September 17, 2018 Show with Dr. Robert W. Carter on “Creation & the Authority of the Bible”

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Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

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Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron, a radio platform on which pastors,

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Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

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Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.

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Matthew Henry said that in this passage, quote, we are cautioned to take heed whom we converse with and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

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It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.

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Now here's our host, Chris Arnton. Good afternoon,

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Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth, who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

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This is Chris Arnton, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Monday the 17th day of September 2018.

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I'm delighted to not only have a first -time guest today here on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, but I'm also delighted to have a returning co -host who's also been a guest himself.

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First, I'd like to let you know that we have Dr. Robert W. Carter on the program for the first time.

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He is a senior scientist and speaker for Creation Ministries International, also known as CMI USA in Atlanta, Georgia, and he is researching human genetics and other issues related to Biblical creation.

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Today he is addressing creation and the authority of the Bible, and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time ever to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Dr.

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Robert W. Carter. Well, thank you. It's a privilege to be here. And we have returning as a co -host, someone who is no stranger to the

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Iron Sharpens Iron Radio audience. He has also been a guest on a number of occasions, going way back to the old program broadcasting out of Long Island, New York from WNYG and WGBB radio.

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I'm speaking of Pastor Bruce Bennett, who is the pastor of Word of Truth Church in Farmingville, Long Island, New York, and he is my co -host today, and he's also the host of an upcoming conference that's being held this weekend at the

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Word of Truth Church in Farmingville, Long Island, New York, featuring our guest today, Dr. Robert W. Carter, and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Pastor Bruce Bennett.

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Oh, Chris, always a pleasure. Thanks for having me. And before we go back to Dr. Carter, Pastor Bruce, why don't you tell our listeners something about Word of Truth Church in Farmingville, Long Island.

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We're a non -denominational reform spiritual church that was organized in 2009.

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We're the last of four church clans that were sent out of Grace Gospel Church in Hatshop, and we are endeavoring to bring the gospel of grace to the folks in the

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Farmingville, Ronkonkoma, Central Suffolk County area. So if anybody's interested in learning more, they can see us at watch .com.

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WOTchurch .com is the website. I just had to repeat that because you broke up a little bit there.

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I'm not sure why, but WOTchurch .com, and WOT stands for Word of Truth, and we'll be repeating that,

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God willing, a little later. Now, Dr. Carter, tell us something about Creation Ministries International.

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We have had at least one of your team members on the program before, all the way from Australia.

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We had Taz Walker on. Actually, he was on for two days in a row in a discussion -slash -debate with an old -earth creationist.

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But tell us about Creation Ministries International. Oh boy, where to start?

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Well, you already mentioned Australia. We are an international organization. We have offices in seven different countries and probably about 30 speakers who are traveling the world every year, speaking at different churches.

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In fact, we'll probably visit 1 ,200 or 1 ,300 churches this year alone. Wow. Well, and I know that one of those churches is

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Word of Truth Church, so I'm looking forward to that. God willing, I will be there. I have another important, a lot less pleasant task to attend to on Long Island that weekend, this weekend, as a matter of fact.

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But hopefully, I will be able to leave that early enough to be there at Word of Truth Church, planning on it and praying for that opportunity, and I would love to meet you in person.

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Well, very often on Iron Trip and Zion Radio, most of the time when we have a first -time guest,

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Dr. Carter, we have that guest give a summary of their salvation testimony. What kind of religious atmosphere, if any, you were raised in, and what were the circumstances that our

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Sovereign Lord providentially brought up in your life that drew you to Himself and eventually saved you?

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Wow. Well, I tell you, I was raised in a Christian home in Long Island. Oh, wow.

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I didn't know that. Oh, yeah. I was born in Patauket. Oh, wow. That's very close to where the debate, I mean, the conference is.

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Yeah. I grew up in Hampton Bays, though, and we went to church all my life, but I didn't know anything, and I thought

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I believed it, but I really didn't understand anything, and I was about a thousand miles away from home.

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I met this girl that I liked in college, and so I started going to her church, and her uncle was a preacher. You know how many salvation stories start with, there was this girl?

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That's right. She's still a good friend of mine, too, and I thanked her for this. But after about three months of going there, literally, it was like someone snapped her fingers and said, wake up.

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I said, oh, that's what it all means, and boom. It's like salvation flooded into my mind and my heart in a way that I had no idea of before.

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It was really profound. Well, where were you in your life when you finally absolutely fell to your knees and said,

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Lord, I need a Savior. Please save me. I am headed for hell. I need to be rescued. And you put your total faith in the person and work of Jesus Christ through your salvation.

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Well, I was 19 years old, and I was in Georgia. I went from Long Island, I went to Georgia Tech.

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And so there, from there, you obviously started to become interested in science.

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I don't know if that was actually before you got saved, but tell us about the whole journey in your life where you became a scientist for Christian Ministries International.

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Yeah, I've always been a bit of a nerd. Growing up, I always liked science and math, and I ended up at an engineering college studying biology.

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And I just fell in love with the whole field, but I didn't believe

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Genesis. I thought the Earth was millions of years old. I assumed evolution was true. I defended evolution to people.

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I had no idea that I was going to be in a position later in life where I was actually working for a big ministry that argues against evolution.

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But it took years. It took lots of work, lots of struggle, lots of questioning, ebbs and flows.

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I was probably about 28 or 29 years old when I finally said, okay, that's it.

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This is what the Bible says, and I actually do believe, and I have enough information here. I'm just going to trust

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God for the rest of the details. And how did you actually physically start working for Creation Ministries International?

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Sorry, folks, I made a little error before I said Christian Ministries International. I meant to say Creation. But how did you get a hold of them, or how did they get a hold of you, and how did that partnership begin?

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Well, I'd moved back to Atlanta after graduate school in Miami, and I was just online.

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I was cruising around, looking at some creation stuff. I said, wait a minute, this is Creation Ministries International. All their faces,

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I said, I know all these people. There's Taz Walker on the list and a lot of other people that I knew. I said, oh, they have an office in Atlanta?

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How come I didn't know about that? Well, they didn't. They had a PO box in Atlanta. They were setting up a new office in Atlanta, and I sent them an email, and it went to Australia.

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And I got a phone call at nine o 'clock the next night, which was eight o 'clock in their morning, and they wanted to talk to me.

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So I was actually the first person they hired from the outside for their new U .S. office. Wow, praise

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God. Unbelievable. Just, yeah, total, completely, I could never have predicted the circumstances, but God engineered it to work it out, so I was in the right place at the right time to get the perfect job for me.

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So tell us specifically on what you are researching in regard to human genetics and other issues related to Biblical creation over there at CMI.

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Okay. My specialty is in genetics. I don't do

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DNA extraction and DNA sequencing anymore. I did that in my graduate work. In fact,

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I did genetic engineering in my graduate work, too. But since then, basically, as long as I have a computer,

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I have access to government databases, and what I do is I write computer programs, and I pull data from them, and I analyze the data to see what it can tell me about how old the

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Earth is, how old humanity is, did we really come from Adam and Eve, was there a thing called the

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Tower of Babel event, and questions like that. And it's actually really amazing, because the evolutionary community has discovered

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Adam and Eve, Noah's Flood, and the Tower of Babel, and it's in the human genome, if you know where to look.

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The evolutionary community has discovered this. Are they remaining silent about their discovery?

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Yes, and when they do run up against the obvious implications, they tend to muddle the terms a little bit.

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Like, they came up with this idea called Mitochondrial Eve 20 or 30 years ago.

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But oh no, that's not the Biblical Eve, that's some random woman who lived, you know, a couple hundred thousand years ago amongst a big population.

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She just happened to be the only woman who passed on her DNA to everyone else after that. Everyone else just kind of went extinct.

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But the alternate is, no, there really was only one woman, and the reason no one else left any

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DNA is because they never existed in the first place. Now, in summary form, how do you connect genetics to any kind of proof for these phenomenal history -making events that you listed, that are actually historical events from the

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Holy Scriptures, like Noah's Ark, etc.? Yeah, that's hard, because in science there's nothing called proof.

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You can only build a case for something. And some cases are weak and some are strong. So you can't, because we can't go back in time, we cannot actually absolutely 100 % know these things happened, but we can look for evidence for these things.

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And the evidence is in, like, when you look at all the people across the world, there are about 10 million letters in their genomes that differ from one person to the next.

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But all those 10 million letters are found everywhere. Like, you have about three million places where the

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DNA you got from your mother disagrees with the DNA you got from your father. So you have about one -third of the world's genetic diversity within just you.

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Take about five or six people and you've got about 99 % of the world's genetic diversity, it doesn't matter what race you're pulling from.

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Wow. And that's amazing, because it shows us that we came from a single population a short time ago.

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And it's very hard to find a difference between, like, Africans and Europeans or Europeans and Asians.

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It's very difficult to find differences. And those differences arose after we spread out.

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But because we share so much in common, clearly we came from one population. And that is a parallel to the biblical story of everyone was in one population before the

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Tower of Babel event, and then we spread out. And the direct implication there, if that happened, we would expect people across the world to be very similar to one another.

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And we are. Wow. I just want to remind our listeners that if you'd like to join us on the air with your own question for Dr.

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Robert W. Carter, our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com. C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

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And please give us, as always, your first name, your city and state, and your country of residence, if you live outside the

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USA. Please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

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And the only way I could conceive of a personal and private question being relative to what we're talking about is if, perhaps, you disagree with your own pastor.

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Perhaps your own pastor is a brother in Christ, but he is an old earth creationist.

