July 12, 2019 Show with Rutledge E. Etheridge III on “God Breathed: Connecting Through Scripture to God, Others, the Natural World, & Yourself”

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century Gospel Minister, George Norcross, in downtown

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It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with

your own questions.

And now, here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth,

who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Friday on

this 12th day of July, 2019.

And I am thrilled to have a first -time guest today.

His name is Rutledge E. Etheridge III.

That is one of the coolest names, I think, that I've ever heard in my life.

I don't think I can say it without pronouncing it.

His name is Rutledge E. Etheridge III, but he likes to go by the name Rut, and he is an assistant

professor of biblical studies at Geneva College, and today we are going to be addressing a book of his that

is soon to be in print through Crown Covenant Publications, a very good friend of Iron Sharpens Iron

Radio, who routinely provides us with giveaway books for our listeners.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time ever to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio,

Rutledge E. Etheridge.

Thank you very much, Chris.

I really appreciate the opportunity.

And this book of which I speak that is soon to be in print is God -Breathed, Connecting Through

Scripture to God, Others, the Natural World, and Yourself.

Before we go into the theme of the book, we have a tradition here at Iron Sharpens Iron Radio,

Rut, where whenever we have a first -time guest who happens to be a

Christian, which would be the vast majority of the time, we do on rare occasions interview non -Christians over

reasons that may be involving a debate, or this non -Christian individual may just have something

very important to say for even Christians to hear and learn from.

But I'm not a modern -day ecumenist, by the way, I want to make that clear.

But for the most part, we interview Christians on this show, Bible -believing Protestant

individuals, and before we go into the theme, the tradition that we have is that

you give a summary of your personal salvation story, let our listeners know what

kind of a religious atmosphere, if any, you were raised in, and what kind of providential circumstances our Lord

raised up in your life that drew you to Himself and saved you.

Sure.

Well, I first began to be presented in a consistent way in a tiny little Christian

school in East Longmeadow, Massachusetts, where my sister and I were reared by our parents, and

I had transferred out of a public school and into that school, largely just because of a bad experience at the

public school, and day after day I kept hearing of Jesus and of my need for Jesus, and

my family had been a little bit in and out of church, and I was

quickly convinced of my need of a Savior, I had no objections whatsoever to Jesus being my Savior.

I think the thing that I struggled with most was whether, for

years, really, I would

choose one night, because it was only 74, the previous, and

then by God's grace, through His Word, through prayer, through good Bible

teaching, my salvation was not a matter of my continually

grasping after it, but rather of the Lord Jesus Himself holding onto me, and

passages such as John chapter 10 and so many others in

Scripture, which really became very, very personal

to me over the

years, and also with the privilege now to...

Amen.

And how did you discover and come to believe in the doctrines of Sovereign Grace, also known as Reformed

Theology?

Sure.

When I was an undergrad at Cedarville University in Ohio,

and one of the thinkers that we studied was John Calvin, and

for a lot of different reasons, coming into my undergrad days, I absolutely hated John Calvin,

a lot of animosity toward him.

The only problem is I had never actually read John Calvin.

So you hated a figment of your imagination, then?

Absolutely.

I hated the stereotype, I hated the straw man, and it was some visceral

hate of necessity, and, you know,

not to praise a man, but,

you know, the opening section,

as he's often

built up, the more I studied his life, the more I studied the context in

which the Reformers ministered,

and once you

begin to grasp

that, a

number of

other particular...

Amen.

Yes, the final straw that broke the camel's back of my own

personal Arminianism as a very new Christian, even though I didn't even know what Arminianism

was, I didn't know who John Calvin was, or Jacob Arminius, or Charles Spurgeon,

or even George Whitefield, but it happened to be a tract that a

friend, who was also a fellow member of Calvary Baptist Church of Amityville, Long Island, which is now

Grace Reform Baptist Church of Long Island in Merrick, New York, but this

tract was George Whitefield's letter to John Wesley on election, and it was Whitefield's biblical

defenses of unconditional election that broke the straw, or

that was the straw that broke the camel's back with me, and initially, I hated it.

I said, this is true, but I hate it, and I was, like, filled with fear about it,

but then within, I would say, a couple of months, maybe less, I fell in love with those teachings.

They radicalized my personal relationship with Christ,

because Christ, no longer in my mind, died for a nameless, faceless sea of

humanity with a hypothetical redemption.

I hope that those for whom he died would be redeemed.

It was an actual accomplished act.

When he said, it is finished, he redeemed me personally, and that just really

revolutionized my whole understanding of the gospel and of grace itself.

Yeah, yeah, it took me several months longer, in fact, a lot longer.

I remembered singing in chapel and just being so utterly disillusioned.

I put my faith in, he seems like a tyrant, and the Spirit worked in my heart, and

I gradually, and I still remember the night in my dorm room, sitting there sulking, epically and theologically sulking,

and the Lord just banging

my head up against the rock of my salvation, thinking that if I were in charge of the universe and salvation

and all things, that I would be so much wiser and more compassionate, and it just makes

no sense to say those kinds of things in the face of

our God -level mysteries that

count ourselves in a labyrinth.

As Paul does in Romans 9 -11, at some point, he's done answering arguments, and he in essence just

says, now you just worship.

And I think that, each

of us, and only makes us want to hold out the gospel of

Jesus Christ to everyone all the more fully and all the more frequently.

Yes, and although we are talking a lot about John Calvin right now, the thing that's interesting is that many non

-Calvinists, and especially anti -Calvinists, because there is a difference, you can be a non

-Calvinist without being malicious and being passionately in a

hateful state against Calvinism, but many non -Calvinists, or should I say

anti -Calvinists, say that we worship John Calvin, that we put Calvin above the scriptures,

we put Calvin above Christ, which is a slanderous argument, because I've rarely ever met anybody that

comes close to that from our theological camp.

But the interesting thing to me is, in my experience as a Reformed Baptist Christian,

although Calvin does come up in sermons occasionally, especially when a pastor may be

quoting from the institutes or something, and although we do regard Calvin very highly, we regard his

contributions to theology very highly, it seems to me that, in my

experience, in all the Bible conferences I've been to and all the Reformed churches I've been to, John Calvin is actually rarely

mentioned.

I mean, you might more frequently hear Charles Spurgeon quoted, or if

the speaker is quoting from a non -canonical, non

-inspired, you know, earthly author,

Calvin, I think, is quoted in the minority of times, so it's kind of ironic that they would say we worship him.

Yeah, and I think Calvin would, you know, bury an unmarked grave, and,

you know, it's important for us to have thinkers as landmarks in church history to be able to look back on and

to not elevate by any means above the Word of God, but

I'm just

struck by, again, not to praise a man, but to debunk a stereotype.

You know, stories that you hear of, or that you often don't hear of Calvin, you know, for instance, he would open

the door in the middle of the night to a knock, and there, standing in front of him, was a woman in her nightgown

in blood, and her children next to her, and what had just happened, and

killed her husband in bed next to her, because her husband was dead, and

so Calvin, and he would mobilize others in the town to take in these new widows, you know, and these semi

-orphans, and he was deeply engaged in Gospel ministry on that level.

