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Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron, a radio platform on which pastors, Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.
Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. Matthew Henry said that in this passage, quote, We are cautioned to take heed whom we converse with, and directed to have in view in conversation, to make one another wiser and better.
It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions. Now here's our host, Chris Arnzen.
Well, good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, and the rest of humanity on the planet Earth. This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron, wishing you all a happy Tuesday, June the 2nd, 2015.
And I think I may have ceased to become a cessationist. I say that in jest because I believe miracles do exist because of the fact that I am actually broadcasting on air, for the second day in a row, technical problems free.
And many people thought that it could not be done, but thanks be to God, and thanks be to the friends that God has given me who are capable of using this technology. We are now broadcasting live the second day in a row.
And for those of you who heard our program yesterday, we began the theme of same-sex marriage with Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, and we particularly were addressing the societal impacts and ramifications of the acceptance of same-sex marriage, which is being forced upon us all by the leftist agenda, and there is an attempt for it to be forced upon us all.
And as we all await a Supreme Court decision, which is supposed to be occurring by the end of this month, we think it is a valuable thing for Christians to be addressing this subject. And yesterday, as always, an hour is not enough time to adequately address everything that needs to be addressed.
In fact, we could do a whole month's worth of these programs on this issue, and it wouldn't give us enough time to really thoroughly delve into it as deeply as we could or should. But we are only granted an hour, so we are actually following up on yesterday's interview with Dr. James R. White, and today we have with us a very, very dear friend of mine, Pastor Ron Glass of Wading River Baptist Church, and he is going to be discussing what the Bible has to say about homosexuality, and we will also be addressing the same-sex marriage issue as well.
And it's such an honor and privilege and a joy for me to have my dear friend Ron Glass with me on the air for the first time during this newly relaunched Iron Sharpens Iron series. Great to have you with us.
Glad to be with you.
And Pastor Glass is the pastor of Wading River Baptist Church, which is on the eastern end of Suffolk County, Long Island. He's also a former adjunct professor of biblical exposition at Talbot School of Theology, and he is the host of the River of Life radio program, which can be heard in eastern Suffolk County on Faith FM radio, and that's every Saturday at 9 .30 a .m. and Sunday at 7 .30 p .m.
And you can hear it anywhere in the world via live streaming at eastgatebroadcasting .com. That's eastgatebroadcasting .com. I strongly recommend that you listen to this program as Pastor Glass is dedicated to expository preaching.
I happen to be the individual who, along with Ralph Lambiasi of Apologia Designs, we edit Pastor Glass' sermons in order to fit within a half-hour program, and I strongly recommend it for its powerful content and biblical faithfulness.
But Pastor Glass, it's good to have you back to address this very serious issue of same-sex marriage and also what the Bible has to say about homosexuality. And first of all, before I even begin with my questions for you, I just want to make it clear to our listeners, who knows, there's maybe some homosexuals listening or some who practice that sin.
We are not attempting to beat up on homosexuals or bash them or what have you. We believe it is the duty of Christians, motivated by love, to inform homosexuals that if they do not repent, they will not see eternal life.
This is a damnable sin, as all sin is without the blood of Christ. And we just urge you to listen carefully and withhold judgment. Hate is not the motivation, I can assure you. Only hatred of sin, which we all should have.
Some people may think that, particularly this radio program, maybe hobby-horsing on this sin. That is not the case, because we are doing this two days in a row. That is not the case that we are hobby-horsing or trying to put an extra focus on this particular sin than other sins.
Pastor Glass, wouldn't you agree that it's really society that is constantly, every single day, bombarding us with this sin by trying to manipulate and brainwash everyone into adopting it, accepting it and celebrating it?
Yes, and more and more television programs feature a prominent character that is a homosexual,.
Even programs that are watched by families, including small children and so on. And it has become an overwhelming issue in the public eye. And obviously, it's really the only sin I can think of that has become a global movement and has become a powerful political force, where people are demanding to be recognized as a specific class of people in regard to this sin, as if they are an ethnic group, a race, or a gender.
It's just mind-boggling how they have successfully reached the level of power they have, being a tiny minority in the society. Wouldn't you agree, Pastor Glass?
I want to repeat our email address.
If anyone would like to email us a question for Pastor Ron Glass on the homosexual issue, what the Bible has to say about homosexuality or same-sex marriage specifically, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail dot com.