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Or perhaps you have a more liberal pastor or church that adheres to full -blown evolution and denies the

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Genesis account of the origins of man and the origins of everything, for that matter.

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Or perhaps you disagree with your spouse on these issues, or some other reason why the question would be personal and private.

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Other than that, though, please at least give me your first name, city and state, and country of residence.

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And, Pastor Bruce Bennett, keep in mind that being a co -host on the phone, you're going to have to be counter -intuitive in regards to rudeness.

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You're going to have to realize that you could barge in with a question. I can't see you waving your hand or facial expressions or body postures or anything like that.

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So, whenever you feel there is an opening, if you have a question, just ask it. Don't worry about being rude or anything like that.

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Of course, try not to just interrupt mid -sentence, but other than that. But, Pastor Bruce, I know that you are an apologist yourself.

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You have personally been involved in a number of debates, I think predominantly, if not exclusively, on Long Island.

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You're a school teacher in a public school. Tell us about why specifically you orchestrated this conference that you're having.

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Well, for one thing, Chris, I grew up as a card -carrying evolutionist. My dad was a science teacher, a public school science teacher, and I became a

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Christian when I was eight years old. I honestly had a real, real hard time my first few years reconciling

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Genesis to the reality of what happened in my life. So, it placed me in an area of questioning and study where I went on a real, real in -depth study, a self -study, you know, for this whole question of origins.

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And after assembling over a hundred books on the topic, and I don't know how many videos and conferences, etc.,

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I'm thoroughly convinced of the younger model of origins, as Genesis clearly teaches.

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So, I actually did my master's thesis on the creation versus evolution debate, and when

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I graduated from SUNY Stony Brook, that was my thesis. So, it's something that I really can hold near and dear to me because God used creation to initially, you know, reveal

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Himself to me. I was raised in a nominal Roman Catholic family, and, you know, the head knowledge of God that I had was grossly incomplete, but I knew that God was real because of creation.

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And consistently, God has encouraged me, refreshed me, and reminded me of His power through creation, as Genesis teaches.

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And Jesus is that creator. So, it's a topic that's near and dear to my heart. It's an apologetic topic that is absolutely critical in today's society where, you know, the public schools and the popular media teach it as fact, unmitigated fact, and we have to politely, lovingly, gently encourage folks to consider the actual evidence and to see that the

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Scripture should be, first of all, the primary evidence, the Bible itself, and after that, we have, in fact, empirical evidence to support the biblical claims.

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So, I'm very passionate. I'm hoping that Dr. Carter is going to be with us, and we're hoping that we have a good turnout in the conference so that many people can be touched with the truths of biblical creation.

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Great. Well, if you don't have a question of your own yet for Dr. Carter, we do have a listener question.

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Do you have a question, or should I move forward to a listener question? Bruce, I'm speaking.

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I'm just wondering, Dr. Carter, if you could tell us how you came into the, you know, apologetics ministry of CMI in terms of, you know, your calling to it, and how that all came about.

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Well, I was a high school teacher myself. I was teaching at a big private school in Georgia, and I decided that I wanted to get a doctorate so that I could have some letters after my name, so maybe some doors could open.

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My ultimate goal, actually, was to be a professor at a college, some, you know, small

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Christian college out in the country, because I like the country, but I never got there. I got into a degree program that I didn't really apply to, but I had visited the school, and the person they had offered this to,

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I turned it down the last second, so they called me up in desperation and said, hey, do you want this full -ride Ph .D. fellowship?

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I said, what? So even though I was a second choice,

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I said, okay, I'll take it, and so my Ph .D. was paid for, and when

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I got done, I mean, what could I do with that? I mean, it wasn't my degree. God gave it to me. He didn't have to do that.

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I said, okay, what can I do with this? And so when CMI showed up on the radar, I jumped at it, and unbelievably, they hired me, and I've been working with these people for, oh, 12 or 13 years now, loving it.

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That's great. Praise God. Yeah, praise God. We do have BB in Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, who says, this question is actually for both your guest and your co -host.

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I would love to hear how both of you would have responded directly to Andy Stanley who was challenging

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Christians to unhitch the Old Testament from Christianity.

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Who's first? Dr. Carter, why don't you start? All right, Andy Stanley is a very popular pastor and preacher here in the

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Atlanta area. He's the son of Charles Stanley, who's even more popular and famous in this region, and he has sadly come out with some troubling statements about the relationship between what

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Christians believe and what the Bible teaches. If you go to creation .com

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and type in Andy Stanley in the search engine, you'll come up with an article that specifically addresses the question.

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Our contention is that, no, you cannot just jettison specifically the

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Old Testament, because, you know, first of all, it was our schoolmaster leading us to understanding of Christ.

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But also, the history there is what everything in the New Testament is based upon.

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I mean, if Jesus or one of the apostles talks about Abraham or Noah or Adam, there has to be a historical figure, because they're treating this person as if he really existed, and as if this person is really important in history, and that the fact that this person's existence and the facts of the story are being used to make a spiritual point, a very important theological point, if that stuff is not real, then a huge portion of what we think about Christianity also might not be real.

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So it's a big problematic statement. And Pastor Bruce? Yes, in addition to what

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Dr. Carter just said, you know, Andy Stanley's dialogue here starts with this dispensationalism where he separates, you know, covenants in an unfortunate manner.

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You know, there's basically two covenants in Scripture, the covenant of works and covenant of grace. And the covenant of grace was revealed initially in the

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Old Covenant in an incomplete way, and then in the New Covenant or the New Testament in a complete way.

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But they're intertwined, and they're unbreakable. You know, we have the partial grace in the

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Old Testament, fullness of grace in the New, and Jesus is actually called the second Adam or the last Adam, as Paul refers to him.

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So, you know, the moral law that the Old Covenant proclaims is still binding on believers today. And the essence of the revelation of who

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God is in his character, of course, is very, very needed to instruct us as believers today that we find in the

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Old Testament as well. So it's very unfortunate what he's done. And of course, Genesis, being the absolute foundation, you know, even the footing of the foundation, it's the super foundation, if you will.

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If you negotiate, you know, Genesis 1 through 6, you know, the creation, the fall, the flood, you really dispatch the heart and the core of biblical history and really the very foundation of the gospel that man in Adam has sent as a race.

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So, you know, we end up with all kinds of real, real serious problems if we're going to negotiate the historicity, the validity of the book of Genesis.

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And for that matter, you know, the moral teaching of the Old Testament as a valid word of God. Well, thank you,

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B .B., for the excellent question. Keep listening to Iron Sherpa and Zion Radio. We have C .J. in Lindenhurst, Long Island, New York.

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And C .J. says, I'm a believer and I'm even a young earth creationist, but I was just curious how you two would answer this question to either the evolutionist or the person who's indifferent and really doesn't care about the matter one way or another.

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They may say that whether one believes in evolution or not doesn't really have any effect on the gospel and on what the important things in the

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New Covenant that are commanded of us. If we have a theory about evolution that is

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Darwinian, even if it's very wrong, it's really not going to affect our Christian life or our status before God.

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How do you respond to people such as these? C .J.

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Well, we start off with a very simple account in the book of Genesis that where it definitely and very clearly claims that there was no death or suffering prior to Adam's rebellion against God.

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That is a historical statement and it's very clear. If evolution is true, then death and suffering have been in the world since the very beginning.

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This death and suffering that came in through the first Adam is answered by the last

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Adam. The man Jesus Christ came and he died on the cross to pay the penalty, which is death, the penalty of rebellion, the penalty of sin against God is death.

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But if death is in the world for billions of years, then Adam's death was a foregone conclusion because he was just a human being.

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He would have died anyway. And this whole gospel story of death being removed gets really muddy and very difficult.

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In fact, it gets almost, I believe, impossible to explain unless Adam was a real figure and death did not produce people over billions of years.

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C .J. And Pastor Bruce, the question seemed to be for both of you again. B .B.

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Yeah, again, not to take away from Dr. Carter's answer, but just to add to it, the book of 1

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Corinthians 15 deals with this whole question of the second Adam and the resurrection.

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And again, it appeals to an actual fall, appeals to an actual mass rebellion as represented in Adam that the whole human race, you know, sinned in Adam.

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Romans 5, in addition to 1 Corinthians 15, proves that. And if you dispatch a literal

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Adam from a literal creative event that God actually made him innocent in an era where there was no death and there was no sin, there was no suffering.

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And then the book of Romans in particular, and as you see it completed there in 1 Corinthians 15 with this continuity from the first Adam to the second one, is severely negotiated.

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And you just can't drive any compromise with the gospel when it comes to the creation statement of Scripture.

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If creation is not true, then the gospel is not true. You simply can't separate the two. Now, a question for both of you, for myself.

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Christians, I'm sure that both of you know, having spoken with no doubt thousands of them, thousands of our brethren in Christ, who we truly are confident are saved,

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Christians say at some times, say and believe the stupidest things.

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They believe sometimes very moronic things, things that like startle you when you hear them come out of their mouths.

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I'm assuming that you too would believe that there are truly regenerate, born -again

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Christians who out of ignorance believe in evolution in some way, shape, or form. And that they're not damned because they believe in evolution, but at the same time,

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I think that God holds a greater accountability for those who are actually enthusiastic evangelists, for lack of a better term, for the case of evolution.

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People who are trying to cast a suspicion, a cloud of suspicion over the

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Genesis account, over the inerrancy of Scripture and so on. I consider those people in one category, just as I believe

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Paul did with the Judaizers, he seemed to be very clear that he put the

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Judaizers who had a false gospel, who were teaching a false gospel and deceiving others, in a far greater category of apostasy than he did with the average

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Christian in the Church of Galatia, because he even calls the Galatians brothers. So, but going back to the evolution issue, don't you believe that there are going to be many

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Christians who are going to be in heaven who are very wrong on that issue? You know, just last week we had a front page article on creation .com,

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and the title was, Is Creation a Salvation Issue? And the short answer is, no.

