Your First Love, Response to ADRobles

Alpha & Omega Ministries

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

00:30

Paul, greetings and welcome to The Dividing Line. I was, I mean, just literally, as the music was playing, got a text from my wife and want to extend our condolences to the

00:43

Escobedo family. Simon, Simon Escobedo the

00:51

Younger has been a part of the ministry for many many years and some of his articles are on the website if you've benefited from those.

01:01

His dad fell yesterday and I don't know all the details but the only thing

01:07

I could figure, I sort of assume, is he hit his head, probably had some type of fractured skull, something like that I would imagine, but was on life support last night and so he passed away about half an hour ago and so our condolences to the family.

01:23

Obviously believers, known him for years. My daughter was particularly, he and Summer had a neat relationship and so that's, lived a good long life and testimony of the

01:42

Lord and there's such a vast difference between being, facing those issues as a believer and not.

01:53

Believe me, having worked as a hospital chaplain for years, I can tell you there is a vast, vast, vast difference.

02:02

So we are thankful for the Lord's mercy in his life and drawing him to himself and the testimony that he has had for many many years as a faithful member of the

02:14

Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church where I was for 29 and a half years and so we'll pray for the family as they deal with this, this passing and you know

02:26

I lost my dad two and a half years ago now so coming up on three years and it's always, you know, a reminder of your own mortality.

02:41

If you've lived as long as I have, you've already lived a good long life and I'd like to live longer but you know what?

02:52

When I was at, I was at that hospital, I remember walking into the room of a 16 year old stomach cancer patient and he didn't live more than about two weeks after that and I was only 30 something at the time.

03:08

I remember just thinking to myself, I've already lived twice as long as he's gonna live and I remember asking myself then, are you truly thankful for life no matter how long it's given to you?

03:24

And so yeah, make mention of that. I promised last night that we would start the program with some scripture and I have put stuff on my screen so hopefully made it large enough to be able to be seen.

03:39

I suppose I can actually do one more, it'd be easier for me too.

03:45

I don't have to, don't have to put the, those things on to be able to see that.

03:55

I mentioned last night in light of what seems to be a boiling cauldron of division, worldliness, taken up by whatever's happening around us within the church.

04:21

And I'm only referring when I say within the church there to what could in some meaningful fashion be identified as a biblically faithful church, because there are so many that that are not.

04:39

And yet there is so much division, it seems that, you know, we used to joke about dividing over the color of the carpet, the pews, but it seems we divide over much more than that now.

04:54

And I've talked to some brothers about it and it's like it just, when the

05:01

Spirit of God grants unity to the church, that's a blessing on any nation.

05:08

A unified, healthy church is a blessing on any nation. And we are not in a situation where this nation deserves that blessing.

05:23

And so, how do we remain faithful? May I suggest consistency?

05:29

May I suggest biblicism? May I suggest a constant willingness to examine what we're getting all excited about in the light of God's eternal purposes?

05:46

Those things might help. And so I was thinking about, I just started looking at Revelation chapter 2, and the first letter that the risen

05:57

Lord writes to his churches is to the church in Ephesus. And it's really, really interesting.

06:08

You'll notice the first, verses 2 and 3.

06:14

Just a quick read through, and then we'll go back a little bit. I know your works and labor.

06:27

I didn't say your because there's a textual variant. We can look at it if you want to. Some of you weirdos like that stuff.

06:36

A number of manuscripts made them all parallel. So, Ergasu and then

06:43

Kapansu and Hupamanensu.

06:50

So, it would be parallel there. But anyway, I know your works and your labor and your perseverance, and that you are not able to bear or to put up with evil ones.

07:09

And you tested the ones claiming to be, saying themselves to be apostles, and they weren't.

07:19

And you found them to be false, to be lying, basically. Verse 3, and you have perseverance, and you have endured for my name's sake.

07:39

And you also have not grown weary.

07:46

You have not become exhausted in all of this work. So, let's just, before we go to verse

07:54

Is that, let me just ask this question.

08:04

If you were the church at Ephesus, and the apostle

08:10

Paul had spent three years laying the foundation of your fellowship, you have the best trained elders in the world.

08:24

And you have been faithful to what has been given to you.

08:30

Because look at the church at Colossae. The church there exists because the gospel had naturally spread out from Ephesus up the

08:42

Lycus River Valley to Colossae. And church was founded there, and Paul writes a letter to them.

08:52

Interestingly enough, that church is not going to be there for very long. Wiped out by an earthquake. Whole city.

08:59

Only a matter of years later. But the church at Ephesus has been faithful.

09:09

They have remained, there's nothing said about false doctrine.

09:16

And they're active. They're active. Look at that. Erga, Kapan, Huppamanein, they are, they're doing deeds.

09:27

They're doing works. They're toiling. They're laboring. They're persevering in these things.

09:35

It's not that once in a while they do something and then they stop doing it. No. These, this is an active church.

09:44

And there's nothing about, is there anything wrong about what they're doing?

09:52

In fact, the Lord who walks amongst the candlesticks, so the Lord amongst his churches, one of the things about the seven letters is it emphasizes the fact that Christ is building his church.

10:06

And he doesn't just go off on vacation simply. It's not like day of judgment, he's going to go, oh look at all the stuff you did or didn't or things like that.

10:14

No. He is actively through the spirit, that's what the seven spirits and stuff like that, the symbolism in Revelation.

10:24

He is in his church. He is intimately aware of what we're doing. The deeds, the toil, the perseverance, he is well aware of all of them.

10:39

And I think of how many

10:45

Christians down through the ages, we don't know their names, there has been no record left of them, and yet they toiled with perseverance in the service of Christ.

11:00

And what we have today is because of what they did. And they never got any kind of public recognition, anything like that.

11:13

But the Lord knows. And isn't that the promise of what Paul said to the

11:19

Colossians, interestingly enough? Hey, when you work, it's the Lord Christ you serve.

11:26

So it doesn't matter if people give you praise or even if your boss doesn't notice.

11:34

When you work, you work as unto the Lord. And he will reward those who work as unto him.

11:43

And when you're in the church, you're in his church. And I think when you rent someone else's building, so much work has to go into every

11:57

Sunday. And we have to set up an overflow room with like a hundred and five, 115 seats, because we don't have enough room in the auditorium.

12:12

And so people have to get there early and they have to set all that stuff up. And the AV guys have to set up the screens and get the feed working and set up the cameras.

12:23

And that's deeds. That's toil. That's perseverance to do it, week in, week out, so that the body can gather and we can gather together and we can have the supper together and we can observe baptisms together.

12:44

Most importantly, have the word of God preached together. These are the things we're doing.

12:52

And the Lord knows. The Lord knows. And he will reward. Maybe not in the way that the world says reward should be given, but he will reward.

13:03

So they're not only doing positive things that you cannot bear with those who are evil.

