Ask A Pastor: November 2024

Kongsvinger Lutheran Church

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We're gonna get started today as our ask a pastor segment and I like the questions because there's some there's some good scholarly questions in here there are some questions that clearly people are working through some bad theology that they have come in contact with and And hopefully we can get this all straightened out you get the idea

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So let's pray and then we will get into our study Lord Jesus again as we open up your word

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We ask the Holy Spirit to help us to rightly understand what you have revealed So that we may properly believe confess and do according to your

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Holy Word. We ask in Jesus name. Amen All right. First question comes from a saloon comes from Canada.

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That's where Yeah, she's Canadian so that she lives in Canada That's where the Canadians live in Canadian And she asked a pastor seeking understanding about the following one the rapture to pre trip

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Three post trip is a rapture a real event that will happen Unexpectedly if we are left on the earth and not taken will there be seven years of tribulation?

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Are there two events ie the rapture and then seven years then white throne judgment? Okay, I would note that there is not two events there is only one event and that is the return of Christ in glory to judge the living and the dead and The analogy

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I like to use is from an old movie that I enjoyed when I was growing up have you ever seen the movie the guns of Navarone or Force 10 from Navarone just classic movies

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I mean I think the Harrison Ford was in force 10 from Navarone but the story of a special ops groups that were do running missions during World War two and Always and again back in the day before they had digital watches and things like this

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Prior to a mission everybody had a wrist watch watch and they had to sync them together

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The idea is is that you know If you don't sync them together Then somebody's gonna blow up the bridge too quick and the guys aren't gonna escape and things like that in the scriptures

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We legitimately have a way of syncing what what the what the evangelicals and the charismatics talk about regarding the return of Christ and The details make it impossible for there to be a

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Pre -tribulation rapture. It doesn't make any sense. So I like to say we Lutherans We believe in the rapture if by rapture you mean when

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Christ returns in glory to judge the living and the dead So let me show you some texts on this because I think it's fun

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We're going to go to let's see. It's a second Thessalonians. Maybe a second Thessalonians. Is it four?

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No, hang on five And I know it's first Thessalonians hang on a second here first Thessalonians the day of the

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Lord, here we go All right So we already saw that in our in our in our text today our epistle text now concerning the times and seasons brothers you have no need for anything to be written to you for yourselves are

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Fully aware that the day of the Lord the what the day of the Lord and I would note this language is

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Identical to the language used in the Old Testament the Old Testament describes God coming to judge and to in his wrath as Described as the day of the

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Lord. It's not days Plural it's day singular. Okay, it's gonna come like a thief.

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Okay, and so the idea then is is that What we're looking at is kind of one thing not two.

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So if I go to second Thessalonians, hang on a second here I'm going to point something out man of lawlessness.

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All right Okay, hang on a second here my

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I'm not able to get to data in my brain like I used to it's kind of annoying Me and that's okay.

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Let's see here first Thessalonians for here. We go first Thessalonians for let me show you this one first Thessalonians four and this is gonna be fun

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Finally brothers we ask you to urge you in the Lord that you receive from us how you ought to walk and to please

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God So we pay attention to that. But here's what it says in Chapter first Thessalonians for we don't want you to be uninformed brothers about those who are asleep

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That you may not grieve as others do who have no hope for since we believe that Jesus died and rose again

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Even so through Jesus God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep Okay note here

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Christ is going to bring with them those who have fallen asleep Christians because of the resurrection kind of have this defiant attitude towards death and you'll you see this throughout the

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New Testament that Those who've died in faith, they're asleep. No, they're dead.

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They're asleep Yeah, don't tell me what what you think because you understand death incorrectly.

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They're alive in Christ So their body is sleeping for this we declare to you by a word from the Lord that we who are alive who are left

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Until the coming of the Lord will not precede those who have fallen asleep For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command

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With the voice of an archangel and with the sound of the trumpet of God These details right here

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Sync up exactly with what Christ is talking about in Matthew 24 So you got the cry of command the voice of an archangel and the trumpet of God you can sync your watch then your theological

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Watch this then the dead in Christ will rise first But when we compare that to what

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Jesus says at the end of Matthew 24, it gets very interesting Okay, let's see here me after this.

