MSL: March 27, 2024

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The following program is recorded content created by The Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live.

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Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry found online at karm .org.

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When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers. Taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877 -207 -2276.

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Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome to the show. It's me,

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Matt Slick. You're listening to Matt Slick Live. And today's date is March 27th, 2024. If you wanna give me a call, it's easy to do.

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All you have to do is dial 877 -207 -2276 and give me a call.

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We have a couple coming in already. And also, if you wanna email me, you can do that.

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All you need to do is just simply dial, let's see, that would be, no, not dial.

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I got three things going on at once here. Here we go, right there. All we have to do is email us at info at karm .org,

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info at karm .org. And just put in the subject line, radio comment or radio question.

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Yeah, so I did, you ever do one of those projects where it's like, okay, I'm gonna do a little bit of a project in the office.

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I'm just going to change a couple of, a power supply. I had an old power supply, it was time to change it after five years.

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And so I did that. Well, in order to do that, I have to do this. But in order to do this, I have to do that over there.

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And for that over there, anyway, four hours later, here we are, and I'm still not done.

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But luckily, got everything going on the web and it's up and working, so that's good.

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All right, yeah, there we go. So camera work and everything else. And man, I'll tell you, I like computers,

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I really do. And I have one of those folding phones, I love that. And I have, my wife got me some really nice Bose noise reducers,

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Bluetooth. Oh man, those things are nice. They are so good. And I use them on the planes and I can drive with them and take it so you can hear and you can hear what's outside.

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It's just awesome. And I am so impressed with tech. And so I have a

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Bluetooth wireless headset I can use for dictation. Oh man, see,

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I just smile at it. And one of my favorite thing to do, seriously, one of my favorite thing to do is to take all the parts of a computer, either boxes, everything, and build it from the ground up.

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Put the OS on it, turn it on, oh yeah. To me, that's a good day.

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That's a good time. I know, a lot of you are shaking your head like, yeah, I knew he had problems. Okay, hey look, 877 -207 -2276.

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Let's get to Buskman from Ohio. Let's see. And what, something just happened.

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The screen just locked up. And so tell you what, if you can hear me,

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Keith, why don't you activate, because the screen locked up. That's really good.

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I see me, but I can't see anything else. And so Charlie, can you hear me? Just nod, you can hear me, everything's fine.

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Yeah, the X screen thing, I'm gonna have to probably do a little bit of another computer thing.

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Remember how I said I like computers? Well, every now and then, they can be rather difficult to deal with.

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Let's see if we can get that going. What the, okay, maybe the mouse died.

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So, of course it's gonna happen right now. So what I'm gonna do is grab some batteries and put them in my phone, not my phone, in my, hopefully that's just it.

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It's just the battery, the mouse thing's only gonna die when it's really critical. So hold on, this is a live radio, dealing with the issues.

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All right, good thing I know about tech stuff. Let's see if that works. All right, oh, now it's working.

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Okay, good. All right, so now, now we can get to Buskman. All right,

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Buskman. All right, man, thanks. Thanks for waiting, got it fixed. Hey, Matt, I've got this switch that I did not know what it did in my house.

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Now when I flip it, I know what it does. Okay, that's good, that means you're a switch flipper.

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I got a switch that I didn't know what it did until I come on the Max Lick Live program, and I flipped it, and all of a sudden, your computer went off.

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Now I know what it does. Well, there you go. Or, or the batteries chose to quit literally while I was moving my mouse to activate you.

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Oh, that's okay, maybe the, we'll see. It's a switch, Matt, I'm sure of it now. Could be.

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All right. It's a switch, Matt. Oh, man. All right. So what do you got, man? I'll tell you that real quick.

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Hey, I got this. So I talked to Keith, your screener, he's wonderful, by the way, give him a raise.

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Yeah, he's good, he's a good guy. But I thought of my, he is. I want to rephrase my question.

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So here's what I want to say, and this is what I want to ask you and ask all of your listeners. Is it beneficial, more beneficial for Christians to say happy resurrection week, happy resurrection day, or happy Easter?

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Beneficial is the key. Beneficial in what way? You get better health, a better bank account, spiritual stuff, what would, what do you mean beneficial?

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A Christian saying it to whoever, whether it be a Christian, another Christian, or a lost person, one who has not been reborn.

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I think that what's beneficial is what God ordains for us to say and do in our freedom as we work with him.

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And he guides us because you could say the same thing to one person and it'll help them and the exact same thing to another, and it won't.

