clarity or something of that nature, or re -translate something, well then you are actually physically altering the text of Scripture.

01:26:49

You're wrecking the revelation of God. You're introducing heresy when you did that. The guy is correct in that, yeah,

01:26:59

I believe the ESV and the NASB, even the NIV, I don't prefer that as a translation, but I believe that God has preserved his word in such a fashion that it's going to be contained in all of those translations.

01:27:14

They don't change the meaning of what God originally wrote in the autographs.

01:27:20

The copies of those autographs are obviously going to collect little flourishes and errors from whatever reason.

01:27:29

Sometimes they might be intentional, but for the most part they're not. But those copies are going to have these little problems, and the way

01:27:38

God, I believe, has protected his Scripture is that by spreading that out all over the world, and particularly the ancient world where the church was, it kept it from being gathered up and being changed or, you know, conformed to one particular edition.

01:27:55

He couldn't have a heretic get a Bible, you know, or get the Bible and totally change it and introduce heresy in it because you'd have a whole bunch of other copies over here that would refute what he's trying to change in his particular version.

01:28:11

And so those texts are going to be preserved by the Lord by the fact that there are many, and we're going to take those and through just the basics of textual criticism, which has been practiced by the church as early as origin when he began to sort of think about these things and collect for us these manuscripts, you know, those, we can trust

01:28:35

God's Word in that he has preserved it for us in both the Old and the New Testament. It's not, and it hasn't been lost, it hasn't been corrupted by heretics to where we don't know what

01:28:47

God is saying or that it's going to somehow trick you into believing wrongly about biblical truth.

01:28:54

It's just not happening that way. So I was trying to get out of my book. So to clarify, when we say, those of us that believe it is completely just and in fact wise to consult various translations of God's Word in the

01:29:17

English language or whatever language that you happen to speak, that is going to be the best way to be hearing or reading the full counsel of God, the way

01:29:31

God intended it. And I know that you made a little faux pas before. God didn't write it. He breathed it.

01:29:37

He used human instruments to write it. But that when you say that God's breathed

01:29:45

Word is only perfectly available in one translation, and then you will have scholars finding errors in that, that brings pollution and doubt into the whole concept of believing in the inerrancy and infallibility of God's Word, doesn't it?

01:30:04

Yeah, exactly. And that's one of the things I wanted to hit on in my book is that rather than, you know, giving us this sort of confidence in God's Word, I think the

01:30:14

King James position, using that only as the exclusive book that no one else, you know, you can't change, or it's only the

01:30:23

Word of God. When you do find those problems, well, there you're going to, they're actually going to find

01:30:28

God's words, you know, His integrity of Scripture is going to be challenged. It's going to be, you know, questioned.

01:30:35

And that's like, well, wait a minute. They're telling me that this is the only pure and authoritative Word of God that you've got these problems with it.

01:30:43

What is that? And if you try to find some clever way to explain that away that's not really accurate, and it's not, you know, it's kind of based on conspiracy or revisionist sort of history, well, then you're going to basically put a person in a place or a position to where they're going to have doubts about their faith in the long run.

01:31:07

It's like, well, is this really God's Word? And then you're going to have all kinds of issues there with that person who's unable to really defend

01:31:17

God's Word the way they should. In fact, and it's they, the King James Onlyists, who hurl that accusation at us, that because we believe in multiple translations being accurate and some being superior to others in certain areas, like for instance, you'll hear someone like Dr.

01:31:37

James R. White sometimes will say, even though I love the NASB, I think the

01:31:44

King James version is the best translation in this passage, or I think the ESV puts it best in this passage, or et cetera.

01:31:52

And I would agree with that, yes. But the King James Onlyist has a dilemma because, especially if they do not believe in re -inspiration, because the only way that you could possibly believe any

01:32:06

English translation or any translation into another language outside of the original

01:32:12

Hebrew and Greek, you would have to believe the translators are infallible and inerrant, and somehow inspired divinely by the

01:32:21

Holy Spirit. Or at least just for those eight years or so that they were translating that particular translation.

01:32:28

And for some reason God used people that in the minds of most independent fundamentalist

01:32:34

Baptists are heretics to do this, the Anglicans. Right, that's true.

