George Bryson and Micah Coate

Webcasting around the world from the desert metropolis of Phoenix, Arizona. This is the dividing line. The Apostle Peter commanded Christians to be ready to give a defense for the hope that is within us.

Yet to give that answer with gentleness and reverence. Our host is dr. James White director of Alpha Omega ministries and an elder at the Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church. This is a live program and we invite your participation.

If you'd like to talk with dr. White call now. It's 602 973 4602 or toll-free across the United States. It's 1 -877 -753 -3341. And now with today's topic here is James White.

George Bryson, Micah Coate, and the Misrepresentation of Calvinism

Well, it has been an interesting time period since we finished program up yesterday. If you were listening yesterday, you know that we spent two hours Starting to work through Micah Coates new book a cultish side of Calvinism.

We found it to be Significantly less than accurate in its argumentation citation and we were looking at one particular element of that Which may possibly be the worst? most obvious misrepresentation of me ever put in print and it was the section page 285 of the Kindle edition.

Where we read in debating George Bryson leading Calvinist James White admitted to Calvin admitted to Calvinism's view of God's this is what This is what Micah Coates thinks. We really think about God and if we were just honest and I was honest see.

The following is a loose paraphrase from this debate as soon as I saw that I was like. And He has Bryson Calvinist believe that God is an evil potentate who causes sin and tyrannically damns people and for no good reason causes Babies to be raped white.

Yes, and here is why I believe that Genesis 50 says Bryson yikes with friends like this who needs enemies? While whites response is shocking. I Deeply appreciate his honesty in acknowledging the sovereign attributes of his small g-god.

Because Calvinist theology has misinterpreted certain verses of the Bible for 400 years. They have essentially created a totally new and totally foreign small g-god now even my worst enemies know that that is a Bold face lie and that I've never said.

Oh, yeah, I believe yeah I believe God's a Evil potentate and I I believe he causes people to sin and tyrannically damns people for no good reason and causes babies to be raped. Yeah, that's that's my god.

Everybody everybody knows that that's just as absurd as the day as long so what would motivate someone to do something like this and so. As I was discussing it on the air yesterday. Certain people in my chat channel who are somewhat frightening as Eric and Cantor learned firsthand.

As Eric and Cantor learned firsthand these folks go a-looking and. So they They they tracked down the source of these things and it took a while because they they found That yes indeed in George Bryson's book the dark side of Calvinism.

You have pretty much the same story but slightly edited and I grabbed my copy but evidently mine's one of the earliest copies and it is now it's now a hundred pages longer than it used. To be when it's a self-published eight and a half by eleven thing.

You can make it as big as you want. I suppose. And Discovered that mr. Cote had misunderstood things and had changed things he had taken out. Well in in Bryce's book. It says even more pointed and comments found on the internet in a section called while and away the hours.

The Calvinist John and again, I forgot to ask. I haven't actually responded his email but Robbie or rave I'm not sure which offers what he calls a loose paraphrase and the James White and George Bryson debate on the Bible answer, man.

So here in Bryson. He's not that this guy was sitting in the studio. He was sitting right there he has the recordings these things he could have checked this out for himself. But hey, that would that would show some type of honesty and integrity and when you're a rabid anti Calvinist.

You don't have to worry about Calvinist like that. You can just you can just we don't have to like use their definitions or worry about being accurate about what they say. We can just let him have it.

So At least he doesn't Attribute the yikes with friends like this who needs enemies. Part to to himself because he knows he didn't say that and then he goes on with the same Type of absurd application that yes, that's I was saying.

Yes, I believe these things. So so both of both so coat is just following Bryson. Bryson was there. So the the first the fundamental guilt here for gross misrepresentation lying through your teeth goes to George Bryson and George needs to be called on the carpet for this to answer for this this level of absurdity but people started wanting to go where this come from and so.

