MSL: April 2, 2024

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The following program is recorded content created by The Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live.

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Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry found online at karm .org.

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When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers, taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877 -207 -2276.

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Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome to the show. It's me, Matt Slick, and you're listening to Matt Slick Live.

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I hope you're all having a good day today and that if you are so inclined, give me a call and we can talk.

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If you have a comment or a question, all you have to do is dial 877 -207 -2276 and we can talk, easy to do.

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If you have a comment or a question you want to send via email, all you have to do is send it to info at karm .org.

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Info at karm .org, C -A -R -M dot O -R -G and put in the subject line, put in a radio comment or radio question and we can get to it.

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All right, all right, all right. Looking and checking and perusing.

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Let's see the various things we've got going. Okay, looks good. All right, there we go. So, hey, like I said, if you want to give me a call, 877 -207 -2276.

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So, we got a lot of radio questions and I got something on my mind too. So, later this month,

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I'll be here in Idaho speaking at a conference and they gave me a text out of the scriptures to speak on, put on the armor of God and they want me to speak on the issue twice, an hour each, expositing those scriptures and laying the foundation for equipping

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Christians. And it's gonna be interesting because I wanna get deep.

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I'm thinking what I'm gonna do is for the first hour, do just an intro -ish kind of a level thing and then the next hour,

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I'm gonna warn them. I'm gonna say, I'm gonna get deeper. I'm gonna get some complicated stuff, but I'm gonna have a slide show and all this stuff and lay things out.

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I think I'll do a, you know, get the handouts also.

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We'll see and do that as well. So, I'm looking forward to doing that. I gotta start prepping the lessons this week and I'll be converting it to PowerPoint, which

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I like to do. I've learned a lot of nice tricks in PowerPoint. I can make things move, slide, blend, all kinds of things.

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So, when I do stuff like that and I use those, I try and make it go really smooth so that people go, ooh, look at that.

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So, that's a lot of fun for me. All right, so we don't have any callers waiting right now. So, what I'm gonna do is get to some of the, some of the radio questions and comments.

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I got this one yesterday, who was King James? And I talked about that, how I answer questions like that from my wife in an irritating way.

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She says, who's King James? He was a king named James. And she gives me this weird stare, you know, like I said something wrong.

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So, there's that. Let me, let me get into, let's see, radio questions. Let's try this one.

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Oh, I can't, here's a, it's a, I don't know, why is it in the radio question thing?

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Because it's a link to something. And I can't, you know, I can't listen to a link or watch a link during that time, during now.

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Let's see, are either of the following views acceptable? Full preterism, partial preterism? That reminds me.

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So, last night, there's another apologist I'm friends with, Andrew Rappaport.

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And I went on his show. They were discussing martial arts and yoga. Can Christians do martial arts and yoga?

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And in the after show, we got talking about end times. So, anyway, and so, we talked about martial arts.

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I've done years of martial arts. And the other guys there in the panel all done years of martial arts.

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They even had a martial arts instructor there. They're all Christians. And so, we got talking about that. Yes, it's okay to take martial arts.

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And yoga, however, is, official yoga is occultic. And it goes into chakra balancing and energy movement and some weird stuff like that.

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And that's not good. But stretching and doing the same movements that yoga might have, you know, put your legs together and you're in a lotus position, you can stretch.

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Stretching's not gonna hurt you. We got talking about that as well. As long as you're not involved in the occult stuff, not a problem.

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And then we got talking in the after show with one of the guys about eschatology.

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Eschatology, preterism, full preterism, and post -millennialism and all millennialism and stuff like that.

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This is the after show. It was a friendly discussion, really nice. It was a good, friendly discussion. And so, we got, you know, point, counterpoint.

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And I developed something on the fly that I'd never thought of that is against post -millennialism.

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Now, I'm not saying it's a dumb position. No, I'm not. But I don't, I'm not a post -millennialist.

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The position is, is that the millennium of Christ is not a literal thousand years.

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It's a figurative period, which I agree with, considering how the term is used in Revelation 20.

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And where I believe things are gonna get really bad towards the end, they teach that things are gonna get really good towards the end.

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That's the basic view, that the gospel will go out, there'll be mass conversions all over the world, and things like that.

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And that's within Christian, with my own mental position, too. All right, so, we got talking, and I came up with something.

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I'm gonna share it with you and see what you think. So, my view is that things are gonna get worse and worse.