Chrisarnson at gmail dot com. Also, I want to quickly let you know about a phone number. This is not a phone number for calling in questions, but anybody that you know that would like to listen to this broadcast at any time live, if they're not near a computer, they can listen via phone anywhere, as long as they have a phone with them, at 401 -283 -6754.
That's 401 -283 -6754. And they just need to follow the prompts and press the number 3 for Christian Radio. So I hope that now even more people start listening to the broadcast, since they don't need to be chained to a computer in order to do so.
Pastor Glass, for Evangelical Christianity, what is the foundational issue at stake in the debate over same-sex marriage?
Well, as I just said, I think that the foundational...
And how does the American commitment to the separation of church and state affect this debate?
Well, that's an interesting point. And that is that that's what's happening now. It's breaking down. And a majority of our culture has abandoned that. The problem with that is...
And it's interesting that a lot of liberals like to use that phrase over and over and over again, separation of church and state. But isn't it true that that whole concept came out of a promise by Thomas Jefferson to Baptists that they were not going to be forced to change their personal theological convictions by a government-run church like the Anglican Church did in England?
Yes, that's correct.
So if the issue at the root of this controversy over same-sex marriage is authority, what is our authority as Christians?
Well, that's a pretty...
But, Pastor Ron, you have to admit that the unbelieving world around us doesn't acknowledge biblical authority. They see the Scriptures as the root of our bias. So how can we make the case for the relevance of biblical authority in this argument?
All right, well, let me take a... For it is written, I am the wise man. God's truth...
So the law was intended to shape our thinking, but that implies this debate is basically academic, a discussion among theologians in an ivory tower. What's the practical impact of God's law?
Well, let me go back to...
We've got to go to a break right now. If you'd like to join us with a question, this is a live broadcast, so you may e-mail your question now at chrisarnzen, at gmail .com, C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N, at gmail .com.
Don't go away. We'll be right back with Pastor Ron Glass of Wading River Baptist Church as we discuss further what the Bible has to say about homosexuality and how we are to respond to same-sex marriage.
Tired of box store Christianity, of doing church in a warehouse with all the trappings of a rock concert? Do you long for a more traditional and reverent style of worship? And how about the preaching?
Perhaps you've begun to think that in-depth biblical exposition has vanished from Long Island. Well, there's good news. Wading River Baptist Church exists to provide believers with a meaningful and reverent worship experience featuring the systematic exposition of God's Word.
And this loving congregation looks forward to meeting you. Call them at 631 -929 -3512 for service times. 631 -929 -3512. Or check out their website at wrbc .us. That's wrbc .us. Welcome back. This is Chris Arnzen.
And if you just tuned us in on Leading Edge Radio Network, on Iron Sharpens Iron, we have as our guest today, Pastor Ron Glass of Wading River Baptist Church in eastern Suffolk County, Long Island. We're discussing the Bible, what the Bible has to say about homosexuality and how we are, as Christians, to respond to same-sex marriage.
And our e-mail address is chrisarnzen at gmail .com. That's C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N at gmail .com. And picking up on the law of God that you were addressing before the break, Pastor Ron, wouldn't you agree that the vast majority of people reject the demands of God's holiness?
Well, they do. And that's primarily at this time.
In our discussion about God's law or the broader category of biblical revelation in its entirety, aren't we usually really attempting to locate the source of truth?
Well, yes. Be perfect. Use pure words as silver tried in a furnace of the earth. Pastor Ron, isn't it true that ever since the 17th century.
Enlightenment, it's been fashionable to deny that anyone can know anything for sure, which is kind of interesting, that it seemed to be the theme of the emerging church, which I'm not sure if it's as popular as it once was.
But I seem to remember that even the French philosopher Rene Descartes, I think I may be butchering his name, but he was reduced to speculating on how he knew he existed. And his conclusion was, I think, therefore I am, comes to mind.
So how can we know truth?
Well, that's the problem. You end up, people does, in fact.
All right, I'm going to take this opportunity to take our last station break. So remember, if you'd like to join us on the air with a question for Pastor Ron Glass on same-sex marriage or on homosexuality, the email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.
That's chrisarnson at gmail .com. We'll be right back.
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Hi, I'm Pastor Bob Walderman, and I invite you to come and join us here at Lynnbrook Baptist Church and see all that a church can be.
Call Lynnbrook Baptist at 516 -599 -9402. That's 516 -599 -9402. Or visit lynnbrookbaptist .org. That's lynnbrookbaptist .org.