Eventually everything was tracked back to a Website a blog and Calvinist John Robbie, I'll let's go. I'll go Robbie for now if it's it's rave then he can let me know. He undoubtedly has to correct the pronunciation all the time.

Anyways, it's not like my life last name mine's pretty easy, but our a be could be all sorts of things. I was a forum. Okay, so in a forum. Evidently John did not like how the program went and this morning.

I got a Twitter message from now I got into the office. I got an email from him. He doesn't even remember this. But he says yeah, that's a forum that I was involved in and yeah, that's my style. So this was a a Knee-jerk reaction after the program.

He did recognize that this was a two-on-one. But he didn't like how the program went well. You know what? I did the best I could over three hours to to drive people to the Word of God and I have met many people That have said that that was The Genesis the starting point of their becoming reformed.

So I leave that in Lord's hands. John was very kind in his emails. He's apologized profusely. Not like it's not like his fault that someone like a George Bryson or a Micah coat Can take those words and read into them a conclusion that is just just I now call it the absurdity.

The you know, not even the cults have come up with something this stupid. But they've pulled it off. It's not his fault, but he said man. I must just got a burn in my saddle and man talk about a lesson in.

You know being careful with your words. You never know where they're gonna end up and you know, that's just that's the way it goes. I as soon as I saw his tweet this morning, I said, hey, don't worry about it.

You're not the one that wrote dollars that stuff blessings to you, etc, etc. You know, there's there's no problem there and If I'm ever speaking someplace reason nearby I'd love to have him come by and say hello.

And I'm not gonna kick him in the shins or anything like that. Yes, sir.

You're obviously well the clip that you put on the website this morning. I'm gonna play it here and I know you will. My I just remember at the time my knee-jerk reaction at the time was wow am I glad this is being recorded because Some people might get the wrong impression of how this went down.

You need to play it back and we need to have it. Because Bryson and Hanegraaff in my opinion at the time where they were shouting you down.

Well, they weren't shouting me down, but they they clearly Did not and and it's I had not listened to this in a long long time. I don't know that I've ever sat down and re-listened all that. I might have right afterwards I I don't know recall now I normally don't listen to my stuff unless I'm preparing for a debate on the same subject or with the same person again.

Uh but I was surprised at how again I my recollection was very very clear how very much involved Hank was On the other side and that was very obvious at the time and and certainly you can tell that by listening.

But it was also so incredibly obvious how George Bryson wouldn't answer a direct question of his life dependent on it. I mean it was he was just he was he was panicked of being drawn into any type of exegetical discussion at all.

It's what is it like to know don't get me into that Bible. I'll be I'll be in big trouble if you get me into that Bible stuff. What's it like to be a Christian and fear being brought into the Bible? I just I cannot even begin to conceive of that.

That was where I am so much at home. That's where I want to be and that's where I just had to keep dragging Him kicking and screaming screaming into the text of the Bible. So anyway Once we started getting all this information First thing I did is I downloaded from our website Actually was day one.

This was day one. Yeah, this is day one. No, well, maybe it was next day or maybe he heard it he say memory listened on the Internet. So it doesn't necessarily mean he was listening live. But it was day one and It was part of the it's within the first 20 it starts I think 20 minutes and 43 seconds if I recall or maybe 22 43 somewhere around that time frame into the very first day and That's at least an hour version of it without the commercials in it.

If you have the commercial stuff then that's gonna be that's gonna change the time frame. But anyways, I'm gonna play it for you. Anyhow, I have posted it on our website in our in my neat little Little audio player thingy here that took us about two hours to get up there, but hey, you know at least now It might work and I'll be able to do this in the future.

I've put it into the same place where I put the links for all the dividing lines. So I should have it. Anyhow, even though I don't have access that subdirectory. So it's useless to me. You better get it to me.

Because I should be able to post audio on the website without having to involve 20 people and taking three hours. It's silly but Anyhow, I Want y 'all to listen. Let's let's let's let's remind ourselves one more time.