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And we got talking about something. I forgot how we got onto it, and I went, wait a minute. The Nephilim of Genesis 6, the

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Nephilim were the offspring, the half -breed offspring of the fallen angels and women.

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This is what the Jews always taught. This is what the Christian church always taught until the 500s, when it was ridiculed, and they came up with a different theory.

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But this is what the Jews had already held to, and I believe that position. In Genesis 6, where it talks about the

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Nephilim, it mentions in verse nine that Noah was perfect in all his generations.

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He was, his ancestry was uncorrupted.

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Now, why would that be put in there? You know, why would that be put in there, if it was just some other weird theory or something?

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But at any rate, so, what's interesting also is, I went to Daniel 2 .43,

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and Daniel 2 .43, it's in the context of eschatology, of the end times.

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Because in Daniel 2, it talks about Nebuchadnezzar's vision and the statue, you know, and the gold head, and the chest area is silver, and then waist is like bronze, and the feet are like a mixture of clay and iron.

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And so the feet area represents another kingdom.

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There's a lot of Christians say that's, you know, future or maybe present to us now.

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All right, well, what's interesting is that it says, and in that you saw the iron mixed with common clay, they will combine with one another in the seat of men.

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So the they, it's a problem. It says with the seat of men or in the seat of men.

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The Hebrew can be done either way. So, from what I understand, it cannot be people that it is discussing because the linguistics and something,

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I don't know. So they will combine with one another with the seat of men. They will combine with the seat of men.

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So that means that they is not the seat of men, but something else. So it looks like this might be in reference to the

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Nephilim. And the reason I'm saying this is because Jesus said, and as it was in days of Noah, so shall it be the days of the coming of the

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Son of Man, where they will be eating, they will be drinking, giving in marriage to the day that Noah entered the ark and the flood came in, took them all away, or the flood came and destroyed them all.

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And then two men will be taken, one will be left. That's the wicked who were taken, not the good. All right, so having laid all that out,

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I said that I said, so if we're gonna be getting better, then why does it say that at the end of the age, that as it was in days of Noah, that's how it's gonna be again, which was rampant wickedness all over the place.

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And I said, if we're gonna be getting better in post -millennialism, then why does Jesus say, as it was in days of Noah, so shall it be again in the days of the coming of the

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Son of Man. And during those time, it was profound wickedness and evil.

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And he goes, that's a good point, it's a good question. It wasn't like, hey, see, I got you. It was, he goes, that's a good point to think about that.

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And so it was a good discussion. And I just came up with that. And I thought I'd share that with you because by doing that helps me anchor it.

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All right, all right, let's get to Jackson from Los Angeles. Jackson, welcome, you're on the air.

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Hey, Matt, I had a question about God's predestination. So my question is, does

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God ultimately predestine the nature of man and not only his nature, but his will and his desire to commit sin if he's one of the non -elect?

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And does that include every action he makes or only some actions? Thank you. You have a super complicated question there.

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So we're gonna have to break it down. So you said, does he predestine, and then a whole bunch of things. So you said he predestined his nature, man's nature.

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So I don't know what that means to say that God predestines nature. What do you think that means?

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Or I don't actually understand. His inclination to be obedient or to be disobedient.

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So does he predestine it? Okay, then we need to define our terms. So predestination is the work of God to determine what occurs.

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And it says, for example, in Acts 4 .728, for truly in the city there were gathered together against your holy servant,

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Jesus, whom you anointed both Herod and Pontius Pilate along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel to do whatever your hand and your purpose predestined to occur.

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So we see right there that there is the predestining of God's purpose.

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And what happened was that Pontius Pilate and Herod, two individuals along with the people of Israel and the

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Gentiles, that's people groups, that they did what God predestined them to do.

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Now that's, it's just what it says. So let's look at some more examples of it.

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Let's see, Romans 8 .29. Those whom he foreknew he also predestined to become conformed to the image of his son.

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Now this is an interesting verse because it says those whom he foreknew he also predestined. It doesn't say of everybody out there he predestined a few.

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It says of those whom he foreknew he also, it's the same group. And then

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Romans 8 .30 says these whom he predestined he also called. And those whom he called he also justified.

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Then 1 Corinthians 2 .7, it says we speak

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God's wisdom, a mystery, and hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages for our glory.

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And then Ephesians 1 .5, he predestined us to adoption as sons. And Ephesians 1 .11, it says that we've obtained an inheritance having been predestined according to his purpose who works all things after the counsel of his will.