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So I don't say there's a, this is the best thing to say, but I would say that, say what you think is right and don't worry about it, just move forward and ask

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God to bless the words of truth that go forth. That's what I would do, okay? Awesome, I heard of a very large organization,

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Christian organization, Matt, and I don't know the name, and I'm glad I don't, but it was reported that their promotion director of this very large congregation has decided not to use the words like blood of Christ, Jesus died for your sins, and things to that nature.

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And they're a Christian, large Christian congregation. So I'm wondering, is that beneficial for the cause of Christ, especially at this time of the year where we celebrate the resurrection?

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No, we need to speak truth, we need to not bow to the political correctness, the wokeness of society, which is just ultimately working against the truth of God, His order, so what we

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Christians are supposed to do is be lights in the world, not flickering candles, discompromising in the wind of darkness here.

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So we're not supposed to do that, and what we are supposed to do is spread the truth. So happy Resurrection Day, you can say that to people, yeah, he just rose from the dead, who he was, you can say whatever you want, but a denomination church, whatever it is,

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I wouldn't use those terms because they don't want to offend anybody. They've offended God in that, because God has chosen certain words to inspire, and we need to not worry about what people are gonna think about them as much as what

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God thinks about them. We are to bow the knee to the sovereign king, not to the relative feelings of the snowflakes, and as Charlie said, it's like changing diapers on snowflakes, and it's just not what we're called to do.

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We are called to be gentle, we're called to be polite, we don't want to be offensive, but let the truth speak, and don't compromise it, that's our obligation as Christians, it may cost us our jobs, it may cost us our lives, but that's what it's gonna have to do, because we're serving the

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Lord Jesus Christ, and it's about him, his life, so are we any better off? Are we any better than him, or should we then not do the very same things that he requires of us, that he himself did?

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Of course we should, we should follow him, pick up your cross daily, and follow after him, that's what we gotta do, all right?

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Wow, good stuff, do you have time for one more question? Sure, real fast.

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Okay, when you're talking to anyone, I mean, as a believer in Christ, should we not always use the biblical terms, the biblical words, the biblical phrases, the biblical thought -provoking conversation, or should we just go, well,

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I'll talk about that later, or I'll turn you on to my church, or this, that, and the other? Shouldn't we just be bold,

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I believe it was Spurgeon that said, just let the lion out, it'll take care of itself, along those lines there,

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Matt? It's hard to say, because I can't give a general thing for every situation, so sometimes it's good to use a biblical phrase, and sometimes it's not, and we have to be able to decide what the truth is.

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Not, hold on one sec, we got a troll in there, there we go, in the thing, and we got people who, let me just give you a sidestep, because of what

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I do on the web, and I have family members, there are people who come in, and it just happened, they come in posing as my daughters, and they will say things and do things, so they're trying to use our family against me, and against the

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Christian faith, and then it happens, just now happened, and also it happens in discord, where there are people who have, and still do, produce pictures of my daughters in compromising situations because of their pagan lifestyle, and then mock me with it.

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So, reason I'm putting a moment out to talk about this, because I want the person and the people who, if they're gonna hear about this,

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I want them to know that they're just merely working with the devil, that he has a foothold in their hearts and in their minds, that they would promote such evil tactics in order to do what they think is good and profitable, and it obviously is not.

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So, it doesn't hurt me, it just makes me, Repent, whoever's doing that to Matt Slick and his family, repent before your last breath, because if you do not repent before your last breath, you will die and go to hell, and Matt wants you to be in heaven.

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Leave him and his family alone, in Jesus' name, repent before your last breath.

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Sorry, Matt, I had to let you go. That's all right, but we have a lot of people who are praying for us.

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In fact, this type of attack is on the increase, and -

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Yes. I have a friend, actually, this is what happened. He's got some

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Mormons that he'll be talking to soon, and he's been talking to Mormons, and he told me today that all kinds of stuff is going wrong in his life, all kinds.

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Car broken into, wife's wallet stolen, desperations of various things around the house, all kinds of stuff, because he's talking to Mormons, and I know that's what it is, because the spiritual realm is alive, and they're praying to their

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God, their false God, to deal with him, and so it's going bad for him.

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Anyway, so it's a spiritual battle. I know it's kind of a shift in the topic here, but this is just part and parcel of what it is.

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I have to go. I'm sorry, what? You are fine,

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Matt. I'm glad you're addressing this, sir, and you can use my phone call anytime to do that, sir. Yeah, that's right.

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So it just happened, because this guy has done this, and over the years,

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I know this is really off -topic here, but over the years, I've been threatened with death and swatted, I've been followed in cars.

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We've had Satanists try and threaten to kill me and my family. We've had the

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FBI involved in that. We've had people say they're gonna sue me.