13:12

That term, it's interesting because Bastasai here,

13:19

Bastasai, sorry, in verse two is obviously directly related to verse three where it's translated, and you have endured, you have borne up for my namesake, but you will not bear with those who are evil, verse two.

13:51

So there is a sense of where the term enduring, and you have endured, but you will not endure amongst yourselves those who are evil.

14:05

This is not saying that these people had nothing to do with evil people, because as Paul has said elsewhere, if that was the case, then you'd have to go out of the world because evil people are all around us.

14:17

We're the small minority. But the same terms are being used here, and in fact, as is

14:26

Huppamanane down here in verse three and up here in verse two.

14:35

So he knows your perseverance, and he knows that you have perseverance, and you will not bear with those who are evil.

14:42

So there is a proper, unrebuked concern for holiness, both in doctrine as well as in behavior.

14:56

So you don't bear with those who are evil. So in other words, the

15:02

Apostle Paul seemed to have taught the church to engage in church discipline. And so there is a, and that's going to be something that comes up with the other churches, because there is false teaching that had come in, and they were allowing this stuff to happen, false prophetesses and stuff like that.

15:22

So these are all said, this is all said positively. The Lord knows his church.

15:30

He knows his people. They have endured. They don't endure the evil people, and they have discernment.

15:40

So they're actively doing good deeds. They're toiling. They have perseverance. They recognize what evil is.

15:51

That's a bit of a challenge these days for a lot of people. But you do not bear with those who are evil.

15:58

So they have a solid foundation in knowing what evil is and to fight against it, and they have discernment.

16:10

You put to the test. You tested pyrrhodzo, which can mean to tempt, but it also means to test.

16:21

And so you put to the test. You tested those who say themselves to be apostles or claim to be apostles.

16:32

How did they do that? How did they do that? I mean, someone comes along, they claim to be an apostle.

16:43

Remember, this is still in the apostolic age, and so there were still apostles who were alive.

16:51

So how are you to know? Well, there was a standard. They had been taught, they had been rooted and grounded by the apostle

16:59

Paul. They knew what the standard was, and they were able to test people who claim to have apostolic authority and find out they're not.

17:10

You found them to be false by a standard. This is a church.

17:16

It's active in doing the things that it's required to do. It's actively seeking holiness and purity.

17:26

It's actively protecting its people from false teaching and false teachers. That's all really good.

17:38

There's nothing in these words that would, for a second, say to us that Ephesus was to be faulted for any of these things.

17:50

In fact, the whole idea is, I know these things, and since there's no rebuke, then this is positive.

17:57

You're doing the right things. You've got the right foundation.

18:04

They haven't gone off into weird teaching or letting false prophetesses run amok amongst the people or any of that kind of stuff.

18:18

You've got perseverance and have endured for my namesake, which means they're also experiencing persecution.

18:27

They're experiencing resistance, the resistance of the world, and their endurance wasn't just a traditional thing.

18:36

It says, you have endured for my namesake. So they're bold in their proclamation of who

18:43

Jesus is. They're bold in their proclamation of the resurrection, and as a result, they have to endure for the sake of the name of Christ.

18:58

In the midst of all that, the last phrase, you have not grown weary.

19:11

You have not become exhausted. It seems that the church at Ephesus was very consistent, week in, week out, month in, month out, year in, year out.

19:27

They had been grounded properly, and so there is consistency on their part.

19:35

You've not grown weary, and the Lord knows it. The Lord knows the temptation to weariness.

19:45

I mean, the days of his human teaching, the morning to night, surrounded by the sickness and evil of man, he would know what the temptation to weariness would be.

20:00

You have not grown weary. So after all that, all this positive truth about the church, but,

20:18

Allah, but I have this katasu against you, that you have, and the term is abandoned, you've left your first love.

20:38

You've left your first love. I've heard a lot of sermons from Revelation, and at least the epistles to the churches, your eschatology isn't going to massively impact how you handle this.

21:05

I mean, yeah, there are people that say, well, the Ephesian church, that was one period of church history, and Laodicea is another period of church history, and they actually turned the churches into prophetic periods of church history and stuff like that.

21:18

Leaving all that aside, where you start is you recognize where these cities were.

21:28

In some of the other epistles, there's specifically, and we know a lot about Ephesus because we have

21:33

Acts, we have Ephesians, so we have more information we have for a lot of the other ones, but we also know, like one of the letters mentions

21:45

Aesav, and it's written to a city that was well known for the production of Aesav for the eyes and things like that.

21:52

And so you look at the historical stuff, you look at where the churches were located, you look at where they are today, or they're not today.

22:01

That is something to consider as well, that these letters were written to churches that God well knew, unless you're an open theist, were not going to be around forever.

22:12

We're going to experience various levels of subjugation to different kinds of world powers.

22:19

But you start with how these letters would have been heard in those early churches.

22:34

You literally get a letter from the apostle saying, this is what Jesus told me to tell you.

22:41

These are not long epistles, this isn't like reading Hebrews. This is a tweet.

22:51

These are very short emails, and they are just so blunt, so straightforward.

23:06

So imagine you're at Ephesus, you've been one of those people, you may have been taught by Paul, and you have been consistently there serving, you've endured for his namesake, you've tested the false apostles, you've done everything you know that you were taught to do by the apostle

23:43

Paul himself, and you hear the first two verses of the letter, as we have divided it up, obviously, you hear those first, and you're like, yeah, we've stood firm.

24:03

Perseverance, endured for his namesake, not grown weary. Wow, finally, someone's recognized just how consistent and stable we are.

24:17

And then, but I have this against you, that you have abandoned your first love.

24:27

And the very next word is, remember, therefore, from where you have fallen.

24:40

There's no, and I'm going to prove that you've abandoned your first love.

24:47

Because when you think about it, if you're going to say to someone, you've abandoned your first love, they're going to know instantaneously whether that's true or not.

24:59

And if they've been doing these deeds, and if they have that foundation, then they already know.

25:07

That's all the Lord had to say, I have this against you, you've left your first love. I see your work, and I am not rebuking your work.

25:19

But they couldn't be having the kind of joy that they should have been having in their work, if they've abandoned their first love.

25:32

There's a difference between remaining orthodox and loving orthodox.

25:42

Being, persevering out of requirement and duty, and persevering out of love.

25:55

And don't get me wrong, there have been times in my life when I have persevered out of duty, but I'm glad I persevered.

26:06

It's, it's, the idea isn't, well, you know, unless you've got all the perfect motivations, you shouldn't do anything.

26:14

No. There are, there are times where you, you keep going because you know that's the right thing to do.

26:23

But the point is, that's man's religion. That's not

26:30

Christianity. Because the motivation for all those terms, for all those, all those terms, deeds, erga, kapam, perseverance, not bearing with those who are evil, testing, testing apostles, you have perseverance, endure for my name's sake,

26:50

I haven't grown weary. What's the motivation of all that? And the motivation changes everything.

