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Steve and Mike discuss the newly printed book of old radio messages from JG Machen! “Pick up and read!"
Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ, based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the Apostle Paul said, �But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.
In short, if you like smooth, watered-down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn�t for you. By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we�re called by the Divine Trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King.
Here�s our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.
Welcome to No Compromise. Radio ministry, softer spoken, Mike Abendroth, Steve. Welcome.
It�s very, very soft, very gentle.
I noticed I was preaching last Sunday, and I needed to make some point, and so then I said, to make the point, because my preaching style is like this, this, this, this, and then I said, you know, something, �Do not be deceived from 1 Corinthians 6, and I said, �Why?
Because it�s easy to be deceived. That was my emphasis.
You said something last week, and I actually, I give you a loud amen, and people were like looking at me, and so.
Was that the first time you heard it, or was that second service? Because I like the second sermon by far way better. Yeah, it was better. I�m not going to lie. Well, part of it, Steve, as you know, you get up and you preach, and not as many people attend the early service.
And so, it�s just not as full, it just doesn�t have the same subjective kind of feel to it, you know what I mean?
Well, that�s part of it for me. But the other part of it is, I mean, when I�m, you know, the rare occasions these days where I�m preaching, the first time I�m preaching, I think I�m more critical as I�m preaching.
Does that sound, you know, sensible? I�m actually, like, analyzing it while I preach, and I go, �Eh, that could be better. You know? And so, the second time around, I�m like, �Okay, I told myself this could be better.
This is where I need to make sure it�s better.
Well, I guess if we were nine marks or something, what we could do is we�d preach a sermon, and then we could just kind of sit at the back of the church, and then anybody could come up and give us any critique we wanted, or at least if you�re an elder, a deacon, or intern, and then we could change to the second sermon.
Yeah, but did they actually do that in between services, or is it. No, no. I�m just saying we�re going to one-up nine marks. Oh, yeah. It�d be ten marks. Oh.
Hmm. Yeah. How long ago did the two of us go down to Capitol Hill? Man, that�s Ten. Fifteen years ago, probably.
Yeah, probably about fifteen years ago. I have to say, though, it was really fun, and it was very interesting to me, so.
How about the place we stayed at that special kind of Republican house there with all the Knights of the Templar people?
You know what? I have to confess, I don�t remember that part. I just remember the actual the church, and kind of walking around and feeling like I was kind of behind-the-scenes kind of secret spy guy, you know, so.
All right. Well, that�s good enough.
Steve, I haven�t had you on for a while. Sorry about that, between my back and everything else, and who knows, blizzards and stuff. And, you know, I was suspended. You know, that�s a running theme with you, first from the police department, then from the jail.
Yeah. Then from Twitter, then from Facebook, and then from NoCo, you know, banned. Steve, what am I going to do now?
No Twitter, no Facebook. Probably once a week, something, I guess, is posted there on. I�m out of social media.
It�s weird. Yeah. It�s a real. It�s terrible, isn�t it?
I read a John Owen quote, and a lot of times I think, �Oh, I have to share that with the world. And I�m like, �No, I don�t.
Just carry on. Well, it�s one way to get yourself marked out, right? Oh, yeah. We�ve got to get that guy on the list.
There�s a young guy that I know. Oh, yeah, that�s true. I forgot. There�s a young guy that I know, and he started doing a bunch of politics stuff, and he�s really good with law, gospel, and other things, and Christ-centered preaching.
He started doing a lot of politics, and I just said, �I know this is unsolicited advice, but I said, you know, you�re in your 20s. Why don�t you just not post anything on social media during work hours
And I said, �That would really help you, because then nobody can say, �Well, that guy�s not working. You know, if you want to post something at night, that�s fine. But all that to say, Steve, today what I want to talk about is J. Gresham Machen.
Machen. Machen. Machen. Machen. I just call him Johnny. Do you? Yeah. John. John. John. Why didn�t he go by John? He could have gone by Johnny Mac. That�s true. I think his last name means something like maiden or something in German.
Does it? Uh-huh. Well, that would be Machen. Das Machen. Yeah.
But there would be a D in there. Oh, I don�t know. They also call him just Das. See, I�m wondering if it�s like, it has to do with the verb, I think it�s to make actually. Like die Macher would be the maker.
So I don�t know. I�m a sermon maker. There you go. So Steve
Did you just call yourself the sermonator? I am the sermonator. I did not. Okay. But I remember when Chuck Swindoll drove into the master�s college chapel, I think on a motorcycle, dressed in leather, and he was the sermonator.
Maybe that was Dallas Seminary�s chapel. Maybe.
Maybe. Because I don�t know if they go for that at TMZ.