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I've had odd things happen in the house, just odd things. It's like, what is going on?

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Weird noises, things that bump in the night. We have, you know, I'm aware of this, and whenever I talk to people about, they wanna come in, work with a car,

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I might say, you need to pray for two weeks, because you, and your spouse has to know what's going on, because this is not an easy battle.

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All right, hey, look, there's the music, so hold on, busman, and we'll be right back after these messages.

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We'll get back on topic, may the Lord bless you. Be right back after these messages. It's Matt Slick Live!

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Taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276. Here's Matt Slick.

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All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. Let's get back on with Buskman. Buskman, are you there?

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Hey, I am, and I have to say this, Matt. I haven't received quite the attack that you have, brother, but just this past week, so I've been in a lot of trouble.

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I've been in a lot of trouble, sir. Let's just call him G -F -Y, and that's not a good name.

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That's why I'm initializing it, but this person emailed me saying,

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I'm a gay and trans Satanist, and I'm not,

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I'm going to come after you, Buskman, and I emailed him back to my website and said,

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I would love to meet you for coffee. Here's my telephone number. I'll buy a dinner for you.

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Let's talk. I would like to talk to you because you are gravely, gravely in error, and you are wearing the wrong jersey.

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Our God is an awesome God who sent his son to die for you, and you're fighting against the winning team.

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You will not win. I am not afraid of you, sir or ma 'am, because I don't know if it was a female or a male, and I'm waiting for that person to email me or call me back,

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Matt. I mean, I'm not afraid of this person because he cannot cast my soul into hell.

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Only Jesus Christ and his Father has that ability. Well, let me give you some advice.

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Let's just say the person says, okay, let's meet. Then you have a public place, and you have a friend. Go there five minutes early, and you arrange where you're gonna sit, and you make sure he watches the situation.

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That's a great idea. I've had to do that before. That's an awesome idea, Matt. Yeah, it is. That's a fantastic, thank you for that.

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With a camera. I'll do that. Have him with his phone filming everything, and that's it, and he's just looking over someplace.

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All right, so anyway, did you have another question? Well, it was just, at this point in time,

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I brought somebody to the Lord at the lumber yard just two days ago.

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I listened to Truth Talk Live here on this radio network that I listen to you on, Matt, and he put out this challenge called the

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Resurrection, Happy Resurrection Day Challenge, and I've been doing that to all the people that come to the lumber yard.

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Well, this one guy, long story short, Matt, he ended up in tears.

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We exchanged numbers, and he was set free right there in the lumber yard where I work at because I'm just very bold with my faith, and it was awesome.

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So I just wanna say that to all your listeners that now is a really good time, guys, to tell the gospel to people because God is moving, and it's an awesome time to witness to people and let everybody hear the truth and let

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God do the rest and watch people just melt in your arms. I mean, this burly construction guy just melted in my arms and thanked me, and it was just,

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Matt, I never felt as alive as that moment right then, sir, and I give all the credit to my

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God. Praise God. Amen, brother, good, good. So that's all

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I got, Matt. Thanks for your time. Well, okay, all right, thanks. Okay.

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God bless. Well, good, you too, God bless. All right, let's get to Paisley from Ohio.

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Welcome. You're on the air. Hello. Hello.

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Hello, how are you? Hi. Good. You got a question?

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Hi, gal. Hello. Did Jesus ever get sick when he was on earth?

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You know, the Bible doesn't tell us, but it is a good question, and sickness is part of the fall, part of when

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Adam and Eve sinned and then sin had an effect on the world, and one of the effects was that we get sick, but Jesus did not have a fallen nature.

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He wasn't affected like that, so probably he did not get sick. I can't say for sure either way, but probably not because he did not inherit the fallen nature and the curse upon him through the male, through the father, okay?

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Okay, thank you. Okay, you're welcome. All right.

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Well, God bless. Okay, Paisley. All right. All right, now let's get to the

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Giggler. All right, hey, Giggler, welcome. You're on the air, man. You there?

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Okay. Okay, you there? I'm here. I'm here now.

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Okay, now I can hear you. Okay, go ahead. All right. Paisley with the lights on.

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Yeah, it's a pretty bad connection, so the producer said we're having a little connection issue with the phone, so anyway, you wanna try it again?

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I can do something to fix it. Maybe somebody can call my address. You could just call right back, too. I can do that.

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There's nobody waiting, so you can call right back. Okay, all right, okay. Okay, just call right back, okay.

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All right. And I know who this guy is. He's an atheist.

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He's a polite atheist, at least with me. We've had many, many, many, many discussions over the years on varying chat areas.