He would, you know, pawn his priceless theology books to supply the material needs of

these newly destitute.

When he was sitting in that day,

he would die in

the near future because of the Gospel.

I think one of the things that's helpful for us, especially in our day, you know, for any of us who would not

want to claim the mantle of Calvin, but a clarity in viewing Scripture, we need

to remember what the lives of these Reformers were like,

you know, and just the self -denial that they, by God's grace, in many ways, faithfully lived

out, and I think that would be anti -Calvinist, so to speak, but

would also temper,

especially on

social media.

Right.

In fact, I could say with near certainty that in the Reform Baptist Church, where I am a member,

my pastors quote far more frequently from Martin Luther than they do from John Calvin, even though

we would have more in disagreement with Luther, we still seem to.

Be quoting him more often.

Whoever serves Scripture the best.

You know, if you're working with a particular text, and you want to get at what the Holy Spirit put there, and, you know, whoever it

is who helped us more clearly see that, you know, we want to give proper attribution and not make

discernment about them, but the goal is to get into the Scriptures, you know, the Scriptures alone, and

to see in the Scriptures, you know, the incarnate.

Word.

Yeah, and I think Martin Luther is also your go -to guy when it comes to shock value.

He was a very earthy, earthy guy that didn't hold, he didn't pull back punches.

Yeah, our culture does not have a monopoly on shocking things said.

Well, what particular branch of the Reform tradition are you in?

I assume, since you were once on the faculty at the Reform Presbyterian Theological

Seminary in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, I'm assuming you're Presbyterian.

I don't know if you're a Covenanter, but tell us where you are as far as your branch of the Reformation

today.

Sure.

In 2006, I was ordained as a teaching elder within the Reform Presbyterian Church of North America, and as you

mentioned, I began to teach adjunct at our denominational seminary, from which I

graduated in 2006 as well, and did that for a number of years, and

did that until I began to serve at my current place of employment, which is the Denominations College

at Geneva College.

So that's my background since 2006.

Now, how did you realize after becoming a Christian that God was

placing a call upon your life to enter into the ministry and also to enter into the realm of academia?

Sure.

Well, in college, due to a degree in professional

writing, and I always loved to write, my dad was a writer, and more

of that particular pursuit took on a technical writing aspect, you know, writing manuals for

understanding my life.

You know, I was interested more in the creative side, and they didn't have something particularly conducive to it, and

every student at my undergrad got a minor in Bible, but I had double -majored in Bible, and I remember one

particular summer before my sophomore year thinking, you know what, I'm just going to go for it, and I'm going to

focus in on Bible, I'll pick up a philosophy minor, and I got to work with a wonderful pastor who was

faculty as well and just mentored me along, and told me in his office one day that in terms of pastoral ministry,

I'm barking up the right tree.

You know, I love interacting with people on the basis of Scripture, I love serving them

in the name of Christ and just diving deep into the Word of God and

speaking, which pastors tend to have to do, being galvanizing

and hearing it even as you're preaching it, sitting under it even as you're preaching it.

And the Lord really blessed that, not only the sense of internal call, but as I was

developing more Reformed convictions, we landed in an RPCNA church, my wife and I,

in the late 90s, early 2000s, and a number of the elders there recognized

what they thought was the Lord's work in me, and I did what was called being taken under care of presbytery, where you're

mentored by elders and put on a

trajectory.

Now, can you tell us a little bit about Geneva College, where you serve on the faculty?

Sure, yeah, Geneva College is right here in Western PA, it's a liberal arts college, and

one of the features that I love most about Geneva is that it is an open

meeting that we do not require

from any faith or no particular faith at all, which just makes it a

wonderful mission field where the missional nature of the place is obvious, and we wear

it on our sleeve, you know, as opposed to having to perhaps dig beneath the surface a little bit to find the same dynamics

in colleges, which, so that's one

of my favorite parts about it.

The website is.

Geneva .edu, geneva .edu.

Now, let's begin our discussion on this book that you have written, God Breathed,

Connecting Through Scripture to God, Others, the Natural World, and Yourself.

In fact, since I have a very dear friend, a longtime dear friend, who is a New Testament Greek scholar, Dr.

James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, one of the few Greek terms that I can remember

since he's mentioned it so often is theanoustos, which means God breathed.

Tell us exactly what that means.

And I know that most often we who are Christians, especially perhaps evangelicals,

we will speak about the divine inspiration of the scripture, but in

actuality, the scripture is expired.

We don't use that term because, yeah, we don't use that term because it connotates death in our minds.

So we don't use that expired, but it is breathed out, it is not.

Breathed in.

That's right, that's right.

Yeah, Paul in 2 Timothy 3 .16 makes this really stunning claim about scripture.

He says, all scriptures, as he says, theanoustos, it's breathed out by God, and then he goes on to enumerate

the particular uses of scripture.

And it's just such a stunning claim that he makes.

You know, obviously he has in mind the Old Testament scriptures, which were then extant, but is making a

statement as to anything that would count as scripture.

It is God breathed, it is breathed out by God.

It's, Lord Jesus says,

by bread alone, but by some, the mouth of God.

And in fact, it was a lecture James White was involved in

where it really struck me, and I'm sorry, I don't remember the reference, but he pointed out that Jesus would

refer to the written word

dynamic of bread by God.

The written word is out to us

right now, and

Paul is

a protege, a reminder.

And when I read this entire

quote, or this entire title,.

I should say, God breathed, connecting through scripture to God, others, the natural world,

and yourself.

I am reminded of a phrase, I think I first heard it years ago from Dr. Joel Beakey,

president of Puritan Reform Theological Seminary, but the term that I heard years ago is

experimental or experiential Calvinism.

Does that have something to do with what you're,.

Why you titled your book this way?

Sure, though I'd never thought of it in those terms.

I think the heart of what Dr. Beakey is communicating is very much there, and hearkens back to what I mentioned

earlier about Calvin's own life in terms of his refusal to sit idle and pontificate, but

rather actually get into the trenches of hands -on gospel ministry.

And the idea, as Dr. Beakey has recently written on it as well, is,

you know, these are not dry academic theories.

I think true theology is not theoretical

and practical.

And that's one of the things I love about scripture the most, and one of the things that really prompted me into the writing of this

particular book, is that scripture has a built -in epistemology.

You don't really know unless you do.

You don't really understand the Word of God.

You're not reacting.

It manifests itself in your life in

discernible ways that look increasingly like God's law.

And I love that, and it's such a,

and by that I don't just mean the young adults, it has a

common characteristic and maybe not a

common

chronology.

And ivory tower that

Jesus summarizes as loving God with all that we are,.

And loving our neighbors as ourselves.

Now you quoted a big fancy ivory tower word there,

epistemology.

That would be why we believe what we believe, would that be correct, a way of defining.

That?

It gets into that as it explores issues of faith.

Most basically it's the study of knowledge, it's how we know what we know, what we mean to know.

Yeah, it's like you said, it's an ivory tower word that you can put in front of people and they might think you're smart.

