The American Churchman: Cancer and the ABCs of Dealing with Worry

Opening Banter and Show Introduction

And welcome once again to the American Churchman podcast. You'll notice I made a mistake already. This is a great way to start a podcast and I played the old theme. So maybe some of you got a little sentimentality and recognized the vintage theme that I haven't played for about a year.

But it was in my folder and it must have been right next to the new theme. So there you go. But we still we will carry on. We will prevail here. We are actually going to talk about a TruthScript article.

So hearkening back to the TruthScript Tuesdays here even though it is the American Churchman podcast. And I just want to remind everyone before we talk about this TruthScript article that we are a 501c3 at TruthScript.

If you ever want to support what we're doing there we would definitely appreciate it. You can go to truthscript .com for more information on that. Just scroll to the bottom. And we also have a conference coming up in Pennsylvania April 25th through 26th.

Christianity and the Founding. Christianityandthefounding .com. And if you want to publish with us there's a way you can do that. Just go to the publish tab and you'll click on that and see all our guidelines.

And we really appreciate that. We found some really good contributors. So with that being said we have a special article today by Pastor Mike Abendroth called Cancer and the ABCs of Dealing with Worry.

And it's really just a chapter from his book on this particular topic. And I want to introduce Pastor Mike Abendroth to the podcast for the first time. Welcome.

John I'm super glad to be on. I think we've known each other for what. Maybe 10.

Years and we're still friends. Yeah we text each other now and then. I think the last time it was mostly pictures of your grandkids and pictures of my daughter. But those are the important things right.

And I've appreciated your support and friendship and well encouragement really. And and I actually I have right with me so the listeners can see your latest book which is Law and Gospel a Primer. And I should mention too you are you are a pastor.

You are pastor of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston Massachusetts if anyone lives near there. And NoCompromiseRadio .com is where people can get your podcast. So well.

Thanks for those. I'm in central Massachusetts John north of Worcester. And I've always thought it was funny because the name Bethlehem Bible Church it reminds me of the story in England and how you know the English and the New England people contract words and just make them shorter.

And so there was an insane asylum in London I believe in the 1600s. And it was St. Bethlehem's. And the crazy stuff that would go on at that asylum they would talk about it. And so they contracted the name from Bethlehem to Bedlam because what went on inside of there was like Bedlam.

So sometimes I feel like not because of the congregation but because of me the pastor I pastor Bedlam Bible Church. You know one of the.

Interesting things about you is you're kind of like so you're in Massachusetts but if I met you for the first time somewhere else I wouldn't take you as someone from Massachusetts necessarily. Because I don't you there's like a lot of California in you or something.

I don't know if that's what it is. You go to California quite a bit right? Because isn't that where like your family or.

Your wife's family is. Yeah. I moved here from California in 97. Had lived there for a long time originally from Nebraska. My wife's from Santa Cruz. My four children and my three grandchildren are all in California.

So I go back quite a bit. And kind of for this Americana show today I wore a shirt like a cowboy shirt a Texas shirt. So. Oh we met. Uh-huh. See funneling California to.

Nebraska to Texas. Yeah. Oh wow that's great. Yeah I didn't notice but that yeah it does have this the square cut or what are they. Yeah that's a that's very cowboy. Yeah. You know it's funny here in New York obviously not the place that you would think of for Western wear.

They opened in Wappingers right near my dad's church a boot barn. And you walk in and you feel like you're in West Texas. It is the weirdest thing to me. And everyone's like wearing cowboy boots and cowboy hats and they're playing country music.

And it's like where am I?

They opened a boot. They opened a boot barn here as well John. Really? I like boot barn a lot. Here's the quick story about that. It was during COVID and I picked out some nice boots. We were gonna go see a concert a Charlie Crockett is the guy's name.

And my daughters really loved the style that he has and all that. So the guy in front of me was a fireman and he was given a large discount because he was a first responder. So I got up there and I was just talking and I said well I'm not a first responder technically but I am a pastor and I have to deal with a lot of folks like that.

And I just smiled and they said you get your boots for $99 too. So ever since ever since then I've been a boot barn.

Fan. I'm gonna use that. I'm gonna try to use that at least. I mean maybe I can as well. I mean I'm pursuing eldership right now. I don't know if I told you that but so that I mean maybe once the process is complete then I'll go pick up my new pair of boots and I'll say hey look Pastor Mike Abendorf told me I get 99 bucks here.