27:02

It changes everything. Because see, when you, if you get to the point where you're just doing what you're doing out of tradition and duty, but you no longer love the one that you're serving, then you're not going to love the ones that you are serving.

27:24

I'm not even talking about, you know, for yourself. Yeah. I mean, if you have the wrong motivations, if you're not doing it out of love, you're not going to have joy.

27:33

You're not going to have fulfillment. But the fact of the matter is, eventually, you're not going to be truly serving the ones that you are supposed to be serving.

27:46

You're not going to have that kind of unity in the body. It's going to be much easier to have division if that's how things are being done.

27:58

You have abandoned your first love. No argumentation, no offering of proof, because there wasn't a need to.

28:09

The Lord knows his people. And he knew this people. They are well -trained people.

28:17

They knew the truth. They could see the consistency of the Christian worldview. They were theologically astute.

28:26

And all he had to say to them is, Remember. Remember.

28:34

What an amazing thing that is. Remember, right here.

28:42

Remember, therefore, from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first.

28:52

The first deeds. You've gotten so far away. What was that song?

29:01

There was a line in a Keith Green song that just, well, there were a couple,

29:08

I think, where he addressed, my eyes are dry, my prayers are cold.

29:16

For someone who only was a believer for seven years, wow.

29:27

And how many of our hymns, I realize some of you don't sing hymns, but how many of our hymns, my heart is prone to wander.

29:39

My heart's prone to wander. You see it in the Psalter. You see it all over the place.

29:46

Remember from where you have fallen. I think that's one of the glories of the

29:53

Lord's Supper. And that's why there never, ever, ever needs to be innovation when it comes to the ordinances of the church.

30:09

When I heard about the pirate ship baptistry at the Baptist church,

30:14

I think it was in Georgia. I'm pretty sure it was in Georgia, because I remember I pulled into the parking lot. I didn't expect to be able to see a pirate ship, but I did visit the church.

30:24

Didn't go in, but I drove through. But we don't need innovation. People trying to come up with ways of making the

30:32

Lord's Supper more attractive. I can't think of a better way to remember from whence you have fallen, because the whole idea of the supper is do this in remembrance of me.

30:55

So it's always calling us back to think about the one who gave himself.

31:02

The price of my redemption is pictured in front of me at every supper. And so, and of course, anomnesis is related in Greek to remember.

31:16

So therefore, remember from where you have fallen. You know you know old saint, veteran, you've been at it for years, and yet you know.

31:35

I don't even have to prove it. You've left your first love. So remember from where you have fallen.

31:44

Repent and do the deeds you did at first. He's not saying stop doing, he's not saying stop being discerning.

31:52

He's not saying put up with evil people. He's not saying stop persevering.

32:00

He's saying to them do it from the right place. Remember those first deeds you did, the motivation of love.

32:12

He's not saying don't be mature, but he is saying all the maturity in the world isn't going to give you that motivation of love.

32:23

You've left your first love. Now part of the danger might be that obviously early on they wouldn't have any basis to basically go, you know, we are, we're the super duper orthodox, you know, we're the truly reformed, we're the, we know everything about every confession, guys, you know.

32:52

They wouldn't have any basis for that. The deeds they did at first, they did out of love and passion.

33:05

I'm not saying that they were just running around doing crazy things for the sake of doing crazy things either. They had been taught by Paul.

33:12

They had a good solid foundation, but they did the deeds with love.

33:23

And, you know, maybe there's nobody in the audience whatsoever that has ever been in a position of becoming weary or who might be tempted to go, you know,

33:41

I've, I've persevered, I've done these deeds and I've been this and I've done that.

33:48

And therefore think that that's your ultimate reward and hence become, you know, the chosen frozen.

34:01

The people think they've, they've got all done because they've got everything right. They've got every

34:06

T crossed, every I dotted and I've got all right.

34:12

And all Jesus has to say is, yeah, but where's your love? And how are you supposed to argue with Jesus on that?

34:20

He knows, he knows your heart and you know your heart. So you got two people in agreement. There isn't going to be much of a debate on that one.

34:28

Remember from where you have fallen. Memory is an amazing thing.

34:37

I'm glad that in some ways, you know, as you get older, your memory starts failing you.

34:44

It does. No two ways about it. And I remember when I was a younger man and I would hear my parents saying,

34:51

I, you know, how old is that? How old were you? And in the back of your mind, you're like, oh man, these folks are really getting up there, you know?

35:01

And my thought was, I'll always remember. No, you won't.

35:08

Okay. I, all right. There are the freaks of nature that will and the rest of us don't like those people.

35:16

But it is fascinating to me that it's your long -term memory.

35:25

You start sitting around and you start reminiscing and old couples do this, you know,

35:33

Kelly and I'll start talking about something or I'll, you know, you get out the photo album and you start looking at pictures and I don't know, the next generation may not have photo albums, may all be digital, which has advantages and disadvantages.

35:51

It really does. But you start talking about stuff and, you know, a loved one, a friend will mention something, you'll go, oh man,

35:59

I, I had forgotten that. And as soon as they do, all of a sudden it's right there in front of you in vivid color, vivid color.

36:09

You know, I'm thinking about a house that we used to live in right now, because I was talking to my sister, her birthday was recently, was recent.

36:16

And we were talking cats. She's a cat lady and I'm a cat guy,

36:23

I guess. And we all have multiple, both have multiple cats. We were talking about Butler, our, it's not our cat.

36:35

He's feral. He's, he's allowed me to just touch his head because I had given him food, but I haven't been able to pet him yet.

36:46

But he wants to be part of the family. He doesn't know how to be part of the family, but he'll sit in our laundry room and watch the other cats as we pet them and play with them and give them food and stuff like that.

36:57

And you can just see he wants that, but he's feral. So it's like, as soon as you start moving toward him, he's like, and then out the door he goes.

37:09

And so we were talking about, he's a tuxedo, by the way.

37:16

Some of you are really big tuxedo fans and we'll find out. Anyway, we were talking about stuff and she mentioned, you know,

37:27

I was thinking, we have this little tabby and I was going, we had a tabby named

37:33

Sam, didn't we? And my sister's like, well, we had Sam one and Sam two. And I remember what happened to the last

37:40

Sam. He got hung. He was on a, he had a collar on and he fell down a stairwell type thing.

37:48

I saw it and it was not a, not a fond memory, but just thinking about these things, all of a sudden

37:57

I'm thinking, I'm seeing things, not visions.

38:03

I'm seeing the makeup of that house and other stuff starts coming to mind.

38:10

I remember being sick once and about all I wanted to eat was 7 -Up and saltine cracker, which is, makes sense.