Well we are going to our very first break right now.

If anybody would like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com, c -h -r -i -s -a

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And don't go away, God willing, we're going to be right back after these messages with more of Rhett Etheridge

and our discussion on the new book that.

Is soon to be in print, God Breathe.

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We are now back with our guest today, Rutledge E. Etheridge III, Associate, or should I say Assistant

Professor of Biblical Studies at Geneva College.

We are discussing a book that is soon to be in print, written by our guest, God Breathed, Connecting Through

Scripture to God, Others, the Natural World, and Yourself.

And Rut, I was interestingly and providentially having a conversation with my

friend Buzz Taylor today, Buzz Taylor, who many of our listeners of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio will recognize that name

because he, for quite a while, was my co -host.

And he has been spending a lot of his time lately writing his own book on eschatology, so

he had to take a hiatus from being our co -host, and he may be back in the near

future.

But we were having a discussion on true and false revival, and Buzz was

reminding me that from his study of revivals, both true and false,

he said that the false revivals were not coming about through

a connection to the scripture.

They were coming from one's personal emotions and through experience,

primarily.

And would you say that that is a valid statement that Buzz made, that from his understanding of history,

the false revivals really have little to do with the God -breathed words contained in the

inerrant.

Scriptures?

Sure.

You know, I'm no scholar on revivalism, but that, of course, is always the tendency of the human heart, and

sometimes it comes garbed in the name of Christian faith that we look

to when we try to, as it were, baptize that

subject, and we end up not as he

intended it, but as we want it to be.

And that whole lot of what feels like very

sincere, emotively satisfying faith experiences,

and yet hard to any

actual...

Amen.

Now, another thing that seems to.

Remove scripture from the scenario is a lot of

mysticism that goes on today, even within evangelicalism, where people want to

connect with God by emptying their minds, but by seemingly

waiting for some kind of a supernatural experience that may involve the reciting of

mantras and things like that, even if they sound like very wonderful mantras that include the name of

Jesus.

But it is not to do with filling the mind with scripture to connect with God, it is in their

minds, emptying their minds to connect with God.

This is a very dangerous trend, isn't it?

Yeah, you know, for all kinds of reasons and in all kinds of ways, the idea that the Bible is actually the breathed -out

Word of God, and that through it and through prayer, we can have meaningful

encounters with the...

It's fallen on very hard times, and, you know, with the rise of neo -paganism

and other trends in culture, you can see a very deep,

and yet we are

any truth that is higher than yourself.

And within Christianity, even allegedly Bible -affirming

Christianity, we can very quickly

gauge how

quickly, you know, would our lives be

that radically all persecuted?

Brethren, throughout the world, we no longer have direct and immediate access to

our daily experience all that significantly.

I tried to explore in my book is, what are

the unbelievers

in this idea that the Bible claims to be from.

Cover to cover?

Well, we have a question from a listener that relates exactly to what you're saying.

And I rarely give full names of listeners, but I'm making an exception

this time because he has been a guest and co -host on Iron Trip and Zion Radio.

I'm referring to Charlie Liebert, who is an author and he is the founder of

6daycreation .com.

He's a former colleague with Ken Ham, now operating as an

independent apologist and author and itinerant teacher and evangelist.

Charlie Liebert asks, what is the most convincing argument for the inspiration of the Bible?

Wow, what a profound question.

It begs other questions in terms of what does it mean to be convinced?

You know, what is our criterion for being convinced?

But, you know, this is going to sound to some like circular reasoning, although all thought

plays some kind of presupposed predicate.

But as you look to this compelling

Jesus about the scriptures, and again, some would say, well, you're going to the Bible,

the Bible came into this world,

and when you see Jesus' intro, when you read,

you know, his heart's agony and his heart's triumphs, always framed in biblical terms, when

he speaks to his father, even on the cross, from the Psalms,

in several different places.

So the Lord Jesus in his own particular,

I think is just utterly compelling, especially for anyone who

has...

By the way, Charlie, you have won a free copy of the book that we are addressing.

You're going to have to be patient because it's not in print yet, but God -Breathed Connecting Through

Scripture to God, Others, the Natural World, and Yourself.

That will be yours as soon as we have them in our hands, so make sure that you provide for us your

mailing address again so that we can have that shipped out to you by our friends at cvbbs .com, Cumberland Valley Bible

Book Service, cvbbs .com, who sponsor this program and ship out all

of the books and Bibles and other things that our listeners win when they submit questions to our

guests.

Thanks a lot, Charlie, for the excellent question.

It actually reminds me, when you were talking about circular reasoning, I had a humorous conversation

years ago.

It wasn't intended to be humorous, and it might not have been very humorous at the time, but when I reflect upon

it, it strikes me still as being very

humorous.

A friend of mine who was actually in a band for many years

with my brother, one of my oldest brothers, Andrew, he was at one time

a fire -breathing, King James -only fundamentalist.

In fact, he was a disciple of Peter Ruckman, the late Peter Ruckman in

Pensacola, Florida, and he became an atheist.

He was having this discussion with me with a pastor friend of mine sitting

passively next to me, and this gentleman was

getting frustrated that I had an answer for everything he had to throw at me regarding atheism

and why I should reject Christianity.

He kept saying, you're basing your whole life on a book, and he kept repeating that.

Eventually, I asked him, so what convinced you of atheism?

He said, oh, I read so many books.

I said, oh, so you're faulting me for basing my eternal life on a book,

and yet you're basing your eternal life on many books that probably will be long

forgotten within a few years, whereas the book that I am basing my life

on is, I am totally convinced, God -breathed and is supernatural

and is inerrant and has stood the test of time for millennia.

It's a question of authority, isn't it?

Each of us has an unchallenged, or at least often unchallenged, authority

somewhere way deep in the bottom of our beliefs that perhaps empirically

unverifiable.

It's in the way

there's some authority, whether it's

looking in the mirror, whether it's a book, that particular

in our lives that drives our ethics and that

therefore drives what we consider to be a credible life phenomena or

just circumstances in our own lives.

So that's a telling answer you heard.

It really is.

Yeah, and I think that we Christians should never.

Forget when we are locked in a discussion, a dispute, an argument with those that

hate Christianity and hate the Bible and mock it and so on.

We have to remember, I think this is a key area where our reformed faith

comes into play.

It is not up to us to convince people of the truth, it is only up to us,

it is commanded of us to declare the truth.

And God is the one who brings the increase.

We can only plant and water seeds.

And don't you think that we always have to remember when we get frustrated and depressed and angry

about our failures, it seems, when trying to convince others of the truth of the Bible or even

of the reliability and the the inspiration of the scriptures,

that this is a book that is God -breathed and is

miraculous in nature when it takes hold in a person's heart and mind.

There is something supernatural, profoundly supernatural and miraculous,

when the spiritually dead are raised to newness of life and go from mocking or

ignoring the Bible to embracing it and loving it and believing it.

There has to be a work of the Holy Spirit involved in this, because you could even have an

academic scholar, historian, who is a

mainline liberal Protestant perhaps, or liberal Catholic, or whoever the person may be,

who has memorized great volumes of scripture by heart, and yet is as

dead and as lost as loss can be.