01:32:40

In fact, there's a humorous story that I once heard by the late John Riesinger. I don't know if you remember

01:32:46

John Riesinger. I do. I read a lot of his materials. Well, John, I used to go to the

01:32:52

Bunyan Conference, the John Bunyan Conference every year, for a number of years. And he referred to an organization, in fact,

01:33:01

I believe D .A. Waite may have founded it, or is the leader of it, called the Dean Burgeon Society.

01:33:07

Yeah, he used the president for that. As far as I know, is he still alive? I don't even know if D .A.

01:33:13

Waite is still alive. If he died, he died recently, because I'm pretty sure he's still alive. But what

01:33:20

I was going to say is that in order to be in the Dean Burgeon Society, you have to be an independent fundamentalist

01:33:25

Baptist. But the irony is that Dean Burgeon was an Anglican. I know, exactly.

01:33:32

And he had like, you know, critical remarks against Westcott and Wharton who were giving a newer translation.

01:33:39

And a lot of that came from, you know, their use of new finds that they had acquired in the fallen

01:33:46

Ottoman Empire there in the Arab world, where a lot of times, and for a long time, those manuscripts were unaccessible because the

01:33:56

Muslims controlled your access to those monasteries and various libraries.

01:34:01

But then the Ottoman Empire fell, and you had all these people were able to get in there and start looking at that stuff.

01:34:08

And it's like, wait a minute, these texts are older than this here. And, you know, sexual criticism began to really take off.

01:34:17

Were there bad people who used sexual criticism to attack God's Word? Well, of course, as there always will be.

01:34:25

It's what God tells us is going to happen, and you're going to have haters of his revelation. But for the most part, you know, they were sincere men who were trying to get back to what did

01:34:38

God really say, and let's discover that for the health of the

01:34:43

Church. They saw that as a gift that God had given them so that they could, you know, solidify his scriptures and, you know, affirm the doctrines that are contained in it.

01:34:54

They didn't see it as a means to introduce heresy and... Are you talking about the translators of the...

01:35:00

Yeah, these various translators and the people who got these manuscripts. They began to give us our modern versions, and to move us kind of away from the

01:35:10

King James Bible. And also... They were doing it for sinister reasons. And the thing that we got to remember is the

01:35:15

King James translators themselves never made the claims about their work that King James onlyists make.

01:35:23

They never claimed that this was going to be the end of all biblical scholarship and translation effort.

01:35:32

They never claimed that this was the one true, inerrant, and infallible translation, and all others must be banished.

01:35:39

They never thought that of their own work. Right, they didn't. And if you read the original preface to the very first King James that they published, they had a long -winded, you know,

01:35:52

Puritan sort of written preface explaining their work and what they wanted to accomplish.

01:35:58

And they were very clear that they understood that in the future that there would be better translations that would come along, and that they were hoping that their work would serve as something of a building block for future translators of God's Word as, you know, as the

01:36:13

Church moved on triumphantly, and that they would be able to be an encouragement to those people that they come along with, find a better way to maybe translate things and to render, you know, a new translation.

01:36:27

They didn't see their work as final and absolute, and if you challenge it, then you're challenging, you know, the authority of God's Word.

01:36:35

They didn't see it that way at all. And, well, thank you, Ronald, in Eastern Suffolk County.

01:36:42

Please make sure we have your full mailing address because you've also won a free copy of Royal Deceptions, and keep your eye out in the mail for a package from cvbbs .com,

01:36:54

Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service, cvbbs .com, because they're the ones actually physically shipping it to you at no charge to you nor to Iron Trumpet's Iron Radio.

01:37:06

We have another anonymous listener who says, how do you respond to the charges that many of my closest friends who are

01:37:16

King James -only -ists make when they will look at a passage that appears on its surface to have a superior rendering to all other translations that would maintain a belief, for instance, in the deity of Christ or some other crucial doctrine, and when a modern translation might leave out a word with the intention of not adding words that were not in the earlier manuscripts?

01:37:48

The King James -only -ists will say, see, they removed that word. How do you typically respond to those that will claim the modern translations purposely removed words to lessen the important doctrines, such as the deity of Christ or salvation by grace through faith alone or a multitude of other issues that we could address?