38:20

But I, but I can see that, I can see that kitchen and then the living room and where the TV was and where we'd put the

38:25

Christmas tree and where I spilled my chemistry set underneath the piano. And that would talk about a permanent stain.

38:35

If you want, you want a permanently stained carpet, try a chemistry set. That'll do it.

38:41

Or start a fire, I suppose. But yeah, that, that was a purple stain. Never, never got that one out.

38:47

I can assure you of that. A house still there. I visited only about three or four years ago.

38:53

About three years ago. Anyways, long -term memory. Things that really impacted you.

39:02

Same house, standing, I know exactly where I was standing when

39:07

I realized that the summer we had just experienced, I was about to go back to school, had seemed shorter than the summer before it.

39:17

And that's when I realized, I think time's going to seem like it goes faster and faster as I get older.

39:24

And guess what? I was right, but I was only like in second grade when

39:31

I figured this out, maybe, maybe first. And I just remember where I was standing. It, those memories are what make you who you are.

39:43

And so when the text says, remember from where you've fallen, the point is we're given our memories so we can remember what that was like.

39:54

That passion that was ours. And that's what gives you perseverance.

40:01

That's what gives you patience. That's what allows you to continue to labor in the kingdom.

40:09

And so I'm very thankful. You can take that down. I'm very thankful. Just for that reminder from the page of scripture, addressed to a sound, sound, solid church.

40:24

And we need to remember, we need to remember, do the first deeds, do the things you did when

40:33

Lord first changed your heart. All right.

40:38

Before we go to A .D. Robles, which is my promise, I said we would live listen and I'd The funny thing is this was like a week ago now, how much of the narrative has already changed in a week?

40:57

Were we talking about post -war consensus a week ago? Are some of the people who are writing about post -war consensus today, had they ever even used a phrase a week ago?

41:12

I mean, it's like, it's like, let's just, let's just throw a new thing out.

41:19

Let's just see how atomized we can make everything. Just break it all up.

41:25

Let's make sure that no one can get along with anyone on anything. People saying it's a psyop, it's a psyop.

41:34

What happened to the spiritual aspect of things? I mean, everything that the enemy of our souls does is a psyop in a sense, but I really do wonder about a lot of my

41:48

Christian friends, my brothers and sisters, who just think of things in a very worldly way.

41:57

What about spiritual things? What about spiritual forces? I realized the world can't talk about that.

42:04

The world, the world cannot see, you know, we, we have this idea and it's, it's, it's, it's an appropriate phrase, the culture of death, you know, it came from a

42:15

Pope, fine, culture of death, but we need to recognize who loves death?

42:24

Who would want to create the culture of death? If Jesus says, I am the way, the truth, and the, oh, life, then it's the enemy of our souls, the prince of darkness, who loves death and is going to cause people to think and behave in such a way as to maximize death.

42:52

And so it, it, it concerns me that I see so much of the conversation amongst

42:58

Christians. There's no spiritual aspect to it at all.

43:04

It's this study, this writer, you know, this historian, this revisionist, and when you go, but shouldn't we be concerned about the enemy of our souls sowing discord amongst the brethren?

43:25

Oh no, it's, we've got to do this. We've got to go after that guy.

43:31

And, and I'm not saying there aren't amazing things happening today. There are,

43:36

I guess something happened yesterday about Russian funding of some, of some groups and, you know, somebody was throwing out names to me and I'm, I'm just sitting there going, sorry, never heard of these people before.

43:55

I don't know what that's all about, but, uh, you know, some

44:01

Russian disinformation campaign. And I, you know, I personally believe that the vast majority of the money, because I haven't seen a single advertisement while I've been watching the

44:14

Vuelta from a Republican, nobody, Carrie Lake, even though Ruben Gallego's commercial against Carrie Lake on abortion is actually really good for Carrie Lake.

44:27

If you have, if you, if you have a morale, you know, morality, ethics, have a heart, brain, conscience, something like that, because the stuff, all stuff she was saying was great.

44:39

But, you know, these are putting out there that this is our winning way, you know, anyway, I, the money for all those ads,

44:47

I know where it came from. It didn't come from Russia. It came from Beijing and it's being laundered through all these

44:54

NGOs and nonprofits. And, you know, the, the election interference and corruption is off the charts.

45:03

That's why I, I was on a program earlier today and I said, I'll be honest.

45:09

I have about a 3 % trust that the results of this election will have anything near a representation of the actual will of the actual

45:23

American people. So that's not a very high level of trust.

45:30

I'll, I'll be honest with you. It really isn't. So I made the mistake of looking over at Twitter for a second and a

45:41

Babylon Bee article came up about Tim Waltz. After motorcade involved in fender bender,

45:47

Tim Waltz adds purple heart to resume. Ouch.

45:54

Ouch. Oh yes. Okay. Anyway, um, what was I saying?

46:00

Um, my point being, wow, have things changed. They changed so fast that the big thing only 10 days ago has been subsumed.

46:13

It's not that it's disappeared, but it's been subsumed under the next big thing. And I wrote a, a, for a tweet.

46:21

It was a fairly lengthy tweet last night where I was, I was pointing this out, that we have experts on all this stuff.

46:31

And, and one week you've got to read this book, this book, this book, this book, or you can't comment. And the next week it's 3 ,500 pages of some other area, or you can't comment.

46:44

And all the people who are pretending to be experts hadn't, didn't know how to spell the name of the field the week before.

46:52

It's just, uh, it's, it's amazing.

46:58

And I really, it does emphasize for us. I think the fact that we really should be at this point in time, spending far more time rooting ourselves in eternal truths than in the exceptionally transitory man -centered last gasps of a once great society, because that's where we are.

47:24

That's what's going on. All right. So what I said last time, I'm going to move this over here.

47:31

I hope this, it's a downloaded file, so it should work. Is it 13 minutes to the hour?

47:41

Oh, great. I'm just gonna, I've not listened to this. Andy Robles, um, posted four brief videos in response to me.

47:52

And so I'm going to play them and respond to them briefly. I'm not gonna be able to do it very long.

47:59

I got other stuff to do today. I had to totally rearrange my schedule today, but, um, here we go.

48:08

So I'm watching, uh, Dr. White's latest video on the Crusades and all that kind of thing.

48:14

And, um, you know, and I'll just admit this. I'm not one of these, I've never prayed to God to, you know, earnestly to send me to be the guy to talk to the

48:24

Muslims. I've never, you know, had that prayer. So, you know, whatever. But, um, I did buy a doctor.

48:29

Well, um, what about being ready when the opportunity arises?

48:36

I mean, they're coming here. Sure. You can live, you might live in some area where there are just really no, no

48:46

Muslims at all. I realized there are people who live in those contexts, but the vast majority of us do live in contexts where there are mosques and there are

48:55

Muslims. And the question is, do we have any desire whatsoever to be ready to bear testimony to them?