I have a black pair and a brown pair and that's all I wear for.

Dress shoes is cowboy boots. Well the Lord and his providence brought me out to Massachusetts and I think John what had happened was my style and my personality is I'm pretty blunt and pretty direct. I think I've probably gotten kinder over the years but I just think men should talk directly and I moved to California and people didn't really know how to deal with me.

I'm sure if I went to Georgia I'd get kicked out of churches but in New England it's perfect because they're blunt. You don't get stabbed in the back. You get stabbed in the chest and so I'm blunt and the Lord and his providence knew exactly.

Where to put me. 28 years ago. Amen. Well I want to talk about some of the other experiences that you've had in life. We have some comments coming in and I would just encourage people as they're listening.

If you have questions for Pastor Abendorf please get them in. Whether it's on YouTube let's see Facebook or X. That's where you where I'll see them. But Isaiah. Isaiah Cooper I don't know if you recognize that name.

Says he likes your stuff. And no drama. Mama. I don't know who this is exactly because there's someone behind the account. But they like Charlie Crockett. To all. Right. Let's talk about. Let's first talk about the article at truth scripts.

So this is an abbreviated I guess form of a chapter in your book on cancer and and this comes from a very deeply personal place with you. It's not abstract. It's not even from experiences of others. It's from your own experience.

So maybe why don't you walk us through that a little bit and how that how that landed when you got that diagnosis years ago and and then and then we can get to how you thought through this.

Theologically sure. Well we would all agree when we'd read the scripture Psalm 103 the Lord is sovereign over all we understand that God is not just a prophet not just a priest but also a king. And I think we intellectually theoretically we understand God's sovereignty and if you read Lewis Burkhoff or Calvin on Providence you think okay I understand that then when you go through a trial and I know everybody listening and watching has gone through a trial it might not be cancer.

Then it's really more experiential and it's it's real in a sense. So it was 2015 John I got prostate cancer diagnosis and then it was about three years ago I got leukemia diagnosis. So two times they've said to me you have cancer and I'm not trying to joke around when I say this but the second time they say it's easier than the first because you've already kind of processed it all.

And I mean I I've written a book on the sovereignty of God I've written books about assurance and yet I still struggled with this every day for probably 18 months. I woke up and the first thought in my mind you know back to the old joke instead of good Lord it's morning good morning Lord.

But for me it was I have cancer and prostate cancer is even to me worse in the sense that it's dealing with sensitive areas of the body and all this other stuff and I just thought oh brother so I thought how could I worry so much.

I know worries the opposite of trust. I know worries a sin. I know I can trust my father if he's giving me the Lord Jesus he'll give me everything else I need Romans 8 32. But it was a fight it was a battle of me trying to repent and work through all this.

And then I thought John if I struggle with that and I'm not trying to say I'm anybody but I'm just saying I as a pastor and leader struggle with it. Other people must struggle too. And so I think between the book of Hebrews and those experiences of having cancer and then not doing what I wanted to do in terms of my godly responses I think it's really softened me and helped me try to come alongside and pastor people.

And certainly I don't want to tell them it's right to sin or it's right to worry or don't trust the Lord. But I know and I understand the suffering. And then it makes Hebrews 4 all the more wonderful when we have this sympathetic high priest who knows and who cares.

And so I just thought I'm gonna try to write a little book to try to put in people's hands when they go through cancer. How can they think about it from a Christian perspective. And from a kind perspective instead of bashing people over the head how can you call yourself a Christian and worry.

This is more. Do you know what Christian I know you worry. We're realist we don't want to worry. And how can we.

Repent and trust the Lord. So the first thing you say is that in a admit that anxiety and worry or sins and I I'm curious about this because you know when you are someone who is anxious or worrying perhaps you don't realize that that's what you're struggling with.

Maybe you're not self-aware. I know. I've had this experience recently. I got this blood test done that's supposed to tell you kind of where you're at physically. And one of the things that it showed was that I'm too stressed and aging at a quicker rate than I should and so I need to calm down.

I need to stop working as hard. I don't know what it is but I wouldn't have thought that I would have thought no. I mean I'm just working. That's all I'm doing. I'm not doing anything that's out of the norm.