They may know the words, but that miracle hasn't.

Happened in their heart.

Yeah, you know, I think one of

the, it's not afraid of inquiry, you know, it's not afraid to

be scrutinized, it's not afraid to be interrogated.

And, you know, one of the Church Fathers famously said, when

someone asked him, you know, how do you defend scripture?

And he replied, I just as soon defend a lion.

You know, it doesn't need to be defended, it's its own work.

And so one of the things that I think is radically post -Christian

culture is to really invite the inquiry, you know, not the autonomous

inquiry that, you know, refuses from the outset to even think that a speaking God is

possible, because that inquiry is no inquiry, there's no honesty there.

It begins by assuming that which is true, and it never

gets to any honest investigation of its own beliefs.

But, you know, to be able to say, like the Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 15, you know, there are those in his day

who are Jesus.

He says, you know, around 500 or so, you know,

if you're a prosecuting attorney and you're able to march in five eyewitnesses, it's amazing.

You know, if you can march in the better part of 500, it's

jitter.

You know, those are not going

to, in themselves,

hand -produce faith and

charity, but not in and

of itself going to do it.

Jesus said, even if someone is going to rise from the dead, you know, this generation's not going to believe.

And yet it's

not some kind

of Gnosticality kinds

of invites that kind of inquiry and that kind of honest conversation.

We're going to go to our midway break, but before.

We go to our midway break, I want to ask of you a question submitted by one of our listeners, and then you can

answer it when we come back.

Sure.

We have B .B. in Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, who asked something that your guest said made me think that

he is probably a presuppositionalist.

Is that true?

We'll have you answer that when we come back.

This is a longer than normal break, as always, that we have every day in Iron Trip and

Zion Radio because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida, airs our program

every day, twice a day, in a pre -recorded format, and they have to localize this show to Lake City,

Florida, according to FCC regulations.

So they air their own public service announcements and commercials in the middle of our show, while we air our

own commercials that are heard globally.

So during this longer break than normal, we ask of you to use this time

wisely.

We ask of you to write down the information provided by our advertisers so that you can more successfully

patronize them because the more our advertisers hear from you, the more

that you patronize them and use their services, or buy their products, or attend their worship services, or

whatever the case may be, the more likely we are going to remain on the air because when

our advertisers see results, they are more than likely going to stick around.

So please remember that.

Don't just bypass these advertisements and ignore them.

Please write down the information provided by them so that you can help us remain on the air for a longer

period of time.

In addition to that, use this time wisely by writing in your own questions to our guest today,

Ruth Etheridge, and that is on the theme, God Breathed, Connecting Through Scripture to God,

Others, the Natural World, and Yourself.

So send in those emails to chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Don't go away.

We're going to be back after these messages with more of Ruth Etheridge and God Breathed.

Chris Arnson, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, announcing a new website with an exciting offer from World

Magazine, my trusted source for news from a Christian perspective.

Try World Now at no charge for 90 days by going to getworldnow

.com.

That's getworldnow .com.

I rely on World because I trust the reporting.

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I believe you'll also find World to be an invaluable resource to better understand critical topics with a

depth that's simply not found in other media outlets.

Armed with this coverage, World can help you to be a voice of wisdom in your family and your community.

This trial includes bi -weekly issues of World Magazine, on -scene reporting from World Radio, and the fully

shareable content of World Digital.

There's no obligation and no credit card required.

Visit getworldnow .com today.

Also check out World News Group's podcast, The World and Everything in It, at

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That's W for World, N for News,.

G for Group, dot org forward slash podcast.

Got to tell you, for my money, Chris Arnson's radio program is just the best.

Iron.

Criticizing.

Iron.

I think that's what it's called.

This is Todd Friel of Wretched Radio and TV with Phil Johnson of Grace to You, inviting everybody

to come to the G3 conference, which has almost instantly become one of the best conferences in the country.

And it is.

It's a great conference.

I love it.

And Chris Arnson was there last year.

He's been there, I think, every year.

It's great to see him there.

You and I actually did some recordings in the lobby at that place.

So tons of stuff going on, tons of great speakers.

And no matter where you are in the building, you will hear Chris Arnson's laugh.

And that's worth the price of admission alone.

If you would like to join Phil, me, Chris and a cavalcade of great preachers.

So it should be a cavalcade of great preachers and me.

G3conference .com.

G3conference .com.

And now there's even more exciting news.

John MacArthur himself is now also on the lineup at the G3 conference Thursday,

January 16th through Saturday, January 18th, 2020.

Go to G3conference .com.

G3conference .com.

See you there.

Chris Arnson, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio here.

I want to tell you about a man I have personally known for many years.

His name is Dan Buttafuoco.

Dan is a personal injury and medical malpractice lawyer, but not the type that typically comes to mind.

Dan cares about people and is a theologian himself.

Recently, he wrote a book titled Consider the Evidence for the Bible.

Ravi Zacharias wrote the foreword.

Dan also has a master's degree in theology.

Dan handles serious injury and medical malpractice cases in all 50 states.

He represents many Christians in serious injury matters all over the country.

Dan is an exceptional trial lawyer.

He wrote the test for the National Board of Trial Advocacy, and currently his firm has over 100

cases that have settled for $1 million or more, and in approximately 10

different states.

In Illinois, his lawyers had the fourth largest settlement in the state's history.

In New York, his case involving a paralyzed police officer made the front page of the Law Journal.

If you have a serious personal injury or medical malpractice claim in any state, I recommend that you

call Dan.

Consultations are free.

There is no fee unless you win.

Dan Buttafuoco's number is 1 -800 -669 -4878.

1 -800 -669 -4878.

Or email me for Dan's contact information at chrisarnson at gmail dot

com.

That's chrisarnson at gmail dot com.

Now you can find the newest styles in Reformed and Protestant apparel at CitizenPriest .com.

CitizenPriest .com specializes in Christian -themed t -shirts and clothing especially for

Reformed Christians.

CitizenPriest .com's merchandise is purposefully scripture -based and meant for the edification of

the saints and the furtherance of the gospel.

Let everyone know that you stand firm on the doctrines of the Reformed faith by wearing apparel from

CitizenPriest .com.

Visit CitizenPriest .com today.

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here.

If you've watched.

My Dividing Line webcast often enough, you know I have a great love for getting Bibles and other documents vital

to my ministry rebound to preserve and ensure their longevity.

And besides that, they feel so good.

I'm so delighted I discovered Post -Tenebrous Lux Bible Rebinding.

No radio ad will be long enough to sing their praises sufficiently, but I'll give it a shot.

Jeffrey Rice of Post -Tenebrous Lux is a remarkably gifted craftsman and artisan.

All his work is done by hand from the cutting to the pleating of corners to the perimeter stitching.

Jeffrey uses the finest and buttery soft imported leathers in a wide variety of gorgeous colors like

the turquoise goatskin tanned in Italy used for my Nestle All -in -28 edition with a navy

blue goatskin inside liner and the electric blue goatskin from a French tannery used to rebind a

Reformation Study Bible I used as a gift.

