September 19, 2017 Show with Bryan Osborne on “Quick Answers to Tough Questions”

The Program Opens and the Guest Is Introduced

Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron, a radio platform on which pastors, Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed whom we converse with and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.

Now here's our host, Chris Arnson. Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City,.

Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com. This is Chris Arnson, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this 19th day of September 2017.

Before I introduce my guest for the day, I want to give you a reason to mark your calendar, not that every day isn't a reason to listen to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, but a very timely interview is going to be held this Friday, God willing, that's September 22nd, 4 to 6 p .m. Eastern Time with my friend David Wood.

David Wood, who many of you may know, is a Christian apologist who primarily focuses his ministry of apologetics to the Muslim people and also atheists, because David was once an atheist himself before coming to Christ.

But we're interviewing David Wood this Friday to pay tribute to his very, very close friend, Nabeel Qureshi, who just last Saturday entered into eternity with Christ after a courageous, valiant bout with cancer.

And David is going to be on the program, as I said, to pay tribute to his dear friend, a friend who was Muslim, who David, while going to college with Nabeel Qureshi, and as his friend, led him to Christ.

And not only led him to Christ, but subsequently, eventually led him into the apologetics field himself, the Christian apologetics field. And so, God willing, we are going to be having that interview this Friday to pay tribute to this precious brother in Christ who went home to be to the Lord, went home to be with the Lord at age 34.

And I hope that you share this information with many other folks that you know who may be familiar with Nabeel Qureshi's ministry and David Wood's ministry. And we would love to hear from you if you have some words of commendation of how Nabeel blessed your life, perhaps, through his own Christian apologetics ministry, or perhaps he's a friend or a loved one or someone that you were just blessed to know.

And we are today very happy to have, for the very first time on Iron Trip, Brian Osborne. And he is a blogger, a speaker, and an author for Answers in Genesis. And he also is a curriculum writer and teacher for Answers Bible Curriculum.

Today, we're going to be addressing his book, Quick Answers to Tough Questions. And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you, for the very first time on Iron.

Trip, Brian Osborne. Thank you very much. It's definitely an honor to be here. It's a blessing.

And in studio with me is the Reverend Buzz Taylor, my co-host.

And once again, it's great to be on the air with you.

And I'll give our listeners right now our email address if you'd like to join us on the air with questions for Brian. Our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com, C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N at gmail .com.

And please give us your first name, at least your city and state and your country of residence, unless for some personal and private reason you are compelled to remain anonymous. Perhaps you disagree with your own pastor on a certain issue we're talking about, or perhaps you disagree with your own spouse, or some reason you are really compelled to remain anonymous, we will grant your request.

But otherwise, please give us at least your first name, city and state and country of residence. And first of all, tell us, I typically, Brian, always have my guests, when they are on the program for the very first time, have them give a summary of their testimony of how they came to Christ, what providential circumstances our Sovereign Lord used in their lives to draw them to Christ, what religious background, if any, you were raised in, and so on.

If you could do that before we begin our.

Discussion on the subject at hand. Oh, yeah, that would be my pleasure. Growing up, I grew up in North Carolina, the Piedmont area, kind of very Bible Belt-ish, if you will. I got saved in denominations, actually, for a little bit, hopped around a little bit, got a taste of Methodist faith, got baptized, actually, I was in the Methodist church, so I got sprinkled.

And at that point, my mindset was probably more along the lines of kind of getting fire insurance more than anything else. And I would not say that would be the time, where God really just drew me to repentance and to Himself.

And it was just a few years later, 17 years old, driving home from church one night, a Wednesday night, and I was riding in my car, in full rebellion of my heart, had my own plans for what I was going to do that day and that week.

And as I was praying home, as I was going home, people were praying for me at the church and other things. And literally, I don't remember exactly the train of thought that led up to the situation, but of my sin.

And I just cried out to Him in repentance right there, just driving down Highway 85 in North Carolina. And as I broke down repentance, confessed my sin, the Lord of my life, and there was a joy that overtook me from that point on, and my life truly was changed from that point.

And really, I've never been the same ever since, as God has just done a radical work in my life in so many different ways. He's just been molding me, sanctifying me since that time.

And you are not aware of any specific thing that triggered that in you, that made you.

Filled with such remorse and repentance? Well, it was literally, I'm 48 years old now, and I was 17 at the time, so it was 23 years ago. And I was driving down the highway, and I remember up to that point, I will say this, I grew up in a church background.

I kind of knew a lot of the right information. And I knew I could feel God tugging at my heart years prior. And basically, a few months before I got to back off, I wanted to just live life my own way as a foolish boy.