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The requirements for getting into heaven are very short. Believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is the

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Son of God, that he died for your sins, and that he rose again. That's basically it. It's really simple.

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You might, you know, nuance that a little bit, or maybe tweak it here and there, but the requirements to be called a

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Christian is not a very long list, and the age of the earth is not part of that. However, when we're talking about the perspicuity or the understandability of the

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Bible, when we're talking about how we understand why we're fallen and why we're in need of salvation, when we're looking at what all of the scholars prior to Charles Darwin believed, you know, 1800 years of Christian history, and things like that, we realize that the account of creation is a very important theological proposition that underlies so much other things that we believe.

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So, granted, it's not something that's going to get you into heaven or keep you from heaven, but there's a lot of very important stepping stones along the path that lead towards heaven that deal with creation.

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Anything to add, Pastor Bruce? Yes, again, another excellent response by Dr.

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Fardai, so I want to take away from it. The only thing I would add is just simply that when we see

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Romans 10, 9, and 10, for example, if you confess that, you know, Jesus is Lord, what does

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Lordship actually mean in a biblical sense? It's, well, first and foremost, that He's Creator.

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Evolution, again, and there's many different shades of it, and I, again, agree totally with Dr.

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Fardai, but I would say if somebody honestly believes in naturalism, that chance that random molecular collisions can somehow make a tree, can make a rosebush, can make a human eye, can make even a paramecium, it's suggesting, on some level at least, that there's not a true realization or acceptance of Jesus' Lordship as the

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Creator. Colossians 1 tells us that Jesus is the Creator of all things. Every atom, every subatomic particle is made by Jesus and under His complete

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Lordship, and if it's not, then He's not Lord at all. The old saying goes, if He's not Lord of all,

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He's not Lord at all. So I would just simply challenge the person, not questioning their salvation necessarily, but I would draw me to another question is, do you really believe that Jesus Christ is the

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Creator? You say He's Lord, but do you realize that calling Him Lord means that there's not a random molecule or atom in the universe because He's the

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Creator? Because only the Creator can properly control creation. So if this is not creation, then what is it?

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Now, where do you draw the line? So I wouldn't doubt their salvation necessarily, but it would raise that question, and depending upon how they answer it, it would lead me then to the possibility of raising a question of their salvation.

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These issues take usually a very long time to work through, and sometimes a believer can have something in his head that's not right that they don't even know is not right yet.

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That's happened to me many times. Like, I even wrote an article for creation .com about 10 years ago, and it got reviewed by an anonymous reviewer, and he said, who is this guy?

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He's talking like an evolutionist. And I looked at the paper, and I was like, wow, he's right. This thing in my mind that I hadn't worked through yet, and it was actually incorrect, and I didn't realize until he made that comment, and I looked very carefully about what

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I was trying to say. So we're all in a process here. It's like, you know, there's a big conveyor belt of life, and God saves you and puts you on the conveyor belt and says, okay,

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I'll see you at the end, figure everything out. And that process of figuring things out, some things are quick.

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Some things we struggle with. Some things take a long time to convince our thick heads that maybe we weren't right in the first place.

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So I tried to give grace to people. I know how long it took me. I know I struggled with this, and it wasn't instantaneous.

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Even years later after I said, okay, yeah, Earth's not millions of years old, and Jesus is the creator, and God created this world.

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Evolution is not true. I even struggled falling backwards into the evolutionary position several times before I said, no.

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You've got to take a deep breath, say, no, it's not true, and then proceed to figure out why. It's not easy.

33:48

Amen. And just because something is not going to bar somebody from heaven, it is serious enough very often, like these issues that we're discussing, that it could morph into something and perpetually become something that does bar somebody from heaven as far as,

34:07

I mean, heresies seem to beget heresies, and they just multiply until you're eventually not even believing in the

34:14

God of the scriptures. So that is not any kind of reassurance that there will be evolutionists in heaven should not be taken as a license or a liberty or a freedom to believe in these things and spread these things, because they can have dangerous consequences.

34:33

But we are going to our first break right now. If anybody would like to join us on the air, if anybody else would like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

34:46

chrisarnson at gmail .com. Please give us your first name, at least your city and state, and your country of residence

34:51

If you live outside the USA, don't go away. God willing, we'll be right back after these messages from our sponsors.

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Hello, my name is James Renahan, and I'm the president of IRVS Theological Seminary in Mansfield, Texas.

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Master of Divinity degree. This is IRVS Theological Seminary. We believe that the scriptures of Old and New Testaments are the inspired and inerrant

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Word of God, that Jesus Christ is God in the flesh who came to save sinners by his life, death, and resurrection, and that the task of the church is to honor and serve the

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Triune God in all things. IRVS Theological Seminary is dedicated by God's grace to preparing godly ministers who will be committed to these doctrines.

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37:58

Hi, Phil Johnson here.

38:06

I'm executive director of John MacArthur's media ministry, Grace to You, and I'm also an occasional guest on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

38:14

So I'm delighted that my friend Chris Arnzen and I will be heading down to Atlanta for the

38:20

G3 conference, where I'll be joining James White, Steve Lawson, Vodie Baucom, Mark Dever, Conrad Mbewe, Todd Friel, Josh Bice, and a host of other speakers to address the topic of biblical understanding of missions.

38:35

Chris Arnzen and I hope to see you all at this very important conference from January 17th through the 19th.

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Make sure you stop by the Iron Sharpens Iron exhibitors booth to say hi to Chris. For more details, go to g3conference .com.

38:51

That's g3conference .com. See you there. Chris Arnzen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio here.

39:06

I want to tell you about a man I have personally known for many years. His name is Dan Buttafuoco.

39:12

Dan is a personal injury and medical malpractice lawyer, but not the type that typically comes to mind.

39:18

Dan cares about people and is a theologian himself. Recently he wrote a book titled

39:23

Consider the Evidence for the Bible. Ravi Zacharias wrote the foreword.

39:29

Dan also has a master's degree in theology. Dan handles serious injury and medical malpractice cases in all 50 states.

39:37

He represents many Christians in serious injury matters all over the country. Dan is an exceptional trial lawyer.

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He wrote the test for the National Board of Trial Advocacy, and currently his firm has over 100 cases that have settled for $1 million or more, and in approximately 10 different states.

39:58

In Illinois, his lawyers had the fourth largest settlement in the state's history. In New York, his case involving a paralyzed police officer made the front page of the

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Law Journal. If you have a serious personal injury or medical malpractice claim in any state,

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I recommend that you call Dan. Consultations are free. There is no fee unless you win.

40:21

Dan Buttafuoco's number is 1 -800 -669 -4878. 1 -800 -669 -4878.

40:29

Or email me for Dan's contact information at chrisarnson at gmail .com.

40:35

That's chrisarnson at gmail .com. My name is

40:43

Steve Lawson, founder and president of One Passion Ministries, as well as teaching fellow for Ligonier Ministries.

40:49

I serve as professor of preaching and oversee the Doctor of Ministry program at the Master's Seminary in Los Angeles.

40:55

I would like to recommend the church where one of my preaching students, Andy Woodard, serves as the pastor.

41:01

It's called New Covenant Church, NYC. They are a Reformed Baptist church that meets in Midtown Manhattan.

41:08

You can find their service times and location on their website, which is www .ncc .nyc.

41:16

They believe in a sovereign God who commands all men everywhere to repent and believe the gospel.

41:22

If you're looking for a church that believes in expository preaching, which is simply biblical preaching, in New York City, I'd like to recommend that you visit

41:32

New Covenant Church, NYC. Again, their information can be found at www .ncc

41:39

.nyc. Have a great day. Hi, Phil Johnson here.

41:51

I'm executive director of John MacArthur's Media Ministry, Grace to You, and I'm also an occasional guest on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

41:59

So, I'm delighted that from January 17th through the 19th, my friend Chris Arnzen and I will be heading down to Atlanta for the

42:08

G3 Conference, where I'll be joining James White, Steve Lawson, Votie Baucom, Mark Dever, Conrad Mbewe, Todd Friel, Josh Bice, and a host of other speakers to address the topic,

42:21

A Biblical Understanding of Missions. Chris Arnzen and I hope to see you all at this very important conference.

42:28

Make sure you stop by the Iron Sharpens Iron exhibitors booth to say hi to Chris. For more details, go to g3conference .com.

42:36

That's g3conference .com. See you there. Transcription by CastingWords Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

43:45

And please continue to pray for Mike Gaydosh, the founder of Solid Ground Christian Books. He is back home from the hospital after a very serious, very dangerous, and complicated open heart surgery.

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He is recovering, but still needs your prayers because he is not out of the He's got about five more weeks of recovery expected before he is back to normal,

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God willing. So please pray that he is restored to fullness of health and strength and vitality, and that he is not only a stronger man physically as a result of this surgery, but that he is a stronger man spiritually than he has been ever before as a result of this trial that our loving and merciful and patient and gracious God has placed him in.

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And we thank Mike Gaydosh of Solid Ground Christian Books for being such a valuable friend to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and to me personally.

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Solid -Ground -Books .com. Now we are back to our guest,

45:15

Dr. Robert W. Carter of Creation Ministries International, CMI USA, and also our co -host today,

45:24

Pastor Bruce Bennett of the Word of Truth Church in Farmingville, Long Island, who is the host of a conference this weekend hosted,

45:33

I'm sorry, where the guest speaker is Dr. Robert W. Carter. And we will continue to give you information on how you can attend that conference at the

45:42

Word of Truth Church, which is, the website is WOTChurch .com.