Here is Michael Coates new book here is here is the all of this but before you listen to this Let's just step back and go. Okay, let's compare how responsible Calvinists deal with the issue of people who disagree with them and how George Bryson, Micah Coate Lawrence Vance Norm Geisler Dave Hunt and all their endorsers Paige Patterson Jerry Vine see Gordon Olson who have endorsed this kind of book let's let's compare and contrast the two sides and Here's what here's what Coate has Bryson Calvinist believe that God is an evil potentate who causes sin and tyrannically damns people and for no good reason Causes babies to be raped.

By the way, why didn't Bryson catch the fact that he never said that? Didn't he see that this was a caricature because it was This was this was a caricature on John Robbie's part of saying well Bryson's way off on this side and and white saying yes and Look at Genesis 50 and it never From his perspective got to where it really needed to be and of course all that really Represents as I was doing or they could to get it back into the text of Scripture.

So why didn't how I didn't Bryson catch that because he didn't want to he doesn't care if it's a caricature as long as it's anticalvinistic and all of these people and their endorsers need to be held accountable responsible for this.

I dare anyone any one find one single parallel in the Potter's freedom find it and And if you go if you and be careful if you go to Geisler's appendix. Which is no longer there. There's a reason why it's no longer there folks.

The publisher pulled it. Because just go to the appendix of the current edition of the Potter's freedom and Be embarrassed for dr. Geisler for the number of outrageous and outlandish errors page number citations.

Complete fabrications of citations the gale rippling er ask level of that appendix. So don't go there. It's not going to be any good. Even though Michael Coate quoted from it and anyway. So what a contrast what a massive contrast.

Why does one side? have this incredible willingness to engage in Dishonesty and straw man argumentation and everything else and the other side doesn't have to it's simple folks one side has the truth and the other doesn't.

That's why I mean that's obvious. But that's that's just the way it is. So let's let's actually listen. Some of you this is only a few minutes long. But here is what became paraphrased and turned into the absurdity By George Bryson as he was trolling the internet looking for something to make himself look better after the debate in 2001.

It was God's purpose to preserve the children of Israel alive in Egypt. So it was his purpose to send Joseph and he did so by having him sold into slavery in Egypt. Let me answer that with a question.

Let me ask you this question and this will put it into perspective to show the difference when a child is raped.

Is God responsible and did he decree that rape. If he didn't then that rape is a Element of meaningless evil that has no purpose. What I'm trying to point out by going. What is your answer there? Because I want to understand the answer.

I'm trying to go to scripture to answer. Yes, but what is the answer to the question that he just asked is that we can understand what the answer I? Mentioned to him. Yes, because if not, then it's meaningless and purposeless and though God knew it was going to happen He created without a purpose.

Now, by the way, let me stop right there. The only thing I was responding to was the use of the term decree not responsible. I Have so clearly at the already up this point had so clearly Differentiated between primary means secondary means the whole nine yards.

All I was responding to was did God decree what does the Westminster Confession of Faith? Freely decreed whatsoever takes place and isn't that what it says whatever takes place in time, isn't that there?

So you're asking a Calvinist. Do you really believe what Calvinists believe? Yes, I do and let me explain what that means. They don't want to explain what that means. George Bryson does not want anybody to really understand what we believe.

He wants people to hear his distorted version of what we believe. He doesn't want anybody to know what we really understand and How we accept these things and how we understand primary causation and secondary causation and what the basis for moral culpability is.

Does anybody remember that two weeks ago? I Spent over two hours on this program discussing this very thing for a single person who had written an email two hours. Discussing these very issues remember about Adam and Eve and moral culpability and the basis upon which God holds men accountable in the whole nine yards two hours and They don't want you to hear that they want to hear they want you to hear a monologue from their side.

Because they just can't interact with it. God brought the evil into existence. No, it was going to exist but for no purpose no redemption. Nothing positive. Nothing good. So he did I trade and if he decreed it then there's a meaning to it.

