May 9, 2023 Show with Anthony Uvenio on “The Resurrection: Fact, Fake or Futile?”

Live from historic downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, home of founding father

James Wilson, 19th century hymn writer George Duffield, 19th century gospel minister

George Norcross, and sports legend Jim Thorpe. It's Iron Sharpens Iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.

And now, here's your host, Chris Arnzen. Good afternoon,

Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet

Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this ninth day of May, 2023.

I'm thrilled to have back on the program after a long absence a very dear friend of mine,

Pastor Anthony Uvinio. Pastor Anthony Uvinio is one of three pastors at Hope Reform Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island, New York, which would include

Pastor Rich Jensen, the founding pastor of that congregation, and also Pastor Christopher McDowell.

And Anthony is also the co -founder of New York Apologetics, and we are not only going to be addressing a conference coming up that New York Apologetics is hosting in Haupaug, Long Island, but we are also talking today about the theme of that conference, the resurrection, fact, fake, or futile.

And it is my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, my old friend, Anthony Uvinio.

Thanks for having me, Chris, I really appreciate it and look forward to a good show. And I'm going to give our listeners our email address right away if you'd like to submit questions on the resurrection of Christ.

The email address is chrisarnzen at gmail .com, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live outside the

USA. Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter. Let's say you are in a liberal church.

They deny the bodily resurrection of Christ. You are not ready to publicly identify yourself as being in opposition to them or something like that.

Whatever the case may be that would compel you to remain anonymous, we will grant your request, but please, if it's just a general question on the

Bible, on theology, on doctrine, please give us your first name at least, your city and state and country of residence.

Well, first of all, tell us about Hope Reformed Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island, New York.

Yeah, we go every Sunday at 945 starts our

Sunday school. 11 o 'clock starts our service. We also have Bible study and prayer Wednesday nights at 7 p .m.

So we're going through Proverbs with the men's breakfast on Saturday mornings.

That's once a month. And Pastor Jensen is going through the book of Daniel on Sunday mornings.

And it's really proven to be a terrific, terrific series. Pastor does a great job.

I put all the videos up on if you want to watch them on the Reform Rookie YouTube channel. So especially considering the times that we're in now,

Chris, you know, I mean, we're coming down under fire as Christians, and our country looks like it's going to implode.

And we may end up being deported somewhere. Who knows? It might be a blessing.

I mean, it was a blessing for Daniel. I mean, you know, him, Shadrach and Abednego got deported and ended up rising to the top, you know.

Well, my own elders at Grace Baptist Church of Carlisle are doing all they can to get me deported.

So I just thought I'd let you know. There's always room for you down here, pal.

Don't worry. We got your back. Don't worry. Well, I wonder how long that would last.

But anyway. And Hope is a confessional

Reformed Baptist Church adhering to the 1689 London Baptist Confession. And firm believers in homeschooling and classical

Christian education. And I just love visiting Hope when

I am visiting Long Island. It is my home away from home. And I know far more people there than I do from my own former church on Long Island, Grace Reformed Baptist Church of Long Island, America.

Because every time I go there, it seems that the people there are new that were not there when, with few exception, are not folks that were there when

I was a member. So Hope has definitely become a home away from home for me. If anybody wants more details about Hope Reformed Baptist Church in Coram, Long Island, New York, if you're visiting that area, if you already live in that area, or if you have family, friends, and loved ones in that area and you want to refer them to an excellent church, hopereformedli .net,

hopereformedli .net. I have so many cherished, treasured memories of being at that church.

And, in fact, you weren't there at that time. But you can ask Pastor Rich Jensen about the youth retreats at the

Tuscarora Conference Center in Pennsylvania where they would have me go there for stand -up comedy.

And I had some really wonderful memories with Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries there.

And I just can't say enough about this church. We hear a lot of things about those youth retreats, and I wish

I was there. I heard there was a little High Hope song going on. Eventually, I guess it was prophetic, right?

Dr. White came around. For those of our listeners who have no idea what Anthony is talking about,

I did a parody of post -millennialism because Pastor Rich Jensen is a post -millennialist.

He's been a post -millennialist as long as I've known him. And I took the Frank Sinatra song,

High Hopes, and turned it into a post -millennial song. And James White, I can remember saying, what are you going to do for your little stand -up thing?

And I said, well, I'm going to sing a song called High Hopes. He goes, let me do it with you. So we did it together, and the rest remains in infamy.

Oh, and then James White, as you were saying, eventually, he was an amillennialist at the time, and now he is post -millennial.

So kind of an interesting turn of events. Amen. And now tell us about New York Apologetics.

Well, New York Apologetics is an organization that was started by myself and Nick Mitchell, and it spurred out of a debate that I had at Long Island University in Brookville with a professor from Hofstra University, Professor Amy Karofsky.

Oh, yeah, I saw that. I saw that. Yeah, right. So what had happened was he found out that I was doing the debate, and he wanted to sit with me and go through some arguments with me.

And he really actually helped coach me and got me to – because he really is a good atheist when he wants to be.

He was really pressing me, so he toughened me up, and the debate went very well. When I look back,

I mean I think she was a weak opponent, but it went very well, and a lot of the people who – the kids who were on the campus wanted more of this.

So we started visiting them on a regular basis and teaching them apologetics, and that spurred into a website and a blog.

And then a friend of Nick invited him to do a radio show, so him and I would do a Saturday morning radio show for a long time.

And lo and behold, we started setting up some conferences here. We had

Greg Koukl, Frank Turek, Mary Jo Sharp, and then we even had our own

Chris Arnzen come and moderate a debate at Stony Brook University between Dr.

Frank Turek and Michael Shermer. And it wasn't Chris's fault, but we got removed from Stony Brook University.

We're not invited back there anymore, which isn't – it wasn't your fault, though.

Actually, knowing Stony Brook University, I would have taken that as a badge of honor if it was my fault.

So why don't you spread the rumor that it was my fault? I kind of like it. Well, the funny thing was you remember

Michael Shermer started pounding his fist on the podium saying, you'll see, you're going to change your views, you're going to hold to homosexual marriage, same -sex marriage.

And all he did was ask Dr. Turek, well, what's your view? And Dr. Turek simply answered and said, my view is the biblical view.

Marriage is between a man and a woman. Nothing more than that. Well, the next day, a four -page scathing letter went to the president of Stony Brook University.

How could they possibly let a guy like this on the campus to put forth those views and hurt us emotionally and all this kind of stuff?

So it actually started making waves online. AP Press picked it up.

