Dead Men Walking Podcast Greg Moore Jr. & Josh Stacey Episode 2

Introduction and Testimony of God’s Rescue

Exploring theology, doctrine, and all of the fascinating subjects in between. Broadcasting from an undisclosed location. Dead Men Walking starts now. Well hello everyone, welcome to another episode of Dead Men Walking.

Glad to have you along. I have a very special guest today, Joshua Stacy. Mr. Josh Stacy. What do you go to, by Josh or Joshua? Either one works for me. Either one works. Well he's just a great guy and just a brother in the Lord and we're gonna learn a lot from him.

But thanks for tuning in guys. We're on Apple, we're on Pandora, iHeart Radio, Spotify, all the places you can find your podcast. Download it, stream it, listen to it. Please do and make sure you leave us a review and subscribe and tell people about the podcast so God can be glorified.

So Josh, how you doing today? I am living the dream brother. Living the dream. We're gonna get into all kinds of stuff today. It's gonna be very interesting. I know we're gonna talk about the Mosaic Covenant, Ark of the Covenant and how it reflects Jesus Christ, which is an absolutely beautiful thing.

But before we do Josh, why don't you just tell our listeners a little bit about yourself, a little bit of your bio, your testimony and where you are today. Absolutely. It really began for me about eight years ago.

I was in one of the lowest places of my life. Drug addict, alcoholic, slowly going down the road to hell, as ACDC would play, right? And the Lord was kind to me in the midst of my brokenness and found me at one of the deepest points in my life and pulled me up out of that miry pit, man.

What a great verse too. Yeah. So you were just going wild. Wild. Like the exact opposite of the direction of God. Absolutely. Our stories are similar there I think. Yeah. Absolutely running from it and really just screwed my life up.

I was looking at one point at life in prison. I had 37 to 52 years over my head and the Lord just brought me to the place where I came to repentance. I really cried out to Him and really just began to seek Him with all my heart.

I'd grew up going to churches, all that kind of stuff. I probably said the sinner's prayer a thousand times. Sure. But never really met Jesus, never really knew what it was to experience the love of God.

And it happened one day in the shower when I found out that I was looking to never come home again. And I really cried out to God. And I was still backslidden. I was still using drugs. I was on house arrest.

And the Lord just steadily began to move me and use people in my life to really pull me towards Him to the point where I was going the day I was going before the judge. And I went and stood before him and the judge even said, I don't know why I'm doing this.

I was two weeks sober at that point finally. I had went to, I got a DUI and I had to go for a three-day hotel visit, go for some reprogramming. Right. And I ran into a guy that I had literally partied with for years all through high school that was clean and sober for first time I'd ever seen him in my life.

Yeah. And through that, Lord brought me to AA where I learned to pray. Wow. Don't give, I don't know. The Lord can use anything for His glory. Exactly. Even AA. Even AA, man. And so I'm two weeks sober.

I'm standing before the judge and he's saying to me, I don't know why I'm going to do this, but I'm giving you two years. Huh? Life. And you were looking at possibly life. Possibly life. They offered me a plea deal, um, different things.

And it came that day where even, um, the prosecutor was begging for me to get eight. Wow. And the judge literally, like I still have the transcripts. I'll look at it from time to time. And it says, I don't really know why I'm doing this, but I'm going to give you two consecutive 24 month sentences and I'm going to run them concurrent.

Wow. Usually most, most of the time the judge will align with the prosecutor. I mean, they work hand in hand in recommendations. They really do. The fact that he was even pushing for eight, which he probably thought that was a deal.

Cause you were looking at what'd you say? 32 to life. Yeah. And even with my deal, um, it was two to 10. So that was a higher end and the Lord just had a different plan for me. Yeah. And so I started my steady progression.

Cause even at that point I had, I had no knowledge. I barely had read the Bible. I thought I knew some stuff about God. And, um, and so I got shipped off to prison and I went through a wild, crazy journey.