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Okay, here we go immediately after the tribulation of those days The Sun will be darkened

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The moon will not give its light the stars will fall from the heaven the powers of the heavens will be shaken

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Okay So what's happening? I pointed this out last week you wake up at 9 in the morning and the

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Sun's not out because they ain't anywhere Oh, and all the stars are gone, too Alright, everyone's gonna be freaking out and we're gonna be sitting there going.

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Yeah Jesus is coming Right. All right there will appear in heaven the sign of the

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Son of Man and Then all the tribes of the earth will mourn and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power

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And great glory and he will send out his angels with a what? loud trumpet call and And they will gather his elect from the four winds from the ends of heaven to the other

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So the what the idea is you take first? Thessalonians 4 sync it with Matthew 24 there isn't a secret coming of Jesus where he takes the church and They all everyone disappears and then all of a sudden that stupid song becomes like number one on the radio again

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Wish we'd all been ready I hated that song. Yes Okay Okay.

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So now now we have an amended part of the question that Aislinn has asked it asked asked it asked it

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Yes, she asked. Yeah, she asked it and that is is that it makes no sense That that the rapture would happen.

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Let me give you the logic behind it Here's the logic behind the rapture number one. Nobody believed it until the late 1800s

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And it arrived as a result of a particular sect a young girl kind of had a fever dream

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About it and and they thought it was prophetic and so they kind of read her fever dream into the scriptures

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I'm not making this up Okay, no one believed in the rapture until then but here's how how people who hold to the rapture then try to justify it

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Because you sit there and you go where in the Bible does it teach it? Okay, and I remember there was back when we lived in Southern, California.

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There was a Radio station KFU. Oh, I think the was the Christian radio station there and and One of the hosts there used to do kind of like a

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Bible answer type question It wasn't the Bible answer man, but he he put a put out a challenge

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He was he said he would give ten thousand dollars to anybody who could provide him with a clear biblical text that taught the rapture

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Okay, nobody can do it. But there was one guy who was really annoying and And and and he kind of got a special mention because his the verse that he says teaches the rapture is

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Is this one? Okay, it says after this revelation for after this I looked up and behold a door standing open in heaven and the first voice

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Which had I had heard speaking to me like a trumpet said come up here. And so he says that's the rapture right there

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One Of the goofiest bits of ice of Jesus needless to say he didn't get his ten thousand dollars Okay but all that being said the logic behind the rapture goes something like this since God intention is to act in wrath if There were a lot of Christians on the planet then those

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Christians being God's children would They would get hurt by God acting in wrath and God can't hurt his children

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So he's going to remove the church so that he can then punish the world Okay, and I sit there and I go

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Yes, that's exactly what God's doing through the apostasy Okay, if you were to go if you were to use the

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Prophet Jeremiah as like a template, okay Wait right before God moves in wrath what ends up happening is is that true teaching of what

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God's Word says and means disappears and people go into rank apostasy so that The number of believers on the planet dwindles down to a remnant

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Okay, and so there's going to be a remnant of Christians on the planet for sure. But though that but God's let allowing the remnant to kind of dwindle down it's like culling the herd because he does his intention is to act in wrath and so Martin Luther in his introduction to the book of Jeremiah kind of says that same idea

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So but but that's the logic behind it, but here's the deal regardless of the logic you can't come up with a non -biblical solution to To do this and so Christ only comes back once He comes back once the end

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Okay, and and and then the other bit is is that you'll note that we do not believe that the thousands

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That's what that's how what it reads in the Greek that the thousand years is not a literal thousand years That's a that's a basically a symbolic number that is talking about Christ's from the time of Christ's ascension until his return

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That's the thousand years. But when you read it in the Greek, it says thousands Year the a thousands years.

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It's just really bad grammar, but it's a plural It's not it's not a singular. So, all right, great question.

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So, you know, we don't so there's only one return of Christ not two and the seven -year tribulation is a

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Symbolic number not a literal number. Okay. Yes, because that's what they're doing

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So so so the it's a during the thousand years that they come alive, right so so we've got

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Revelation 21, right 20 to Revelation 20 watches I saw an angel coming down from heaven holding in his hand the key to the bottom was pissed he sees the dragon the ancient servant who is the

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Satan and bound him for a thousands Helio it's thousands years

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Threw him into the pit and shut him and sealed it so that he might not deceive the nations any longer until the thousand years

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Were ended after that. He must be released for a while This is its own Picture the you have to think of this in the book of Revelation you have these word pictures.

