The Nashville Statement, the PCA, and a Whole Lot More

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July 1, 2019

Spent a good bit of time today looking at the Nashville Statement in light of the Revoice/PCA/Greg Johnson situation last week. What is ahead for the PCA? For all of us? Also looked at some comments from Dr. Jamin Hubner on the same section of the Nashville Statement. Looked at some Bradly Mason claims, looked at a few other tweets, talked about biblical racism, and finally some words about Norman Geisler. Visit the store at https://doctrineandlife.co/

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00:41: Well greetings and welcome to the dividing line on a Tuesday July 2nd.
00:47: I almost said it's Tuesday, July 2nd I'm Albert Moeller and this is the briefing but I can't do that because it's
00:53: July so then you would know it was fake You probably would have known it was fake anyways, because we have a very smart audience.
00:59: Yes. Yes, we do At least I think you're allowed to say that. I don't know. Well, anyway It is the summer in Phoenix the summer finally arrived here.
01:07: It took it a while We had a very cool June relatively speaking according to the National Weather Service and July not so much so far, but it's cooling off today hundred only 109 today in Phoenix So anything under 110 is just yeah, whatever
01:24: It's the summer. That's how it that's how it works here. So I get to wear Hawaiian shirts now because yeah, it's
01:32: It's time to do that Which is as close as you can get to a Coogee Sort of no, not the same.
01:39: Okay. Alright, I I'll leave it that way because Rich, you know has has
01:46: Coogee derangement syndrome and it's it's a sad thing to see it really really is. There are a lot of sad things to see
01:54: That's is if you look at social media at all It's pretty ugly
02:01: So many things where in the world do we start? Well, I think we need to start with important stuff
02:11: Many of us, you know, I've been I've been I wrote a few things this morning about this that I posted the speed and pace at which
02:22: Things are from our perspective changing radically in culture and in the church
02:29: Leaves a lot of us disoriented uncertain about what we're supposed to be doing which direction we're supposed to be going all sorts of things like that and Obviously, I Will admit
02:41: I was caught napping. I did not see these things coming. Oh, I saw certain elements,
02:47: I suppose but in the sense that I posted a link this morning to a
02:55: Drayer article about the influx of cultural Marxism into the seminaries
03:01: And of course if you looked at the super liberal seminaries decades ago they all the stuff that you're now getting in in Mainstream stuff that we'd ever thought we'd ever hear it in those contexts.
03:16: All that stuff was was present back then and We knew that but it was sort of like yeah.
03:22: Well, they're crazy Crazy liberals and so they're gonna do what crazy liberals and leftists do
03:29: But all of a sudden things have changed and someone threw a switch and Seeds that had been sown for decades
03:40: But especially over the past decade began to flourish as I said this morning billions of little green seeds posted sown by George Soros and others have
03:52: Flourished and yes in our seminaries in our schools and our churches and our denominations and now we're seeing this all around us
04:02: One of the ways in which that's being seen it was illustrated last week in The PCA General Assembly the
04:12: Presbyterian Church in America split off from the PC US Years ago same reasons that that always happens and that is the
04:25: Constant tendency of leftward movement on The part of theological denominations.
04:32: That's that's just there's no way to Say it any other way but there is a constant leftward movement in seminaries and therefore denominations
04:45: Denominational structures people will build up a Denomination build churches build seminaries endow them and then give them to their theological enemies.
04:57: That's That's just what the history of the United States looks like over the past 200 years That just seems to be how things work.
05:03: That's certainly how it's worked in in Europe as well. So The PCA and then you have the
05:10: OPC there's so many there's so many you've got the What our PCNA and are all sorts of smaller denominations?
05:19: out there as well, and then you have PC USA and The last time
05:25: I talked with really orthodox PC USA people was when we did the debate with Barry Lynn in 2001 so that's been almost two decades ago.
05:34: That was a PC USA congregation was trying to hold on But PC USA, oh goodness
05:42: I can tell you some pretty sad stories Friend of mine oh,
05:50: I won't go into it, but let's just say that that we had first -hand experience with the
05:57: Collapse of the PC USA back in the 1980s PC USA and so the fact that we ran into a
06:06: PC USA minister on Twitter last week and and still Conservatives are like you're a
06:12: Presbyterian minister and you believe what and it's like yeah That's that's where the majority of them are these days
06:18: Being a Presbyterian minister doesn't mean anything you have to ask much more specific questions being a Baptist minister doesn't mean anything
06:24: There are super ultra American Baptists ultra liberal Baptists out there folks and there remember if you believe
06:34: What I teach about the Bible that it's the inspired inerrant Word of God if you believe Jesus Christ physically rose from the dead if you believe
06:42: Basically in the fundamental gospel message you are in the minority and what calls itself Christianity. That's just that's just a reality and You got to start thinking that way you got to start recognizing that that reality anyway
06:57: At the PCA General Assembly There was a discussion of what happened at the revoice conference last year there had to be
07:10: Because it had been held at a PCA church. This does not make the PCA denomination
07:17: Responsible for Revoice, but it does raise the question
07:23: What will the denomination do? regarding those who would
07:29: Be involved in such things. What's the PCA's position and there was a discussion not of the adoption as a
07:40: Statement of the PCA but but the utilization of the
07:47: Nashville Statement Basically the agreement that the Nashville Statement Speaks biblical truth when it addresses the issues of human sexuality
08:01: Basically was what was going on So, let me read some of the
08:07: Nashville Statement to you so, you know, we're talking about it's been a few years since it came out so May not be the first thing on the top of your on your reading list and stuff like that But it is important to to hear it
08:20: I'm gonna just start with article 6 because there's some other stuff. I want to address and This is this will be relevant
08:28: To that article 6 we affirm that those born with a physical disorder of sex development are
08:36: Created an image of God and have dignity and worth equal to all other image bearers They are acknowledged by our
08:41: Lord Jesus in his words about eunuchs who were born that way from their mother's womb With all others there welcome as faithful followers of Jesus Christ who should embrace their biological sex insofar as it may be known
08:52: We deny that ambiguity is related to a person's biological sex render one Incapable of living a fruitful life in joyful obedience to Christ now this one for me is especially
09:05: Relevant because some of you may recall a couple years ago when I went right around this time of year went over to CNN Well, I was on twice once by Skype and then once in studio and the issue of Sexual ambiguity
09:24: Intersexed individuals came up it always comes up in defense of transgenderism and there is no logical connection between the two
09:34: I ran the numbers a few about sometime last year and I've forgotten what they were and I feel badly about that because it took
09:41: Me a long time to track them all down as with the number of homosexuals in the population
09:48: The people on the left want to exaggerate the number of the percentage of the population
09:54: That has some kind of genetic disorder You can have xxy and xyy and and there can be chromosomal aberrations that impact the development of Sexual organs and and issues along those lines, but the percentage of The population is
10:18: Exceptionally small. I think it was less than point four
10:26: Percent if I recall correctly, it was very very very small Number of people and so But since it is brought up Then the national statement addresses it and here basically says
10:45: The image of God is not determined by that that those who would have this, you know, there should be pastoral sensitivity and And that kind of thing in regards to dealing with intersexed people so then article 7 then says we affirm that self -conception as male or female should be defined by God's holy purposes in creation and Redemption as revealed in Scripture We deny that adopting a homosexual or transgender self -conception is consistent with God's holy purposes in creation and redemption now,
11:22: I Identified this last week since this is the section that was primarily being focused upon by people
11:33: Protesting PCA ministers protesting the
11:39: Nashville statement and its Involvement in the
11:45: PCA this is what they're focused on and they were focused primarily upon the denial but once again, we affirm that self -conception as male or female
11:57: Should be defined by God's holy purposes in creation and redemption is revealed in Scripture. So no transgenderism transgenderism is a fundamental violation of God's created order and his purposes then we deny that adopting a homosexual or transgender self -conception is
12:21: Consistent with God's holy purposes in creation redemption and there is the issue
12:27: Though I called it Bible 101 40 % of The delegates at the
12:38: PCA General Assembly Voted against not the adoption of the national statement, but Presbyterians have 47 ,000 terms for all the complicated stuff they do but the
12:57: Acceptance in the sense of being biblical whatever Concept of the national statement
13:04: So 40 % Disagreed with we deny that adopting a homosexual or transgender self -conception is consistent with God's holy purposes in creation redemption
13:17: This is the homosexual Christian movement. This is the Matthew Vines This is now the
13:25: Greg Johnson because Greg Johnson The the one of the elders at the church that hosted revoice
13:34: Spoke he came out prior to the General Assembly. He had been asked specifically last year.