Richard Dawkins commented on it. And the funny thing was this letter actually united a

Christian and an atheist. Dr. Turek and Michael Shermer got together and co -wrote a letter to Stony Brook University saying, this is the essence of free speech.

We have to be able to vocalize our views with one another. There was no harm done unless you consider ideas harmful.

And that's what colleges were all about for centuries. Universities, colleges, debate.

I mean, even Berkeley, left wing Berkeley had

George Lincoln Rockwell, the founder of the American Nazi Party, speak there.

Not because they supported what he believed, but they wanted to see the interaction of ideas, even ones as horrifically evil, where both left and right wing individuals typically are abhorred by the likes of the neo

Nazis. In fact, technically, although most people would deny this,

Nazis are left wing. They're not right wing, but they're national socialists.

But in fact, to even go a step further, the original Nazis, before they became an enormous political machine, the majority of them were homosexuals.

But that's another topic for another time. But it's just amazing. It's disgusting.

It's ridiculous. I mean, the whole idea of collegiate debate, even liberals used to thrive on seeing things like this, debates between opposing views.

But these people aren't liberals. They're leftists. Yes. I mean, the word university actually means unity of diversity.

That's the whole point. We're supposed to be able to go and explore and share our ideas and learn from one another.

We don't have to agree, but we certainly can love each other through it and learn from it and may the best ideas win.

So when you shut down one side, it just goes to show you that they feel threatened. And I think they feel threatened because the truth hurts sometimes.

Yes, and I remember very vividly that my presence there at that debate was almost useless because both

Frank Turek and his atheist opponent threw out the rules, and they both preferred just having an argument.

At the end of it, I was hoping for this nice scholastic debate, and it'll be a real exchange of ideas.

And it really turned into like a New York WWF match, and people from the audience were shouting and clapping, and I was like, oh.

And when I was trying to correct or chastise the atheist

Michael Shermer, Frank said, no, no, Chris, I like it this way better.

So, I mean, what could I do? I mean, when you have both sides saying that's what they wanted to do.

Well, Turek's from New Jersey. It's kind of in him, so. But anyway.

Your Popeye's done. You know,

I have – I don't know how many friends that I've known for decades who call me during the show, and it's like they don't know by now.

My show is 4 to 6 p .m. Some friends never listen to the show.

Anyway, if anybody wants more information about New York Apologetics, go to NewYorkApologetics .com.

NewYorkApologetics .com. And we can't forget the reformed rookie. Tell us about the reformed rookie. Yes, reformed rookie actually got started a little bit before COVID, and obviously during COVID was able to allow me to do more stuff.

So I started a website just to teach people, beginners anyway, the basics of reformed theology, the doctrines of grace, the five solas.

We put up articles, blogs, videos, our Wednesday night

Bible studies we put up there. So it's just designed to get people introduced to Calvinism and reformed theology.

So I shouldn't say Calvinism that way only because most people think that when you're reformed, it just means

Calvinism, and it goes way, way, way beyond that. It involves a confession of faith.

It involves the regulative principle of worship. There's so much more to it than just Calvinism.

Of course, that's part of it. That drives the theology. But it's just designed to get people to understand what it is, not to be afraid of it, because so many people hear the word

Calvinism, and they think you're a heretic. And when you just start going through the scriptures and showing people what the

Bible actually teaches, and if you could do it in a winsome and gentle and respectful manner, people seem to take it a little bit better.

So most of the people who I interview on the show, I start them off by talking about their testimony into reformed theology.

How did you become reformed so that people who don't understand what reformed theology is can listen to other people who are smart, who are theologians, explain how they came to an understanding of the doctrines of grace and how it's helped their walk with God and their biblical literacy.

And it's reformedrookie .com? Yes, reformedrookie .com. And you can go on YouTube, just type reformedrookie.

We just recently got over 2 ,000 subscribers, so I was very happy about that. Yeah, the channel's growing.

We're getting a lot of views. In fact, Pastor Jensen's teaching on hermeneutics, part one has over 11 ,000 views, and part two has over 5 ,000 views.

Wow. Yeah, so he did a really good series on hermeneutics. We did a series on the infallibility of the scriptures, which is doing great.

One of the teachings that I did on the symbolism of the temple, part one and two, collectively, those got over like 12 ,000 views.

So people are watching it. I mean, it's basically a Reformed Baptist YouTube channel, so I don't think we're going to start seeing millions of views.

But whoever it is that comes on gets edified and comments and likes the teaching, so we'll continue to put it up.

Great. That's reformedrookie .com. Moving back, I forgot to mention something very significant. Moving back to the reformedrookie .com.

I mean, not the reformedrookie. I just mentioned that. Moving back to newyorkapologetics .com.

One of the things that you have done with this ministry was a very bold and courageous move on your part, because you have done something that is nearly unheard of, not only in Reformed Baptist circles, but in Pentecostal circles, where you have you and Nick Mitchell, the co -founders.

You are on opposite ends of the cessationist, continuationist debate.

You are a Reformed Baptist, as everybody knows by now. And Nick Mitchell is a

Pentecostal, and I believe also an Arminian, or somewhere in that orbit. And yet you find things that you have in common that you're able to cooperate with one another, and I know that that will upset a multitude of Reformed Baptists and a multitude of Pentecostals and Charismatics.

But you have been able to pull it off, and tell us about that, your reasons for it, and how it's been going.

Yeah, sure. I think what we need to do as Christians is find common ground and work together on the things that we agree on.

If we start focusing on the things that we disagree on, I think that there are no two

Christians on the planet that believe exactly the same things. So we start drawing that circle smaller and smaller and smaller.

It's just going to be me in a room broadcasting to nobody, because nobody is going to listen to me. Now, obviously the differences between myself and Nick are deep theological differences, and he defends his position,

I defend mine. But the bottom line is we can love each other as brothers in Christ through it. He's become a really good friend to me, and I've become a good friend to him, and we have a ball together.

I don't want to say it's similar to James White and Dr. Brown, because we're probably a couple hundred

IQ points lower, but a couple hundred pounds heavier. I shouldn't say that about Nick.

It's mostly about me. But, you know, look, I can love somebody who differs with me on certain theological issues.

We're not going to co -labor on—if he has a conference on the gifts of the

Spirit, I'm not going to be co -laboring with him on that. It's the same way as if I have a conference on the doctrines of grace.

He's not going to be like, yeah, oh, let's go, let's push that. And we have to recognize that we are going to have differences between one another.

But if he is born of God's Spirit and I am born of God's Spirit, what unites us is much, much stronger than what divides us.