The silver gilding he added on the page edges has a stunning mirror finish resembling highly polished

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Jeffrey will customize your rebinding to your specifications and even emboss your logo into the leather,

making whatever he rebinds a one -of -a -kind work of art.

For more details on Post -Tenebrous Lux Bible Rebinding, go to

ptlbiblerebinding .com.

That's ptlbiblerebinding .com.

Hi, this is John Sampson, pastor of King's Church in Peoria, Arizona, taking a moment of your day

to talk about Chris Arnson and the Iron Sharpens Iron podcast.

I consider Chris a true friend and a man of high integrity.

He's a skilled interviewer who's not afraid to ask the big penetrating questions, while always defending the key

doctrines of the Christian faith.

I've always been happy to point people to this podcast, knowing it's one of the very few safe places on the internet

where folk won't be led astray.

I believe this podcast needs to be heard far and wide.

This is a day of great spiritual compromise, and yet God has raised Chris up for just such a time,

and knowing this, it's up to us as members of the body of Christ to stand with such a ministry in prayer

and in finances.

I'm pleased to do so, and would like to ask you to prayerfully consider joining me in supporting Iron

Sharpens Iron financially.

Would you consider sending either a one -time gift or even becoming a regular monthly partner with this ministry?

I know it would be a huge encouragement to Chris if you would.

All the details can be found at ironsharpensironradio .com, where you can click support.

That's ironsharpensironradio .com.

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio depends upon the financial support of fine Christian organizations to remain on the

air, like the Historical Bible Society.

The Historical Bible Society maintains a collection of Christian books, manuscripts, and Bibles of

historical significance spanning nearly a thousand years.

The mission of HBS is the preservation and public display of ancient scripture, dissemination of

scripture, to provide tools equipping believers in Christian apologetics with evidence for the Bible's

reliability, and to introduce Reformation literature and Christian art to a broader audience.

Since 2004, HBS has toured schools and churches throughout the northeast United States,

reaching thousands of believers and non -believers alike who are hungry for knowledge of the Bible.

HBS's founder, Daniel P. Buttafuoco, attorney at law, is committed to sharing this

along with an inspirational historical message that will captivate you and your church.

Come journey through their website, historicalbiblesociety .org.

The collection includes a complete 11th century Bible, an actual page of the Gutenberg Bible from

1455, the first book ever printed, the Geneva Bible, the 1611

King James Bible, and much, much more.

Visit historicalbiblesociety .org today.

Thank you, Daniel P. Buttafuoco, attorney at law, for your faithful support of Iron Sharpen's.

Iron Radio.

Hi, I'm Buzz Taylor, frequent co -host with Chris Arnzen on Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio.

I would like to introduce you to my good friends Todd and Patty Jennings at CVBBS, which stands for Cumberland Valley

Bible Book Service.

Todd and Patty specialize in supplying Reformed and Puritan books and Bibles at discount prices that make them

affordable to everyone.

Since 1987, the family -owned and operated book service has sought to bring you the best available Christian books

and Bibles at the best possible prices.

Unlike other book sites, they make no effort to provide every book that is available because, frankly, much of what

is being printed is not worth your time.

That means you can get to the good stuff faster.

It also means that you don't have to worry about being assaulted by the pornographic, heretical, and

otherwise faith insulting material promoted by the secular book vendors.

Their website is cvbbs .com.

Browse the pages at ease, shop at your leisure, and purchase with confidence as Todd and Patty work

in service to you, the Church, and to Christ.

That's Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service at cvbbs .com.

That's cvbbs .com.

Let Todd and Patty know that you heard about them on Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio.

And you can also call cvbbs .com at their toll -free

number 800 -656 -0231, 800 -656 -0231, Monday through Friday

between 10 a .m. and 4 30 p .m. Eastern Time.

Try not to call outside of those hours because you're not going to get a voicemail or anyone manning that phone line

outside of those hours.

That's Monday through Friday, 10 a .m. to 4 30 p .m. Eastern

Time, 800 -656 -0231, 800 -656 -0231.

When you purchase anything from cvbbs .com, no matter

how inexpensive, you will get for free, if you ask for it, the book True Love, Understanding the Real

Meaning of Christian Love by Dr. James M. Renahan, president of IRBS Theological

Seminary in Mansfield, Texas, one of our sponsors on Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio.

And by the way, their website at the IRBS Theological Seminary in Mansfield, Texas, is

irbsseminary .org.

IRBSseminary .org.

Remember the two S's back -to -back in the middle.

IRBSseminary .org.

But you will get this free book, True Love, Understanding the Real Meaning of Christian Love by Dr. Renahan,

simply by putting that in the comment section at cvbbs .com when you place any order, no matter how

inexpensive.

This is a beautiful little hardback published by Evangelical Press.

Now, you will also get another book, which is much larger, another beautiful

hardback, a gorgeous cover from Evangelical Press, a book by my friend John

Thornberry, which is actually my favorite of all Christian biographies, my favorite of

all biographies, period.

This is A Pastor in New York, The Life and Time of Spencer Cohn.

This is a remarkable biography that, before I was even halfway through it, I

was saying in my mind, somebody has got to make this into a major motion picture, at the

very least a documentary, because of the fascinating life of Spencer Cohn.

He was a 19th century particular Baptist pastor in Manhattan, First Baptist Church of New

York City, which still stands.

In fact, I had a Bible conference in 2018 at the First Baptist Church

of New York City that my friend Dr. Tony Costa, professor of apologetics and Islam at Toronto

Baptist Seminary, conducted there.

But he is just such a remarkable person, Spencer Cohn.

He was a school teacher, a lawyer, a theater actor in the 19th century, a stage actor.

He was a war hero in the War of 1812.

He was, as I said, a pastor in Manhattan, facing all kinds of theological

controversies surrounding him being a particular Baptist pastor.

Today they are more commonly known as Reformed Baptists, although one of my sponsors still uses that

title.

Sovereign Grace Particular Baptist Church in Texas.

But if you want to get a hold of this book, which is my favorite of all biographies, you have to purchase at

least $50 worth of merchandise from cvbbs .com.

You have to add this book into your cart.

A Pastor in New York, The Life and Time of Spencer Cohn by John Thornberry.

You have to add it into the cart, and then when you include an additional $50 worth of merchandise,

if you enter the coupon code IRONTRUPPENZIRON, all capitals, all one word, the price of a Pastor in New

York will be subtracted from your total.

And you'll also get, if you ask for it, True Love by James M. Renahan, the

previously mentioned book, both by Evangelical Press.

If you want to make your life a lot easier, getting these free books, jot down their toll -free number and just

tell them this verbally, 800 -656 -0231, 800 -656 -0231, and

tell them that you want both of those books, True Love by James M. Renahan and A Pastor in New York, The Life and Time of

Spencer Cohn by John Thornberry.

If you purchase at least $50, you'll get both of them, and you'll get the book True Love for any purchase.

And always, you have to remember to tell them that you heard about them from Chris Arnzen on IRONTRUPPENZIRON radio.

