December 17, 2020 Show with Ryan Denton & Joe Jacowitz on “Even if None: Reclaiming Biblical Evangelism”

The Program Introduction and the Theme of Biblical Evangelism

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron. This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27, verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have a view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions. And now here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth, who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com. This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Thursday on the 17th day of December, 2020.

And I'm thrilled to have back on the program two guests that have been interviewed on this program before, the second of which is joining us in the second hour. That will be Pastor Joe Jakowitz of Christ Bible Church in Pleasanton, California.

He is also the founder of First Love Radio that live streams this program every day, and also the founder of First Love Missions and First Love Publications. So stick around so that you can hear Joe's participation with us in the second hour.

But joining me right now for the entire program is Ryan Denton, who was a pastor on the Navajo Reservation before starting Christ in the Wild Ministries, which he has directed since 2016. And it's my honor and privilege to welcome Ryan Denton back to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

It's great to be back on, Chris.

And our topic today is going to be Ryan's latest book, Even If None, Reclaiming Biblical Evangelism. And if you could, first of all, Ryan, let our listeners know about Christ in the Wild Ministries.

Yeah, so like you said, and I was doing a lot of evangelism while I'm more gifted as an evangelist, certainly more burdened about that kind of ministry than pastor. My wife and I, we prayed about and sought the Lord, and I thought I had similar ministries as the Wild Ministries.

And we stepped out in faith and started telling people kind of what we're going to do, you know, as far as what's God burdening us with, church walls, with the gospel. And of course, but for me, the primary emphasis and really taking it to area farmers markets down and find a group of people to keep our ministry underneath church.

And they sent me out to central and to evangelize to certain areas. Again, it's to preach the gospel.

And that website is christinthewild .com.

That's correct.

Christinthewild .com. And before we go into a discussion on your new book, Even If None, Reclaiming Biblical Evangelism, I think we should let our listeners know about another book that you co-authored with Scott Smith that I interviewed you on.

I can't even remember how long ago. It was at least a year ago, I believe, but perhaps even longer ago. A Certain Sound, A Primer on Open Air Preaching. Why don't you tell our listeners about that so that their appetites will be wet, not only to get a hold of that book, but also to listen to our interview on that subject.

Yeah, I think it was probably, what was that, 2019, I think, around April or May when the book was published. And yeah, Scott Smith and I, Scott's another open air preacher. Yeah, he and I, we co-authored a book and really built on that.

And so he had no idea where to turn or where to go. And like most people, you know, you go to YouTube and you start watching videos. And the problem with that is most of the guys on YouTube are Pelagians or, you know, far left of even Arminianism.

And so there's not a whole lot of quality content. And so Scott and I got together and pitched an idea to ourselves on open air preaching, and he kicked it out. And Joel Beek, he actually wrote that. So yeah, you can find that at RHB.

Yes, and that actual website is heritagebooks .org, heritagebooks .org for Reformation Heritage Books. You could also get it from CVBBS .com, who sponsors my program. That's Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service, CVBBS .com.

And if you want to, after this program's over, if you want to look up in the archive of Iron Trip and Zion Radio, the previous interview that Ryan Denton and I had on his book, A Certain Sound, a primer on open air preaching, just go to irontripandzionradio .com, click on podcast past shows, and then type in the search engine Ryan Denton, R-Y-A-N-D-E-N-T-O-N, and that interview will come up.

The archived recording of that interview will come up. But our discussion today is your new book, as I said, Even If None, Reclaiming Biblical Evangelism. And first of all, the title, the main title of the book is quite interesting.

Even If None. And I have a very strong feeling where you're coming from with that title. I'm assuming it has to be in regard to, this is something especially believed by Reformed Christians, those that believe in the doctrines of sovereign grace, that we are to proclaim the gospel to every creature, even if none come to us with a profession of faith, and within our witnessing, get saved.

I don't know if that's what you meant by that, but why don't you tell us?

Hey, we would love for local churches to, and you know, every time we go out and share the gospel, we see people converted. We would love that. We live in a culture that's very gospel hardened. And, you know, when you take the gospel to the lost, by and large, there's not a lot of conversions taking place.

And even, you know, healthy, good biblical churches are not seeing this. And so the difficulty becomes, if we're in, if we're doing these things for the sake of seeing people saved primarily, then what happens if that doesn't happen?