Yeah, and you are not compromising at all. You are just—your unity is involved in the areas where you do agree, which are the salvific areas of the

Scripture. Sure, yeah, like him and I, you know, and we've said it at certain events that we've been at together.

You know, he'll say, look, I'm an Arminian and Anthony's a Calvinist. We both believe that we're saved by grace through faith and that and not of ourselves.

It's just a matter of how we get into Christ that we differ on. And he is not a dangerous, heretical, word -of -faith

Pentecostal or anything like that. No, no, no, no, not at all. Not at all. No, he loves the

Lord. He prays. He reads the Scriptures. He keeps me sharp because, you know,

I have friends like him and another dear friend of mine who considers himself a provisionist, who knows the

Scriptures backwards and forwards. And whenever I have talks with both of these guys, they're constantly, you know, pushing against my position and giving the

Scriptures that they hold and the way they see them. And it causes me to go back to the

Scriptures to look at and examine what they're saying and see how I can either better articulate my position and understand their position better and understand ultimately what

God's word is actually saying with regards to these things. So and the other thing is the people who know us know that we have disagreements, but they see the love and the unity that we have with one another.

And I think that goes a long way, especially when you're doing apologetics. And even apologetically, you know,

I've come to a presuppositional understanding of apologetics. Nick is evidential. So, you know,

I'm able to show people the reason why

I hold to presuppositionalism. He holds to evidentialism, and I think that's a consequence of our theology.

You know, my theology, Reformed theology, says that man cannot come to Christ unless the spirit draws him, and it has to be the work of God first in the person's mind and heart.

Whereas on Nick's position as an Arminian, he believes that the evidence is useful and can draw somebody to Christ.

And I would agree that God uses the evidence to do that. So the differences are big, but God is bigger than that in the sense that he brings his church together.

We have to start working on the unity of the faith and present a united front to the people who are on the outside looking in saying, you guys can't even get along with yourselves.

And now you want me to be a Christian and jump into your church, and now you're going to fight between, you know, who believes in the gifts of the spirit, who believes in cessationism.

Now, I believe those things are very, very important. I really do. And I stand my ground on my position, and he stands his ground.

But again, he's a—both of us are born -again Christians.

So—and God designed it and orchestrated it this way. And until we get to the perfect unity of the faith, we have to work through it.

Amen. And I, for one, think it's refreshing. And as long as I've been hosting

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, starting in 2005, I've always publicly—and it's well known that I take a staunch cessationist position.

I've had guests who are extremely critical of Pentecostalism and the charismatic movement.

But at the same time, I've also had Pentecostal and charismatic pastors and authors on the show, when they are saying something, when they want to say something that is of value,

I think, to the body of Christ, when it's something that we can agree upon. So, in fact, one of my dearest friends, who's now in heaven,

Al Stein. I don't know if you ever met Al Stein. I did once at one of Bruce Bennett's conferences.

Yeah, that's right. He spoke at it. Yes. Yes. Al Stein was the pastor of Neighborhood Assembly of God in Belmore, Long Island.

He was eventually a Assemblies of God bishop. He was an overseer for all the churches on Long Island, all the

Assemblies of God congregations on Long Island. And when I first met him, he was a five -point

Arminian, but very inquisitive about the Reformed faith.

And one of his favorite speakers and authors of all time was none other than John MacArthur, very clear in his opposition to the

Pentecostal and charismatic movement. Well, Al eventually became a full -fledged, thoroughgoing five -point

Calvinist, and he was a guest on my show frequently, even before he was a

Calvinist. And he was able to get by the

Assemblies of God's scrutiny over the one issue of Calvinism that they vehemently disagreed with, that you could not embrace as eternal security and remain in the pastorate.

And they had a misunderstanding about what that—and maybe still do—about what that means. They take the heretical

Charles Stanley understanding of that, that you could come to Christ in saving faith, genuinely be saved, and then live like Satan the rest of your life and still go to heaven.

Obviously, a non -biblical and non -Calvinist understanding of that. So when he had to fill out his form, he said he believed in evidential security.

In other words, that if you are truly secure in Christ, your life is going to give evidence of it. And they were fine with that.

So he was able to maintain his pastoral post and even became a bishop, and then tragically went home to be with the

Lord after an automobile accident a number of years ago. But I'm just told that to say that I'm on the same page with you.

And also, of course, you know Jim Capo, former pastor of the

Massapequa Church of God, who also became a five -point Calvinist, and was almost a cessationist but never quite reached that point.

And now he is retired and living in Florida. But anyway, I hope you're listening, Jim, because I do truly miss your fellowship, brother.

I miss him as well. I miss him as well. Well, we are going to our first break right now.

And when we come back, we are going to be addressing the theme that Anthony is going to be also addressing with Nick Mitchell and Tim Fox at the

New York Apologetics Conference coming up. But we'll also hear more details about that. The theme, the resurrection, in fact, fake or futile.

If you have questions, send them to ChrisArnson at gmail .com. ChrisArnson at gmail .com. Don't go away. We'll be right back with Anthony Uvinio right after these messages from our sponsors.

Please don't go away. And just a reminder to Anthony Uvinio, please put your mic on mute during the breaks.

And 99 % of our guests do not remember to do that. So I just hope that you will do that.

We'll be back together again. We'll be back together again.

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here. I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend Chris Arnson of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and I are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia again for the

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On a theme that I've been preaching, teaching, writing about, and defending in live public debates for most of my life, the sovereignty of God.

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Chris Arnson, I look forward to seeing you all Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd. The G3 National Conference in Atlanta, Georgia on the sovereignty of God.

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Going back to 2005, one of my very favorite guests on Iron Sharpens Iron is

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As host of Iron Sharpens Iron radio,

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Hello, my name is Anthony Uvinio, and I'm one of the pastors at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Corum, New York, and also the host of the reformrookie .com

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Again, I'm Pastor Anthony Invidio, and thanks for listening. When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the

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soon and mention Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. And by the way, I had a wonderful time over lunch, a wonderful time of fellowship over lunch with the daughters, the two daughters of the owners of royaldiadem .com.

Actually, I'm mixing something up. They're not the owners of the daughters of royaldiadem .com.

They're sisters of the individual that just read the ad, the voiceover for royaldiadem .com,

Alex Salter. His sisters, when Alex told them

I was in Black Mountain, North Carolina for the

Chief End of Man Conference being run by Church and Family Life, they immediately said they wanted to meet me because I had been friends with their parents,

Roger and Maureen Salter, for many years. Roger Salter is a frequent guest in this program.

He is the pastor of St. Matthew's Anglican Church, a Reformed Anglican congregation in Birmingham, Alabama.