My first six months traveling from camp to camp. And when I finally got to my home camp in Chilicothe, I met an ex-Aryan nation enforcer turned Jesus freak. Okay. And he introduced me, which at that point I was a very prejudiced, very racist young man.

And the Lord used this guy came from the same type of lifestyle as me and been reformed to introduce me to these group of guys, uh, black men that, uh, did this Bible study in the midst of prison where we gathered together on the yard.

We did praise and worship. We were gathering together every day, uh, five days a week studying in the middle of the gymnasium while basketball, weightlifting, all this stuff's going on around us. And we would sit and fellowship and it changed my whole life.

Prison as Ministry School and the Power of a Changed Life

Oh, isn't there, isn't there just such a great experience to the closeness and intimacy of God in brokenness? Oh my goodness, man. It, it was, it's just, it's amazing. Yeah. And it, it was so like him.

He took me to this place where like, I had, I had nothing like I could have been doing other stuff, like, especially at the camp I was in, I could have done whatever I wanted, but the Lord placed me with all these guys, even surrounded me with one.

I, my buddy Blake, the, um, Aryan nation enforcer was bunk next to a dude from defiance Ohio, which is around near where I was originally from. Okay. That was a, uh, Darwinist creation, like arguer, like super, he practiced Buddhism, all this stuff.

And we would all just sit there and have debates and sit there and talk about different things, talk all the crazy stuff. It was amazing. Some good church is what that was. Oh my goodness. Yeah. And, and now that same dude where literally even in prison, um, like, I don't know if I would do the same thing now.

He, he was complaining to me one day that he, he could go down to the chapel and any Christian could go down there and get their book. But him being a Buddhist, he was excluded. So I actually bought him a Dhammapada, which is there like scripture sure.

And, and had it ordered in so that he could have his own blew his mind. It was super cool. And now that same brother, I talked to him about two years ago when he got out, he got put into a halfway house and got saved.

Awesome. It's incredible, dude. So the Lord just was so kind that he used prison to be the first place I ever went to ministry school. And I was surrounded by such, I like how you called it ministry school.

Oh man, it was, I learned to evangelize there. I learned to share the gospel with people that literally did not want to hear it. At one point I was in a bunk with guys that were Muslim five percenters that if you try to talk to them about Jesus, they will tell you that.

What does five percenter mean? They, it's a super, it's kind of the strictest kind of, yeah. And it's minimalized to a certain people group and all these different things where me and my skin color were not welcome to them.

Right. And if you even tried to approach them and mentioned Jesus, they would threaten to kill you. Right. And that was your bunkmate? Yeah. I was literally across the row. He was the dude that ended up doing my laundry at one point.

So like being surrounded in there with people that had such a diverse faith from what you had. And we had so much favor in the prison that we were in. We were allowed to have prayer groups of 50 or more people.

You're literally not supposed to be able to gather in groups of four or more. Wow. We, um, like doctrine bootcamp for international religions. Yeah, it was rowdy. I bet you there's people who go to seminary that don't learn as much in this short of time.

Exactly. Oh man. And just seeing the way God moved there, seeing us, uh, working with my dude, Blake, who would sit and get to minister that were, uh, to guys that were still in the Aryan brotherhood and all of that, talking to them about their faith and what they believe and being able to share Christ with them.

Just different things like that. Like you don't, you're not supposed to get those opportunities in there. Right. And getting to share with CEOs. Like we got to minister to CEOs at different points and even see God use CEOs to be able to protect us.

We were doing a Jericho walk at one point. Really? And we ended up half of us got thrown in the hole for it. Where some guys just jumping on board. Like maybe these walls will come down. I can get out of here.

No, most of prison break. That is a great show. If you've never watched it before, I watched it before I got locked up. It gave me some weird ideas and it got shut down real quick. Yeah. But, uh, but no, um, even the midst of like, there's a Sergeant screaming in our faces and saying, you're going to segregation, you're going to segregation in this, uh, wonderful CEO.