It has meaning it has purpose now Hank's summary was exactly right. Hank heard me. Hank got it, right. He didn't say you didn't use response. We said he decreed it and because he decreed it it has a purpose.

Exactly does that does that mean? That you had a morally neutral human being with God the big gun behind his back saying do evil. No. In fact, you probably had restraint involved even at that. But that was part of the rest of the conversation this got it suffering all suffering has purpose.

Everything in this world has purpose. There is no basis for despair. But if we believe that God created knowing all this was going to happen, but with no decree He just created and all this evils out there and there's no purpose then every rape every situation like that is nothing.

But purposeless evil and God is responsible for the creation of despair and I that is not not as I've been for years.

I've been trying to figure out why it is that in order for rape to exist. Or unless God caused it to happen there can't be any purpose in it. God can use evil and he does but to blame God which is what a decree does to blame God for the rape.

No, I just I wasn't gonna comment on this. Which is what a decree does only if you insist like George Bryson to simplify to the position of stupidity. Only if you will not allow for distinctions that we all make in our theology.

That again that this is where you know, Michael Coate gets this stuff. He's just simply following in line in this kind of we will not defend our theology. We will assume our theology. We will not ask these questions of our theology.

We will presuppose all of our distinctions, but you can't examine them, but we will examine yours. You can't you know when people come into our chat channel what's one of the first things we ask him where you coming from what's your church background and We can tell immediately when the Lamers don't want to tell us.

But why do we ask that because we're info Nazis or something? Because you have to have a context from which to have a meaningful Conversation and you need to know where both sides are coming from and this side just simply won't lay their cards on the table.

We're only attacking Calvinism. We ain't talking. It's just a mystery to us, but we just think your answer is terrible. No, you have answers you just don't want to have them examined on the same level and that's what they don't like about me and that's why Bryson won't do a debate with cross examination because cross examination means his position gets examined for consistency and He knows it's not.

Consistent of a child is a horrible attack on the very character and.

How about to blame God for for the destruction of the heart of a father thinking that his son has been killed? For many years the weeping that he underwent. Genesis 50 20 has not been answered yet. And acts chapter never war tells us that the early church believed that Pontius Pilate and Herod and the Romans and the Jews in the crucifixion of the sinless Son of God.

Which I believe we would all agree is the greatest evil that man has ever committed. That that took place on the basis of the sovereign decree of God. Acts chapter 4 verses 27 to 28. If you could tell me both what you believe acts 427 to 28.

I didn't say what you both. Yeah, that's pretty obvious by that point. Let me ask you if you think That rape is a sin. I believe that's funny when I asked him earlier. Are you an open theist. Hank really got upset with me?

But now he just asked. Now he just asked me do I think rape is a sin. And Hank did not get upset with him for that that. Yeah, that was yeah. Can we use a biblical example. George Bison. No at least that's a direct quote.

Rape is a biblical issue. Is rape a sin. Just as the crucifixion was the same.

Okay, so does God decree and therefore is God the cause of sin. Again as you catch catch to see Bryson.

Does God decree and therefore is the put into parentheses primary cause he will not allow. For for the he cannot criticize Calvinism as it is. He has to create this straw man it's just that's that's all he's capable of doing.

That's what he's built his entire shtick on that and It's just it's sad to see but you know That's just that's just Bryson and if you're gonna follow Bryson You can't go any higher than Bryson who well knows having read all of these things.

Let me just read this into everyone's hearings. They can see it the early church said for truly in the city. They were gathered against your holy servant. Let's see instead of going after George. What am I trying to do?

I've got a purpose in this program. I know I knew I had already written and Eddie Eddie Dalcour will Testify to this and I could probably go in the other room and find the notes from this even though this was eight years ago I'll bet you because I remember which notepad I had and I I know about where that notepad is on my shelf.

