- 00:00
- Our Father in heaven what a delight it is to have the opportunity here to be here this morning and to gather in your name as we drive in this morning even to notice the change of seasons the change of temperatures to be reminded that You are in control of everything that you sovereignly shape and mold and bring everything to pass and father we just praise you for the coming of fall and And Lord, we just look forward to what you will do this year at Bethlehem Bible Church father as we gather this morning
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- Would you bless our time as we look into issues? Of your word what it says what it does not say and father what you would have us
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- To do with those things in Christ name. We pray Amen Well, you know before I get started.
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- I want to say I've received such kind notes from daddy Daddy Stein Helfer, and I thought
- 00:53
- I would just share a little something that she sent to me It's a very personal note Okay, it's not she said in this case.
- 01:01
- She said she sent me this little story says the Japanese eat little fat and Suffer fewer heart attacks than the
- 01:10
- British or Americans the French eat lots of fat and Also suffer fewer heart attacks than the
- 01:18
- Americans or British the Japanese drink little red wine and the Italians drink
- 01:24
- Significant amounts of red wine and yet both have fewer heart attacks than the British or Americans conclusion
- 01:31
- Eat and drink what you like. It's speaking English that will kill you So I like that.
- 01:37
- I like that a lot. I've been saving it for months a matter of fact Well, I'm gonna completely change things this morning.
- 01:45
- We're gonna do something completely different than what I was gonna do I just I Wrote this or I didn't write this paper.
- 01:54
- That would be thievery. I Printed this paper. It's a theological paper, and it just it made me mad
- 02:01
- And so I just started scratching questions on the back and that's what we're gonna do this morning and it has some application to us because in the scheme of things
- 02:11
- Bethlehem Bible Church is a pretty Unusual church and you guys know that for some reasons you might think well
- 02:18
- Yeah, because this is where we go and we hear the Bible taught as opposed to other things that are taught at other places
- 02:25
- But it's also unusual because we are neither fish nor fowl Strictly speaking.
- 02:33
- I don't think we really we Fish nor fowl we're neither covenantal nor are we strictly speaking dispensational?
- 02:41
- We would tend to be I think lumped in the dispensational camp and some of you are going. What does that mean?
- 02:46
- Well, that's what we're gonna talk about a little bit this morning What is if someone was going to describe
- 02:56
- Dispensationalism, what is dispensationalism? I see those hands.
- 03:03
- Okay, Bruce Okay with regard to salvation
- 03:14
- God operating in different ways at different times that there are different dispensations Some have seven some have eleven some have seven elevens, but I digress
- 03:28
- So Fred Yes Well, you can't a little bit sure you can't remember all the seven times and that's fine
- 04:00
- Fred brings up a good point. This was basically a system Not invented, but it was really popularized via the
- 04:07
- Schofield study Bible seven different dispensations seven different times when
- 04:13
- God tested man and man failed and so the he kind of tweaked things a little bit, but That's really is about as far as I want to go but the key difference
- 04:26
- Let me just say this before I discuss covenantalism for just a minute The key difference between covenantalism and dispensationalism is one single question
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- Anybody know what that question is? Besides my wife.
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- There are no greater theologians in this room. They're my wife It has everything to do with the
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- Jews Absolutely. The the question is is there a future for Israel as an ethnic group as Jews in God's plan?
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- Or not in fact covenantalism that the strict Word that they use or that the word that is employed by them is one called
- 05:15
- Supersessionism Which means you know, you have a session and then you have a really good one. That's a super. No, that's
- 05:23
- Supersessionism is the idea that Israel has been done away with God is done with Israel as his chosen people and that he has replaced
- 05:34
- Israel with The church So the blessings that applied to Israel I'll get to you just a second
- 05:41
- Pam The blessings that applied to Israel Applied to the church and the promises that applied to Israel applied to the church,
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- Pam Well, and I'm not saying that's
- 06:04
- I'm not saying that's all there is to it. But that is the key difference. Oh Of course, they of course they don't because there are a lot.
- 06:16
- Well, let's put it this way if I were to Compare the totality of the of the two systems we would be here for quite a while But Here's what they say
- 06:29
- They do say that God is done with Israel as that he divorced them that he is finished with them that there is and and this is
- 06:38
- This is not what leads them to say that there isn't going to be a literal millennium But they ultimately wind up saying that there is no literal millennium.