And so I was indulging in my sins, and as I was driving home, it was at that point, maybe just recognizing how to just indulge and rebel. And I don't remember the train of thought that led up to it, but I remember just being utterly aware of how heavy my sin was in the sight of a holy God, like I did at that moment.

And it led me to change, and it was at that point,.

My life was never the same. Well, praise God for His sovereignty and mercy over you. By the way, on a side note, I just want to recommend to our listeners what Brian just told us in regard to his testimony made me remember the testimony of Evel Knievel.

And Evel Knievel, if you look up his testimony on YouTube, it is quite remarkable. He is giving this testimony in, of all places, Robert Shuler's Crystal Cathedral, which I view as a false church. It's no longer in existence, but it was a false church, in my opinion.

But Evel Knievel, nonetheless, was giving a solidly biblical testimony of his salvation, and it's quite remarkable. And it reminded me, your testimony reminded me of it only because he didn't really know why he began to be overwhelmed with this recognition that he was going to hell, that he was a sinner.

Unlike you, he was not raised, I don't believe, in a Bible-belt home, in a Christian home, but he just really recognized seemingly out of nowhere that he needed to embrace Christ or he would be in hell, and he radically transformed his life, this work of the Spirit in him.

But you say you're from North Carolina. Just out of curiosity, the only places that I have spent any amount of time in North Carolina are Charlotte and Boone and Blowing Rock. Were you raised anywhere near any of those places?

I was raised about an hour north, in a place called Thomasville, close to High Point, or Greensboro, Winston-Salem, just right in the middle of North Carolina. A lovely place, loved my grandma, still that in me a long time ago, and so I have that blessing.

From that heritage. And when I was in Boone, North Carolina, I was actually there at a Christian rehabilitation ministry for drug and alcohol addiction, and I was there because of alcohol addiction, and the Lord used that place very powerfully in my life.

He brought in colony ministries in Boone, North Carolina, but everybody wore the tar, well not everybody, but most of the people were wearing the tar heels, jerseys, and so on, and I never got really a unanimously same answer as to what a tar heel is.

Someone told me that they thought it was a goat, a kind of a goat, but do you know what is a tar heel? It's kind of embarrassing. I'm not really.

Sure. I mean, I know for tobacco, maybe it's the tobacco on the hill, stepping in there, I can't remember for sure, but yeah, I don't know if anybody knows. Maybe that's just a trade secret.

Of the college. Chris, you're going to have to wait a little longer to get a definitive answer,.

I think. You mean heaven, is that what you mean? Maybe, that's where, maybe.

Hold on, let me google that real quick, hold on.

Creation, Evolution, and the Authority of Scripture

When in your life did you realize that the issue of the creation evolution debate was such an important matter in the church, such a huge divide, not only between the Christians and the atheists, but even amongst the body of Christ, we have some huge differences in regarding to the age of the earth and whether theistic evolution is true or false.

When did these areas of thought become such a primary area of interest for you?

Yeah, I'll tell you, that's a really good question, and I'll try not to make the answer too long. For me, the part of the testimony here for me is that I grew up in a Christian home, in a lot of different churches, and I never saw the importance of this issue until much later in life.

So back in my history, I went to church growing up, went to Christian school when I was younger, graduated high school, went to a Christian college, majored in biblical studies, had a minor in Greek and Christian education, graduated from there, started teaching in a public school, teaching Bible history in a public school, a really unique setting, and it wasn't until years into that that I was first really introduced to creation apologetics and the God's words being understood, the divide that's happening within much of the church, and that was in my mid -20s.

I'd never been introduced to this, and I grew up in a church, I went to a Christian school and never knew about any of this, not really, it wasn't introduced really well. And if I had not known about any of this, then how much so?

Well, for the reason I could see the need for this, it's not even an issue on table, which is as dumb as you think we are, but the more I looked at this, the more I recognized the reason this is so important is because, and the gospel based in that authority, because if you can't trust the Bible's history, why trust what it says about salvation?

And so, as I got more familiar with the heartbeat of this, and I connect with that, and also see the need to spread this message to...

I want to read just a brief portion of Ken Ham's forward to your book, Quick Answers to Tough Questions, that we're going to be addressing today. Ken Ham says, Quick Answers to Tough Questions is your handy tool that offers relevant answers to many of the pressing questions people have.

It is dedicated to upholding the authority of God's word from its very first verse and to answering the skeptics of our day. Of course, the gospel is presented in the book. And this book appears to be a book for laymen, perhaps laymen of all ages, and you have basically five major sections of this book.