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So those are the occurrences of it except for one other one which is a weird one in Acts 2 .25

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for David says to him, I saw the Lord always in my presence. And that word saw is also from the word prorizo from predestined which is a different usage.

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All right, so the reason I went to the texts is because there's one, two, three, four, five, six occurrences of that, well, seven total.

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But six are in the context of what we're talking about. And I wanted to see what the scripture says so we get an idea of what it says.

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So we can say, well, this is what predestination is according to biblical doctrine. We know from Ephesians 1 .11

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that it's related to working all things after the counsel of his will. We also know that God predestines people and events to occur.

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And we know that those who he predestined he also called and that God predestined the wisdom from God from ages past.

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So when we get back for the break, we'll see if we can kind of summarize it a little bit and then go to the other parts of the question, okay?

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So hold on. Hey folks, we'll be right back after these messages. If you want, give me a call and at 877 -207 -2276, we'll be right back.

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It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276.

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Here's Matt Slick. All right, welcome back to the show. Let's get back to Jackson as soon as he is reactivated on the system here.

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And we'll get back on about, does God predestined acts choices of all people?

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Because it's a good question. So if they can activate them, I'm waiting. So we'll see.

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Maybe something's going on, I don't know. We got John from Georgia on the tag argument and Claudia's from Raleigh, North Carolina.

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Why is it Easter Sunday and not Resurrection Sunday? That's a good question. And so I'm waiting for Jackson to be activated.

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This is an unusual. So once I hit the hold button,

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I'm not able to unhold them. They have to kind of re -put them into place and then I can activate them.

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So give it another few seconds. If we can't get to it, we'll get to John. We'll come back to Jackson because we'll have to do that.

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All right, let's see. Three, two, one. Let's get to John from Georgia. Hey, John, welcome.

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You're on the air, buddy. Hey, Matt, how are you doing today? I'm hanging in there, man.

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Hanging in there. Okay, so what's up and what do you got? Yeah, the tag argument.

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Well, first of all, I just want to run it by you for a second to make sure I understand it completely because I know you like defining terms and everything.

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So tag, God is the necessary precondition for transcendentals like the laws of logic and such because he makes sense of it.

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Yes, universals, transcendentals, yes. Yeah, I have a problem with that twofold.

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One of them is since you're pre -assuming,

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I'm sorry, pre -assuming, I guess, forget my words I want to use, I'm sorry.

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God, the Christian God, can't you just presuppose the Muslim God or maybe atheists can presuppose, let's say, aliens?

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You understand what I mean? I mean, since you're presupposing, you're God, yeah. Yes, if you presuppose another position, then you see if that position can account for what we're talking about.

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And the Muslim God can't, for example. Within the issue of transcendentals are what's called particulars and universals.

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So if you're sitting in a room full of identical chairs, say 100 identical chairs, a church, a forum, it doesn't matter, well, what you're looking at is what's called a primary substance.

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You're looking at an initial chair. And then you look to your right, to your left, there's more chairs. Well, what you're observing is our particular manifestations of a universal called chair -ness.

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Get a lot of wind there in the thing. And so what you're seeing is the one chair and many manifestations of chair -ness, one and many.

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You're seeing universal particulars. Now this is, well, what's these words mean?

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What's the big deal? Well, in the Trinity, God is one and many equally.

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And this is important because that condition provides the necessary preconditions for intelligibility where the

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God of, or any single being God, single person God, like the

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God of Islam, can't provide the necessary preconditions because the nature of the universe is, from that perspective, is either one or many, either universal or particular.

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So is the universe comprised of many particular objects that are interrelated?

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But if that's the case, then what unifies them? And if without the unity, we can't have truth statements because we can't have coherence between the different objects.

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But if everything is one substance, then we don't have any way of justifying true distinctions because they're all of one thing.

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And if that's the case, then we undermine truth statements as well. So the idea of the universe being the nature of all things existing, being one thing or many things, proposes problems.

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If Allah is the one who created all things and he's gonna create out of his nature, out of his essence, he's gonna reflect what he is, not what something else is, but what he is, because nothing existed in Islam until Allah decided to create.

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Well, then when we ask the question, what's the nature of Allah? And if he's one, not plural, not one and many, but just one, then what we have is the ultimate nature of all things reflected being the one.

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And if all things are out of Allah's existence and made in his image, then that means the universe is ultimately of one thing.