- 06:46
- They are all millennial because God is fulfilling his promises to Israel through the church
- 06:56
- So that's some of the things that I mean there are many other things they believe they have a Why do they baptize babies
- 07:04
- For example, because they say it replaces. I mean there are that it replaces circumcisions there are many places we could go to talk about the difference between covenantalism and dispensationalism many covenantalists will say that For example, they'll call them the sacraments
- 07:26
- Baptism Lord's Supper and that sort of thing. A lot of them will say that it is a means of grace And then you say well, what do you mean?
- 07:34
- Does that make you more saved or you know, they'll say well no because it's kind of a mystical thing
- 07:39
- That's really kind of hard to explain There are a lot of differences between covenantalism and dispensationalism
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- But I mean the primary one, I mean, it's hermeneutics Hermeneutics being how we understand the
- 07:53
- Bible, but the primary one would be is there a future for Israel or not? we'll talk more about that now some of the flaws of Dispensationalism really ultra dispensationalism and you know, here's what bothers me and and this is what bothered me about this paper because it's a critique of covenantal theology
- 08:13
- And what bothers me about that paper and what bothers me about a lot of things? I read on both sides.
- 08:19
- Is it they? Caricature that is they they they take the most extreme examples and they say this represents covenantal theology this represents
- 08:32
- Dispensational theology and so some of the problems with dispensational theology ultimately is it wound up In some cases like a
- 08:39
- Dallas Theological Seminary, they wind up saying things like what? Does anybody know what's gone on last 30 years at Dallas Theological Seminary and if you don't raise your hand
- 08:49
- It's no surprise because when I talked to the DTS Students ten years ago. They couldn't tell me what's going on at DTS either.
- 08:56
- So Anybody ever heard of easy believism? Non lordship, these are all things that came out of dispensational theology really kind of the fruits of an ultra dispensationalist mindset and what that means is they they literally said at Dallas Theological Seminary some of their professors
- 09:17
- Zane Hodges and others said that one could accept
- 09:22
- Jesus Christ as Savior and yet have absolutely no fruit whatsoever that you could be saved and yet be unchanged and You know was into that Kind of gap that MacArthur stepped in and wrote his book the gospel according to Jesus Other problems with ultra dispensationalism
- 09:49
- You know the first Bible study I ever went to wound up headline chasing, you know picking up the
- 09:56
- LA Times and reading it to try to figure out where we were on the Continuum, you know, we we just go from Daniel to Revelation and back and forth and trying to figure out how close we were to the end
- 10:07
- It's a waste of time Other problems, you know, they would say maybe that there
- 10:15
- I think They would say this that there are Basically because the different dispensations that God saved in different ways kind of it wasn't always by faith alone
- 10:30
- Now again, I'm having to go quickly. But I but I have some questions here that I think are pretty
- 10:38
- Interesting these also came up at the the conference. I was that here's a question for you Is there an inner
- 10:44
- Trinitarian meaning between the three persons of the Trinity? Is there an inner Trinitarian covenants of redemption
- 10:53
- This paper I read says no Says that's one of the problems with covenant theology is that there's no such thing as a covenant of redemption
- 11:02
- Because the Bible never says that there's a covenant of redemption And I just said well the
- 11:08
- Bible never says such a Trinity Bible never so, you know I mean, I'm just reading it going on. Is there an inner
- 11:14
- Trinitarian covenant of redemption that the Father Son and the Holy Spirit? before the world began
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- Determinant they Were going to save a people for themselves golden chain of redemption
- 11:34
- Okay, and see strict dispensation list would say that doesn't exist. Well, let's look Let's even look at Romans 8 since Charlie brought it up It's fun to blame
- 11:47
- Charlie Well, let's start in Romans 8 28 because it's good to read that verse
- 12:01
- It's always good to be reminded of that Romans 8 28 and we know that for those who love
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- God all things work together for good For those who are called according to his purpose for those whom he foreknew
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- He also predestined to be conformed to the image of his son in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers and those whom he
- 12:26
- Predestined he also called and those whom he called he also justified and those whom he justified
- 12:32
- He also glorified. Well that gives us some evidence of A covenant of redemption why because what does it mean to foreknow something?
- 12:47
- To know before it happens. That's a common Possibility.