And when Helen and Melanie heard that I was in their area in North Carolina, they wanted to take me out to an

Indian restaurant because their parents, Roger and Maureen, have told them that I love

Indian food. So they took me out to the best Indian restaurant in that area, and I just had a spectacular time with these two wonderful ladies.

And I also ask of you to pray for Roger Salter, their father, because he was just rushed to the hospital yesterday.

And although I understand he's doing fine now, they are keeping him there for tests, and I don't know the exact details of why he was rushed there, but he has had health problems for years.

So please pray for Roger Salter, because although it would be heaven's gain, it would be certainly a tragic loss for us here on the planet

Earth to lose a powerful Reformed voice with an Anglicanism like Roger Salter is.

But also I just wanted a quick thank Scott Brown and everybody at Church and Family Life for the wonderful time

I had at the Chief End of Man Conference. They provided all of the expenses for my travel there and my exhibitors booth there and my lodging and so on.

So I just had a phenomenal time there. They had 16 speakers, including some of my favorite preachers like Dr.

Joel Beakey, Paul Washer, Jeffrey D. Johnson, Josh Bice, Rob Ventura, and many others.

So I know that they will be having the videos and audio available soon.

They might already have it available, but go to churchandfamilylife .com to find out more about that. And they've already said that they want to pay for my expenses to return next year for the next conference.

So I just want to give my heartfelt thanks to Scott Brown and everyone at Church and Family Life.

We are now back with Anthony Uvinio. And if you have any questions on the resurrection, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com,

chrisarnson at gmail .com. Give us your first name, at least your city and state and your country of residence.

Before we go on to any of the listener questions, Anthony, what was the primary reason that compelled you to address the area of the resurrection?

Obviously, it is a pillar teaching of Christianity. The scriptures say that you have no hope of salvation if you deny the bodily resurrection of Christ.

And so that is certain. But it is something that has been spoken of and written about numerous times for centuries.

Why at this time did you choose this subject? We were actually discussing several different topics and arguments and things to go over.

So we're actually doing this at Tim Fox's, his pastor's church.

And he asked his pastor, what do you think we should go over? And he brought up the resurrection. So we wanted to accommodate him.

And obviously, there's a ton of stuff that we can do. We have three different presentations that we're going to do on it.

In fact, this is Doug Jansen, who is Pete Jansen's son, who we prayed for.

We had so many churches praying for him during COVID. He got COVID bad. And I think when they put the tube down his throat, they punctured his lungs.

So we had so many churches praying for him. And thankfully, he recovered. He's back up on his feet.

And they purchased some new land in Hophag. And that's where we're going to be doing the conference.

It's at 328 Hoffman Lane in Hophag, New York. It's going to go from 10 a .m.

to 1 p .m. We're going to do three presentations and Q &A. And it was really at his suggestion.

There's so many different areas in apologetics that we could tackle. So he seemed to want us to do this.

So each one of us, Tim Fox, myself, and Nick, are going to hit it from a little bit different angles.

Now, just to let you know about Tim Fox, his dad was a Church of God pastor.

That's how I got introduced to him because Nick is a Church of God pastor.

And him and Tim Fox's dad knew each other. And Tim went to Biola out in California, and he was looking to do something here in New York.

So as we started to grow as New York Apologetics, we had him come on board and teach some, present at some of the conferences that we did.

And we did a monthly event at a church in Bohemia where he would help lead and do presentations.

And he's just a really good guy, good apologist. I'm glad to have him on the

New York Apologetics team. So he's going to be doing the resurrection of Jesus, good news or fake news.

So he's couching it to garner a little bit of attention. So looking forward to hearing that talk.

I'm going to do the resurrection, why it's a fact. I mean, why we can absolutely rely on the resurrection as a historical fact of history.

And then Nick is going to hit it from the angle of, OK, so there was a resurrection. Why does it matter?

What is the consequence of the resurrection as far as our faith goes?

So hitting it from three little bit different angles and hopefully going to make an impact in people's minds and hearts to show them that the resurrection is pivotal for us as Christians.

And I believe we may have even forgotten to announce the dates of this. What are the dates?

Yes, Saturday, June 3rd from 10 a .m. to 1 p .m. The cost is free.

I did put in a text to see if it's going to be live streamed. I'm not sure if it is, but the venue can hold, you know, 100 or 200 people.

So if you want, please come out. We'd love to see you guys. So many people do come to the presentations.

They're always blessed by them because there's always something that you can learn. And it's just good to have interaction with other believers from other churches so that we, you know, every week from the pulpit,

I tell our congregation that Long Island is Christ's Island because it is. You know, he owns every inch of it.

It's not just Long Island, but the entire world. But for our intent and purposes, you know, it's our goal to turn

Long Island right side up for the Lord. So if we bloom where we're planted and we turn this island right side up, you don't know, you know, how that's going to affect

New York City. Hopefully it affects the city and then the rest of the country. So I'm optimistic.

We have a lot of horsepower on Long Island. We have a lot of strong men of God. If we can put our heads together and just continue to be faithful and edify the saints, the sheep that God's placed in front of us,

God will do the work. You know, he'll bring revival. Once we start seeing the true gospel preached and people coming to a real understanding of their sinfulness before God, God's spirit will move on them and bring them to a humble position so that sin becomes the issue again.

You know, now it's, you know, God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life, not your life for God's wonderful plan.

So I think a lot of churches are still centered on comfort and even entertainment, dare

I say. So we need to bring back why the gospel is important and what the gospel addresses.

The gospel addresses sin, not your comfort. In fact, when it comes to your comfort,

Jesus says, deny yourself, pick up your cross and follow me. Amen. And I'm going to read a question from our first questioner in the audience today, and I'll have you answer it when we return from the midway break, because I don't want to cut you off in the middle of your question, your answer.

It happens to be a mutual friend of ours, Pastor Jason Contino. He is the pastor of Harborview Christian Church in Port Jefferson, Long Island, New York.

And I have just grown to love him and his wife and have been so blessed by their friendship.

But Pastor Jason asks, could you ask Pastor Anthony if they have an open or closed communion at Hope Performed Baptist Church?

Would you allow a known full preterist to take communion? That's an interesting question, even though it has nothing to do with the subject.

Well, actually, I guess it would, because the resurrection is involved, and full preterists don't believe in the bodily resurrection of Christians in the future or of anyone.

You know, both the dead in Christ and those that are true believers will be raised.

And so that is an area that does reflect some of the aberrant teachings of full preterism.

But we'll have you answer that question when we come back. Don't go away. We're going to be right back with Anthony Uvino right after these messages from our sponsors.