Her name was miss Smith. She was, uh, straight from West Virginia and she walks into the room and everything changed. Like it was like God walked in with her and the dude changed his entire tone and let, let the two of us go.

The other two, cause there was only four of us going around. It was, it was really amazing. I have probably said this so many times in my life, but it, it just remains true. Like men, humans, mankind, we try to convince the mind and move on the mind and the Lord moves on the spirit.

And when he has chosen to use someone or to convince or to move them in the spirit, like your judge, like your CEO, like the people around you, there's no resisting it. Uh, to, to the, to the point of, um, you just have to sit back and you just go, wow.

Mind blown. I mean, the Lord moves on people's spirits now in my life and I still know what's going on, but I still just get that all in wonder of God, you're so awesome. Like it, it makes no logical sense.

There's probably no way I could convince them or debate them or argue them or bribe them or, or, you know, whatever it is that I could do to try to get something accomplished. And then on top of that, the Lord does it in such a mysterious and cool way that you just go unbelievable.

Because when you say, when you tell that story to you, me knowing you and you just being, you know, who you were back then without the Lord and being a hustler and, and, you know, just hard worker and the whole thing, you could have went to prison or into jail and just went a totally different route.

You got hooked up with a, you know, with a, with guys, with a gang, whatever you want to call it. And you probably could have been running stuff in there and getting deeper into the things that the Lord was pulling you out of instead.

It's a refining period. It's like I said, it's doctrinal bootcamp, it's church. And, and so what did, so did you serve your time and then come out of there just like on fire? Exactly. Um, so as I was saying, uh, Blake introduced me to this group of guys and my brother, Rudy, my first Bible teacher, one of the most extraordinary men that I know, I, uh, I can't, he's just, he, he was a father when I had none and, um, just invaded my life, man, taught me, taught me everything, taught me how to read the word correctly, uh, taught me how to, um, study the word, taught me how to live the word, taught me how to disciple others, how to be a pastor.

Like he was preparing me and his biggest thing, it wasn't to get some people to learn the Bible. It was to prepare, prepare men to go home and to be who God created them to be. So when I came out the gates, I was ready.

I was gonna, I was gonna go start a church. I was ready to go do whatever God had for me. And it, even when I first got home, uh, right around five years ago, it startled people in my life. Like I came out, my mom and them, they had like, they'd came and visited me in prison.

They read my letters. And, but when I came home, they realized like, Oh, like, yeah, something was way different because even when I, when I told them I was, I was done doing dope. When I told them that I was done drinking, sure.

They laughed at me. Right. Yeah. Right. Normal response. Like they had seen me, they'd heard it, yada, yada. And in, and when I came home, they saw it and they were like, wow, they knew. And now both of them, I've seen an enormous transformation in their lives.

My mom comes to church with us. Now she comes to our Bible study. My sister, her husband, both go to church. It's been amazing. And I've seen widely used term revival in my own family to see God really moving on them because my sister was the one that when I was an evangelistic atheist growing up, she was the one that was a part of the Lutheran church in our hometown.

She did the whole acolyte thing all the way up through high school. My mom, same thing. She had been raised a Catholic and then Lutheran and had always had the relationship, always was praying for me when I was off doing dumb stuff.

And then now getting to see their lives transformed. It's, I have finally pursued after God and taken the role in my family the way I should have when my dad passed away 11 years ago and seeing what God has done to transform their lives.

Literally this year, all three of us got new houses. Oh, that's awesome. Only favorite God, like, right. And it's absolutely his poetic justice, man. Yeah. The way he does things. It's just been phenomenal.

It's, it's awesome to see when your obedience to God actually blesses others. Oh, man. It's crazy how that covering of blessing. I mean, even David says it in the Psalms. He's like, let you the shadow of your wing, let your blessing encompass my children, my children's children and my children's children, children, meaning generational blessings.

