February 19, 2006

Webcasting around the world from the desert metropolis of Phoenix, Arizona. This is the dividing line. The Apostle Peter commanded Christians to be ready to give a defense for the hope that is within us.

Yet to give that answer with gentleness and reverence. Our host is dr. James white director of Alpha Omega ministries and an elder at the Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church. This is a live program and we invite your participation.

If you'd like to talk with dr. White call now. It's 602 9 7 3 4 6 0 2 or toll-free across the United States. It's 1 8 7 7 7 5 3 3 3 4 1. And now with today's topic here is James white.

Culture Cannot Define Truth

Really sir, are you to go to France and insist they speak English? Oh, listen, you need to speak my language. I Love French, but not the French. Not if you're gonna change the rules. The thing is. Culture cannot define truth.

So culture runs on feeling. It happens in our pulpits. God help us. Not your pulpit. I promise you not my pulpit. Not with dr. Falwell, but it happens. Pulpits used to be filled with people who would thunder.

Thus saith the Lord the Bible says. Now it seems to me. Um, I feel. What. What what time does the service end. Dr. Powell. What I know. What. No, no. Say again 10 30 10 30. All right. Let me ask you a question.

Why did you dress up? Some of us are in ties. I have to be. You do know Jerry Falwell, don't you? He was born with a tie. I saw him mowing his yard with a tie. Why? Why why why'd you get dressed up? Did you come to hear somebody's opinion?

I didn't I. Come to hear somebody expound the Word of God.

And if it hurts my feelings good that is dr. Ergon canner of Liberty University preaching on the 10th of December and I Listened to this this presentation. It was sent to me by a friend who I will not name so he doesn't have to deal with them any of dr. Cantor's fans, but I I Had never gotten a chance to listen to to dr. Cantor a preach on a non Calvinistic subject he did mention hyper Calvinist once been sending more about it, so and this was supposed to be a Christmas sermon and I Just gave you a taste of it there and give you a little bit more.

I Was I was just. Maybe this is what a lot of people are accustomed to. Maybe this is what's popular today. I don't know. Maybe I'm a little Sheltered. Maybe I'm just just accustomed to. You know if I'm not preaching I'm listening to Don Frye preach.

So I you know That's what I've gotten accustomed to over 15 years now and and so I don't hear a whole lot of other preaching to be honest with you and. But I I listened to this entire thing. He did go to a text in in in Isaiah for about 40 seconds I'd say You know read it made some basic comments about the context and then very quickly departed there from my friend.

Mentioned something that Spurgeon said and and as we listen to the end of this sermon how it ended. I Think that this really says something. Spurgeon said natural humor may possibly be consecrated and made to wear the yoke of Christ.

But he who apes it is no true man. If you find us a man who has any object in this world and what he says. But the glory of God and the winning of souls. He is the man who is out of center and into his secret and into his secret may we never come.

And furthermore if you discover a preacher who is Indelicate and causes the cheek of modesty to tingle let him be cast out of the pulpit and the door locked against him. We have known men of the slopdash order who would have been nothing if they had not been outrageous and.

Of these it may be said that they were worse than nothing when they followed their own style. There was nothing in their absurdities to excuse them for they were not carried away by zeal. Nor did the excellence of their matter make up for the ridiculousness of their manner of.

Such men we will neither be defender nor judge. Thank you very much. That's evidently I still have the sounds on the notepad program that I use there but I Just I don't know how to describe the the the range of things that are discussed in this 24 or 28 minutes 30 about that is about 30 minutes about about half an hour about half an hour.

I I don't know how to discuss. I don't even know how to start cataloging them. I guess the only way that I can I can explain it is just just listen how this ends for these.

Little kids this big show up to school this big Dr. Kenner. I Eat and I eat and I eat and I cannot gain weight. I'd like to roll you in breadcrumbs and deep-fry you. Don't you keep that to yourself? What if they start gaining weight is their face shaking?

What if they lose their hair face shaking? Is it feeling or is it fact? Is it based on truth of who God is or is it based on the way I respond to it? No believe and understand he said. That's a deeper type of faith.

That's a that's a that's a type of faith that goes beyond just My feelings. I served in churches in the south my entire my entire pastorate. I I lived and was raised in the city and they played a little game out there called torture the immigrant Yankee.