And an anxiety can be like that where you have a legitimate threat like cancer and like isn't it normal to worry about that. I guess is my question where's the separation between recognizing the threat and then going into a sinful.

Mindset. Sure. A great quote. Great clarification and follow-up. The Lord talks about anxiously and eagerly awaiting his return. Of course that's not sinful. Anxiousness. Paul is concerned about churches in Corinthians where he's just trying to deal with what they're going through and he's got the weight of and the pressure of the church concern there.

I don't think that's sinful. But I think when Philippians 4 says be anxious for nothing the way that I always talk to my daughter about it was a sweetheart. What's the opposite of worry. And she'd say trust.

Sometimes you say trust like is that the right answer dad. And I'd say yes. And so we are to trust the Lord. Proverbs says with all of our hearts. And that's not a divided heart. And sometimes worry is defined by this division that we have in our thoughts.

And so I'm to trust the Lord with my whole heart. I'm not to lean on my own understanding. I'm to acknowledge him in all my ways and he'll make my path straight. And so John I think when I kind of just almost walk through Proverbs am I doing that.

When it comes to this worry or anxiousness most the time for me. When it comes to cancer I realized I wasn't following Proverbs 3 and then had to say Lord I think I am anxious about this. I'm concerned about money length of life life insurance.

Will you take care of my wife. Will you take care of my children. I'd like to see my grandchildren. I've got two daughters to be married. What about the medicine. What about the treatment. What about the doctors.

Instead of me saying you know what I can be concerned about that and work through every one of those issues properly. But I I need to not worry first Peter says casting all your cares upon him because he cares for you.

And so when you're not doing that if you're watching today and you're not doing that that's a good time to say Lord please forgive me. I don't want to be anxious. So much self-dependence so much self-reliance.

I need you. And as a good father would you take care of me. And and I'll trust you.

Trusting God's Promises in Suffering

To do that so one of the questions I have I think a lot of people who are Christians have wrestled with is you talk about trusting God's promises is the next step. So after recognizing these sins believe your Heavenly Father is loving good and provides for all your needs.

And of course Matthew 6 Jesus talks about this that that he closed the lilies of the field and allows them to grow. And there are people I know who are Christians who did not have the same result. You did they actually passed away.

And going through this trial. And I've there are times I've wondered about that. I mean your theology right is one thing but then when it really hits home you start. If you're not grounded you can quiver a little bit and start asking it is God really good.

Is that promise. Really true. I mean I thought he was supposed to take care of me. And now or my father or my brother my uncle and now they're they're passed away. Maybe just address that for a moment.

What God's best for. Sometimes what we think is the.

Best. Sure. Well of course the wages of sin is death and Adam our federal head sinned and we get credit for that and consequently have a sin nature. So we're all going to die short of the Lord's return.

And so the promise isn't. Oh we're gonna get good results. And you're right I I don't have cancer now neither prostate cancer nor leukemia. By the way a side note the treatment that I'm on for leukemia is a two-year treatment and they said to me we're gonna do a bone biopsy after 12 months but you will be on this treatment for 24 months.

I said okay fine and I had given all my staff the book cancer's not your shepherd that you're talking about and they knew I was a pastor and and all that. So I go in after one month through the bite bone biopsy and they said you are the unicorn we can't we can't believe you have no leukemia and you're the only one out of 500 people that does not have it.

And so what I did say is I said well a lot of people are praying for me and that's true. What I didn't say was I regularly take ivermectin. Yeah so yeah. But what if somebody gets cancer and then they die is God still faithful.

And so what my mother used to do when she was going through chemo and she got lung cancer and died 15 years ago Christian lady she didn't get healed physically from cancer. She would always start going through the ABCs and in this little article that you posted your mind and thank you for doing that I just did ABCs because it was easy to remember what she would do with ABCs and she'd begin to think about the Lord and she would start with a what can I remember about the Lord God revealed in scripture that starts with an A he's Almighty he's all-knowing he is B beautiful bountiful beneficial C compassion caring D he's a deliverer.

And she started just working through as she said and got infusions with chemo and then when she got to X where there's no X's that would talk about the Lord she'd already be thinking about who he is and instead of what she has and so we're we as Christians are to walk by faith and not by sight.

And Job would say even though he slay me yet I'll trust in him. And so God is faithful even if we die. And when we die he was faithful when it comes to Paul and his death Peter's death the father was faithful with the son's death.