01:38:12

Ah, that's an excellent question, and I do address this specifically in my book, so if they can get a copy of that, that'd be great.

01:38:21

What they're talking about are instances where it seems to be, when you read a modern version, they're taking away from the blood of Christ, or it looks like they've tweaked a verse here or there that might take away from what this person was saying, the deity of Christ, but that's not what's happening at all.

01:38:41

A lot of the modern versions, they're trying to find out what was originally written by the apostles, by the inspired apostle.

01:38:51

So when they go back and they look at these older manuscripts, which the King James owners will vilify, they'll claim that, well, they see they took out these things.

01:39:01

Well, did they really? Or did later Christians from which, you know, that created the manuscripts from which the

01:39:09

King James are translated, did they add to those manuscripts some clarification to make sure that the reader understands, oh, he's talking about the deity of Christ.

01:39:22

So for example, you'll see instances where they'll have like in, I think in Ephesians, where it talks about the blood of Christ, but in Colossians, in a similar sounding word, in the modern versions, they won't have that little phrase in that same verse, similar sounding verse.

01:39:39

And what other copyists have done in the past is they would oftentimes bring over that similar sounding verse to make it sort of balanced together.

01:39:50

It's like, well, I think what he means is this, but that's not really what he wrote. They're just trying to, you know, smooth out the text or they're trying to add some clarification to what was said or written or whatever.

01:40:04

So in their mind, they're helping God as it were, when really what they're doing is, I think causing a little bit of confusion here in the 21st century when people look back and say, wait a minute, this

01:40:14

Bible says this and this Bible says something different. Well, they're not taking away from the word of God to introduce heresy or anything of that nature.

01:40:22

But what it is, you have copyists in the past who have in their copying and then

01:40:27

I think in a lot of times in their zealous efforts have tried to, you know, add to the

01:40:34

Bible to put things in there that weren't necessary. So the scriptures, even modern versions clearly talk about the deity of Christ.

01:40:42

It clearly talks about the virgin birth. In fact, James White's King James only controversy has a chart where he compares the modern translations with the

01:40:55

King James and shows how some of them are superior to the King James translations of certain texts to prove the very deity of Christ.

01:41:05

Yeah, exactly. And both modern versions of the King James clearly teach the deity of Christ.

01:41:12

I could teach a Mormon or a Jehovah witness about the deity of Christ with either translation.

01:41:19

It's not difficult. And I think that King James only has tend to exaggerate that. A lot of times they exaggerate these so -called problems greater than what they really are.

01:41:30

And it's just not the case. When you kind of dig down a little bit and you look at what they're saying and you look at the evidence, what they're claiming about that modern version is not panning out and it's not saying what they're claiming it's saying.

01:41:45

And that can be a problem because then you got people who are like, wait a minute. Yeah, I can see what that person's saying because it is changing it.

01:41:52

But it's not really when you consider what they're saying. Okay, we are going to our final break right now.

01:42:04

It's going to be much more brief than the other breaks. So please be patient with us.

01:42:10

Or should I say, please make sure you get in your questions before we run out of time because it is a briefer break.

01:42:15

So send your questions immediately. If you have one to chrisarnson at gmail .com. chrisarnson at gmail .com

01:42:23

We'll be right back with Fred Butler right after these messages from our sponsors. When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the

01:42:33

New American Standard Bible were among my very first sponsors. It gives me joy knowing that many scholars and pastors in the

01:42:42

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio audience have been sticking with or switching to the

01:42:47

NASB. I'm Dr. Tony Costa, professor of apologetics and Islam at the

01:42:52

Toronto Baptist Seminary. And the NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Jeff Downs of Knox Reform Presbyterian Church in Mechanicsville, Virginia.

01:43:01

And the NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Mark Romaldi of Grace Reform Baptist Church of Long Island in Merritt, New York.

01:43:10

And the NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Scott Pasolo of the

01:43:16

Master's Church of Bucks County, Pennsylvania. And the NASB is my

01:43:22

Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Kevin Venio of the Bible Church of Port Washington, New York.

01:43:28

And the NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Andrew Smith of Christ Reformed Community Church in St.

01:43:34

Augustine, Florida. And the NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Clint Leiter of High William Chapel, Sedalia, Missouri.