It was because of the game torture the immigrant Yankee. That I found myself in a field at 5 a .m. With a burlap sack in my hands yelling for something called snipe. You are evil for laughing at that and the things they did to me were horrific.

I had a cough once and they gave me some cough syrup. Cough syrup. It was my father-in-law. I Couldn't stop coughing in the morning service. We had to clear the platform out for the pageant that evening.

And I couldn't stop coughing. Nothing's open. We're an hour from town. He said I got some in my truck. Who's got cough syrup in their truck. I expect him to come back with Robitussin Dimetapp. It's a mason jar.

Some of y 'all know cuz you got some cough syrup at home. And I said, what is this and Braxton doesn't my father-in-law. He's at Braxton. He said maybe you mind preach. You just hold your nose and take two good gulps and step away from a truck.

And I chugged it. I Chugged it cuz I believed it cuz he told me it was true. And I finished it. They got rid of my cold. At least that's what they tell me. I Remember nothing. I remember nothing. My wife says I prowled the stage like Ric Flair.

I was walking around going to be the man. You gotta beat the man. Whoa, I've taken your word for it. Every time I trusted them I got into the baptistry and there was no baptistry. I went to the back there nothing there.

Where are we gonna baptize? We do it at the river. I Deacons got in the water with me. That was awesome. I was like, what are the deacons doing in the water with this is awesome, and they got sticks now.

I'm nervous. Deacons got sticks. What they have sticks for. Snakes, oh my Hindu. Let me tell you something if I knew there was one snake in that water. I've been the second person to successively navigate walking on top of it out.

I got into the water said my stuff. They had me facing her the wrong way. Deacons thought that was funny. I didn't know that you don't have him facing upstream when you baptize in a river. So I got to my little part that I've memorized buried in the likeness of his death and she shot out of my arms.

Because the water went up her nose. I love you. I Love Fort Myers and this place is extremely special to me and this pastor and this church is very special to me. But I don't have faith based on you telling me so.

My faith is built on nothing less than Jesus blood and righteousness. I Don't have a faith. I don't have a faith. That's a believe so feel so or hope so I have a faith that's a no. So I know whom I have believed and I am persuaded that he is Able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

Why? Because my faith isn't in a system or denomination. My faith is in the true living only Sovereign Lord, he is King. I ain't nothing and if you're gonna celebrate that holiday of his incarnation his birth God in the flesh.

Don't you mess with it and call it winter solstice or seasons greetings or happy holidays? We are celebrating the birth of the one who saved me. Merry bloody Christmas. Stop Playing games. So don't be a moron.

Don't be willfully ignorant. Don't be an idiot. And if you're on my turf if you're in the area where we're talking about the one who saved us don't mess around. We'll call you on it. Merry Christmas.

Sermon as Comedy Routine and the Problem of Applause

Okay. Most everybody is just sitting there going you're you're kidding right you made this up. No, I I couldn't I couldn't I couldn't make this kind of thing up. That's what the whole sermon was like that was the last five minutes or so and and the whole Sermon was a disjointed string of Stand-up comedy routines for Christian nightclubs.

I mean, that's that's the only way to describe it. It was it's it's get a laugh. Get him clapping. And you know push the envelope at times go ahead and you know just just. You know, I love Frank I love the French language, but not the French and you know, you know he likes to take on Britney Spears and and Paris Hilton and and you know throw that type of stuff in there and show how very up to date he is with the youth culture and stuff like that and This was supposed to be a Sunday morning sermon in a church and that that's what the entirety of the thing was and I just When I first started listening to it, I sort of assumed well, there's gonna be something here about Calvinism, you know.

That's why someone would direct me to it. No, it was just this this disjointed, you know rambling of. That that as far as I can tell him that's not preaching. I don't know how anyone can call that preaching.

That's a comedy routine. And there are a couple funny spots, you know, he's he's got fairly decent comedic timing you know at times sometimes it's strained and really pushed but You know, uh, he can communicate.

I'm not sure what he was communicating. The majority of times the the jokes the funny stories didn't have anything really to do this. It was a massive stretch to make the connection, but There there you go.

That's that's that's what you have as as preaching by the President of Liberty Seminary, I Have a feeling that Charles Haddon Spurgeon would have gone. Yep. That's who I'm talking about that's that's closed-door locket because that's I Don't know I don't know that that's a definite pulpit crime that entire sermon was was a pulpit crime of.