Well, it�s kind of like the John MacArthur building, and here comes Swindoll going through. You're teaching a class on Saturdays here at the Church for Men. And is it going to be recorded? It�s my first
No. No. I�ve stricken that. No. Okay. No, because I, you know, here�s my thinking. I didn�t want to, like, require something else out of people, you know, somebody to come in and do that and then edit it and post it and all that stuff, you know, and I want the guys to feel the pain of missing.
But it�s not really, I wouldn�t really call it a class per se, you know, it�s going to be a time of fellowship, a time of discussion, and, you know, really just kind of a time of discussing important theological and kind of worldview topics.
And it�s from the newly published book of old material in the �30s. No, it�s brand new material. Machen wrote this recently. I think that was after The Witch of Endor. It could be. Yeah, we can channel certain things.
So Machen�s radio addresses put together by Westminster Seminary Press, WSP. First, I thought that was Wippenstock. Yeah, but it�s not. No. Wippenstock. Boundwell, and it�s called Things Unseen. So tell our listeners why you think it�s a good book or worth reading or something like that as it�s kind of an intro to Machen Day here.
Well, I only read, you know, the intro, the first chapter and just kind of scanned through the book. But what impressed me, I mean, there are a number of things, just the way he words things, but also the kind of the priorities he sets for how we should view the world, how we should think about things because our tendency is, as he says in the first chapter, basically is to flit from emergency to emergency and to feel like and it�s easy.
In the world we live in, you know, with the virus, I mean, Machen was writing in a world almost 100 years ago, you know, it was like 1935, 1936 in there, speaking in that time. But the things he�s talking about seem like it�s right today, you know, in terms of you just change the countries.
Like he talks about the rise of totalitarianism in Italy and Germany and Russia. Well, you can just kind of change the faces a little bit and it fits perfectly today and he talked about some of the situation that was going on in the United States and he goes, �Well, that�s pretty much what�s going on today.
And, you know, the clamp down on religion and all these kind of things and he goes, �Well, he could be talking about right now. But the important thing is just the way he frames it in terms of getting our priorities straight.
He talks about how, you know, you see somebody drowning, you see a man drowning and he goes, �Your first thought is that man�s about to die and go to hell. I need to give him the gospel. And he said, �You know, you�re right.
That is your primary mission. He goes, �But it�s not the first thing you should do. The first thing you should do is save his life, right And so he goes, �We look around the world and we�re like, �Oh, man, if only I could change this, if only I could change that.
And we wanted to change the temporary circumstances and forgetting about what our ultimate calling is, about our ultimate priority, which is the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Talking to Steve Cooley today. We�re talking about the new book with some radio addresses by Machen. Steve was reflecting upon what you were saying earlier about his writing and how it seems so modern.
But isn�t that true when you are writing about God and people and sin and redemption and eternal truths? Well, they�re always in, right? They�re always in vogue. It�s timeless.
I know there�s a tendency, and I think some of the things that I�m relearning or learning to apply differently, like James Dolezal, when we look at his book and how he examines the A�s, Aquinas, Augustine, and Axelm.
I heard he was a good singer, but then somehow Slash got involved.
And looking at not being so critical that we focus on their flaws, but looking at the things that they got right. And I�m just reminded of Ephesians 4 and the fact that Christ has given men to the church as gifts.
He has gifted them through the centuries. You know, why? So that we, even later, might be able to understand the scriptures better, might be able to understand the nature of God better and understand our own plight better and all these things.
These are gifted men blessed by the Holy Spirit. They�re not infallible. This is not scripture, but it is foolish to think that when we come to a passage, when we come to a problem, when we come to anything, we�re the first ones to ever do that.
And we ought to be mindful that men have been wrestling with issues for hundreds of years and we can learn from them.
When I think of J .G .M., should we call him that? We can.
Gresham. Or, you know, I call him Big Daddy.
That�s okay. He is on my desktop computer. Did you know that?
No, that�s a good choice.
What I like about him is that he, as I stated earlier, is writing a lot about who God is. And so when you look at his 1923 book that is called Christianity and Liberalism that all our listeners could read for free, right, it�s online for free, talking about the nature of scripture, the nature of Christ, the nature of salvation, it�s timely even though it�s 100 years old.
And it shouldn�t surprise us because scripture is timely even though it�s 2 ,000, 3 ,000 years old. And therefore it stands the test of time. I read the first sentence in this book, in his chapter 1, The Present Emergency and How to Meet It.
�At the very beginning, I may as well tell you plainly that I am not going to talk about the topics that are usually regarded as most timely just now. I am not going to talk to you about the gold standard or about unemployment or about the NRA or about the brain trust or COVID -19.
Oh, sorry, that last part. Second sentence, �Possibly some of you may discover that certain things I may say have a bearing upon those topics, but those topics are not the topics about which I�m going to talk.