- 12:54
- Yeah, Peggy. It is the person not the works if we look at it again
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- For those whom he knew something about beforehand It really does have to do that.
- 13:11
- That whole idea. Is that intimate knowing? In the same sense that it says, you know,
- 13:17
- Adam knew Eve this is that same word with kind of a Preposition affixed to it and it's so it's an intimate knowing and he knew ahead of time meaning
- 13:28
- Not that he knew the event but that he knew the person and he determined before this person
- 13:35
- I mean we could let's look at Romans 9 Again to give us an idea And I say, you know in many occasions my wife will tell you my kids will tell you that You know
- 13:47
- If you have difficulty with the sovereignty of God If you have difficulty with almost any issue the answer is almost always in Romans 9.
- 13:57
- I don't want to tell you of it You know if I if I had to be stuck in a desert island Romans 9 would be a pretty good chapter to be stuck stuck with And look at verse 10 and not only so but also when
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- Rebecca had conceived children by one man our forefather Isaac though they were not yet born and Had done nothing either good or bad in order that God's purpose of election might continue
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- Not because of works but because of him who calls She was told the older will serve the younger as it is written
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- Jacob. I loved but Esau I hated You say well, wait a minute before they did anything because of God's election
- 14:42
- God's choice God loved one and he hated the other again, that's that idea of God's choice
- 14:50
- God's choosing God's electing God Making or choosing a people for himself
- 14:56
- God's covenant of redemption or sometimes called the Covenant of grace we could look at Ephesians chapter 1.
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- Let's turn there for a moment And this all has to do with election, but it also has to do with God choosing beforehand
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- God choosing a people for himself and There being agreements between the
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- Father Son and Holy Spirit now as we read Ephesians chapter 1 verses 3 to 14
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- Let's kind of keep that in mind and see How this might fit into that Blessed be the
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- God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places
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- Even as he chose us in him The Father chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world
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- That we should be holy and blameless before him in love He predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ According to the purpose of his will to the praise of his glorious grace with which he has blessed us in the beloved in Him we have redemption through his blood the forgiveness of our trespasses according to the riches of his grace
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- Which he lavished upon us in all wisdom and insight making known to us the mystery of his will according to his purpose which he set forth in Christ as a plan for the fullness of time
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- To unite all things in him things in heaven and things on earth in him
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- We have obtained an inheritance having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things
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- According to the counsel of his will so that we who were the first to hope in Christ Might be to the praise of his glory in him
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- You also when you heard the word of truth the gospel of your salvation and believed in him were sealed with the promised
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- Holy Spirit who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it to the praise of his glory this is all about the glory of God and what we see here is the
- 17:04
- Father choosing us in Christ and The Holy Spirit agreeing to be the seal as it were he is the he is the seal of Believers now some might object to that being called a covenant of redemption or a covenant of grace
- 17:22
- But I don't know what else you would call it It is an inter Trinitarian agreement that was carried out before the or was was planned out before Time began and was carried out within time.
- 17:36
- Let's go to John 17. I Think John 17 is interesting. By the way tonight in the shameless plug
- 17:44
- We're gonna be talking about John 1 verses 1 to 5 and those are 5 amazing verses.
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- I mean we could literally have a conference We're not gonna have a conference on it, but we could literally have a conference on those verses because of all the truth
- 18:00
- There's just packed in there and truth about the Trinity truth about the eternality of Christ Just amazing things that I Think we just kind of skip over sometimes but in John 17
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- Jesus interceding for his people And listen this when
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- Jesus had spoken these words he lifted his eyes to heaven and said father the hour has come
- 18:30
- Glorify your son that the Son may glorify you Since you have given him authority over all flesh to give eternal life to all whom you have given him
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- Again we could go to other places in John like John chapter 6 the father has given these to the
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- Son who the elect and This is eternal life that they know you the only true
- 18:52
- God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent I glorified you on earth having accomplished the work that you gave me to do
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- When did he give it to him when he was 30 when he was 12? No before the foundation of the world.
- 19:06
- I mean it doesn't say that no But we will get there look verse 5 and now father glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you
- 19:16
- Before the world existed I Have met I mean it's like Some people frankly,
- 19:24
- I think just think that that the father said to the son Jesus I want you to go into the world.