Immense proportions. I I don't know. Iii would be interested in listening to that first part that you played when we came in. Because it seemed like the last part that you played totally violated what he was saying about the way men used to preach.

Oh, of course. Yeah, that was the irony was saying I didn't come here to hear somebody's opinion. I came here to hear someone Proclaim the word Lord from the Bible and stuff and then he well.

It sounds to me like he wasn't even here there for either one of those. He was there for a good laugh. And and that. But unfortunately, I mean, you know how many churches are turning into story time. You know with their famous fishermen pastor or something like that who likes to tell fish stories or something and or comedy routines.

Let's let's let's get the. Get the folks in the seats and make them enjoy and be entertained. And they'll come back and pay next week.

Well, and how often in just what I played there did we hear? The applause. There was a tremendous amount of applause and Kenner was feeding off of it. If if there had been an applause of the people that sat there and gone, excuse me, this is not why I came.

I don't know what he would have done because I don't know what he was prepared to anything else. But it is once people start doing that and approving of it by their applause and by their laughter and ah, this is great.

Nope, you know, I doubt anybody was getting up and walking out. That's that's what what you feed on.

I think it's it's also just as much of a commentary on his preaching as it is to their Listening and what they find approval of I in their church and what they find to be spiritual.

Don't know. Don't know. I can't can't say hey, don't I hang about the church. Had never heard the church before. I I just listened to this and when it ends the way that it ended I'm Just left going you you're you're kidding me this I.

Well, well, I'm I'm preaching both services on Sunday. So I suppose people will be able to see if I hold myself to my own standards. But anybody who's ever been to PRBC knows that we're not going to be having any of those particular kind of jokes appearing in a discussion of Isaiah and the prophetic texts regarding Christ that doesn't really fit rule will be an Isaiah though.

He went to Isaiah something Didn't stay there very long and never really made any much of an application of it. But that's that's another issue. Well, anyway, we do get emails and I Want to spend some time on the program today responding to some emails that we have received.

First of all, I had about four or five people send me the entire Quotation from Doug Wilson. It's a volume 10 issue 3 of credenda agenda and The full citation is and I you know, you know what I should have done.

I should have. Why didn't I grab? His book to see how much of this quotation you put into it. Oh, well my mistake. The quotation is George Bryson is a very unusual non-Calvinist. He is able to describe the doctrinal position of Calvinism without putting any extra eggs in the pudding.

His descriptions are fair and accurate and he clearly knows his subject. The first portion of the book the place where he does all this Is very good. The second where he turns to reputation Falls in another category the name of this book is the five points of cows and Wade and found wanting just thought.

You might be interested my writer says and yes I had recalled that and that in essence what Wilson had said was okay, you know. In the section where he's quoting Calvin, that's one thing. But then when he tries to interact with it.

That's where you run into the the real problems and and I doubt I mean, I don't know but I sort of doubt that's a George put the Second part the second where he turn returns to reputation falls in another category.

Which is Doug's way of saying it's not overly good. Then I had this This email as a Calvinist. I have a question about Matthew 11 23. If the mighty works which were done in you had been done in Sodom It would have remained until this day and its implication on Reformed theology particularly total depravity.

I've heard Reformed preachers say that it shows that God does not intend for all to be saved which I agree with. I See if the verse demonstrates that God chose not to show them such mighty works and not give them the opportunity to repent however if an opponent of Reformed theology were to use this verse in connection to total depravity not necessarily God's election and Argue the verse in this manner.

This verse implies that man is not totally depraved for Jesus even said that if the people of Sodom would have seen his works They would have believed implying that they had the ability to believe. How would you respond?

I haven't personally received this objection. But as I was reading this verse, I noticed that this could be taken in such a way. Well, I have many times it's actually quite common for people to take judgment passages and Attempt to argue from them that.

Well, yes, this is the way it happened God did is to her judgment. But the implication is that if God hadn't acted in judgment, then they had the natural capacity To believe that is not an unusual argument at all the problem is this introduces us again to a The necessity of understanding something called the analogy of faith and what does that phrase mean it in an essence? is is illustrated by this question and that is that scripture is the context for the interpretation of scripture and that is because the nature of scripture in Most instances if you were dealing with a merely natural book That would not necessarily flow from the nature of the book itself.

But given the time frame over which scripture is given and given the nature of scripture itself the the Totality of Christian truth is not to be found in any particular text isolated from all others. You can take a text and you can isolate it from all others.