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All right The at the and so here we have a picture This is a complete thought here

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If you then just go and then I saw thrones seated on them and those whom the authority to judge was committed

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I also saw souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and Those who had worshipped who had not worshipped the beast or the image they had not received his mark on their forehead

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They came to life and reigned with Christ for what a thousands years Okay, so the idea here is this is a complete thought and then what happens then is is that you'll note they are ruling and reigning with Christ during the thousands years

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So the Saints who've gone before us What do you think they're doing? They're currently ruling and reigning with Christ and they're alive.

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They're not dead. This is why we say They're sleeping. Okay, they're sleeping. That's the idea.

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So the idea here These are two different thoughts regarding the thousand years and they each have their own focus in their own emphasis and those who die

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They reign with Christ during the thousand years, that's the idea there So it's not like you're gonna sit around going

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I don't have anything to do and I've already solved the 40 ,000 piece puzzle that Dwayne gave me, you know

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You know that that's this We have plenty to do we ruling and reigning with Christ and I would note something here

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There's a reality then to consider in this regard and that's found in Ephesians 2

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Um watch what this says All right But God being rich in mercy because the great love with which he loved us even when we were dead in our trespasses

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He made us alive together with Christ by grace You have been saved and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus So there is a reality to the fact that we are already seated with Christ and when we die

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That goes by we we are no longer doing that by faith. We do it by sight So Yeah Important stuff good question, by the way.

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Okay. Now next question and this is this is a fun scholarly one from Tori Kakuk in in Job starting in chapter 32 a young man named

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Ali who the son of Baruch hell the Buzzite. Okay. Yeah, the Buzzites.

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They were they have a really good at buzzing off. So Of the family of Ram seems to pop up out of nowhere and tell

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Job not to trust in his own righteousness But to trust in God then in chapter 42 God tells

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Job to make a sacrifice with his friends But Ali who is not mentioned who is

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Ali who was he a type for Jesus John the Baptist or someone else? It seems unlikely that a wise young man was just testing a ghillie suit hiding in a bush

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Eavesdropping on Job's property then as soon as God showed up in a whirlwind said look at the time.

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I've got a dip I've got to go. All right Yeah, that's Yeah, that's that's a good point.

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That's a good point. So the the answer to the question is is that that's a highly debated topic Because when you look at Job, okay, let me go this way when you look at Job Ali who shows up remember

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Job's comforters what a miserably worthless Lot these guys are

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One of them's like a word of faith guy The other is a works righteousness guy, you know, and and the other one is a complete wacker doodle

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Okay, and all the advice they give to Job you just slap your head and go What?

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Okay, how how how okay so Ali who shows up and he's not one of Job's three friends now

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When you read the writings of the church fathers on this guy the church fathers, they don't think he's without fault himself

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I do think that's fascinating that they and I think I think

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When I when you read the church fathers on this the thing that they seem to be most Annoyed at is that this young man is rebuking older men

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Which you're not supposed to do but this guy's doing it and I would note when you read the section on Ali who?

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Watch this chapter 32 Ali who rebut rebukes Job's three friends So he comes out and he's doing kung fu fighting here

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Then Ali who rebukes Job chapter 33 chapter 34 Ali who asserts

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God's justice and his theologies like on point Ali who condemns

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Job 36 Eli who extols God's greatness 37 Ali who proclaims

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God's majesty 38 then the Lord answers Job. I I'm I'm of the personal opinion that Ali who sounds a lot like Jesus Okay, and the scandal of his youth and him rebuking older people

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I Put that aside and basically say, you know

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Jesus being God in human flesh He did a lot of that and in his earthly ministry too and man this guy

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Eli whose theologies on point He comes like out of nowhere, you know wearing a ghillie suit.

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That was a hilarious analogy But yeah, he comes out of nowhere. So my personal opinion I Think he's a type of shadow of Christ Yeah, yeah, he's just like Melchizedek.