And even though we might not get better there would be ultimate glorification God's will will be done. And on the flip side John I got saved and became a pastor. My brother got saved and became a pastor when our father died of cancer because the Lord is still using death.

And the effects of death in people's lives for all of his purposes. So even though we.

Might die and we will die. God is still faithful. Well you say in C &D that chase after God in his glory and do not borrow trouble. I guess we should start with C you know chasing after God. Practically speaking I think you already gave us probably the template for what that looks like and just cultivating this mindset that's so focused on who God is and not your situation specifically making that the secondary thing.

But if you have anything to add there I guess you know go for it and then we go to do not borrow trouble. Sure. Well when I went.

Through a church split in 2000 I didn't really think through all the ramifications and the ripple effect and what I didn't know was the Lord gave me a ministry and that ministry was eventually talking to other pastors who would go through church trouble.

And in a similar fashion we go through a trial. We've seen the Lord faithfully take us through the trial first Corinthians chapter 10 verse 13 and other passages and then we can help other people and we can say yes that Bible verse is true.

But I also want you to see in my own life how I experienced God's grace and his undergirding strength in that trial. So when I got cancer the first time I didn't realize I was given a cancer ministry.

And so I was starting to say on no compromise radio if you're a man and you've got prostate cancer believer unbeliever write me and we'll talk. And so I've talked to many many men both Christians and unbelievers because once you're in the club the Cancer Club and I can talk to people just directly and frankly and I'm just in the club and so I didn't know I had a ministry to cancer folks.

And same thing when it comes to leukemia so chasing after God in his glory. I think when we go through trials the Lord is refining us the Lord is helping us but also it's for other people. My wife always says only two things matter in this world God and other people.

And so the Lord is helping me. So then I want to try to help other people and so whether that's talking to them being there having chemo whatever might be. So chasing after God in his glory when Jesus said seek first the kingdom of God.

I'm not that smart. I'm a public school educated kid from Nebraska so the way I I process that is I've been through this and I've seen God's hand and how can I help other people. And so ministry is for others.

And you know as Luther said God doesn't need our good works but our neighbor does. And so how can I help other people that have gone through this trial. It's just like when a lady goes through a miscarriage and other ladies who have had miscarriages come alongside and try to help and serve.

And I think that's what we do in the middle of a trial versus this focus on self and what was me. Yes we're hurting. That's true but I need to think upwardly.

And outwardly yeah yeah. I have learned that in my own life through you know smaller tragedies perhaps in some ways but infertility struggles. And then my wife losing her mother two years ago at such a young age.

And it does open these doors that would never have probably been opened with non-believers even who have encountered similar things and they want to know how you face that challenge. And it's a great opportunity to talk about Christ and the strength of the promises that he's given us and how that that helps us through.

The last thing you'd say is do not borrow trouble. And this is this is all from Matthew 6. But do not be anxious about tomorrow for tomorrow will be anxious for itself. Sufficient is. The day is its own trouble which I'm gonna admit.

I have a struggle with this at times. I'd like to I mean maybe that's a guy thing too like we. You were trying to spot the threats. What are the threats. What are the things that could take away the health and financial condition of your family.

And I want to get out ahead of them and make sure that we meet those challenges. But obviously I can't control everything. I'm not God. He's already got it under control so we.

Living One Day at a Time Instead of Borrowing Trouble

Expand on that a little bit sure. I was given a complete body scan to see if I was able to take the leukemia medicines these oral medicines and they did the complete body scan. John and you know that I'm a long-distance bicyclist and I like to work out.

I try to take care of myself for the most part and and so they do the full body scan and they say well the good news is you can have the leukemia. The bad news is you have an aortic aneurysm that if it grows any larger you're gonna have to have open heart surgery and replace your or if you strain too much it will burst and you'll be dead.

So the upside is if I wouldn't have had leukemia I'd never know about that. And now every year I get that aneurysm measured and if it gets to be about five more millimeters larger they'll have to do the open heart surgery heart bypass etc and so and I used to work in the operating room so I've seen those procedures done and it is brutal.

So here's my point. I have now been given by the Lord this diagnosis and I realize every day could be the last day. Today could be the last day. And but the thing is John it's true for all of us. We all know theologically today could be the last day.