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here. I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and I are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia, again for the

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That's also the email address to ask a question of Anthony Eugenio. chrisarnson at gmail .com,

chrisarnson at gmail .com. Give us your first name, city and state, and country of residence.

As you likely remember, Anthony, before the break we received a question from Pastor Jason Contino of Harborview Christian Church and he asked if you have open or closed communion at Hope Perform Baptist Church and would you allow a known full preterist to take communion and the reason why this has some connection with our discussion is that full preterists, among other things, deny a future resurrection of the saved and the damned, a future bodily resurrection.

So there is a connection with our discussion on the resurrection. So what is your answer to that?

Okay, so the answer to the first question is we have a closed communion. In other words, we guard the table of the

Lord, the body and blood of our Savior, the bread and the wine, and we warn people that if they eat the bread and drink the cup in an unworthy manner, you're drinking judgment upon yourself.

In fact, Paul goes on to say that this is why many of you are weak and ill and even some have died.

So that's a pretty serious warning. So we make sure that the members of our congregation are not harboring any unrepentant sin or unconfessed sin.

We encourage that the goal is not to keep them from the table, but to bring them to the table. But you have to come to God on his terms.

So we encourage repentance, confession of sin, and then to partake of the elements.

For those people who are not members of our church, we tell them that the table is for believers only.

Obviously, we can't police every single person, so we have to leave it up to them whether they want to take communion or not.

Again, we make sure that they need to be believers in Jesus Christ, first repentant of their sin and holding to faith alone.

By the way, I just wanted to insert real quickly, there are many who define closed communion differently than you.

They will not allow anyone who is not a member of their own congregation to have the Lord's Supper. So I'm assuming from what you said, that's not what you mean by that.

Right. Yeah, I don't know. I probably would hold a little bit different definition. I could be wrong, but that's what I was thinking in my head as far as closed.

And I'm assuming you also would insist upon somebody being a member in good standing of a church, a good, biblically faithful church.

Right. If a visitor comes in and they're sitting in the pew and we serve communion, we don't do interviews before we hand it out, but we do guard the table.

We do issue the warnings and make sure that everybody understands that you could be eating and drinking judgment upon yourself.

I mean, and the penalty, some have died. So, I mean, this is this is not frivolous.

This is serious as far as the communion table goes. So that would be my understanding of closed communion.

As far as the second question goes, would we would we allow a full or hyper preterist to take communion?

Well, the answer would be no, because right in First Corinthians 11, part of part of the communion passages for as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the

Lord's death until he comes. Now, a hyper or full preterist believes that Jesus has come already.

Everything, all prophecy, every every biblical prophecy has been fulfilled and completed by 70

AD, according to hyper preterists. So to allow somebody who we know is a hyper preterist to take communion when they believe that Jesus came to earth physically in 70

AD or just came to earth and is not returning physically after that would be wrong.

So we would we would pull that person aside and explain to them that, look, you do not hold what we hold to here.

So in that sense, the community would be closed to them. They could stay for the service. They can listen to the preaching of the word.

But to celebrate as a church family when we are completely doctrinally at different ends of the spectrum on this is is serious, serious enough to withhold communion from them.

When you understand what full preterism actually is, I mean, you have to deny 30 closely held

Christian beliefs in order to be a full preterist. You have to believe that there that Jesus came back already and is not coming back again.

You have to believe that there is no bodily resurrection of the righteous and the unrighteous. You you have to believe that Jesus was not bodily resurrected from the dead.

You have to believe that the that Satan and the fallen angels were cast into hell and have absolutely no influence on the earth today.

You'd have to believe that every single person has been judged. Every everyone has stood before the judgment seat of Christ and been judged already.

You'd have to believe in you can't believe in progressive sanctification. It has to be immediate sanctification of believers.

And the list goes on and on and on and on. The presence of the Holy Spirit is not in the world today.

The church has reached full unity. The curse on the earth is going to stand forever and ever.

Sin is going to continue on forever, ever. So those are all antithetical to what the what the scriptures teach with regards to our to Jesus's bodily resurrection and our bodily resurrection.

In fact, most of the prominent full or hyper preterists believe that Jesus's body as he ascended into heaven dissolved.

He's not seated in heaven in a physical body right now. Now, do they believe you mentioned before they deny the bodily resurrection of Christ?

I've heard from in fact, every hyper preterist I know or have spoken with has said they do believe in the bodily resurrection of Christ.

They just don't believe in the future bodily resurrection of the elect and the reprobate.

You're right. Some of them don't believe that it's it's it's Jesus's. It was

Jesus. It's the same body. Some of them do. Others don't believe that it's the same body.

It's not it's not a physical body. It's a spiritual body.

And they don't mean spiritual body the way Paul means spiritual body in first Corinthians 15. So, um, others do believe that he was raised physically, but as he ascended into heaven again, his body dissolved and he is he is in heavenly in heaven in in in spirit, not in a physical body.

Now, why that is serious is because Psalm 16 says, and Peter quotes on the day of Pentecost, David saying that he will not let his holy one see decay.

Right, so if Jesus doesn't have a physical body anymore, what is death in a

Hebrew understanding of death? Death is separation from the body. So, in essence, Jesus died twice.

So he's not he's not the God man right now.

He's the spiritual mediator, but not truly, truly God, truly man right now.

So those are some very serious things to deny to deny that we will be bodily resurrected and the curse on the earth will never be dealt with is a denial of the finished work of Jesus Christ.

You know, the curse on the earth remains where Jesus is the meek will inherit the earth.

We're going to have a transformed a new heavens and a new earth. Okay, in which the city of the city heaven is going to come down as it is now, and the dwelling of God is going to be with mankind.

So there's not going to be any any more future sin like that. And when Jesus is back, finally.

Yeah, they're not a monolithic group. They know they have infighting, just like many other groups.

And some some are even universalists. Some some no longer participate in a baptism in the

Lord's Supper, but some do. Don, Don Preston is one of the most famous of them all.

And he does continue to practice baptism in the Lord's Supper.

But and he believes he believes in the dissolving of Jesus's body as he ascended into heaven.

Yes. And I did just to let you know, I did a three part series where I articulated a little bit better than what

I just did now. Again, if you go to the Reform Rookie YouTube channel, there's a playlist called

Eschatology. You'll see three, a three part series on full or hyper -preterism.

So you'll hear Anthony explain this when he hasn't been drinking. We serve real wine for communion.

So, yes, yeah. Well, I'm assuming you're using one of those little shot glasses and not drinking right out of the jug.