49:05

Because I've, I've said this a million times before, it is far easier to get a Muslim to talk to you about Jesus than it is a secularist.

49:14

They want to talk to you about religion. They really do. And so a well -prepared

49:20

Christian, man, you've, you've got a wide open invitation. It's really cool.

49:27

White's book about Muslim apologetics. And the reason I did that called what every

49:32

Christian knows about the Quran is because at the time I had, you know, a handful of Muslim friends, like three or four.

49:38

And, you know, I wanted to talk to them about things and stuff like that. And there were friends of mine, you know, we had friendly relationships and all that kind of thing.

49:46

So, you know, you know, I evangelized those Muslims, you know, and that was, that's what you do when you have a normal relationship and normal friendship, you know, all that kind of thing.

49:56

Of course, you know, the gospel, we understand that. Yeah. But what about when you get in the, in the

50:04

Uber I've met, like I said, when I was overseas, every cab driver, every

50:11

Uber driver I had was a Muslim. Are we praying to have that opportunity? And it just seems to me that a lot of the guys that I was talking to last week would rather hack a

50:25

Muslim to death with a big long crusader sword than they would to invest the time to prepare their own hearts and their own theology and their own apologetics, their own evangelism to be able to speak to that person.

50:43

What I find so annoying about these videos, Dr. White, if you watch this, is that you try to like throw shade as if we don't understand that the gospel is the power of God unto salvation.

50:52

And maybe you just stab them and that's how you get them saved. I never said that, of course. But I have been blocking people right and left who, well, okay,

51:05

I did have people specifically say the crusades did not go far enough. What's that supposed to mean?

51:12

Or we need crusades today. Now, maybe some of them were talking about crusades against the Jews. But if you didn't see the number of people expressing their detestation, hatred for Islam, if you didn't see the response to Peter the

51:29

Hermit and his mob massacring Jews as they traveled through southern

51:36

Germany toward the holy lands where they themselves then got massacred, except for Peter the Hermit, what can

51:44

I say? You missed it. That's what I was referring to. But don't blame me for your not seeing what

51:50

I'm referring to. It hurts you.

51:55

I think you have a lot of good things to say about this topic, but it hurts your message when you pretend like these reformed guys are out there saying that.

52:02

That's not what they're saying. No, they are. I'm sorry you missed it, but they are. Those are the people

52:08

I'm talking to. If you didn't see the people saying the crusades didn't go far enough, we need it again today, then

52:16

I'm sorry. Then we're talking past each other because you're just ignorant of what I was responding to. That's fine.

52:24

Twitter isn't all that good at being able to see everything that's being said. Especially right now,

52:31

I've blocked so many people. 98 % of them have red avatars and blue eyes, but there have been others.

52:41

I'm not seeing a lot of stuff now because I don't want to. But there's a separate issue, though, because there's also there's

52:49

Muslims like my friends who I could talk to. And your book is very helpful for that. But then there are also like gangs of Muslims, you know, patrolling neighborhoods in Europe, you know, doing all kinds of evil things that they do.

53:06

And, you know, your book is not helpful to them when they're in the acts of doing it.

53:12

Of course. And there are Venezuelan gangs in Aurora, Colorado and in Chicago and probably literally every major city where they've started their activities or not.

53:27

What about the gangs in Chicago that have been there for decades? They aren't Islamic. They aren't anything.

53:33

They're just gangs. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's, you know, in in the

53:39

UK. The. The view of women and sexuality.

53:47

In Islamic countries. You've got higher views in the more educated places and lower in the others.

53:57

It's not, unfortunately, unique to Islam specifically. But, yeah, they they do terrible things.

54:07

And if you don't have the opportunity to actually talk with someone with some level of freedom.

54:17

Well, OK, back up the truck. What about all of all of our Christians living under Muslim rule in Pakistan and places like that?

54:25

They have to be incredibly careful. And no, they can't stop some gang from doing something there in Pakistan or something like that.

54:33

What do they do? They establish relationships over years. And yes, they do risk their lives to be

54:41

Christians in those places. But the point is.

54:48

I don't see these guys with the slightest interest. To be prepared to talk to anyone, they hate

54:57

Muslims, period. Period. That's just it. They're obviously the reprobates, not going to worry about them.

55:08

If you're going to say the crusades did not go far enough, we need more crusades today. If you're going to say, as one guy did about the.

55:19

Peter, the martyrs. Thugs massacring Jews. A Christian prince has the right to punish criminals under his domain.

55:34

That's what I'm talking about. That's what I'm talking about. And I've known for many, many years since I started dealing with Islam that I am unusual amongst the reformed community.

55:48

And that's sad. And that does say something about the reformed community. We should be up front, out front.

55:58

In doing deeds. Revelation chapter two, doing deeds in bringing the gospel to these people.

56:08

And risking our lives. And I would say to you that the

56:14

Christians who have risked their lives and lost their lives. Bringing the gospel into Muslim nations are far more to be emulated and lionized than any crusader who hacked

56:33

Muslims to death in supposed defense of Christendom.

56:39

One had the sword of vengeance. The other had the sword of the spirit.

56:46

Who will be honored in the heavenly halls? So like you've got to put a stop to that with the proverbial sword.

56:58

And when I mean proverbial, I mean, you know, we've got different tools now. Okay. But that isn't because of Islam.

57:08

We have to stop invaders in our country from attacking our citizens in the streets.

57:15

Because that is a violation of God's law. So I don't have any problem whatsoever if, you know, and there are so few cops in comparison to so many invaders.

57:29

If a call went out that we need volunteers who can arm themselves to help us to start rounding these people up and kicking them back out.

57:43

Fine. If I hear gunshots and screaming in my neighborhood and find a gang attacking my neighbors,

57:54

I am well -armed and I'm a darn good shot. I really am.

58:00

I don't care what Red says. Remember? Do you remember that?

58:06

We went shooting in Georgia after church one Sunday and I had an AR -15 and I just kept hitting that ping, making the thing jump around.

58:14

He said it was, he came up with every excuse on the planet as to why. No, I'm just a darn good shot.

58:20

That's all there is to it. And what I'm saying is serious. If, if, if they attack my house, if they attack my neighbor's house,

58:29

I will fight them. I will fight them. Not because, you know, if they're just thugs and I don't care if they're

58:39

Catholic thugs or atheist thugs, or I don't think there are any Jove's Witness thugs throwing doing new world translations through windows or something like that.

58:49

Read the Watchtower, you know, no, I don't think that would ever happen, but not because of that.

58:55

And look, I've thought about this for quite some time. It is not easy to know exactly how to draw the line when you do have a gang that is held together by some kind of alleged religious commitment.

59:20

Because I mean, I could argue from the Muslim side, there is no caliphate to be able to declare a state of jihad.

59:27

And therefore all these people are violating Sharia law. All right.

59:33

So they're, they're breaking their own law. You can make that argument. They're not going to care.