- 19:30
- I'm not gonna tell you what to do now You know, you just go and I'll give you something to you know,
- 19:35
- I'll give you the words later we don't see that I mean that There and and tonight we're gonna see a little bit more of the relationship between the father and the son
- 19:46
- There was no separation. There were no secrets The father wasn't holding on to secrets when he sent
- 19:51
- Jesus into the world Says I have manifested your name to the people whom you gave me out of the world yours
- 20:02
- They were and you gave them to me and they have kept your word I mean it just goes on and on and on and he he prays only for The disciples for the elect why is that Because there's a special relationship there and ultimately what happens the father gave these people to the son
- 20:22
- The son saves them by dying for them and he will give them back to the father they are we are the elect are in effect a
- 20:33
- Love gift from the father to the son and then back from the son to the father so I have no problem saying that there is a
- 20:43
- Covenant of Redemption And MacArthur actually has taught that Which isn't the reason
- 20:49
- I don't have a problem with it. I think it's just biblical Number four not that you guys have all these written down This is another one that just kind of stuck in my craws.
- 21:01
- I read this paper Is Adam's sin imputed to mankind and we should all be able to get that Since pastor
- 21:08
- Mike did how many weeks was that 14 weeks on imputation? Always like to stretch those things out.
- 21:15
- How many weeks was it three weeks? Where would we find that in the Bible that Romans 5 12 and would you care to read that Brian?
- 21:41
- Okay, so all sinned in Adam and it is important why because ultimately it it is a reflection of The what's the flip side of Adam's sin being
- 21:58
- I mean few people have much of a problem saying that Adam's sin was imputed to us. What's the flip side of that Christ's righteousness?
- 22:09
- Christ's righteousness and would you keep reading there where it talks about Christ's righteousness? You know, let me
- 23:05
- I'm sorry Brian. Let me actually back up here a little bit and Back to verse 10
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- For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his son true
- 23:18
- Because of the death of Christ we are reconciled That is we're brought into a right relationship with God.
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- We're no longer under his condemnation Much more now that we are reconciled.
- 23:31
- Shall we be saved by his life? What does that mean? Saved by his life
- 23:41
- Active obedience is exactly right Active obedience is exactly right
- 23:46
- There's an argument as presented this paper here that if we're not saved by works, then we can't be saved by any works
- 23:55
- It's grace alone and to say that Christ's work are the grounds for our
- 24:01
- Entrance into heaven is just as wrong as to say that it's wrong for us to Enter heaven on the basis of our own works.
- 24:15
- It's not it's not work It's the act of obedience of Christ is him perfectly obeying on it's his work, but it's not our work.
- 24:23
- It's a divine work and so I What's that that's exactly right,
- 24:33
- I mean there we could not Do a good work. There are no works that we could do all our works are filthy rags
- 24:39
- But Christ having no sin perfectly obeyed the law for us think about this, you know
- 24:45
- We're talking about Adam and we're talking about Jesus What if Adam had never sinned, you know like one of those dopey books what if Jesus had never been born
- 24:56
- I I think that's so I think that's a bad premise for a book. But what if Adam had never sinned?
- 25:04
- We'd still be under the Adamic Covenant We I'm sorry. What's somebody else say
- 25:09
- John? He had no righteousness, but he would have if he
- 25:16
- Right if he never got thrown out of the Garden of Eden, that would mean what that that he hadn't sinned
- 25:24
- And he was born without it is without Adam sin because he hadn't sinned yet Yeah, I mean there are people three people born who were perfect three people
- 25:37
- And January sadly is not one of them Devaney they're still hopeful
- 25:44
- No Adam Eve Jesus No sin
- 25:54
- Right, they were created. So no sin nature when they appear in the Bible. Anyway, that's that was my point good good correction
- 26:04
- But you know This whole idea that you know, gee, what if Adam had never sinned?
- 26:10
- What does that presuppose? That maybe God didn't Know beforehand that Adam was going to sin, you know, and then all of a sudden that sent
- 26:20
- God's scrambling Whoa, but holding an emergency cabinet meeting get the you know,
- 26:27
- Jesus and the Holy Spirit in here We're gonna have to fix this thing That's not what happened at all So what happened at all?
- 26:38
- Okay. So what would you say then on what basis?