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But if it's just one thing, it undermines truth values and becomes self -refuting. So I know

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I'm going quickly, but this is one of the reasons that the God of Islam can't provide the necessary preconditions for intelligibility.

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And when I spoke with a pretty knowledgeable, philosophically knowledgeable Muslim about a year ago on this, his response to that was, he was prepared, and his response was, well,

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Allah is one person, but the particular things he manifested are many.

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So he recognized the problem and tried to get around it that way, but it didn't solve the problem because it just didn't get into the reasons why.

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And I told him why it doesn't work. And he couldn't get past that. So this is why the idea of a

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Unitarian being God doesn't provide the necessary preconditions for intelligibility, but in Christian Trinitarian theology,

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God is one and many equally. So then when we look at the universe, we can say, is it one or many?

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We say, no, it's one and many. We can then understand the nature of the universals, which reside in the mind and the heart of God, as well as the particulars, which reside in the creative work of God.

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And we can then unify them by presupposing that he's behind all things. And then we can count for the universality, the laws of logic, and particular manifestations between you and me.

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Okay? Yeah. Well, I appreciate that, Matt. Last thing, because I know you got another caller in there.

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That's all right. I appreciate your answers and how you explain it, but do you have a, this, not just what you said, but do you explain it on call anywhere, or can

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I email you and maybe you explain it that way? Because as you know, a two or three minute call, you're not going to remember everything.

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So do you have anywhere I can go to maybe read that and have it?

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Well, let me see. I thought I wrote an article recently on this, but I write so many articles. I see calm, transcendental.

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Let's see if I have it. Specifically, my question, like why can't other, like you just explained the

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Muslim God account for, why can't anything else account for it? Like atheists might say, well, how about an alien that exceeded life or whatnot?

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As you know, that's an argument. The reason that's a problem is because if aliens are the ones who did it, where do the aliens come from?

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And are the laws of logic, for example, required in their minds as well as our minds?

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See, the nature of the laws of logic is that they're abstract entities. We can't find the laws of logic under rocks.

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We can't take pictures of them. We can't put them inside of a Ziploc bag. They are abstractions.

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They occur in the mind. And what's interesting is that these abstractions relate to material world perfectly.

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It's really interesting. Well, let me ask you, yeah, I'm sorry. Let me ask you one last thing.

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And I've watched your debates on it, and I can't remember if you answered or not. I agree, the laws of logic occur in the mind.

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I think it was asked of you, you asked, if there was no minds, they don't know that the laws of logic still exist.

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No, if there are no minds, because the nature of the laws of logic is that they are of the mind. When I've talked about this with atheists, they just say, no, they're not.

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I say, well, good, what are they? And they'll say, well, I don't know what they are, but they're not of the mind. Well, then I have a problem with that.

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If you don't know what they're not, how do you know, if you don't know what they are, how do you say it's not this or not that? Because it might be that.

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If you don't know what it is, it might be what you think it isn't. So it becomes really a problem for the atheists to say, well, no, the laws of logic are not abstract entities.

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Well, what are they? Oh, they're propositional truth -bearing entities, and they give up with something new.

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And so I researched that and I found out that there are different propositional theories within philosophy, and I say, which one do you wanna go with?

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Because each has its own problems. So the way to make sense of it all, if God's there, then that explains everything.

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The Trinitarian God, nothing else. Okay, buddy? Well, Matt, I appreciate the call, man. You have a good day. You too, man.

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God bless. All right, hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Please give me a call. It's Matt Slick Live!

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Taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276. Here's Matt Slick.

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All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. I know the last conversation we had before the break was a little bit heady.

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Sorry about that. But these are some of the discussions that I get in with on a semi -regular basis with atheists discussing universals, particulars, transcendentals, primary, secondary substances, abstract entities.

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And the only reason I have to know these things is because atheists would come to me and say, what about this? I gotta study it.

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And so I developed a philosophy outline. And I'm actually thinking about putting it online and where I go through the different philosophical positions and define what they are and then discuss their problems.

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Because every single one of them has problems, every single one. And so I'm thinking about putting it up.

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I gotta figure out how to do that because it would be like 100 articles really quickly.

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And I just can't quite, I ain't gonna figure it out. So this is one of the things I've been working on for a long time.

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And that's why I had those conversations because that's what's necessary in apologetics.

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And it's good stuff. The atheists do have a great deal of difficulty accounting for transcendentals as do, as they relate to particulars, as do the

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Muslims. And so this demonstrates the inefficiency and insufficiency of the secular and theological perspectives that we've mentioned.