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He just pops up out of nowhere. Okay But I would know if that's a highly debated topic among scholars

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Who is this Ali who guy the one thing we can say about him? Is is that yeah, he's the one who's talking sense in the middle of the nonsense of three of Job's three comforters

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Okay, you know I mean, like I said, it's like one of them might as well be

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Ken Copeland And you know the other one Jesse Duplantis and it's like this. Oh anyway second question then in Genesis 34 45

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Through sorry 34 through 35 8 the chapter break always seems to be in the strange place there

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Jacob's daughter was raped by by the prince of the Hivites the

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Hivites agreed to be circumcised and on the third day when their pain was at its worst Jacob's boys

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Capitalized on the situation wiped them out with minimal resistance, which I can totally understand preferring the sword

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Jacob is afraid but God handles it and delivers them to Bethel Is this a type of Jesus is defeating works based salvation and delivering those with faith?

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Is it in the capital E end of the world or like Jericho or something else? I would note when you see

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Texts like this In fact, let's take a look at it because this one's a harder text to kind of work out because what happens before it is

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Super interesting. So if I go to 33, okay Jacob meets

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Esau, okay We got Jacob meeting Esau chapter 34 then you have the defiling of Dinah So God is the one who told them to go told

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Jacob to go back to Where he grew up back to the the promised land, which is a type in shadow and upon getting there something like Horrible legitimately horrible happens where you have this where you have this joyful family reunion in 33 then you've got the defiling of Dinah and it's tragic because this this woman's going to die an

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Old maid she's never gonna get married She's she's never gonna have kids of her own and it's just it's a horrible thing but here's the thing is is that when you consider the details of this this this episode gets invoked later in the book of Genesis by Israel himself when he kind of rebukes the

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His boys who carried out that particular mission. So here's the issue is is that?

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God's justice is what eye for an eye tooth for a tooth things like this Okay, and before the

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Mosaic Covenant, there wasn't a death penalty for this kind of sin

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There was restitution that needed to be made and what happened is is that Israel's boys?

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Basically were so incensed by what happened They took justice into their own hands and the justice they exacted did not fit the crime

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That's that's part of how you kind of have to unpack this and as a result of it when later when

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Israel is giving out Blessings to his sons before he dies he invokes this and and doesn't speak well of them at all

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Okay, so this is not something that we look we look to as an example of God's justice because there's no justice in it

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There's this this is an overreach. This is an overstep to hold the entire community of that town liable for the one man's sin is over the top in this particular case and so yeah,

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I think this is an example of a sinful act on the on the part of the boys of Israel and Although I it's understood that they would be upset.

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It's understand that they would want justice This actually wasn't that when God acts in glory to comes in glory to judge the living and the dead when he acts he acts justly and When people are punished they are rightly punished for what they've done collectively as well as individually and so You know that that God's justice can't be kind of held out held out as somehow being wrong

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People say well, that's not fair Yeah Well, you don't have any ground to say that but what that what what

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Israel's boys did here was not justice It was it was this is absolute vengeance and you'll note throughout the scriptures

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We are admonished that vengeance belongs to God. It does not belong to us

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In fact a little bit of a note here. Okay, I'm gonna take this moment to do an aside.

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Okay? There I know make no Secret about the fact that we're fighting

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Nazis nowadays. Okay this past week I signed something called the Antioch Declaration Which was put together by a bunch of reformed guys to combat the

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Nazism That's growing among the conservative churches in the in the confessional confessional Reformed churches.

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I spoke with some of the leaders that but put that together and said why are you guys fighting them on your own?

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because Mahler and Dump earth are Lutherans and they're the ones having a big impact on the guys in your own

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Congregations once you open up your documents so that others can sign it like confessional Lutherans so we can all fight this together and They listen to what

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I said open it up I signed the document, but one of the things that You hear now in today's

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Nazis. I don't even want to call them neo -nazis. They're just Nazis All right is is this belief that it is their job.

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It is the job of the church to act in vengeance Okay, that doesn't fit the soundtrack that soundtrack does not fit the theme we're working for here

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I appreciate the day after though And way too it was way too happy I mean but the idea then is this is that and so that when so what they want is

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Legitimate like extermination removal stripping of rights and things like this on no basis of Actual justice, but based upon a group identity so for instance they believe that there is a global cabal

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Now Constructed by Jews for the purposes of destroying Western civilization, okay?

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This is the same nonsense that that Hitler bought into and what's funny is is that there's a particular document?