I have a couple of more announcements to make regarding special events that I hope that you all attend.

First of all, we've got an event featuring the aforementioned Tony Costa, a very dear friend of

mine, Professor of Apologetics and Islam at Toronto Baptist Seminary.

He is going to be speaking at a conference coming up August 2nd through the 5th,

that's Friday through Thursday in 2019, of

course.

And that's August 2nd through the 5th at the Church at Friendship in Hockley,

Texas.

Dr. Costa is going to be the keynote speaker at this conference that we hope that you attend.

And if you want more information about that, you're going to have to email me at

chrisarnzen at gmail .com, chrisarnzen at gmail .com, because I just had all of the

information in front of me and it vanished.

So I'll be updating you next week with the details on that, but if you want them

immediately, email me at chrisarnzen at gmail .com, chrisarnzen at gmail .com.

That's the conference featuring Dr. Tony Costa of Toronto Baptist Seminary in Hockley, Texas,

coming up August 2nd through the 5th.

Then after that, in December, Thursday and Friday, December 19th and

20th, I am packing up my bags and heading back to my old stomping grounds in New York City to attend the

Foundations Conference, a conference of sermonaudio .com.

The Foundations Conference has become one of my favorite conferences to attend, and what better time of year to go to

Manhattan than Christmas season?

I can't think of any place I'd rather be during the Christmas season than New York City.

And this conference includes a phenomenal lineup, as it always does.

Dr. Stephen J. Lawson of One Passion Ministries is on the roster.

Paul Washer is on the roster.

Reverend Jeff Thomas is on the roster.

Armin Tomasian, who is going to be, in my opinion, in my strongly held opinion, a household name over

the next decade amongst Reformed Christians.

He is that powerful, that gifted, a remarkable young man with talents and abilities

far beyond his youth, a really remarkable preacher.

Richard Colwell Jr. and Andrew Quigley are also on the lineup, but I have never heard them yet.

But since sermonaudio selected them, they must be remarkable.

So if you want to attend with me this Christmas season, December 19th and 20th, that's Thursday and Friday, December 19th and 20th in

New York City, if you want to attend with me, go to thefoundationsconference .com, thefoundationsconference

.com.

Then in January, I'm packing up my bags again and heading down south to Atlanta,

Georgia, more specifically to College Park, Georgia, to the Georgia International Convention Center.

And I am going to be, once again, manning my exhibitors booth for Iron Trip and Zion Radio at the G3

Conference.

The G3 Conference stands for Gospel, Grace, and Glory, and they always have an absolutely

extraordinary lineup of speakers.

You've been hearing the ads I've been running, I'm sure, with Todd Friel and Phil Johnson

promoting this conference.

They are on the roster of this conference, but also the exciting news is that John

MacArthur himself has also been recently included on the roster.

Other speakers are Kosti Hinn, who is a Reformed Baptist pastor in California and a

cessationist, and he is, believe it or not, the nephew of the notorious charlatan and

heretic Benny Hinn.

And Kosti Hinn doesn't mind me saying that because a major part of the mission that he has in life is to expose his

own uncle and all within the Word of Faith movement for the dangerous, deadly, and

damning heretics that they are.

And he is on the lineup.

Daryl Bernard Harrison, a new member of the Grace to You

ministry team at the Ministry of John MacArthur.

David Miller, who's a phenomenal preacher.

Derek Thomas, who I'm sure most of the Reformed listeners in the Iron Trip and Zion

audience are very familiar with the name Derek Thomas.

My friend that we've been mentioning during the show, Dr. James R. White of Alpha and Omega Ministries.

Jeremy Volo, who was a professional soccer player with the San Antonio Scorpions.

He is now a Reformed Baptist pastor in Laredo, Texas, and a good friend of mine.

He's also married to one of the Duggars, by the way, one of the Duggar girls.

Joel Beeke, one of my oldest friends from my Christian days,

going back to the 1990s.

He is president of Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary in Grand Rapids, Michigan.

We have Paul Washer and Dr. Stephen J. Lawson are also on the lineup at this conference.

Todd Friel, as I mentioned before.

Dr. Tom Askell, the executive director of Founders Ministries, the Calvinistic ministry within the Southern Baptist

Convention, and also a very old friend of mine.

Voti Baucom, one of the finest preachers alive today, and more.

If you want to register for the G3 Conference, go to g3conference .com, g3conference .com.

And because of the fact that they draw an audience of over 5 ,000 a year,

I would strongly urge you, if you have a business, a parachurch ministry, a special event, or

something else that you want to promote to the body of Christ, this is an excellent opportunity to man an exhibitors

booth at a conference where there is an enormous crowd.

And I think that even though they've been getting over 5 ,000 people there every year, now that they have

Dr. John MacArthur added to the lineup, I think they're going to have over 6 ,000 people there.

I am very confident of that.

And I will be manning my exhibitors booth.

I hope that you have one near me.

Go to g3conference .com, g3conference .com, not only to register to attend, but also for an exhibitors booth,

if that applies to you.

Remember to always tell all of our advertisers that you heard about their conferences, or their

products, or their services, from Chris Arnzen on Iron Trap and Zion Radio.

Last but not least, if you love Iron Trap and Zion Radio, you don't want us to disappear from the

airwaves, you love sharing the free downloadable mp3s with your family, friends, and loved ones, you

love the topics and the guests that we have on this program that many times

have never heard anywhere else.

And please, if you don't want us to go away, go to irontrapandzionradio .com, click

support, then click, click to donate now.

I am in urgent need of your donations, possibly more than ever.

We have, I just found out, a $600 internet bill

for our live streaming of this program that needs to be paid by July 20th, or we're

not going to have a program, at least until we have that bill paid.

So, remember that we rely upon the live streaming for this show to exist.

So, if anybody out there has $600 that they can generously donate to us, we won't have to worry about that bill.

Anything else that you can donate, I think a lot of people are embarrassed because they can only afford to give a little bit

of money.

But please don't be embarrassed because if everybody who listens to this show donated to us, we would

never have a problem and I would never have to ask you for money because we have, on average, 35 ,000

people minimum downloading the mp3s every month of this show.

And obviously, only a tiny fraction of those people donate.

So, please become one of them and go to irontripandzionradio .com, click support, then click, click

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You can donate instantly with a debit or credit card.

You can also mail in a check made out to Iron Trip and Zion Radio to the address that appears on the screen if

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An address will automatically appear on the screen when you click support at irontripandzionradio .com.

The caveats that I always try to remind you of is I never want anybody siphoning money away

from their regular giving to their local church where they are a member in order to give to Iron Trip and Zion Radio.

Please don't do that.

Please don't put your family in financial jeopardy by giving to Iron Trip and Zion Radio.

Those two things are commands of scripture providing for your church and your home.

Providing for Iron Trip and Zion Radio is obviously not a command of scripture, but if you are financially blessed

above and beyond your ability to obey those two commands, you have extra money for benevolent purposes.

You have extra money even for recreational purposes.