45:50

WOTChurch .com. And we look forward to seeing you there. By the way, before I return to our guests,

45:57

I forgot to mention our new sponsor on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, the Bible Fellowship Church, the

46:05

Grace Bible Fellowship Church of Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. They are having a conference on Saturday, October 6th, and Sunday, October 7th, featuring author, pastor, and conference speaker

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Mike Ebengroff, who's also been a guest a number of times on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. The theme of the conference at Grace Bible Fellowship Church of Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, is

46:30

Why the Reformation Still Matters. And the Saturday sessions are at 1 o 'clock, 3 .20,

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and 4 .35. And the Sunday sessions, October 7th, are at 9 .15

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a .m., 10 .30 a .m., and at 6 .30

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p .m. And for more details on this conference, go to GraceBFC .com.

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That's GraceBFC, which stands for BibleFellowshipChurch .com, GraceBFC .com.

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And you can also call them at 717 -652 -5229, 717 -652 -5229.

47:11

And we thank the folks at the Grace Bible Fellowship Church of Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, for joining the

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Iron Sharpens Iron Radio family of advertisers and supporters. And God willing,

47:23

I will be there for those events. Now we are back with our guest,

47:29

Dr. Robert W. Carter, and our co -host pastor, Bruce Bennett. If you would like to join us on the air with a question of your own in regard to creation and the authority of the

47:39

Bible, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

47:44

We have, let's see, we have Joey in Clifton, New Jersey, who says,

47:52

Dr. Robert, I ask this question as a young earth creationist. I have heard arguments on two sides from the secular evolution community.

48:03

One side seems to favor common single ancestry of life and mankind because of what they perceive to be the extreme unlikelihood of evolution happening in multiple places independently.

48:16

Yet others seem to have moved forward toward favoring the idea that evolution has occurred separately in different places and populations.

48:25

I believe some of this is genetics driven. Can you comment on where that trend stands and why and where the mainstream lies?

48:35

And what do you think is driving them? That's a long question.

48:42

That's a series of questions, actually. Yeah, I'm a little confused about the terminology. Evolution happening in more than one place simultaneously,

48:53

I'm not sure what the definition here of evolution is. Well, I assume what he's saying is that instead of one couple of apes who have mated or primates that were not human, having a human offspring, that this was happening all over the world sporadically.

49:14

Okay, okay, so this is the out of Africa theory versus the multi -regional hypothesis, if I can use bigger words, if that's what the question is.

49:25

Since the 1980s, we've been taught, and people have been whacking us over the head with this for a long time, that we evolved from an ape -like population in Africa and homo sapiens started about 200 ,000 years ago in Africa and on and on and on.

49:41

But there's a lot of new arguments from the evolutionary community saying, no, that's not true.

49:47

We are a much more pan -myctic population around the world and we evolved from homo erectus over time as a large population, not a small population in Africa, if that's what the question is.

50:00

Now, of course, I disagree with that, but just over the last couple of years, they have discovered a modern human in North Africa that predates the supposed evolution of humans.

50:15

They've discovered teeth in, I think it was Greece, that were modern human teeth that predate this.

50:23

We have tools and artifacts and a skull in Israel. They keep on discovering what appear to be modern humans in an evolutionary dating frame that predates the supposed evolution of modern humans.

50:38

And so most people have been forced to conclude that, oh, this out of Africa thing, that's what we used to think. But now really, before that, modern humans must have lived in different places of the world.

50:51

Okay, Joey, thank you. And if I or Dr. Carter misunderstood your question, you can feel free to send a follow -up email that further clarifies what you meant.

51:01

I have a feeling we understood you correctly. I don't know if you answered this,

51:07

I don't think you did. He said, can you comment on where that trend, meaning the genetics -driven trend where there were multiple cases of primates, non -human primates giving birth to humans globally, where that trend stands and why and where the mainstream lies?

51:30

I mean, is that a mainstream view or is it more the one parent of apes view?

51:36

Well, it's really interesting because there's a huge change happening right now in evolutionary science.

51:42

And what they've been telling us for decades, they're saying that's not true. And so their biggest argument against the biblical

51:50

Adam and Eve is actually not true, according to most evolutionists today. But the arguments are not coming from genetics so much as they're coming from archaeology.

52:01

And the archaeologists and the geneticists have, and the paleontologists and the geneticists, they've been fighting for many years because when genetics comes up, it starts challenging the bone, challenging the artifacts.

52:14

Like, you can say whatever you want about evolution, but wait, the data behind it, the DNA here is not saying that your story is true, it's a different story.

52:24

And now things are turning around and the geneticists are on the back foot because the archaeologists are pulling up all this information saying that that Africa story is not true.

52:32

So my biblical answer to that is that, yeah, we did actually come from a single population, but that population wasn't in Africa, it was in the

52:40

Middle East around the Tower of Babel. And modern humans today do not necessarily look like our ancient forebears.

52:49

The oldest people in the fossil record are Homo erectus, and they don't quite look like the modern humans.

52:56

They've got these huge, tall foreheads and got a big chin. Well, Homo erectus didn't really have much of a forehead and they didn't have much of a chin either.

53:04

And they were definitely, their bones are thicker, their teeth are stronger, and they're bigger and stronger people, but they're shaped differently.

53:14

And so when you lump Homo erectus and Homo neanderthalensis into humanity, you realize that people in the past are more diverse than they are today, but we all did come from a single source population.

53:30

So basically what you're saying is that we have to be careful with our terminology,

53:35

I'm assuming, that we are not saying as young earth creationists that humans did not evolve into different physical descriptions of humans.

53:52

We're just saying that they didn't evolve from a different species or a different animal life form.

53:58

Yeah, yeah. I fully believe that species change over time.

54:04

This is absolutely true. And given thousands of years of human history, why would we expect people to be exactly the same now as they were thousands of years ago?

54:13

Right. Some people survive better than others. And you know what, they're going to pass on their genes over the other people. And that's going to change the genetic landscape.

54:20

And it's going to change the way people look over time. Yeah, it's not really controversial, but it's not evolution either.

54:26

Well, I mean, we use the term evolve in different ways in the English language that have to involve

54:33

Darwinian concepts. But it's interesting that even,

54:40

I live in Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's a very historic area. Some of the homes and buildings date back to the 1700s and earlier.

54:49

And sometimes when you see these buildings that go back that far to the 1700s, the doorways are extremely small.

54:55

And it's interesting that I'm assuming that people typically were just shorter and narrower, thinner than they are today as far as a typical or average person.

55:09

And that's just a couple of hundred years. Yeah, but that's also almost all nutrition. Huh, really?

55:15

In the late 1700s, people were noticing how tall the Irish were. They're a good inch taller than the average

55:22

Belgian. Really? Because of nutrition, they had a lot of carbohydrates called potatoes.

55:29

Today, the tallest people on earth are the Dutch. Even taller than the

55:34

Norwegians and Scandinavians? Yeah, yeah. But even the Norwegians and Scandinavians, they have grown taller over the last hundred years.

55:43

That's not genetics. It's nutrition. We are better fed than we used to be. Therefore, we grow better.

55:50

Huh, interesting. And that much changed. You think about the difference between humans and chimpanzees or the common ancestor between humans and chimpanzees supposedly living millions of years ago.

56:01

That animal might have been three feet tall. I'm just picking a number here.

56:06

And so over the supposed six million years, this animal would have morphed into about a six foot tall human.

56:13

So it had about a double in size. But at the rate of change we're seeing in the modern human population, just over a hundred years, we have changed hundreds of thousands of years worth of evolutionary change just because of our diet.

56:29

Right. Well, we have to go to our midway break now. The midway break, as many of you know, is a longer than normal break.

56:38

That is because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida, that airs this program twice a day in a rerun format in Morning Drive and also 8 to 10 p .m.

56:48

at night. They require of us a longer break in the middle of our two major segments because they air their own commercials and public service announcements in order to localize

56:58

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio to Lake City, Florida. So please be patient with us as we take this longer than normal break.

57:04

Use this time wisely and write down information provided by our advertisers so that you can more successfully and more frequently patronize them.

57:12

Because the more you patronize our advertisers, the more likely they are going to remain our advertisers, which subsequently means the more likely we are going to remain on the air because we rely on their advertising dollars to exist.

57:25

So please write down the information for our advertisers or provided by our advertisers so you can contact them and also write down questions for our guest,

57:35

Dr. Robert W. Carter, and send them to chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com,

57:42

c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com. Please give us your first name, city and state and country of residence if you live outside the

57:48

USA. We will begin the second hour when we return with a question from Debra from Durango, Colorado, a first -time questioner on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

58:00

And while you're at it, Debra, you might as well send me your full mailing address in Durango, Colorado, because you have won a free

58:07

New American Standard Bible compliments of the publishers of the NASB since you are a first -time questioner.

58:14

Don't go away, God willing, we'll be right back after these messages with more of Dr. Robert W. Carter and more of Pastor Bruce Bennett right after these messages from those who keep us alive.

58:26

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Hello, my name is James Renahan and I'm the president of IRBS Theological Seminary in Mansfield, Texas.

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The Word of God says, if a man desires the office of an overseer, he desires a good thing. Do you have the desire to serve

01:00:04

Jesus Christ in pastoral ministry? Twenty years ago, the Institute of Reformed Baptist Studies at Westminster Seminary, California was born.

