Atheist Hitchens Refuted & Face-Plants

Apologia Studios

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00:30

Well, I hope you're enjoying Collision Through New Eyes. I know

00:35

I am, big time. Yeah, a decade or so later, to come back and start looking at all the raw footage, all the things that I couldn't put into the movie, the little moments, the gems, the behind the scenes, the stories.

00:53

I mean, it's just, you got to stay focused as much as I could to make Collision. And so to revisit it now, it's just been such an amazing, fun thing to do.

01:12

And so this is kind of how it gets done. In the Apostles' Creed, it is said of Jesus that after suffering under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried, he descended into hell, you'll remember that.

01:24

Well, I've heard it argued by some Christians that he went to hell in order to retrospectively recruit all those who'd been boiling there awaiting his arrival.

01:32

I think we're on episode nine. It's a fantastically cruel way of explaining things, but at least it does square the circle, which otherwise cannot be squared, believe you me, of Through New Eyes.

01:45

And this is kind of how I do it. Get up early in the morning, before the kind of the day starts, come into my office here, pull up footage,

01:53

I just go and order. No, indeed, I mean, there is no hell. It's a detail worth pointing out.

01:59

There is no hell in the Old Testament. There is no hell in the Old Testament. There's no mention of it. Once God is finished with you, once all the

02:06

Amalekite children have been killed, that's the end of them. There's no punishment of the dead.

02:12

It's only with gentle Jesus, meek and mild. He says, if you don't listen to my meek and mild message, you can depart into everlasting fire.

02:20

Of just everything that was shot, and I just reflect, and I think, and I find new ways to tell stories. And this episode here is one that I think it's not in the movie.

02:32

You know, it's the moment I think I wanted. I've been looking forward to the most in regards to this series is to tell this story.

02:41

You've always got that option, if you don't like my meek and mild stuff. So yes,

02:47

I think it's good. I think it's very, it's not a matter of pedantry at all. The difference between hell, Hades, infinite, eternal punishment, and not is very important.

02:55

One of Christianity's specifically horrible contributions to human mythology and delusion is the idea, the terrifying idea, that you could be tortured forever.

03:04

What happened at the very first debate, there was so much, the whole movie could have been about just that first debate.

03:14

And there was a particular moment that to me, actually ended,

03:20

I mean, it ended the entire debate. Wilson took out

03:25

Hitchens so early that I was shocked and I didn't think from a narrative standpoint of telling the story of Collision that I could just have the first 10, 15 minutes kind of end because what happens in that first debate was just,

03:42

One of Christianity's specifically horrible contributions to human mythology and delusion is the idea, the terrifying idea, that you could be tortured forever.

03:51

Horrible by what standard? Horrible by, well, good question.

03:58

Yeah, I know. Good question. Horrible, well, shall I say, let me ask you, anyone?

04:06

Again, it kind of was over. And watching Hitchens, you know, watching the raw footage and just looking at Hitchens, that's kind of what

04:14

I want to do with this episode, just watching Hitchens and his angle. Horrible, well, shall

04:20

I say, let me ask you, anyone here who doesn't think it's a horrible idea to put up their hand?

04:29

So it doesn't seem to require much explanation, does it, as a horrible idea? Of how he's processing Doug Wilson.

04:37

Do you feel you need a standard to keep your hand down at the moment?

04:43

How he's processing someone whose style and rhetoric and wit and knowledge and sincerity and, like I said,

04:51

I think he said humor and humor. Well, did I just say something that was, so to speak, morally self -evident?

04:57

No, there's a difference between an emotional reaction to something. Every person - I don't think they're using their heads. No, there's a difference between an emotional reaction, which all of us have, everybody with natural affection thinks it's a terrible idea to think of people perishing eternally.

05:13

It's disarming Hitchens. He's never, ever, ever had to deal with someone like Doug Wilson.

05:21

That's not the issue. The issue is, how do you give an accounting of what is good and what is bad?

05:27

And watching, almost like a reaction video, watching Hitch think through what is coming at him.

05:34

When you say, if the universe is, on your counting, time and chance acting on matter.

05:41

All the debates he had done, and the wheels are turning, he's becoming, something's happening, and then

05:50

Doug hits him with something he's never, ever, ever been hit with. If all the universe is, is matter in motion, what do you mean horrible?

05:58

What do you mean by horrible idea? Who cares? This is collision through new eyes.