Well, we're petitioning for bigger glasses, but we'll stay with the little ones for now.

And and it's good to know that it's still purple liquid in those shot glasses and not brown.

So, yeah. Anyway, and now our friend

Jason Contino has another question and we'll let him slide since he's such a wonderful brother in Christ.

How do we address the swoon theory and witnessing to Muslims?

The theory, as I remember it years ago, it wasn't just Muslims teaching this, but liberals as well, that Jesus Christ, those liberals actually believe that Jesus existed as a human, that Jesus Christ went into some kind of a coma temporarily.

He didn't die on Calvary. But if you could let our listeners know about that and witnessing to Muslims specifically who most of them.

It's amazing how the most conservative of Muslims will borrow from leftist apostate

Christians for their apologetics. But they would never allow us to get away with doing the same with Muslims.

Like we see liberal Muslims all the time on TV, some of these feminists in Congress and so on.

But if you could. Sure. So swoon theory basically states that when

Jesus came down from the cross, he was really in a deep comatose state.

He was still alive. So when they buried him, he was buried alive, and he was revived in the tomb and then came out after he basically, not resurrected, but was resuscitated.

So the first thing I would speak to a Muslim on this would be, okay, what is your evidence for that?

Where do you find historical evidence that Jesus was in this comatose state and didn't really die?

Because it doesn't appear in the scriptures. In fact, the scriptures speak of the exact opposite of that.

I mean, Jesus himself said that destroyed this temple in three days.

I will raise it up again. So then he spoke about the sign of Jonah three days and three nights.

Just like Jonah, the son of man will be in the earth three days and three nights and come back to life again.

So Jesus himself is the one, and according to them, he's Esau. He's a prophet of the highest order.

That would make Esau a liar. That would make Jesus a liar. So I would go on the offensive first and ask questions.

Where did you come up with this? And then seek to refute those things.

And then just explain to them through the scriptures and the nature of Jesus' injuries. If there's one thing that the

Romans were good at, it was crucifying people. Like in the revolt of slaves, they killed, they crucified 6 ,000 men.

Not a one of them lived. So now here along comes Jesus, who is guilty, according to them, of the crime of sedition.

He claimed to be Lord when there's only one Lord. Caesar was Lord. Certainly the

Romans are not going to allow him to come down off the cross and live again.

In fact, the soldiers were convinced that Jesus was dead because they didn't break his leg.

Usually to speed up, crucifixion was really death by suffocation.

Your lungs would fill up with water and you'd push up on your legs to get a breath of air.

In order to speed up the death process, the Roman soldier would break the leg of the person being crucified.

Jesus, they didn't have to break his leg. In fact, the soldier put a sword in his side and blood and water came out, which was an indication that he was dead.

So there's so many different problems with this wound theory.

OK, let's say that Jesus really didn't die and was put into the tomb.

Now you have the problem of the rock. Who moved the rock? There was two

Roman soldiers guarding the tomb. Did Jesus push the rock away by himself and escape the

Roman soldiers? The Roman soldiers were guarding his tomb under the penalty of death. If he got out, they would be put to death.

So it wasn't like these guys allowed this to happen. This was a supernatural event that was prophesied in the

Old Testament, was talked about and heralded in the New Testament. All of the early believers and followers of Jesus who met the risen

Lord, this didn't cause them to cower and run away. This emboldened them.

This is what fueled the movement known as Christianity. If Christ was found dead,

Christianity would be found dead and we see nothing of the sort. In fact, these men, the apostles, the early disciples and followers of Jesus, the

Christians, were willing to die because they knew that Jesus rose from the dead.

They met the risen Lord, 500 people. There was 514 witnesses of the resurrection.

And really all you had to do was interview any of them. And if one of them would have said, no,

I didn't see the risen Lord, Jesus really didn't rise again, the resurrection would be falsifiable.

But not one did. They were all willing to go to their death, willing to die for Jesus.

And no one, no one willingly dies for a lie, knowing that it's a lie.

Right? Right. So if they knew that Jesus, somebody stole the body or he's hiding out somewhere, they would, one of them would have at least confessed.

No, don't kill me. I know where Jesus is. Or I know, you know, this this disciple and this apostle, you know, they stole the body and, you know, they they're hiding him right now.

Right. In fact, there is a I don't know if you've seen it. There is a hilarious video of that is mocking the idea that the disciples made up this story of the death and resurrection of Jesus with a role of plotting to remove the body from the tomb.

And the leader of this, I believe it was

Peter who is leading the discussion and the plot says that we're all going to certainly be put to death.

You know, they're like, what? Excuse me. Wait a minute. What? I mean, because there was no benefit to making up a lie that they knew to be a lie to just lead to their own torment and execution.

So anyway, yeah, it was it was if if they did it to to exalt themselves, boy, did they get a surprise?

I mean, their benefits package was persecution, beatings, death.

Some some Peter, you know, tradition has that he was crucified upside down. They didn't do this for for their own glory.

They recognized that Jesus did rise from the dead. He he appeared to them.

Thomas, you know, he tells Thomas, put your hand in my side. You know, it's it's me.

So, again, all of them were willing to go to their death, knowing that Jesus rose from the dead.

If he didn't, this is the greatest hoax that humanity has ever known. And this will also be part of Nick's talk on why it matters, because if Jesus didn't rise from the dead, even

Paul says, if Jesus didn't rise from the dead, you're still in your sins. OK, and of most most of all people to be pitied.

So, again, if if Christ didn't rise from the dead, we don't have an atonement for our sins.

We're we're making God out to be a liar. We're misrepresenting God and we're to be pitied because we're following something that's completely untrue.

And by the way, Pastor Jason, I don't know if you're aware of this, but that is actually the swoon theory is a very tiny minority view, from what

I understand, amongst Muslims. Most Muslims believe Judas was nailed to the cross, that that Jesus was not nailed to the cross.

It was Judas, not that the Romans knowingly nailed

Judas to the cross, but it was a mistaken identity kind of a situation. But I know that Shabir Ali, at least

I'm nearly positive Shabir Ali, who is one of the most well -known Muslim apologists, does believe in the swoon theory.

But well, thank you. And by the way, I want to give a plug to Harborview Christian Church, where our listener,

Jason Contino, is the pastor. Their website is Harborview Christian Church.

I'm sorry, HarborviewChristian .Church. HarborviewChristian .Church.

And I urge anybody living in or near Port Jefferson, Long Island, to visit and even join that congregation.

We have a listener from St. Kitts in the

West Indies. We're going to have to go there and answer this one person. We have

Gregory in St. Kitts who says, I heard someone say that they believe that someone got into the tomb by some secret way and stole the body.

