Luke Abendroth Interview 2019 (part 1)

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the

Apostle Paul said, �But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.�

In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn�t for you.

By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we�re called by the

Divine Trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King. Here�s our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.

Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry, and today is one of those once -a -year highlights we have.

Highlight for me, and I think it will be a highlight for you as well, Luke Jr. NoCo. Guten Morgen.

Abendroth is here. Great to see you, Luke. Likewise. So, you flew in last night, it was a red -eye, and for those that don�t know who

Luke is, he is my son. You are what? Twenty -three and a half? Is that it now? Twenty -two. Two -two. Two -two.

I don�t know about you. And so, you had no sleep, so if the show doesn�t go well today, we just won�t play it, right?

Yeah, sounds good. I think I got about 30 minutes or so. The dude, I wasn�t having a very, I was in curvata se, like Luther said.

I was wanting to have an arm battle war with the guy in the armrest next to me. We didn�t talk at all. We were just battling over the armrest, trying to get the back side.

He got most of it, so most of the time. But he was hogging. He was man -spreading. Yes, man -splaining.

Man -splaining, man -spreading. He was doing all kinds of wrong things. And he was in the center aisle? He was in the center.

I was on the aisle. Oh, sorry. He was in the middle seat. Okay. All right. Because I didn�t even get the pleasure of looking out the window to distract me.

Okay. And what�s new with you in the last year? You�ve graduated from university, right?

I have. Graduated from the Master�s University, TMU. And I work now in the lighting industry.

So, you know, I think Luke means �bringer of light� in Greek. So I think the Lord, you know, in His sovereignty kind of gave me some direction.

I had a couple different job opportunities, and I had to choose lighting because my name means �bringer of light.� Well, but I thought that was like a

Gentile. Was it, Luke? A Gentile physician? Yeah. I mean, keep that going. I�m a Gentile, too. Anigoim.

Keep that going. So, you�re going to work in the lighting industry for a while, and then what?

Just pay some bills off? Or how�s that all work? Yeah. The plan is pay off the student loans, borrower is a slave to the lender.

So I�m trying to get out of that arrangement as much as I can. I think Paul does say, �If you can secure your freedom, do so.�

So I�m going to try to do that as quick as I can, and then we�ll see, maybe seminary in the future.

But that�s the plan. Well, Luke, when I hang out with you, you know, in many ways you�re like your mom, but in many ways you�re like me.

And so then I think, okay, maybe that�s why people either want to hang out with me or they don�t. It�s kind of like the polarizing personality thing.

There�s not many people that are like, �Oh, I�m not really sure about Luke and Mike.� Or Pat.

Pat�s the same thing. Yeah, Pat�s the same thing. The Abendroth curse. Well, it does resonate with me when

I think, when we preach or teach the Bible, and I know you don�t preach on Sundays, but you teach regularly, I never want people to say, �I wonder what he thinks about that.�

Right? He�s very clear, passionate. Maybe like Jonathan Edwards on justification.

Oh, whoops. I didn�t think I was supposed to say that. We�re in New England. That�s a holy name.

Luke, I never will forget that time, and I think you went with us, because I would take you if any speaker was here, and it would be

Rick Phillips or Daniel Block or James White or Carl Truman or whatever, and were you with me with Truman, and I said, �Oh, you know what?

Carl, do you want to go see the Great Awakening sites and the Whitfield Rock and Edwards House and all that ?�

He�s like, �Yeah, I guess we can.� He wasn�t thrilled about it, and I thought, �Why wouldn�t you be thrilled ?� I mean, this is so important, and now

I see. Now you see the light. I see. I�m bringing the light. Luke. I see the light. So, let�s talk a little bit about the

Master�s University since you�ve graduated. DMU. Bleed blue, go gold. If you could summarize, what�s like the main thing that you appreciate about the school as you look back?

You know, I think I really just had � I learned what it�s like to not dance for four years.

That was really helpful. I�m just kidding. I�m totally kidding. David danced before the

Lord, so that was always my argument. No, I�m just kidding. I think the Master�s was awesome just because of probably primarily the people

I met. I mean, I learned a lot about the Bible, and I had a lot of great professors, learned a lot about business. But I think just the people

I met. I mean, pretty much all my closest friends, since I still live in Los Angeles, I still go to Grace Community Church, or from the

Master�s University, or from connections through that. So, the people. I mean, and then it�s like crazy how many people then they move across the country or around the world or go back to their countries, and then it�s like you�ve got connections for life all over the place.