Christianity, then what God tells us, the saying, even if one. So in other words, you go out and you share the gospel, and it's not to say that even unbiblical, it's not to say that we should just check a box when we go and evangelize, and we say, okay, we do our duty and, you know, we did it and that's it.

You know, it should be motivated by our love for Christ and by our love for people. But it is to say that wind up in the area.

And God is glorified when his truth is declared and when error is exposed and refuted. And also, we must never forget, as has been the case in history, when missionaries went out on a very dangerous mission field that was practically, if not completely, void of any presence of Christianity, the fact that no one comes to Christ while that missionary is evangelizing and proclaiming the gospel and just being obedient to Christ.

And if he never sees a soul while he is there or while he is alive, receive the gospel, embrace it, and become a Christian. That does not mean that his labors were in vain, even in an earthly sense, because there have been circumstances when very little, if any, fruit had been borne by the labors of a particular missionary in a particular foreign field.

But after that missionary had passed on, the crop where the seeds had been planted and watered sprung up. And there have been great revivals that took place in areas that are now, even today, thriving with Christianity, even though the first missionary efforts, in an earthly sense and according to human beings, may have been viewed as a complete failure.

William Carey, and that's exactly what happened to him. He was a guy who was in England, and he was burdened, and he was trying to get people motivated and get people behind him to support him to get out there and to do it.

And he couldn't find hardly anybody until he got to India, six years. Now, if you could imagine, and nobody really had hyper-Calvinism, but what William Carey was, you people, nobody was really motivated that what goes out there, you could imagine how eager he would have been to send back some kind of report.

There's a lot of good quotes from Carey about how, you know, during that time that he's out there, he has nothing to say, now, of course, and just unimaginable, his wife's going in, even if he's not somebody who would be consulting hundreds, a hundred years later, or whatever.

And so, tomorrow, my guest on Iron Chopper and Zion Radio will be Dr. Michael Hagen.

And we're going to... Yeah, we're going to be discussing his book, Strangers and Pilgrims on the Earth, Remembering the Mayflower Pilgrims from 1620 to 2020. Yeah, I love interviewing him.

Praise God.

And it's going back to what we were just talking about, the mission field. It's tragedy when you hear about these non-reformed denominations, and a very large one. Well, I'll just say it, because I know that my friends who are in the Southern Baptist Convention, who are theologically reformed, would readily admit this and speak about it publicly often.

But it's sad that denominations like the Southern Baptist Convention, the element in it that is not reformed, which is the majority these days, even though it was founded in the 19th century completely by Calvinists.

But the mission boards will be very quick to yank people off the mission field if they don't produce numbers. It's almost like a sales representative for like a paper company or some other kind of manufacturer.

If the sales rep is failing miserably making sales, then the company will either yank him out of that area and put him in another area or fire him, whatever the case is. But the gospel of Jesus Christ is an entirely different matter than selling paper or other products.

To that, I wrote down the quote, BC. I'm an ordained minister. I'm no longer part of the SBC. When you go to their website, church, I go to their cover, you know, the church of these denominations with Christ.

Again, you're not seeing a lot there. And I want to start a church, but I'm not seeing anybody say, but I know just like that I'm under requires, let's say, four years and I'm not seeing that happen. Well, necessarily, I'm going to water down the gospel.

I'm going to make it easier. In other words, I'm not going to tell them about counting the cost. I'm not going to, I'm going to give everything just plain and simple. I'm going to make, I'm going to cater to sometimes lost human.

You know, it's sad that that's the way these denominations work, but that's just how it.

Is.

And that's why I'm doing it right now. But it is the outworking to me in my mind of become unbiblical in your theology.

The Case for Reformed Evangelism and Why Results Do Not Define Faithfulness

Well, speaking of people who I interview, one of my favorite guests that I've ever interviewed, and in fact, he is one of my favorite preachers of all time, if not my very favorite preacher of all time, Dr. Conrad M. Beyway, pastor of Kibwata Baptist Church in Lusaka, Zambia, Africa, whom I have had the privilege and honor to call my friend since 1995.

And I'm looking forward to him returning to the States, as he has promised in 2021. At some point, he will be my speaker for my biannual Iron Shepherds, Iron Radio pastors luncheon, and I'm really looking forward to that.