We have a perfect creation, we have a corrupt creation, we have a catastrophic flooded creation, and I make a correction here, this is six major sections. A confused creation, an evolutionary takeover of creation, and a redeemed creation.

Why don't we start with a perfect creation, but what are you mainly covering.

In that section? For the foundation of how God made the original creation, that it was indeed a perfect creation. One of the questions we get asked often is, you know, why do we live in a world that's full of so much death and suffering, and why do we have people dying of cancer?

Recognizing that God did give us a perfect creation. He gave us what he wanted, and we're standing up God's original very sin that brought death and suffering into the father's own man, unto the own man, which is of that sin and the effect on the world.

And so we start from the core foundation of understanding that history to answer some of those fundamental questions. I even back up a little bit before that section, the introduction of this book is to tell people why all of this.

I travel around 30 weekends a year to a lot of different copies of the biblical authority and the gospel based on that authority. Because really if you look around, so many people today, especially younger generations, but there are many who don't know why they don't believe the book.

And if the Bible gets history wrong, then why trust it about salvation? This is ultimately a biblical authority. And this is where the attack is occurring today, in God's word, and doubted and rejected, just like in Genesis 3 verse 1, when he did with Eve.

And so we want to recognize where the attack is happening, defend the faith, stand on the foundation of God's word, in order to boldly proclaim the gospel, Jesus the foundation. That's why we say these answers.

Are so important. Yes, and you have a lot of people in the 20th century, and in fact, they've been doing it for every century. They mock the stories, especially of the Old Testament, because many of these stories that we as Christians, at least we as Christians who take the Bible seriously and believe it is the inerrant word of God, God-breathed teachings that are found in there, but they are mocked because the stories are so fantastic.

The stories defy a human experience and logic. You know, the fact that we have the universe being created out of nothing, and we have man being created out of the earth, and we have Eve being created out of him, out of his rib, and we have all these things happening in this section, the Hebrew scriptures, this section of our Bible.

We have, you know, the flood, the global flood, where two of every animal that would have perished in the flood taken into the ark, and people look at these as merely children's fairy tales, because if you are not filled with the Holy Spirit, if you do not take the Bible seriously, you're, that could be a logical thing to think.

I mean, if you have not the indwelling of the Holy Spirit guiding and teaching you, and you're not thinking as a reborn individual, this is something that you might readily think, and we shouldn't necessarily be overly condemnatory, even though we are obviously supposed to be disagreeing radically with the unbeliever.

We shouldn't be so quick to condemn them as being a reprobate or idiots, even though they may be calling us idiots. Don't you think that when we approach this area of Genesis, we have to recognize that these are fantastic things, that if we did not believe in God, we would reject them as childhood fairy tales as well?

Yeah, no, I definitely agree with.

What you're saying there, and one of the things we say, I say in the book, one of the first chapters, actually the fourth one, two worldviews, God's Word versus man's, and we say often as a ministry, this is a battle between the two fundamental religions of this world, between two foundational authorities.

Either God's Word is the authority, we build our things to this Lord, we take everything, either God's Word is the authority in some way, shape, or form, and man's Word becomes the authority. People have the same evidence, this is not a battle over here, we got this amount over here, the evolutions have their pile over here, and whoever has the most evidence, they win.

That's not the debate. Actually, what it is, we got the same rock layers, the same distant starlight, the same DNA, the same fossils, but we interpret those things differently in the present, and make different guesses about their origin based on our different starting assumptions about the unseen past, based on our different worldviews.

And the bottom line is, if you start with the wrong assumption, you'll most likely get where his wife was going deaf. So one night, he snuck up behind her about 10 feet away, and he whispered, he got a few feet closer, can you hear me, honey?

Nothing. He got right behind her, can you hear me, honey? To which she responded, for the third time, yes! Right? Yeah, it wasn't her problem, right? Right. But you see, wrong assumptions, wrong conclusions, and here's the thing, secular scientists and secular people give really wrong conclusions about certain things.

Why? Because they're starting with the wrong assumptions. And you know what, it's no big surprise that someone who's rejected God's Word will believe that maybe life came from non-life, or aliens created life, or evolution is a good theory.

They're being consistent with their worldview, with their foundation. What we would say is, they have the wrong foundation. They should be built on thinking of God's Word. Of course, we recognize, ultimately, that is a heart in the Bible.

Why? Because we're going to righteousness. We as sinners want to be our own God and His Word. And so we recognize, ultimately, it's an authority issue, which is ultimately...

Amen. You know, you were referring to Romans 1 there, and something I still don't quite understand about Romans 1, because basically Romans 1 is teaching us that there are no atheists or agnostics because of the fact that every human knows the truth but suppresses it.