So, it�s really cool. So, I think that�s been what I�m most thankful for, and the closest friendships, the people who encourage me the most in the

Lord on a more serious note are all from Master�s. So, I think that�s one of the biggest things. Luke, you kind of are half, you know, half the time you�re serious and you want to understand

God�s Word and learn about the Lord Jesus, and the other half the time you�re usually joking around or doing pranks and all that kind of stuff.

How does that work together? Is this like simul -eustice et peccator kind of stuff?

Which one�s the saint and which one�s the sinner part? Oh, that was good. I don�t think it�s that good.

I don�t know. I think we�re supposed to have fun. If we have a sense of humor, you know, who came up with a sense of humor?

Wouldn�t it be that the Lord created that? I don�t think the Lord in the Scriptures has ever said that Jesus laughed.

Right. I think Adam was just stone -faced in the garden. For sure. With his wife. They just sat around and talked about,

I don�t know, naming things in a very serious manner. That�s right. That�s right. When he saw her the first time, he was just like, �Ah.�

He�s like, �Hey, what�s up ?� I did want to read this to you.

It�s Psalm 2 and the message. Oh, exciting. You know, Psalm 2 is regularly used,

Luke, in Hebrews, and I�m preaching through Hebrews, and Hebrews could be basically an exposition of Psalm 110 and Psalm 2, those two great

Psalms about the Lord Jesus, and it says here in Psalm 2 in the

Message Bible, �Let me tell you what God said next. He said, �You�re my son and today is your birthday.�

That�s so bad. You have your Bible open to Psalm 2. What�s the text really say?

I will tell of the decree, the Lord, or Yahweh, just to � your daughter, my sister, got in trouble.

She went and did the study abroad in Israel, and people didn�t want her to say Yahweh because it�s offensive to Jewish people.

She is an Eben Drotho, and the word German, the word Deutsch means direct, and so she did it anyways and took the lesser grade.

So that�s beside the point. But anyways, �The Lord said to me, �You are my son, today

I have begotten you.� Yahweh said to me, �You are my son, today I have begotten you. Ask me and I�ll make the nations your heritage and the ends of the earth your possession.

You shall break them with a rod of iron and dash them in pieces like a potter�s vessel.� It sounds a little bit better, and I think that the message then is messing with the true and Christian doctrine of Jesus Christ as well.

I don�t think it squares too well with the Chalcedon, the creeds of Chalcedon or anything,

Apostles, Nicene. It doesn�t really sound like eternal begetting. Luke, when

I read then Acts 13, for instance, in the message, and we�re here today bringing you good news, the message that what

God promised the fathers has come true for the children, for us. He raised Jesus exactly as described in the 2nd

Psalm, �My son, my very own son, today I celebrate you.� But how would I know that if it doesn�t talk about today is your birthday?

Right. Right? Isn�t that the Beatles? That�s what the Chalcedon, the Beatles do. �Today, it�s your birthday. Happy birthday to you.�

There�s all kinds. Then there�s like that Ninja Turtles birthday one. Oh, see, I don�t know that. Did I let you watch

Ninja Turtles? I don�t think we ever did that. Is there anything in your childhood where you think, �You know what? Why didn�t my dad let me do that, or why did he stop me doing the other ?�

You have some kind of daddy wounds and regrets. I think I maybe just used to hear a lot of law sermons.

Maybe that wasn�t what was super helpful. So, that explains it.

I�m just blaming it all on that, the times they are a -changin.� That�s another mother pop culture reference for NoCo.

So tell me, I think that was a Bob Dylan song, right? It was. That�s right. Tell me a little bit, Luke, about what�s happening as you think about theological issues you�re teaching.

Well, tell me where you�re teaching and what you�re teaching, and that particular gospel that you�re teaching the kids and all that.

Yeah, so I help with the high school group at my church and get some opportunities just to teach in the regional

Bible studies and stuff. And we were just recently going through the book of Mark, so that�s been exciting. We just kind of immediately jumped in there and started studying.

I�m just kidding. I�m hoping you�ll catch the �immediately� part, but... You know, when

I was turning my Bible to Mark, and I missed the �immediately.�

Uh -huh. No, it�s been good. And just the structure of Mark and the fast pace he�s going to run and get to Jesus and just show who he is, and, you know, this first gospel being written to encourage these early believers that Jesus really is who he says he is.

And yeah, I think it�s been really cool, and just trying to proclaim and preach Jesus from the gospels.

One of the hermeneutical keys to the book is it�s the beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ. It�s the good news of Jesus Christ.

So is the way that you�re preaching Mark actually good news about Jesus? Or is it, whatever, some bad news about me and my performance?