How do you deal with that? I'm assuming he means other than rolling the stone away.

I've never heard that. I've never heard that one. Somebody tunneling through the rock. I'm not even sure why that would be necessary since the stone was rolled away.

So I'm not sure why. Again, the question becomes, okay, what is your basis for making that statement?

What is your evidence? What is your foundation for believing that?

Obviously, if the scriptures are the inspired, infallible, inerrant word of God, they're

God -breathed. So, again, this is a very strong sticking point for us as believers because we all believe every apologist recites 1

Peter 3 .15. Always be prepared to give an answer for the hope that lies within you with gentleness and respect. But the first half of that verse is set apart

Christ as Lord. So if Jesus is Lord and Jesus held that the scriptures were true and the scriptures are

God -breathed, infallible, self -attesting, and historically sound, why would I believe anything outside of the scriptures that contradict the scriptures?

So I have a basis by which I can point to and be certain about it because the scriptures are

God -breathed. They're given to us by an omniscient God. Omniscience means that God knows everything.

So if I have a God who knows everything and tells me something, I can be sure without a shadow of a doubt that it's true.

So now this man comes along and says, well, how do you know somebody didn't sneak into the tomb, pull Jesus out, and did something else with him?

Well, you can make up all different kinds of stories. How do you know it wasn't aliens? How do you know it wasn't

Mary who was buried with him and she rolled the stone away? You can come up with a gajillion different options and not have to give a foundation for it.

I mean, we have more historical evidence and scriptural evidence for the resurrection than any other theory that's out there.

Plus our scriptures are God -breathed. This is the word of God. So if you set Christ apart as Lord of your heart and Jesus used the scriptures to combat the devil,

Jesus said, Thy word is true. Sanctify them by your truth, your word, your word is truth.

If Jesus held that the scriptures were true, why would I think differently? Well, thanks a lot,

Gregory and St. Kitts. Please continue to spread the word about Iron Trump and Zion Radio in the

West Indies and beyond. We have a listener, Anthony, in Hoshton, Georgia.

And since Anthony has never corrected my pronunciation of that, I'm assuming that I'm pronouncing it correctly.

He says, Pastor Eugenia, when discussing the resurrection of Christ, do you find it enough to establish the scriptural and historical fact of it as spoken in First Corinthians 15, verses one through four, according to the scriptures, or have you found that setting in the context of redemptive history as Jesus is

Lord and King, speaking through his word as in Hebrews 12, verses 22 through 29, i .e.

he rose from the dead to rule and reign from heaven, where it speaks of him speaking to us after his ascension as king over the gospel of the kingdom spreading worldwide.

Does expanding the dialogue to the gospel of the kingdom open up our evangelistic and apologetic opportunities?

And I'm going to be honest here, I don't really understand Anthony's question. Maybe you do. Well, I think the scriptural basis in First Corinthians 15 is more than enough to explain to an unbeliever that the early

Christians believed that Jesus rose from the dead. If this is truly God's word and God's word can't be wrong, well, then this is a historical fact.

In fact, Paul says, again, if the resurrection hasn't happened, you're still in your sins and your faith is futile, right?

So the question is, how could Christianity explode in expansion in Jerusalem in the very city that Jesus supposedly rose from the dead from if he really didn't rise from the dead?

Why would these men willingly go to their deaths believing and professing the resurrection of Jesus if it didn't happen?

On top of the fact that you have the witness of Jesus several times saying that, you know, destroy this body in three days,

I'm going to raise it up again. You have the New Testament witness about the Sadducees who didn't believe in the resurrection.

And Paul said there is a resurrection. Daniel talks about the resurrection of the just and the unjust. The resurrection is part and parcel of the new creation and the reason that Christ was crucified on the cross.

If Christ was crucified on the cross and there was no resurrection, well, then Jesus didn't accomplish what he set out to do.

Now, yes, we can go into the scriptures and say that Jesus is ruling and reigning right now, seated at the right hand of God the

Father. And his kingdom has been established on Earth already, which is a big sticking point, even within Christians, because you have

Christians waiting for Jesus to come back to set up his kingdom on Earth. Where post -millennialists and amillennialists believe that Jesus established and set up his kingdom when he first came.

And he's ruling and reigning until when? Until he makes his enemies a footstool for his feet. So, yes,

I would definitely say Jesus is king. He's Lord. You will have to stand before him one day and give an account of your life and what you've done.

Now you can either stand before him as your judge or you can stand before him as his son.

You need to repent, trust in the Jesus of the scriptures, be reconciled to God.

You need to come to God on his terms. And that's through Jesus Christ. Some people say, well,

I think all roads lead to heaven. And I say, well, I disagree with you. But even if they do, you're going to stand before God either as judge or his son.

Which would you rather? In fact, I heard an excellent and I'm not sure.

I'm not sure if my friend Don Holder invented this. I don't think it

I don't think it was original to him. But when I was in when I was in a Christian alcohol rehab facility over a decade ago,

Don Holder, who was the director of Hebron Colony Ministries in Boone, North Carolina, during a sermon, he said, there are many people who say all roads lead to God.

And I say and he said, I say I agree with that. But only one of those roads leads to God and salvation.

All the others lead to him and judgment. Amen. Yeah. So because we're all going to be facing

God, no matter what road we're taking. And obviously, we only want to be in that one road.

That is the road to eternal life. I'm sorry I interrupted you. No, no, no, no.

That's that's quite right. Listen, I tell people every sin in this world must be paid for. It will either be paid for by you or paid for by Jesus.

Which would you rather? Yeah, if you. Yeah, good. I was just going to say, Anthony has a second part to his question.

I am sure it might vary depending on who is listening to you.

But have you found it better to offer more of a biblical worldview that comes into play because of the resurrection?

And then he closes with I have enlarged the font of my email due to the host's older eyesight.

He's talking about me and I thank him for that. I wish everybody would do that. Yeah, absolutely.

Obviously, we have to use a biblical worldview for everything. But I think what he's explaining is,

OK, now that Jesus rose from the dead, what what is what are the ramifications for that?

The ramifications for that is that Jesus is ruling and reigning right now. Now the kingdom.

Now you see the effect that Jesus's resurrection had on the entire world.

Right. So his resurrection fueled the movement known as Christianity in the

Roman Empire where Jesus was killed. Let's say let's say let's say he didn't rise from the dead and he's still in the tomb.

Well, why would this movement called Christianity explode so quickly and grow so quickly?

It wouldn't if Jesus was still found in the tomb. Right. And that's one of the big things that we have.