But Dr. M. Beyway, who wrote the foreword to your book, I want to read just one chapter, chapter, not one chapter, one paragraph of his foreword for our listeners. A person who reads Ryan Denton's book should not simply read it for the purpose of increasing head knowledge, but rather for the purpose of joining the growing number of God's children who take the work of evangelism seriously.

We have done enough talking. Let us fold our sleeves and get to work. We have the true gospel. Let us ensure that it is communicated collectively and individually to those who need to hear it. Let us proceed to pray that the Lord will own our labors so that with the help of the Holy Spirit, we may see more spiritual babies being born and nurtured in our churches.

Also, I'd like to read the commendations for this book by three other men who I know personally very well and love and who I've interviewed on this program. First of all, Dr. Tom Nettles, Senior Professor of Historical Theology at the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary.

Ryan Denton has given us an essential handbook on evangelism that is like eating frozen, concentrated orange juice straight from the cylinder. Then, Justin Peters, who actually was very recently one of my Iron Trip and Zion Radio Pastors Luncheon speakers, Justin Peters of Justin Peters Ministry, says, I really, really loved this book.

Ryan Denton gives both a sobering assessment of modern evangelical methods, as well as a motivating challenge for believers to do evangelism as God has prescribed it to be done. And then finally, Sy Ten Bruggenkate, another dear friend, says, The authority of this book is scripture.

The wealth of biblical references and exhaustive quotes from evangelists of old are alone worth getting this book. Well, those are just some of the folks that have written endorsements for this book, and we will be talking more about that when we return from our first station break.

If you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail dot com. C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N at gmail dot com. And as always, give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live outside the USA.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter. Let's say you are in disagreement with something that you're asking about. You're in disagreement with your own pastors, for instance.

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Don't go away. We're going to be right back with Brian Denton and more of our discussion on Even If None, Reclaiming Biblical Evangelism, right after these messages from our sponsors. Chris Arnsen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, announcing a new website with an exciting offer from World Magazine, my trusted source for news from a Christian perspective.

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Call 1 -800 -669 -4870. Welcome back. This is Chris Orange and if you just tuned us in, our guest today for the full two hours is Ryan Denton, who is founder of Christ in the Wild Ministries and we are discussing his book, Even if None, Reclaiming Biblical Evangelism, joining us during the second hour, in about a half hour from now, will be Joe Jakiewicz, the founder of First Love Radio and First Love Publications.

If you'd like to join us on the air, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com. Chrisarnson at gmail .com. Please give us at least your first name, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live outside the USA.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter. And Ryan, perhaps we should make sure that you define evangelism. Some folks have even used that as an adjective for many years, that only means that you're talking about anything aggressively and passionately that you want to share with others.

But people even have been using it for secular reasons as an adjective these days. But if you could tell us, what is evangelism? By the way, your voice sounds completely different than it did before. You're really muffled now.

Yeah, I know. I was opening up the, I got a Bible here. I was opening, you go out and you share the gospel and people get saved. That's evangelism from a guy named Darius Salter and another guy named Peter Wagner.

And, you know, they're Arminians and like Martin Luther and J .I. Packer, who define evangelism as simply sharing the gospel. And again, you see that, what I was going to say, you see that in Acts chapter 8, the word that the Bible uses there is gospelizing.

And that's whenever the disciples are scattered from Jerusalem and they're going around and they're gospelizing. And that's the word that, that's where we get the word evangelism. But as they know it, they come in and they'll say, okay, well, that's actually divine evangelism.

To me, this is so ironic because Christ, a lot of his parables, and three of the, well, actually two of the parables by the weeds. And he says, this is how I evangelize. It turned out not to be saved like that.

And then, hey, you know, so-and-so evangelized or said something to me, you know, a week ago or a month ago and didn't see anything. But you don't know how that arrow is going to, Christ made it very clear in a lot of things.

He says that if you look, if you go by appearances only, you'll be deceived. And I think the same thing happens in evangelism all the time. And so I think that's why it's so for guys like Darius, there is God knows one who knows whether or not a person's truly on, whether or not someone's truly converted.

How do we ever know? Again, that's to me why evangelism, what's the script evangelism includes.

Yes, we must never forget that some plant seeds, some water them, but it is God who brings the increase. And we can't manufacture that. And unfortunately, many people do for the sake of reporting numbers.