Third sentence, �Instead, I�m going to talk to you about God and about an unseen world. Yeah.
I love that. Yeah. Well, I mean, because our tendency, and let�s just keep that phrase there, our tendency is to think about the seen world, to focus on the things that we can see, because we imagine that we can control those things.
Well, the problem is the unseen world. And the unseen world, the spiritual world, and we wrestle against those things, right? 2 Corinthians chapter 10, the unseen world is motivating the seen world, right?
It's the dark forces, the demonic forces that are motivating the worldly aspects of it. And it's God and his word that is motivating the more seemly, the good things. And just talking about Christianity and liberalism as you were with Machen, I thought this from our good Scottish friend here, Sinclair Ferguson was so good that when it came to looking at liberalism, he says this, he says that he, Machen, came to the conviction that the Jesus of whom they, the liberals, spoke was not the Christ of scripture.
He could therefore, this Jesus of liberalism, could not therefore save and transform. And so, when we deal, it's so easy these days, and we so often hear people say things like, well, you know, at least they're Christians, or at least they have a Christian worldview, or at least, or at least, or at least, or at least, well, maybe there is no at least.
If we're talking about liberalism, liberal Christianity that is focused on social good, social justice, social justice, right? That is not a Christ who saves, and it is not a Christ who transforms. That is a Christ of their own imaginings, and may I say, it's an idol, a worthless idol.
Yes, but if the amount of reparations that are given and then received are adequate, then maybe it might save people.
And here's what I believe the Lord would say, it is a stench in my nostrils.
Steve, what I love about Machen is, as he, I mean, I guess the backdrop is psychologically, if you will, and I don't mean that in a secular sense. He goes to Princeton, he studies at, you know, St. John's in Baltimore, he comes from a rich family, et cetera.
He goes overseas and he studies the German liberals, and he thinks they're kind, he thinks they're nice. He's tempted to believe what they believe because of how they carry themselves. And it's kind of like, you know, when we meet liberal Christians that are nicer than the fundamentalist, if you will.
Pete. Which isn't hard. Mark. I know, I know. And then he's thinking, yes, but this is not a Christ that saves, and we all need our sins paid for, and so we have to have the right Jesus. And so he comes across as, this is the right Jesus to look at.
And when I see Machen deal with this issue, it's so easy for me now to see this critical race theory and social justice and everything else as liberal Christianity. He already knew what it is ahead of time because he dealt with it in a different generation.
Steve. And what's interesting now is, the people who are pushing these things would, they would not accept that, you know, that label. We're not going to be called liberal Christians. We're Christians for justice.
We're Christians who are concerned with racial injustice and, you know, all these kinds of things. And no, you just, you're kind of trying to repackage the same old, same old, and, you know, we're alive.
If Machen were alive today, he wouldn't be fooled.
Pete Steve, we need to do some kind of show where it would be some kind of quiz regarding Machen and what he would believe. And it could be, you know, you're at a social justice, liberal church, if your pastor does a nine part series on Amos in light of current events.
There's nothing wrong with Amos. Pete. Yeah, nothing wrong with Amos. Pete. Or if your pastor goes to Together for the Gospel and takes Amos 5 out of context, you know, you're in bad trouble.
Pete I was pointing at the Magic 8 thing here, the Joel thing, because I was like, wouldn't it be great if we could have a Machen one? Pete Just to hear his voice. There's all these radio addresses. We don't have them recorded.
Pete Wouldn't that be great if we could just, you know, like, what do you think about Machen, you know, thunder back at us?
Pete I just turned on the Joel cube, and sadly, it's not been date set or anything. I just, yeah. Pete. Oh. Pete. We were at the store the other day, Walgreens of all things, and I needed to get something in particular.
I don't know if you go there often, but they're usually, you know, the priciest type of stuff.
Pete I'm not quite in your medical, you know, situation.
Pete. Well, that's true. And so, I thought to myself, oh, there's a Machen cube. Sorry, there's a Joel cube. I would have paid 19 for the Machen cube, but 19 for the Joel cube, I didn't want to pay. So, somebody gave me this for free.
Pete 19 for the Joel cube and worth half the quarter.
Pete. And it probably requires a $6 9-volt battery too to keep the thing going. Pete. Oh, yeah. Pete. I know. Talking about Machen today and theologians, Steve, let's talk in general about why it's good to read people that write about God instead of reading how-to books.
I just got a thing from a major publisher, and since I am a radio host along with you, I can get books for free or free downloads, PDFs of these books, and some of them sounded pretty good. This month's offering were something about dealing with anger, right?
That's an important topic. Contentment. There's a lot of how-to's, you know, how to be a better worker.
Pete Now, were these how to assuage the anger of God or how to know that God is content with you or? Pete No, this is like.