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Old and New Testaments are the inspired and inerrant Word of God, that Jesus Christ is

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God in the flesh who came to save sinners by his life, death, and resurrection, and that the task of the church is to honor and serve the triune

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God in all things. IRBS Theological Seminary is dedicated by God's grace to preparing godly ministers who will be committed to these doctrines.

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Do you sense a call to serve Jesus Christ in his church as a pastor? Why not consider IRBS Theological Seminary?

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You'll find more information at irbsseminary .org. That's irbsseminary .org, two

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That's wrbc .us. Big Gamble Spiritually.

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Even many of the major Christian networks that include excellent biblically faithful teachers on their lineup, sadly often also include the worst of doctrinally dangerous heretics.

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Spread the word about firstloveradio .org. James White here, co -founder of Alpha Omega Ministries and occasional guest on Iron Sharpens Iron radio.

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I'm so delighted that my friend Chris Arnzen will be heading down to Atlanta for the next G3 conference from January 17th to the 19th, 2019, where I'll be joining a very impressive lineup of speakers on the theme,

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A Biblical Understanding of Missions. Speakers include John Piper, Steve Lawson, Vodie Baucom, Mark Dever, Conrad Mbewe, Phil Johnson, Josh Bice, yours truly, and many more.

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I hope you all join Chris and me for this phenomenal event. For more details, go to G3conference .com.

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Every day at thousands of community centers, high schools, middle schools, juvenile institutions, coffee shops, and local hangouts,

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That's liyfc .org. Chris Sorensen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio here.

01:07:50

I want to tell you about a man I have personally known for many years. His name is Dan Buttafuoco.

01:07:56

Dan is a personal injury and medical malpractice lawyer, but not the type that typically comes to mind.

01:08:03

Dan cares about people and is a theologian himself. Recently, he wrote a book titled Consider the

01:08:09

Evidence for the Bible. Ravi Zacharias wrote the foreword. Dan also has a master's degree in theology.

01:08:16

Dan handles serious injury and medical malpractice cases in all 50 states. He represents many

01:08:22

Christians in serious injury matters all over the country. Dan is an exceptional trial lawyer.

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He wrote the test for the National Board of Trial Advocacy, and currently his firm has over 100 cases that have settled for $1 million or more, and in approximately 10 different states.

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In Illinois, his lawyers had the fourth largest settlement in the state's history. In New York, his case involving a police officer made the front page of the

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Law Journal. If you have a serious personal injury or medical malpractice claim in any state,

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I recommend that you call Dan. Consultations are free. There is no fee unless you win.

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Dan Buttafuoco's number is 1 -800 -669 -4878. 1 -800 -669 -4878.

01:09:13

Or email me for Dan's contact information at chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

01:09:24

My name is Steve Lawson, founder and president of One Passion Ministries, as well as teaching fellow for Ligonier Ministries.

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I serve as professor of preaching and oversee the doctor of ministry program at the Master's Seminary in Los Angeles.

01:09:39

I would like to recommend the church where one of my preaching students, Andy Woodard, serves as the pastor.

01:09:45

It's called New Covenant Church, NYC. They are a Reformed Baptist church that meets in Midtown Manhattan.

01:09:52

You can find their service times and location on their website, which is www .ncc .nyc.

01:10:00

They believe in a sovereign God who commands all men everywhere to repent and believe the gospel.

01:10:06

If you're looking for a church that believes in expository preaching, which is simply biblical preaching, in New York City, I'd like to recommend that you visit

01:10:16

New Covenant Church, NYC. Again, their information can be found at www .ncc

01:10:23

.nyc. Have a great day. And we invite you to visit the pastor's study by calling in with your questions.

01:10:55

Our time will be lively, useful, and I assure you, never dull. Join us this Saturday at 12 noon eastern time for a visit to the pastor's study, because everyone needs a pastor.

01:11:14

Hi, I'm Buzz Taylor, frequent co -host with Chris Arnson on Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio. I would like to introduce you to my good friends,

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Todd and Patty Jennings at CVBBS, which stands for Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service.

01:11:27

Todd and Patty specialize in supplying reformed and Puritan books and Bibles at discount prices that make them affordable to everyone.

01:11:35

Since 1987, the family owned and operated book service has sought to bring you the best available

01:11:40

Christian books and Bibles at the best possible prices. Unlike other book sites, they make no effort to provide every book that is available because frankly, much of what is being printed is not worth your time.

01:11:53

That means you can get to the good stuff faster. It also means that you don't have to worry about being assaulted by the pornographic, heretical, and otherwise faith insulting material promoted by the secular book vendors.

01:12:06

Their website is CVBBS .com. Browse the pages at ease, shop at your leisure, and purchase with confidence as Todd and Patty work in service to you, the church, and to Christ.

01:12:19

That's Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service at CVBBS .com. That's CVBBS .com.

01:12:27

Let Todd and Patty know that you heard about them on Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio. And you can call

01:12:32

CVBBS .com at their toll -free number, 800 -656 -0231, 800 -656 -0231,

01:12:40

Monday through Friday from 10 30 a .m. till 4 30 p .m. Eastern time.

01:12:45

Actually, I think that's 10 a .m. to 4 30 p .m. Eastern time. And of course you can order 24 hours a day, seven days a week, 52 weeks a year at CVBBS .com.

01:12:58

CVBBS .com, which stands for Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service. And if you mention

01:13:03

Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio, when you purchase $50 or more worth of merchandise, you'll receive absolutely free the journalable, that's a very hard word to say, the journalable

01:13:17

Psalm 119 from Reformation Heritage Books. And you'll also get free shipping on your entire order of $50 or more when you mention

01:13:25

Chris Arnzen when ordering $50 or more from CVBBS .com.

01:13:31

And we just have a few very important announcements regarding special events before we return to our guests and our listener in Colorado.

01:13:42

First of all, the conference that we've been mentioning, the Creation and the Authority of the

01:13:47

Bible Conference featuring Dr. Robert Carter of Creation Ministries International, that's being held this

01:13:54

Friday and Saturday, September 21st and 22nd at the

01:14:00

Word of Truth Church on 1055 Portion Road in Farmingville, Long Island, New York.

01:14:07

That's 1055 Portion Road, Farmingville, Long Island, New York. The Saturday session,

01:14:14

I'm sorry, the Friday session, September 21st is at 6 .30

01:14:19

p .m. and at 8 p .m. The Saturday sessions are at 1 p .m.,

01:14:25

2 .30 p .m., and 4 p .m. That's Saturday, September 22nd. Dinner is at 5 .45,

01:14:32

followed by the final session at 7 p .m. and a Q &A on Saturday, September 22nd.

01:14:39

And once again, that's the Word of Truth Church in Farmingville, Long Island, New York. You can find out more details on this conference by calling 631 -806 -0614, 631 -806 -0614, or you could go to wotchurch .com,

01:14:57

wotchurch .com. And then, coming up on October 6th and 7th, as I mentioned earlier, a conference being hosted by our new sponsors,

01:15:08

Grace Bible Fellowship Church of Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. This is a conference featuring author, pastor, and conference speaker,

01:15:16

Mike Ebengroth, on the theme, Why the Reformation Still Matters. That's Saturday, October 6th, and Sunday, October 7th.

01:15:24

If you want more details on this conference, go to gracebfc .com,

01:15:31

gracebfc, which stands for biblefellowshipchurch .com, forward slash conference, or you could call 717 -652 -5229, 717 -652 -5229.

01:15:44

I plan on being there, God willing, so I look forward to seeing you there at the Grace Bible Fellowship Church on 1250

01:15:52

Colonial Road in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, Saturday, October 6th, and Sunday, October 7th.

01:15:58

I hope to see you there. Then, coming up in November on the 9th and the 10th, the

01:16:04

Alliance of Confessing Evangelicals is having their annual Quakertown Conference on Reform Theology. This is another

01:16:11

Grace Bible Fellowship Church in the same denomination, but different city. This will be in Quakertown, Pennsylvania, and that will be, as I said,

01:16:19

November 9th and the 10th. The theme is The Glory of the Cross, and the speakers include

01:16:24

David Garner, Ray Ortland, Richard Phillips, Timothy Gibson, and Carlton Wynn.

01:16:30

For more details on the Quakertown Conference on Reform Theology, go to the Alliance of Confessing Evangelicals website, alliancenet .org,

01:16:39

alliancenet .org, click on events, then scroll down to Quakertown Conference on Reform Theology.

01:16:45

Then, the G3 Conference is coming up, as you've been hearing my friends James White, Phil Johnson, and Todd Friel promote on the show.

01:16:55

The G3 Conference is such a phenomenal event. I am looking forward to my third year in a row being there,

01:17:01

God willing, from January 17th, which is a Thursday, to January 19th, which is a

01:17:07

Saturday, and that will be at the Georgia International Convention Center in College Park, Georgia.

01:17:14

They are expecting between 4 ,000 and 5 ,000 people there this year, so I would strongly urge you not only to attend, but also to register for an exhibitor's booth, just as I will be manning,

01:17:28

God willing, for Iron Trip and Zion Radio for the third year in a row. The conference has been extremely valuable to me, having an exhibitor's booth there, so I really urge you to do the same, and you can register at g3conference .com.

01:17:43

But the theme is The Mission of God, A Biblical Understanding of Missions, and by the way, there is a special Spanish -speaking edition on Wednesday, January 16th.

01:17:55

But the English -speaking conference has a huge roster, as always, of very impressive speakers, including my friend

01:18:04

Dr. James R. White, John Piper, Stephen J. Lawson, Vodie Baucom, Mark Dever, Conrad M.