- 26:45
- Apart from the active obedience of Christ on what basis would anyone get to heaven is his death alone enough to get us to heaven
- 26:58
- I guess ultimately is the question is Jesus Christ death Alone enough to get us to heaven
- 27:05
- Why not? He had to fulfill the law for us Charlie okay, we are saved by Christ's work
- 27:23
- Substitutionarily applied to us in our place. He obeyed in our place He died the death that we deserve because of our sins.
- 27:32
- He lived the life that we could never live in our place And we appropriate those things through faith, which is not something we generated on our own, but as a gift from God Pam yes, and no
- 28:07
- Pam asked, you know, is it is it kind of speculation to say that Christ Christ died for our sins so What will so what what's the other part of it
- 28:23
- There's no sin to keep us out of heaven. So okay, but but here's the problem with that is it very clearly tells us you know much sore much more we have been saved by or Shall we be saved by his life now that we are reconciled much more.
- 28:39
- Shall we be saved by his life? Well, what does that mean if it doesn't refer to his act of obedience? Why did you know ultimately?
- 28:46
- Why did Jesus have to come to the earth? Why did he have to obey? Because the law had to be fulfilled
- 29:02
- Well, yes however, if people are out there and there are many people out there saying that I mean
- 29:11
- I could cite you what was I Could say what they say actually since I have an underline here
- 29:19
- Well, I mean we don't have to but I mean I if there is a stream of thought that says that It's not it's not works at all that saves us but Grace alone and that apart even
- 29:37
- Paul says I think he says in Galatians 321 That this would rule out
- 29:44
- And we find it here well the ultimately what they're saying is
- 29:55
- That they're just trying to destroy this this whole idea of a covenant of works and so they're going so far to do that as to say that Works are not necessary.
- 30:08
- Not even Jesus works Listen to this salvation is only by grace in that it is by grace believers take part in a works -based
- 30:18
- Salvation Well, that's not really what well said salvation here is by the works of the law
- 30:24
- He says let me see if I can front. Oh, there it is. It's gonna be here
- 30:32
- Paul Paul repeatedly and this is by a doctor of theology here
- 30:37
- Paul repeatedly makes the categorical statement that justification comes apart from works
- 30:48
- Since he does not qualify this statement by specifying whose works are excluded He seems to be saying that justification per se is not based on works
- 30:59
- Not only works done by man, but works Period that's very unfortunate.
- 31:16
- Okay Yes, well here here's the difference between Christ's death on the cross, so let me just Take that's a good question
- 31:32
- Peggy. There are two aspects to Christ's obedience his passive obedience his passive obedience is where he
- 31:41
- Stood silently while he was condemned He was sent to the cross and he died on the cross.
- 31:48
- He didn't have to He's God. He doesn't have to be crucified and yet he passively let an unjust system execute him
- 31:58
- So that's his passive obedience his active obedience is that he perfectly obeyed his mother and father
- 32:05
- He never sped while he was driving. He obeyed the law perfectly.
- 32:11
- He paid his taxes He did everything that we're supposed to do and that we so struggle to do and that we failed to do because he did it
- 32:19
- From the heart even though sometimes we might do things externally I'm sure many of you will sit down this year and joyfully write your check to the
- 32:27
- IRS you know or did that last year and we'll do it next year and we love paying the taxes of the state of or the
- 32:33
- Commonwealth of Massachusetts we rejoice in the opportunity to do that. Can I get an amen?
- 32:41
- Okay, never mind his active obedience Was that he fulfilled the law all of God's commands?
- 32:50
- perfectly Again, not enough that he passively his passive obedience is what makes us right with him
- 33:00
- He was the perfect sacrifice He went to the cross willingly. He died a sinless substitute for our sins
- 33:09
- Great We're not guilty of sin. But what do we need to get into heaven Matthew 548 tells us we have to be
- 33:17
- Perfect. We have to live a life of perfect obedience to God's law that we can never obey.
- 33:23
- So what do we do? We're gonna live in perfect neutrality and go to what purgatory?