So I bet you I could even find this. But I and and Eddie will tell you I Had written on the notepad is that you know, I'm taking notes as you know. And what would really be cool now boy, I wish we'd had this is I've got that live scribe pen.

Because what people don't hear is what went on during the breaks. Which very much substantiates what I have said concerning what was really going on in this in this situation, but I Had written on my on my pad.

This is the last time I'll ever be on BAM and I had showed it to Eddie and he just sort of looked at me because I had been on 13 or 14 times that point I was starting to become a regular. But I could tell That this was last time I'd ever be invited on and it was I've not been on since then and So I Knew I knew what was what was going on here.

And so I had a purpose I had decided early on. The people that I want to get to in this conversation are the people who honor the Bible is the Word of God. The only way you're ever going to believe these things is you believe God has spoken and I've told the story many times of Susan V who came into our chat channel years ago from a Church of Christ background still attending a Church of Christ and How we explained John 6 to her and she'd come back a few days later and she'd you know Talk to her elders and they said this and we'd respond to that and then she'd come back.

She read some commentaries. We respond to that and over a period of time She'd come in and she'd say I'm losing sleep over this and I'm losing friends over this and it's impacting my family and all the rest of stuff and yet her commitment to the Bible is Word of God never varied and she Accepted what the Bible states because she looked into it just that carefully and those the type of people I'm concerned about I'm not concerned about the philosopher who wants fancy philosophical language because if you're a philosopher who wants fancy philosophical language.

And I convince you with fancy philosophical language. Then another philosopher can come along and convince you to another viewpoint with fancier philosophical language. And I don't I don't. Eat, you know life's too short to even bother with such things.

Real edification of the body of Christ comes from the application of God's truth from his word by his spirit. Period and a discussion and if that's what you're looking for then You're not gonna be interested in what I have to say to you.

At all, and I'm not gonna try to make you interested and I and if you want to fill the blogs with With insults of me I was looking at that I was looking at the the very place where John Robbie had put that initially and you scroll down the page is all sorts of just snobbish.

Insulting he's such an idiot. He's no scholar blah blah blah blah stuff. I mean if I believed 10 of what I read about myself on Google, I'd jump off a building but It's just it's just the way it is, but that's what I was trying to do and so here I am trying to get it back into the text of Scripture and There's George Bryson trying desperately to keep it out because he knows that's the one place he cannot go.

He has to stay in the realm of emotions. He cannot go into the realm of actually thinking through these things because his his position will collapse. Jesus whom you anointed both Herod Pontius Pilate along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel to do whatever Your hand and your purpose predestined to occur.

And so here is an example where men committed evil and they did so at the predestining Purpose of God God is glorified. His intention is positive and good the intention of Herod the intention of the Jews intention.

Something you'll not hear George Bryson talking about what is the intention of the heart because that's the basis upon which judgment takes place. But no, no, no. We can't we can't have that God these were not innocent people and God standing behind them with a big gun pushing them down the Road going be evil be evil.

In fact, how many times did God restrain them? So they're making a choice in the process and they're and you're in your view. They're not only making a choice. So they have the ability to choose within the realm of their nature since they are fallen.

Remember God restrains men from committing evil. Do we do we believe why are men fallen? That's the question now it is absolutely clear. How relevant my question here is. Can God Restrain men from committing evil.

Isn't it obvious if God can do that? Then there's a question isn't there? Why doesn't he? Why doesn't he and If George Bryson will admit that God can restrain the evil of men then he asked to answer the question Why does God not restrain someone from raping that little child?

Now the fact the matter is God has restrained people from raping little children every single day Throughout the course of human history, but since it didn't happen, we almost never thanked him for that.

But The fact is see once again the Calvary Chapelite Has to answer these questions too and he may duck and and Make excuses, but he's got to answer these questions just like anybody else and a refusal to do So is simply dishonor.

Do you believe that the question is why are men fallen? Could it could I ask it? I finish a point here. Do you believe that God can keep someone from sinning?

