Thomas Charles II: The End of Pride | Behold Your God Podcast

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Welcome to another episode of the Behold Your God podcast. I'm Matthew Robinson, director of Media Gratia, and I'm here again this week with Dr.

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John Snyder, pastor of Christ Church New Albany and author and teacher of the Behold Your God study series for Media Gratia.

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John, we're on the second part of multiple part series on a letter from Thomas Charles dealing with the subject of pride.

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And last time we made it all the way to 0 .3, and I'll just jump right in with 0 .3.

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So if you haven't heard the previous podcast, I'd encourage you to go and listen to that one before going any further.

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Thomas Charles' third way that he says pride tends to manifest itself in the lives of all of humans, but especially the lives at this point of the believer, often when the spirit ceases to seek worldly riches, it tries to be supported, if possible, by religious wealth.

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And the man, if he cannot be a god to himself, will at least be his own

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Savior. Man, what a cutting statement about our desire for self -righteousness in religion.

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Yeah, we don't normally use those phrases, but that's the truth about it. You know, we normally say, well, you know,

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I'm just trying to be a good person. I'm trying to be a good Christian. He really drives us home by giving a contrast between two very wealthy men who were so wealthy, they thought that they were too wealthy for God.

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And it's not men that we normally compare, the rich young ruler and the Pharisee. Yeah, he writes, the young man in the gospel who went away from Christ very sorrowful because he was very rich, and the

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Pharisee in the parable, they were they were influenced by the same spirit, equally opposite and distant from God.

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The one was rich in temporal things, and the other, as he thought, in spiritual things, each being a god to himself, possessing in himself all fullness and sufficiency.

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I thank you that I am not as other men are the words of the Pharisee's lips, and I am rich and increased with goods and have need of nothing is the language of his heart.

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Yeah, and in that point, he's really trying to show us that secretly cultivating a sense of religious self -sufficiency, because I do

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A, B, and C, I don't need God quite as much as the guy that won't do these, that that religious self -sufficiency is no more admirable and no more acceptable to God than the pride of a worldly man who says,

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I'm so wealthy, I don't really need religion. He goes on and writes, but here in religion, this spirit is of all things the most detestably odious in the sight of God.

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There is no creature in the universe so abominable to him as the one who tries to support his own pride and independence by a mask of religion and a form of godliness.

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Thomas Charles, you know, first half of his ministry, well, until 1811 when the

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Welsh Calvinistic Methodist broke officially from the Anglican Church. You know, he was in a state church that he said was oftentimes fueled by this pride.

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It's not a very nice thing to have to say about your own church, but I think that the point was there were many people in the church of his day who were working very hard, even outworking other people around them, and having accomplished, you know, something outwardly in religion, they could not come to believe that they couldn't do enough to partially earn

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God's love and they couldn't be convinced that they were so weak they couldn't actually do what

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God required them to do, and they wanted to be seen as very good and very religious.

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They wanted to be without debt to the mercy of Christ, and that may appear noble to people, like, well, you know, you're doing so well, and you're self -sufficient in religion.

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If we're not careful, when we watch a person be extremely diligent in religion, and if we don't ask, you know, the question, is it love to Christ, or is it love for how

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I look? We may think that that's a very sacrificial, self -denying life, but Thomas Charles goes on to say, actually, it has nothing to do with self -denial.

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Yeah, now here in Northeast Mississippi, we don't have a state church, and we are not reaching out, ministering, really, to worldly Anglicans, but this sounds very familiar with our religious culture, but Thomas Charles writes, referencing back there to that original temptation that came from Satan to our first parents in the garden, which

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Thomas Charles identifies as the root of all pride. I think that the main point that we have to take away from that is that there are many ways to deny ourselves certain things in religion, like,

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I don't do this, I don't do this, I don't do this, and I give up this so that I can do all these good things.

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You can do that without ever having to deny self, to kind of, in a sense, step away from yourself and look back at you and say, that person their good intentions, their best efforts cannot save them, you know, and so until a man humbles himself, he will never actually deny self, and sadly,

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Charles says, there's more to be said about spiritual pride that exists in a

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Christian. Yeah, his fourth point, even in those who have submitted to the righteousness of God and put on Christ in sincerity, this spirit of pride and independence will still exert itself.

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He says, Yeah, he's so careful, as all helpful pastors are, all helpful older Christians, you know, mentors and disciples, to distinguish between the work of God in justifying us and the response of the soul, you know, that we call sanctification.