59:41

I'm not saying that it's wrong to protect men, women, and children or anything like that.

59:48

But certainly you can see the vast difference between defending my neighbors against lawless thugs and getting a hundred thousand people together, marching 2000 miles from your home, sewing the cross on your garments and painting it on your shields and engaging in absolutely barbaric warfare, both sides, barbaric warfare, beheading people and marching around the city that you're besieging with the heads of their friends on pikes.

01:00:29

Both sides did it. Both sides did it, but doing it because you think you're going to earn eternal life for doing it.

01:00:42

Come on guys. That's the part when I say it, you all stop listening. I don't ever hear any of you responding to that.

01:00:56

So there's a vast difference, isn't there? I admit there are gray areas.

01:01:02

I admit there are places where Christians might disagree. My point has been rather simple.

01:01:08

We have all sorts of people to lionize and to appreciate because of their laying their lives down in service to Christ.

01:01:21

Why, why, why are we lionizing at this point in time people who thought they were earning their own salvation by hacking

01:01:35

Muslims to death or anybody or Jews? What's the foundation of that?

01:01:43

So something's got to be done about those guys in addition to guys like my friends who we had normal conversations and a lot of really good conversations that your book was so helpful for.

01:01:53

Those are two different things though. Yeah, they are. And the crusades are a third different thing because unless you're just like everybody else willing to just dump the theology out, yeah, they thought they were earning salvation.

01:02:10

Yeah. Indulgences. Yeah. People, people authority. Yeah. Crosses. Really? Why is, why does that get lost?

01:02:20

I don't get it. And I think like when I think about my friends who are like, you know, talking positively about the crusaders, it's like, you know, these guys are, they are reformed.

01:02:33

They're not ostensibly reformed. It's just so it's, it's, it's, it's very, it's off -putting when you, when you try to throw shade in that way.

01:02:41

Well, I'm going to keep throwing it, buddy. I'm going to keep throwing it and I'm not going to apologize for it because if you can sit there and take people who have been lied to about the gospel, they think they're earning their own salvation on the basis of the authority of the papacy through indulgences.

01:02:58

Haven't you guys read the 95 Theses? Hello! What started the reformation guys?

01:03:05

Hello! You know, something got really, you kept saying you don't get it.

01:03:14

Yeah. I don't get it. When I say ostensibly reformed, if you can so minimize the definitional central aspect of the gospel that was a part of what happened and just push it out of the way, then you are only ostensibly reformed.

01:03:35

Or if as other people would have it, reformed is a tradition that has really nothing to do with the gospel anyways, then you can have it.

01:03:43

I don't want any part of it because whatever I've ever defended as reformed was founded upon the centrality of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

01:03:53

Galatians 2, they snuck in amongst us, their pseudodelphoi, their false brethren, we didn't put up with them for even an hour so the truth of the gospel would remain with you.

01:04:03

I have been right there for 40 plus years. So don't tell me that I've changed or you're throwing shade.

01:04:13

I'm standing right where I've always been. I haven't changed and I'm not going to.

01:04:23

Oh how dare you use the term ostensibly and you're the guys running around with your swords and your armor getting all mad because I said ostensibly?

01:04:33

Night! We're offended! Oh well. I'm sorry.

01:04:41

Get over it. Get over it. Get over it. It's like all this stuff, you need to debate

01:04:50

SEMA, on what? What specifically? Can we talk about that?

01:04:55

When I try to go, okay, here's all the issues, oh you're just running away or you're just...

01:05:02

Common sense has flown out the window.

01:05:09

I don't know where it went but it seems like... And you do it just kind of like it's no big deal.

01:05:19

What in the world is that? Hold on a second. Yeah. It's so annoying because you try to throw shade at people like well they don't get the gospel.

01:05:31

They don't understand that the papacy is not real. I thought we all agreed on that. We all liked Luther and as if well that's now in question.

01:05:38

It's not in question. We're just having two different conversations. Then you are not understanding the conversation you're trying to have because you cannot pull the foundations of the crusades out from the crusades and go, oh we can just simply...

01:05:56

Hey who cares if these people thought they were earning their own salvation? Who cares if they have been promised a plenary indulgence for the punishments of their sins?

01:06:06

Who cares if they say that it's the vicar of Christ on earth who's called...

01:06:12

All that stuff doesn't matter. Well it matters the reformation, right? Are you going to tell me that it's okay to go after Johann Tetzel with the 95 theses but I can't do the same thing today when people are saying, oh look, these people were great even when they massacred

01:06:35

Jews. They were great. There was a theological reason for that.

01:06:42

And we know what the theology is. And so I'm saying you are ostensibly reformed when you aren't making application of what you claim your reformed beliefs are, right?

01:06:58

That's the origin of the term. And I'm sticking with it because you've not given me a theological reason not to.

01:07:05

You're just saying, oh that's annoying. Yeah, I find inconsistency incredibly annoying.

01:07:13

I find people glomming onto stuff and abandoning what they thought we've listened to you for years.

01:07:19

You weren't listening very closely. Why in the world even engage in all these debates if this isn't something that remains vitally important to this day?

01:07:34

I don't know. I don't get it. You evangelize the Muslims, of course, but warriors that are going to defeat

01:07:41

Muslims are not... They're not trained to give the gospel because it's a different...

01:07:47

It's a totally different thing. Okay, so why are you lionizing?

01:07:57

Why are you telling Christian men to lionize those who with false theology and foundation engaged in these activities and that their theology is a contradiction of and a negation of what you believe the gospel is and that in fact the gospel is the only power of God given under the church?

01:08:26

Why do you do that? I'm just... I don't... I keep saying I don't get it because I don't understand.

01:08:33

We have all sorts of people that we could lionize. We have all sorts of people that we could be putting memes up.

01:08:40

The problem is they laid their lives down rather than taking someone else's.

01:08:48

And you're going, yeah, but they're... You know, we need to take on these gangs. Okay, fine, because they're

01:08:53

Muslim or because they're breaking the law? Because they're Muslim or because they're evil?

01:09:00

See the difference? And sometimes it gets all mishy -mashy together, but again, as far as I can tell,

01:09:14

I hear stuff going on my neighbor's house and I see people attacking them and trying to kill them.

01:09:22

My first duty is not to inquire about the religious nature of the people doing the attacking. Okay? But the crusaders had 2 ,000 miles of walking during which they could be considering the religious nature of the people that they were attacking that didn't even know they were coming.

01:09:47

And by the way, that weren't coming for them. Oh, I know. I saw somebody today. In fact,

01:09:54

I'm not sure. Yeah, I'm not sure if it's right there, but, and I'm not even going to get to probably get to this, but the constant meme over and over again, if it weren't for the crusades, we'd all be speaking

01:10:07

Arabic. Untrue. It's untrue. It's historical.

