June 3, 2022 Show with Alexander Wright on “Fulfilling the Great Comission by Equipping Pastors, Leaders, & Laymen with the Proper Tools to Instruct Sound Theology Abroad”

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

Carwile, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron. This is a radio platform in which pastors,

Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the Church and the world today.

Proverbs 27, verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have a view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.

And now, here's your host, Chris Arnzen. Good afternoon,

Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Friday on this third day of June 2022.

And I'm thrilled to have back on the program a returning guest, Alexander Wright, who is founder and president of Vessels for Christ.

We are going to be addressing fulfilling the Great Commission by equipping pastors, leaders, and laymen with the proper tools to instruct sound theology abroad.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Alex Wright. Thanks, Chris.

Thanks for having me on. Always love listening to the program and just glad to be here. Let's have a good show.

I'm sure we will. And tell our listeners about Vessels for Christ. So Vessels for Christ is a 501c3 nonprofit ministry.

Started about 2017. We started and just the

Lord put on my heart a burden for missions after I got saved and started traveling to Belize and then went to Myanmar, went to India, began raising money for different pastors, missionaries, orphanages there and started the ministry.

And we're just trying to fulfill the Great Commission, equip and edify believers, pastors, leaders overseas, and encourage them with the

Word of God. And because there's some dark places out there, the gospel still needs to go out to almost 6 ,000 people groups.

So we're trying to come alongside those people or those pastors and leaders to go to those unreached areas.

Wow, it's amazing that in the 21st century that there are still unreached people groups who have not yet heard the gospel.

That just boggles my mind. Yeah, it's wild. I was actually reading earlier a story about the guy

John Chow. Do you remember the story about him? No. He was going to the,

I believe it was the Sentinel Islands in India, and he was preparing for 10 years to go over there, and he actually got killed just trying to reach these people.

He made it on the shore, but it was short -lived for him. And I was reading a story that was encouraging to see someone with the boldness and the zeal that he had to share the gospel with an unreached people group and ultimately giving his life for it.

Well, if anybody wants more information about the ministry Vessels for Christ, go to vesselsforchrist .org,

vesselsforchrist .org, and I intend to repeat this information later on in the program as well.

Well, although you have already given your salvation testimony, which is a tradition we have on this program for first -time guests, you're not a first -time guest, but the only time you gave your testimony was in an abbreviated interview that we had on site at the

G3 conference. So now that we're conducting a longer interview, I'm going to give you another opportunity to give a summary of your salvation testimony on Iron Trump and Zion Radio that would include the kind of religious atmosphere, if any, you were raised in and the kinds of providential circumstances our sovereign

Lord raised up in your life that drew you to himself and saved you. So I'd love to hear that story again.

Yeah, sure, sounds good. So I was raised in a nominal Christian home at best.

We went to church every so often on Sundays, but there wasn't a very, there wasn't very an atmosphere where we were serving the

Lord or reading the Bible together. We weren't keeping

Christ's commandments, as he says in his word. So that was kind of what I grew up with.

I had a little bit of a rough relationship with my dad. We have a really good relationship now, but growing up we just butted heads at times, and we just kind of went back and forth.

So because of that, I'm originally from Naperville, Illinois.

I was going to school there. So when I turned 18, instead of staying in state for college,

I actually went to the University of Arizona. So I went out there in 2006, and I just got into the drug scene, doing a lot of different drugs, fornication with women, gambling, various things, and it just got deeper and deeper to where I was physically addicted to drugs.

I was taking some really hardcore opiate drugs. And from that point on, for eight years, my life was a mix of trying to chase the next high to make myself feel good and ultimately to not get sick at some point, dealing with withdrawals and things like that.

And this went on from the age of 18 to the age of 26. I probably overdosed almost 15 to 20 times.

I never went to a hospital because I was in trouble with the law at times.

I had guns to my face, dealing with different, getting robbed, getting set up, dealing drugs, all these things throughout that period of time.

And basically in 2014, at the beginning of 2014, I was 26 years old.

I was completely addicted to drugs still. Taking a few different drugs every day, having to take them, and I just was getting sick of it, and I really wanted to quit.

Well, at the same time, a friend I coincidentally prayed for my whole life was a

Hindu guy, and he became a Christian. And he started reaching out to me with Bible verses and trying to take me to a

Christian movie, things like that. And I had grown up, like I said, I grew up nominal

Christian at best, went to church, had heard the gospel, not a very clear presentation of the gospel, but definitely knew that Jesus had died for our sins and rose from the grave.

But nothing, I was just still dead in my sins at that point. So my friend started reaching out to me, and we started talking, and basically it got to a point where two of the guys

I was getting drugs from, one tried to commit suicide, and he went to the hospital so I couldn't get drugs from him.

Another guy went to rehab. So my two sources, and let me tell you, Chris, at this point

I had burned a lot of bridges in my life between family and friends and all kinds of things.

So these were the, didn't have many close connections at that point. So these two guys

I was getting drugs from, I couldn't get the drugs from them anymore. So I decided to quit cold turkey, and I actually started withdrawing.

Withdrawing is basically when your body doesn't have the drugs it needs, you start to get flu -like symptoms, you start to get depressed, suicidal, things like that.

And I went to the emergency room, and I said I had some pain in my stomach.

And if you say that, they're not going to give you opiates or anything because it messes with your stomach line.

So the doctor wouldn't give me any painkillers, you know, trying to offset the withdrawals at this point. So I went home, and I just stopped completely.

And, I mean, I had serious, serious withdrawals for about two or three days. Suicidal, depressed, didn't leave my room, you know, just totally messed up.

And then after a few more days, started to feel a little bit better.

And I'd say after about, you know, somewhere between seven and ten days, I called that friend I just told you about, and I spoke with him.

And I said, look, I know Jesus died for my sins. I know he rose from the grave. I know he's the son of God.

I know he's the Lord, and I need to pray. I need to ask forgiveness, not just for this drug addiction, but for my whole life.

And he said, okay, let's pray. So we prayed, and that prayer felt like two hours to me.

In reality, it was only about five minutes. And as soon as I said amen, the

Lord regenerated me. He put a new heart in me. He, as it says in Ezekiel 36, 26, you know, he'll take out the heart of stone, and he'll give you a heart of flesh.

Well, he did that to me after I said amen. And I woke up. It was like I woke up out of a coma.

And I looked around at my room and the filthiness I was living in, and I had, you know, just this love for Christ.

And I walked into church that Sunday for the first time in years, and I was converted instantaneously.

Well, hallelujah. And tell us about how you came to discover and fall in love with and embrace the doctrines of sovereign grace, also known as Reformed theology and Calvinism.

Yeah. So after I got saved, I went down the

NAR, Bethel, IHOP type road, extreme charismania stuff.

And, you know, I was at the prayer houses and all that and just seeing a lot of crazy stuff. And so that was about a period of like one to two years.

And then something happened to me where I actually followed a prophet, quote -unquote prophet, false prophet now, always was.

But I followed him down to Georgia and actually went under his ministry as the youth pastor.

And I was seeing all sorts of things, you know, fake miracles, just, you know, he was swimming in a congregation.

Come to find out later he was, you know, having issues with women in the church, you know, relations with women in the church.

You care to share the identity of this person? Sure, yeah. His name was, quote -unquote, you know,

Prophet Michael Obang. He was in Georgia. Could you repeat the name of that? I'm sorry, the name of that false teacher?

Michael Obang. O -B -A -N -G? I believe so, if I remember correctly.

Okay. Even that sounds like it's false. Yeah, well, he was a

Nigerian. He grew up in Ghana, but he was Nigerian -born. And, yeah,

I believe he's still around, but I know his, after all the allegations and all these things,

I think his, quote -unquote, congregation has dwindled. So that's a good thing, praise the

Lord for that. But so while I was in there, I actually had a lady point to me.

We had a revival one night, and a lady pointed to me. And she said, hey,

I want to speak to you, and she brought me outside. And this was after about three or four months of being there. And she said,

I've never met this lady in my life. And she said, look, you're from Chicago.

She didn't even know that. And she said, you need to go home. You were never supposed to be here. And she puts a $100 bill in my hand.

And she said, the Lord wanted you to have this and go home. And it was wild.

That moment woke me up. And I started to think, am I really supposed to be here?

Is this really what Christianity is about? Is this biblical Christianity? And that moment, you know, think about whatever you want regarding that moment.

But I believe the Lord used that woman to help get me out of there. And so after that happened, eventually

I went back to Chicago. I was crushed. And, you know, some of your listeners know this coming out of NAR.

Your pride is built up so much. And my pride was built up. And NAR is the

New Epistolic Reformation? Yes, New Epistolic Reformation. And this guy was saying to me, you are going to preach the

Bible to Obama at the White House. He was saying, you are going to be the next

Billy Graham. You have the spirit of David and the spirit of Moses.

All these wacky things, you know, that were going on. And so he's saying this to me.

And I mean, so anyway, your pride gets built up, you know, because it's all flesh. It's like you're going to be this great person.

And so after coming out of there, my pride was crushed. I fell into a deep depression for about four or five months.

And I actually fasted and prayed at the end of that period of time.

And the Lord lifted me out of that. So to answer your previous question, how did I discover the doctrines of grace?

So after the Lord lifted me out of that, I started discovering guys like Paul Washer, Tim Conway, R .C.

Sproul, John MacArthur, Steve Lawson. I started listening to these guys.

And I started hearing things about the doctrines of grace, the five solas,

Calvinism, tulip, these terms. And I started studying them on my own. And I just go to the scriptures with what they're saying.

And I'm saying, this is exactly what the scriptures teach. And the last part that I had struggled with was limited atonement.

But actually, James White was a big influence. Listening to him break that down about God, Christ dying for his chosen people, the elect, that really helped get over that, you know, three or four -month period.

That was the last piece of the tulip puzzle, so to say. But that was how I discovered the doctrines of grace.

Praise God. And if anybody listening wants to ask a question of your own, of Alex, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

chrisarnson at gmail .com. As always, give us your first name at least, your city and state, and your country of residence if you live outside the

USA. Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal, private matter. Well, our subject matter today is focusing on fulfilling the

Great Commission by equipping pastors, leaders, and laymen with the proper tools to instruct sound theology abroad.

What exactly and specifically do you mean by that, as far as proper tools especially?

I mean, you know, the problem in a lot of other countries is bad theology.

I'll just take one place, for example, that I do work with in southern India near Hyderabad. I work with a pastor there, and it is, from being there personally and talking to him on a regular basis, they are mixing

Christianity with Hinduism. Pentecostalism is really big down there.

False charismatic teachings are very big. They love guys like Kenneth Copeland, and Joyce Meyer, and Jesse Duplantis, and these guys that, you know, you've had

Justin Peters on the show before, and he preaches, or he talks against these guys.

These guys are big in that area. So a lot of that stuff is getting mixed up, and the devil is using that big time to deceive many.

And then what happens is India is such a—the illiteracy rate is very high there, so these guys are teaching people who, you know, many of them aren't reading, so they're just learning from them.

So it's just this trickle -down event, or this trickle -down thing. And so what we try to do is, in that area, we provide this pastor we work with with resources so he can create copies of Martin Luther's 95

Theses, books on Reformed Systematic Theology, books on John Owen, I'm trying to think what else, probably like some

MacArthur books, some Steve Lawson books, things like this. So we try to equip them with good materials and resources so he can then, you know, give these out at certain conferences in the area, and also he can learn himself and teach these guys he's working with and discipling with these laymen pastors in the area.

So that's partly what I mean by when I said that. Okay, well, there is a lot of ways where people who are trying to convey the doctrines of sovereign grace to any given people, no matter where they are in the world, there is obviously commentaries.

There are books on theology by a vast assortment of Christians from the past and present,

The Miracle of the Internet, which has both been used mightily by God and mightily by Satan as well, unfortunately.

Tell us, you're in an area somewhere in the world and you are basically trying to disciple, probably to start with leaders, pastors and so on.

How do you go about instructing them how to properly instruct themselves?

Well, so, I mean, so because of COVID, I haven't been traveling that much.

I'm actually going to be doing some trips this year to Belize and India, maybe to the

UK as well. But while I have not been there, and this is what I would be doing on the ground,

I work with this pastor, my main pastor in India. He has a good understanding of the doctrines of grace and good theology, so I kind of help him do more things regarding that, point him to the scriptures more and show him more how he can effectively teach these guys.

Like, I'll give you an example. He will go out to this area and he'll hold a conference of about 100 people, and a few guys will be really zealous and want to understand more and learn more, and they're not really asking for anything in return.

And so he will take them and he will start discipling them, and then they will go back to their churches and teach them, and then hopefully it will be a trickle -down event in a positive manner, and hopefully more of this sound theology and biblical truth can go out more across this area that's just rampant with false doctrine and heresy.

And do you have any anecdotal experiences that you can share with us on witnessing people from foreign lands, seeing perhaps for the first time these doctrines and embracing them?

Let me think about that. In fact, why don't you think about it while we go to our first break, because I don't want to interrupt you mid -sentence.

Okay. All right. If anybody wants to join us on the air with a question of your own for Alex, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

chrisarnson at gmail .com. Give us your first name at least, your city and state, and your country of residence. Don't go away. We'll be right back with Alex Wright.

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I just love that guitar riff by Larry Correale. But we are now back with our guest today,

Alexander Wright. We are discussing his ministry, Vessels for Christ, and if anybody has a question that you'd like to submit, our email address is chrisarndsen at gmail .com,

chrisarndsen at gmail .com. Please give us at least your first name, your city and state, and your country of residence.

And before we go to any of the listener questions that have already come in, please,

Alex, if you could pick up where we left off. I asked you about any anecdotal experiences of people that you've worked with discovering the doctrines of grace.

Sure, yeah. Before I go to the story I'm thinking of, I wanted to address something.

You were talking about the Internet and how people have access to a lot of these resources.

But I wanted to say that in a lot of other countries, you would think they would, but you have to pay for Internet and you have to pay for things, services like that, and sometimes they don't have enough money in some of these areas to even pay for data or Internet.

I think sometimes it can be something we think, we don't even think twice of it here in the U .S.

or in the Western nations. Well, I pay a lot for my Internet, so maybe I'm doing something wrong. Paying a whole lot of...

So, yeah, it's so good to get some materials in their hands and things like that. Sometimes they just don't even have access.

I mean, I think with this Elon Musk Starlink thing, there will be a lot more access across the world and in a lot of these rural parts, but pray for that.

But, yeah, I was thinking about a story. Well, because I haven't been overseas in a while here because of all the

COVID stuff, but I can give you a story from a pastor I worked with in India.

He was recently holding a conference, and so he's holding a conference.

There's probably about 70 to 100 people there. We were able to provide food and drinks and books for the conference and actually pay for the transportation costs because a lot of these pastors are traveling from rural areas and just need some rupees, as they say, the money, the monetary thing in India.

Give them a couple so you can take the bus. So he's at this conference, and two women were there.

One stood up and said, I have a vision from God, and God has called me to preach.

And she started talking about this, and he actually let her go on for a little bit.

He wanted to be respectful and nice at the time. And, boy, don't I hate that when

I'm in the audience for something like that. Yeah, exactly.

And so she does this. And so, anyway, she wanted to be respectful and nice. So after she does this, she gets back up, and he waits for her to finish, and he rebukes her, and he quotes directly 1

Timothy 2 .12, but I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over man but to remain quiet.

And then he goes on about this, and her and the other lady got upset, and they walked out of the conference.

Yeah, it reminds me of when I was at a James White conference that I actually organized at a church that was not my own.

I have to make that clear. And during a time of testimony that the pastor of that church apparently had every

Sunday, a woman stood up and spoke for about a half hour, chewing into Dr.

White's time, and her testimony was that her son couldn't afford to go to college, so he would sneak into classes and take courses at a local college and take notes and all this, and was not paying for this.

And when she was going through a crisis of guilt over this, she said

God told her it was okay. So that was the half hour of wasted time and also heresy that intruded into Dr.

White's time during this conference. And I was amazed that the pastor said nothing to contradict or reprimand or chastise the woman for her belief that basically

God was telling her to steal. But anyway, I'm sorry,

I interrupted you. Were you finished with that? No, no, no, no, I was just listening to you.

Yeah, no, it's amazing when some of these people, you know, they get up, they have visions or dreams or whatever, but they go against Scripture, I mean, clearly against Scripture.

And, I mean, your story with the stealing, mine with the preaching, things like this, and you really see how the devil can just manipulate so many of these people and twist them and throw them off course.

Okay, well, we have a number of questions already from listeners. We have a first -time listener from San Jose, Costa Rica, Eric.

And Eric says, If everything is already predestined, then what role does prayer play in the lives of Christians?

According to Reformed theology, did Jesus die for everyone or just the elect? I'm just generally confused on how

God's absolute sovereignty ties in with works and with man's free will.

Before we have Alex begin to answer those questions, and we'll take them one at a time, we do have on Iron Trip and Zion Radio a multitude of archived interviews, each one being based solely on these issues.

So if you go to irontripandzionradio .com and you click on Podcast Past Shows, and you type in the search engine things like limited atonement and prayer and Calvinism and things like that, you will find a multitude of interviews that deal with these issues.