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Welcome back. This is Iron Sharpens Iron on Leading Edge Radio Network. Our guest today is Pastor Ron Glass of Wading River Baptist Church, and we are discussing the theme of what the Bible has to say about homosexuality and how we as Christians are to respond to same-sex marriage.
I just wanted to read a question from a listener, Josh in Riverhead, New York. He says, how do you respond to the comment by those who oppose Christianity or the Christian view of traditional marriage, biblical marriage, that when they say it's just a piece of paper, why are you getting so upset?
How do you respond to that?
Well, I think...
Yes. Christine in Atlanta, Georgia, asks if you have any thoughts about what will happen to the visible church in America going forward, given the culture around us is so increasingly hostile to Christians holding the biblical view on homosexuality, i .e., violent persecution, pastors arrested, the disappearance of the visible church, and or underground churches.
Do you think that, Pastor Glass, that we are going to see that in the near horizon?
Depressed the truth in unrighteousness, climate change. So what was the... Therefore, it's a sober thing to think...
Well, how then should we go about defending the truth? Obviously, there needs to be a recognition. When we proclaim the gospel to sinners, which would include homosexuals, would include everybody, we have to also recognize and profess that we are sinners who, by God's grace and mercy, have been delivered from those sins and the penalty thereof by the blood of Christ, correct?
Right. That's correct.
And of course, we have to hold up the banner of Paul's words, where after he finished describing the behaviors of those who would be cast into hell if they did not repent, he did say that including homosexuals, that some of you once were these things, that you've been washed and you've been cleansed and sanctified and so on, correct?
That is absolutely true, and that goes... But you are washed in drunkenness and swindling and all of those things as well.
Yes, one of the greatest sins known to the church is gossip, and that's included in there.
And pride and all of...
Now, just to touch on something you said about the ability to conform to the law, you of course are talking about through the regenerating power of the Holy Spirit, correct?
The regenerating power...
We've got about four minutes, and I think you've made a very persuasive case for Scripture as the authority for Christian belief and practice. We understand that the unbelieving world won't accept what you've said, but we as Christians need to have sound biblical answers.
Would you just spend the rest of our time biblically evaluating some of the claims that the homosexual community often makes? And obviously we've got far too brief a time to adequately do that, but if you could just bring up a couple.
Right. Well, I don't even like that term. It wasn't the only thing. Capital punishment was...
I just want you to just now conclude with about a minute time what you have most... What's most burdening your heart that you want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners.
Well, I think the most... There are churches and people like us as Christians standing behind...
And obviously Pastor Glass and I urge everyone to pray fervently in regard to the Supreme Court decision that we are expecting to hear, could be any day now before the end of June. Pastor Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries promised to be back on after that decision again to address the arguments made by theologians who proclaim either to be homosexuals or advocates of homosexuality, since he has debated a number of them and written on the subject.
He'll be back tomorrow. We have Pastor Josh Fryman of the Community Baptist Church of Riverhead joining us, and he's going to be discussing the misconceptions non-Calvinists have regarding the doctrines of sovereign grace.
And on Thursday we have John Sampson, who was a former Word of Faith pastor, who by God's grace has abandoned that heresy and entered into Reformed theology and has thoroughly embraced that, and that is the teaching of the church that he is now pastoring, the doctrines of sovereign grace.
And Friday we don't have anyone booked yet at this moment, but I'm sure we will, and we'll let you know who that will be as soon as we have that name of that guest. Pastor Glass, I know that your website is wrbc .us, and I thank you so much for being our guest, and I look forward to having you back often, brother, and thank you so much for all you've done to make this program possible.
You're quite welcome, Chris. Thank you.
And I got cut off yesterday. I want to dedicate the relaunching of Iron Sharpens Iron to my precious wife, Julie, who went home to be with Christ after nearly 20 years of marriage at the age of 56. And I also am doing this relaunch in memory of a very dear friend, Pastor Al Stein of the Neighborhood Assembly of God, who went home to be with the Lord as well very recently in January, in fact.
And also Ken Silva of Uprising Ministries, who was a guest on this program as well. Very often he also went home to be with his Lord and Savior for eternity. I do this program in memory of them. And last but not least, my mother-in-law, Carmen, who just very recently went home to be with the Lord.
And I want to conclude this program with the words of Puritan Christopher Love, as I have done many times before in the past when the program originally aired for five years. I hope you always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far, far greater Savior than you are a sinner.
God bless, and I hope you tune in tomorrow. Take care.