I would like to ask you the question. Is God the cause of that.

I've already pointed out chapter 50 that God's decree is based upon his good intention. Can God keep a person from sinning will he violate Libertarian free will to keep a person from sinning. Yes or no what.

I it's not a yes-or-no question George it is and we all know it. So there's there's the section folks there is the clip that was turned into Sutton into the absurdity by George Bryson a Paraphrase it was meant to be a somewhat mocking paraphrase of both of our positions.

But mainly more of a mocking of the debate itself. Well, it's just you know, it's it didn't get to where we need to go. Okay. But to turn that into oh look James White has admitted that he worships an evil God that causes sin and damns people.

And and has little babies raped just because it's fun to do. What an incredible insight. Not only into the rabid anti-calvinist mindset. But into those who would aid in a bet. Through the promotion endorsement of such material men who sit in positions of high honor.

I really wonder if Al Mohler Read this book what he would say about it. I mean he would he would be shocked at anyone who's ever graduated from the seminary and someone's told me since last night that Michael Cohen has an MDiv and If that's the case.

Okay. Then there's absolutely no excuses whatsoever for all the things we've talked about in just just Outside of just abject laziness or dishonesty on a level. That's just beyond comment. But if if Al Mohler read this book and then saw Paige Patterson's endorsement on it I wonder what the next meeting of Southern Baptist Seminary presidents would be like just amazing just absolutely amazing.

Well, I I Wanted to get that out because that had developed since yesterday's program and I wanted to deal with that we had gotten it posted this morning and I Just I Don't even know what to say, but I did want to oh the way back.

We'll be playing the entirety of this debate after the live show. Whoo. Yay. That'll be interesting. So you want to hear the whole thing you want to hear how many times I tried and tried and tried and tried to get Calvary Chapel leader George Bryson to do exegesis and how many times.

Well, I remember remember remember what that was what eventually led to read my book. Which is part of the Radio Free Geneva theme. I Finally looked at him. How do you interpret that text read my book?

Don't ask me to actually deal with the Bible. What are you talking about? That's that's not that's that that's not fair. Amazing thing. All right, so what we're gonna do here is I had promised to do this and there are numbers of you who Go, hey, this is much more important to me than that other stuff.

And and so, you know, we understand we want to try to continue to have things, you know that a wide variety of folks Why very folks can find useful and I had mentioned we're a little bit of on Tuesday.

And I was gonna do on Thursday we moved it off today which I was why we're doing a another hour and a half. This week will give us four and a half hours of dividing lines this week four and a half hours two weeks ago.

Three hours last week. So we're I'm trying to pack up the archives. So it takes more than just a month to go through all of them. See, it's we're just gonna keep stretching it out there. It'll take much longer now.

But I Was talking about the three-part lecture series that Was delivered in Scotland by dr. Simon gather Cole Dirk Junkin and Peter J Williams and How useful I found it I thought I thought Peter J Williams presentation was just well since he's British smashing and Just very very well done and But I I really enjoyed this portion of Dirk Junkin's Presentation it's it's a little bit difficult to follow this kind of talk without seeing the slides and I didn't hear this until the slides are even pulled down but there was for like a week or so right afterwards you could Actually download them from a website, but I didn't know about it until it was too late.

And so It can be I've often commented I would not even want to try to do my King James only Presentations my textual critical, you know New Testament reliability presentations without using a digital projector.

I just I don't know how people did it before you could show people stuff trying to describe it is just a Death sentence. It's just yeah, it's it's it's rough and So anyway What I want to do is I want to play a portion of Dirk Junkin's comments now he's commenting on Misquoting Jesus.

I was reaching over here and grabbing the book, but then I realized I have it open in Kindle. So I don't you do that now misquoting Jesus. He's gonna be comment on pages 158 and 159 at least of The printed edition that I have It's interesting.