Yeah. Because of one person's active obedience and sacrifice to the Lord. Exactly. And it's so cool when you come out like that. And actions speak louder than words, man. Yeah, I think we have, you know, some real issues in the Western Christian church.

And funnily enough, your third world countries don't have this, this problem that much is we're all about what we say, and not so much about what we do. There's a lot of preachers and teachers and leaders that will tell you what to do.

But you don't see the action in their life. Yep. And when I've been to Nicaragua in India and Thailand and these other places, and I see these Christians that are either being jailed or beaten or tortured for their faith, the action, the actual discipleship in their life speaks far louder than any words they say, come on.

And it's, it's so cool to see that in your life. I'm gonna give you a compliment. I know you're not comfortable with them. But for people listening, I've seen that gospel walked out in actions in your life.

And that's so exciting, because I will take and you're good with words, too. Don't get me wrong. I've heard you preach. I've heard you teach. Absolutely love it. But I'll take someone of action in the gospel over someone and words in the gospel any day of the week.

Come on, because we can change the world. Absolutely. You know, and that's why even, like preaching the gospel, and also living it is key. That whole phrase of preach the gospel and then use words like, I think that gets thrown around a little I like that.

It can be right, though. But if people actually have to live it for it to actually be meaningful, and that was exactly what I learned in prison. It was how to actually walk it out. And, and I appreciate it.

And I know, yeah, like, for me, I, we all get it wrong. Yeah, but but, um, the, the Lord, and I definitely agree with you, the Western Church, what they really miss out on is the character. Sure. God cares about character, he, he sees the intense of our hearts.

And when we're really about it, when we're really practicing what we preach, it's going to be evident in our life. And there's fruit, then there's people are attracted to that. They are. I mean, that's even in the secular world.

I mean, leadership is done by example. Yes, it's not done by, you know, we all have bosses in our lives. We all have supervisors and managers, and no one likes them when they tell you to do something, but don't do it themselves.

Yes, look at they teach you that 101. When you go into boot camp, like we're all a unit, and we don't expect any yet. Yes, there's a hierarchy of command. But everything I tell you to do, I can do and will do and I've got your back and you've got mine.

And the Christian faith is really like that, too. Yeah, you know, between the fellowship of brothers and sisters in Christ, and not only that, but acting out what the Lord commands us to do and not just commanding other people to do it.

Absolutely. I think that's a beautiful thing. And I think it's a very effective thing for for evangelism. Absolutely in the kingdom. So you you get out. You're you're a different person. I'm sure you get all those run ins with friends that you'd seen years before and they look at you weird and sideways and go What?

You're not doing what anymore? You know? Yep. So you kind of got to readjust your social life, your family life, everything, everything. I went through that as well. Not not from prison. I should have been in prison.

But the Lord was gracious enough to refine me in in my home, instead of prison. But so you get out and then where do you go from there? Because that's just what five years ago, five years ago. And now I look back at it, man.

And God has just been so good to me. So good that I don't deserve it. It's incredible. Looking back, because one of the great things that happened for me, and one of the things I had prayed for so much in prison, there were two things.

One was to find a really great church community, which I found through my my home church city light, and then also through the community of Emory Toledo. Some of the brothers and sisters that I've done ministry with in both my church and in Emory Toledo have impacted my life in such a way.

That's even how I met you. I believe was through a number. Yeah, we're gonna have we're gonna have we're having Savannah on soon Joe Liggett, who kind of took the reins of that he's going to be on the podcast in the coming months.

But what a great ministry that was to bringing different churches together and just to glorify worship praise preach that preach the gospel that the book. Yeah, that's kind of where we met even I think before city later right around the same time.

Yeah, about that long ago. Yep. Yeah. So you got involved in that stuff. Yeah. Which that was one of the things that also aided in my continued accountability in discipleship was being around other on fire believers that were passionate about Jesus passionate about spreading his kingdom spreading the gospel and about actually living and walking it out.