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something about the the learned elder you know the Protocols of the learned elders of Zion is an old document that is now making the rounds again

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Which has been proven to be a fraud a forgery and completely false But it posits this idea that Jews and Freemasons are working to overthrow the world

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Okay, Western civilization and to corrupt it thoroughly. It's complete hogwash and so what the

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Nazis want Notice I'm using that not neo -nazis the Nazis what they want is they want to remove get rid of exterminate the

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Jews and And how many and Mahler this week said we'll get rid of as many as them as is necessary so that Pornography and and usury are never a problem again in our in our society

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Pornography and usury are not the result of the Jews. That's the result of sin Right and so they think it's their job to exact vengeance

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And so if you're not enforcing the death penalty on certain sins and stuff like that This that somehow you are not a true and serious and committed

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Christian to which I point out Do y 'all remember when Cain murdered Abel?

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What did God kill Cain? What did he do?

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He had mercy on that guy He did not exact the death penalty when

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David Knocked up Bathsheba and then murdered her husband

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Did God? Call for David to be executed for that No He did not so when the people seem to think that it's the job of Christians to exact vengeance on evildoers and To do so indiscriminately.

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So we're gonna get rid of we're gonna get rid of Jews according to them We're gonna get rid of anybody who is African. You got to go.

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I wonder if Elon Musk counts Just it's just saying Right, you we're gonna get rid of anybody who's

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African Hispanic Semitic and we're going to and we're going to reestablish America as a white nation what a bunch of garbage satanic nonsense and so you sit there and you go so you're gonna

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Indiscriminately take everybody from these particular groups and saying you're guilty of The sins of the people who have this, you know who happen to have your same skin color just because Right.

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So, you know black people have murdered people therefore all blacks are bad And if you're black you got to go is that justice?

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No, it's it's vengeance and it's not ours as a Country or as a government to exact God's vengeance the

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Nazi Holocaust was vengeance and It was absolutely uncalled for the governments are called by God to punish evildoers which requires them to engage in actual jurisprudence to Legitimately bring charges for there to be of the charges to be established and punishments to be meted out according to the crimes that are committed by the individuals, okay

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Should I be held responsible this that this then by the way gets into the issue of reparations, okay

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Have any of you own slaves? No Okay, has anybody alive today?

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Been a slave in the United States during when when slavery was still a thing

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No Why should I or you be held responsible for the sins that People who are here 150 years ago committed but still aren't alive.

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I might my basic theology is this Reparations sure anybody who's still alive who was a slave at that time will give you reparations

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The end Okay, because here's the deal I'm not responsible for what a bunch of white

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Europeans did in the south especially since Genetically my people didn't get my my group didn't even get here until much later

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Okay. Now granted I was adopted into the Roseboro clan and the Roseboro clan from Kentucky They founded

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Hazard County, Kentucky What they had they had sons who fought on both sides the

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Union and the South but I'm not genetically related to them I was just adopted into that family. And so my question then is what about you know, what about the actual blood

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Roseboro's? should they be required to pay reparations because part of them fought to free the slaves some of them fought to to keep the slaves and You know now so how do you resolve that?

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Who's going to make these decisions and you'll note that they want to make the decision based upon the group?

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without any any Discernment as to who's guilty of doing what and who's should be exempted.

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That's not justice Reparations is a form of racial vengeance and that is not justice and the government's not called to do that right so I'm off topic, but I've got

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Nazism in my brain again It's a you know every now and then I take a whack at him on On X and I do it for a few weeks and then

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I have to back off because it's like the stench of Nazism And Nazis are stupid.

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Oh, they're the dumb Another side note real quick. I'm gonna bunny trail myself.

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So, you know, one of the things I found about these Nazis They all deny the Holocaust Every single one of them.

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They all deny the Holocaust. And so what's their narrative regarding the Holocaust their narrative?

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Is this is that that the the allies so this is going to include the

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Marxist regime in Russia? It's going to include the Brits. It's going to include the Americans the

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Canadians and the Australians that we are all Controlled that every one of our nations is controlled by a

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Jewish like secret government You know Jewish cabal were all controlled by them

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And once the Allies won the war then our Jewish overlords said we need to make the

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Nazis Look bad, and so they concocted the entire Holocaust Okay, so which

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I've I've been to Buchenwald right and I'm was I was a walk in Buchenwald.