01:18:10

Bayway, Tim Challies, Phil Johnson, Josh Bice, the founder of the G3 Conference, Todd Friel of Wretched TV and Wretched Radio, Stephen J.

01:18:21

Nichols, the president of the Reformation Bible College, founded by R .C. Sproul and Ligonier Ministries, and many more are on that lineup.

01:18:30

For more details on registering for attendance and to register for an exhibitor's booth, go to g3conference .com,

01:18:37

g3conference .com. Last but not least, if you love the show, you don't want it to disappear from the airwaves, go to irontreppanzironradio .com,

01:18:46

irontreppanzironradio .com, click support, then click, click to donate now. You can donate instantly with a debit or credit card, and if you would rather send in a check via snail mail, there will be a mailing address that appears on your screen where you can mail a check made payable to Iron Sharp and Zion Radio.

01:19:05

As always, never siphon money away from your regular giving that you're accustomed to to your local church. Never put your family in financial jeopardy by giving to Iron Sharp and Zion Radio.

01:19:14

Providing for your church and your family are commands of God. Providing for my show is not a command of God, but if you're financially blessed above and beyond your ability to obey those two commands, then please support

01:19:24

Iron Sharp and Zion Radio as much as you can and as often as you can. And if you want to advertise with us, send us an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com

01:19:32

and put advertising in the subject line, because we truly could use your advertising dollars. That's chrisarnson at gmail .com,

01:19:39

put advertising in the subject line. That email address is also the email address where you could send in a question for our guest,

01:19:46

Dr. Robert W. Carter of Creation Ministries International, our guest today, who is speaking on creation and the authority of the

01:19:54

Bible. That's chrisarnson at gmail .com. And now we have the aforementioned

01:20:01

Debra in Durango, Colorado. And Debra asks, let's see here.

01:20:09

In addition to the material produced by various creation ministries, I have consumed many materials put out by old earth creationists,

01:20:20

ID proponents, and found them to contain many compelling arguments that refute evolutionary theory.

01:20:27

I'm a bit mystified as to why these folks seem to summarily dismiss the young earth position and even disparage those that hold it.

01:20:37

One would think that they could readily see that the old earth interpretation of the fossil data uses many of the same materialist presuppositions held by evolutionists who oppose intelligent design.

01:20:53

And I will move on with a couple of her other questions after you respond to that, because she has basically three or four questions here.

01:21:03

Dr. Carter. All right. Wow. That is a deep question, and it is something that is not easy to answer without insulting people directly, and I don't want to do that.

01:21:18

All right, go ahead. Let's just say that I know of a lot of very well -known scholars who do excellent work after Genesis 11, but for some reason they don't apply the same rules of logic and scholarship to the first 11 chapters of the

01:21:37

Bible. Of course, after Genesis 11, that's Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Before that is creation,

01:21:43

Noah's flood, and the Tower of Babel. And for some reason, they don't think through these first couple of chapters in the same way.

01:21:51

They don't apply the same thought processes and the same rules for arguing and for interpreting.

01:21:59

And it's a giant mystery, except that none of this type of scholarship existed before the early 1800s.

01:22:10

And if you look at just about any scholar prior to that, they're going to say Adam and Eve are real people, that Noah's flood was real, and things like that.

01:22:18

It's after the rise of Old Earthism and after the rise specifically of Charles Darwin where scholars really started struggling with these early chapters.

01:22:30

And then Deborah in Durango, Colorado, moves on to say, I find only a few very mostly dated debates between young earth creationists and old earth creationists, but very little cross -examination and no cases of open discussion of the data.

01:22:50

By the way, this is me interjecting here, Deborah. I have orchestrated many debates since 1995, and I concur with you that cross -examination is the most vital part of a debate, because if you don't have a cross -examination, you just have two people giving speeches.

01:23:11

But, going back to her questions slash comments, such discussion would be very helpful to non -scientists and non -specialists in the fields.

01:23:24

Also, I believe it would make the young earth creationist arguments even more robust to defend the data interpretation against strong challengers, rather than simply be dismissed as ignorant.

01:23:40

Maybe this is why they don't want to engage you in discussion, smiley face. Are you aware of any old earth creationists that are willing to engage in detailed scientific discussion or debate as to interpretation of geological and physical science data relevant to the age of the earth?

01:23:59

Very good question, and I know that the old earth creationists that I have spoken with, some of them are very leery because they say, they allege, that the young earth creationists will, they seem to be broad -brushing here, and I'm not meaning to be broad -brushing when

01:24:17

I'm referring to the old earth folks, because there may be some that wouldn't say this, but I have heard a number of times that they automatically assume the young earth people are going to be nasty and cast doubts of their opponent's salvation in the exchange.

01:24:35

But if you could, answer these very excellent questions by Debra. Excellent, excellent, excellent question.

01:24:43

As far as the dated material, this is true. There aren't as many good examples of old versus young debate that I'm aware of.

01:24:55

We have had several in CMI, in fact our Dr. Carl Wieland, who is noted for his gentleness and his humility, not his arrogance, he doesn't disparage people, has been on the stage several times.

01:25:09

I myself was in a debate, it was called the Great Dothan Creation Evolution Debate, but it wasn't with an old earth

01:25:14

Christian, it was with an atheistic evolutionist. We do have a booklet that CMI has produced, it's called

01:25:22

Skeptics vs. Creationists. This was a series of newspaper editorials with a back and forth, you know, skeptics wrote one, creationists wrote another, skeptics replied, creationists replied, and it was published in an

01:25:36

Australian newspaper, a very widely read newspaper, and we publish that now as a pamphlet, unedited.

01:25:43

We let the evolutionists say what they said, and we liked how we said it well enough, but again, that's not old versus young creationists.

01:25:52

It's hard to find a platform where you can talk civilly.

01:25:58

In fact, over the years, we have drifted away from the debate style. There's a lot of things that happen in debates that are more style than substance, and it's easy for an audience to say, oh yeah, that guy won, where really he got his tail kicked, but the audience doesn't know it because the style is often different than the substance.

01:26:24

Of course, that could be true, viewing the presentations of the opposing sides solo.

01:26:34

I mean, either way, you can have people say, well, sure, you watched that video of the old earth creationist, but that guy is an uneducated moron or whatever, you know.

01:26:46

You could have either, either way is susceptible to being, having laid the charge against it for not having an adequate representative of that particular view in the venue that you are viewing or listening to.

01:27:02

Yeah, you also have to be careful of psychological thing called transference. That's when you take what you're doing and place it upon the shoulders of your opponent.

01:27:11

Very typical in politics. We've had a lot of people throw aspersions at us saying, oh, you people can do

01:27:19

X, Y, and Z. Well, wait a minute, this is what you're doing right now. We're actually answering you politely and you're throwing caustic accusations at us.

01:27:27

One particular example is Dr. Hugh Ross, who's a very famous old earth creationist, um, not really creationist, like I would say, but you know, old earth guy,

01:27:37

Christian, he runs a big politics ministry. And, uh, you know, he said, no young earth creationist will debate me.

01:27:44

But he said that, um, knowing full well that our Dr. Jonathan Sarfati had offered a debate. And it's very confusing.

01:27:51

It's like, wait a minute, you know, you were challenged here. And then later on you said that no one will. And so actually one of my friends, uh,

01:27:57

Dr. Danny Faulkner actually came up and said, okay, I'll debate you. So he agreed and they debated. Danny has been on this program at least three times, maybe more.

01:28:08

Yeah, he's a friend of mine. He's a good guy. I like Danny a lot. And we're both board members of the creation research society, even though we work for different creation organizations.

01:28:17

Um, I've known him for a long time. Yeah. I can't, you can't really answer the question of how come there's no good debate material out there.

01:28:26

My best answer is I hate debates. I don't enjoy debating and I don't enjoy the debate format.

01:28:33

I don't think it's very productive toward, uh, furthering dialogue or mutual respect and admiration amongst debaters.

01:28:41

And as one who loves debates, I will, I will try to arrange one.

01:28:47

You put another, uh, piece of burning coal underneath my fire, uh, to get something done there.

01:28:54

I happen to value debates myself because if they're done correctly and if they're properly moderated and you have the proper, uh, participants, uh,

01:29:05

I think they can shed a lot of light rather than heat. And what you wind up having if you don't have a debate is you just merely have the option of people talking about each other behind their back.

01:29:17

But anyway, uh, that's, that's just happens to be my opinion as being somebody who's loved debates all my life as a

01:29:23

Christian and look forward to arranging many more. But thank you, Deborah. And by the way, Deborah has been honest, honest enough to remind me that she has already written a question in the past.

01:29:35

I thought she was a first time questioner and she told me to give the Bible to someone else. Well, thank you very much,

01:29:40

Deborah, for listening to Iron Trip and Zion Radio. Uh, once again, we have Joey in Clifton, New Jersey, with a follow -up question.

01:29:49

He says, yes, you got me right, in reference to his previous question where we weren't certain where he was coming from.

01:29:56

We obviously understood him correctly. Then he says, that debate you mentioned is the one

01:30:02

I had in mind. What I mean is if their trend is to abandon the single ancestry out of Africa theory because of archaeology, as you said, what do they do when they hit the problem of common genetics?

01:30:17

In other words, archaeology and genetics should box them into single common origin for mankind, the biblical view.

01:30:25

How do they try to escape this dilemma? Wow. Well, they try to escape the dilemma by simply appealing to deep time and to their evolutionary assumptions.

01:30:37

Since they believe evolution must be true, there must be an evolutionary answer, and therefore they're going to keep on searching until they figure it out.

01:30:43

They also dodge the question. They also evade the obvious answers. Clearly, there is only one species of humans on this planet.