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Let's get to Claudius from Raleigh, North Carolina. Claudius, welcome, you're on the air. Yes sir, good evening, sir.

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Good evening. Good evening. Yes sir, I just wanna know exactly why the

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Resurrection Day is popularly known as Easter Day. Easter, yeah.

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Are you there? Yes sir, you have any idea? What about Easter, where it came from?

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No, no, why is it popularly known as Easter Day and not Resurrection Day? Oh, why is it called

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Easter, not Resurrection? Okay, oh, I gotta yawn. It's because when spring began, it was in Europe, in the

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Germanic areas, that they would celebrate the arrival of spring and they would serve the goddess

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Ishtar. Ishtar is Easter. So it just kind of devolved into that frame, that pronunciation.

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And one of the symbols of the god Ishtar was, she was a god of fertility.

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Well, the rabbit multiplies a lot. So, hence rabbit associated with Easter, which came from the pagan origin of Ishtar.

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And that's why it's called Easter, not Resurrection Day. It should be Resurrection Day. Because what's interesting is that we celebrate this when spring comes, but that's in Europe.

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So anyway, I think it's interesting, but that's the history and its origin, okay? Okay, sir, thank you very much.

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You're welcome. All right, well, God bless. Hey, we have nobody waiting. If you want, you can give me a call, 877 -207 -2276,

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Donitis. If you are listening, you gotta email me at info, because we're trying to find the stuff you're emailing us.

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I don't know if she's listening right now, because I just got a word about stuff. And I'm like, what?

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No emails, can't find it. So, we're trying to figure things out. If she's listening, she'll know what it's about.

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And let's see, we didn't lose audio. We've got nothing, we've got nobody waiting. So, barbecue rabbit, someone says.

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Far out, man, it was a good movie. So, anyway, okay, let me get to, that reminds me, that reminds me,

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I got a little article up I released today, Marriage, Divorce, and Remarriage. And my ex -pastor, who's retired now, we got talking on the phone about stuff.

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And I said, you know, what are you gonna do when you're retired? He says, I don't know. I says, well, why don't you consider writing for CARM? Just writing some articles every now and then.

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And so, he presented one. And I released it today. It's an outline he did a while back.

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Now, this, he's an old Calvary Chapel pastor. So, we have all kinds of people who kind of contribute here and there to CARM.

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I write the great majority of stuff. But we have others that write an article here and there. By the way, yesterday, was it, over the weekend,

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CARM has passed the 162 million, 162 million views of individual visitors yesterday.

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So, or I mean, over this weekend, 162 million visitors we've had to the site. How about that? 162 million, so that's pretty awesome.

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So, there you go for that. And if you wanna give me a call, like I said, all you have to do is dial 877 -207 -2276.

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So, what's interesting is, people are telling me they've lost the audio. Here in, oh, in Clubhouse, you did.

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Well, I'm getting back into it to see if it's gonna help at all. But I don't know why or what happened. So, there we go.

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And if it works, it works. If it doesn't, it doesn't. Now, I'm back in. So, we should be good on Rumble and in the other areas.

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Good. All right, nobody waiting. Let me get us some calls. Oh, excuse me, not calls, but some emails.

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Some of the questions, some radio questions, stuff like that. All right, all right, let's see.

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How about this? In my reading, First Thessalonians happens on the day of the

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Lord, Second Peter on the day of the Lord, same day. How, where can I address with dispensationalists this fact that those happen essentially the same day?

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Thus, I need to refute their insertion of the seven years and millennium between the two events. Well, Conrad, the only thing you can do is read them the verses.

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Just read them the context. Just read it to them and just ask the question. So, where is the literal thousand years if the rapture occurs on the day of the

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Lord to come like a thief in the night and the new heavens and new earth are made on the day of the Lord to come like a thief? Where, how's there room for the millennium in between those, in those two statements?

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And that's the question. You just ask them. If they refuse to believe that they're the same day, well, you can't make them believe.

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It's just what it is. You have to deal with it. You just gotta say, well, okay. They just wanna say that it's something different?

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Then let them say it's something different. You can't force them to believe, all right? What I have done many times though is shown those scriptures to people and it really surprises them.

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It really surprises them. Just like I show two men are in the field. One is taken, one is left. I show them that it's not the rapture, but it's the wicked who are taken.