And, um, and as I've done it, I met my wife, which is another really crazy, crazy testimony, because love me some amber. Oh, man, great girl. She is she blesses me and refines me more than anybody else in this world.

Yeah. Through Jesus using her in my life, I would I know that I wouldn't be here. And I know that I wouldn't be the man of God that I am now if it wasn't for her impact. Literally, three weeks I met her after I got home from prison.

Oh, wow. I don't know you guys knew what you knew each other that yes. Right? Yep, we so I got out of prison February 24. It was six weeks. Okay, I'm usually I'm good with dates. Um, I started attending city light a month later, March 22.

And then I met her April 7 at Ember. She was a coffee girl, I walked in, and the Lord captured my heart for her, man, I literally, I wouldn't always call it this, but I had a encounter where the Lord highlighted her to me and showed me and I knew that she was going to be my wife.

And she friend zoned me with a friend zoned wall that was taller than I think any Donald Trump could hope to build. And, and we became best friends. And I pursued her for nearly eight months. And then the war, the Lord brought those walls crashing down.

And friends, friends, history, the friend zone can't stand up against the will of God. Heck no, it's supposed to be. And it was worth it. Because it was the same type of refining thing. Yeah. For all the single young guys that are listening out there.

Many of you and I got to have this conversation with a brother at work today. Many of you are praying for that godly Christian woman in your life. And the question that God is asking you is are you a godly Christian man, you're asking to be rewarded the when he who finds a wife has found favor from God.

So in knowing that boys realize that God is trying to make you into who he is called you to be so that you can lead that woman well, and so that you can be the godly man that she needs in her life. That's so important.

It's it's big, you know, it's funny, because, you know, you get maybe some non Christians or religious Christians that will quote, you know, wife submit to your husband. And they'll drop that there. Yeah.

And it's like, read that read the next verse. And husbands love your wives. Okay, that's hard enough. As Christ loved the church giving up your life for her. Yeah, it's like my mandate says I have to give up my life for you.

Yeah, you know, so it's like, you know, all these all these people in Christianity kind of forget that last second part where we have a very important duty as godly husbands to love her so much. And I mean, when I just say love it, you know, guys, they think like manly, like, Oh, I'd take a bullet for my wife.

And it's like, No, he's saying giving up your life, all your wants, all your desires, all your needs, all your professional goals. Anytime, anytime you're feeling unloved, or impatient, or not needed, or whatever.

I'm not saying to be in an abusive relationship if your wife is that, but guess what her needs come first in every single way. Yeah. And that's the mandate that Christ gives us to how to love our wives.

And so when you get a wife that is godly and wise and discerning, and I've been blessed with that as well too. Yeah. And then you read through Proverbs just have you have you been blessed with Amber the same way you read through Proverbs and it says things like you know, like you said, a godly wife is to find favor with the Lord and then Proverbs 31.

And you're just like, Oh my gosh, I don't know if I could do life in this walk without her. Yeah, I tell people all the time as a joke, I say I'm I might be the head of the house, but she's definitely the neck and the neck always turns the head.

Oh, that is good. Just meaning, you know, my wife is so wise, I'll come up with an idea or something I want to do or buy or go or you know, I get all these ideas. I think you're the same way get excited about something you're like, let's do this and she'll go.

Okay, just you know, if you really feel that way, pray about it. And if the Lord tells you to do it, then we'll do it as a family. And I went, well, she always gets me, because she knows I have to answer to God.

Yeah. And believe me, I fear God much more than I fear anyone else in this world. And you know, and then I'll pray about it. And I'll know, yeah, that's just me. That's my flesh wanting it. And I'll have to go to her and say, No, that was just me, the Lord doesn't want us, you know, but not to say we I make all decisions by myself, we make almost all our decisions together.

But those things that I just get, you know, I get on a thing about a rant about, give it up to the Lord, then. And I just but there's such wisdom in submission. She's saying, Sure, I'll submit. But guess what, you have to submit to the Lord, then.