01:10:14

It's historically laughable. But we're repeating it so often it's becoming a truth unto itself.

01:10:21

So there, if you can't see the difference, I can't help you. Between purposefully, and I guess

01:10:30

I'm gonna have to spend some time, I hate having to do this, right now I'm juggling the commitment that I've already made to defending the biblical teaching of the atonement of Jesus Christ against the assertion that the only way to worship

01:10:55

God appropriately is in Roman Catholic mass, and that will be in just a little over a month.

01:11:05

That's where my mind should be, and that's where my research should be. But all you guys, you included, 80, are out there.

01:11:18

You need to, you know, encourage the young guys to be crusaders.

01:11:26

No, I would encourage young guys to be Adoniram Judson, patiently enduring torture and imprisonment for the name of Christ.

01:11:39

There's someone you can lionize. There's someone you can go, I want to be like that. Because see, that takes discipline.

01:11:46

That takes spiritual discipline. That takes taking up the cross daily. Not taking up the cross by putting on your armor, but by dying to self.

01:11:57

So you want a challenge? You want something to channel your young man energies into?

01:12:05

There it is. There it is. But I don't see you all talking about that.

01:12:12

And so I'm sitting here going, this is what

01:12:18

I've got coming up. This is where I should be focused. This is what has, because this stuff ain't gonna last.

01:12:26

This is not gonna last. Most people today cannot remember what the hot topic was two years ago this week.

01:12:39

Had no idea. This is not gonna last. Don't look it up. Stop it. This ain't gonna last.

01:12:48

So where do I put that effort? Because I want to spend, you know,

01:12:55

I'm a church historian. I would like to spend some time talking about the council in Clermont and how he lit the fires of crusaderism and why.

01:13:15

The how, the why, the when. Fascinating stuff. The vast majority of people, no earthly idea.

01:13:23

But to recognize that he dehumanized the

01:13:29

Muslims. Not only did he lie about what was going on. There were no Muslim armies marching toward even

01:13:36

Constantinople at that point in time. The Muslims were divided. They were fighting each other. So there was no threat.

01:13:43

And most of what the Pope said was going on were lies. And the whole thing was,

01:13:50

I can't really provide real evidence. I mean, the Pope did say in his sermon.

01:13:58

I'll just mention this real fast. The Pope did say in his sermon that one of the things the

01:14:05

Muslims were doing to get to rob Christians of their wealth was they would, the

01:14:14

Christians would swallow their gold so they would not have to give it to the Muslims. And so they would either give them stuff to make them throw the gold up or to have diarrhea to get it that way.

01:14:27

Or they would tie them down and rip them open and shred their intestines to get the gold out of them.

01:14:36

That wasn't happening. It was a lie. But by dehumanizing

01:14:43

Muslims as a whole, you created this, well, mobs.

01:14:52

Mobs are mobs. We've seen mobs, haven't we? Haven't we seen enough mobs recently? And that's what you got.

01:14:59

Peter the Martyr had a mob. They got wiped out. Okay. Then the first crusade arrives and they're professional soldiers and knights and they have military equipment and stuff like that and different outcome.

01:15:11

But it was still the dehumanization. Of the people you're sending tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people off to kill.

01:15:21

And that's what the Pope did. Oh, we don't need to worry about the Pope. We don't need to worry about the gospel.

01:15:28

We don't need to worry about the promises that were made. We don't need to worry about the cross that they were wearing and their representation and the fact that nobody, nobody, nobody following the crusaders were actually attempting in any way, shape or form to evangelize

01:15:44

Muslims. They're just the infidel. Why lionize that?

01:15:52

Why say this is what we should follow? It makes no sense. I can understand.

01:15:58

Let's, let's, let's look at an Athanasius. Okay. There's, there's a number of things in Athanasius' theology

01:16:05

I would disagree with. He was very influenced by the desert fathers. I get it. I get it.

01:16:13

But why not, why not lionize him? I mean, look at the impact he had for good in his life, but he never led anyone to take up arms.

01:16:28

He fled from his church five times. I get the distinct feeling that if I were to take his name out and just make him a theoretical person who ran from his persecutors five times and hid in the desert, that most of these

01:16:52

Arnold Schwarzenegger pumped up AI crusader guys with crosses on their chest would say, what a wimp.

01:17:00

Who in the world would want to be like him? Oh, loser.

01:17:07

Yeah. There's massive loser. And yet he stood against the world.

01:17:17

He stood against the world. What takes more bravery to be in a 10 ,000 man army wearing armor or to literally stand against the world as he did.

01:17:38

Y 'all can make all the little videos about me. You know, there was a little video last night, real toe tapper about sacralism.

01:17:48

Did you see that? Oh, sacralism and stuff like that. Most of you don't know what sacralism is.

01:17:55

So it's sort of funny that you make videos about it, but you can do all that you want 30 years from now, no one's going to remember this stuff.

01:18:08

What will be remembered is people who stood firm on the foundation of what

01:18:13

God's word teaches us. And when I look down through history and I think about the

01:18:21

Christians who have truly impacted Christ's church positively, none of them did so based upon a false gospel while hacking infidels to death.

01:18:40

Didn't happen. Now, some of them say, well, but, but, but there were some good people amongst them.

01:18:50

And some of my favorite late antiquity, early medieval

01:18:55

Christians had beliefs that I just roll my eyes at your tradition, but the fundamental difference is the why what's the foundation, why?

01:19:13

So that's, as far as I'm going to get with that, I'm sure there's more. Um, but you guys really, if you're going to make you want it, if you want to tell me what

01:19:28

I'm doing is wrong, here it is.

01:19:36

You guys aren't doing it. Not even trying. You're not even trying. AD pick it up.

01:19:44

Point me to it. Show me where I'm saying is wrong. Tell me that the people we should lionize are the people who acted on the basis of false teaching, false authority, and erroneous doctrine.

01:20:04

Didn't try to make Christ known amongst the people that they came after and bathe themselves in blood.

01:20:12

That that is how you build the kingdom of God. It's funny that movie about the crusaders are called the kingdom of God.

01:20:21

You show me that. Well, you should be an encouraging young people.

01:20:27

How did Paul encourage Timothy? He did tell him to be brave. He did tell him not to be a wimp.

01:20:36

And what did that look like? Stand firm, stand on the gospel.

01:20:44

And if it's so, so required of God, give your life. That's what he said to him.

01:20:54

Be strong by the spirit of God, not by the size of your sword.

01:21:04

So none of this, none of anything that I've said would have even been slightly controversial 10 years ago.

01:21:17

Yeah. Rich says two years ago. Yeah. And much of that's true, but I'm just trying to be, I'm just trying to avoid someone pulling one person up from, you know, seven years ago or something like that.

01:21:28

Wouldn't have been controversial. Wouldn't have been. And you say, well, you know, we, we don't want to, we don't want to discourage the young people, young.