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And people are just, their eyes bug out. Well, what are you talking about? That's the rapture. I said, no, it's not. Read the context. And 100 % of the time when

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I've done that, they go, oh my goodness, it's not the rapture. And so it's really interesting to see people's reactions to eschatology when you just read things in context.

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And it really kind of surprises me because I will be there talking to somebody about something and they go, no, no, no, no.

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This is rapture. Well, let's take a look and read the context. And they're dumbfounded.

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Two men in the field, one is taken, one is left. And they just, they said,

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I've never seen that before. And I say, no, I know you haven't. And here's the question. I'll ask him, does your pastor teach this?

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Yes. And why is your pastor not teaching, seeing this too? Isn't he supposed to be reading the Bible, reading it, studying it?

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Because apparently what's happening is pastors are just repeating what they've heard. It's just what it is.

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It's the rapture. No, it's not. So that's always a concern for me. And so along the lines of the rapture occurs, like a thief that comes in the day, like a thief that comes, like a, what is it?

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How's that work again? A thief that comes, oh my goodness, now I gotta find it. Second Thessalonians, no, first Thessalonians.

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Yeah. And it says, the day of the Lord come like a thief in the night.

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I knew that was what it said. So that's what it is. And that's the same day that the new heavens and new earth remained, which means a rapture and the new heavens and new earth occur in the same day.

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Oh boy, oh boy, I just scared a lot of people. They're going, no, man,

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I love you, but you're wrong. Well, I'll say, okay, then call me up and just tell me why

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I'm wrong. I wouldn't mind being wrong. I don't have to be right about everything. The one thing I'll fight over is the

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Trinity, the deity of Christ, resurrection, justification by faith, things like that. I'll fight for that. But there's stuff, well, what do you got?

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Let's just see, maybe I missed something. I'm always open to that. And I've always enjoyed people not agreeing with me.

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I do, I like it. Okay, what have you got? And I open my mind and my heart to what they're saying because maybe they got something.

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That's my attitude. See, that's what's nice about what I do is I'm not loyal to denomination. I'm not a member of a denomination where I have to tote the denominational line.

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You have to agree to it when you sign up and you have to tote the denominational line in preaching and teaching.

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I don't have to, which is probably why I don't get asked to speak all over the place because I'll just say, well, let's do what it says.

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I'm not gonna go with a Baptist thing or the Presbyterian thing or the cessationist thing.

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It's just, well, there we go. People just, they furrow their brows at me.

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They furrow their brows. Oh, boy. Hey, folks, we got a break coming up right there.

33:56

And if you wanna give me a call, 877 -207 -2276.

34:01

We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276.

34:16

Here's Matt Slick. All right, welcome back to the show. Let's see, next longest waiting is

34:22

Kay from Durham, North Carolina. Welcome, you are on the air. Are you there?

34:31

Hello, Kay. I'm waiting for you. I'm waiting.

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So let's, oh, I heard a noise. There you go. Hi. Can you hear me? Yes, I can.

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Yes, I can. So what do you got? I wanted to know, I wanted to know if you are indwelled with the

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Holy Spirit as soon as you ask God for forgiveness to come into your life, or are you, do you have to speak in tongues to know that you have to indwell in the

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Holy Spirit when you ask for forgiveness? No, you do not have to speak in tongues.

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No, you do not have to speak in tongues to have the Holy Spirit, not at all. And so you have the

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Holy Spirit when you receive Christ, you trust in Christ as Lord and Savior, and you are cleansed, you're justified, the

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Holy Spirit lives in you. Some false religious systems will say that you have to get the

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Holy Ghost, you gotta speak in tongues, that's how you know you've received the Holy Spirit. That's a load of crud, all right?

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It's one of the evidences of, that you have the Holy Spirit. A greater evidence is found in John 16, eight.

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When he, the Holy Spirit, when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin, righteousness, and judgment.

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So I wouldn't look to speaking in tongues as a manifestation of the Spirit, I'd look at what's the

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Spirit doing in your heart and your life in regard to your sanctification? Because he convicts of sin.

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If there is no conviction of sin, but you wanna speak in tongues, I wouldn't say such a person has received the

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Spirit. But if the person is convicted before God, before people of their holiness, their lack of holiness, that is, their sin, and they don't speak in tongues, that is better evidence for the presence of the

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Holy Spirit. Okay? So if you're baptized, are you saved because you're baptized?

36:31

No. No, it sounds to me like you're mixed up with a United Pentecostal, United Apostolic cult.

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Uh, I don't know if you are or not, but those false religious systems are cults.