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God justifies us by doing something outside of us for us that is received through faith, a righteousness, not of the law,

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Paul says, but the righteousness of God that I've received through faith. But then, having been brought into that glorious relationship, then the believer wants to obey.

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Is that obedience now to be kind of put into the foundation? No, he says, it's like the walls and the sheetrock and the pictures and the paint and the roof, it's what is built on this justifying love and can never be made a part of the justifying love.

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In other words, our acceptance before God can never be based on what's going on on the inside of us, and that's hard for a proud person to accept.

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So Thomas Charles warns the Christian, but if care is not taken, the natural pride of man will place the superstructure in the place of the foundation, or at least will attempt to put partly as the foundation some of those materials which are fit only for the construction of the building.

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Thus, holiness is apt to degenerate into self -righteousness, and what

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God gives for sanctification, we are in danger of applying for justification. Yeah, he goes on to say that the

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Christian who is not careful to humble himself finds it impossible to see a mighty work of grace going on within the soul, you know, the changes, what he calls the superstructure being built, the fruit of the

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Spirit. So he sees sanctification occurring in here, and that's essential to a Christian life, but he says the proud believer can't look at that and recognize that as occurring without somehow adding that to the work of Jesus for his acceptance with God.

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In other words, he puts it this way. He says we don't know how to recognize that as being there, that work of grace as being there, and at the same time still rely completely upon Christ's righteousness for our own peace.

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He uses an illustration here, and he says imagine, you know, that you're laying the foundation of a house, and in his day, not a slab of concrete, but big paving stones.

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So you're laying these large stones of the work of God, you know, the justifying work of Christ, the perfect life and death offered to us freely through faith, imputed to us.

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And he says what we want to do is we want to take, you know, that response in our soul, that sanctification that flows out of that, and we want to put it like mortar or cement in between so we get some credit for it.

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And he says the whole reason for this is that we hate to be reminded that we are so absolutely dependent upon what

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God does for us, for our acceptance. And while saying that, he says we don't forget that the work of Christ for us that justifies us at the cross, and the work of the

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Spirit in us that sanctifies us after the regenerative work, these are both from God, and they're both essential.

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The problem is when pride wants to mix them in an inappropriate way. So this is,

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I mean, this is all taking place in the life of the believer. So how does God continue to rescue us from this ongoing manifestation of pride?

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Well, Thomas Charles writes, This reminds us of a hymn that we've discussed on the podcast before by John Newton, I ask the

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Lord that I might grow. And it's interesting to think about Newton's influence on Thomas Charles.

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Yeah, amazing, amazing. Sadly, Charles says that's not all the ways that pride can express itself, even in a believer.

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So he comes to a fifth point. A fifth point, are we not become as gods to ourselves when in our own strength we address ourselves to our work, face difficulties, and encounter temptations?

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What is he saying there? He's saying, is it not natural to us thus to act independently of the

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Almighty? Do we not, even the best of us, find ourselves every day, almost in everything, acting as if we had an all -sufficiency of might and power in ourselves, and as if our own arms were to bring us salvation?

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Yeah, pride will live on anything we give it. And if we say to pride, you cannot, you are not sufficient to support yourself by what the world offers, and you are not sufficient to justify yourself, then pride will come along and say, okay, well, having been given this wonderful start by God, and all glory to Him, we can, we can do the rest.

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You know, I can, by kind of screwing up my courage and pulling myself together,

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I have the strength to really do the things God wants me to do without His extra help, and face the things that come my way.

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And so, Charles gives an illustration. He says, you cannot even, in the physical realm, with a body, you cannot do the things you do with this body without the constant sustaining and animating power of God, much less can you do the tasks that God gives you to do today without the constant sustaining and animating grace.

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He writes, not one motion of any single part of the body can we, for an instant, command without His permission, without His aid, nor can there be in our minds in the least degree any spiritual motions of our thoughts, or any holy workings of our affections toward God, but what proceed every moment, in every degree, from Him.

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In Him we live, move, and have our being, both temporally and spiritually.

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Yeah, and we wish that in this podcast that that was unnecessary, that we didn't have to say it, but really we could have written that, because by our own experience, sadly, we've seen that to be true, and Scripture is very clear here.

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And yet, Thomas Charles asks, but in what heart dwells the practical belief of this?

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Are we not living, in this sense also, without God in the world? Where are those who are practically sensible that without continued influences and aids from above, we have, the best of us, wisdom for no work, strength for no duty, success under no trial, and victory over no enemy?