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And by the way, Crusader for Christ, 99 things for the $20 donation there inside of Rumble.

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Really appreciate it. Seriously, we do. Thank you very much. Oh, okay, Giggler's back on.

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Let's see, Giggler, you there? Okay, hopefully that's better. I think so.

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I think it is better. All right, man, what do you got, buddy? If not, it's Jesus telling him not to talk to me. So I wanted to talk about the problem of divine hiddenness, which

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I think is something I've talked to you about before, if I'm not mistaken. Okay, okay. And you're familiar, of course, with the problem of evil.

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There's no problem of evil with Christians. There's a problem of evil with atheists, but go ahead. Well, I was just gonna say, you might want to, in case the audience isn't aware of that one, kind of bring them up to speed, and then we'll move on.

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Why is there evil in the world? Well, the Christians have an answer. We can define what evil is. It's that which is contrary to the nature of God.

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But God permits people who are made in this image to behave in a way contrary to his revealed nature.

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He doesn't want us to lie or cheat or steal, and yet he permits us to do that. He permits evil in the world, so it's under his ultimate control, and he uses it as a means by which the greatest act of love, the sacrifice of Christ, God, and flesh, then redeems those who are affected by such evil.

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So we don't have a problem with it, the atheists do. But anyway, go ahead. I would have said the problem of evil is if there's a

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God who's all -loving, all -knowing, and all -powerful, then bad things can't happen because he knows they're happening, he loves us and wants to stop them, and he has the power to stop them.

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Now, as an atheist, I've never seen this as a big objection to Christianity. It doesn't concern me that much.

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I don't know why people always bring it up. But the problem of divine hiddenness is very different for me.

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That one I do see as a bit of a stumbling block for a non -believer to come to Christianity.

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Okay. I don't think he's hidden at all. Yeah. Okay. Are you there?

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There you go. Yeah. You see, imagine that we have some people who are bad people and with glasses on that allows them to see different things at different times.

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Some say, I can't see that over there. Another one say, we can easily. Hiddenness depends on the individual, right?

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And what they're looking for and what they're able to see. Hey, we'll be right back. Okay, hold on. Folks, we'll be right back after these messages.

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Please, stay tuned. It's Matt Slick Live!

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Taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276. Here's Matt Slick.

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All right, everybody. Welcome back to the show. Let's get back on with Giggler. All right, man. You still there?

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Yeah, I'm here. Hello? All right. So, I had rushed through that before the break, but God's not hidden.

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But he, the Bible does say in James 4, 6, he's opposed to the proud, but he gives grace to the humble.

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In Isaiah 45, 15, it says that God is the one who hides himself, and he hides himself from those who reject him.

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You don't want him? Okay, there you go. He's a gentleman that way.

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During the break, I was reflecting on, if I'm not mistaken, you're a Calvinist.

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And so, when interacting with Calvinists, the problem with divine hiddenness might be a weird thing to bring up, because my understanding of, am

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I correct, you're a Calvinist, Matt? Yes. Okay, so my understanding of Calvinism, which is obviously very limited, but is that everything's been decided before we were born, the die is cast, to some extent.

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Yes. So, if I'm going, hey, why don't I see

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God? You'll be like, because you're not the elect, so why would he show himself to you? I don't know if you're elect or not.

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That's not my call. My call is to teach you, and to answer questions, and say, seek for the Lord Jesus Christ.

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We know that Jesus says, in John 6, 44, he says he draws people. And so, I can only ask that God draw you.

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I don't know how it works from eternity past. I don't know how God decrees whichever shall come to pass. I know that I'm free in Christ, because of God's grace, and that I know the prayers of a righteous man avail much with God, as says

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James 5. I'm righteous because of the blood of Christ, and my faith in Christ. So, therefore, I pray, and I ask

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God to be merciful for you. I've prayed for you before, and say, Lord, open up his heart.

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I appreciate it. And so, does God hear me? Of course he does, but it's all part of his divine plan.

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See, the only real question I have, period, and this is, you gotta be Calvinist, or Arminian, or whatever, is this.

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Excuse me, I've got some in my throat here. You know, God, what he did in John, in Acts 9, he just knocked

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Paul off his horse. He said, I'm the one you're persecuting. Paul had no choice at that point.

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He got knocked off his horse, he was blinded. Who are you? I'm Jesus you're persecuting. Okay, he opened the mind,

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Jesus opened the mind for the disciples to understand the scriptures about him, Luke 24, 45, and it says that God opened the mind of Lydia to receive the things and understand the things that Paul was teaching in Acts 16, 14.