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It was horrible it was absolutely a terrible depressing awful place to be and the one thing

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I can say is is that Buchenwald kept all of the artifacts they put on display the

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Meticulous records that the Nazis kept of everybody who was interned in that camp Photographs where they were from all that kind of stuff and they kept track the

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Germans kept track of all of that and you can't make this stuff up if you tried and And so one of the arguments

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I put out yesterday was this is that when you go to the Nuremberg trials? Every one of the

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Nazis who actually worked for the government When they were put on trial, so these are military guys or people who worked in you know in the in the actual

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Nazi inner circles Every one of those guys when they were on trial they didn't sit there and their defense wasn't this what

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Holocaust? There was an all -across. What are you guys talking about? Okay, every single one of them that actually was in the government here was their defense.

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We were only following orders This is well documented

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In fact that particular defense became so famous that now in in legal jurisprudence

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It's called the Nuremberg defense If you and if you were on trial and you said I was just following orders the attorney would say

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Oh, he's using the Nuremberg defense. That's what it's called now Okay, we were only following orders.

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There was only one guy who questioned the veracity of The of the

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Holocaust But this didn't even work out for him and it was the fellow who was in charge of that propaganda rag called their stirmer and That this was this anti -semitic

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Paper that came out and then and it just was calling for the extermination of the Jews and stuff like this and that particular guy

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He's the only one who'd had no official government position And he at the beginning in his defense said that he he didn't believe the reports regarding the death camps in the east

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He didn't believe the reports But then during the trial when they presented him proof that it was

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Hitler who ordered them. He said well, then I believe Fascinating stuff, right?

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So yeah, the fact that we have to deal with Nazism again it from time to time

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I just have to let off some steam because it's really annoying. So my apologies. Okay Okay Let's see

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What's the deal with a song of songs is the next question? Maybe I'm not a poetry guy. But what does the song of songs teach us?

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I've read it a number of times and it just feels like right between profound wisdom and amazing prophecy

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We suddenly have this lyrics from the King of Solomon's favorite rock ballad either by his band Solomon 700 angry wives or possibly

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Night Ranger I think that that's just the best well -written question ever Song of song of Solomon song of songs is a difficult book

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Because it it Ultimately spiritually emphasizes the love of Christ that he has for his bride the church

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But I will say this That throughout Christian history There have only been like three or four periods in the 2 ,000 years since the the ascension of Christ Where the church has really thought it was like amazing the rest of the time that people thought it's kind of creepy

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Best way I can put it and so one of my seminary professors kind of described it this way is that every

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Every nation has a culture all right, and cold and those cultures shift and they change and so our culture is heavily steeped in a very

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Legal mindset I didn't say legalistic but legal mindset where we understand justice and things like this

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And this is part of the Western mindset and so the Western mindset has a very difficult time with the song of songs because it depicts

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The love and mercy of Christ in a way that isn't that way at all. It writes it like it's a romance

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Okay, and we look at this and just sit there and go Okay, that just gagged me with a spoon right all right, but there are other cultures

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That they do not have such a heavy emphasis on the law their cultures embrace beauty and things like this

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I would note that Japan is an example of that in the past When they talk about their different art masters who mastered one of whom mastered light

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One who mastered the waves one who mastered the clouds one who mastered the forest This is how they talk about this.

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And so there's this there's an aesthetic that to their culture oddly enough the song of songs hits really well in cultures like that it doesn't hit well in ours and So, you know, we read it and saying what's going on here, you know, and and I would note there's there's a reason

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Why we haven't done a song of songs Bible study here because I would be really uncomfortable

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Reading certain parts of song songs in public with men and women in the same room.

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They're just Okay, it just the idea is terrifying me to be honest with you

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You know, so you'll know I'm we're not doing the song of songs Bible study anytime soon so yeah, but but that but so that's

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I think the better way to look at it is is that When we look at the gospel itself

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God describes what Christ does for us in Multitudinous ways.

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It's not only penal substitution. It's going to be his it's going to be Christus Victor It's going to be ransom.

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It's going to be setting the captives free. It's going to be It's it there's there's all kinds of different ways in which it's talked about and song of songs

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Hits really well for people who are from a different culture than we are is the best way to put it.