Not that Mark doesn�t ever talk about that, but primarily this is a message about this is who

Jesus is, and it�s a proclamation. Believe in him. Keep believing. There�s persecution going on, but he is who he says he is, and he�s so much more, and you better trust in him.

Can you imagine getting the book of Mark when you were a new, you know, first century

Christian and the Spirit of God inspires this book, and you get a hold of it, and you just, you know, get to reflect on who

Jesus is and know with exact detail what he did and said? That�d be pretty encouraging. And then, you know, on the reverse side of things, how is it that we get the book of Mark and we get, you know, four steps to resist temptation?

Or not necessarily Mark�s section is shorter than that, but to read ourselves into the hero of the text is just you got to refuse to do it.

This is a book about Jesus, and it can be a secondary point, and of course, we see things that are true there, but primarily the book better fit, like we said before, the good news about Jesus.

Psalm, excuse me, Mark 10 .45 says, �For even the Son of Man came not to be served, but to serve and to give his life as a ransom for many.�

And we have been rightly taught that that is the theme of the book, and I would not say it wasn�t.

I mean, right after that, he sees the blind guy, and he wants to serve the blind guy. What do you want me to do for you?

But I think we better, as you just said, Luke, read the entire book in light of the intro, right?

So, Mark 1 .1, the beginning of the gospel, good news of Jesus Christ, the

Son of God. And I think that verse is the�it better blanket everything in the rest of the way we look at and interpret the book.

Right. Yeah. Whatever passage it is. So, could you preach a sermon from the gospel of Mark and then have it not be about Jesus in some way, shape, or form?

Would that be a bad move if you did that? What do you think? What do you think?

I think the answer is found somewhere within the question. Was it a riddle wrapped in an enigma inside a question?

What is that? It�s just a bodyguard of lies. Uh -huh. Yeah, that�s right. I like that. I like that too. No, yeah, of course, and of course that would not be right, and I think it can be done pretty easily because we�re just so naturally turned in on ourselves and want to see ourselves and how this practically applies to ourself, but what�s really more practical than knowing deep down really who

Jesus is, that He is eternally the Son, He�s begotten of the Father, He�s in a relationship with the

Father and the Spirit, and He becomes a man, He takes on flesh, it�s subtraction by addition,

His deity is not diminished at all, and He comes to serve us and to accomplish our salvation.

What�s going to be more practical than that when actually hard things start to happen in my life for you when you find out you have cancer, or for me when,

I don�t know, the hardest thing that happens in my life is like I run out of gas or something, but I�m sure that won�t be true for long, so.

Yeah, the trials are there ordained for you. You know, it�s interesting, Luke, just like with Ephesians chapter 2, where God has created us for good works, you know, and He�s created these works beforehand that we might walk in them,

I think He�s created trials beforehand that we might walk in those as well to help us.

Yeah. Luke, when I read the Gospel of Mark, and let�s just say, or any of the

Gospels, and Peter takes his eyes off the Lord and he falls into the water and he�s not walking on the water anymore, don�t you think it�s fair?

I mean, it�s a leading question, but it�s fair to then say, see what happens, Christian, when you take your eyes off the

Lord? There�s a time to address the person in the pew and not just say, �This is another message only about Jesus, and I�m not going to show you the connection on how you need to think about the object of your faith.�

So, we address the people in the pews, but we do it in a way that�s not moralistic or how -to kind of thing.

Right, absolutely. Okay, do you want to elaborate on that at all? Well, there�s obviously clear times in the text where it is about you and how it applies to you.

So, I think, you know, Mark includes sections from Jesus about drastic action against sin and, you know, you cut off your right hand rather than if it causes you to stumble.

I think Mark has it too, doesn�t it? I don�t know. You�re the one who�s done it. You�re the one who has the seminary, so I don�t know. I�m pretty sure, though.

Speaking of seminary, would you like to go to seminary someday? I think one day. Okay. Yeah. Good. Well, I have done things wrongly in many areas of my life, and so then

I try to give good counsel in light of that, and I have said to Luke, �Luke, why don�t you go to university, then get a job, learn some skills, pay off your bills, see what it�s like to live in a normal, you know, work environment and know what men and women struggle with, and then if you want to go to seminary after that�

How do I know what women struggle with? Well, I�m just saying there are ladies in the workforce. I�m trying to be, you know, cool about it.

I like that. That�s good. I always say, though, Luke, when you either go to work in the morning or you wake up at night, go to work.

And see, that includes the ladies, so they know I know. Right. Yeah. Being a mother is a full -time job.