Car accident brain bleed. Who knows what could happen. You know nuclear bombs. I did ask a guy an engineer engineer a church. I said if a nuclear bomb hits Boston will I make it here in Worcester 50 miles away.

He said it depends which way the wind is blowing. So all these things we could worry about all these things we could be anxious about. And I'm thinking you know what today you know you think of the psalmist this is the day that the Lord has made and let us be glad and rejoice in it.

And what can we do today. I can't fast forward till tomorrow. I can't go ahead and say well when am I gonna have to that aortic aneurysm repair today's got enough trouble that is it has enough concerns and issues to deal with in terms of God and other people.

Prayer scripture service. I learned a long time ago from a man who said when you get home man go up to your wives and say honey I love you greet the kids and say to your wife how can I serve you today.

And just thinking about lovingly laying down our lives for our wives and our children and teaching them things. So we've got a lot to do today and am I gonna be dead tomorrow. Maybe that's so.

Good maybe I don't wake up. That's so. That's such a good word. I don't if you've heard the Tim McGraw song live like you were dying you ever heard that. Mm-hmm he you know talks about a guy who's diagnosed with cancer and my dad likes that song.

And it's not a Christian song necessarily. I mean he does talk about he reads the good book but it's it does kind of focus you on the things that are truly important when you realize your time is short.

And and I think of like in some of the online discourse that happens in Christianity there's I don't know if you've noticed or not there's a strong current on trying to make sure that patriarchy is emphasized and you know male leadership is emphasized and and I think the scriptures do speak about this.

But when you say you know tell your wife how can I serve you I love you it just resonates with me. I was at a conference recently where I heard a guy who said look you can't lead your wife till you love your wife.

And it's true like I could you know you or you or anyone could just leave their home and that that could be the last time you see your wife and what's she going to what's she gonna be left with right is I guess the question.

And I want her to know that I love her and that I've you know I'm willing to lay down my life like Christ did for his church and so anyway.

That's good. Well I think it's so true. And for those people who are watching or listening you know we asked the question when's the last time you said to your spouse I love you. Can't believe the Lord gave me you children.

I love you I'm proud of you. I don't remember my dad ever saying that I'm proud of you. He loved me in the sense that he took care of us provided for us but he was a drinker and other things. And so now when my kids fly or I fly or I talk to them we have a little thing and that is we don't say to dad and I don't say to them love you.

Love you is one step under I love you. And so I say to them I love you. They say I love you every single day. And then I say to them I'm proud of you. I'm so proud of you. And at young men at the church I regularly say to them when they do something good I say you know if I was your dad I'd be proud of you.

You.

Said that to me. Actually so. And I well and it meant no I meant a lot. I was like wow I don't really get that very much. That's a you know that is you don't realize it until maybe it happens. That is something that men crave.

Is that what do they say. Like you know wives women like to be loved. Men want to be respected. But it's it's really the form of love. I suppose. Right. Because they.

Both have loved but correct. I mean there's just something about if you think about how God has designed us specifically as as men and and leading. And if you think okay what about Adam in the garden.

There's a debate on this but let's just say he was prophet priest and King just all these things. You look at the Lord Jesus and what he was like on earth and who he was. And so there's just something to me that you know it's not.

I don't want it to be flattery. You just throw it out there. But somebody tries to do something and they're there. They're trying to serve the Lord or they preach the sermon might not have been that good but it was Christ exalting.

I'd say you know what. That was a really good and if I was your dad I'd be proud of you. I mean to this day. And here's why I I'd like to say it John there's a pastor is he's still alive. He's in Texas Dave Jeffries.

And I was preaching here in Massachusetts and I was in Ephesians and I don't think I did a very good job. It was the old-school Abendroth and exegetical digest and a lot of data and grammar and lexicon and just back up the dump truck.

It's a commentary. Beep beep beep beep versus a versus a well-crafted sermon. And he said to me afterwards you know what. And I think he knew I was struggling in the sermon but he could tell. I studied.

He said Mike if I were your dad I'd be proud of you. And I mean I just started crying I just thinking you know what this affirmation of another godly man saying I know what you're going through. I know the crucible of ministry and I know you're trying to discharge your duty even as a fallen sinful man redeemed by grace.

Good job. I mean the text does say encourage one another. And now we live online and online. There's not much encouragement. It's did he you hear that did you say.