13:40: Are you gay? He said He didn't say no He said he had a porn addiction years ago, but didn't say whether he was a homosexual he came out as a homosexual prior to the
13:54: General Assembly and then stood on the floor and Identified himself as such and received applause for opposing the
14:02: Second part of article 7 of the Nashville statement now it was passed
14:11: But what you see is Again if it follows all the preceding mainline denominations
14:23: You see what's going to happen and how it's going to happen. And so after It passed
14:31: Greg Johnson Let me put this up I don't know if you can zoom in on that or not or wait a minute
14:44: There we go So here's here's here's his his tweet
14:52: Last night NS that's Nashville statement won the battle, but they will lose the war One we had a seat at the table that's new to notice the average age the proponents and opponents big shift three
15:05: About 40 % of PCA leaders rejected NS for we got a study committee whose report will supersede
15:11: NS in PCA Now, of course, this is the tweet so you have to be fast.
15:16: You have to be short He did remove this tweet not because of what it said but because people
15:25: People were offended by the use of the word war we live in the snowflake generation
15:35: So Last night the Nashville statement won the battle, but they will lose the war.
15:46: Is that true? Well if the
15:52: Perspective of history if the flow of history Remains the same probably probably
16:01: Number one we had a seat at the table. That's new. Yep Yeah, and look back at Episcopalians look back at PC USA look back at the liberal
16:16: Lutherans and once you start granting to a women homosexuals transgenders, whatever once you ignore biblical parameters of what is
16:36: Supposed to be the requirements to be able to fulfill those offices Then you're giving a bunch of people a seat at the table and eventually they will take over the table and They will run your denomination into the ground
16:51: Which is what has happened with PC USA Episcopalian Church in America, etc, etc
17:00: Number two notice the average age the proponents and opponents big shift He's right.
17:08: And how has that happened? Professors seminaries culture the next the next generation as the older Orthodox retire
17:27: That's could become 45 55 then 50 50 and boom Won't take that long
17:35: Won't take that long About 40 % of PCA leaders rejected NS now they could have had other reasons
17:43: But in all probability it was primarily over this issue That means there is a large percentage in the
17:51: PCA that have accepted the idea that of identity politics and in this case identity sexuality and Have accepted the idea that a
18:06: Person who experiences same -sex attraction should self -identify as a homosexual Christian that there is nothing in that act that is
18:21: Problematic and of course and this is the doomsday statement for Presbyterians The doomsday statement number four we got a study committee whose report will supersede national statement in the
18:36: PCA in other words historically when
18:43: Presbyterians Because of their polity
18:50: One of the ways that they try to avoid splitting is by creating committees and Those committees never go away and They can go on forever and What has happened historically is that kind of thing?
19:09: Just keeps bringing it up and bringing it up and bringing it up and it's like the dripping of the water on the rock
19:17: Eventually it erodes the rock away and That's what's happened.
19:22: That's that's what's happened to the PC USA and to all the liberal denominations that went before it and and Anybody with any historical
19:34: Sense is look at this going Seen this before Seen this before Here we go again
19:43: So it doesn't you know will will the PCA Recognize that this is a life and death situation for their denomination and Do something and Close the door on this or is it too late?
20:05: Is the infection too widespread 40 %? That's a lot That's a lot.
20:12: That really really is and as we look around today. I Said in a little article yesterday,
20:19: I think I'm seeing it amongst reformed Baptist. I'm seeing critical theory. I'm seeing the whole idea of acceptance of this cultural milieu
20:33: It it goes under the the rubric of well You know, we just we just need to be loving and they think that loving means adopting these cultural
20:43: Mandates and these cultural ways of thinking rather than deriving your worldview from Scripture.
20:49: It's well I can fit my worldview into This etc, etc.
20:55: No and so There's Greg Johnson and I I'm afraid that on most of the stuff he's right
21:05: Now he's in the wrong but the point is you know, and I'm not
21:10: I'm not the PCA so I can't nothing I can do about that, but There you go that's
21:18: That's what's going on. So that Nashville statement Like I said when
21:25: I when I saw The Controversial aspect was
21:34: Section 7 and the reality that Christians are to have their identity in Christ as redeemed sinners and Hence the intersection of critical critical race theory and critical gender theory
21:52: Which we see coming at the church from both directions and this is This is tiring a lot of pastors out who are just simply trying to be faithful and ministering the word
22:01: But now we're just getting hit right left and center From all sorts of different directions and so we're being told that You are to identify yourself by your ethnicity by your
22:20: Self -determined sexuality and it is weird a Lot of people that are willing to to buy the critical race theory and the the racial self -identification
22:33: Haven't quite gotten the point of what was Dolezal. Was that her name? Rachel Dolezal.