- 33:30
- Until we obtain our righteousness Charlie right it is it is
- 34:32
- Absolutely. The cross is a work and I think I think you bring up another excellent point if we just or another way of looking
- 34:38
- At it we look at it this way the penalty that we deserve the negative side of things
- 34:44
- Christ day died for on the cross took our penalty the
- 34:51
- The positive side heaven the perfection is through his obedience and we get both granted to us both his passive obedience his death and His perfect life are both credited to the believer on no other by no other means
- 35:06
- Could we ever merit heaven and you know, I don't often talk about the Treasury of merit, but there it is Christ perfect life is the
- 35:15
- Treasury of merit as it were and it is infinite is vast. There can be no additions to it
- 35:20
- And it is sufficient for all the elect to go to heaven to merit heaven perfection okay, some other questions
- 35:37
- Because if not, I'm gonna keep moving. Yes, John What that's true, too.
- 35:50
- It did qualify me that that is true because if he didn't live a sinful or a sin less life
- 35:56
- Then he would not be the unblemished lamb. He would not be qualified to go on the cross.
- 36:02
- That is true But it's more than that. He is the very fulfillment. He came not to abolish the law but to fulfill it
- 36:10
- For what for his own good? No, but there were it is interesting because You know studying
- 36:29
- John a little bit like I have been the Baptism of John was what kind of baptism
- 36:38
- Baptism or repentance, but it was also it was a baptism that the Jews would practice when someone
- 36:44
- Who was not a Jew? Wanted to become a Jew he would be baptized the trick though is
- 36:53
- Because it was it was a ceremonial Kind of identification that you were in need of repentance that you were a
- 37:00
- Gentile that you were unclean Now what's interesting though is guess who performed those baptisms a priest
- 37:12
- Someone from the tribe of no The Gentile proselyte would perform it on himself so that no one else was unclean defiled but John the
- 37:28
- Baptist came in and he was performing baptisms on other people and he said
- 37:36
- He basically commanded the nation of Israel to be baptized. Why because as a nation They were defiled
- 37:44
- They need to repent Did Jesus need to repent? No, so why did he get baptized?
- 37:54
- because John said Repent be baptized John was brought this baptism of repentance and commanded that people do it and he was a prophet prophet of God An Old Testament, he was the last of the
- 38:10
- Old Testament prophets, which is kind of a you know Wait a minute. He's in the New Testament. Yeah, but he was you know, old covenants.
- 38:17
- I guess we could say that What's that, you know,
- 38:24
- I think you're right, I think he was Levi, but anyway But the point of all that is
- 38:29
- I don't remember what the point of that was It's just something, you know, absolutely for free Yeah Hmm.
- 38:57
- Yeah, that's interesting. I I don't think that's I don't think that's right I don't think
- 39:03
- Christ was baptized so that those who are not baptized Have fulfilled the law because I I don't think that's the point the point
- 39:11
- Was that he he did that as a symbolic? Much as he obeyed everything else
- 39:18
- Why because it was that you know for righteousness sake so that he would be the perfect keeper of the law
- 39:24
- I think many have died without being baptized and will be in heaven
- 39:31
- But anyway Some other differences between Well first first I want to get to you, you know, really the the key issue between covenantal ism and dispensational ism and There are some schools of thought in between and that's where we are.
- 39:50
- We're kind of in between Is one of hermeneutics one of biblical interpretation and you know people like this the man who wrote this paper will say that there's no such thing as Objective hermeneutics, what do they mean by that?
- 40:05
- There's no such thing as objective hermeneutics We all have biases going in Right, and even if we had no bias going in We'd have another problem.
- 40:20
- Anyway We have a sin nature We're just gonna lead us to you know to to want to go different ways or another one way or another
- 40:27
- So it's okay to say that there's no such thing as objective hermeneutics, but that really doesn't that doesn't end the story
- 40:34
- I mentioned before and I and I think this is a this is really important one of the key
- 40:44
- Differences is not the key or it's not the only difference. But one of the certainly one of the key differences between covenantal theology and Dispensational theology is this question.
- 40:55
- Is there a future for Israel? And answer that we're gonna begin answering that this morning
- 41:02
- Let's look at Genesis chapter 15 Verses 18 to 21 and what somebody read that when they get there, please
- 41:14
- Genesis 15 verses 18 to 21 Thank you.