01:21:43

First of all, I'm not your daddy. If you want a spiritual father, that's your pastor. If you're looking to me, you're looking at the wrong person.

01:21:52

Okay. I can provide you with an example over decades of time of seeking to be consistent in the defense of the word of God.

01:22:03

I can do that part. What I'm saying to you is if you want to be a manly man for Christ and take up your cross and join the death, take up your cross and join the death mark, because that's what

01:22:22

Jesus said. And if you read the story in Mark, you know what the result was?

01:22:29

All those people didn't follow them. They weren't, they weren't willing to take up the cross because I cannot imagine a greater contradiction than to think that taking up the cross in the crusades on your armor has anything to do with what

01:22:52

Jesus said when he said, take up your cross under Rome, because everybody knew what he was saying.

01:23:02

The cross was despised. It was Romans. Roman citizens could not even be crucified.

01:23:13

That was only for slaves. It was for the worst of the worst. There were people in the first century that wouldn't even use

01:23:23

Stauro as a term because it was, it was, it was like bad, bad words.

01:23:30

It was, it was beneath them. So when Jesus said, take up the cross, the crusaders did not understand what he said.

01:23:42

They were fundamentally denying what Jesus said by their actions.

01:23:49

So if you're going to, if you're going to say

01:23:54

I'm wrong, pick it up, show me. Am I, am I wrong about what

01:23:59

I just said about taking up the cross? Am I? Prove it. Am I wrong to say we have all sorts of examples of godly men and women that we can emulate the call for our highest commitment and discipline and the, and every fiber of our being to live in a way like they lived.

01:24:26

Are you saying there's nobody that we can point to? There are, there are many, there are many, but they don't fit into the muscular.

01:24:46

Got my gun. I'm going to go kill the infidel stuff.

01:24:52

That's worldly. Oh, it is. It's worldly. This is worldly.

01:24:58

So I don't have anything to offer to people who aren't willing to look at biblical examples.

01:25:05

I've never tried to, we've never tried to do that. We've, our focus has always been on those who would be willing to.

01:25:14

And what's the dividing line about? The very title dividing line is between those who believe the

01:25:19

Bible is sufficient in of itself to teach us how we are to live and to worship

01:25:24

God properly and those who do not. So we've always been, hey guys, here's where we are.

01:25:31

It's always been where we are. And Lord willing, that's always where we will be.

01:25:39

All right. Well, well that went 25 minutes longer than, uh -oh. Yeah. I just want to say you labored over the last few weeks to make a contrast between the blood of the crusaders and really the blood of the martyrs.

01:25:56

That's a big difference. The, the, the difference is, is huge. It's gigantic. And as we were talking about on lunch the other day, one of those, the original really, uh, that has struck me so deeply is teaching on Stephen and realizing the sermon that he gave as he stood before the

01:26:17

Sanhedrin and their reaction to him. And throughout that entire ordeal being dragged to the edge of town, he didn't cower, but as his life is being taken, he looks into the heavens and he sees the son of man standing at the right hand of God.

01:26:39

And this is who we are supposed to be emulating.

01:26:45

This is what we're supposed to be saying. We're just supposed to be doing all these things. Our mentality, our view of ourselves is supposed to be everything you've been saying.

01:26:55

And for these young men to say, I've listened to you for so long. Let me give you an example.

01:27:01

And you didn't get this. I, I've won before you give that example. One example, I've been trying to find it.

01:27:07

That's what I've been doing over here. I can't find it. But the tail end of one of these tweets was a young man talking about how we need to be saving them with the sword.

01:27:18

And I'm like, you mean the sword of the spirit? No, that's not what he means. And it's just breaking my heart.

01:27:26

So for having listened, they haven't heard anything. There's a guy, some guy named Reformed Resistance.

01:27:33

James White was essential in forming my theological thought. The pushback against him comes from the responses he made about the crusade.

01:27:41

He answered questions with animosity and stated, we do not understand the very essence of the gospel.

01:27:47

And again, let me tell you, if you think you can earn salvation from God by going and killing the infidel.

01:27:56

If you think indulgences are part of the gospel of grace, then you do not understand the very essence of the gospel and do not understand why the reformation took place.

01:28:05

I don't know why you call yourself Reformed Resistance. And then he said, and then someone,

01:28:12

Matt LePage had said, had responded to him and he said, we're past the time of being lectured.

01:28:20

We have seen our nation be pimped out and the Christian response is to be nice. We realize we are the ones that have to stop being nice.

01:28:33

That's disconnected from reality, first of all. Yeah. I just keep hearing Galatians 2 coming around in my mind.

01:28:40

I am so, I'm amazed that you have so quickly abandoned. And it's happening fast.

01:28:47

It's happening fast. And then one last thing here. Someone named

01:28:54

Lydia Eliza had put up a poll. I had not seen this, but this just popped up.

01:29:04

Because I believe we, the people, want James to debate Wolfe, regardless of whether or not Wolfe has formal debating receipts.

01:29:12

Share and poll it, folks. White and Wolfe should formally debate. Yes, 93%.

01:29:18

No, 7%. Then that's being quoted as, the people have spoken.

01:29:24

James and Stephen should make this debate happen. Even though Tucker's interview eclipsed the poll, 59 people still voted.

01:29:29

Okay. So 59 people, that's not a large group. One last time.

01:29:37

Program two days ago. I walked through, I read, what are we supposed to debate?

01:29:44

The debate challenge makes me the attacker of the Reformation. And I'm stunned at how many of you just didn't read what

01:29:53

I said or just did so with such prejudice. Has nothing to do with debate receipts.

01:29:59

It has to do with the fact that one of us has been defending the Reformation all along. And so how do you turn that around backwards without redefining what the

01:30:08

Reformation is? And so I said in the last program, the point is Stephen Wolfe's definition of the

01:30:14

Reformation is philosophical and political, not theological. So what are we supposed to be debating?

01:30:22

If there's been a response, I haven't seen it. If there's been a, well, we need to focus on this or focus on that.

01:30:30

And this is what actually, because see, to say that means this is what defines the Reformation.

01:30:36

And that's not an easy thing to substantiate, especially in a debate. So whoever

01:30:43

Lydia Eliza is, I hope you understand that, oh, you guys need to debate.

01:30:52

Debate what? I'm asking for specifics.

01:30:58

I have been very straightforward and there is nothing arrogant or anything else about my asking him to show me where he has defended the

01:31:10

Reformation before. Where have you defended the Solas? How is that not an appropriate question?

01:31:19

It's an obvious question. And the fact that you all don't seem to get it means you're not thinking seriously about the subject to begin with.

01:31:28

I think the whole election thing is just so emotionalizing people that it's just, all right, anyways, now we've gone way, way, way, way, way over.

01:31:40

Thanks for watching the program today. Lord willing, we'll see you next time.