Now, in defining that, it's hard for me to know, and I know that there's even differences of opinion amongst Christians on it, but when somebody says that they're an atheist or an agnostic, do you think that they're actually lying, or is this something that they have suppressed so deeply and have become so accustomed to rebelling against God and rejecting His existence that they are not currently conscious of it?

How do you define what Romans 1 is talking about when it's saying that they know the truth but suppress it?

Yeah, that's a really good question. I think that's going to depend on the person we're talking about, how long they've been suppressing the truth, how long they've been hardening their heart, giving over to sin they are based on their time frame.

Of course, people much smarter may have tried to dive into the depths of this passage, but I think it does depend on the person. I think some genuinely think what they think is right. Some use it as an excuse.

You know, I think the bottom line is, you know, a non-believer can't find God for the same reason a thief can't find a cop. Does it want to? And I think ultimately that's really the bottom line issue.

We like our sin, and whether we recognize how much we're doing it or not, we are suppressing that truth of God. You know, the truth of God's creation screams at us that there's a creator. Our conscience tells us there must be a God, and we suppress it simply because we want to do what we want.

I thought about, from this perspective, if you hear or Lawrence Krauss, and you hear some of the things they start breaks for them in a particular way, I pray that they come to repentance. They recognize their sin, and they bow to Christ as Lord before they die, and they get saved.

It's just an awesome testimony of God's power and His grace, but if they don't get saved, when they stand before God, I heard Richard Dawkins say that if he stands before God and God is real, he'll start asking God, why didn't you show yourself?

Why didn't you prove yourself? Why'd you make yourself so hard to find? And he's acting like he's going to put God on trial, but in truth, if he doesn't get saved, and he stands before God, as soon as he's before God, he will know in an instant that he is mine, and how he will recognize automatically he has suppressed the truth that God has made himself obvious, and he rejected it because he wanted to be his own God.

There will be no question. There will be no arguing with God. He will know that God is holy. Reminds us of why this is so important, but also ultimately does get back to that really the heart issue that we in our sin, no surprise.

God has got it. Amen. That's why you would have somebody who is considered.

By most people to be a genius, Professor Stephen Hawking. He actually believes, as you were referring to this before without naming him, but he actually believes that the existence of life on Earth began with aliens from other planets, and here you have somebody who's considered a genius, and even though scientific evidence completely militates against this notion, we have never discovered a planet that is capable of sustaining human or even any kind of life that's anything similar to ours, and yet you have somebody that hates God and his word so much, and people like him, that they would rather believe something as insane as that than believe in the biblical account.

And Reverend Buzz Taylor has something to say. Of course, you've noticed.

That it's much more prevalent now on the History Channel and all that about aliens, and I think that they're trying to put that before our face so much that after a while it will not be considered.

In any way weird. Right. We're going to go to our first break right now, and I want to get more into the creation as being perfect, and because there is, as you know, debate that continues to go on amongst professing Christians.

I would even say amongst genuine Christians. I disagree with old Earth creationists very strongly on that area of theology, but that would tend to muddle the area of the biblical account of a perfect creation because you have death before the fall and things like that.

But I want to have you get into that a little bit more before we take any of our listener questions. We already have several people waiting to have their questions asked and answered by you. If anybody else would like to get online and have your question asked and answered, our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N at gmail .com. Please give us your first name, your city and state, and your country of residence if you live outside of the USA, and only remain anonymous if it makes you feel more comfortable because the question regards a personal and private matter.

Don't go away. God willing, we'll be right back with Brian Osborne. I am Chris Arnsen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, here to tell you about an exciting offer from World Magazine, my trusted source for news from a Christian perspective.

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And all of these hardback reformed commentaries are 50 off. Well, welcome back. We are interviewing today Brian Osborne on his book, Quick Answers to Tough Questions. If you'd like to join us on the air, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

And Brian, if you could revisit the concept of this creation being perfect. Yeah, no, absolutely. Before I do so,.

I just wanted to say really quickly why during the break I did go to the UNC website to look up what a Tar Heel officially was. To set your mind at ease, they have no said understanding of its origin either.

They have a few different theories, but nothing else. They know it's not even UNC Chapel Hill. You're not alone, brother. Why do Bible believers believe creation? And the fundamental answer to that is because that's what the Bible teaches, the teaching of creation.

God made it originally perfect. He called it very, and so He gave mankind what He wanted for them. And so, and this is so important because what the Bible says for us is that after He made that perfect creation and then gave them the tree of knowledge and the option to obey or disobey, death was therefore set as a consequence.