01:43:44

And the NASB is my Bible of choice. Here's a great way for your church to help keep

01:43:50

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio on the air. Pastors, are your pew Bibles tattered and falling apart?

01:43:57

Consider restocking your pews with the NASB. And tell the publishers you heard about them from Chris Arnzen on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

01:44:06

Go to nasbible .com. That's nasbible .com to place your order.

01:44:14

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries and the Dividing Line Webcast here. Although God has brought me all over the globe for many years to teach, preach and debate at numerous venues, some of my very fondest memories are from those precious times of fellowship with Pastor Rich Jensen and the brethren at Hope Reform Baptist Church, now located at their new beautiful facilities in Coram, Long Island, New York.

01:44:36

I've had the privilege of opening God's word from their pulpit on many occasions, have led youth retreats for them, and have always been thrilled to see their members filling many seats at my

01:44:45

New York debates. I do not hesitate to highly recommend Hope Reform Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island to anyone who wants to be accurately taught, discipled and edified by the

01:44:55

Holy Scriptures, and to be surrounded by truly loving and caring brothers and sisters in Christ.

01:45:00

I also want to congratulate Hope Reform Baptist Church of Coram for their recent appointment of Pastor Rich Jensen's co -elder,

01:45:07

Pastor Christopher McDowell. For more information on Hope Reform Baptist Church, go to hopereformedli .net.

01:45:14

That's hopereformedli .net or call 631 -696 -5711.

01:45:21

That's 631 -696 -5711. Tell the folks at Hope Reform Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island, that you heard about them from James White on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

01:45:38

Thriving financial is not your typical financial services provider. As a membership organization, we help

01:45:44

Christians be wise with money and live generously every day. And for the fourth year in a row, we were named one of the world's most ethical companies by the

01:45:53

Ethisphere Institute, a leading international think tank dedicated to the creation, advancement and sharing of best practices in business ethics.

01:46:03

Contact me, Mike Gallagher, financial consultant at 717 -254 -6433.

01:46:10

Again, 717 -254 -6433 to learn more about the

01:46:15

Thrivant difference. We know we were made for so much more than ordinary life.

01:46:24

Lending faith, finances and generosity. That's the Thrivant story. We were made to thrive.

01:46:46

Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said, Give yourself unto reading. The man who never reads will never be read.

01:46:54

He who never quotes will never be quoted. He will not use the thoughts of other men's brains, proves he has no brains of his own.

01:47:02

You need to read. Solid Ground Christian Books is a publisher and book distributor who takes these words of the

01:47:08

Prince of Preachers to heart. The mission of Solid Ground Christian Books is to bring back treasures of the past to minister to Christians in the present and future, and to publish new titles that address burning issues in the church and the world.

01:47:21

Since its beginning in 2001, Solid Ground has been committed to publish God -centered,

01:47:26

Christ -exalting books for all ages. We invite you to go treasure hunting at Solid -Ground -Books .com

01:47:33

That's Solid -Ground -Books .com and see what priceless literary gems from the past to present you can unearth from Solid Ground.

01:47:43

Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. Here's what

01:47:52

Gary DeMar, president of American Vision, had to say about Iron Sharpens Iron Radio recently.

01:47:58

Good to be back, Chris. I always enjoy our time. I have to tell you, one of the better interviewers out there, and I've been doing this for 30, more than 30 years.

01:48:08

Wow, that's some compliment. How much do I owe you for that? You don't have to owe me anything.

01:48:15

We're in good shape. I'm glad you said it on the air so I don't have to brag about myself.

01:48:21

Tell your friends and loved ones about Iron Sharpens Iron Radio airing live Monday through Friday 4 to 6 p .m.

01:48:28

Eastern Time at IronSharpensIronRadio .com This is

01:48:44

Pastor Bill Sousa, Grace Church at Franklin, here in the beautiful state of Tennessee.

01:48:49

Our congregation is one of a growing number of churches who love and support

01:48:54

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio financially. Grace Church at Franklin is an independent, autonomous body of believers which strives to clearly declare the whole counsel of God as revealed in Scripture through the person and work of our

01:49:11

Lord Jesus Christ. And of course, the end of which we strive is the glory of God.