If that, I have no problem you siphoning money out of your recreational purposes or funds

to give to Iron Trip and Zion Radio, then please do that if you don't want us to go away.

Obviously, if you don't like this show or hardly ever listen to it, that is immaterial to you, but if you love the show and you don't want us

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And that email address chrisarnson at gmail .com is also where you could send in a question for

our guest today.

By the way, if you are not a member of a local bible -believing church and you are not prayerfully looking

for one, you're living in rebellion against God, please rectify that situation.

I have lists of biblically faithful churches all over the world and I've helped many people in our audience find churches near

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need a church or something like that in the subject line.

That's chrisarnson at gmail .com and send in your questions for our guest today so that we can

have him answer those questions if he can.

That is Rutledge E. Etheridge III, Assistant Professor of Biblical Studies at Geneva College.

We are discussing his book, God Breathed, Connecting Through Scripture to God, Others, the Natural World, and

Yourself.

It's chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

And you may remember, Rut, that before the break we had B .B. in Cumberland County, Pennsylvania ask,

is your guest a presuppositionalist?

Maybe if you want to give us a brief definition of what that is and compare it to an evidentialist.

And I was actually thinking in the previous hour when I said something that

that's probably going to send off a signal.

Discussed as an approach to apologetics tries to

identify, and if it's a non -Christian idea, confront what the name suggests, the

presupposition, the assumptions that are behind whatever particular belief

is being interacted with.

Evidentially is one that would rely more heavily upon the

necessity of the Christian, perhaps making arguments

based upon scientific data and location of biblical truth

in studies of creation.

It's an oversimplification, but it's a fair enough assessment.

And I do appreciate quite a bit.

I don't want to necessarily put myself exclusively in one particular camp, you know.

As we were talking last hour, I think it's good to to delve into and draw the

benefit in so far as how we understand Scripture.

And I think the same is true with different camps of theological endeavor, like apologetics.

One thing I really do appreciate, at least as I've understood, is

in our culture, really the gloves are coming off in terms of

what people believe, and an increasingly open hostility toward Bible -believing Christianity.

It gets us

conversations along those lines ultimately go, and ultimately is

there, you know,.

In this particular approach.

Amen.

And one of the things I think that it does as well is it helps to prevent those we

are speaking with to drag us into rabbit trails.

A lot of times enemies of the Bible and of Christianity will purposely,

when they see they're getting backed into a corner on something, they will immediately bring you on a rabbit

trail to purposely avoid answering the questions that you had that they couldn't answer, and try to

stump you by just bringing up things that in many circumstances no human

can answer.

Things that the Bible is ignorant, not ignorant, silent, I should say.

The Bible isn't ignorant on anything.

The things that the Bible are silent on.

Yes.

So it is helpful in that way, but I can say that

although I think evidentialists are in a minority amongst Reformed

Christians, at least today, a couple of my greatest heroes of the Christian faith who are now

in eternity with Christ were evidentialists, and that would be R .C. Sproul and also Dr. John Gerstner.

Gerstner, absolutely.

Both of them were evidentialists, and actually at least at one point were strongly opposed to

presuppositionalism, although I think that they've changed their mind now, since they're in

eternity with Christ.

But anyway, I think that we do ourselves and the body of Christ a disservice when we

get hot -headed over these kinds of things.

Right.

Intramural debates.

And I'm glad you mentioned that, and I'll do a little bit of a plug for Geneva College.

We were recently blessed with the John Gerstner Library.

The family bequested to us a number of wonderful resources, Dr. Gerstner,

and so we had a ceremony officially receiving those gifts just before our

commencement in early May.

And so I think it's a situation, ideally, in which

one approach complements another, and both are seeking to be biblically faithful, and I couldn't agree with you more

that arguing amongst ourselves hot -headedly about method,

the intent of the Word of God faithfully to bear on whatever particular issue were

happening.

Now, is one of the aspects of connecting through Scripture to God,

is one of the aspects in your book, as I haven't read it yet, it's not in print yet, but is it that our

prayer life should be more scripturally informed?

I do deal with that, particularly in chapter 2, which I've entitled, The Bible Takes

God.

Seriously.

And it's not a polemic on worship practices by any

means, but it's calling all of us who profess the name of Jesus to really reckon

with whether we believe what we say.

And there's nothing new there, but I think in our day and age, as we mentioned toward the beginning of the First,

that we can end up having faith in our faith, or

thinking that we're worshiping the Lord Jesus, and what we need

to ask questions about is whether we're really informed

and fueled by Scripture.

Are my thoughts about God?

Are my songs about God?

Am I praying in the way that the Scriptures record

some of the...certainly including

bringing to God,

largely, I mean, it's meant for Christians as well.

You know, we live in a day and age in which we've been

accepted at our old

venue, and it's not accessible.

What do you do with a book that claims to be God's own?

Really explore sinful

nature that keeps us away from God's Word.

But even the way that we in the West

are trying to serve Christ, ironically, and yet who taught us that

we're worthy of praise than a God who speaks.

You know, when you said...when you made.

The statement, do we really believe what we say we believe?

I think you made that statement anyway.

I was immediately transported back in time to my early days of

Christianity.

I was at the Conference on Reform Theology at 10th Presbyterian Church,

and the aforementioned Dr. John Gerstner was speaking, and James Montgomery Boyce was sitting

behind him, and James Montgomery Boyce turned as white as a ghost.

He looked a bit fearful about what Dr. Gerstner was saying, but Dr. Gerstner was

comparing Calvinists and Arminians, and he was calling Calvinists Christians, and he was calling

Arminians, I think, lilac Christians.

He had developed an acronym to describe Arminians, and I think it was lilac.

But anyway, Dr. Gerstner said, you cannot be a lilac Christian,

actually believe what you say you believed, and be saved.

Let me repeat that.

You cannot be a lilac Christian, actually believe what you say you believe, and still be saved.

I think it struck fear in Dr. Boyce's mind and heart, because he knew that

a lot of Arminians listened to the Bible study hour, which was a globally heard radio program.

But I don't know if I would fully agree with that statement, but there is a lot of truth packed

into that idea that sometimes if you take your belief system to its logical

conclusion, many people outside of what we believe,

the doctrines of sovereign grace, really, even if they would never say it in words specifically,

they're taking too much credit for their salvation upon themselves.

And even I have had conversations with non -Reformed

Christians who, when I have explained to them that God

is sovereign over all things, that nothing happens apart from his sovereign decree,

they have said, even if they started the question by saying, oh, there's not really too much of a difference between Calvinism

and Arminianism.

I think that a lot of people make too big of a deal out of it.

By the end of the conversation, they're saying with intensity and veins popping out of their neck, if God is the way you

described him, I do not want any part of him, I do not want to worship him.

And I have said to them, you have to be very careful about saying things like that, because in my opinion, you've just blasphemed

God, and if you're wrong about what you've said, that's a very dangerous position to put yourself.

In.

Have I overstated this?

Well, you know, I think we want to be especially careful because, you know, again, when we take up the

mantras and the label camp or forget that

we're at least on a popular level, we're not really

dealing with what those people taught.