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Well, my question is, why doesn't God do that more often? Why doesn't he do it? I don't know.

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Yeah, do you think it's arrogant of me, Matt, to say that I would like Jesus to knock me off a horse, or a motorcycle, or a car, or something?

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No, I don't think it's arrogant, but I think that if you want to find him, as we've had this conversation before, you need to humble yourself before him.

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You need to recognize this, that I'm not accusing you of anything other than what I'm guilty of, too.

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I mean, you've lied, you've stolen, you've done bad things, and just like I have, and there's a consequence to it.

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The consequence is that when you face God, and you will face him, that you're gonna face him on your own, or you're gonna face him with Jesus as your advocate.

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I want Jesus as my advocate. And so, I've talked to you so many times over the past couple, three, four years,

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I guess, I don't know how long, that on one hand, you want to seek for God, but on the other, you're always working against him at the same time.

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So you have to make a decision. It does sound like you, yeah. And you know

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I'm not insulting you. I know I'm not casting. I don't want to take up too much of your time on that. Yeah, no, I was gonna say, I really appreciate, as an outspoken atheist,

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I love talking to Christians who are willing to talk to me without being condescending, which I always appreciate you doing.

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So thank you for that. Yeah, I'm not condescending to you. I hope I never have been. I will disagree with you.

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I'll tell you I think you're wrong. And we've always had good conversations. You don't take it as an offense to disagree with you, you know, so that's what's nice.

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That's one of the reasons I like you. So, my Christian friends are gonna hear me say that. They're like an atheist. But you know.

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All right. All right, hopefully we'll talk again soon. Okay, man, we'll be seeing you online at other places. We'll talk some more, okay?

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And try this, read the New Testament, and just focus on what Jesus says and did. Just see what happens, tell me what you think.

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That'd be an interesting little discussion. You just read through the Gospels, you know, look for the red letter stuff.

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You know, if you find one of those kind of Bibles, and just read about him, and then give me your thoughts. You know?

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Challenge accepted. Okay, all right, sounds good, man. All right, thanks.

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All right, buddy, talk to you later. Okay. Okay, now, everybody, that's

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Giggler. And you can just tell that, you know, we've had, he and I have had many conversations in the past.

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People tell me he's rude to them. But he's never been rude to me. Maybe because I treat him respectfully.

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I listen to what he says. And he's also mature in that if I disagree with him, he's not offended like a little baby.

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You know, he's not like that. And he will sometimes say, no, I just think you're flat out wrong. Okay, then why? We just had this conversation.

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And so I've appreciated that about him. And he's always got an invite, you know, come up to my place and we'll have a dinner, something like that.

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So anyway, folks, here's what's interesting, is he still, every now and then, talks like this with me about the

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Lord. Pray for Giggler. God knows who he is. Pray that God would open up his heart and mind to trust in Christ, to give his heart, give his soul, just to relinquish himself into the hands of Jesus and just trust him, to save him.

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Just ask God to do that for him. And I'll be praying that too. All right, let's get on the air with Jeff from South Carolina.

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Jeff, welcome, you're on the air. Yeah, hello, Matt. Hello. How are you?

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Busy. Can you hear me? Busy, a little annoyed today because I had to redo a whole bunch of stuff. My back is sore to get underneath desks and rewire stuff when you're 67.

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It doesn't help. So there, you asked, so I'm telling you, okay? So what do you got, man?

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Oh, I just, I found it was interesting that you was in the

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PCA church. Yeah. And I guess you was actually a minister, right? Yes, I was called to a church at a church plant in Moreno Valley in the

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PCA, the Presbyterian Church in America. I was assistant pastor at a church in Ontario, California.

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And that was in the CRC, the Christian Reform Church. And then I was ordained in a church,

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Wellspring Christian Fellowship. And one of the main guys there was a seminary professor that was a pastor.

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That I went to seminary with. And so by God's grace, you know, there you go. That's my history.

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Well, I was interested that you said that you still believe in the tongues and the gifts.

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Yes, I still believe that all charismatic gifts are available. Now, I was raised in a Presbyterian church.

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Back then it was just Presbyterian. And then when I got older, I went into my 40s.

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I went to the International Pentecostal Holiest Church for 12 years. And then

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I went back to the same piece, Presbyterian Church, which is Ebenezer A .R

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.P. Because I really liked the way they bring the word and the conservatism. And I just wanted to get back to that.

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I think when I was in the Pentecostal church for a while, I think it was good. I really got a lot out of it, but I wanted to get back to my,

31:46

I guess, my roots. But the question is, I don't understand. I mean, I still believe,

31:53

I haven't seen in the Bible where it says that tongues have ceased, but now in 1 Corinthians 13, eight through 12, it talks about, you know, charity, faith, love, and tongues.