And what do I mean by that? Well, it's applied to the situation Total depravity is a doctrine that is directly stated in scripture. You have the the direct statement of man's deadness and sin you have the direct statement of man's Inabilities over and over again inability inability unable unable unable the the statement of the of the Extensiveness of sin you just read through Jeremiah can that can the leopard change its spots?

So can those then who who are accustomed to do evil can do good and and the whole point is they can't. There is a constituent problem. You have Romans 1 you have all these texts that make these you know extensive and clear teachings on the subject and so by isolating a judgment passage and saying well, okay, this isn't what happened, but the Implication is that if a counterfactual had taken place that this would then imply a Capacity in man.

Well, the problem is that's not what the text is about in the first place. Secondly you're isolating it from those and it is those other texts. It is the context of scripture as a whole. It is the revelation of God as a whole that provides the ability to rein in that kind of Errant reading of the text now.

This also brings up the fact that many people are somewhat troubled by the fact that That they want an answer on Every single text. That they'll frequently say there must be something in the Greek that contradicts that right?

Well, look at this look at this text. You're taking the implication of the negation of what actually happened and drawing a conclusion from From the implication and so you're not even dealing with the text at that point.

The issue isn't Greek. It isn't syntax isn't it? Sometimes there are sometimes there are are our clear grammatical issues involved we had for example a charismatic King James only Arminian Come into the channel this week, and he was trying to argue that That in the second Thessalonians 2 Paul is saying that God chose us because we believe the ground of faith was was God's was our believing and The ground of God's choice was our believing and I tried to point out to him not I'm sorry.

That doesn't that doesn't work. You're you're you're ignoring that the parallel in this phrase here and you're making a sub. I just went through all the all the grammar and syntax stuff with him and that didn't have the slightest bit of impact upon him.

But there are times when that just simply doesn't work. I remember it's still up on the on the website. There was an illustration from Mormonism where this one Very intelligent LDS apologist had argued from John chapter 4 as I recall that that Jesus and his disciples were baptizing and I point out to him.

No, you're you're missing the use the nominative here and you you know The grammar just all wrong at least he had the temerity Eventually to go. Yeah, you know what? You're right. I I've misread that one all along and and you are correct.

But sometimes there's something right there that that you know Does answer the question but that's not always the case and especially in a situation like this where you have such an extended argument based upon implication and and.

Well, but if that didn't happen then this Clearly the the grammar and syntax isn't going to be something that's going to address a subject like that. And sometimes people get just a little bit Concerned or worried if there's not a compelling argument of an isolated text that will protect it from misinterpretation and that's why I keep saying the entirety of Christian theology the entirety of Christian truth is delivered to us in the entirety of the Bible not just in any one text and.

So if you if you if you isolate any one text there are times When taken out of the context of Scripture you can read it in multiple ways and some of those multiple ways are heretical and untrue and false and That's what the cults do.

But you can't disprove that reading solely on the basis of that one text. It's an issue of the entirety of the texts that address that particular subject. And so we're talking there. Specifically in regards to the analogy of faith and its importance at that at that point.

Then one more email that we have received. By the way, the phone number is eight seven seven seven five three three three four one eight seven seven seven five three Three three four one. I have a theological question intramural.

Of course is I believe the concept or reality of predestination to be irrelevant in terms of destination. To explain I mean to say that as long as one has accepted Christ as their Lord and personal Savior.

Then any doctrinal confusion on free will changes nothing. My question is why would an atheist choose to accept Christ if he were to understand that it is not his choice to begin with? I'm not God admit sometimes.

The questions are a little bit Difficult to to follow and to understand there. That is first I wouldn't agree with a statement I mean to say that as long as one has accepted Christ their Lord and personal Savior than a doctrinal confusion on free will changes nothing, I I think that it has a Tremendous impact to just look at the difference in the kind of preaching that flows from someone who recognizes God's free will and man's creaturely will and his enslavement to sin and the Sovereignty of God and salvation and his freedom over against the creaturely freedom of a man controlling all things in essence and Those who Who believe the other I think it has a tremendous impact.

So I I think it does when it says it changes nothing. I don't accept that but then the the question is why would an atheist choose to accept Christ for you to understand that it's not His choice to begin with well that that begs the entirety of the question and that is it's assuming that the only reason someone accepts Christ or repents and believes Is because they somehow feel like they have the ability to do so in the sense that well It's totally up to me.