Yeah. And I'll tell you what, if you're the type of husband that will do something and say the Lord is telling you as the head of the family to do it, just because you want to do it, you better tread very lightly, because you will be answering for that is as your wife shepherd one day when you know when every knee will bow and every tongue confesses before him.

Come on. But yeah, so so five years out, and then I know you were hooked up in a couple different ministries, Ember, you were leading in and then you were doing some stuff down in Chillicothe. Yes, with my buddy, Clayton Collins.

Yeah, I'm doing him a few times in healing ministry with him. And what's what what is down there? I've never been down there. Is it a church? Is it like, is it a group? Yeah, so I'm Clayton's church is been down there.

It was actually his dad's, which his dad has a crazy, incredible testimony. He is beaten within an inch of his life, lost hearing in one of these years lost his eardrum and God miraculously healed him.

Awesome. And the really crazy thing. Five years ago, Clayton prayed for me on April 12, which we just passed on a son like, it grinds my gears that we didn't get to sit in on a Sunday service these past couple weeks, but it's all right.

Um, it was my five year mark from when God miraculously healed me. Really? Yeah, I was dead. I was partially deaf in both my ears my entire life. I was supposed to be using hearing aids by the time I was 30.

And God did something. It was insane. And now you can hear just fine on the podcast. Look at this. It's insane. And um, and so Clayton, the really crazy thing. So I meet Clayton within the first two months I get out of prison.

Okay, I was in prison in Chillicothe. Oh, wow. That's right. So when you were saying Chillicothe camp earlier, I was going Wait a minute. Is he was he visiting a church? Right? But you were in prison there.

And then that's where you end up hooking up at too. And it was crazy. Because while I was inside, I actually heard of Clayton's church. Okay, his buddy, he has a buddy that does worship named clay web.

He actually came into our prison and played for a praise day. Yeah, it was incredible stuff. I got a couple of his albums on iTunes. I think he came down to Ember. Yeah. Yeah. That's where I met him. Yes.

He probably came with Dr. Brian Adams when he came, he came a couple different times. I missed both of them. I was super salty. But um, so I've gotten to do some different stuff with Clayton, definitely with Ember Ember Monroe, their affiliate up there.

Um, and I've gotten to just do anything the Lord has called me to do. So what kind of stuff you do now? I think you do you do do in small group? Yeah, right. Yep. I do know you preach from time to time.

Correct. I've gotten to preach it probably four or five different churches, different opportunities, different places. And then right now, me and my wife hold a small group through our city light church.

But even with that, we have people come from different churches. It's really open to anybody. Yeah. And we, we love to dig into the difficult topics. Last year, we did extensive seven month study just on the book of Revelation.

Awesome. Yeah. At the end of this year, we actually are going to be looking deeper into the topic that we're going to talk about here in a little bit talking about the Moses tabernacle, how to points to Jesus.

Sure. Um, but how was that revelation eschatology study, man, that's probably one of the one of the biggest, like, sections of the Bible where I just I'm just kind of still up in the air about everything.

There's so many different things you can get to rabbit holes and different theologies and things like that, at the end of the day, and I'm trying to get better at it. Because for a few years, I was just like, you want to what doesn't matter live every day like crisis coming back today anyway.

And you know, that's how the apostles live. That's how the early church fathers lived. And then the Lord just really spoke to me and was like, well, you can't ignore certain parts of who I am just because they either don't interest you or they're too convoluted, or you feel like they're too nuanced.

He said, dig in. So I've actually the last six to eight months have really just been kind of looking at that and go where do I fall on it? Because here's another thing too, I'm I'm much more concerned about first degree doctrinal issues, Trinity, DD, Christ.

Yeah, like when I talked to a brother, sister in Christ, I want to know, we'll make sure we agree on those first. Yeah, those are the most trippy, pre trib, preterist, a millennial, you know what, there's some differences there.