32:05

Yes, it says they will cease, but it doesn't say they have ceased. It says they'll cease when the perfect comes.

32:11

Well, what's the perfect? Most people think it's the completion of the Bible. Yeah, that's the big question. It's not.

32:17

But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is unapart will be in our way.

32:23

So what is, is that, I mean, to me, I think that that's when the resurrection, when

32:30

Jesus comes back. I think that's when that's what comes. Yes, that seems to be where it is. The canonization of the scripture.

32:37

I didn't know what you thought. Yeah, if you go to 1 Corinthians 1, 7, this is in the same book, right?

32:44

1 Corinthians 1, 7, so that you're not lacking any gift. And the word gift there is charismati, charismatic.

32:51

That you're not lacking any gift, waiting eagerly the revelation of our Lord Jesus. And what

32:57

Paul does there is he ties it with the return of Christ, the apocalypse, apocalupsin, the revelation of our

33:03

Lord Jesus. When you go to 1 Corinthians 13, we know in part, we prophesy in part, but when the perfect comes, a partial will be done away.

33:11

So let's look at this. Because in verse 12, it refers to, it says, now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face -to -face.

33:23

The antecedent of then is verse 10, when the perfect comes.

33:29

So if it's the Bible that's completed, is that when we see face -to -face? It doesn't make any sense to say that.

33:35

But if it's a return of Christ, we'll see face -to -face, then it makes sense. I know in part, and then

33:42

I shall know as I'm fully known. Well, we don't, are not fully known when the

33:49

Bible's completed. We're fully known when Jesus comes back and we're received to him. So this is why I regard that argument from those scriptures.

33:57

We got a break, so hold on, man. We got a break. We'll be right back after these messages. Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick Live!

34:11

Taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276. Here's Matt Slick.

34:17

All right, everybody, welcome back to the show. Let's get back on with you from South Carolina, sorry.

34:23

All right, you still there? Hello, Matt. All right. Well, I was just thinking,

34:29

I found this other verse. Is this a good reference for 1 Corinthians 10? 1 Corinthians 13, 12, where it says, through a glass darkly, then face to face.

34:40

It's 1 John 2 -3. 1

34:45

John, let's see, 1 John 3. Two through three, yeah.

34:51

Three. Yes, and that's about his return. We don't know what will be yet. Yeah. And it says, yeah, but it says that we shall see him as he is.

35:00

Is that like a good reference to that? I think it's supportive. Yeah, I think it's supportive of 1

35:07

Corinthians 13. We'll see him, but then face to face. For now, we see in a mere dimly, but then face to face.

35:16

And I did a study, by the way, on the term face to face. And every time it appears, it means personal encounter.

35:23

So, I mean, this is what's going on. And I'm sorry, but I know that there's a lot of people who are just definitively stating that the charismatic is all of them have ceased.

35:32

I just reject that. I know that. I'm not saying that they're a heretic or anything. I just reject it.

35:37

I don't think that's the case. Yeah, like Sam MacArthur, like John MacArthur.

35:43

I'd love to meet him. There's a lot of noise going back there, man. What's that? Got a lot of noise in the background there.

35:50

Oh, I was just looking for a power cord to charge my phone. Yeah, see, I was concerned about that because when people are driving on the road and they start hearing weird noises,

35:59

I don't want to get distracted. That's what happens to me when I'm driving,

36:05

I hear a weird noise in the car. What is that? I used to get distracted. So anyway, yeah, I'd love to debate, respectfully debate

36:12

John MacArthur on this. I would love to. I mean, I really, you know,

36:20

I love the PC ARP. That's where I want to go. Right now, my mom, she's 89 years old and I'm having to go with her, be with her to go to her church, of course.

36:31

But I'd really ultimately, I'd like to go to the Presbyterian USA. I mean, not the USA. ARP. PC USA is bad.

36:38

ARP. Oh, yeah, that's where she goes and I don't really like it, but that's where my family went. That's a bad church,

36:43

PC USA is very bad. But it just used to be, it used to be just Presbyterian, but they ruined a lot of churches,

36:49

I think. Yeah, they fragmented as liberals get in and cause problems. Right?

36:54

It makes me sick, but. Yeah. So is this the argument that they use to say that tongues have ceased?

37:02

Or is that, or is it going a lot more depth and detail? Well, they basically say that the charismatic gifts were apostolic, that they were endowed to the apostolic age in order to establish the gospel.