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Are we not found making weak attempts for duties, fruitless struggles against temptations, until almost overcome, before we are made truly sensible of our own weakness, and apply to the

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Lord for strength? So, he continues, what wonder is it, if in this case, we hear people complaining, they cannot do this work, or overcome that temptation.

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If they could, would they not set up the idol self? God is determined in everything to bring man out of himself.

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So far, therefore, as we depend on ourselves, so far we are sure to be disappointed.

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Yeah, and Thomas Charles says that there is this kind of constant complaint among church folks, as you just mentioned, that well, you know, if I weren't so weak, if I were just stronger,

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I'd be a better Christian. I would do this better. I would never do that again. And Charles points out that that really is dodging the main issue.

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You know, the logic is this, our problem is not our weakness. And you know, you want to interrupt and say, wait,

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I thought you said that we're all weak, and we're actually, we need help to even to do today's obedience.

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Well, that's true, but weakness is not the ultimate problem, because of the way God deals with this.

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We are needy and weak. What we need for obedience is the grace, or that loving favor that provides from God, that provides everything

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I need for obedience. So, I need grace. And the Bible says that God gives grace to one kind of person, a humble person, and He resists one kind of person, the proud person.

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Therefore, being needy isn't the big problem. It's being needy and arrogant. It's my thinking

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I'm strong. It's my pride that keeps me from constantly going to God and receiving everything

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I need for obedience. So, instead of complaining that I'm just so weak, or I have struggles in this area, or you don't understand, it would have been better to humble myself, receive freely the grace needed for obedience, and find that even though I am weak,

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I am able to have victory over sin by the constant grace of God. Yes, so it's not our weakness.

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It's actually pride and unbelief that refuses to go to an all -sufficient

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Savior for strength to live. So, he points out that the path of consistent holiness is humble dependence.

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He writes, if denying ourselves our own schemes, contrivances, and our own strength, we steadfastly look for Him for deliverance under trials, difficulties, and temptations, then we shall infallibly obtain effectual relief and experience

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His grace alone to be sufficient for us. Yeah, and he concludes that fifth point by basically pointing out two terrible sins of pride.

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Living to yourself, you know, it's all about me, and living upon yourself,

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I am sufficient, and both of those must be put to death daily. And then we've only got one more point that we kind of have to quickly hit.

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Yeah, so point six, are we not become as gods when we take and keep to ourselves the praise and glory due to God only?

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He writes, everything that is good done in us or by us, every good thought, desire, word, or work proceeds immediately from God, and to Him all the glory is due.

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But are our hearts freely disposed to render to God the things that are

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God's? Or are we not secretly prone to value and commend ourselves as if we had done something?

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Instead of seeing the hand of God in them as they ascribe their success, victories, and prosperity to their own schemes and contrivances, to their own diligence and power, but see the contrary spirit of sincere humility conspicuously shining in the whole of Paul's conduct.

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Whatever good was found in him or done by him, he ascribes the glory and praise of all to God, the giver of every good and perfect gift.

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And Charles goes on to warn us that while we may want to talk like Paul and say things like,

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I'm less than the least of all saints, or I'm the chief of sinners, or by the grace of God I am what

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I am, or again, not I but the grace of God which was with me or within me, it's a very different thing for a man to feel the weight of those truths.

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Thomas Charles talks about the fact that pride can live on anything and even on the work of grace.

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He writes, the deceitfulness of the heart and the subtlety of Satan in no one thing appears so great as in the workings of pride.

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Nor have we in anything more cause for continual watchfulness than pride.

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Nothing is so subtle, so secret, so insinuating as pride. It often surprises us at an unexpected hour and is in actual possession of us before we are aware even of its approach.

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It will feed on the ashes of other sins and gain strength by the exercise of real grace and of true humility.

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Now, listen to this, we are in danger of worshiping ourselves as saints when we have denied ourselves as sinners.

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So apt are we to forget ourselves and overlook our unworthiness through the enjoyment of distinguishing blessings.

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Yeah, he says even when we reflect on these distinguishing blessings, you know, when you think back about the kindnesses of God and the work of God, the legitimate work of God that you can see that has occurred in the life,

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Him working in you, Him working through you. He says reflecting upon and talking about former experiences without the grace of those experiences in present exercise, presently working on you.

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This is where pride will continually be engaged. It's the situation, he says, is where you're talking a lot about what

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God did in you and through you, but you're forgetting God Himself. So the focus becomes us again without knowing it.