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Okay All right from Gabriel Martin Luther's morning prayer contains the words let your

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Holy Angel be with me. Who is this Holy Angel? I don't know. I don't name him. I don't know the name of your

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Holy Angel. Okay Scripture says that the angels are ministering spirits and they minister and to the elect so we get this is where the idea of guardian angels come into play and What's funny is is that it usually gets reduced down to each individual

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Christian has a guardian angel But that's not how the texts read. It actually kind of describes guardian angels plural for Christians and All I know is that when

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I'm able to finally see them The first thing I'm gonna probably have to do to my angels is apologize and say

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I'm sorry I made it so difficult because I think I frazzle these guys, you know, it's the best way to look at there

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Yes, he does Okay So the idea here is is that in the morning prayer we pray let your

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Holy Angel be with me with the evil foe may have no power over me it is a reference then to the passage that talks about the angels being ministering spirits to the elect and And and and do the idea here is we're asking

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God to you know to protect us and Do so via one of the means by which he is revealed in his word that he does so Okay, do you guys remember?

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Did you? It wasn't in the theaters. It's the movie Greyhound. It was it's on Apple Plus.

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It's Tom Hanks's plays a captain on a Fletcher class class

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Destroyer and it's it's a fascinating thing. And and what's funny is at the beginning and at the end of that Movie you see

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Tom Hanks character He is in his bunk on his ship and Even as even though he's the captain.

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He doesn't have the best of quarters It seems pretty tight and he gets down on his knees and he prays

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Luther's morning prayer And then he prays the Luther's evening prayer and I'm sitting there going that's awesome.

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I've never seen that in cinema So, you know, it is kind of a fascinating thing

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But so you'll note then that as Christians Christ teaches us to pray daily

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To lead us not to temptation Deliver us from the evil one and and then Luther builds on that Let your holy angel be with me that the evil foe may have no power over me

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The idea here is is that yes, God protects us through angels. And so we're we're asking

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God to send them All right, and it could be holy angels plural. I'll let your holy it but do you get the idea?

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Okay? So Gabriel says my pastor didn't know I'm I suspect

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I'm I'm of a few of my Lutheran church If any who use are aware of the small catechism, this is indicative of liberal leaning not yet radical church, and I'm attending.

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Okay. All right Okay, I know he also says in Psalm 34 and 35 it mentions also the angel of the

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Lord careful with that angel the Lord stuff Because oftentimes you're dealing with Christ in the angel of the

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Lord. All right from baggy green How many wills did the incarnate Lord Jesus have?

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Okay, I have to read more of this question Okay I believe that the incarnate

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Lord Jesus has a divine nature and also human nature perfect not fallen but not sinful ie fully

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God and Fully man hypostatic union. I believe that the canonic canonicism is wrong I either canonic heresy which espouses the false notion that the

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Lord Jesus gave up his divinity in Part or in full during his incarnation. I believe the

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Lord Jesus even during his incarnation is one person Ie one of the three persons of the

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Holy Trinity Is it the case that the will of the incarnate Lord Jesus proceeds from his personhood ie?

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Which in which case the incarnate Lord Jesus had only one will or is it in the case that the will of the incarnate?

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Lord Jesus proceeds from his nature's from his nature's ie from his divine nature and from his human nature in Which the incarnate

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Lord Jesus would have two wills his divine nature and his one will while his human nature has a different world

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The answer to the question is that in the Incarnation, Christ does not have two wills, he only has one, okay?

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And the idea is this, is that the way the Church Fathers hammered this out comes back then how the hypostatic union works.

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So over and again, when I teach the basics of the hypostatic union, I pick somebody,

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I'll pick Jeff Kinney. Jeff Kinney, how many of you are there? There's just one of you?

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Okay, Jeff, don't you have a body and a soul? There's two, there's two of you.

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And your wife is going, no, I can only handle one. Okay, no, there's only one of you.

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So the idea then is that a human nature has a body and a soul, and they come together in a hypostasis, and you are one person, okay?

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And so as a result of that, in your personhood, you have one will. Now, you'll note then as fallen human beings and who are

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Christians, then you can say that Christians have kind of a divided wills because there's the will of your sinful flesh and the will of the person you are in Christ.

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But that's not, that's a result of our fall into sin, not the result of how

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God made us. So in the same way then that Jesus Christ, he is the

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God man. He has a divine nature, and he has a human nature, which means he also has a human body and a human soul.

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All right? And they all come together into one hypostasis, and so there is no division of wills.

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It's not like his body is gonna have a will separate from his because he doesn't have a fallen nature.

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Okay? So because he doesn't have a fallen nature, he's not at war in himself like we are as Christians.