There's not a deep familiarity, typically, with what James Arminian saw

and consistently

held, and so we almost become

whose understanding of this thinker is better than their understanding of it, and it just circles around itself and

ends up getting anyone.

Shading faith is,

you know, and matures, and

one of the things that can happen, and it's inevitable, and

sometimes led astray by unbiblical ideas, you

know, so much of Scripture is written because of that very fact, and so I think we want to be careful

to hear people out and recognize that what they may be saying is the heat of

the moment, and to really sit down and calmly work

by that particular person or ourselves and measure it up against the

Word of God.

You know, I think one of the best examples of this is in J .I.

Evangelism and the Sovereignty of God, in which he takes what are typically held to be Arminian

presuppositions and demonstrates that no one practically

says, if we have ever prayed for God to save someone, then we've violated what's become known as Arminius'

teaching.

We get lost in the shuffle of a lot of those things, and it's helpful

with regard to that God

is God, and then we begin from there, and

from that essential takes us, and it's very

from that standpoint of humility that we can rightly receive and live out.

Yes, and in fact, I think that we have a listener that is making a good point.

We have Christopher in Suffolk County, Long Island, New York, who says, let us not forget

those who profess to be Calvinists who actually violate the biblical teachings

of their so -called heroes of the faith by going far beyond what those teachers ever

said or wrote.

Yes, of course, there are hypo -Calvinists who might even be more dangerous than hyper

-Arminians, who don't even believe in the necessity of evangelism, who

actually live out the caricature or stereotype that the Arminians have against us,

and that could be equally, if not more, dangerous to be a hyper -Calvinist.

But of course, we also always remember that many non -Calvinists call anybody who is a Calvinist a hyper

-Calvinist, just because we believe in the five points, or we believe in God's total sovereign

control over all things.

They are labeling us hyper,.

So we have to make those distinctions, don't we?

We do, and I think the best thing in the midst of all of that is for us to calm down and just to start looking at the scriptures

themselves and really work through some of the practical implications of the major

are mentioned, and also just the practical benefits.

You know, you mentioned that during the first hour with regard to the Atonement, and I

think it's good for us to acknowledge that we want to, when

we're what he

did, when he did, to whom he did.

You know, we know it's ultimately the Holy Spirit, and it's the Holy Spirit addressing particular...and

I think sometimes in these debates, we use the

wrong text, and so you end up proof -texting, and you end up

on rabbit trails that the scripture is never intended.

But the more faithfully we can dive into God's will and intent, as I think John Knox

put it, the Holy Spirit's mind in that particular

way.

But at least we're having a more honest and less personally insulting discussion,

even if those.

Were and shouldn't have.

By the way, I forgot to mention to many of the, or most of the

listeners who asked questions already, you have all won a free copy of the book, God Breathed,

connecting through scriptures to God, others, the natural world, and yourself.

You just have to remember to be patient to receive it, because it's not yet in print, but you will be on a list to receive it through

cvbbs .com, Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service, who will ship those books out to

you.

And we want to thank our friends at Crown Covenant Publishing, who donated those books, who published this

book.

Their website, just to let you know, is crownandcovenant .com, crownandcovenant .com, if you want to

find out more about books that they have brought into print.

I would ask that even though you may discover many more books published by Crown Covenant,

that you actually purchase them through cvbbs .com, since they are a sponsor of this show.

You'll actually be helping both entities, you'll be helping both Crown Covenant and cvbbs

.com at the same time, because of course, Crown Covenant still wins when you purchase their books anywhere,

because cvbbs .com has to order them from Crown Covenant.

We are going to our final break.

It's going to be much more brief than the last one, and if you have questions that you have in mind to ask, then

please send in those questions immediately, because they're rapidly running out of time.

It's chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

We do have a question I'll read to you, that you can answer when we return.

Okay.

We have Arnie in Perry County, Pennsylvania, who asks, when

you speak about connecting to the natural world through the scriptures, are you speaking

primarily about Romans 1?

So you could answer that when we come back.

And please send us those questions immediately, we're running out of time.

Chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

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Welcome back.

Let's see here.

Rut Etheridge, our listener in Perry County, Pennsylvania.

Arnie asked if your reference in your title to God

breathed, connecting through scripture to God, others, the natural world, specifically the

natural world, he was wondering if you were making a reference primarily to Romans 1 in that part of the title.

Well, obliquely.

It's certainly mentioned in the book.

The heart of the book is to minister in particular to

young adults and the established church, and one of

the things that I hope is helpful about the book is it's written in a conversational way so that any older Christians who want to engage

this generation can kind of listen in.

And symptomatic of this particular generation, not just young adults, is a deep sense

of loneliness.

You know, studies are showing how social media has revealed our loneliness.

So you combine that increase in

loneliness.

Our book has been called The Age of the Lonely Self, heralded by Philo.

Combine that with some positive trends, such as an increasing

desire

to love the world God made,

our known world burned.

Jesus is coming back soon anyway.

And so one of the things that I

want to talk about is the natural world.

There are laws in the Old Testament civic code which prevent animal cruelty

in the world that he created, connecting

to the natural world against Scripture as the means through which we, in a

day of detachment, find a deep and a very real

connectedness through whom all things were created.

So that's kind of the heart of the book.

You know, it's interesting.

I've never heard anybody say this, but I thought of it.

I don't want to, like, take credit for something profound or anything like that.

But when Nathan the Prophet brought to light that David was

the one whom Nathan was speaking about when he gave this little story about

a pet lamb that was murdered and cooked

by an evil man to serve a wealthy guest, it's interesting that although

David, it was certainly sinful and wicked of David to have a higher regard for an

animal than Uriah the Hittite whom he had murdered, at the same time though,

Nathan the Prophet knew that that story of the lamb would work upon the heart of David.

So it was really both the story that I think

where Nathan revealed the horrible mistreatment of a pet animal would actually be used to startle

David into realizing he was even more wicked than that man in the story that murdered and cooked, and

I use the word murdered because it was a pet, the animal.

But anyway, am I off base here?

I think that's.

A great insight because I think that's one of the compelling witnesses that Christianity can have to those

who, as we know, you know, environmentalism is a big thing, but you know, the Spirit of God walks with

and for the environment.

Creation is valued more than image.

We see in culture some encouraging image

-bearing trends and concerns which reflect the fact that each human being does in

fact bear the image of God, and where the Christian church can have such

a witness is to say, you know, faith in Christ and the scriptures

do not compete against those good concerns.

They renew and they fulfill them, and they keep us away from the kind of idolatry and the

kind of autonomy

that the demise of the world and the deep pains that every

one of us as fallen image -bearers are experiencing daily in that fallen world.

And we want to repeat your website.

It's ruttetheridge .com, ruttetheridge .com.

Thank you so much.

I look forward to having you back often as a guest, Rutt.

I want to thank everybody who listened, and especially those who took the time to write in questions.

I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior than you

are a sinner.

Have a very blessed, happy, and safe weekend and Lord's Day.

We'll look forward to hearing from you and your questions next week on Iron Trumpet's Iron Radio.