01:49:18

If you live near Franklin, Tennessee, and Franklin is just south of Nashville, maybe 10 minutes, or you are visiting this area, or you have friends and loved ones nearby, we hope you will join us on Lord's Day in worshiping our

01:49:32

God and Savior. Please feel free to contact me if you have more questions about Grace Church at Franklin.

01:49:40

Our website is gracechurchatfranklin .org That's gracechurchatfranklin .org

01:49:49

This is Pastor Bill Sousa wishing you all the richest blessings of our

01:49:54

Sovereign Lord, God, Savior, and King, Jesus Christ, today and always.

01:50:13

We are excited to announce another new member of the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio advertising family,

01:50:19

Banu Gadi, owner of three New York pharmacies, Lee's Drugs of Floral Park, Long Beach Chemists, and Prescription Center of Long Island in Hempstead.

01:50:30

Banu Gadi earned a doctorate in pharmacy degree and is very knowledgeable on the current coronavirus pandemic.

01:50:37

Please contact Dr. Gadi so he and his expert staff can give you proper guidance amid all the contradictory confusion we are all hearing in the media.

01:50:47

To find the pharmacy nearest you, call 516 -354 -2000. That's 516 -354 -2000.

01:50:56

Or order online at leesdrugsrx .com. That's L -E -E -S drugsrx .com.

01:51:06

Don't forget to ask about their discount generic drug program. Greetings in the matchless name of our

01:51:12

Lord Jesus Christ. My name is Banu Gadi. I'm a pharmacist in New York, which is the epicenter of the latest crisis the world is going through.

01:51:22

In Psalm 139 verse 14, the psalmist offers praise to the Lord like this.

01:51:27

I praise you because I'm fearfully and wonderfully made and wondrous are your works that my soul knows very well.

01:51:34

He saw God's goodness and mercy, kindness, and the beauty in what

01:51:39

God has designed and he has erupted into praise. In any crisis or problem, brothers and sisters, our only fallback position is to trust

01:51:49

God's design. And once we do, there is nothing for us to do but to erupt in praise to him.

01:51:56

When the whole world is searching for a solution, God in his infinite mercy has given us what we need to address this illness, which can be very serious.

01:52:05

Such is the beauty of his design. Knowing that design, how can we not erupt in praise to our great

01:52:12

God like the psalmist did? May God bless you and give all of us wisdom to see greater things in his design.

01:52:19

Thank you. And the voice you just heard, Dr. Banu Gadi, the sponsor of this program.

01:52:27

He is a co -elder along with the aforementioned Dr. Doug McMasters, who was a colleague of my guest today,

01:52:36

Fred Butler. Dr. Doug McMasters being the pastor of New Hyde Park Baptist Church on Long Island, who used to work for Grace to You Ministries on staff there.

01:52:48

And Banu Gadi is an elder there at New Hyde Park Baptist. But we are in our final segment here, and I already know,

01:52:55

Fred, that I want you back because we need to get into many more of those six defenses of King James -only -ism that they present to us to grapple with and how you would respond to them.

01:53:12

But just to clear up something to the idea, because this is a frequently thing, probably the most frequently thing

01:53:22

I hear, frequently heard thing that I hear from King James -only -ists is that they will say things just like our listeners said.

01:53:32

Well, look at this passage. The Lord, the word the Lord in the NASB is left out, or the word

01:53:38

Lord in the NIV is left out, or the defenders of your modern translations don't even believe in the passage of the woman being caught in adultery is a

01:53:52

God -breathed text that belongs in the canon, and we could go on and on. But one way that I have sought to add clarity to that, and I don't know if I succeed or not, but I said, let's say that I want to come up with a translation, the

01:54:11

Chris Arnsen translation, and in John 1, 1, it says, in the beginning was the word, and the word was

01:54:19

God, and the word was with God. And I add the phrase for further clarity, and the word was

01:54:26

Jesus Christ, the second person of the Trinity. That sentence is nowhere in any manuscript.

01:54:34

That's correct. And then, then for some reason, 500 years from now, the most popular translation of the

01:54:42

Bible is the Chris Arnsen version. And you have those defenders who have become Chris Arnsen version -onlyists saying, look at these other translations.