I just realized something That in the Kindle edition for some reason I don't know why. Yeah, this says page 158 of 247. With this new book now this edition of Kindle is showing me the page number. I'm sort of wondering if I would reopen Coats book if I'd now have page numbers.

I'll find out soon enough. But anyway This book is the popularization published by Harper San Francisco of The book that put airmen on the map Called the Orthodox corruption of Scripture which is an Oxford publication and mine is rather dog-eared and from 1993 and You will find the same discussion beginning on page 54 And extending for a number of pages very well marked and in my edition here and I think you could make an argument that Ermin is more careful in his scholarly work than it is the in his popularization that may be Due to a lot of things Given the publisher.

I have to wonder if it's not the editing in the sense of There is I have disco I Sense and I don't know if anybody else has sensed this but I think a lot of people would have sensed this I sense that Bart Ehrman When you read the covers cover copy when you read the stuff that the that Harper San Francisco puts out or Harper one now I think is what it's called puts out promoting his stuff.

It's always much more rabid than what Ermin actually says himself. I Of the atheists out there other than Prometheus, which is normally even worse, but but they love anything that is anti-christian, I mean that the bias there is Unbelievable and ironically they put out Rob Bell's book, too.

But I just have to have to wonder if it's if it's the publisher Juicing it up. Because they know who's gonna be buying this book I don't know but Dirk Junkin is responding specifically to the popularized version in Misquoting Jesus, and so let's take a listen to what he had to say and then what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna go back through and I'm gonna give you more of the details of the specifics Regarding the text so grab your Bible if you have a Greek New Testament.

Especially the UBS 4th or even better be the Nessie Island 27th sure wish I'd get the 28th out as far as printed. Grab yours take a look at the textual critical data because we're gonna be looking at that and then In the last half hour, we're gonna go back to probably the the Perkins slick debate.

So Here's here's what Dirk Junkin now, it's j-o-n-g k-i-n-d And as you're gonna hear from his accent English is not his first language.

That's the wording of the New Testament If not the same in each Greek New Testament so along the way those differences in wording were introduced and The question is why why did this happen now? But Ehrman has as a beautiful and to some convincing theory.

He basically says that many of the variants we have in the New Testament are deliberate. They were made because scribes Wanted to change the text and they wanted to change the text for a very good reason.

Because in the early church there were all sorts of wars going on between various groups. That is nothing new in itself. Because if you read the New Testament if you read the Apostle Paul whatever if you read the first letter of John you get indeed the impression that Even before the time about which what Herman is writing in the first century There was a core group of Christians, but there were also all sorts of groups around them.

But in in later centuries second and third century there were issues about whether Christ was born As the Son of God or only became the Son of God at his baptism. Well, so that means that he was adopted as the Son of God at the moment the Spirit descended upon On him and that's a widespread Kind of heresy we call it these days.

And in those days it was called heresy as well by the people who didn't agree. It's a widespread thought and it's called adoptionism. So Christ being adopted as the Son of God and Herman says well this sort of heresy Influenced the text of the New Testament quite a bit because scribes changed the text of the New Testament So that it could not be used by the heretics.

Anymore so there is deliberate change in order to avoid Misinterpretation and of course it is the in the end one group one they called themselves the orthodox and all the others who lost were called the heretics and If you read his work, then there seems to be some sort of bias to to favor.

The heretics actually know the heretics they were losers but they were the undeserved losers in a sense because what they promoted was perhaps part of what Christianity was all about in the first place.

Now what does he write. He says this the thesis of this chapter is that sometimes the text of the New Testament were modified for theological reasons. This happened whenever the scribes copying the text were concerned To ensure that the text said what they wanted them to say.

Sometimes it was because of theological disputes Raging in the scribes own day Other that there's something going on. Of course in in this quote that he's very imprecise in what he says. And this happened whenever the scribes copying the text were concerned that seems like a Systematic way of editing the New Testament or whenever they were concerned they changed it but then we get Know twice the word sometimes just in order to tone down his own claim a little bit.