And very often, or very often, that is to boast about how successful they are because of their own gifts and their own zeal and aggressiveness and on and on. Oh, we have a listener who happens to be a very faithful listener and a very generous supporter financially of this program.

His name is Grady from Asheboro, North Carolina. Hello, brothers. For about 30 years now, our Heavenly Father has allowed me the privilege of sharing the gospel to truckers in our country. As a professional truck driver, out stop time is limited.

Maybe he meant our. Our stop time is limited. So I hand out New Testaments with Psalms and Proverbs, a pole washer tract, the gospel of Jesus Christ, and a booklet by either John Blanchard or Todd Freel.

I pray that our Lord will use these to reach truckers because the field, the fields are certainly white unto harvest. How do you handle evangelism when you're limited on time with someone?

I like that he does that. Yeah, I have one of the minutes. But yeah, that's a great question. Tracts are great. I mean, you know, because the thing is, is it goes back to what you in by hearing, hearing by the Word of God, the gospels, the power of God and the salvation, things like that.

Somebody that, that, that to me is evangelism. Actually, I mean, that's why, you know, when we go out and evangelize, let's say, in open air, see, I think now in central track in the bathroom, I heard the gospel and, you know, I think we're all having to tell he's always done things might not look like it.

Yes.

And I remember at a Jeremiah cry conference that I attended in Pensacola, Florida years ago, where I actually met side 10, Brigham Kate and some other folks. I met Jeff Durbin there and some others for the first time.

But I remember Jeff Pollard, the current executive director of Chapel Library, who mainly produces tracks and very affordable, brief booklets, some of them, which are excerpts of the writings of men like Charles Spurgeon and some of the greatest preachers and teachers that have ever lived.

And some, some of them are more contemporary, but I think most of them are from brethren of old who are now in heaven. But he, he coined a phrase, at least I think he coined it during a message that he was giving there at the conference.

He called tracks, paper missionaries. And I love that. But we have to get to our break right now, our midway break. This is a longer than normal break, folks. I hope that you will be patient with us. But in the middle of the show every day, we take a longer than normal break because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida requires of us a longer break because the FCC requires them to localize this program to Lake City, Florida.

So they have to air their own public service announcements and other local things that connect us to Lake City, Florida. While they do that, we air our own globally heard commercials. So please use this time wisely, write down as much of the information as you can for as many of our advertisers as you can so that you can more frequently and successfully patronize our advertisers to keep them happy so that they will continue sponsoring this program because we need their finances to exist.

We cannot exist without their financial support, without the financial support of our advertisers. But also use this time to send in a question for Ryan Denton on evangelism to chrisarnson at gmail .com.

C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N at gmail .com. As always, give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live outside the USA. And don't go away.

We'll be right back with Ryan Denton after these messages.

The Hope of Reformed Evangelism

James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries and the Dividing Line webcast here. Although God has brought me all over the globe for many years to teach, preach, and debate at numerous venues, some of my very fondest memories are from those precious times of fellowship with Pastor Rich Jensen and the brethren at Hope Reform Baptist Church, now located at their new, beautiful facilities in Corham, Long Island, New York.

I've had the privilege of opening God's Word from their pulpit on many occasions, have led youth retreats for them, and have always been thrilled to see their members filling many seats at my New York debates.

I do not hesitate to highly recommend Hope Reform Baptist Church of Corham, Long Island to anyone who wants to be accurately taught, discipled, and edified by the Holy Scriptures, and to be surrounded by truly loving and caring brothers and sisters in Christ.

I also want to congratulate Hope Reform Baptist Church of Corham for their recent appointment of Pastor Rich Jensen's co-elder, Pastor Christopher McDowell. For more information on Hope Reform Baptist Church, go to hopereformedli .net.

That's hopereformedli .net, or call 631 -696 -5711. That's 631 -696 -5711. Tell the folks at Hope Reform Baptist Church of Corham, Long Island that you heard about them from James White on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio is sponsored by Harvey Cedars, a year-round Bible conference and retreat center nestled on the Jersey Shore. Harvey Cedars offers a wide range of accommodations to suit groups up to 400.

For generations, Christians have enjoyed gathering and growing at Harvey Cedars. Each year, thousands of high school and college students come and learn more about God's Word. An additional 9 ,000 come annually to Harvey Cedars as families, couples, singles, men, women, pastors, seniors, and missionaries.