01:30:53

Clearly, we've had a very recent common ancestry. Clearly, we're so different from chimpanzees that they cannot explain how humans and chimpanzees became so different in only a few hundred thousand generations.

01:31:08

Sure, it might be six million years, but even at 20 years per generation, that's about 300 ,000 generations in their model.

01:31:16

They've got to explain millions upon millions of differences, and they can't do it.

01:31:21

Now we know that Neanderthals are human. We have this other group of people called the

01:31:27

Denisovans, which we only know from a few little isolated fragments, but they're human too. I suspect that they're

01:31:32

Homo erectus, but I don't know that yet. We haven't these diverse looking people from the past that everyone assumed were very different from one another, and yet the genetics is telling us that they interbred, which means they're one species, humans.

01:31:59

So there's all this information right now challenging all the standard models from yesteryear.

01:32:04

Everything has fallen apart. Everything is up in the air, and yet they're still not turning toward the

01:32:11

God of the Bible or toward a biblical explanation, I believe, because, if I can quote

01:32:17

King James here, it's the verse I learned this one in, the carnal mind is enmity against Christ. It is not subject to law of God, neither indeed can be.

01:32:28

So the unbeliever, whether, you know, I'm not talking about Christians who are evolutionists, but the unbeliever is not going to turn to a biblical answer no matter what.

01:32:38

They're going to do everything they can to supplant the knowledge of God that they have in their heart and in their mind with something else, and the best excuse against God today is evolutionary theory.

01:32:50

Did I answer the question? Dr. Carter, what? I'm sorry. Go ahead. No, no,

01:32:56

I ran out of time. I wasn't sure if I answered the question well. I just kept talking there. In fact, Bruce, we're going to our final break right now, so ask your question as soon as we return from the break.

01:33:08

All right, we'll get Bruce's question. We're going to our final break now, so send in your questions now if you have them to chrisarnson at gmail .com.

01:33:16

chrisarnson at gmail .com. Don't go away. We'll be right back with Dr. Robert W. Carter of Creation Ministries International.

01:33:23

Hello, my name is James Renahan, and I'm the president of IRBS Theological Seminary in Mansfield, Texas.

01:33:30

The Word of God says, if a man desires the office of an overseer, he desires a good thing.

01:33:36

Do you have the desire to serve Jesus Christ in pastoral ministry? Twenty years ago, the

01:33:41

Institute of Reformed Baptist Studies at Westminster Seminary, California was born. For those two decades, these institutions worked together to train men for ministry in Reformed Baptist churches.

01:33:53

It's been a wonderful partnership. Now we have advanced our school into an independent seminary offering a full program of courses leading to the

01:34:01

Master of Divinity degree. This is IRBS Theological Seminary. We believe that the scriptures of the

01:34:07

Old and New Testaments are the inspired and inerrant Word of God, that Jesus Christ is God in the flesh who came to save sinners by his life, death and resurrection, and that the task of the church is to honor and serve the triune

01:34:18

God in all things. IRBS Theological Seminary is dedicated by God's grace to preparing godly ministers who will be committed to these doctrines.

01:34:27

Do you sense a call to serve Jesus Christ in his church as a pastor? Why not consider IRBS Theological Seminary?

01:34:34

You'll find more information at irbsseminary .org. That's irbsseminary .org, two

01:34:40

S's in the middle. I hope to hear from you soon. God bless you. Got to tell you, for my money,

01:34:48

Chris Arnzen's radio program is just the best. I think that's what it's called.

01:34:58

This is Todd Friel of Wretched Radio and TV with Phil Johnson of Grace to You, inviting everybody to come to the

01:35:05

G3 conference, which has almost instantly become one of the best conferences in the country. And it is.

01:35:10

It's a great conference. I love it. And Chris Arnzen was there last year. He's been there, I think, every year.

01:35:16

It's great to see him there. You and I actually did some recordings in the lobby at that place.

01:35:21

So tons of stuff going on, tons of great speakers. And no matter where you are in the building, you will hear

01:35:27

Chris Arnzen's laugh. And that's worth the price of admission alone. If you would like to join

01:35:32

Phil, me, Chris, and a cavalcade of great preachers, so it should be a cavalcade of great preachers and me, g3conference .com,

01:35:41

g3conference .com. Paul wrote to the church at Galatia, For am

01:35:49

I now seeking the approval of man, or of God? Or am I trying to please man? If I were still trying to please man,

01:35:56

I would not be a servant of Christ. Hi, I'm Mark Lukens, pastor of Providence Baptist Church. We are a

01:36:02

Reformed Baptist Church, and we hold to the London Baptist Confession of Faith of 1689. We are in Norfolk, Massachusetts.

01:36:09

We strive to reflect Paul's mindset to be much more concerned with how God views what we say and what we do than how men view these things.

01:36:17

That's not the best recipe for popularity, but since that wasn't the apostles' priority, it must not be ours either.

01:36:24

We believe, by God's grace, that we are called to demonstrate love and compassion to our fellow man, and to be vessels of Christ's mercy to a lost and hurting community around us, and to build up the body of Christ in truth and love.

01:36:36

If you live near Norfolk, Massachusetts, or plan to visit our area, please come and join us for worship and fellowship.

01:36:42

You can call us at 508 -528 -5750, that's 508 -528 -5750, or go to our website to email us, listen to past sermons, worship songs, or watch our

01:36:54

TV program entitled, Resting in Grace. You can find us at providencebaptistchurchma .org,

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that's providencebaptistchurchma .org, or even on sermonaudio .com. Providence Baptist Church is delighted to sponsor

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Or visit lynbrookbaptist .org. That's lynbrookbaptist .org. I gain insight from the analysis and World provides clarity to the news stories that really matter.

01:40:05

I believe you'll also find World to be an invaluable resource to better understand critical topics with a depth that's simply not found in other media outlets.

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forward slash podcast. That's W for World, N for News, G for Group, dot org forward slash podcast.

01:40:53

My name is Steve Lawson, founder and president of One Passion Ministries, as well as teaching fellow for Ligonier Ministries.

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I serve as professor of preaching and oversee the Doctor of Ministry program at the Master's Seminary in Los Angeles.

01:41:09

I would like to recommend the church where one of my preaching students, Andy Woodard, serves as the pastor.

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It's called New Covenant Church, NYC. They are a Reformed Baptist church that meets in Midtown Manhattan.

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You can find their service times and location on their website. Which is www .ncc .nyc.

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They believe in a sovereign God who commands all men everywhere to repent and believe the gospel.

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If you're looking for a church that believes in expository preaching, which is simply biblical preaching, in New York City, I'd like to recommend that you visit

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New Covenant Church, NYC. Again, their information can be found at www .ncc

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.nyc. Have a great day. FirstLoveRadio .org

01:43:15

Welcome back, and don't forget about the

01:43:26

Reformation Conference being held at Grace Bible Fellowship Church in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania on Saturday, October 6th and Sunday, October 7th.

01:43:35

And the speaker is Mike Ebengroff, an author, a pastor, and conference speaker.

01:43:41

The theme will be Why the Reformation Still Matters. And if you want more information on this conference, where I intend to be,

01:43:48

God willing, both days, go to www .gracebfc .com. Grace BFC, and BFC stands for Bible Fellowship Church, dot com.

01:43:58

www .gracebfc .com forward slash conference. www .gracebfc .com forward slash conference, or you can call them at 717 -652 -5229.

01:44:09

717 -652 -5229. I urge you to be there if you live within traveling distance to the

01:44:16

Grace Bible Fellowship Church of Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. And even if you're not, if you can take the time off from work, or actually this is a weekend, so you wouldn't even have to do that, but if you can manage to jump in a plane, train, or automobile and get there,

01:44:30

I would urge you to be there on October 6th and October 7th, which is a Saturday and a

01:44:35

Sunday. Grace Bible Fellowship Church in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. www .gracebfc

01:44:41

.com forward slash conference. That's www .gracebfc .com forward slash conference.

01:44:48

Now we are back with our final segment today with our guest, Dr. Robert W.

01:44:54

Carter of Creation Ministries International, and also our co -host, Pastor Bruce Bennett of Word of Truth Church in Farmingville, Long Island, New York, which is actually the host church for the conference this weekend,

01:45:07

Friday and Saturday, September 21st and September 22nd, featuring Dr. Robert W. Carter on Creation and the

01:45:13

Authority of the Bible. And before the break, Pastor Bruce Bennett, you had a question.

01:45:21

Yes, I was wondering, Dr. Carter, if you could share with us your personal top three evidences for biblical creation?

01:45:32

Awesome question. Fantastic question. I'm going to first turn to an idea called genetic entropy, and that is we know that genetically we are decaying over time.

01:45:46

We know that mutations are accumulating in the human population. We're going downhill, not uphill.

01:45:53

That is strong evidence that we are not a millions of years old species.

01:45:59

In fact, the rate of birth defects increasing over time, the number of mutations increasing over time, we're not going to last for a million years even.

01:46:08

So clearly we had a recent creation, and we were created very good without mutations or we would already be extinct.

01:46:16

Number two, oh, I might turn towards something like the magnetic field of the earth decaying over time, the magnetic field of Mercury.

01:46:26

Mercury is a small planet. It should not have a magnetic field if it's millions of years old. It just can't.

01:46:31

The magnets decay too fast, and yet there is a magnetic field on Mercury. In fact, Dr. Russell Humphreys, another friend of mine, another board member of the

01:46:40

Creation Research Society, he wrote a paper where he predicted the magnetic field of Mercury in the future because they had measured it once in the 70s.