- 41:58
- And you know as we go through the Middle East today We are we see the land of the Hittites the Perizzites the no, we don't see any of those lands, of course
- 42:07
- But the point of this is he says to Abraham God says to Abraham while he's
- 42:13
- Abraham's in this like coma I Mean, that's what's going on here in Genesis 15 he tells
- 42:20
- Adam to put the the animal pieces out there and then the smoking oven
- 42:27
- Anyway smoking fire pot and a flaming torch Symbolizing God passed between the the pieces of the animals thus making this covenant between Abraham and God and he promises them
- 42:38
- This land how many of you ever studied? This covenant just in terms of the land
- 42:45
- Have you ever looked at it? Okay, and of those who have studied it how
- 42:54
- How many of you would say that the land has been controlled by Israel? I don't see that hand and I mean, that's it.
- 43:05
- That's the problem that I have, you know, God says to Abraham What and I mean, it's pretty amazing. Let's just say that this is you know that you guys are the pieces of animals
- 43:13
- Sorry, and this is where you know, this is the space between it where the torch and the oven go
- 43:21
- And God says I'm gonna give you this land and By virtue of this covenant what he's saying is if you don't get that land
- 43:32
- I'm gonna wind up like these animals. I'm gonna wind up torn in two pieces God says that So I look at that and I think
- 43:42
- Just being a simple man myself. I think Pretty much looks like God's pretty serious about this land thing
- 43:51
- So if we take that and we say well, then that means that God has to Provide that land now covenantalist will say
- 44:07
- That that land promise is fulfilled how what's that?
- 44:18
- Some will say Solomon's reign but I mean again if you study that period you'll discover that they never really got that far
- 44:27
- I mean, that's quite a that's quite a journey because this the River of Egypt Really is across the
- 44:35
- Sinai Peninsula and we know where? Many of us have been to the what river is that the other river the
- 44:41
- Euphrates? I mean, that's it. We're talking about Iraq and they'll talk about you know
- 44:51
- Well, there was a time where they were taxing between here and there and the other thing. Well That's just not how
- 44:56
- I see it. I mean when we look at this it says To your offspring
- 45:02
- I give this land. I think that's a pretty tough one to overcome the covenantalists will say well
- 45:09
- They'll either explain it away in some way like that that well, you know, they had taxation rates during Or they'll say it's fulfilled spiritually in the church
- 45:24
- Yes it could be yes that they'll say it's fulfilled in Christ, but again
- 45:40
- What does that mean? He gets everything so then why
- 45:47
- Wait, what kind of promise was that to Abraham Abraham? I want you to understand something Someday, there will be a
- 45:53
- Messiah who will control everything Including the land from the river. I mean that wouldn't really mean a whole lot and It's fairly consistent when you read some brilliant minds some covenantal theologians that when they come to passages like this or they come to some passages that we'll look at next week that they have to Kind of use a unique hermeneutic and I'm not
- 46:21
- I'm not saying that you know, some of our dispensational brethren have everything right But sometimes it's just kind of hard for me to Jump up and down for what the covenantalists do either and this is one of those areas where I just go
- 46:32
- I don't know to me it pretty much looks like there needs to be the seed of Abraham and What would he have understood what would it you know again if The what we're trying to get at when we look at scripture is the authorial intent the original intent
- 46:51
- I don't think that when Moses wrote that he was thinking this promise to Abraham is someday gonna be fulfilled in the
- 47:00
- Messiah spiritually or that someday this is gonna be You know fulfilled through the church
- 47:09
- And we're gonna see that kind of thing happen again and again Pam Yeah there
- 47:46
- Yeah, there are a number of interesting books out there on that on Abrahamic covenants and different promises
- 47:53
- I mean, I really like the book I have called understanding the end times by Ben where but I mean again
- 48:00
- If the idea of a covenant is this unbreakable promise from God to a person
- 48:06
- Then I take it as unbreakable and I take it from God to that person and what would that person have understood it to mean?
- 48:14
- We'll wrap this up next week, but let's go ahead and pray Father in heaven, we know that you are a faithful God one who
- 48:26
- Makes many promises even to us that we can rely on your promises that you
- 48:35
- Cannot break your word Father when you say something you bring it to pass you tell us that over and over and over again
- 48:43
- And Lord we praise you for that we praise you that you are not like these other so -called gods who are arbitrary and Often changing their minds father.
- 48:54
- You are faithful Lord, would you bless us as we? contemplate your goodness towards us as We think about all that you have granted us and all that yet lies before us
- 49:09
- Lord Would you just cause us to glorify you even more as we think about how faithful you are in Christ's name.