And so that that makes me feel good. And so because it makes me feel good, then I'm going to go ahead and do this. That's not the reason why anyone believes in the first place. There is this thing called the Holy Spirit of God and there is this thing called the conviction of sin and there is this thing called regeneration and then taking out of a heart of stone and the giving of a heart of flesh and The whole question seems to be based upon well, you know We have to we have to make the atheist want to do something.

No, we need to make the atheist Understand who he is and he already knows who he is. We just need to be involved in reminding him forcefully through the power of the Holy Spirit that he is God's creature and he is suppressing the knowledge of his creator and that he is in a state of denial and if God is Merciful to that individual he will reveal himself to him and draw him to himself.

And that's how True saving faith that will continue on Over a long period of time is is going to be born that person's heart. So I I would simply say Why would an atheist choose to accept Christ? No, why would an atheist Bow the knee before his creator?

Well, because God in his mercy has removed the rebellion that is inherent in his in his heart. And has been merciful to him. That's how I would respond to that particular question eight seven seven seven five three three three four one.

We have three lines have lit up since I mentioned the phone number there just a few moments ago. So we'll be taking your phone calls once we take our half-hour break and we'll be right back right after this.

Ministry Announcements and Sponsor Reads

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Get pulpit crimes in the bookstore at a omen org. This portion of the dividing line has been made possible by the Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church. The Apostle Paul spoke of the importance of solemnly testifying of the gospel of the grace of God.

The proclamation of God's truth is the most important element of his worship in his church. The elders and people of the Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church invite you to worship with them this coming Lord's Day.

The morning Bible study begins at 9 30 a .m. And the worship service is at 10 45. Evening services are at 6 30 p .m. On Sunday and the Wednesday night prayer meeting is at 7. The Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church is located at 3805 North 12th Street in Phoenix.

You can call for further information at 602 to 6 grace. If you're unable to attend you can still participate with your computer and real audio at prbc .org. Where the ministry extends around the world through the archives of sermons and Bible study lessons available 24 hours a day.

What is dr. Norman Geisler warning the Christian community about in his book chosen, but free a new cult. Secularism. False prophecy scenarios. No, dr. Geisler is sounding the alarm about a system of beliefs commonly called Calvinism.

He insists that this belief system is theologically inconsistent. Philosophically insufficient and morally repugnant in his book the potter's freedom. James White replies to dr. Geisler. But the potter's freedom is much more than just a reply.

It is a defense of the very principles upon which the Protestant Reformation was founded. Indeed it is a defense of the very gospel itself in a style that both scholars and laymen alike can appreciate.

James White masterfully counters the evidence against so-called extreme Calvinism. Defines what the reformed faith actually is and concludes that the gospel preached by the reformers is the very one taught in the pages of Scripture.

The potter's freedom a defense of the Reformation and a rebuttal to Norman Geisler's chosen. But free you'll find it in the reformed theology section of our bookstore at a omen org.

Baptism, Hermeneutics, and Covenant Practice

And we'll go back to the dividing line. We go to our phone calls and talk with.

Michael. Michael, how are you? Hey, how are you? Very good. Thank you. Yes, sir. Hey, I wanted to ask you I actually have a one question. Then maybe the other ones more personally oriented about a situation I'm in with regarding baptism.

But I listened to your debate with Bill Shishko on baptism. I got it off the net and I had real trouble following one of your arguments and it's it's. Simply because of the pace that the debate took place at okay, but repeatedly said that he was a Exegeting Scripture in one place with a method that he didn't use in another to support his case for baptism.

I was wondering if you could elaborate on that a little bit. Help me understand that a little better.

Yeah, I was one of the primary arguments that I made and and that is that the Hermeneutic that is used for example to look at the texts for example in regards to Lydia or especially to the Philippian jailer and to come to the conclusion that the rest of the family the Philippian jailers family Though they had had the word preached to them Rejected that word and were not saved and yet they rejoiced with him That he had accepted Christ that that seems to me too.

I don't think that in any other context a reformed hermeneutic would see unbelievers rejoicing in the Acceptance of Christ by someone when they themselves have rejected that very same message and yet that's the kind of interpretation that you hear repeatedly.