That�s true. More than full -time. More than 40 hours a week. It is. And so you�re studying now.

What have you been reading lately? We talked about the whole Christ maybe last year. What have you been reading this year, besides your phone right now?

He�s on his phone. I�m looking at stuff on my phone, stuff to say. People are texting me what to say in response. You�re texting me, �Say this.�

Oh, that�s funny. That�s funny. What have you been reading? What have I been reading? All kinds of random stuff. I was looking at some

Michael Horton stuff recently. I started the Zacharias Ursinus Commentary on the

Heidelberg Catechism. That was pretty interesting and good, just the first part of that. I don�t know.

I haven�t been reading as much as I wish. I�ve been pretty busy with work. I�m training right now to go into sales, so it�s a lot of work, and then along with high school and other stuff like that.

I�m trying to be more disciplined this next year with my � I don�t really have

New Year�s resolutions, but I want to leverage my resources well. I want to be like the shrewd and wicked or evil manager, the son of darkness, who is actually more shrewd with his resources than the sons of light.

Is that Luke 16? Is that? I think it is. Yeah, Luke 16. Anything about light now? See, you�re all about light.

I�m all about Luke and light. Bringing the light in. What kind of lights are these here in the office, in the studio? It looks like they�re

U -fluorescence, like U -bend, just cheapo, two -by -two BBC lights.

They�re budget church lights. You know, actually, sadly, a lot of times, churches are the worst people to work with, so that�s sad.

It�s a bad testimony sometimes. Would that be evangelical churches or mainline churches, Methodist, Catholic? There�s no mainline churches on the

West Coast. I�m just kidding. They just die out.

Yeah, pretty much. All right. Well, anything you�ve been wanting to ask me here? I know sometimes you listen to OCO, but not very often, because you can just call me anytime you want.

Anything you�ve been thinking about lately you want to ask me? Hmm. Okay, that�s a no.

Hmm. No, I have some answers. I mean, I got some answers. I got some questions. I got some answers. I got some questions.

I have a question. Could you explain, you know, maybe stir up a controversy a little bit? I don�t think we have very much time, but would you explain your view of sanctification synergistic or monergistic?

And what do you mean by that? And does that mean if it�s monergistic that we�re not active? I think I know the answer to that, but can you elaborate?

See, you like to ask those questions, and now I have to, you know, I thought it was going to be like, what�s my view of the millennium, or what�s my view of covenant theology?

The Amillennium Falcon. I watched the Han Solo movie on the plane over here, so it�s in my mind. Well, it�s interesting to just watch the sanctification debate, and here�s what

I�ll just say generally, because we�ve done some shows on it, and actually we�re going to have Clark in, R. Scott Clark, Dr. Clark, and we�re doing these

Reformation studies, so one�s on law and gospel, one will be on the Reformed view of sanctification, and I just read the

Christian spirituality four or five views that I think Sinclair Ferguson did the chapter on sanctification.

He did a Reformed one. Yeah. And, you know, I guess my default, Luke, used to be work out your salvation with fear and trembling, and since I was responsible to do that in Philippians chapter 2, and kind of forgot about it was in chapter 1.

What�s the next part of that? It is God who works in you both to will and to do. I know. And therefore, since I knew

I was responsible in sanctification, that that was going to be synergistic.

I�m working, God�s working, and I would have given the credit to the Lord, of course, for anything good that�s happened. But as you look at the idea of sanctification, and I think, let�s say

Westminster Confession, you�ve got a section in there for sanctification and how it has to happen in light of justification, a different category, but it follows.

And then you�ve got another section of good works, and it seems to put more of the responsibility of the person in the �of good works� section than the sanctification section.

So here at No Compromise Radio, we�re monergistic, but we are not antinomian, and I think if you say you�re monergistic, then they think you�re antinomian, and I think we do have a responsibility.

I think it�s some kind of �lay back and just chill on the couch� type of thing. When people say �lay back and let God�, why do they always pronounce it

G -A -W -D, God? I think that might be taking the

Lord�s name in vain to say it like that. Well, maybe. You know, I did change my screensaver, so I didn�t have that Downey, Doubting Thomas thing, so now

I�ve got the Rembrandt, Darius. Yeah, you�re not breaking the Second Commandment anymore. Uh -huh. What about the Fourth Commandment?

Hmm. What day is it today? What day? It depends whether I record this on Sunday or we play it on Sunday.

I think it�s Friday. Yeah. When you were in Israel and you studied for a semester, any interesting thing that you learned that made you understand the

Bible better? I think I learned that when Jesus says that Abraham rejoiced to see my day, that maybe that still needs to be said to people, to Christians today.