You will surely die if you disobey me. And we know from the Bible, it teaches from beginning to end, that death entered this world as a result, and death is a consequence. It's an intrusion on God's perfect creation, which, as you know, will one day be dealt with and thrown into the lake of fire.

When Christ returns, there'll be no more death, no more suffering, no more bloodshed, back to its perfect state. And so, we see this clear biblical teaching of death, and that has, God gave us this perfect estate in the.

Beginning. Now, as I hinted at earlier, the old earth creationists, those who actually believe in the inerrancy of the Bible, they would say that this perfect creation would only be referring to sin specifically because they believe that death occurred amongst animal life and plant life prior to the fall.

And this is where, one of the areas where there is a huge divide between the old earth and young earth creationists, and why would this, in your opinion, be a violation of proper exegesis to say that the creation is perfect, and we're only speaking about sin, and it has nothing to do with the death of animal and plant life, and it only is in regard to the.

Introduction of death of humans. Speaking, we don't see the death of an animal until after Adam sinned. That'd be one thing you see there. After they sinned, then God comes and kills an animal. He sheds his blood to make clothing for Adam and Eve.

It's the Lamb of God who shed his blood. One thing to think about, if you, and then when Christ returns, does that mean animals still die when he returns? Is there still bloodshed? Is that still happening on the earth?

That'd be a conundrum. Also, I think when you look at the passages that deal and talk about through man's sin and the world death as a consequence, Romans 8 .22, that sin affected everything. All of creation is groaning in pain as a result of what?

Of mankind. It affected animals. It affected dirt. And I know many do try to jump through hermeneutical gymnastics to try to make it fit within the biblical text. You're definitely always kind of twisting and prodding to try to get this idea.

People often ask, couldn't God have used evolution if he wanted to in millions of years? Yes, he could have, because he's God. He can do whatever he wants. The question is not what God could have done, bringing death and suffering into this world.

Death as a consequence affecting all of creation. Death will be one day dealt with when Christ returns. And so that concept and metanarrative, if you will, of the individual text all point to that clear truth.

And you can try to twist it to fit with man's ideas, but you're going to change or affect multiple dots.

And therefore there were no carnivores before the fall. Yep. And it's obviously death is only speaking about animals and humans. It's not referring to vegetation, because obviously the animals and Adam and Eve ate vegetables and plant life.

That's right. And plants don't die in the biblical sense that we think of, the biblical understanding of death. They don't have the nefesh in them, the soul, like animals or humans. And we kind of understand this instinctively.

There's a good analogy, you know, if you're walking in the woods and you see a dead deer, you know, it's kind of deep, and you're walking with your feet on that dead deer for a rest. That'd be weird.

That'd also be the end of the marriage, probably.

That's right, yeah. So if you see a tree that's fallen over and it's rotted out, you know, it's still straight enough to hold you, we have no qualms whatsoever sitting on that fallen tree, because it's not dead in the biblical sense.

It was never alive in the biblical sense, plant life and of course animal and human life. So the Bible has asked enough.

Questions About Darwin, Apologetics, and the Age of the Earth

All right, let's go to some of our questions. We have Bruce in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, who says, my question for Brian Osborne is, is there any truth to the assertion that Charles Darwin on his deathbed may have renewed his faith and renounced evolution?

Yeah, that's a part of a lot of Dr. Tommy Mitchell, another speaker for the ministry, did a whole in-depth series on this. And he did a lot of reading into the in-depth researches. No, most likely that is, you know, lifestyle was, you know, someone he loved and cared about that he did repent and truly confess Christ as Lord.

That would be wonderful. But there's no actual record of it. It's something that was invented by someone who's a little excited to have that as a point to share, but does not have a root in history, unfortunately.

Yeah, I actually heard that myth repeated at a Bible conference that I was recently at. It wasn't by one of the speakers, it was by somebody who was in attendance, who got up to a microphone and made that announcement.

But thank you, Bruce in Pittsburgh. Please give us your full mailing address in Pittsburgh so we can have Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service ship you a free copy of Quick Answers to Tough Questions by our guest, Brian Osborne and Bodie Hodge, who we've had on this program.

I believe Bodie is Kenham's son-in-law,.

Right? That's correct. Yeah, yeah. Bodie's a great guy. Enjoyed working with him on the book. That's another speaker and writer. And it was great to tag team with him to put this thing together.

Great. And we have Daniel in San Jose, California, who says, thank you for having this discussion, brothers. Can you ask Brian Osborne what motivated him to engage in apologetics, especially with Answers in Genesis?