01:54:51

They left out the reference to the Trinity in John 1, 1. See how heretical they are? That's kind of what we're talking about here, isn't it?

01:54:58

Yeah, exactly. A good example of that is in 1 John chapter 5, and I believe it's verses 7 and 8.

01:55:07

And in the King James, it has something along the lines of, you know, this is the water and the blood, and the father.

01:55:15

I can't remember exactly what it is. I'm totally pulling this from memory, but it makes reference to the Trinity. The King James, or at least the text from which the

01:55:23

King James are translated, are the only ones that really have that rendering.

01:55:29

And so they'll claim, there you have a full and complete recognition of the

01:55:34

Trinity, the triune Godhead in that one verse that John is referencing. But that's not found in the vast majority of manuscripts anywhere.

01:55:45

In fact, I think Erasmus didn't even have it in his first edition of his

01:55:51

Texas Receptus, or what would become known as the Texas Receptus. And later, somebody produced some manuscripts that had it, and, you know, he had added or something.

01:56:02

I can't remember the details of that, but they traced that back, and it very well could have been that that was a marginal rendering by some scribe who was copying that.

01:56:13

And he added the concept in the margins of his manuscript that just said, you know, he's talking about the

01:56:20

Trinity, or he tried to clarify what John is saying there.

01:56:26

That rendering eventually found its way either into a future copy of that manuscript, or, you know, it came into use, and somehow it became part of our understanding of textual history and our textual criticism, and, you know, it's become part of our

01:56:45

Bible. So now if you remove it, well, then you're, you know, removing a mention of the Trinity.

01:56:51

Well, honestly, you don't need to go to that passage to prove the Trinity. You know, the Trinity is found all over the place in the

01:56:58

New Testament, and the idea that somehow you're removing the Trinity or, you know, corrupting

01:57:04

God's Word that way, it's just not, it just doesn't bear that out when you study it out, you know, to its conclusion.

01:57:11

And we have Susan Margaret in Dauphin County, Pennsylvania.

01:57:18

You'll have to be quick with this answer, and it's kind of related to what you just said. Was not the

01:57:24

Latin vulgate a, let's see here, she's kind of using improper grammar here.

01:57:31

Was not the Latin vulgate a crucial aspect of the development of the Textus Receptus?

01:57:37

And it is odd to me that that would be the case since most independent fundamentalist

01:57:42

Baptists who are King James Onlyists vehemently oppose Roman Catholicism as a false religion, and the

01:57:49

Church as a false Church. Right, the Latin vulgate would basically be a translation from the

01:57:55

Greek into Latin. It wasn't the best translation because I think it was the work of Jerome, if I'm remembering my history.

01:58:03

Yes, it was the work of Jerome. And it wasn't, and so it had its problems because Jerome had, you know, he wasn't the greatest translator and, you know, he was kind of working by himself and maybe a few other people helping him, and it became the standard.

01:58:19

In fact, for the longest time there was Latin vulgate onlyness, only if, because when the

01:58:25

Protestants began to want to translate from the original Greek manuscripts, the

01:58:31

Catholics opposed that and they were like, well, wait a minute, we already have, you know, God's Word in the Latin. You're going to change

01:58:37

God's Word and put it in the vulgate tongue, and, you know, that way you're devaluing the Word of God.

01:58:42

It's, you know, it's in the Latin, which is inspired, and it's, you know, a heavenly language kind of thing.

01:58:50

I'm sure that King James translators probably referenced the Latin vulgate.

01:58:55

They had a lot of different sources that they used and they appealed to when they did their translation.

01:59:01

Their translation really was more of a revision of a lot of translations that had already gone before them, and they were pulled heavily from Tyndale's work, as I mentioned at the beginning of our program, and they tried their best to stay in a reference to what the

01:59:20

Greek text is saying. Okay, we're out of time, Fred, but we're going to have you back. If you could hold on,

01:59:25

I'd like to schedule you off the air, another interview. I want to thank everybody who listened, and don't forget about GraceTU's website, gty .org,

01:59:35

gty .org, the ministry of Dr. John MacArthur, where our guest, Troy Butler, is on the staff.

01:59:42

I want to thank Fred for being my guest. Look forward to his return. I want to thank everybody who listened, and I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater