Sheikh Muhammad Ahmed Awal

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Webcasting around the world from the desert metropolis of Phoenix, Arizona. This is the dividing line
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The Apostle Peter commanded Christians to be ready to give a defense for the hope that is within us Yet to give that answer with gentleness and reverence
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Our host is dr. James White director of Alpha Omega ministries and an elder at the Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church This is a live program and we invite your participation.
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If you'd like to talk with dr. White call now It's 602 nine seven three four six zero two or toll -free across the
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United States. It's one eight seven seven seven five Three three three four one and now with today's topic.
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Here is James White And welcome to the dividing line on a
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Tuesday morning the 15th of June halfway through June over halfway through well getting toward halfway through the entirety of Of the year of 2010 for those of you in the
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Detroit area Just a couple of items of information. I will be heading out there tomorrow
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On the 18th, I will be on with Paul Edwards live in studio on his program drive time program
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I believe around four o 'clock if I recall correctly There in the
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Detroit area this coming Friday afternoon The debates
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My my best suggestion to end to call and double check on times and which debates are which for example
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I have blogged the fact that my Sunday debate which was originally scheduled For I believe 2 30 in the afternoon is now at 6 30
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I have taken Tony Costa and I have switched places because he has a flight to catch basically and So my first debate was shake a wall will be evening but there are debates before that and I I'm hoping to be at those debates.
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It would be helpful to me to be at those debates I still learn from other folks. I would like to be in those debates
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To be able to hear and take notes and things like that but I don't know when
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I do not have a schedule right now as to a When I'm going to be at the
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Aramaic broadcasting network recording a series on the reliability of the
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New Testament And When I'm going to be doing live
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The live programs late at night now that was a new thing to me that just came up But evidently there is a late -night program and It goes to one o 'clock in the morning
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Which is I I do not guarantee the orthodoxy of anything. I say past 10 o 'clock at night. Anyways, so I could end up, you know being the hairless
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Benny Hinn or something at one o 'clock in the morning. I don't know but Right now the possibility has been raised
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I tried writing to the powers that be a little while ago have not heard back yet should have called but a
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Possibility exists that I've committed myself to something that I don't know is overly wise But I got a call yesterday
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I Have a debate on Monday evening the 21st again with shake a wall on the deity of Christ the topic for Sunday evening is is the
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Bible we have today the Word of God and I know exactly where shake a wall is going on that.
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In fact, that's what joy the programs could be today I'm not really certain what I'm gonna be doing with the phone calls guys.
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So we'll see here But let's let's see what but the topics are but I I'm just not sure
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I'm gonna be doing some shake a wall stuff today but on Monday evening, I believe the debate starts at 630 on Monday evening and Right now
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I have agreed that if this works out and I have not gotten confirmation It's gonna work out yet.
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If we get confirmation, it's gonna work out We will post this information on the blog so that you all can participate
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I am bringing my little computer to live webcast the debates
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I'm gonna need to get hold of somebody in Detroit to babysit that thing I brought so much stuff home yesterday to pack and I just realized it ain't gonna happen
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I there's no way on earth that I could get all this stuff into my bags and so I've closed to where a and B With all the adapters and batteries and everything.
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No, no, no, I'd be dragged off that plane. So I'm gonna need someone to to be of some assistance there in the
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Detroit area as far as babysitting some of the stuff and if and if there any Photographers in the area by the way, and I'm gonna get to my point here a moment
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I realize I'm I'm meandering but if there any anybody who has high -quality Photographic equipment 35 millimeter zoom lens, etc, etc.
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We had somebody I don't even know who it was, but somebody showed up at a debate I did about two years ago now and we're still using the shots that were taken at that time and our our graphics man
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Hasim son of Ramallah king of graphics Really would like to have some more stuff to work with.
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He really really would if you like all those wonderful banner ads Then if you've got some high -quality stuff that you could shoot some high -resolution
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With zoom lens and stuff like that. That would really really really be helpful. I may bring my camera along I just don't know.
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I'm gonna have room I just really really don't I want to bring some fairly large books along with me for use in debates and There's just you know, there's 50 pound limit and blah blah.
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So I just don't know if I'm gonna be able to do it. So All of this to get back to the point that I got a call yesterday and after the debate this is not confirmed
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We'll confirm it on the blog if it's gonna happen, but the possibility has has opened up To do the debate
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Monday night. We'll shake a wall on the deity of Christ as soon as the debates over Jump in a vehicle drive to the television studio and do a second live debate on the air with the
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Shiite shake That we were going to debate initially who then decided not to but then is decided to So the possibility exists that from 11 p .m.
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To 1 a .m. On Monday night in the Tuesday morning
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And as they may know is Detroit on Eastern Time or Central Time. I'm assuming
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Eastern Time, but I am I haven't taken the chance. I haven't checked yet, but I'm not sure which time zone
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It's in so you all Maybe let me know. Maybe some main channel will know But there's always at least a 30 -second lag between my saying that It's okay.
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I'm being told Eastern Eastern Eastern. Okay, it's in the Eastern Time Zone. So For those folks out here in Arizona, that would only be basically eight
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O 'clock at night until Until 10 o 'clock, which wouldn't be too bad
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Now that is available online and available via satellite So if that happens if I do the double debate
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Over five hours worth of debating on Monday night into Tuesday morning, and I've got a flight the next morning
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There will be nothing I won't be getting in early enough to do the Tuesday dividing line anyways But even if I did there wouldn't be anything of me left to do it.
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So That is a possibility we could end up and with three debates instead of just two and one would be live and of course it would be
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I'm not even sure that we appropriate necessarily to call it a debate because it's not going to be You know even time periods and stuff like that.
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It would be more of a give -and -take interview type situation, whatever it might be so anyway
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Don't know if that's gonna happen if if you see it on the blog with the URL and stuff like that then then we'll do it and hopefully you all will find that to be helpful, but I will put up a link or someone will put up a link maybe
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Micah or rich or somebody will put up a link To the it's regular if you're listening right now live on the dividing line same same link
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But I will be live webcasting the The actual debates both on Sunday night and Monday night
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From that location on the regular dividing line links. You'll be able to listen in live
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To that so that's what's coming up. I'm excited got a lot of work to do really feel rather rushed
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At the moment just ran in here gonna do this run back packing Keynote presentations, etc.
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Etc. Etc. That's just gonna be very very very busy this weekend. So please pray for health and Getting enough sleep
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Stay to stay functional Most these other guys that are doing this or are at least 10 years younger than I am
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I'm not sure how old Shaka wall is but as far as the Christian guys, they they I'm the the old guy in the group and So just pray that we will we will
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Make our way through all of them. So that's what's coming up this weekend in In Detroit in the
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Dearborn area and look forward to seeing our friends. They're Looking forward to this weekend indeed before we hit
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The main topics and so we'll take this one call and then we'll be switching over to providing a response
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To shake a wall. I on the last response to shake a wall
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I For some reason as you could tell the files the file names just weren't right and and I wasn't able to find the main stuff
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I was really wanting to respond to I've got the right file queued up this time now and So it should be a little bit more interesting than the last one was but let's let's talk real quickly with Dabney in Milwaukee Dabney.
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Hi Done pretty good. I don't want to get too much your time.
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I know you're busy. Let me just run through real quick I left my church that we were talking about before.
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I'm gonna become a member now at Format the church in Milwaukee pastor
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Chantry, I believe, you know, all of everybody knows pastor Chantry That's like asking if you know
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Al Martin or something like that They take they take your they take your official reform
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Baptist card away if you do not know those names I'm not sure if they've told you that yet, but Leaving my church
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Yeah, well that happens that has happened many many times you are not the first one to experience it
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I I assure you I mean, I'm used to that I get all the time But when people have been in a church and fellowship with people and then there is that disruption of fellowship over Very important doctrinal issues.
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It is very common to hear that that term used it's it's a shame that happens, but that unfortunately does happen, but Well and to be and to be consistent,
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I mean, you know if if a person can live with inconsistency I suppose they they don't have to pay those those those prices but you know,
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I I had to make that very move that you made about 20 almost 22 years ago now and yeah, it was quite costly.
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It was very very costly My pastor's father was actually there and he pulled me aside and wanted to argue with me over this and told me that I couldn't find your grace in the
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Bible and so I went and showed him and As I showed him John 6 and 44
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John 6 37 He he turned to the Greek New Testament and he said that In 30s in verse 37 that all that the father gives me.
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He argues that the all Pawn because it's a neuter should actually mean all things instead of all in the sense of people
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So I told him that context determines the meaning of words and therefore In reference to people, but what do you what do what would you say to pawn being in the neuter case?
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What is that really? Does that carry any validity? What is what what would you respond to that?
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Well notice a couple things There is a there is an an interplay between the use of the neuter and the masculine in John chapter 6 and when
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In verse 37 when it says all Which the father gives me will come to me
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Coming to me in John chapter 6 is parallel to believing. So unless he's actually either a universalist and Believes that Satan himself will someday believe and be saved then the idea of saying pawn here is all things
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Leads to some kind of pantheism. I mean you hear pan in pantheism some kind of wild theology where you have the redemption of of the
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Created order and that the created order ends up believing in Jesus. I mean, it just doesn't make any sense when you tell when you have a group
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Taken as a group the neuter is often used to wrap that whole group up as a whole the same thing
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Happens elsewhere in this text notice in verse 39 in order that of all pawn he is given to me.
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I lose none of it But I raise it up on the last day So you have a whole group here being taken as a singular using the neuter which is very common, but when you have
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The actions of each Individual in that group then the masculine is used and it's the the masculine personal pronoun because it is
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Individuals who come to Christ it isn't it notice When when verse the first part of verse 37 all the father gives me will come to me
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And though one coming to me so when it becomes individual there
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It's it is obviously in in the masculine and it's its emphasis is upon the particular
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Individual that one I will never cast out So it's just a matter of recognizing that when you're talking about the entire group you can summarize the group together
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But then when you're looking at the activities that define that group, they are clearly personal activities
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So the idea this is all of creation. I that's a new one Because we're sitting in the in a room that had a lot of chairs
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I said all things so you mean like these chairs are given to given to the given by the father and they come to me
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Is that if you do that with your what you're saying and I couldn't believe the man because he's been a pastor for many years
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And he looked at me What you see there sadly and it's hard to deal with because you're you're
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Dealing with men for whom you have respect and and that God has used in your life and yet still what you see and this is something that That you you can see it from the outside But we always have to remember that that we're always in danger of slipping into the same thing
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There's such a strong traditional hole that that they are not aware of it They don't see how self contradictory their own statements are and and once we see it, it's really easy for us to go well if Anybody should be able to see it.
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If you can't see it, then you must not be saved or something like that No, that's that's where we get into some real real problems there is a there is a work of the spirit that that causes us to to see
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God's truth with clarity and we can't we can't say that because someone else hasn't yet experienced that that automatically they
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They are not redeemed. We have to be very very careful there, but it still should be Something we always remember and and make a commitment boy.
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I never want to get into that situation I don't want to become so comfortable with a particular tradition that that I could never even begin to Examine it and examine it critically in a meaningful way.
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So that that's something to keep in mind, but no I've been collecting various ways around John 6 for many many years and I Suppose over the years maybe somebody had said that that pawn at the beginning of verse 37 somehow has something to do with You know all things as in all of creation maybe
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But I you know how in the world you you make that fit In light of what comes before and afterwards
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I have no idea All right, thanks a lot daddy
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All right Like I said, I had found this debate and had tried to play it for you
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I don't know what happened to the recordings. I had I just you know, sometimes things happen, but This is actually the the commentary that came before The audience
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Q &A that we did here about two weeks ago but the commentary is is all shake a wall and it's
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Obviously is helpful for me immediately prior to Engaging someone debate to be
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Hearing them understanding them and of course, I have the hope in the back of my mind somewhere
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That possibly shake wall might listen and that this might help to improve the interaction that we have
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One with another coming up in in less than a week now, so I I do before we begin exhort you to pray for This this upcoming time
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I can do all the study in the world, but if the Spirit of God does not bless It's it's it's worthless.
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It's not gonna it's not gonna have any effect And so I do hope that you will pray if you have a
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Wednesday night prayer service at your church If you could ask them to pray for the outreach will be going on this entire weekend there will be much conflict and Confrontation in light of the fact that this is the
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Arabic festival time up there in Dearborn but my hope and prayer is that that element will be will be minimized and what will be maximized is the communication of God's truth and if the
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Spirit of God does not birth a Desire to truly know and love the truth the consistent truth of God in the heart of anyone
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Muslim or anyone else? Then anything I can do will be absolutely useless. So please pray toward that end with that Let's pick up with Some comments from Sheikha wall, and then
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I'm gonna talk about that If Jesus is actually God That's really actually make it look like you have to get his obedience
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Otherwise you end up in the hellfire Jesus is the only way and on and on and on in jaw in Matthew to the 7 verse 21 or John 7 21
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Jesus said On that day which day the day of judgment on that day many will come to me saying
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Lord Lord Now I again I stop it. This is a therapy said Matthew 7 21
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John 7 21. They're not the same thing. Of course This is Matthew 7 21 and we spent a fair amount of time on this and in fact,
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I Believe I posted on the blog about two and a half weeks ago a
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Study that I did on Wednesday evening on Matthew chapter 7 and went through this text
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It is one of those texts that comes up with enough frequency that it would be one of those that I would recommend
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You add to your memorization list But add beyond merely the memorizing of the text
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The Understand memorization of an understanding of the context
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Just a practical apologetic point here if you've never looked at it Old old file.
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I mean I'm sitting here right now I have my eyes closed because I am thinking of our first office that we had which we could barely afford in This beat -up old building tiny little thing
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About the size about the size of twice through my men right now and My the old compact portable that did not have a hard drive in it little tiny green screen and My sitting there at that desk typing away on what's called the 100 verse memorization system for dealing with Mormons It's still on the website.
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It ain't pretty it's part of that massive amount of information We have yet to convert over to what is now the old website format.
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So it's the old old website format But it still remains an excellent resource and an example
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It would be really good someday as if I ever have the time to write anymore It would be really good someday to create a 100 verse memorization system for dealing with Muslims and with Roman Catholics and so forth because what it does is it gives you the verses to memorize but It likewise gives you the application of the verses and hence the contextual information that you need to make those
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Verses worthwhile. I cannot tell you how many times I've heard a Christian just simply think that by quoting of a verse of Scripture This somehow is going to close the case
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But they didn't explain The context of the verse so the person to whom they're speaking would have any idea why it should
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Conclude the argumentation or should conclude the argument and So Matthew 7 would be one to not only memorize
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But also to understand the context is to be able to respond to Something like a shake walls presentation on it
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Did we not prophesize in thy name in that name we cast out devil in that name? We do so many mighty works in that name.
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We went to Africa and build houses in that name We went to India Jesus said and I will tell them get away from me
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I don't know you you who work for nothing now. I remember he he said that you who commit iniquity he claims means you worship me for nothing and as we pointed out that is not what the
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Greek term means and If that's repeated, I will be challenging shake a wall to provide meaningful scholarly lexicographical
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Substantiation for that particular assertion And he said not all those who call me Lord Lord will enter heaven
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But those who do the will of God in heaven, they would enter heaven not those who call me Lord What is the will of God now notice?
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He says not those who call me Lord. That's not Jesus point Jesus not saying the calling him
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Lord is antithetical to ones going to heaven what he's talking about here is false profession
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Those who would identify him as Lord, but do not do the will of the Father in heaven to get into heaven You do have to identify
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Jesus as Lord, which shake a wall says he does not And you have to do the will of the
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Father which is in heaven and identifying Jesus as Lord is part of The will of the
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Father, but that's not all of the will of the Father obedience to Christmas commands Is the result of that spiritual work in our lives, which makes us true followers of Christ?
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Those who do the will of God not all those who call me Lord Lord will enter heaven
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But those who do the will of God in heaven, they will enter heaven So he's been canceled.
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He's not supposed to die for you. This is what I said. You have to die. Otherwise, no way How about those who came before Jesus?
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Where are they going heaven hell? Where are they going? Those who came before Jesus who believed in the one true
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God likewise Receive salvation from his hand
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They do their sins are dealt with likewise by Jesus Christ in light of the certainty of the sacrifice of Christ that's
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Paul's explanation in Romans chapter 3 when he talks about those whose sins
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God had overlooked in light of The demonstration of his justice in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ in Romans 3 25 so I would recommend that he take a look at that, but of course, we know the shaker wall has a very very low view of The Apostle Paul that is something that I'm sure will come out more than once In in in our discussion is there any in between where they will go those who came before Jesus, where are they going?
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In the book of Ezekiel chapter 18 verse 20. It reads God Almighty is speaking about how to enter heaven
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God said all souls are mine The soul that sinneth it shall die
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The father will not bear the iniquity of the son neither the son bear the iniquity of the father
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The wickedness of the wickedness shall be upon him and the righteousness of the righteousness shall be upon him
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But if the wicked turn around and do that, which is pleasing and follow the status of God Almighty He shall be saved and he'll enter heaven and I God will
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I will not look at his iniquity. I will forgive him now again on the blog
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I have posted an entire study again from the Phoenix reform Baptist Church on a
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Wednesday evening on Ezekiel chapter 18 providing the context of this discussion that being the saying the proverb and the fact that the people in This context and of course this also came up my discussions
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With Michael Brown as well because this was one of the texts that he wanted to look at but the the people's
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Utilization of that proverb as a means of getting around the apostles. I'm sorry Prophets a call to repentance
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Is the specific context that shake a wall does not bring in he does mention the proverb
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But does not seem to see that that provides the immediate context of the discussion It's How would you say that you eat a sour grape and your sons teach is rotten
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No, if your son eat a sour grape, he still is going to be rotten And if you eat, so whatever you do is upon you the book of Ecclesiastes and You understand you understand his argumentation here
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Is to assert that there can be no Substitutionary atonement there can be no union with Christ there can be no
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Taking of someone's guilt, but he doesn't seem to realize is These very very same text that he's he's quoting if he would if you would look at them in their context convict us all of sin and To say with with the to look at Ezekiel and not see that Ezekiel 18 ends just like 31 and so on so forth that Ezekiel keeps talking about the sinfulness of men the symbolism men and then he starts talking about this new heart
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I will put my spirit in them and I will take out a heart of stone I will give them a heart of flesh.
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He doesn't deal with any of that because there's no correlation there in Islamic theology there.
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There's no need for regeneration. There's no need for That radical transformation and so he doesn't see that Despite the fact that We bear our guilt.
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Yes That just is bad news That does not provide for peace with God That's not addressing the how of how
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God's law having been broken Can can be assuaged because that's really not something that is a part of Islamic theology at that point
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There's 12 it reads Listen to the whole truth. That's what he said.
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This is the whole matter follow God Follow his commandments for God Almighty shall look into each and every account of you as you walk on earth on it
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You will be rewarded I'm gonna talk about that's bad news. By the way, that's bad news the person who stands before a holy
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God Again then the Muslim just simply assumes, you know the scales and That's a that's a that's a horrific thing when you think about it
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It's one thing if your heart is not convicted to believe in scales You know, if you if you just sort of think that you're you're better than others then you can live with that day of these scales
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Oh, I'm good. I'm gonna go but a person who really experiences any kind of spiritual conviction
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That's torture. That's torture that that was that was Martin Luther in his six hours in the confessional
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Once once the spirit begins working and of course, that's the only thing that can ever bring anyone to the truth Jesus making himself to be
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God My brother quoted that Jesus said he can go to MIT. I won. I said this is did not say you
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I Say Jesus did not say he and go to MIT. I want it now here
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Hey, I keep referring to the blog, but that's because it just happens that we have a lot of information there
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I just posted from sermon audio Now I can post those neat little widgets and sermon audio and so you can you can listen straight from sermon audio on the blog
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I just posted One of the Sunday school lessons from John chapter 10 where I covered this very issue of John chapter 10 verse 30 and Here you have an excellent example of why
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I have emphasized in my writings over the decades and in my speaking that we should not simply grab hold of The Text in John chapter 10 verse 30.
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I and the Father we are one plural verb and Go see this demonstrates an essential
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Ontological unity between the Father and the Son and the Godhead, etc, etc That we should make application of that verse in its context.
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It is first and foremost a Esoterological assertion it is an assertion concerning the doctrine of salvation
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It is first and foremost an assertion of the unity of the Father and the Son in the bringing about of the salvation of God's people
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Jesus has said no one can take them from my hand then he says no one can take them from the father's hand.
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I And the father we are one one in bringing about the salvation of God's people So when you hear the
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Mormon or the Jehovah's Witness or the Muslim say it's a oneness of purpose
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Don't get trapped into Contradicting the truth. It is a oneness of purpose, but that doesn't mean it's all it is think clearly
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Because once you've established this oneness of purpose, then you can ask the question twofold response a
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Okay, it's a oneness of purpose and no Sinful human being would ever say that salvation itself is in his hand
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No one can snatch them out of my hand My father who's great and all is given to me.
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No one's able to snatch from my father's hand The unity that is being discussed by Jesus there which you can trace back to John 5 18
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Through John 6 John 8 now into John 10 is a unity that has already caused the
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Jews to pick up stones to stone him and it's gonna do it again right here and now and So this unity of purpose is not just the unity of purpose that you and I would have with God and we do the right things
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We're talking about a unity here that points directly to the deity of Christ Which is exactly what the
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Jews interpreted him to say and Jesus's response in verses 31 and following is not a repudiation of that conclusion
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It is a confirmation of that conclusion and fact is one of the many places with demonstrates that they're saying you make yourself out to be
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God and Jesus's restatement of that as I am the Son of God Means the same thing
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Son of God is not merely some morally exalted creature but that even
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Jesus interprets that accusation of your God as Son of God and he embraces that in the unique way that John communicates that so Take a look at that on the blog and it should help to expand some of that for you
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I want to see that place is drawn to the 10 verse 30 where it says I and the father are one
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That's the text in what sense did Jesus make these statements? What are the tests that go with it before and after in what sense did he if I say
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I and the cameraman are one? Naturally you need is for the what do you mean you are so okay?
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I have to give reason so the reason can be found in the same joint of the 10 But we start from 23, and I give you why why he said
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I and the father are one It reads and Jesus walked in the Solomon's temple alone and the Jewish came and surround him
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Brandishing their finger at him and they said to him if thou art the Christ tell us plainly and he said
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I have told you And you don't believe in me my sheep They hear my voice and they follow me if you don't believe in me believe in at least the work that I do
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Because the father who gave them my disciple to me is greater than all of you and no one among you can take them out
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Of my hand neither can you take them out of my father's hand I and my father are one in this in purpose They are one in purpose
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God Almighty is one with Muhammad with Jesus with Moses not in power in omniscient in you know omnipresent No in purpose they are one so this is the purpose what the one is and notice notice
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He immediately associates him with Moses things like that. Just simply one in the sense of promoting
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God's purpose that is significantly less Than what Jesus has just claimed when he says no one can snatch them out of my
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Hand Moses never said that Abraham never said that no prophet ever said that no prophet ever could say that see
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That's where you have to listen very carefully. And that's where you have to know the text and you have to hear
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What the text is emphasizing to see when someone whether it's a Sheik wall or anyone else is
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Missing the key elements of the exegesis of the text itself And if you still insist that I and my father are one means one
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I will refer you back again to John to the 17 verse 19 now this again Anyone who deals with Jehovah's Witnesses, this is exactly what you will hear from Jehovah's Witnesses When they come to your door if you are mistaken enough to go this text
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I would never recommend going to John 10 30 John 1 1 as your primary text in talking with Jehovah's Witnesses and witnesses of door
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They're they can answer these things without even starting their brains. They can they can not only put their brains in idle
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They can turn them off and let them cool down Okay That's just how simple it is.
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They've heard it so many times before these are not the strong text to go to in the first place But this is exactly what you hear from Jehovah's Witnesses as they will go to the unity passages in John John chapter 17
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I and them they and me as if The unity that exists between the father and son is identical to the unity that exists amongst believers
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Now the problem is that the emphasis in John 17 has to do with the indwelling presence of the
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Holy Spirit through John 14 and 16 Which interesting enough shake a wall could not possibly follow because he doesn't believe the
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Spirit in John 14 and 16 is the Holy Spirit Which clearly it is so the point is that The unity that we have is a spiritual supernatural unity and It's a unity unheard of before it's a unity that transcends
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Jewish Gentile That Paul brings that out in Ephesians and places like that. So when
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Jesus said, oh my lord I want you to be one in me. I in you you in me them in me me in them
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So that will become one as it means 12 gods plus God that Jesus 13 God plus God The oneness is in purpose men not in power in glory the oneness
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So that they may know that they have sent me down in me me in you you in us
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Them in us so that we become one and the world would know that I came from you. This is it
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Not one in one one God No, no No If we have to believe it one John 10 30 then we have to also believe that Jesus and disciple and God are 14 gods
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We become mushrooms This is not that this is not the case at all so This kind of argumentation is again.
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I'm sure it it is primarily effective for those who do not understand
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Christian theology or the Bible and What you're listening to is at times word -for -word the argumentation of Sheikh Ahmad Deedat and And In God's Providence, I was not engaging the
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Islamic field When Ahmad Deedat was still debating I had started debating there was a about a six -year overlap between When I first began to debate and when
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Ahmad Deedat was still debating but I Had had no knowledge of the Islamic field at that point at all
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So there is no possibility of our ever having engaged whether and I've mentioned many times that Ahmad Deedat's VHS tapes
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Yes, VHS tapes are still some of those popular items watched by Muslims world the world around and So that's one of the reasons that I'm not only looking forward this weekend.
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And again Ask for your prayers for this this effort this weekend, but likewise pray that we will be able to arrange debates in August in New York with Sheikh Awal I figure if we're already paying to send me to New York twice in one month that you know, let's let's
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See if we cannot arrange at least one or two more debates Maybe around the time of the debate with Christopher Hitchens Maybe at the beginning of August whichever works out best with Sheikh Awal's schedule to To do some of the other topics that I think would be really necessary now
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He's going to be debated by others this weekend on some of the topics. I would like to debate him on but Especially in regards to such things as The crucifixion
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I would love to debate the crucifixion historical issues the crucifixion and You know there are issues regarding the the
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Quran and the transmission of the Quran and things like that they'd be good to address and and salvation as a whole and there's many many things we get into but Pray that we will be able to arrange some things for August as well
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At that that particular point in time and then we have Elohim. We have Alleluia They call the name
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Yahuwah now Here but I was what I was saying was he represents Akhmed Didot's argumentation and what
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I mean by that is In the thankfully he's he's a little bit easier to understand
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I know some of you do struggle even with with his accent but a Lot of Akhmed Didot stuff was not recorded really well on very high quality equipment came from the 80s and Just wasn't recorded as well as we could do today, and I've done entire programs in the past I just know that people really struggled because If you zero in on Didot, then you can follow him
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But if you if you lose something Also, it sounds like he's speaking a foreign language until you catch a phrase that you can understand again and refocus
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But one of the difficult things of Responding to Akhmed Didot is you'd have to play 20 minutes worth
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Before he'd get to the point he was making Didot was a showman Didot would would go on and on Proving points that are not in dispute
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Not in dispute at all building up this faux credibility with his audience and Then once he finally got to his point
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So much time had elapsed and he had proven so many points were actually not relevant to his argument That he could make his conclusion.
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The conclusion was Was false, but he's built up this this sense in the audience and they'll buy the argument it's it's it's fascinating once you know what he's doing and to follow it and to see to see how it works and Shake a wall likewise will will spend a great deal of time proving things that really aren't relevant he's gonna talk a lot about how you pronounce
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Yahweh and and It doesn't seem to understand how Jehovah came into English through the
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Germanic pronunciation Using the vowel pointing of Adonai in the medieval period and all the rest that stuff But but he's talking about languages and and for example at one point
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I'm not sure if it's in this or in another one. I was listening to yesterday, but You know spends five minutes
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Doing nothing more than proving that Hebrew and Arabic are closely related Semitic languages. Well, duh we all knew that but you can you can make arguments like that and Then present it like you just refuted your opponent in proving an argument that actually has nothing to do with the debate at all
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It's one of those things again that the person who seeks to train himself or herself in in thought and an examination of argumentation you catch these things, but That wasn't a class even
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I took in school back in my day when schooling was a lot better than it is today And it certainly isn't something very common today
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Ask any Christian, any regular Christian, what is Yahuwah? Is it English? It's not English. It's not
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Greek It's not Phoenician. It's not Latin. What is Yahuwah? Yahuwah is
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Arabic and Hebrew meaning. Oh, he Yahuwah who Allah will let you know You know, yeah, whoo. Ah, so the word you know,
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Jehovah is actually Yahuwah because in Hebrew there is no W The W is used as V.
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Yahuwah. I mean the V is used as W. So it should be Yahuwah Jehovah you keep changing it
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Jehovah You you keep changing it well no, anyone who is at all familiar with the
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Tetragrammaton the divine name and the history of the controversy over its pronunciation all the rest that stuff is well aware of Why Yahweh which is the the most appropriate pronunciation
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Has ended up in English as Jehovah. It's not a matter of somebody changing it. There was a history There was a period of development
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There was the concern on the part of the Jewish people for the pronunciation of the divine name and hence the utilization of the vowel pointing of Adenai being placed with the
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Tetragrammaton as a Warning not to pronounce the divine name and how that came through the
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Germanic languages in the Middle Ages into English and so on So I mean there's a history to these things. It's not someone trying to quote -unquote change something
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It's not a conspiracy theory or something like that Because in Hebrew, there's no J. Where do you get the J from? German there is no
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J in Hebrew language at all. It's Yahuwah And then why you get hallelujah if someone go into ecstasy?
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Where do you get the word hallelujah from it's a question? We read in the scriptures that the angels they came from the heaven and they say
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Hallelujah. Hallelujah. Peace be on earth and unto man and on and on. Hallelujah. Hallelujah Hallelujah Yeah, because the
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Hebrew the Westerner if he see something like if I are if I Exclamation mark that is the
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Westerner the Arab will bring the exclamation the Arab in the Hebrew They bring the exclamation before the actual word.
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So allahlujah will be Hallelujah. Hallelujah. Hallelujah. That's where it came.
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Yeah Allah This is what it means Actually halal means to praise so it's halal.
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Yeah praise. Yeah That's that's it's regular usage in the
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Psalter and things like that, but you see how he's you know Seeking to impress the audience and and when you listen to this other program that I have where he was with the radio announcer in a radio studio
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It's very much. It's very similar to the Dean show where they have this this host and Whatever supposed expert he has on the host just always oh so it mean it means that oh
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It means that he's always acting like he's never heard of these things for and maybe he hasn't though I would figure that that fellow by now has heard about everything there is to hear but it's this building of credibility not really proving any points, but it's it's a
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It's a way of keeping your your particular followers Interested in what you're saying and thinking that you are really pursuing a refutation of what the other guys said
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Jesus when you were on the cross, what did he say a lot a lot of martial attorney? Did he say God God did a lot a lot or a lot a lot or elite?
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That is sound like a lot a lot. It's not a lot a lot of my telephony my God my God Why has that forsaken me?
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That's what he said I'm wondering if this is could come up possibly in the second debate. I doubt would in the first debate
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Because he very frequently Raises the the text from the cross.
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I've never however Heard him then connect this as needs to be connected to the meaning of Psalm 22 and the fact that Psalm 22 is a messianic
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Psalm that ends the vindication of the one who begins by saying Eloy Eloy Lamas mocked me, so That's gonna come up.
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I'll sort of predict it now and and hope that we have time to actually pursue it a little bit My God my
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God why is that forsaken me this is the name of Allah he used but you call that God God is something that has been modified and worshipped by the
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Greek and Phoenicians at their court. I Have absolutely no idea how those two are connected together
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That's that's a little different. No one can come to the father, but through me they say Jesus I said I don't have problem with that Yeah, now this again
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John 14 6 it's gonna be a place a lot of Christians are gonna go to immediately when they see the decentralization of Jesus in Islamic theology and the centralization of Muhammad as the final prophet and in fact while I wrote this morning,
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I was listening to the Collection of of a
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Hadith Sahih al -Bukhari It is not easy to listen to that stuff
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I I have jokingly said to some folks in channel I read this stuff so you don't have to It was very difficult to listen to this if you've not read
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Hadith If you have then you know, you know exactly I'm talking about for at least six miles today
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I Was listening to repetitive traditional statements And I'm not trying to shock anybody here you just go read them for yourself they're available online
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But for at least six miles today I was listening to repetitive traditional recollections of Companions of the
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Prophet about how he went to the bathroom Which direction he would face what hand he would use to clean himself
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And even more explicit discussions than that and this is the
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Hadith literature and The oblations the the ablutions the the cleansings wadu
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And the necessity to you know engage in wadu if you pass gas
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Before prayers and and this kind of stuff. It's not enjoyable There there's nothing, you know
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Exalting, you know, I even had to pray Lord sanctify even this I know there's a reason
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I'm doing this so that I can I can respond to these folks and and and do so accurately and things like that But Lord, this is this is not enjoyable at all and so that that's the that's the the kind of stuff that's that's out there and It's not overly pleasant to deal with but it's necessary to deal with to to have the proper backgrounds and and to understand the mindset of Those you're involved with Which Takes me back to Not sure how that reminded me.
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But so when you look at something like like John chapter 14 We have to remember that what
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Jesus was saying and His emphasis is is lost in that over emphasis of Muhammad the fact that he's been replaced this idea that well, yes
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Jesus was the way at that time That's not what anyone would ever gather from John chapter 14 in its context
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But remember when someone can look at a text divorce it from the argument of The letter itself here the
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Gospel of John Then that's how they can come up with these misinterpretations is
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That they're not even looking at what the original author intended to communicate when you look at all of John Then there's no question what he intended to communicate.
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I'm in return asking a question during the time of Noah Who was the way the truth and the lights who was the way come on said the man that no
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I was the way no, Yahweh was the way and Noah pointed to the way of Yahweh and followed the way of Yahweh But Noah never said
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I am the way the truth in life. No one comes the father but by me even as a prophet
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Isaiah would have said I Point you to the way God has revealed to me the way he would never say
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I am the way That's the difference That's what needs to be emphasized
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Those who followed him in the boats They follow the right way and they were successful. So Noah was the way the truth and the light at that time
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But I'm of Moses. He was the way those who follow him at the Red Sea. They were successful So Moses was the way the truth and the light
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This is it. No that that's not it You need to be able to respond to that and and point out the the shift that has been made
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That Moses Abraham Noah never said I am the way
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They said they knew the way because they were the recipients of it, but they themselves were walking upon the way
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Jesus said something that no other prophet ever said and You cannot diminish that the
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Muslim must because Islam does not provide him an appropriate position within Islam To to be the way because he's been replaced by someone else the time of Jesus He said
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I am the way the truth and the light and no one can come to the father, but truly I say
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I agree He did not say I am the only way I'm the way of course that was his time.
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He was the way at that time the Quran said If you love
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Allah If you love Allah the Quran said don't follow Muhammad Follow him, but we don't use all this catchphrase because we believe in all this prophet as the messengers of God He did not claim to be divine.
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They did not claim none of this and then we talk about the brother Just mentioned about their convenience was made through Isaac and not
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Ishmael We Muslim don't have any problem. We believe both of these children were well
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We're being blessed by God Almighty We believe Moses was Jesus Isaac was blessed as well as Ishmael was also blessed
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But the New Testament make it looks like Ishmael and his mother were being insinuated to come from illegitimate children well,
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I Think he's referring to their the New Testament assertion that Isaac is the child of promise
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Ishmael is not the child of promise That's that's the evidence the the of course when you read the
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Old Testament the promise was That Sarah would give birth not
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Hagar I wanted to get to another point, but we're not gonna get to it Let me see if I can find it real quick here.
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This is gonna sound funny, but Moses or God Almighty in the police Abraham was scared.
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He was already I Read it Okay, I'm probably have time that's the section but I don't
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I don't I think it would take too long to play all of it he made an argument that I had never heard of before and so it's good to hear new arguments and Learn how to respond to them the argument he he made was
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He went to the citation On the part of Jesus remember he told the parable of the vineyard and How the you know?
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The master rented out the vineyard and then when he sent people to collect they they beat them up and killed them and he sent his
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Son and they killed him and cast him out of the vineyard Then what's he gonna do? He's gonna come and he's gonna take that vineyard away. He's gonna kill the the people and give it to somebody else and then
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Jesus quotes in 118 Psalm Where he talks about the stone which the builders rejected this cheat that has become the chief cornerstone
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Now in context Jesus is obvious talking about himself He is the son who's been sent by the father.
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He's being rejected by the Jewish leaders Judgment is going to come upon them and those special privileges that have been given to the
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Jewish people as a national entity are going to be given to someone else and That is the obvious application but what
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Sheikha wall does is he he takes that term? Stone the stone was to build objection.
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He says the word stone is refer in reference to Hagar that Hagar means stone and Hagar was rejected and so the one that comes from Hagar is the one to whom the kingdom is going to be given and that's
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Muhammad The problem of course is that in Matthew the word stone is lithos and In the
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Old Testament in Hebrew, it's Evan not Hagar or anything related to Hagar and so I guess you could you know sort of pull what some of the
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Roman Catholics try to pull with Peter and Say well, that was this guy that you know
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Jesus would have said this type of stone or that type zone in Aramaic which we don't have any Aramaic or something like that but the reality is that the specific term is
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Evan in the Old Testament Hebrew and Has nothing to do with Hagar either contextually or linguistically at that particular point in time
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But I didn't have time to play all of that, but it was interesting the first time I heard it because I was climbing a
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Grade that tops out at about 17 percent. So you're in first gear At Maximum heart rate and I'm listening this at the same time going am
57:50
I hearing this or is this just lack of blood getting to? the brain Anyway, it's it's funny how you remember where things like that were.
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So anyways, this is it for the dividing line So we get back from Detroit lots of ministry this weekend.
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Please. Please. Please. I am very serious Pray for this weekend that God will open hearts and minds that he will give me
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Clarity of expression and that he will bless people with his spirit.
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They might understand his truth. Thanks for listening We'll see you next time the violin The dividing line has been brought to you by Alpha and Omega ministries
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59:30
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59:37
That's a o -m -i -n dot o -r -g where you'll find a complete listing of James White's books tapes debates and tracks