01:46:49

When they sent another probe out there, sure enough, they detected it again, and it had decayed. Boom. So we know the rate of decay of Mercury's magnetic field, and it's just a young earth.

01:46:59

Oh, I don't know. I might throw in something like the rate of erosion of continents. If you just measure the amount of mud coming out the

01:47:05

Mississippi River, you will soon realize that the entire continent of North America should be eroded down to sea level within just a few million years.

01:47:15

And so the age of the supposed age of the continents doesn't match the erosion rate of the continents.

01:47:23

So clearly, the continents are not as old as they say. Those are just three scientific bits of information.

01:47:29

There's many more than that, but those three I might just bring up. Genetic entropy is definitely my favorite.

01:47:35

I think genetics is the best thing ever to happen to us. Any follow -up, Pastor Bruce?

01:47:41

Very good. Any follow -up before we move on? Yeah, that's... Pardon?

01:47:46

Any follow -up before we move on to a couple more listener questions? No, no.

01:47:53

That was my only real burning question. Okay, great. We have... It's not a question, actually. It's a comment.

01:47:59

Ted in Tuscaloosa, Alabama says, If you want an old earth guy to debate, try

01:48:05

Tyler Vela, V -E -L -A. He's not a scientist, but he's an

01:48:10

MDiv student, I believe, at Westminster Theological Seminary. Well, we will look into that.

01:48:17

Ted from Tuscaloosa, Alabama, thanks a lot. Let's see here. We have

01:48:26

We have Lou in Sharpsburg, Georgia. Hasn't Dr.

01:48:32

Jason Lyle debated Dr. Ross? If so, what was your assessment?

01:48:40

I believe I heard this. I did not see the debate, so I can't give a fair assessment. And Dr.

01:48:46

Jason Lyle is a young earth creationist, isn't he? He is. He's a really good guy too, yeah. Yeah, I've been trying to get him on the show, and hopefully that will happen at some point.

01:48:54

Well, thank you, Lou in Sharpsburg, Georgia. Let's see. We have

01:49:00

Ronald in Eastern Suffolk County, Long Island, who says, How can old earth and young earth creationists look at the same geological data from the

01:49:14

Grand Canyon and come up with polar opposite conclusions about the age of the earth?

01:49:20

Is one side being dishonest with the evidence? It just seems to be mind -boggling today that people apparently of integrity who are brothers in Christ in the science field could come up with entirely different answers to the question on the age of the earth using simply the data from the

01:49:38

Grand Canyon geological record. Excellent question, Ron.

01:49:44

Fantastic question. Just knowing that this exists, this diversity of opinion, looking at the same rocks, tells us that worldview and philosophical assumptions are driving most of the conclusions.

01:49:59

People don't come to the data without a preconceived notion of what the data is supposed to tell them, and they interpret data according to what they think is already true.

01:50:08

This is human nature. We are all subject to it, and we must all be careful with it.

01:50:17

However, specifically the Grand Canyon, as we go back and reanalyze what evolutionary geologists said 100 years ago about some of the key aspects of the canyon, we said,

01:50:28

Wait a second. This is not what you said. Specifically, there are several sandstone layers in the canyon.

01:50:33

The Coconino sandstone is near the top, and we are told that this was laid down by wind blowing across sand dunes over millions of years.

01:50:43

When you look at a sand dune, there is a specific angle the sand makes. Underwater, the angle is different.

01:50:51

A sand wave underwater will have a different angle of repose than a sand dune in air.

01:51:00

Air -blown sediments tend to get rounded.

01:51:06

The edges get knocked off from erosion as they blow and blow and blow. Those two things everyone said a long time ago.

01:51:14

Coconino sandstone is clearly an airborne deposit, until some creationist went and looked at it and said,

01:51:20

Wait a minute. All these grains are rounded, just like they were deposited underwater, and the angle of the lines is clearly an underwater deposit.

01:51:32

So what happens is Christians are forced to use the data available to them, and when one does that, they are always faced with evolutionary art.

01:51:48

It takes a lot of work to go to each little specific thing and test this, test this, test that, test the other.

01:51:56

As we do that, though, we examine one bit of evidence at a time, we remove that from the evidence for evolution.

01:52:11

But it's going to take a long time to remove all of that, and there's a lot of time the evolutionists have had to put together this big story.

01:52:20

Here's a good analogy. The little boy who said the emperor's naked.

01:52:28

A classic story of the emperor's new clothes, where everyone was telling the emperor that he had his beautiful clothing, and no one wanted to admit that he wasn't wearing any clothes.

01:52:39

The little boy could call it. That's just like what we're doing today. All this grand picture of evolution has been painted for us, but when we actually go and get close to the painting, we realize it's fake, but it's one little bit of evidence at a time.

01:52:56

I believe the big reason why there are evolutionary

01:53:02

Christians, Old Earth Christians, is because most of them haven't actually really gotten in there and analyzed the data.

01:53:11

Some of them have and still come to their old age conclusions, and that's another discussion. Did I ramble too much there?

01:53:17

Did I answer that question well? No, that was fine. Thank you, brother.

01:53:24

And now we have, let's see, we have Bobby in Hartsdale, New York, who says,

01:53:31

I have heard the Old Earth creationists and evolutionists both say one of the reasons that the argument has a lot more credibility on their side is because you could hardly find anywhere an academically accredited geologist who is a

01:53:51

Young Earth creationist. How do you respond to this? Taz Walker has a

01:53:57

PhD in engineering and a master's in geology. Steve Austin has a

01:54:05

PhD in geology. He's also a superhuman after a surgery that happened after a space capsule crashed.

01:54:15

We're going to have to live with that his whole life. It is true that creationists are not in the majority.

01:54:26

This is acknowledged. I know this. It is true. It does not mean they don't exist.

01:54:32

A lot of the evolutionary community wants to pretend that the creationists among them don't exist. That doesn't mean they don't exist either.

01:54:40

I know scientists in basically every field of science at multiple universities in this country and around the world who do not believe in evolution.

01:54:52

Most of them are not publishing these views because they'll get fired or they'll have problems getting funding which will lead to their firing.

01:54:59

But they certainly don't accept the evolutionary mantra and they don't even accept millions of years.

01:55:07

Literally, I know at least a hundred and probably more than that if I really thought about it. So they're there.

01:55:15

It's just you don't see them for two reasons. One, they have to be quiet to maintain their job. And two, their opponents don't want to acknowledge that they exist.

01:55:22

Right. And of course you cannot underestimate the attempts at preserving one's livelihood and career because it's very easily proven that the halls of academia are predominantly ruled by leftist totalitarians even in the scientific realm.

01:55:45

And if you disagree with their religious dogma, and I said it that way for a reason, it's because many of the things that they believe are not scientifically proven fact.

01:55:55

It's really their religion of secular humanism that maintains and preserves some of these things like Darwinian evolution and so on.

01:56:04

If you are out of step with them you will be ridiculed, you'll be mocked publicly and likely lose your career if you're in that career to begin with.

01:56:15

Back in the 1800s the Duke of Argyle was a famous political commentator of the day and he wrote a very powerful essay about the early and he referenced the early

01:56:26

Darwinists. He talked about a reign of terror that they wage against their opponents as they made sure that only

01:56:34

Darwinists got in place in important positions in government, in religion, and in academia.

01:56:42

So from the very beginning of the Darwinian movement they have been politically active to make sure that their guys got in position and they would denigrate, obfuscate, you know, try to ruin the reputations of other people to get their people in position.

01:56:58

They're actually very politically astute and the effects we're seeing today. It's as if in order to win respect in academia, in religion, or in politics you have to say, oh yes

01:57:11

I'm a Darwinist. Well I'd like you and now in two minutes time to summarize what you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners today.

01:57:22

I want to impress upon the listenership of your excellent radio show that the

01:57:30

Bible claims to be an all -comprehensive history of the universe. It makes claims of how things started, why things are the way they are now, and where they're going.

01:57:43

Those claims tell us that Jesus Christ created this universe for His own glory and for His own purposes.

01:57:52

It says that Jesus Christ created the universe only a few thousand years ago.

01:57:58

Those are very big scientific and historical claims that really do test whether or not the

01:58:06

Bible is true. As a believer myself, I have struggled over this issue, so if someone is struggling over this,

01:58:14

I at least understand what they're struggling over. This is a hard thing. It takes a long time sometimes to get your brain around it, but I want to encourage people that there are answers to those questions that are bedeviling them and really challenging them.

01:58:27

They are there, they just have to dig. And I would first go to creation .com as a great resource of a tremendous number of articles, and I would keep listening to this radio show because I'm sure there'll be more information presented.

01:58:39

Great, that's creation .com. That's the website where you can find out more information about Dr. Robert W.

01:58:46

Carter and his colleagues at Creation Ministries International. Don't forget about the Word of Truth Church Conference this

01:58:54

Friday and Saturday, September 21st and 22nd. For more details, go to wotchurch .com.

01:59:03

Also, look up on the Iron Trip and Zion Radio archive the two -day,

01:59:08

I think it was at least two days, conversation that we had with Taz Walker and an

01:59:14

Old Earth creationist. Go to irontripandsironradio .com and type in Taz T -A -S

01:59:20

Walker in the search engine, and you will find that series of interviews between the

01:59:26

Young Earth and Old Earth position. I want to thank Pastor Bruce Bennett for being on the show today and for being a part of this discussion and also arranging this interview.

01:59:35

And I want to thank, obviously, Dr. Robert Carter and all of you who took the time to write in questions, and also all of you who listened today who we did not hear from.

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I hope you all always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior than you are a sinner.