But I think at the end, we're all on the same team still. Yeah, so I kind of took a backseat for me too, just because it was like, is it really that important? And I come to realize it is that important.

It is so like, what kind of stuff did you guys cover in that just for our listeners that might, you know, might prick their ears a little bit when you say we revelation, we literally went chapter by chapter, and worked through talking about the hard issues.

Because I've been on the same type of journey. You know, I'm in prison, I read all the left behind books, or they had them all in the chapel library where I got to work at one point. So you know, I read that.

But really a year ago, at City Light, our pastor George preached a message on the on the return of Jesus. And some of Jesus words, like, I, I had had a kind of like unbalanced view where I'm like, I'll pray for rapture, prepare for tribulation, which I think, like people use that and it can be a good thing.

I think that a lot of people land in that. Definitely. And the same type of thing, the Lord really just cracked me hard and really began to just move where now I would call myself a post trib. But it's all definition of where you think tribulation ends, begins, all that stuff.

Where's the post at? Really, but working through all of, one of the things that I always try to do within any Bible study I do, I follow the principle of Acts 1711, talking about the saints of Berea. They would study to show themselves to prove reading the scriptures daily.

Oh, man, my brother Rudy ground that into my brain. Like I, that's the way I treat every podcast or teaching everything I listen to, because first of all, like, we're men, we get it wrong. Not every, there's no man who has his theology perfect on this earth in any given moment.

And so I'm always being willing to be teachable in that. But I always present every view that's available. So like you had brought up, I'm a millennial, there's pre-trib, there's post-trib, there's mid-trib, there's no-trib, like partial preterist, full preterist, there's all kinds of weird, yeah.

All of this stuff. And I've, and I've worked through and really dug in and read in and like, it's a journey. I'll just put it that way. And it's one that I encourage everyone to go on because just like, I feel like the Lord probably had spoke, it is important.

What we believe about the end is going to prove how we live now. And it doesn't have to be a bad thing. Whatever position people take. One of my favorite ministers, again, another dude, can be kind of crazy.

Perry Stone. Perry Stone's a hardcore pre-trib teacher. Yeah. Everyone loves Perry. Oh man. Perry. It's those shirts. That's what it is. I love when he says that. Everyone loves Perry. I watch a couple of his sermons.

Everyone loves Perry. Yeah. I'm just Perry. Anyway, sorry, that was a bad Perry Stone impression. Sorry, Perry Stone, if you're listening, I doubt it. So I think I'm safe. Oh man. But yeah. I love how big he is on Israel too, man.

He's a heart for Israel and taking it back to the Old Testament, aligning the Messianic prophecies. Exactly. And that's, that's the next thing I was going to get to. So with him, even though he's a pre-trib person, he doesn't allow that to let him withhold from how he evangelizes, how he reaches the community, how he impacts the world with the gospel.

He is more about it than some others that probably take on the escapism and the pre-trib rapture and all that stuff. We are so tracking on the same wavelength because I was just going to say that. I was just going to say, you know, one of the reasons why I didn't really delve into it too, is I just went, you know, people get off on a tangent and then, you know, they have a warped view of like rapture or pre-trib or whatever.

And then they, and then they change the way they act. And the Lord just said, look, there's all kinds of doctrine and theology that can warp how you act out the gospel. Exactly. It's not, it's not limited to end times eschatology.

It could be, you know, in doctrines of grace, it could be creationalism. If you're letting a theology warp the way that you act out the gospel in your life or a doctrine, then it's warped no matter where it's coming from.

Exactly. You know? And I just went, oh yeah, I guess that's right. There's space where you become extreme or become, you know, hyper, whatever, hyper dash, put whatever you want in front of it. Right?

Exactly. So I love that you just said the exact same thing I was thinking while you were talking is, you know, if it's affecting the way that you either evangelize or walk out the gospel or, or, or even how you view God and his true character, then it can become an issue.