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They teach that you must be baptized to be saved, baptized in Jesus' name, with the evidence of speaking in tongues, and that's how you know you're saved, and that those are doctrines of a non -Christian cult.

36:58

Both of them are cults. Okay. Wow. Yeah. Okay. Well, thank you.

37:08

Yes. Thank you. Have a great day. You're welcome. And God bless, Kay. Okay. All right.

37:15

Okay. You know, um, I know that there might be some UPC, United Pentecostals, or United Apostolics, who believe in oneness and the necessity of baptism and speaking in tongues and all that stuff.

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If you get a good representative of your religious system, I'd be glad to have a public formal debate with them on this.

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Flat out. Is the Trinity true? Must you speak in tongues to be saved? Must you be baptized in Jesus' name?

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Be willing to debate these publicly, recorded, moderated debates.

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Be willing to do that. Because I will stand on the truth.

37:52

And the United Pentecostals is a non -Christian cult. United Apostolic, non -Christian cult. Okay.

37:58

So there you go. And, uh, Miguel from Minnesota. Welcome.

38:04

You're on the air. Thank you very much, sir. I want to speak on the topic of general revelation, specifically as Paul addresses it in Romans chapter 2, verses 12 through 16.

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As you know, there are many people that have a debate that, depending on the light that you get from general revelation, if you're faithful to it, then you will eventually lead to the

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Lord. How do you mesh that with the doctrine of predestination?

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Is that something that you feel that is someone who is predestined, will seek the

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Lord, even if they're in a tribe in Africa and have no access to the gospel, God will somehow get them to that point?

38:54

Sure. He can do whatever he wants. Right now in the Middle East, in Muslim countries, they are having thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands are having dreams.

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Muslims are having dreams of Jesus. You're breathing into the mic. Okay. They're having visions and dreams of Jesus, and they're coming to faith in Christ.

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There are countless stories of different cultures all over the world where they have remnants of the biblical gospel woven into their cultural antiquities.

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And so God has his way of communicating. Now, it can only be through Jesus Christ. Some people say, well, it has to be a formal preaching of the gospel for them to be saved.

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I don't necessarily agree with that. I'm not saying we don't preach the gospel, but I do believe that God can certainly communicate his will to people, as the

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Muslims are being communicated in visions and dreams, and they're trusting in Christ. They are looking to him as the

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Savior. And I don't know what their knowledge is about his deity or resurrection, but I think that they're getting saved, and then they will gradually come to that truth and that knowledge.

39:59

I have no problem with that. So general revelation, you mentioned Romans 12, excuse me,

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Romans 2, 12 through 16. The context there is that Paul had already condemned the

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Gentiles under their slavery of sin and their unrighteousness in Romans chapter one.

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And so the Jews, because he's addressing the Jews here in the Roman church, he's setting the

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Jews up. What he's doing is saying, well, they're wrong, aren't they? The Jews, as they're reading the letter or hearing the letter, are going to say, yes, that's right.

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They're in, the Jews, excuse me, the Gentiles are lost. They don't have this. They don't have that.

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But he goes on, and in Romans chapter two, verse one, he says, therefore, you have no excuse, everyone who passes judgment, for in that you judge another, you condemn yourself, for you who judge practice the same thing.

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And in verse 17 of chapter two, but if you bear the name Jew and rely on the law and boast in God and know his will and prove the things, you know, and he goes on.

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So the context of Romans two is that what Paul is doing is showing the

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Jews, you're right, Jews, the Gentiles are condemned.

41:12

They have their problems. And Mr. Jew, isn't it true that if you do what's right, you're going to be okay? Well, look, hey, there are actually

41:19

Gentiles who behave better by that law than you do. And that's the point of what's going on there.

41:26

He says, and according to what he's talking about, he said, they'll be justified, won't they? Because he said, according to my gospel,

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God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus. So what it looks like is

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God has his way of communicating his gospel truth through the work of Jesus Christ to people anywhere he wants.

41:45

He's not restricted to the formal preaching of, you know, the five, you know, the

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Romans road, or you must preach law, then gospel. I believe that this is normative and this is how

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God does it. And we need to preach that gospel. But God has his way of bringing people into the faith and he can open their hearts and their minds to believe in him.

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And he can certainly manifest to them in visions and dreams and in person and bring them to faith, just like he did with Paul.

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And Paul didn't know who Jesus was in a lot of areas until well after he got saved in Acts chapter nine.