But these are very commonly asked questions by those who are not

Reformed, as you likely know, Alex. And it's interesting that a non -Reformed person would ask about prayer because many people would think that if God's already predestined everything, why are we praying?

And the better question is, especially when it comes to praying for somebody's salvation, if God's already done everything that He can do, what is your prayer to God going to do to affect that person's salvation?

We're the ones who believe as Calvinists that God not only commands us to pray, but He uses our prayers.

He uses means to save people. He uses prayer. He uses evangelism. He uses preaching and teaching.

He uses books, and I could go on and on, as to the means that God uses to bring people to salvation, and of course the ordinances of the church as well.

But if you want to answer that first question yourself, what role does prayer play in the lives of Christians according to Reformed theology?

Yeah, kind of a two -parter there, but yeah, the prayer thing first and foremost, I mean, like you were saying,

God commands us to pray. We are asked to pray by the Lord. And if you go to the passage,

I can't remember off the top of my head, but where the disciples ask, teach us how to pray.

I mean, that's the one thing where the disciples ask. That's how important prayer is, where He goes to the

Lord's prayer, our Father in heaven, hallowed be thy name, and so on and so forth. But it's like, teach us how to pray.

That's the thing. The best thing to be doing to learn is prayer.

And that is also the hardest thing to do in our flesh as well.

I mean, I think at times, reading the Bible can be easy. We can get in a good pattern to a daily reading plan or something like that.

But prayer, everything against us doesn't want us to pray. But it's what God calls us to do.

The disciples were taught how to pray. I think, of course,

I'll tie this into the next part. The Lord is sovereign. Everything is set forth.

But our prayers can come together, and God can hear our prayers and act in a situation.

I mean, I can think of so many examples. I can think of a family member of mine and my wife who had some very serious health issues, and it was not looking well for her.

And we were praying for her for months and months and months. It was a miracle. She even got out of the hospital.

It was a miracle that we were able to see her and talk with her. I mean, that's how powerful prayer is and how it connects to God's sovereignty.

It's like, well, you know, I'll take a line that I just heard. I was just recently at the Fellowship Conference.

You're familiar with Eno Max Tomlinson, right, Chris? Oh, he's a very good friend of mine, and actually a financial supporter of this program.

Yeah, yeah. I spent some time with him, and they had Tim Conway there and Jeff Thomas at the conference.

Jeff Thomas did a great sermon. I would encourage your listeners to look it up on Albion's YouTube channel about the mysteries of God, the secret things of the

Lord. Some of these things, you know, we can only so much with our human mind and our human brain connect stuff together.

But, you know, some of this is, you know, we just trust in the Lord and trust in what he does and how he's worked out things.

And we might not even know when we get to heaven. Maybe we'll have more information, but we may never know, and we have to be okay with that.

And his second question is, according to Reformed theology, did Jesus die for everyone or just the elect?

Before I allow Alex to answer, we believe that Christ did not only try to save sinners.

We do not believe that he was on a mission to make the lost savable.

We believe that he saved sinners. He didn't try. In fact, God doesn't try to do anything.

Jesus saved sinners on Calvary, and he redeemed them.

He finished his work of redemption completely, and it was perfect, 100%.

And therefore, since we do not believe as Reformed Christians that every single person will be in heaven after they die, we do believe that hell will be inhabited by a countless number of people, tragically.

Obviously, then, that would force us to conclude that Jesus did not die for everyone.

He died to rescue his elect from their sin and to glorify his

Father in heaven. And he allowed others to remain in their sin, which they voluntarily participate in daily.

So that's my answer, but if you want to add to that, Alex? I'll add a little bit.

You remember who wants to be a millionaire? I wish I could call it James White Lifeline right now.

Oh, is he available?

No, I'm just kidding. You know, I'll touch on it a little bit, but a lot of times they'll use

John 3 .16. For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Which to me clearly teaches that, yes, Jesus Christ died for those who will believe. I mean, that's right in the text.

Exactly, exactly. Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say. I mean, that is a particular people group that he died for.

Because, you know, if he died for all and all are not saved, well, then he failed, and he didn't fail.

He redeemed his elect. I mean, that's what he did on the cross. Yeah, and if you read

Paul's admonition to husbands, husbands, love your wives as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her.

Let me read it exactly from the text. This is

Ephesians 5 .25. Husbands, love your wives just as Christ also loved the church and gave himself for her.

I actually did it by memory exactly the way it was written. So, Paul, being inspired by the

Holy Spirit, or having God breathing out his words through Paul inerrantly,

Paul says, husbands, love your wives just as Christ also loved the church and gave himself up for her.

He did not say, husbands, love your wives and every other woman on the planet just as Christ also loved the church and everybody else on the planet and gave himself up for her and everybody on the planet.

He didn't say that. It renders Paul's command to husbands nonsensical and even a moot point.

We're supposed to love wives, our wives, in a particular and unique and exclusive way.

So this text would be really the opposite of what it meant if Christ died for every single person.

So that text is not frequently used by Calvinists to prove the point of limited atonement or definite atonement or particular redemption, but I think it is a perfect text to use to bolster other texts.

Yeah, I completely agree with you on that. Let's see, I want to make sure that Eric in San Jose, Costa Rica didn't ask anything else here.

Oh, I'm confused on how God's absolute sovereignty ties in with works and man's free will.

Well, men freely choose to sin. Men freely choose to follow what their nature dictates.

Man will freely choose and pursue everything that he wants to.

The issue is what does he want to pursue? What does he freely want to pursue and do and believe?

Before his regeneration, he wants to merely please himself. And it requires a miracle of God for man to freely believe in him in a saving and trusting way.

He cannot do so as Romans 8 clearly dictates. A man in the flesh cannot please

God. And if offering God a faith that saves him, that was a bit of a tongue twister, is pleasing to God, then obviously in the flesh he cannot do that.

So in Ezekiel we learn of the fact that there must be a heart transplant that God performs on us in order for us to believe in him in a saving way and follow him.

So God's sovereignty is in that he rescues men from their own depraved will and makes us willing to love, follow, and serve him.

But if you want to add to that as well, Alex. No, I have nothing to add. That's pretty much how

I would have said it too. All right, we're going to our midway break. We have some more listeners who have questions waiting for us.

Please be patient with us, folks, because the midway break is a longer break than normal. We have to take a longer break in the middle because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1

FM in Lake City, Florida, requires of us a longer break because the FCC requires of them to air their own public service announcements and other local things that localize

Iron Trumpet and Zion Radio geographically to Lake City, Florida, where they are based.

While they do that, we simultaneously air our globally heard commercials. So please use this time wisely.

We ask of you to write down as much of the information provided by as many of our advertisers as you can so that you can more successfully and more frequently respond to our advertisers.

That means that we hope that you will purchase products from them, that you will use their services, that you will support their parachurch organizations, and that you will visit their churches.

But when you cannot do any of those things, there's one thing that you definitely can do. If you love this show, you can respond to our advertisers and merely say thank you so much for sponsoring

Iron Trumpet and Zion Radio. That is indeed if you really love the show and are grateful that there are people and businesses and corporations and professional practices and parachurch organizations and churches that share the money that God has given them with us so that we can remain in existence.

If you're really grateful for that because you love the show, please thank our sponsors. We cannot exist without them.

And also take this time to send in a question to Alex Wright about the Vessels for Christ ministry. That's chrisarnson at gmail .com,

chrisarnson at gmail .com. Don't go away. We're going to be right back after these messages. Attention all men in ministry leadership.

You're all invited to my friend Chris Arnson's Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Free Pastors Luncheon Thursday, September 22nd, 11 a .m.

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Before I return to Alexander Wright, founder and president of Vessels for Christ, I just have a couple more announcements to make.

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Earth you live. I have helped many people all over the world in our audience find churches near them, sometimes within only a couple of minutes from where they live.

So I may be able to help you too, and I may be able to help your friends, family, and loved ones who are also in that predicament.

So please, if that is the case, send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com,

and put I need a church in the subject line. That's also the email address where you can send a question to our guest,

Alexander Wright, founder and president of Vessels for Christ. We have

Ted in Moundville, Alabama, who says, There is a well -known

Ghanaian -born plastic surgeon by the name of Michael Obeng whose practice is based in Los Angeles.

This isn't the same man your guest mentioned earlier, is it? No, no, that's not the same man.

Just the same name. Okay. Oh, wow. I was almost certain that you would say, yes, that's him.

No. Well, actually, I hope, Ted, that you sent in that question knowing that Michael Obeng, of which you speak, is a false teacher, and I do want to apologize to Michael Obeng that Ted asked, over which

Ted asked, if he is a sound teacher and evangelist. I don't know who this person is, so I don't want to automatically assume that this person is a false prophet of any kind.

Thanks, Ted, and maybe you want to get back to me to let me know whether or not you are familiar with this person's ministry and whether they would be considered a false teacher by people whom

I interview on this program. We have Cindy in Findlay, Ohio, who says,

Hello, Chris and Alex. Alex, thank you for being a guest on Chris' show today, even though I have heard this subject addressed,

I would like to get your views on the topic of when witnessing to a lost sinner, should you tell them that God loves him or her?

I typically do not express that to them and have heard opposing views.

Thank you for your thoughts in the service to Christ. Well, when witnessing to people, yeah,

I don't usually bring that up. Especially if you do have sound theology, you know

God does hate sinners and he hates the wicked. You know, it talks about that in Psalms and in the

New Testament as well. So I kind of understand where she's coming from with that.

So I don't really, over the last three or four years, yeah,

I've strayed away from saying that. Usually when I witness, I want to press on the law being written on their heart.

Everyone will stand in judgment before God someday and that the only way to be reconciled between you and God and have your sins forgiven is believing on the

Lord Jesus Christ, that he lived, died, and was resurrected.

And then I also can talk about the Trinity as well, you know, three persons, one

God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. But yeah, I tend to stay away from saying that to strangers and when

I'm witnessing. Yeah, I agree. And strangers or people that you know are unregenerate, who you may know personally, and they reject

Christ, they are not demonstrating any fruits of regeneration in their life.

I would not say God loves you. And maybe just to clarify, when you said

God hates sinners, that is true, but he does love sinners who are among his elect and we don't know who his elect are until they give evidence that they are of the elect by repenting and believing upon him.

Yeah, thanks for clarifying that, Chris. I was speaking in context of what you were asking.

Right. So thank you very much, Cindy, for that question.

Well, give us some more of the reasons why our listeners should want to get involved in Vessels for Christ, how they can get involved, the different areas, and so on.

Well, so we strive to come alongside leaders, pastors, evangelists, a few missionaries, and a few orphanages.

We come alongside people who are teachable. They might not know everything we are privy to when it comes to theology in the

West, but we want to make sure they're humble and they're teachable and they love the

Lord and they want to do right by him and also that they fear God.

So these are the guys that we have vetted over the years. We have relationships with the people we support for years now.

We have one orphanage in central Myanmar, a pastor in Chin State, which is in northern

Myanmar. Myanmar is the country next to Thailand. You may have seen them in the news in the last couple of years.

There was a military coup. There's a lot of persecution going on, a lot of villages being burned down, people being attacked, things like that.

We also support Mr. Timothy, who is a pastor and missionary near Yangon, which is southern

Myanmar, and another pastor named Coop. So that's the work we're doing in Myanmar.

Some of these, before COVID, I mean, COVID has made things a little harder at times, but before COVID, some of these guys were going into unreached areas still, still areas where they're not even hearing about Christ or even had heard the name

Jesus Christ. And that's the same as we do work in India.

And the pastor there, I've changed his name for security purposes. His name is Pastor Paul. We'll just refer to him as Paul.

He has a small local church. He's evangelizing. He's going to these unreached areas across the border from the state he's in where they have strict anti -conversion laws.

If he is seen sharing the gospel or baptizing people, he can get in serious trouble.

And there have been people martyred around those areas as well in the last few years.

And so he is specifically going into some of these unreached areas, and that's what we want to see.

We want to see the gospel, as Christ said, proclaimed to the nation. And then also we are working with a brother, a missionary named

Nate Stewart. He was sent out by a local church in Texas. He is in southern Belize. I'll be traveling there at the end of the month.

We provide him mostly with resources as he trains pastors in Belize in sound theology and right doctrine.

So we would love to see people come alongside us because we are just trying to get the gospel out.

We are sharing the gospel where it needs to be shared, and we are doing it for the glory of God. I mean, this is not work that I ever thought

I would be doing. This is nothing of my own. This is all the Lord's. So number one, what we need from people, number one, we need your prayers.

Pray for our ministry. Pray for our people overseas. And number two, we could always use financial support, whether it be monetary or donations of any kind.

You can go to the website, vesselsforchrist .org, and donate or send a check to the P .O. box on there.

So that about sums up what's going on there. And obviously, since you are

Reformed, the very nature of what you do militates against the slander and false claims of anti -Calvinists that being

Reformed is deadly to missions.

In fact, some of the greatest missionaries in history have been thoroughly Reformed. I would actually say the greatest missionaries of history.

And so this in no way, your Reformed faith is obviously not in contradiction to what you are passionately involved in yourself as far as the mission field, right?

Yeah, no, quite the opposite. Yeah, we are called to share the gospel.

We are called to evangelize. We are called to go to the nation. I mean, we are not—I would never associate myself with, you know, the famous story of—not

David Brainerd. Yeah, was it David Brainerd before he was about to go? Have you heard that story, Chris?

You might be thinking of Hudson Taylor. David Brainerd was a missionary to the

Native Americans here in the North American continent. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hudson Taylor went to China.

Yeah, no, I think it was Brainerd. Okay, maybe I'm wrong about what you're going to talk about. When you were saying sent off,

I was thinking maybe you were— Go ahead, finish your story. Yeah, no, that's okay.

I think it was David Brainerd before he went overseas.

I can't remember. I think I'm getting it wrong. A missionary—I forgot who it was off the top of my head, but in English— before he went overseas, people were saying, well, why go if God's going to save you?

Yeah, that's Hudson Taylor. Yeah, Hudson Taylor. Okay, okay. I haven't—you know, it's funny. I'm halfway through Hudson Taylor's spiritual secret, so I'm still reading the book at the moment.

But yeah, Hudson Taylor, yeah. And why even go? God will save them. If he's elect, he'll save them somehow.

Well, you know, quite the opposite. You've got to go. This is what Christ commands us to do, to share the gospel.

I mean, we're not hyper -Calvinists here. We're just Calvinists, you know. We believe in the doctrines of grace, you know, five solas, and Tulip and his principles, but we're not hyper -Calvinists.

We're not sitting here waiting for God to do whatever, you know. We are called to—you know,

God works on our hearts and commands us to share the gospel. Amen. Amen, and that's what historically

Calvinists have always believed, even John Calvin himself.

And as you've mentioned, there are an aberrant group known as hyper -Calvinists that do not fit in the category of faithful missionaries that we were just addressing.

We have a listener, another listener who wants to ask about the

Reformed faith. Let's see. We have RJ in White Plains, New York, and RJ says,

Chris Arnzen was saying earlier that Reformed people do not evangelize by telling

God that He loves them. I have heard Reformed people who disagree with others in the same camp of Reformed theology who believe that God does indeed love all people, and I believe the late

Peter Jeffrey was one of them. Can you explain? Well, I happen to know the late

Peter Jeffrey. I knew him personally. In fact, he was with my own mother in 1995 at her deathbed evangelizing her, and he reassured me when emerging from that room after a half hour that he had absolute, complete confidence that my mother was regenerate due to her responses.

And I had known that prior to Peter's entering into my mother's sick room near her deathbed, but I certainly loved and considered it a gift from God that Peter gave me extra evidence and assurance.

But I believe I know what the listener is talking about. Peter did believe that God loved all of humanity, but in different ways.

And to my knowledge, I don't recall he would evangelize using that phrase to strangers or to open rebels against God that Jesus loves you, even though he believed that God loves all of humanity because he believed that there was a unique love that God only had for His elect.

That's the love of a father, and that's the love of a spouse. That is the kind of love that saves or that offers the grace that saves.

But any comments of your own on that? Yeah, I mean, no, I appreciate the listener's question, and I think your response is great.

Yeah, there's a different type of love between God's chosen, the elect, and the whole world.

There is a different type of love. And, I mean, I just wanted to say one thing was, you know, there is a danger these days, and I think that's why that other previous listener asked that question.

I remember one time I was in Belize at a children's home there that I had been volunteering at, and a group came in, and they're just hugging everyone, saying,

God loves you, God loves you, God loves you, God loves you. But there's no gospel presentation. There's no anything about Christ, anything about, you know, sin, wrath of God, none of that.

It's just God loves you. And I think that's the danger we can experience with that statement today.

Yeah, I've even heard some people who retaliate with mockery when being evangelized.

And there is actually logic in their blasphemous retorts.

They will say, well, if God loves me, I must have nothing to worry about. Thanks. And walk away.

If you tell people that God loves them, especially when I've heard people go on and on with a definition of love, that God's love will never change,

God's love is eternal, God's love is forever, and on and on.

Well, if that is the case, the kind of response that that blasphemer gave to the evangelist

I just mentioned is a very logical response. I mean, because if Jesus Christ died for me and He loves me, then why would

I ever go to hell? So, and now, having said all that,

God in His sovereignty and mercy and grace has saved a multitude of people, even though they've heard that message wrongly delivered, clumsily delivered, with a mixture of truth and falsehood,

God still has used the evangelism and the preaching and teaching of non -reformed people for centuries to bring the lost unto

Him. And that's one of the wonderful things about God, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, no, exactly.

And I spoke my Bible up into Ephesians 5, and Ephesians 5, 1 says, Therefore, be imitators of God and His beloved children, and walk in love, just as Christ also loved you and gave

Himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma. There, it's right there in Scripture.

Amen. I'm going to go to our final break, which is a lot shorter than the other breaks.

I'm going to go to that now, so I don't have to interrupt you in mid -sentence. And if anybody would like to send in a question,

I would urge you to do it very soon, because we are rapidly running out of time. Our e -mail address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

chrisarnson at gmail .com. As always, give us your first name at least, your city and state, and your country of residence. Don't go away.

We're going to be right back with Alexander Wright, right after these messages from our sponsors. James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here, excited to announce that my longtime friend,

Chris Arnson of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, and I are heading to Washington, D .C., for the

G3 Ministries Regional Conference on the theme, Just Thinking About the Bible. The conference will be held

Thursday, September 15th, through Saturday, September 17th. I'll be speaking along with Stephen Lawson, Josh Weiss, founder of G3 Ministries, and Daryl Bernard Harrison and Virgil Walker, co -hosts of the

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and click on Events. Your registration will include a ticket to the Museum of the Bible, nearby the conference venue in Washington, D .C.

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Attention all men in ministry leadership You're all invited to my friend Chris Arnzen's Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Free Pastors Luncheon Thursday, September 22nd, 11am to 2pm at Church of the

Living Christ in Loisville, Pennsylvania featuring me, James White of Alpha Omega Ministries, your keynote speaker.

Not only will you enjoy a wonderful time of fellowship with your colleagues in ministry over a delicious meal but you'll also receive dozens of free brand new books donated by Christian publishers all over the

United States and the United Kingdom personally selected by Chris Arnzen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

So if you're a pastor, an elder, a deacon, a parachurch leader or any other man in ministry leadership please register for the

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Free Pastors Luncheon today by calling 631 -291 -7002 631 -291 -7002 or by visiting ironsharpensironradio .com

ironsharpensironradio .com This is James White of Alpha Omega Ministries hoping to see you

Thursday, September 22nd, 11am to 2pm at Church of the Living Christ in Loisville, Pennsylvania for Chris Arnzen's Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Free Pastors Luncheon.

Welcome back, this is Chris Arnzen. If you just tuned us in, our guest has been through the entire program

Alexander Wright, who is founder and president of Vessels for Christ. If you have a question for Alex, please send it to chrisarnzen at gmail .com

chrisarnzen at gmail .com and send it in quickly because we are rapidly running out of time.

Well, I want to make sure before we run out of time, Alex that everything that you want etched in the hearts and minds today about what you do and why what you do is important and why what you do is needed by the body of Christ please share with us as much of that information as you possibly can uninterrupted, before we take any more listener questions.

Yeah, I mean, first and foremost, why what I do is important to the body of Christ is because we are commanded to share the

Gospel to the nation and some of the people, some of the Christians that we work with and Christians around the world just don't have the resources or the financial capabilities to go to places they want to go and that's a lot of what we're doing.

We're trying to support them so they can go to these unreached areas and not only just share the

Gospel in these unreached areas where some have never heard about Jesus Christ they might have heard the name possibly or seen a cross but not known but some of these places are going to never hear the name and also we want to correct bad theology, correct bad doctrine get some of these pastors who have these small churches to conform to the standards of the

Word of God and to be able to teach that and ultimately we do what we do just to glorify and honor the

Father you know, the One that has saved myself and so many you know, we were wicked heathens that were completely lost and God sent

His only Son to come into this world God incarnate, God in the flesh to come to this world and die and rise again so we may be saved

I mean, just when you reflect on that and the beauty of that and that God came down to do that for us

I mean, it's just so special it gives me goosebumps just thinking about it at times and so we want to continue to share that message to the places around the world that Christ, it's all

Christ and it's all for Christ and that's it, I mean, that's the only truth that we have in this world

We have a very faithful listener of this program who sent in a question

Grady from Asheboro, North Carolina Greetings, brothers

How do you choose the churches and people to whom you minister and do you give them funds or just materials that they need?

Okay, so first, how do we choose them? Well, basically, it's a long process

You know, it's taken years and there have been some people who seemed promising that weren't or, you know, this happens if you talk to Paul Washer or anyone who's doing missions there are just things that happen over the years but how we choose them is we want to see men that fear

God that are humble, that are teachable that know all the glory of the Lord and that they just want to see the gospel go out

So we build relationships with them over time and we just try to see if they're conforming to the

Word of God and if they're obedient to it and their character is tested over time

We, for the second part, yes, we provide materials and resources such as books,

Bibles, commentaries like you mentioned earlier, things of that nature and then we also provide funds directly to some of the pastors that we support on a monthly basis and every other month basis just really depending on what they need and how much they need as some of them might be able to do other things such as work or bring in their own support as well

So, yeah, that's to sum it up And we have, let's see here

We have B .B. in Cumberland County, Pennsylvania who wants to know What is the greatest opposition that you face when you are doing your ministry abroad?

Is it from those that openly reject Christianity or those that are from a different theological position than you from within Christianity or perhaps even cults and other religions that masquerade as Christianity?

Well, I think to tackle that question Number one, our fight isn't against flesh and blood

It's against spiritualities and principalities and heavenly places So it is a demonic fight we are in, a demonic battle

I mean, we are fighting against the Prince of Darkness against the demons, things like that in the unseen realm

So that is going to be fighting against us no matter what and whether or not other people are used to attack us

I mean, you can watch abortion clinic videos or people in unreached areas that get attacked, martyred

That happens So that's number one Number two, it's a little bit of both to answer the question directly

A little bit of both We get some people that are very twisted in their theology not adhering to the

Bible that can be opposition I would compare it maybe to Roman Catholics outside an abortion clinic if you are witnessing or have friends who witness like that that you think they are of Christ but yet they are kind of preventing what's going on So we get some of that and then we also just get the straight people who are the fanatic

Hindus Pastor just last year was evangelizing and he was chased by a mob of fanatic

Hindus and they threw a pole at him and hit him in the back and he had to go to the hospital and so you do get those as well

So I would say it's not predominantly one or the other It's both Yeah, you just brought up something that a lot of people in America are totally ignorant of The fact that Christians are persecuted and even martyred on occasion overseas by militant

Hindus People are usually only thinking of Muslims that are doing this

They look at a Hindu as somebody that is nothing but a peaceful person that's typically a vegetarian who sits and contemplates and meditates and prays and they think of the stereotype of Gandhi which is actually a false stereotype

Gandhi was a true racist People don't know that Gandhi They look at him as a champion of equal rights and a champion against racism

Well, he was, but only for the Indian people He believed that the

Indian people should be treated equally with the white British But one of the things that he hated was that the

Indian people were being treated like black people who he despised I strongly urge everyone listening if you're interested in that topic to get a hold of the book

Maybe out of print by now, I don't know Behind the Mask of Divinity by G .B.

Singh, S -I -N -G -H who is actually a Sikh who was in the

United States military a colonel, I believe, who wrote that book But that is obviously not the main theme of our discussion

Now, I want to make sure before we go off the air that you leave our audience with what you most want etched in their hearts and minds because we are rapidly running out of time now

Well, the number one thing I want your audience to know is that, you know, we do live in the

Western world and we have a lot of comforts here but I don't want I don't want

Christians to forget about the believers overseas You know, that we are a universal church a body of believers that are all over the world

So let's not forget about our brothers and sisters in Christ and terrible areas that are either predominantly

Muslim, predominantly Buddhist, predominantly Hindu even predominantly secular, atheist, or whatever

Let's not forget them Let's pray for them Let's pray that God has mercy and grace on them and let's continue to just lift them up in prayer because that's the one thing talking to people is that sometimes we just get comfortable

I'm also guilty of that Sometimes I just I'm here for too long and I get complacent and I get comfortable and I can forget about that there are believers just completely struggling and just struggling to eat and struggling to survive and lots of persecution coming against them in different places

So that's the one thing I would like your audience to take away Well, thank you

I want to repeat my guest's email address It is vesselsforchrist .org

vesselsforchrist .org and I want you to examine and explore that website and pray about how you can help this valuable ministry to fulfill the

Great Commission I also want to again urge anyone listening who is a man in ministry leadership whether you're a pastor, an elder by the way,

I think that's the same office a deacon, leader of a parachurch organization no matter what leadership position you hold as a man, this is for men only

I urge you to do everything that you can to attend the next Iron Sharpens Iron radio

Pastor's Luncheon Thursday, September 22nd 11 a .m.

to 2 p .m. in Loisville, Pennsylvania which is in Perry County, Pennsylvania It's going to be featuring, as you've been hearing on the show my dear friend, going back to 1996 one of the most brilliant minds within the

Christian faith today Dr. James R. White of Alpha and Omega Ministries and not only will you be able to hear

Dr. White speak for free you're going to get fed a free meal a delicious meal you're going to be enjoying fellowship and fun with your colleagues in ministry and you're going to be given dozens of free brand new books specifically chosen by me donated by major Christian publishers and also publishers that may not be very well known but they are really publishing some of the best material out there

These books that I choose from them have been donated every year going back to the 1990s that I give to every man who attends the

Iron Sharpens Iron radio luncheons This whole concept, this idea was the brainchild of my precious late wife in the 1990s who said to me one

Christmas season why don't we next year instead of spending money on each other for Christmas gifts why don't we use that money and treat your pastor friends to a lunch, a special luncheon since you have so many pastor friends being in the radio industry and we can not only treat them to lunch but you can get your your contacts in the publishing industry to donate books and we can have a guest speaker come in and I thought that was an excellent idea and I took her up on it and we've been doing it ever since and even after my wife went home to eternity with Jesus Christ I continue to do the to arrange the luncheons in her memory and in tribute and honor to her and of course first and foremost in tribute and honor to Jesus Christ the

King of Kings and Lord of Lords so if you do want to attend this luncheon please send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com

chrisarnson at gmail .com tell your friends, family and loved ones about the luncheon who happen to be men in ministry leadership that is tell all the pastors that you know the pastors with whom you share fellowship the pastors that you know from your own denomination brotherhood, association we would really love to see as many of you as possible at this luncheon and of course don't forget about the week prior to that the

G3 conference the G3 regional conference featuring Dr. James R. White Dr. Stephen Lawson Josh Bice and the hosts, the co -hosts of the

Just Thinking podcast Darrell Bernard Harrison and Virgil Walker they will be speaking at the

G3 regional conference in Washington DC and that will be the week prior to my pastor's luncheon

I am going to be manning an exhibitors booth there and I hope that as many of you as possible will greet me at my exhibitors booth and I am sure that you will be blessed as I have every single time

I have been at the G3 conference this is Just Thinking about the

Bible is the theme September 15th through the 17th in Washington DC go to g3min .org

that's G3 M I N abbreviation for ministries g3min .org

and then click on events at the top of the page well I hope to see you at both of those events

I hope that you all have a very safe, blessed happy and healthy and Christ honoring weekend and Lord's Day and I hope that you all will always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater

Savior than you are a sinner I hope you tune in Monday as a new friend of mine will be the guest on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio a dear brother

David Monreal pastor of the Carlisle Alliance Church who will be discussing his journey into the reformed faith and being a theological minority in the

Christian and Missionary Alliance denomination so I hope you tune in then God bless you we'll hear from you