22:39: No Okay On the sexual part. We'll let you
22:45: Decide what you are Not when it comes to the race part I think most people are like no, no, no, no, no, no, not no not gonna
22:57: Not gonna go there. If you're if you're white you're white and if you try to pretend you're something else
23:02: We're not gonna we're not gonna buy that. Got something in my eye But still
23:08: I don't know why I mean if you can buy your Exercise of your mind
23:16: Determine what your sexuality is. Why can't you determine what your race is? I mean it that makes perfect sense
23:24: But a lot of people aren't willing to go quite that quite that far So I was sent a an article this week
23:37: By an old friend Someone who
23:45: Known for many many years used to be a Regular participant in our chat channel and our chat channel is flowing along over there right now and we've got folks in there that have been in there for years and years and years and Most of them will will remember
24:04: Jamin Huebner Now doctor and And So I was sent a an article that is a review and critique of the
24:21: Nashville Statement by Jamin by Dr. Huebner and After seminary
24:30: Dr. Huebner as many others have took a pretty hard turn left hard turn left and So I Went down to section 7 to see what
24:47: The the idea would would be and of course at the end of the discussion of section 6 we read
24:59: The clarity of the NS Nashville Statement seems to escape Precisely those complex situations.
25:05: It was supposed to help Warren Throckmorton a Christian professor of psychology Accurately assesses the situation this way the real world of sexuality is not as neat and clean as portrayed by the signers of Nashville Statement I hope
25:17: Leanne story provides a caution to those who marginalize those who have been dealt a hand They didn't ask for and again.
25:23: This is this is in regards to That incredibly small number of people
25:30: Who are quote -unquote intersex? And Again that that calls for great pastoral sensitivity
25:39: But it has very little to do with the utilization of that concept today
25:45: And that's concept context for article 7 which is quoted Dr.
25:52: Huebner says the first line appears to be a third reassertion of CBM W's complementarianism
25:59: But why should human identity all the more Christian identity be defined solely in the categories of creation redemption and not for example
26:06: By the teachings of Jesus or something else Well because it's a foundational concept that Jesus himself grounded his teaching for example in Matthew chapter 19 in Answering questions about sexuality marriage male -female relationships in creation
26:33: The creation ordinance is going to be consistent with Jesus But creation and redemption
26:42: Should not be in any way placed in opposition to the teachings of Jesus, so I don't understand that Surely we cannot pass over the parables of Jesus or the
26:53: Sermon on the Mount with its beatitudes Lord's Prayer and golden rule No one was even suggesting that of course
26:58: We're talking about categories creation redemption. We're not talking about specific texts of Scripture The same might be asked about Paul's through the
27:07: Spirit while the earliest Christian summaries of Christ likeness again I don't see it. This is at all relevant in a meaningful fashion as a critique of The statement that we deny that adopting homosexual or transgender
27:21: Self -conception is consistent with God's holy purposes in creation and redemption Saying well, what about the
27:29: Lord's Supper or the Lord's Prayer or through the Spirit Isn't relevant category error
27:38: The denial is confusing as well since it implies that simply Identifying and I that is in italics simply identifying as homosexual or transgender
27:50: Whether verbally or even in one's own mind is unacceptable Well, I'm not sure what simply identifying would mean but yes
28:00: It is right here that we address Self -identification how you view yourself
28:07: Christians believe that you view yourself in light of God's revelation. I don't get to have sovereignty over the categories of creation and redemption
28:19: I Don't have that right. I don't have that power as a believer
28:25: Then this was interesting in Parentheses this assertion was made explicit in Article 10 of the 2018 statement on social justice and gospel
28:37: And the gospel by John MacArthur at all. I guess that's how it's cited now Quote we reject gay
28:44: Christian as a legitimate biblical category Endquote. Well, that's exactly what we did say and that's
28:55: I Stand firmly in support of that. There's no question about that at all
29:03: But then the authors might as well have said
29:10: We deny that Recognizing oneself to be a sinner is consistent with God's holy purposes
29:22: How Do you get from we reject? the idea that We have the right to determine the categories of our own existence.
29:36: God does that by creation? To we deny that recognizing oneself to be a sinner is consistent with God's holy purposes
29:45: I mean unless you're unless all you're saying here is that homosexuality is sinful and Therefore should be recognized as sinful and repented of but that's not what you're saying.
30:02: We recognize that No, the authors might as well not have said we deny that recognizing oneself to be a sinners because it was
30:12: God's holy purposes But then how do we how does? This how does dr.
30:20: Huebner follow this up, but recall that Abram and Sarai Were not called to immediately abandon polygamy before God would make a covenant with them
30:33: Nor did God abandon covenant promises when the people of Israel clung to a hopeless system of monarchy and bloody political maneuvering first Samuel 8
30:42: The Apostle Paul also had his self -conception of being the greatest of sinners
30:50: In this sense, it is no more sinful to call oneself gay straight or lesbian than to call oneself greedy arrogant or violent
31:01: Um That is such a mass a morass of Categorical errors.
31:10: I don't even exactly know how to untangle it The point of the national statement.
31:19: I didn't have anything to do with that one I I can tell you I can speak with some authority on the statement of social justice in the gospel
31:27: Nothing to do with the national statement But I can guarantee you
31:32: That the point of the Nashville statement is that you do not identify yourself on the basis as a redeemed
31:43: Christian on the basis of your temptations or your predilections and Hence, we do not start groups.
31:52: Well here of Greedy Christians, I'm a greedy
31:57: Christian and I'm going to get together with other other greedy Christians And I I think it's terrible how the church has treated greedy
32:04: Christians down through the ages There needs to be not something needs to be done to Maybe we need some reparations for how greedy
32:19: Christians have been treated down through the ages or arrogant Christians or violent
32:24: Christians or thief thievery Chrone Christians or whatever. It's obvious that What is being said?
32:35: By those who identify themselves as homosexual Christians is that this is a constituent element of their self -identification and What the
32:46: Nashville statement and what we said is this is an inappropriate thing to do We are identified by our
32:51: Redeemer not by the sins from which we were redeemed Admitting those sins is something completely different than then having been redeemed
33:02: Using that language to identify ourselves and to then draw ourselves into groups draw lines of division
33:12: Demand that the church treat this group in this way That's what it's referring to And I don't see how
33:23: Anything about Abram and Sarai Had anything to do with You know making a covenant with with them.
33:34: What does that have to do with a movement today of People who are attempting to overthrow basic biblical moral teaching by inserting into the church categories of identification that Paul said such were some of you not such are some of you
33:58: Paul placed it in the past tense people trying to place place it in the present tense and None of these illustrations are even close to substantiating
34:09: That attempt to make that insertion we go on of course
34:15: Homosexuality set aside transgenderism for a moment. You do have to treat them differently.
34:20: They need to be Does not always refer to homoeroticism anyway homosexual often refers to those with same -sex attraction a
34:31: Psychological state it's not just a psychological state. It's a moral state Regardless that person's social actions and or sexual behaviors and embodied social and ethical state
34:43: So we want to start chopping got it got have got to find a way For homosexuality to be given a special status, it's always
34:55: Sad to see this in that case saying I'm gay is like saying I find contemporary folk music to be beautiful pure predilection just taste
35:12: I I prefer Glenn Miller over Stan Kenton Same thing is
35:20: I'm gay No, it's not Not even close not even on the same planet not even the same solar system the same galaxy or the same universe musical taste is not the same thing as a fundamental twisting of the creator creation relationship
35:43: That Paul uses as an illustration of how deeply into the very formation of man
35:50: Sinful rebellion can go and there's nothing in 1st
35:56: Corinthians 6 that would say and Don't be deceived
36:01: Big band lovers will not enter in the kingdom of heaven and such were some of you No, so in that case saying
36:13: I'm gay is like saying I find contemporary folk music to be beautiful though Same -sex orientation is obviously more permanent and central then why use the illustration it trivializes it and This is viewed as morally objectionable, but this is absurd.
36:29: No the example was absurd our present -day Disabled Christians to be charged immorality for saying
36:35: I have MS or I'm autistic I've allowed Justin Peters to address this because it directs directly impacts him
36:44: But once again, this is becoming incredibly popular for people to say that That Homosexual desire is nothing more than Justin Peters being
37:02: Cerebral palsy keeping him in a wheelchair. It's the same thing No, it isn't and If you can be so confused to think it is you have lost all connection with biblical ethics and morality
37:16: You really have do you really it does someone?
37:22: Seriously want to suggest that the Apostle Paul would have gone. Oh, yeah. Mm -hmm.
37:27: Yeah, I mean he wouldn't have known what a wheelchair was but yeah, yeah, sure.
37:33: Yeah, it's just a that one particular sin is just it's just like having a
37:39: You know a bum leg Having having MS or autistic or something like that No, the
37:47: Apostle would never have agreed with that we should not either because it trivializes
37:54: The prohibition against homosexuality for what it represents as a
38:00: Denial and a twisting of the fundamental created order made by God This is what happens when you embrace
38:11: External sources of authority and use them to recreate Christian orthodoxy and the text of the
38:18: Christian scriptures Should they undergo conversion therapy and remain alienated from the local church in the meantime?
38:26: I suggest a genuinely Christian response These questions is no So I guess the idea is there is no such thing as conversion therapy
38:38: In other words first Corinthians 6 should have a present tense not a past tense
38:43: Because conversion can't change anything and that's exactly what Greg Johnson said to PCA.
38:50: He doesn't know of anyone who's ever ever been delivered From same -sex attraction ever.
38:56: It doesn't exist. They have to they have to say doesn't matter how many people come forward and say that's me You don't exist.
39:02: You don't exist Remain alienated from the local church No But there are two different attitudes that a person with same -sex attraction can come into the church with There is the repentant attitude
39:18: That Acknowledges and embraces the authority of God's Word to define these issues
39:27: That does not demand that the church change its theology that does not demand the church celebrate
39:37: That person's sexuality and Then there's the attitude that says you need to celebrate me
39:44: You need to validate me you need to say that who I am in of myself is good and You need to change your fundamental theology and then
39:58: I'll accept you That's what you encounter. That's what you run into So it says in short the whole paragraph runs the risk of Pushing some
40:12: Christians into denial or back in the closet It does not see the church as a hospital for sinners or provide sound direction for the complexities of local congregations
40:26: So evidently from dr. Huebner's perspective Um Homosexuals need to be open and out
40:37: Celebrating and That a hospital for sinners is not a place where sin can actually be very clearly defined
40:43: So I would have to ask is same -sex orientation
40:51: In of itself something needs to be mortified And I can see why you push transgenderism out of the way and didn't address that Because that wouldn't fit this narrative at all there is no way to avoid creation categories in discussing transgenderism, but hospital for sinners
41:10: The very use of the phrase assumes the ability to define the term sinners sin itself
41:19: It's necessary. It's got to be there this kind of material again,
41:27: I address this specifically because We used to we knew we used to know this individual this person was a regular in our chat channels
41:36: I still have I still have Scripts Somewhere in my old
41:45: Merc setup that were designed specifically for Jamin, and I think read if I recall correctly
41:52: Yes Yeah, yeah, I know I know
42:01: So there you go A sad a sad thing to see but How prevalent is this well, and when
42:13: I say this I mean the Infection of critical theory it's everywhere
42:24: Man do I do I Do I give the context for all this do
42:29: I walk through this? I don't know in the amount of time. I have left Well, I'll try it.
42:37: I'll try to be brief It's not easy to do, but I will I will try to be brief without closing once again
42:46: Bradley Mason Has posted some material I Didn't at least start this one, but that's that's good
42:57: Looking at the Twitter feed Bradley Mason says first it is interesting to pit me against James White.
43:03: I'm inventing nothing nor are these my ideas I'm simply attempting to bring together to the best of my ability
43:08: Centuries of thought and wisdom from african -american thinkers pastors and godly men and women this is on the issue of race though Critical theory is going to be very very very very much a part of all of this
43:21: Second if you think that it is leftist ideas that have been Been the shackle around the God -given freedom of American of african -americans in this country, then
43:29: I simply don't know what world you live in The South argued it was atheist progressives who rejected the authority of scripture who were driving abolitionism
43:38: Then it was Marxism and the influence of the Soviets that was to blame for integrationism And now it is the cultural
43:45: Marxism and leftism that is to blame for seeking justice in society Just 50 years now following the civil rights movement and at each step of this struggle the victimizer
43:55: Condemned his victim for the public ideas and social systems. He suffered under so once again for Bradley Mason and for this entire perspective
44:03: It's always it cannot be because the background of all this again was the tweet that we talked about last week the statistical anomaly 3 .5
44:14: times more likely black woman to seek abortion than the corresponding white woman or other minorities plus The article that said hey look at this
44:25: Canada United States different histories same issues Why is it the same issue if it's
44:32: Americans the American history that creates all of this? That was the background to to all of this but Then we had
44:47: Yeah, this is a long thread so doing screenshots is slow Last the reason of this disagreement of historical and social perspectives is what
44:58: James White and I is that use a larger font one here is so small is last the reason for this disagreement of historical and social perspectives is that James White and I start from two different very different set of Assumptions.
45:13: I simply do not believe there is anything wrong with black people full stop so there is
45:21: This is this is how you make assertions and if you want folks I just yesterday
45:29: Followed a few links that people gave to me. There was a a former was a apostate guy.
45:35: He's an apostate. He's left the faith Was making just wild and insane assertions about me in a in a in a thread and and Jeff Durbin had responded to it and corrected the falsehoods and I Couldn't see half of it because I had half these people already blocked but There are places in social media right now that are just violently nasty violently nasty and They've probably always been there but I I just I don't go looking for that kind of stuff and Sometimes it just boils over and someone says hey, did you see this and you look and you go?
46:20: Then you realize these these people have been baying away on these drums for a very very very long time and they're really angry and they're racist and They are minority racist and though that doesn't exist.
46:35: Yes, it does Let me say this again and It's the most unpopular thing in the world to say but it has to be said from a biblical perspective if you buy into the lie
46:49: That a black person cannot be a racist There is no end to that rabbit hole
46:56: Because you have now bought into an externally derived concept Unbiblical categories
47:05: That Fundamentally impacts our ability to even define what sin is
47:14: Racism can be defined as a sin, but it's a complex of sins it's hatred in the heart it is a
47:25: Unfairness or a lack of justice in treatment of other individuals made in the image of God You have to bring together
47:35: Certain categories of biblical teaching to create a foundation for the condemnation of racism
47:45: But if you do that, then you have to recognize that the modern definition of racism based upon oppressor and oppressed
47:56: Power structures you have to have power. Believe me. I go into these areas
48:02: Those people have the power. They're nasty. They're willing to do anything. They got power. They got lots of power.
48:08: They can slander They got lots of power. But no, no, no, no. No, it's not that kind of power.
48:13: We don't define it that way. No, no, no It's all has to be economic power. A lot of these folks are quite well off No, no, no, no, no see critical theory doesn't allow for that.
48:23: You're trying to reason with critical theory. You can't do that There if you buy that definition that some mythical definition of power is required for someone to be able to sin and Therefore a black person cannot sin
48:38: That's simple heresy It should be identified for exactly what it is and it is absolutely destructive to the church's ability to actually call out
48:49: Racism wherever it exists, not just the United States You see
48:55: I see people who are so willing to press this narrative so as to bring fundamental social change the
49:01: United States that they Are willing to do irreparable damage to the rest of the world's church in the process
49:11: And don't you realize that in reality what you're doing is you're dehumanizing black people to say this
49:19: There is the soft bigotry of lowered expectations behind this as well
49:26: There is only one standard when it comes to sin and it's provided by God's law and If you can't see that then you are blind to what the gospel is actually saying
49:38: Because there is racism in every nation in the world and it takes on all sorts of different hues and perspectives and backgrounds and dynamics and everything else and if the gospel is going to speak to the whole world it has to speak to the whole world and And once you redefine it just so you can get your political perspectives pushed through in one place you're proving yourself not to be a follower of the truth and willing to damage
50:08: God's God's church wherever it might be so there is a tremendous amount of black racism and Hispanic racism and Asian racism and Russian racism and wherever you want to go wherever you want to go you go to places in Asia and there are people you and I could not tell one lick of a
50:33: Difference between the two of them, but there is racism involved and it goes back a long ways
50:38: And it's still sin it has nothing to do with power dynamics And once you say it is you are muting the gospel.
50:47: You're shutting it up Stop it So I'm listening to these people and they are spewing racism
50:58: Based on slander and lies and falsehood and they claim to be
51:04: Christians They claim to be Christians Once you tell a people group.
51:12: Hey, guess what? There's a certain sin. You can't even commit it You know what?
51:18: That's gonna do it's gonna result in a whole lot of that sin a Whole lot of that sin because now it's acceptable.
51:26: I can do it feel good about it. It's deception It's deception so When Bradley Mason says
51:36: I simply do not believe there's anything wrong with black people full stop. I responded by saying well,
51:41: I Know a whole bunch of black brothers and sisters who will join with me in saying you are completely wrong
51:50: Because there's all sorts of things wrong with black people It's called sin and that's the same with Hispanic people and Asian people and white people and every other kind of people
52:00: Now what he's trying to say is that I'm saying there's a special wrongness because of that one anomaly in regards to abortion
52:12: But of course he ignores what my real argument was. Maybe he didn't listen. I don't know. I Don't have
52:19: I don't I do not have any reason to trust anything Bradley Mason says he has twisted my words so many times
52:25: That I why should I why should I even begin to give the man the benefit of the doubt?
52:32: There's there's no reason to eventually just have to go. Yeah the missing element of his criticism was that he ignored a the
52:46: Prager you video that I Presented specifically in regards to group think group think which is demonstrated by the fact that in the
52:59: United States the American black population votes 95 % the same way and Then how they treat black
53:07: Americans who don't Stick with the group and we've we've
53:12: I've shown you I've shown you the tweets from people like dr. Anthony Bradley calling people Oreos Eric Mason Talking about Christian brothers as black on the outside white on the inside in public without these beginning of a semblance of repentance nothing
53:32: They stand by that and so the whole point that Evidently people like Bradley Mason just want us to just walk on by and ignore is
53:45: The fact that you can have a people group who adopt a way of thought
53:52: A way of thinking and enforce it upon themselves that is self -destructive and that's what this is it is the embracing of a set of principles
54:05: That is Destructive, but if you dare say it and You're a part of the group
54:14: You will be excluded with nasty names. If you say it from outside the group, you'll be simply called a racist
54:21: Which is what I've been experiencing all along now you empty the word of its meaning when you use it in that way that's what's going on today and Christians of all people should be people who defend the idea that words are supposed to have meaning if you're going to make an accusation against someone you've got to be able to ground it properly and You can't twist the meaning of words to make your slander stick
54:49: That's what's going on today and Hate to tell you it's 2019, which means 2020.
54:56: It's right around the corner Which means we've already entered into a season Where you will see the redefinition of words over and over and over and over and over again it's just So I He says
55:15: I simply not believe there is anything wrong with black people full stop Then he goes on to actually say no race is physically mentally or morally inferior as a group to any other
55:28: There is also no race wide culture that can stand in and receive the lashes for as they stand in for a people group
55:34: Allowing plausible deniability to those repeating age -old racist sentiments, which has nothing to do with the reality
55:43: And evident I I don't know how he deals with the reality of The abortion plague amongst
55:50: African Americans in the United States, I don't know how he deals with it. Maybe just closes eyes to I don't know He says and I seek to apply as consistently when
56:02: I see a 3 .5 times type relationship between races One move that is not available to me
56:07: Is that one of those races is just more sinful than the other or deficient in any way? It has nothing to do with sin for deficiency.
56:13: It has to do with the group think It has to do with the you mean are you telling me that a group that decides to function as a group?
56:23: cannot embrace principles and theories mores, especially sexual mores that are non -flourishing that are
56:32: Negative to the the continued existence that group that can't happen Bradley Are you so sold out
56:39: The social justice warrior knew that you will allow this to go on and not even deal with the root issue
56:47: Therefore therefore that's that's what there's a critical theory does that this is what this is what it does Can't address it biblically.
56:54: Oh, no. Oh, no No can't do that There is no group in need of paternalistic care
57:03: See that's see if you dare say this you're just being paternalistic I am so sick and tired of these snowflakes
57:14: Who are so you're being paternalistic? You know what
57:20: God's law as our father gets to tell us what we're supposed to do and not do and When a group decides that as a whole fatherlessness is
57:34: Something that we're going to shame people over any longer shame is a good thing in God's created world
57:41: That baby mamas and fatherlessness. Yeah, that's okay No It's not okay.
57:50: Are you gonna say that Bradley or you keep your mouth shut because you don't want to be viewed as paternalistic. Oh Man On the other hand
58:05: James White clearly at least to me there's always the the little weasel worried Believes there is something wrong with black people or maybe that a community has embraced mores and Sexual perspectives that allow for fatherlessness and baby mamas that is destroying life.
58:28: Oh You can't say that why? Well black people say that but they shouldn't say it either
58:37: Um when he sees 3 .5 times whatever he looks to identify in what manner they are more sinful
58:45: You see what angers me about Bradley Mason is I'm sure he thinks he's he's doing something wonderful and great here
58:50: And he's standing on a pile of dead black babies to do it and doesn't even realize it
58:56: Doesn't he realize that's what happens when you become a social justice warrior That you've you've missed the forest for the trees
59:08: He says his goal is to fix them my goal is for God to open eyes to the gospel and to see in that community and every community a recognition of the humanity the preborn child the necessity of the covenant of marriage the in the
59:24: Absolute importance to human flourishing of the nuclear family. It doesn't matter what color they are
59:29: But I see in this situation that in this country in this culture There is a situation that has arisen because of groupthink that is causing this problem join with me in pointing it out
59:41: Don't just sit there as a snowflake behind your social justice Ridiculousness and let it continue
59:49: Stop the lying Bradley Stop deceiving people.
59:57: I know it makes you feel good You get pats on the back from all the social justice warriors
01:00:05: The fact is black Americans don't need fixing any more or less than do white Americans or any other racial group
01:00:11: Which is why there's 3 .5 times more. Oh, well, we can't talk about that Can't talk about that.
01:00:20: I'm saying exactly what black men and women have been saying and you know What the whole point is you're not allowed to anymore
01:00:28: And as soon as you accept that you it's done It's done Because you have now accepted the idea that culture defines what can and cannot be said what should and should not be said to whom at any one time and it's all just A matter of whether I'm offended and we are done communicating
01:00:48: That's it Capitulation it's over It's over yeah, well, okay one other thing before we wrap up well two things
01:01:07: Ray Ortlund likes to post this thing every once in a while. We did a little looking around and You'll be able oh, that's that's too small let people see it so Ray Ortlund just preached the gospel and you don't need to address other issues.
01:01:29: Now. Nobody says that it's a it's a It's it's a straw man, but Ray Ortlund's good at straw man.
01:01:36: I Disagree that approach though. Nobly intended allows burning issues to go unaddressed flagrant wrongs uncorrected needed apologies silence
01:01:43: Let's press the gospel into the whole of our lives. That sounds wonderful but why in the world would you be placing a picture of The Klan in 1922
01:01:55: I think in Portland and My understanding is they're meeting with the people in the black over there on the left
01:02:05: We've been doing a little digging into this because people keep throwing it out there this is
01:02:10: Ray Ortlund and the social justice people's way of trying to say that if you
01:02:15: Agree with the statement of social justice in the gospel. This is what you're promoting Okay, this is this is the level of rhetoric
01:02:23: That is out there And so we started digging around what in the world is this and it seems to come from Portland which it's hidden of itself
01:02:30: These days is ironic Given what's going on up there and the collapse of law and order that comes when leftists are in charge
01:02:42: But all the information we've been able to find is that it comes from Around 1922 and that the people in the black there are
01:02:50: It's a different group. I forget what their name was. I apologize what their name was, but they're another nativist type thing that was opposed
01:03:01: See that the the Klan was against Jews blacks and I think
01:03:07: Eastern Europeans and I forget What group this was these other people but they were it was a get -together in 1922
01:03:17: This is not to my knowledge a church service It's possible that the minister allowed them there there were people like that there's no question about it, but Isn't it obvious that these people need the gospel?
01:03:33: Isn't it just grossly unfair just absurdly offensive To attach this to the misrepresentative phrase just preach the gospel and you don't need to address other issues
01:03:47: The point is is that the answer to the other issues must be conditioned by the gospel That's the whole point
01:03:53: Ray Artland knows that but he likes to he likes to stir the pot and Throw stuff like that out there.
01:04:03: So There's that Wow folks
01:04:09: Can I say something? I'm watching Twitter. Would you people calm down? You're a bunch of snowflakes
01:04:17: Yeah, I'm talking to you unsafe space and and all the rest of them,
01:04:22: I mentioned that it was suggested to me as a means of Improving the the character of interaction on Twitter and to actually
01:04:39: Slow down and maybe increase its depth a little bit
01:04:45: To look at who is tweeting at you and ask the question
01:04:52: Do they have any followers? Is is are you gonna be amplifying a voice that is not amplified in of itself?
01:05:00: So in other words, you're not Lending your platform To someone and there are a lot of trolls in Twitter.
01:05:09: I can't tell you how many times Someone has come along and I've looked and they had zero followers one follower two followers and they tend to be the nastiest people and Often they're people that you've they're actually people you've blocked from someplace else and now they're coming around another direction and they're trying to get back into the into the conversation and It just seems to me it was suggested me from someone else who
01:05:38: I will not mention Came from someone else to them look at the number of followers and that way you're at least engaging with someone who's been in Twitter for a while and Has convinced at least a certain number of people that they have something worthwhile to say this might be a way of Raising the level a little bit let the let the noise go by Block if you need to mute if you need to you know,
01:06:15: I've been doing a lot of one month mutes one month mutes Because you know a month are we will this will be well, yeah, we will be going through the same thing a month from now, but Specifically on this exact topic.
01:06:29: No, probably not so One month mutes will help when you've got someone who just loses loses and you know themselves and gets angry or whatever fine
01:06:42: But So so I said, you know if someone has less than 500 followers
01:06:49: Do you really need to engage them? Do you really need to to interact with folks in that way?
01:06:56: It just seems like with an avalanche of stuff Flowing through social media.
01:07:01: It might be worthwhile to give some consideration that I happen to know and again, I won't tell you how but I happen to know certain
01:07:13: Major corporations and They have specific guidelines as To how they will interact with people on social media and your number of followers is extremely relevant extremely relevant
01:07:33: So I asked this particular person So what I get a response and they said oh, yeah, you'd get a response but if you had less than a certain number of followers
01:07:47: You don't get that and oh all of a sudden there, but that's not fair Everybody in the internet has to have an equal voice
01:07:56: No No, not really I'm not gonna listen to what you have to say about cardiology if you work at Walmart Now you might be a cardiologist who's working at Walmart But the point is
01:08:12: I don't think everybody has the exact same right To say the exact same things and everyone just simply everybody's opinions equal.
01:08:20: No, it's not if you think that's the case Then take your car for maintenance to the vet
01:08:27: We'll see how that goes You don't do that. You realize that's not the case. So man,
01:08:33: I cannot believe these people on On Twitter, they're just going nuts.
01:08:40: I can't believe that you would do that It's my Twitter people.
01:08:46: I will respond to who I want to. Oh my goodness. I Wow It's just stunning the snowflakes are everywhere
01:09:00: Just stop it and some of your you get muted immediately Good night
01:09:07: If I want us if I want to cut off at a certain number I'm gonna cut off a certain number and if you don't like that unfollow me
01:09:15: Just live your life and relax man,
01:09:20: I Started I sort of wonder if there's the the Pharmacy companies don't make a lot of money on blood pressure medication.
01:09:28: They're just doing this. We're all just doped up All right one last thing here
01:09:38: Yeah, it might and then there might be other people who someone's saying well this might trim the number of followers it well
01:09:44: I don't care But it also might increase it because there might be a lot of people. Well, at least we'll have a higher quality of conversation going on last thing
01:09:58: Hate to have it a negative, but I was just Stunned a couple days ago
01:10:05: I Guess Paul Washer preached at Grace Community Church Actually, there's two things oh great fine wonderful Brother Paul preached
01:10:21: Grace Community Church and You know,
01:10:29: I I am NOT Paul washers best bud But he's got my number and I've got his
01:10:39: Back in May I think it was last time I was in in the
01:10:45: UK. I walked from What was that station Victoria Station all the way back to my hotel close to the
01:10:53: Thames The whole time I was walking along I was talking with Paul Washer on the phone So we do talk
01:11:00: We've seen each other a couple times so far this year I've learned a lot about what happened to him
01:11:07: You know, I had seen him at the TMAI pre -conference at the
01:11:13: Shepherd's Conference shortly before the heart attack took place and at the time
01:11:20: Paul will tell you I'm a bit of a nag About him and his health and I was nagging him then
01:11:25: I was concerned by what he was saying He said he was seeing all sorts of doctors So I would get my assumption was they would have done all sorts of echocardiograms and scans of his heart and stuff like that because it just seemed to me like that's what it was, but Anyway, somebody missed them missed the the elephant in the room on that one
01:11:49: Anyway The the point is that I've spoken with Paul and Those around him and what he went through is just incredible and it's had long -lasting impact upon him
01:12:14: His brain was starved of oxygen for lengthy periods of time his wife was told he was dead
01:12:22: Then when he was revived one of the many times she was told he will he'll never speak he'll never walk nothing
01:12:30: Some of the things that have happened to him since then that I guess are common with the heart attack victims
01:12:37: Sometimes everything is green everything everything's turns green
01:12:45: You know, these are these are difficult things to be dealing with and and the point is that I'm concerned about the man's health
01:12:55: I'm very thankful that he's able to be ministering again But I'm very very concerned about his health
01:13:02: We had a great conversation in Louisville about a book He's working on I was able to Have some conversation with him about that because I've done a little work in some of that area in regards to the
01:13:12: Greek septuagint It's utilization in the New Testament. It was it was really cool. I mean, he's really doing some some great stuff there.
01:13:17: It really is well he speaks at grace and that's a that's a
01:13:27: There's some pressure there folks in case you haven't wondered There's some pressure staying behind John MacArthur's pulpit and When you're
01:13:37: Paul Washer, I think there's even more pressure there. You're expected to be to do certain things Well, lo and behold here comes
01:13:46: Steve Camp and Steve Camp just rips into Paul calling him a one -trick pony and Arrogant and all that didn't do any exegesis and all this stuff and I'm like what on Earth are you babbling about and I'm sorry.
01:14:09: I Maybe should have just sat there and said nothing, but I couldn't the the level of arrogance and hypocrisy for Steve Camp To go after Paul Washer that way.
01:14:25: I I lit in the Steve And he deserved every bit of it deserved a whole lot more.
01:14:31: He didn't get well Hancho posted a picture
01:14:39: And this is this is the Paul that I know this is Paul Washer that I know this is a picture and He Hancho took it in such a way that he tried to avoid faces and stuff like that But this is
01:14:54: Paul Washer over 90 minutes after the end of the evening service after a very full day of incredible preaching and talking
01:15:00: To everyone who wanted to speak to him. Thank you Lord for this precious servant leader, and that's the Paul Washer.
01:15:06: I know That's the Paul Washer. I've seen drive himself into exhaustion at G3 Almost every time
01:15:17: I've seen him there. He's just been beating himself up And there he is with someone in a wheelchair praying with them an hour and a half after the service is over and that's
01:15:33: The Paul Washer right now. That's that's the guy that's who he is So Steve you don't know what in the world you're talking about Repent and shut up It's all there is to it repent and shut up.
01:15:48: Sorry need to be blunt about that. May I be blunt about something else? We're being blunt Might as well be blunt all the way now.
01:15:55: I don't have any pictures this I don't want to show I don't want to show any pictures of this but Who was it that sent it to me?
01:16:04: I don't know a concerned person Sent it to me But you'll recall it was right out a year ago
01:16:19: That the controversy over the islamicized me videos took place and Criticism that I offered then well now a new video came out.
01:16:33: I don't know if it's a series But it was called
01:16:38: Muhammad's boom -boom room, I think is what it was called But it's
01:16:43: David Wood dressed as Satan with a mask on and then vocab alone is
01:16:50: Muhammad with a suicide vest on and It ends up with the suicide vest going off and once again there were a number of Issues that were raised in the video
01:17:11: There are valid issues it is I've raised this issue myself.
01:17:17: It is a very valid issue to discuss and And to let people know about the fact that in Muhammad's experience his initial
01:17:32: Reaction to the prophetic calling and angelic visitations was towards suicide that is a documentable reality of the early seerah literature in Islam and I think it's very important to contrast that with the biblical prophets and With New Testament teaching concerning the identity of the
01:18:05: Holy Spirit of God All of those things are valid Certain aspects of Muhammad's character as revealed in Seerah literature or in the
01:18:25: Ahadith must be Out in the open for conversation, but they need to be out in the open for conversation in a trustworthy truth -loving and respectful manner
01:18:44: Not respect for Muhammad, but for the person you're talking to that's the problem here
01:18:55: We have already stated very plainly we have laid out why we believe that The apologetic task needs to be undertaken in A certain fashion that would not include
01:19:14: Muhammad's boom -boom room That would not include
01:19:21: Well, they they're the ones that Came up with the terminology of mockumentary instead of a documentary a mockumentary and so we go back to Well, I'm like the
01:19:36: Old Testament prophets and I'm mocking the prophets of Baal And I'll just simply repeat what
01:19:42: I've said before Apologetics is
01:19:50: A dangerous field it is dangerous Because to engage in it you have to be armed
01:19:59: You have to have knowledge And what does the Bible say about knowledge
01:20:05: Well, we are to grow in the grace of knowledge Lord Jesus Christ. So you need to have knowledge.
01:20:11: That's true But what does what else does knowledge do? Puffs up It puffs up So That is why
01:20:23: I believe apologetics anyone involved in apologetics Needs to have
01:20:30: Christian maturity needs to be Rooted and grounded in Christian truth service in the church all that Because we've seen what happens
01:20:45: When you don't do that, we've seen people go off the rails every which direction apologetics is a
01:20:57: Giving defense of faith is something that is to be done within the context of the church
01:21:06: It is what the church is supposed to be doing Not to simply be left to outsiders.
01:21:12: There needs to be that balance that balance and so my concern
01:21:23: First and foremost, of course is for the Muslim Because I've sadly spoken to many
01:21:33: Muslims and all they knew of the Christian response to their beliefs was either ignorance or mockery and they were shocked when they discovered there there were
01:21:47: Christians who knew what they believed and Were able to interact with them on a respectful basis
01:21:55: And not just simply mock them The argument made in return is yeah, but there are certain
01:22:01: Muslims that are impacted by that Well what you win them with is what you win them to What kind of a church are you going to direct them to that is going to continue that kind of behavior?
01:22:14: Hopefully none What you win them with is what you win them to so if you love the
01:22:22: Muslim people then you want to Give them the truth in such a fashion
01:22:30: That we are being consistent See I I don't know how you defend
01:22:38: Christian truth in that fashion. I Know how you mock
01:22:43: Islam in that fashion. I don't know how you defend Christian truth I think so. I don't see how you can be consistent. I Don't see how you can be consistent
01:22:52: So But I also have a concern so I'm concerned about the Muslims I'm concerned about Christians who watch this
01:23:02: Because I lament the attitude that Christians have toward the Muslim people Really do but I'm also concerned about the men themselves this can't be a
01:23:23: Path to walk on that is truly edifying and grounding Does it lead to?
01:23:35: stronger Relationships within your local church
01:23:43: Within the service that you give in that local church questions,
01:23:49: I think have a Necessary part in our conversation.
01:23:55: So last thing I was going to mention it at the top But yesterday as we know
01:24:08: Oh, wait a minute, okay, hold on I Have been tweeted and when summer tweets people listen,
01:24:16: I Mean, you know, they did come in second to us.
01:24:22: So I think that's you know, something needs to that gives them special Okay, so summer just tweeted
01:24:43: Beth Moore tweets about how she can sit wherever she wants in the cafeteria Good day, sir thousands of likes and swoons for her wisdom
01:24:52: James White says I'm gonna respond to those who pick a fight with me after evaluating the time cost benefit Y 'all fall on your swords
01:25:02: It's exactly right, ah Unbelievable man
01:25:11: So Everybody say well, so you don't have a real profile pic. You're not gonna ever talk to me again.
01:25:17: No, it's those little egghead things, you know Get get get over it.
01:25:24: My goodness. Um, as most of you know yesterday morning Norman Geisler passed away and You know, he'd been declining health for for quite a while and There have been some wonderful things written and I believe
01:25:43: It's a Saturday, I think the I think in Charlotte the funeral is Saturday You can get the information at his website and stuff like that I'm not gonna say much because the last 19 years of his age.
01:25:59: I was on Norman Geisler's Do not like list And I was on dr.
01:26:05: Geisler's do not like list because of the Potter's freedom and Though I say to this day and I'm very thankful to this day that I was nothing but absolutely respectful to dr.
01:26:21: Geisler in that book I Disagreed with him and I Obviously had to refute things that he said but I Studied his position.
01:26:38: I Documented it to the hill and when he tried to respond when we were in the middle of responding to his response
01:26:50: Something terrible happened in his life. We just dropped it. We just dropped at that point and So as A person on the naughty list.
01:27:01: I don't want to intrude myself in this situation So I did just want to tell one funny story because the fact the matter is if you were
01:27:10: Norm's friend When Norm considered you a friend There were a few people that had a better sense of humor than Norman Geisler and everybody who knew him knows that Some of the some of the conversations we had and some of the conferences that we spoke at together were just hilarious and One of them that I mentioned yesterday on Twitter was
01:27:37: It was in Philadelphia. I remember it was in Philadelphia and It would have been only a few years.
01:27:43: This was this is probably about 97 So the the King James only controversy came out in 95 So it was within two years and he had endorsed the book
01:27:52: So the conversation came up at dinner with a bunch of other speakers. It was the speakers dinner at a conference
01:27:58: I don't remember which one it was but it was in it was in Philadelphia And so he says
01:28:08: Book came up and he says well James he says You go get those King James only guys We're right behind you
01:28:16: Long ways behind you. We can barely see you but you go get him. We're right behind you and the whole idea was
01:28:23: Yeah Go get him We support you, but we glad you're doing it
01:28:29: Not the rest of us is basically what it what it was. It got quite the laugh and So, yeah at that time, you know,
01:28:38: I Was I was still on the good side there were there were some subjects So you just didn't discuss with with Norm and one of them was reformed theology.
01:28:45: The other was presuppositionalism those two subjects Religion and politics in anybody else's situation with Norm that was that was that so I Haven't yet seen it, but I I bet you dollars don't it's eventually someone's one of those
01:29:04: Doherty and Calvinist is gonna Put out an article sending sending
01:29:09: Norm to the the flames of perdition. I'm sure But we're thankful for Norm's life.
01:29:14: He had obviously a tremendous impact by a lot of people the first The first defenses
01:29:21: I ever read of the existence of God came from Norm Geisler now I didn't end up adopting those defenses as a mature person, but they were important at the time and so we're thankful for Norm Geisler's life and He's he's pretty much
01:29:43: Actually, my dad's a year older than he is he was so he lived a lived a long life and Did a lot of good things defend the
01:29:52: Resurrection and of course Geisler Nix's book on general induction of the Bible We use that for years as a great introduction to stuff like that.
01:29:59: So Our prayers for his family and our thanks for his his ministry as well
01:30:05: All right. Well, that was a lot of heavy stuff again. Sorry about that, but We're in a battle folks.
01:30:12: We are simply in a battle and If you're wondering we're in the world
01:30:18: Why how in the world this stuff got into your church, well, sometimes we have to talk about it, so We Lord willing we'll see you on Friday When I don't know we'll figure out then but we're gonna have because Thursday is
01:30:32: July 4th, so Rich decide yeah, we don't want to compete with the with the with the fireworks.