42:24

So, OK. And do you believe the quick follow up?

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Do you believe that that's how it was also in the Old Testament, that there were people who lived in other lands who didn't have access to Jewish people with, you know, with what they had with the knowledge of the law and whatnot.

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And God spoke to them through some manner to get them to be saved as well, because they did earnestly seek the

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Lord. I don't know if that's true or not true. The Bible doesn't tell me and I can't answer.

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But I can say that if anybody outside of the Jewish context is saved, it's they're saved because of the work of God upon them, drawing them and whatever that would be and mean for them at that time.

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But God doesn't say that in the scriptures. He doesn't talk about it, though. There were others who believe like the centurion, the

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Roman centurion believed in the true God and was undoubtedly saved in the

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Gospels. So I think it's possible, but I can't I wouldn't die in that hill. It's certainly possible that everybody went to hell, but I'm not going to die in that hill either.

43:37

The Bible just doesn't tell us. OK. Thank you, sir. You're welcome.

43:44

All right. I appreciate it. All right. God bless. All right. Let's get to Bob from Nebraska.

43:50

Bob, welcome. You're on the air. Thanks, Matt. Hey, as Christians, we believe that all of our sins were forgiven by Christ on the cross, right?

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They the sin that was canceled by Christ on the cross. Colossians 214. Yeah, OK.

44:07

And that includes all of our all of the sins past, present and future, even if we aren't anymore like asking for forgiveness of the sins, because it all happened back 20 centuries ago, right?

44:22

Yeah, yes and no. There's a little bit yes and no there. But but keep going. Well, I mean, what's the no part?

44:29

Because that part does confuse me a little bit. So how would you better explain that?

44:34

Understand? Are you a Christian? Yes. OK. So Jesus bore our sins in his body in the cross.

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First, Peter 224. And he canceled the sin debt at the cross.

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Colossians 214. The certificate of debt, the caragra fund. This was done at the cross.

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So the canceling of the sin debt is not accomplished when you believe. It's accomplished by Christ on the cross.

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Now, there's been people away, but that's what it is. We do not activate the efficacy or the power of the atoning sacrifice based on our goodness, our belief.

45:12

We don't activate it. It is active because of what God did on the cross. It's accomplished because of what

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God designed, not because of what we do. Now, we are not then when we believe.

45:25

This is the it's called the now and the not yet. It's a theological perspective that is now for Jesus, but not yet for us.

45:35

He bore our sins, yours and my sin, you know, our future sins. But we were not yet.

45:40

Well, how can he do that? Well, relationship of time and things like that. Anyway, whatever.

45:45

God did it. And so all of our sins past, present, future, your sins and my sins past today's and tomorrow's and the days after are canceled at the cross.

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All that sin debt. So when we pray like, you know, you do something wrong today. I do something wrong today.

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We go get our knees. Lord, I'm sorry. Please forgive me. Well, the sin debt is already forgiven, but it's already canceled.

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But we are seeking that present forgiveness because it's the reality of our condition now. So it's the now and the not yet.

46:18

Yeah. Go ahead. OK. So so the

46:25

I guess the the passage and I really struggle with then, if that's the case, because I guess what you're saying is sin's already been forgiven.

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We're just kind of asking for forgiveness for ourselves. It's it's not it's not a reality anymore for God because sin's already forgiven.

46:43

And once we accept God as our Lord and our savior, then we don't need to ask for any sins from then on out because we're believers and the sins have already been forgiven.

46:52

Is that a clear? Well, when you say need, I say, yeah, we do need to still go to the cross and say,

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Lord, you know, I just please forgive me. And when I do that, I know I'm already forgiven.

47:05

But yet I need forgiveness. It's again, the now and the not yet. Mm hmm.

47:12

So then if you look at John 20, 21 through 23, he said Jesus goes into the upper room and says, the father has sent me, so I send you.

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And he tells them that they that the apostles have the ability to forgive sins. No, if you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven.

47:28

If you retain the sins of any, they are retained. That's not right. And so we're out of time, but I want you to call back tomorrow.

47:36

I suspect you're a Catholic or an Eastern Orthodox. But what it actually says in the Greek there in John 20, 23, is not they are forgiven, but they have been.

47:44

And it's a perfect tense, which means the sins that they have proclaimed to be forgiven, how already have been.

47:49

That's what's going on in the text. Hey, we're out of time. OK, we are. Call back tomorrow. OK, buddy. Hey, folks, hope you enjoyed the show.