You know, I think I saw some kind of tweet about that, so I won�t totally steal it, but sometimes that still needs to be said today. We�re so excited about Abraham when

Abraham�s really so excited about Jesus. So, I think, no, I learned a lot of cool things and just saw these places and it really brought the historic reality that these things really did happen.

This is true. These are not false realities or these are not, or things that help us get through life or some kind of thing in the sky that�s just some

Greek idea that�s come down to us. This is the real history that happened, that Jesus really did live and die and obey the law perfectly for us in our place and come back from the dead.

And he rose again and ascended into heaven and he sits at the right hand right now ready to judge, what is it?

Both the quick and the dead. I like that better. The quick and the dead. I know. It sounds like a Clint Eastwood. I know, because they stole that.

I know. Wait, is it a Clint Eastwood? Well, some Western. Some Western. I like it. Well, I had two thoughts go through my mind,

Luke, regarding that. One was Pontius Pilate, apostolic creed,

Nicene Creed that we were looking at this morning. He suffered under Pontius Pilate. Why is that in there? And the second thought goes along with that and Machen would say,

J. Gresham Machen, that a Christian theologian is primarily an historian, right?

Because you�re studying a person who really existed, right? If he wasn�t a person, then there�s no

Christian religion. He�s not a representative. He�s not our substitute. He didn�t really obey the law in our place and earn righteousness for us.

And we have to have that history. So, when you walk into Tiberius�Caesarea by the sea.

West. Yeah. No, I was talking about the one on the ocean. You go to Caesarea by the sea.

Not Philippi. Not Philippi. But the one by the sea and it�s got that some kind of a

Pontius Pilate inscription. Right, yeah. It�s the fake one, but the real one�s in the Jerusalem Museum. And I�m thinking, you know what?

This is really real. So, when we had our little devotion there by that little obelisk, whatever it�s called,

I thought, Jesus really ate food and had real footprints in the sand.

Wow. I wonder what size foot he had. Probably about, he was about probably five foot tall.

If that was the average size of people, and it was. We�ve got the obelisks for the femur bone sizes.

And he was probably five foot tall. And my guess is, he looked like his mother. I think that�s guaranteed.

Well, the funny thing is too, I think, what�s that Luther? You�re going to have to correct me on this one. But the Luther, you know, Luther talked about the same thing.

You know, this is, what is it? He talks about, obviously, you know, Luther�s great cry for us, for us.

Christ for us, not Christ in us. But when you talk about, when you add, it becomes not doctrine, but I�m losing my thought now.

But basically, we take history, but then through Christian faith and religion is when we say, this was done for me.

And for me, he lived. And for me, he dies. Oh, yeah. And some of that is, you know, learn to say, and this is in light of Galatians 2 .20,

learn to say, Christ loved me. Christ died for me. Christ, you know, was raised for me. He did those things for me.

And maybe the other thought that�s going through your mind is Machen would say, Jesus died. That�s history.

That�s what I�m thinking of. Jesus died for me. That�s, you know, theology. You know, Jesus loved me and died for me, and that�s doxology.

Something like that. Yeah. See, I knew that. That�s why you�re the dad. I know, but I just was telling

Luke this morning at home over a cup of coffee that my memory doesn�t, you know, serve me like it used to.

Well, hopefully, at least you don�t have some kind of, you�re not going to go back and forget that you weren�t

Jewish before or something and go back and forget it. Some Feinberg -esque type of thing. But I might go back to my punk rock disc jockey days or something and, well,

I don�t know. New Order wasn�t punk rock, but maybe, you know, some kind of� What do you mean go back? I thought you�re still in it. It seems like.

Well, you know, it is so funny. I like it that you know all the bands that I like because I just made you listen to that.

I know people at work think I�m like just some super old man, like in a young man�s body, because it�s like all these, like, it�s like I�ve read on Twitter and I like I already get all the

Talking Heads references. Nobody has to explain it to me. It�s the same as it ever was. And that�s my favorite line. My favorite line

I would say to people is, �Hey, you�re talking a lot, but you�re not saying anything.� And then I just keep going with it. And when I have nothing to say, my lips are sealed.

And they�re just like, �What ?� And they just think I�m completely sane. Why say it again? And then I don�t say the psycho killer part because it gets a little weird.

All right. We�ll have one more interview. Luke, thanks for being on. Roger. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible -teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life -transforming power of God�s Word through verse -by -verse exposition of the sacred text.

Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at 6. We�re right on Route 110 in West Boylston.

You can check us out online at bbcchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.