Especially by those who want to very strongly emphasize that Only he had believed that he alone was his faith was the basis upon which everyone else was baptized and that they had not believed it's a very unusual way of interpreting the text and It only seems to come up in this particular area when we're dealing with this particular concept.

I don't see that if we were looking at any other text of Scripture where you have believers and unbelievers that a reformed Individual would jump to the conclusion that unbelievers are rejoicing in their rejection of the gospel but rejoicing with those who accepted it and and the same thing with With Lydia and this came out in the cross-examination question and that was that I even asked In regards to the rest of the household a question and and Bill's response was oh I'm I would imagine the rest of the household did repent and believe because that's what they did back then and I'm Yeah, and I still don't understand what it means to say.

That's what they did back then I think what it means is if the head of the household did something the rest of them did it too, but Does that doesn't? Again that there's there's just such a different Hermeneutic being used in those contexts that I even had some some Presbyterian friends comment to me that a lot of the presentation about children and Things later on the debate.

They're they're just like I didn't really see the direct relevance to the subject of baptism of those particular Presentations. I said, yeah, I I didn't either and it really surprised me that the the closing statement in essence was This is all about the children and It's not all about the children.

I'm sorry. It's it's all about Christ as king of his church Determining the the ordinances of his church. It's not all about the children and So That's just not how reformed folks normally Exegete the scriptures and we're talking about the resurrection or the inspiration of scripture or the deity of Christ or or you know Judgment justification, whatever that's not the kind of Interpretational methodology that I see in those in those situations.

Well, thank you. Thank you very much.

You're really not, you know at this pace of doubt of the context of the debate the media context of the bait.

I can follow what you're saying. It might help a little bit once the DVDs are available because Hopefully, you know when you can see something and it that sometimes will help and we're still trying to we're still missing One of the one of the things that we well, I'm sorry got it yesterday.

All right. We got the second we got the seconds of video yesterday but now we've got to do is take two different types of video and The audio and try to figure out what was missing in the audio and try to Put all three of these things together if you can imagine what that's good.

I think I'm up so it's gonna be gonna be fun. Anyway, I got one other good shirt.

I'm a personal a little bit of personal application here about three four years ago I kind of came around to the review reform review of things and. Here in Central Central PA, I mean, it's a lot different now than when you were here in the 70s.

But there's not a whole plethora of reformed churches. I come out of a baptistic background, but we're currently attended. I just attending and just finished a membership program and a and an Orthodox Presbyterian Church.

They know my beliefs on the baptism thing and they're they're working with me and Adam under no specific pressure or anything. But here's my situation, all right, I am a believer in. You hold two believers baptism only but I think you'll be able to sympathize a little bit to your father.

But I have a handicapped daughter. Mm-hmm. What do I do with her? She's been only have deception. She may never ever be able to offer a faith. Mm-hmm.

Well, you know toward the end of the debate Bill asked some questions along those lines and and again, I was a little bit confused as to What was being asked? It seemed that he was asking. Well, don't we have you know objective?

Promises concerning our children and and at the same time I thought he had said he doesn't believe in in any type of baptismal regeneration. So I'm not really wasn't really sure I was following the argument at that point.

But what I had tried to indicate in my response to a somewhat similar question It wasn't specifically about that kind of a concept but I had said look, you know, there are all sorts of very Difficult and challenging pastoral issues that come up in the church on all sorts of subjects.

Subjects about which the the scriptures speak very clearly you think of for example The the teaching on resurrection is is very clearly taught in Scripture. And yet We know that when we talk about Infants dying in infancy or things like that or why bad things happen to good people and everything else There's there's still you know pastoral applications and things that are not Simplistic in how you you give a response.

Yeah, and when it comes to this issue in regards to to your daughter You know the question that I would that I would obviously first have to ask is do you believe? That you know, you don't believe given what you just said that baptism is something that is a Salvific ordinance in the sense of it's somehow saving someone from their sins.

No, I absolutely don't believe that. Yeah, and I don't know obviously the the state of your daughter as far as If she's just has a diminished capacity or basically no capacity to understand at all. I don't know.

I have I have no way I would call it greatly diminished as the. From what we see now that the depth of her ability to comprehend literally may never exceed. I know that Jesus loves me. Yeah. Yeah, so.

You know in that type of situation that the question then becomes what is the what is the purpose of baptism? And what would be the the purpose and desire on the part of other people? For a person to be baptized within that context.