We have an empty tomb. And you have atheists like John Dominic Croson and Bart Ehrman and Gerd Lunemann all saying that the death and the death of Jesus is a historical fact.

And the empty tomb is a historical fact. One of the one of the ways that we we study history.

One of the things we use is called embarrassing testimony or enemy to enemy attestation.

When your enemies are admitting that the tomb is empty and agreeing with you.

Well, that's something that you you want to highlight, because that means it's probably true. If if we came back and said the tomb was empty and the

Jews who who were who who wanted Jesus dead are saying, yes, the tomb is empty because the disciples stole the body.

They're making an excuse for the empty tomb. So the empty tomb becomes a catalyst and something that we could stand upon to say, yes, the tomb was empty.

The question is why now we have the scriptures that support why the tomb was empty. We have

Jesus's own words. We have the disciples boldness.

We have the conversion of Paul, which is, again, a big factor. Here's Paul persecuting

Christians who now meets the risen savior on the road to Damascus.

He has a conversion experience and he goes from persecuting Christians to now teaching them and edifying them and preaching the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Paul's conversion from a Pharisee to a Christian is is a decidedly big mark for for the

Christian movement, because what would convince a man like Paul that Christianity was true after he was persecuting

Christians as as many as he did? He had something something big had to happen to him.

OK, we go to our final break right now, and when we come back, we will begin with a question from Cindy in Findlay, Ohio.

If you want to join Cindy, our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail dot com. Give us your first name, at least your city and state and your country of residence.

Don't go away. We'll be right back after these messages. James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here.

I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend Chris Arnson of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and I are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia again for the

G3 National Conference. That's Thursday, September 21st through Saturday, the 23rd on a theme that I've been preaching, teaching, writing about and defending in live public debates for most of my life.

The sovereignty of God. I'll be joined on the speaking roster by Steve Lawson, Voti Baucom, Paul Washer, Virgil Walker, Scott Annual and Josh Bice, founder of G3 Ministries.

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Chris Arnson, I look forward to seeing you all Thursday, September 21st through Saturday, the 23rd. The G3 National Conference in Atlanta, Georgia on the sovereignty of God.

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Getting a driver's license, running a cash register, flipping burgers, passing sixth grade.

Do you know what they all have in common? They all require training, assessments, and certifications. But do you know what requires no training at all?

Becoming a parent. My name is A .M. Brewster. I'm the president of Truth, Love, Parent, and host of its award -winning podcast.

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Please visit us at truthloveparent .com. Welcome back. We have Cindy in Findley, Ohio, who asks,

Good evening, Chris and Anthony. I apologize I've missed most of the show, so this may have been covered.

I would like to know your thoughts on cold case Christianity.

Well, before Anthony answers, I'd just like to let you know that cold case Christianity is a form of Christianity adopted by the

Presbyterians and Lutherans. Whenever you open up their refrigerators, you could always find a cold case.

No, she is referring to the video series by homicide detective

J. Warner Wallace, a detective that handled old murder cases. And I think you had him speak at one of your events, didn't you?

Yeah, actually, he was scheduled to speak at one of our events, the Day of the Defend conference.

And what happened was his daughter, who's a Marine, she she hurt her ankle or something.

And her graduation date got postponed. And it just happened to be the date of our conference.

So he called and he says, well, I got a I got a conflict. You know, my my daughter's graduating the

Marines that day. I said, well, I hope she's going to be OK with you if you don't show up. So, you know, he laughed.

J. Warner Wallace is one of the most genuinely nice Christian apologists

I know. He's he's so eager to help, eager to sow into people, eager to help them along in their faith.

He he's an evidentialist and he does a tremendous job laying out the case evidentially for the resurrection, for the for the chain of custody of the

New Testament. He's a phenomenal guy. I would just differ with him slightly, obviously, being that I'm a presuppositional apologist.

But the stuff that I've watched that he's done, in fact, the new the new series that he came out with called

Person of Interest is absolutely phenomenal. The stuff that he he uncovers and presents to two people is just excellent.

I highly recommend him again. He's an evidentialist and as a presuppositionalist, we can use evidence for sure.

I would just say that, you know, we stand on the word of God. If the word of God says something, then it's true. Well, we're out of time.

And, Anthony, I'd like you to summarize what you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners before we go up to the air.

Sure. I want them to understand that the the resurrection of Jesus Christ is a bona fide fact.

It's biblically supported. It's evidentially supported. It's supported historically. So I would encourage you, if you want more information on this, to come out to the conference.

We're going to have three good, excellent sessions with Q &A to follow. Again, the date for that is

Saturday, June 3rd, from 10 a .m. to 1 p .m. free. There's no cost.

The location is 321 Hoffman Avenue in HopHog, New York.

It's Living Word Church. The tagline for the resurrection conference is called

Fact, Fake, or Feudal. So we're going to be presenting presentations along those lines.

And, again, if Christianity—if there was no resurrection, there'd be no Christianity, and we would still be in our sins.

So this is crucial to Christianity and our atonement. Amen. And let me repeat the websites of everything connected with Anthony Uvinia.

We have Hope Reformed Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island, New York, where he is one of three pastors.

HopeReformedLi .net. HopeReformedLi .net. We have the

ReformedRookie .com, where our guest, Anthony Uvinia, is the host of that website.

ReformedRookie .com. ReformedRookie .com. And last but not least, New York Apologetics, the ministry hosting this conference that we have been addressing.

NewYorkApologetics .com. NewYorkApologetics .com. I want to remind our listeners that Iron Sharpens Iron Radio was hit very hard by the coronavirus pandemic hysteria, where governments, both federal and local, imposed unconstitutional and anti -biblical restrictions upon people, shutting businesses down, sometimes family -owned businesses that were open for centuries were closed down.

People in our audience, no doubt, were hurt immeasurably financially by this hysteria.

And that has hurt us. We have never, ever bounced back from the plummeting of the giving to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio ever since COVID broke out.

So we're asking you, please, if you really love the show and you don't want it to disappear, go to IronSharpensIronRadio .com,

click support, then click, click to donate now, and help us survive into the future so that we can have more guests like Anthony Eugenio on the air.

I want to thank everybody who listened. I want to thank especially those who took the time to send in questions.

Of course, I want to thank my guest, Anthony Eugenio. I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater

Savior than you are a sinner. Don't forget to tune in tomorrow when another Long Islander, or at least a native

Long Islander, Kevin Vigneault, pastor of Community Connections at Lakewood Baptist Church of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, will be our guest tomorrow to address foundations for evangelism.