37:18

And it's no longer needed with the apostles since they've died. Right. So they have died and the perfect is the completion of the

37:26

Bible. And therefore we don't need the charismatic gifts because we have God's word. But God's word tells us in 1

37:32

Corinthians 14 to seek the things of God and seek the charismatic gifts.

37:39

The spirituals and what I recommend people do is take 1

37:45

Corinthians 12 and 1 Corinthians 14 and because they're on the charismatic gifts and have them in there and copy them to a word processor and then print them up and then go through and assume that the charismatic gifts have ceased and then draw a line and cross out the verses that are no longer applicable if that position is true.

38:07

And you'd be surprised how much you have to cross out when it says seek prophecy or seek speaking in tongues.

38:14

You can't do that. You gotta cross that out because it's not for us today. So cessationism is the one

38:19

Christian doctrine that I'm familiar with within orthodoxy that negates large portions of the

38:26

New Testament, okay? Hey, man, we got callers waiting to get to them, okay, buddy? Well, I sure appreciate your time, thank you.

38:35

Oh, okay, man. Well, God bless, buddy, God bless. All right, you too. All right. All right, now let's get to Rebecca from Salt Lake City.

38:44

Rebecca, welcome, you're on the air. Thank you, Matt, for taking my call. Well, first of all,

38:51

I wanted just to say you were saying that your hip hurts or you had to straighten your chair or something.

39:00

Is that what you were saying earlier? No, it started off with when I would print, my computer would reboot.

39:07

And so I thought the printer was bad because it's an old printer. So I got a new printer and it still happened. Oh, man, now that tells me that it's probably the universal power supply.

39:17

Oh, the unbroken, so I had to go buy another one. Well, in order to get that going,

39:22

I had to take everything out because, and then I go, wait a minute, I got two. And it just became a project, that's all.

39:28

And so I still have a lot more cleaning up to do. That's all. Yeah, I know, a lot of unneeded time, right?

39:35

I understand. But anyway, first of all, I just wanted to say I got my heroin shot today in my hip and in my back by my spine so I can walk again.

39:45

Oh, that's good. I just thought you had hurt your hip, so. No, that's okay, he's with me all the time.

39:51

Anyway, I just wanted to also comment on the caller before this gentleman, that he's an atheist, his name is

40:01

Giggler or something? Giggler, yes, he's an atheist, yes. Yeah, but I wanted to say that when

40:07

I, this is the first time I've heard about him. I really think in his heart he wants to believe.

40:15

He really wants to. That's why I heard what he said when he said, well, I prayed for you, and he said, thank you.

40:23

An atheist wouldn't say thank you to that, you know? So I think he's slick. I really think he wants to be a

40:28

Christian. I think he wants to be born again. But anyway. Yeah, he's told me that he wants a movement of the spirit upon him.

40:37

Just doesn't believe that God really exists. So he has a conflict. He wants it to happen to him, instead of humbling himself.

40:46

Yeah, that's what I got from him. Anyway, I also wanted to ask you about what does it mean when one is taken and one is left?

41:00

That's in Matthew 24, Luke 17. Two men in the field, one is taken, one is left.

41:06

It's the wicked who are taken. Most people, by far, the great majority of people in churches misunderstand that.

41:13

You're reading into the mic, just so you know. And so they misunderstand that, and they think that the ones who are taken are the good when it's not the context.

41:20

The context is that the wicked are the ones who are being taken, because they're the ones who are being destroyed.

41:26

And you can cross -reference that with Luke 17, Matthew 24. Just read them in parallel, those sections.

41:32

It is clearly the wicked who are taken. In fact, it's 100 % of the time when I've shown people this, 100 % when

41:37

I've shown it to them, read it to them, and they look at it, 100 % of the time, people go, you're right, that's the wicked who are taken.

41:43

No one's ever disagreed. Yeah, well, the way I understood it myself was that one was taken and one was left.

41:51

The evil one was taken, and the good one was left, because they were born again.

41:57

That's correct. Am I right in saying that? Yes, yes, that's what it seems to be there. And then they asked

42:02

Jesus in Luke 17, they asked Jesus, where are they taken? And he answers the question. He says, where the body is, the vultures gather.

42:09

So they're taken to a place of destruction. And then when you go to Matthew 13, where it says the parable of the wheat and the tares, and Jesus talks about the wheat and the tares, and he mentions that the gathering happens at the end of the age, and he says the first ones gathered are the wicked.

42:23

He specifically says first gather the tares, and then gather the wheat into the barn.

42:29

So this is a flip against, a flip on the view that so many people hold in churches today.