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I mean, we're saying, oh, all glory to God, but we're really thinking, wow, I'm a pretty impressive person, and you forget the

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God that's done it. He is there in word, but not the focus. And he makes an astonishing statement here comparing this to idol worship.

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He says it is no greater idolatry to worship the devil than to worship an angel.

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And he gives a comparison. He says to talk much about ourselves of our own experiences and discoveries, though under the pretense of giving glory to God is a sure proof that we're gods to ourselves.

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This was the very spirit of the Pharisee in the parable. In words, he gave glory to God for making him to differ.

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God, I thank you that I'm not as other men. And he was not as other men. He was distinguished with divine favors.

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He was far more eminent in holiness and piety than all others. It is true he acknowledges that God made him to differ.

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So good theology there with the Pharisee. But then his mind dwells on the difference itself until he is swollen bigger than all mankind put together.

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To ascribe all in words to the grace of God in Christ in no degree prevents our thinking highly of our attainments and holiness, nor is it any proof that we are emptied of the pride and vanity of our natural minds.

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Yeah, what a precious warning for every believer. Right theology in no degree, if it's just the theology of the mouth, ascribing it all to God in no way prevents pride's poison.

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Are you focusing on how distinguished you are or are you focusing on the kind God that distinguishes his children?

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And you know he brings this point to a close by saying look, pride is preeminently the work of the devil in the soul of a man.

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It enters into the very essence of every sin. It's the lifeblood of every other sin.

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And until this is daily brought down or mortified, the work of God is not going to go forward in the believer.

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No grace, he says, can really grow in the atmosphere, this pride, because ultimately pride is, in a very subtle way, once again setting ourselves up like Adam and Eve in the garden with the statement that we will be as gods and we are opposed to him.

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One of the most encouraging things about attending conferences is when people drop by our booth to tell us how one of our studies or films helped or influenced them, their families, or their church.

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Eventually we started asking if they would let us record their stories to share with you. This is

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Royal. We talked to him at the G3 conference about rethinking God biblically. We watch it as a family devotional, a learning opportunity.

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We go through one of the men of the faith of the time to learn more about them and how that theology affects our lives today.

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So we spend a lot of time doing that. And again we watch it over and over again because you just you miss certain things or you just want to remind yourself of what's going on.

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Wonderful series, wonderful series. I've never been a biography guy. A theology guy, yes, probably not a lot about biographies.

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But consequently having saw the video series, I picked up probably a biography of everybody on the videos because it's just it's so interesting.

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And when you get those little vignettes, it tells you a little bit about them. But then you really do want to know more about them and what caused them to be so faithful toward God.

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And you hear about all the things that they're challenged with as well. And when you hear about these great men who had all the challenges of their life, it makes it so that you say, well if they can do it and they can persevere to the end, so can

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I. For more information about Behold Your God, Rethinking God Biblically, visit TheMeansOfGrace .org.

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Well, the picture that Charles paints we have to say, yes, we recognize that.

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We recognize that not in, I mean even in the recording the podcast, I think, man, some very well -known leaders who have had some great theology, you know,

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Calvinistic men like the Pharisee who said, God, I thank you that you have made me not to be this way, have fallen from pride.

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And yet I have to rebuke myself for thinking about other people, even as we're talking about this, because this is laid right at my feet, and at your feet, and believer at yours as well.

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So should we despair? I mean the picture is bleak. No. Thomas Charles reminds us, to destroy this spirit, this wretched spirit of pride, is imminently the work of Christ who came to destroy the works of the devil.

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Yeah, if you can just do the work of backing up from this problem and looking at the immensity of the work of redemption of the triune person of God, every aspect that the

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Bible spells out for us, the small print of the covenant of grace, look at it and realize that every attribute of God comes from his throne room and meets us to rescue us from this most foul pollution and poison.

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It's for our good and his everlasting glory. You shall call his name

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Jesus for he shall save his people from their sins. Thomas Charles concludes with this cheering thought, that we may receive strong consolation, and that Christ may be to us all in all.

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Every high thing must be cast down, and every thought must be brought into captivity to the obedience of Christ.

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And when the gospel is made to us the power of God and to salvation, herein does its power most imminently show itself to the everlasting glory of the

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Savior and to our own growth in true holiness, peace, and joy.

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Thanks for listening to the Behold Your God podcast. All the scripture passages and resources we mentioned in the podcast are available in this week's show notes at Mediagratia .org

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