That he did that. Yeah that's so true. And sometimes the encouragement you do see isn't legitimate. It's trying to stroke someone's ego to ladder climb or to maintain tribal integrity instead of you legitimately meaning it.

And that is a good point. I didn't. I haven't really thought of that deeply but probably worth thinking about. So let me let me switch gears a little if I can on this. And we I don't see questions specifically related to what you're talking about but I want to remind people all 335 of you who are streaming right now 36 if you guys want to ask a question of pastor Mike Avendroth now is your chance.

He said he would take the most controversial questions. I think he said that. Did he say that. No he'll take any questions on this. I want to just also plug the book. It's called cancer is not your shepherd a 31 day guide to suffering and I think so it's a devotional essentially that you can give to people who have been diagnosed who might not even be Christians.

And it's a way to I think. Would you say Mike you said someone had ordered like 999 copies just to pass out. Right. Great witnessing tool like that so check it out. It's on Amazon. Do you want people to go to Amazon.

Where do you want them to go. Sure.

Well there's two versions of the book. The larger version that you just talked about cancer is not your shepherd excuse me it's got some of my information that I've got some Puritans on suffering in general.

Then a condensed version that's the one that my friend ordered 999 of those that's called Jesus and cancer and.

Both are on Amazon. Okay so go to Amazon. So there's the larger catechism and the smaller catechism of the same book. There you go. So I want to talk a little bit about it with our remaining 15 minutes or so about this book.

Here we go. Law and gospel. A primer. This is your latest and when I say book it's really you can see this is more of a booklet. It's kind of how many pages is this. It's only well hundred pages. So I know it's a it's a book but it's it's a lot of quotes from scripture and from confessions and from old dead guys.

Some of them are living. But I noticed that one page you have your brother here you snuck in Baptist Confessions. So I mean it's quite the status there but a lot of Luther I say you quote Luther. I don't know Calvin or Luther the most probably Luther more than anyone else but it's this is something we could take in a couple different directions but I know you I've had you on before to talk about this a little bit and I don't see this slowing down as far as like it seems like it's one of those things that church will always have to navigate because there are constantly new innovative ways that people want to merge law with gospel.

Sometimes I don't recognize it even at first because it's sneaky or or you don't understand maybe what someone's saying and then you realize what they're saying. So one of the things we had talked about was the social justice movement and how guys like Jim Wallace and he would talk about the gospel of the kingdom.

And then when you unpack that he was trying to sneak in categories of law and and Jarvis Williams and some of these guys. What I've noticed though is that there's guys on the more conservative political end who are against those guys in their political agenda but they do some similar things.

And I think it might be prudent to talk about that a little bit because this is an error that can affect you regardless of your political position. It seems like right. So maybe we maybe I should back up what's what's the law gospel distinction since for those who didn't see our episode on that why is it.

Important. Sure Luther Calvin the Reformers they would say there are two words to help you understand the Bible and those two words are law and gospel. Now you can generally talk about law. Or you can specifically talk about law.

And the same thing with the gospel but strictly speaking. Not generally but strictly speaking law is something that God tells you to do it's command it's an imperative and gospel is a promise centering around the work and the person of the Lord Jesus.

And so one is do and the others done. And you've heard it said over and over and over even by Spurgeon the laws do do do the gospel is done done done. And when we talked about social justice it was easy to see oh the social justice they're saying it's the gospel of social justice.

But they're telling us to do things. And so they're making. They're making category errors. And once you see it and I watched it in your life John and in your ministry once you see it you can't unsee it.

And it's very very clear. Let's not mix the two together. They just don't mingle. And so when it comes to law for the unbeliever we tell them about God's standards. And then we give them the one that measured up to those standards that's the good news of who Jesus is life death burial resurrection.

Then when we go to believers we tell them here's who you are in Christ and here's what he's done for you. And in light of that he wants you to obey not to earn salvation or to get it but because you want to out of gratitude serve him.

So generally speaking law gospel helps you interpret the Bible under these two parameters do and done. Or law and gospel. Yeah. And you.

Had I should probably open it up. You have some good quotes from historic reforms confessions and so forth that backup everything you're saying like the Augsburg Confession all scripture ought to be distributed into these two principal topics the law and the promises and Philip Melanchthon.