42:35

And when I hear people talk about this, oh, too many feel it's the rapture. It is not. It is so, it's such a bad, bad thing for people to say.

42:44

It's not. The rapture occurs. It's just 1 Thessalonians 4, 16, chapter five, verse two. That's where it occurs.

42:50

Anyway, okay. Right, uh -huh. Okay, and is it your opinion that the rapture is first before the, oh my,

43:01

I bit my tongue there. The tribulation, yeah. No, I'm a pessimistic amillennialist who teaches depressed catology.

43:11

So I believe we're gonna go through it all, and that there's only one return of Christ, and the one return of Christ is when the rapture occurs.

43:20

And so not two, where he comes in the other. Yeah, okay. But we will go through the tribulation as well?

43:28

That's what I believe. Christian? I hope I'm wrong. Yeah, I hope I'm wrong. That's what I believe. We're gonna go through it. Okay, well,

43:35

I'll pray that the rapture comes first. Yes, pray, absolutely. Indeed, he could change his mind, but God never does.

43:46

But anyway, I've really learned a lot from you. I just started listening to you not too long ago, and I like everything you say,

43:53

Matt. Keep going, preacher. Call my wife and tell her that she needs to be like you.

44:01

Like everything I say. Okay. Oh, she knows. Thank you,

44:07

Eddie, bye -bye. All right, God bless, thanks. All right. All right, let's get on to talk with Tony from North Carolina.

44:16

Tony, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, can you hear me okay, Matt? Yeah, yeah, you got a lot of wind or something, road noise,

44:24

I guess. But what do you got, man? What's up? Yeah, yeah, I drive a truck, so it's kinda noisy.

44:31

Well, I wanted to thank my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, for five years ago. Can you hear me okay?

44:36

God, I can call back another time, but. No, it's okay, keep going. Keep going. Yeah, I wanted you to, my name is

44:43

Tony Weaver, so when you're bored and you don't have anything to do, Google me, and you will read my story of what happened.

44:52

I'd like for all you listeners to do the same. I just wanna give Jesus Christ all the credit and tell you my full story of what happened.

45:00

But the reason I'm calling to get your opinion on this or what you think, and when

45:06

I died, and I was in a doctor's office, and I was dead for well over five minutes, and Jesus brought me back.

45:14

And, but, you know, I just wonder if you're asleep during that time, and you're, you know, and then what, you're just gonna wake up, and it's gonna seem like a second, and you're in heaven, or, you know.

45:25

Because the reason I ask is because I've been there, and I know I was actually clinically dead.

45:32

I don't know if I was God dead or not, but I was heart stopped beating, wasn't breathing, dead for well over five minutes.

45:39

So that's what the cardiologist said. There was an atheist there one day, that day. Did you see?

45:46

And they, Did you see anything? No, no, see, that's exactly why I'm calling, because in my mind, you know, what explains that is, okay, you die, and you know, when you're asleep,

45:59

Matt, you could be asleep for days, and you would know what was around you, you know?

46:05

And then you wake up, and you're in heaven. And, but, it's only gonna seem like a second, but I did not see anything.

46:12

I've had numerous people, you know, ask me that, but I did not. But there was an atheist there that day, and I don't think she's any longer an atheist.

46:22

And the whole doctor's office are Christian people. If you'll take time and read my story, and if you'll have anybody else that would like to read it, that show the power of Jesus Christ, please pass it on and have them do it again.

46:37

My name is Tony Weaver, and I just wanna get your thought on that, so.

46:43

On, you mean what happens when we die? Are we, are we asleep, is that what you mean?

46:49

Yeah, you think, because. No, we're not. Yeah, because, yeah, I just, you know,

46:55

I wonder, because I didn't see anything, you know? Well, you see, the physical body, and the way the soul is related to it is complicated.

47:03

And so, there can be, I understand that you can, your heart can stop, but you're still alive.

47:09

And your breathing stops, you're still alive because there's oxygen still in the brain. Consciousness can occur, or even unconsciousness can eventually occur, and you're still alive, and you can be revived.

47:21

So, and it can happen for a long period of time, you know, relatively speaking, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine minutes.

47:26

I've heard varying numbers. So, that's just that biological function. So, who knows exactly what happened to you at that time?

47:33

However, we could talk, maybe there's some music, we're out of time. We could talk about what the

47:38

Bible says what happens when you really do die. We can talk about that another time. We're out of time, buddy. We gotta go, buddy.

47:44

Call me back, okay? Hey, folks, sorry about that, out of time. May the Lord bless you by His grace.

47:49

We're back on the air tomorrow, and we'll talk to you then. God bless, bye. Another program powered by The Truth Network.