If your wife wants you to grow a soul patch, don't be angry with her type of thing. Pete. Oh, okay. It was human. Obviously, there are laws in the scriptures for Christians, right, that norm our lives or direct our lives and tell us what to do.
That's true. But I think what's missing is, you know, the first three chapters of Ephesians, right? You got chapter four and five and six with all the imperatives law, but you don't have the rest. And therefore, when I read Machen, he does deal with things with sin and anxiety and other things, but it's all through the lens of a big view of God, have a big view of who God is.
And that's how we ought to view the world, right? And it helps kind of, you know, even as we have been talking, I think, for quite some time now, you know, we tend to forget how really transitory we are.
And, you know, I think that's what Machen does a really good job of framing things because we tend to think that, you know, the current crisis is all that matters, the current emergency, you know, as he describes it.
And really what matters is the transcendent God who is timeless. And that's where our focus needs to be. That's where our drive needs to be. And it's so easy to lose that. You know, if there was ever a reason that we would wander, it's because we're constantly pulled at the next emergency and the next and the next and the next.
And we have to set our priorities straight.
I like that, Steve. Would you also think that Machen's writings or his radio addresses that are not put in writing are valuable because he's preaching to people not like they're at Miller's Chapel in Princeton, seminary students.
He's preaching to just lay people that would tune in. I think he said he liked it when college students would turn in, just kind of a tune in, just regular expositions for regular people. I think people would benefit from this book who are lay people because they would see this is kind of what exposition should be.
I don't mean exactly verse by verse, but high view of God, low view of man, and not this incessant, here's five extra new laws that are takeaways based on this passage for these pragmatic kind of seeker-sensitive churches.
You won't get that with Machen, right?
Right. And it's not even stuff like, do you love Jesus enough? And these kind of false measurements, can you ever love Jesus enough, right? If you love him 102%, is that enough? I mean, but yeah, this is...
And I think something else you were touching on here is it's amazing when you find somebody gifted like an R .C. or a Machen or something like that, somebody who could converse easily in a kind of jargon, wording that nobody would understand, right?
And I mean, R .C. would certainly throw in Latin phrases and stuff like that, but it's a special skill set to have all that kind of knowledge and yet be able to distill it, to kind of bring it down to where anybody can understand it.
So true. And I like that point, Steve.
It's very insightful. You have Machen, who is this professor, and he can write a book on the virgin birth of Christ. And I tried to read it a couple times and I have not gotten through it. I've read most of his other books, but it's at a heady level because his audience is going to be professors and pastors and stuff like that.
But here in this book, he can just write simply, and one of my all-time favorite Machen quotes, what I need, first of all, is not an exhortation, but a gospel, not directions for saving myself, but knowledge for the way God has saved me.
Have you any good news for me? Your exhortations will not help me. Now he could say law, gospel, this, that, and the other. He's not a Wesleyan in terms of sanctification or preaching or Roman Catholic and law only, but the way he says it, you go, oh, that's right.
Right.
Rather than risking losing the audience, he just kind of goes, how can I make this so that everybody will follow me? And from, let's say, sixth grade level on up, I mean, it's pretty tough. We teach kids sometimes and you think if the spread of the kids is from kindergarten to like sixth or seventh grade, I'm sunk, right?
But if you can shrink the band a little bit so that it's either kindergarten to third or fifth grade on up or whatever, so that I can kind of get one level that I'm talking to, that's fine. And I think what he does is so, so well is communicate in a way where, you know what, from the time I was like maybe 11 or 10, I could listen to Machen if I were alive back then and go, wow, I mean, I get it.
He's brilliant, but I get every, I understand everything he's saying.
My son Luke has a friend named JT and he's a youth pastor. And I think it's junior high, maybe high school, but I want to say junior high. And every time, if I remember the story rightly, every time he says something about do, the kids all shout out, law.
And every time somebody says something about done and the finished work of Jesus, gospel. And they just shout that out. And boy, if I could have figured that out at fifth grade, eighth grade, how long did it take me to figure out a law gospel distinction?
And you know, with what you're saying there, just imagine those kids for the rest of their lives, when they hear a sermon, they're going to sit down, I mean, they're evaluating a new church and they're going to go do, do, do, do, do, do, do.
Well, this is not the place for me. I mean, like I'm keeping chicken scratches. I've got, you know, 40 do's and one done.
How to ruin a person who listens to sermons, just tell them the difference. Okay. So show's over, basically. Machen, Things Unseen, Westminster Seminary Press. I hopefully will be there tomorrow, Steve.
So we don't have to record it for me.
I'll sit in the back and just listen. Pete I got on a heritage, what is that? Reformation Heritage Books. It was 25 bucks.
Sweet deal. Pete. That's good. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life-transforming power of God's word through verse-by-verse exposition of the sacred text.
Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at 6. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston. You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.