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So that's kind of how that works out. So this, they,

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Baggie gives a bunch of verses that absolutely prove that Jesus is God in human flesh, but you get the idea.

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But at the end of the day, Christ only has one will, and his human nature and his divine nature come together in a perfect hypostasis.

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And so it's not like Jesus' body wants to do one thing and the divine nature in Christ wants to do another.

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It's a whole personal union. All right? Let's see here. Okay. Next question from Dorothy Bressler.

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Okay, I have really struggled for a long time with predestination and election. I think I may be getting it.

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Romans 9, it tells about Jacob and Esau that God chose them before any works.

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So if God had waited, as it were, Jacob could boast about his part in being elected by God, and our salvation and election is the same.

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It is our salvation and election. I'm getting close here, or am I way off track? I would note election is a challenging doctrine on any good day.

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Okay? It's a very difficult doctrine to wrap your head around. But the basics of it is the

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Lutherans never talk about election apart from the means of grace. And when we talk about election, we are always sure to make sure what we don't mean as well as what we do mean.

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Because when you talk with the Calvinists, the Calvinists talk about election and they arrive at their doctrines regarding election with a little bit of scripture and a whole lot of logic.

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And the Lutheran sits there and goes, you can't do that, okay? And so when the

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Calvinist talks about election, they will say this. They will say that God elects some for salvation and God elects some for damnation.

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And the Lutheran sits there and goes, it says in scripture, it's not his will that any should perish.

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And that Christ died for the sins of the whole world. And they'll sit there and say, nope, Jesus only died for the elect.

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There's no text that says that. The texts say Jesus died for the sins of the whole world. And so what we do as Lutherans then puts us into a very uncomfortable predicament.

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And the predicament goes like this. Everybody who is saved is truly predestined.

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They are truly elect. And God is the one who's given them faith.

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Everybody who is damned, it's their fault, not God's. And the

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Calvinist sits there and goes, logic, it doesn't work, logic. And we sit there and go, your logic be damned.

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Because we have biblical texts that say this. And so this then, when you talk about election, it always ends up dealing with a theological category called the crux theologorum.

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Crux theologorum is Latin for the theologian's cross. And the question basically, you can kind of boil it down to this.

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Why, when the gospel is preached, do some believe and others don't?

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And the Calvinist says, I got this worked out, man. I got it worked out. Are you ready? Here's the answer. The answer is the reason why some believe is because they're elect to salvation.

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And the reason why others don't believe is because they're elect to damnation. And Lutherans go, no biblical text says that.

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And they'll sit there and go, so what's the answer? The Lutheran says, it's true. Everybody who's saved is elect, and everybody who is damned, it's their own fault.

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The scripture says so. And we have texts that say both those things.

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And so they'll sit there and go, but that's not logical. And we sit there and go, who cares?

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It's biblical, and I don't have to understand it. This is what God has revealed. And so what the

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Lutheran will say when it comes to the crux theologorum, you can't answer the question because God hasn't revealed the answer.

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If God wanted us to know the answer to that question, he would have revealed it in scripture. And to go beyond scripture puts you in a really bad spot because here's the thing.

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The Calvinist sits there and go, logic demands this. And then you talk to the Calvinist who've left Calvinism who've come into the

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Lutheran church, and you say, why did you leave Calvinism? Answer, because I could never tell if I was of the elect or not.

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Ah. So that little knife cut two different directions, didn't it?

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Yeah, yeah. So we can sing God's own child, I gladly say it.

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I am baptized into Christ. The Calvinist can't sing that. They have to sit there and go, I hope

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I'm of the elect. I hope I'm of the elect. I hope, I hope, I think I am. Maybe.

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Right? Right? That's a problem. They can't sing some of our hymns. In fact,

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I'll be blunt. I've never heard a Reformed guy preach on the epistle text that I preached on today and say, y 'all are predestined.

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You're not predestined for wrath, you're predestined for God's grace and glory and eternal life. Calvinists can't do that because they can't say with certainty that everybody listening to them is of the elect, okay?

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So the idea then is that everybody who's saved is elect, for sure, and we always talk about it via the means of grace.

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God does his electing through the preached gospel, through the waters of baptism, and the rest of it, we just can't figure the rest out because it's not revealed in scripture.

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All right, that's where we're gonna end today, and I'll give this back to you, Barb, and we're gonna continue with Anonymous next time in a month.