October 12, 2022 Show with April Chapman on “Being Black, Female, Conservative & Christian: A 21st Century Survival Guide”

Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Introduction and Iron Sharpens Iron as a Ministry

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania. It's iron sharpens iron. This is a radio platform in which pastors Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us. Iron sharpens iron so one man sharpens another. Matthew Henry said that in this passage We are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have a view in conversation To make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours. And we hope to hear from you the listener with your own questions, and now here's your host Chris Arnzen.

Good.

Afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania Lake City, Florida. And the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming at iron sharpens iron Radio .com. This is Chris Arnzen your host of iron sharpens iron radio.

Wishing you all a happy Wednesday on this 12th day of October 2022. I am thrilled to have as a first time ever guest today April Chapman who is host of the standard of truth podcast and we are going to be addressing the theme being black female conservative and Christian the 21st century survival God.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the first time ever to iron sharpens iron radio April Chapman. Oh, I am thrilled to have you and tell our listeners something about the standard of truth podcast.

Well my musings from being on social media and being frustrated at being the trajectory that our culture was going and you know being a relatively young to middle-aged wife Homeschooling mom and Bible-believing Christian I just felt as if there needed to be a space for me to share my voice on things going on in the culture.

Things going on, you know socially, but I wanted to do it from a distinctively Christian worldview in a biblical perspective. And so I started to show earlier this year. After getting a nudge from my husband and the Lord has been really really gracious to me in that.

I've a Mac I just crossed 8 ,000 subscribers after launching the show January 1 of 2022 so to God be the glory I'm grateful, you know to have the platform. But it doesn't come without you know, some drawbacks because a lot of the things that I say you you know postmodern culture that we're in and Even a lot of Bible believe I do tend to challenge their worldview and their thought process as we're kind of thinking.

As they happen, you know in the fullness of time things that are going on in the culture. So that's basically the show in a nutshell. We discuss politics theology Culture education entrepreneurship we do we discuss a myriad of issues but we do so from a Christian perspective and I named the show the standard of truth is because I'm Starting from the biblical worldview and if the Bible is not our standard of authority, then what do we have?

Amen, well congratulations also on the launching of and the popularity of The standard of truth podcast and if anybody wants to start listening to that podcast The website is the standard of truth podcast.

Calm very easy to remember the standard of truth podcast. Calm. We have a tradition here. April on iron sharpens iron radio whenever we have a first-time guest. We have that guest give a summary of their salvation testimony that would include the kind of religious atmosphere in which they were raised if any and What kind of providential circumstances are sovereign Lord raised up in their lives?

That drew them to himself and saved them. And I'd love to hear your story.

Salvation Testimony and the Sovereign Grace of God

Absolutely. Well, I like to refer to myself as a church baby meaning every single day of the week. And so all I knew was church and having some sort of reference to God and religious things Was second nature for me.

However, I was I was not a believer. Meaning I affirmed and gave mental assent to the fact that Jesus was the Son of God and that he died on the cross for sin. But I never made the connection between what the implications of that and what that meant for me.

As an individual that was a sinner I have no early memories of ever hearing a clear Gospel message as a child and I know my mother she if she's listening. She's gonna struggle to understand how that could be so but I grew up in a very charismatic.

You know, I called it. It was like a Baptist castle. Because it was a Baptist Church in name. But I remember early on in the 90s I'm in my mid 40s. There was a heavy it just came out of nowhere this huge charismatic influence to where there were all of these Manifestations and new things that I didn't remember seeing as a child.

It was like this new thing that was going on and all I remember is not wanting to have anything to do with it. I was like, this is scary. I don't want people pushing on my head throwing me on the ground.

I don't like this I so I mentally checked out of church, even though I can see. In high school. I found my way in a boarding school away from home in Richmond, Virginia. On scholarship and then I found myself in an Episcopal context.

So now take this, you know girl from the hood at a little Baptist Pentecostal hybrid Church, I don't know what you call that to an Episcopal high school where it's very conservative very. You know book of common prayer and I didn't want to have any parts of that either.

I was like, I don't like this high church stuff. But I still if you had asked me was I a Christian. I would answer in the affirmative absolutely fast forward. I meet my husband we get married and You know you start a family.

Well, you know what good quote-unquote Christian girl has children and you don't take your kids to church. Right, like who does that? So Naturally, I tell my husband. Well, you know, we're parents now.

We got to go to church and He's just like, okay, that's great. So me, you know taking the lead in that area started attending church and my husband Who I honestly believe the Lord was sovereignly working in his life was able to discern like Where do we see any of this stuff happening in the Bible and I was like, oh you're just you didn't grow up in church.

So you just this is how it's done. Like this is This is this is the real deal and he was like, no Don't think this is it like I don't I've never seen any of this in the pages of Scripture, but okay if you say so and Then Facebook comes out 2008 and I'm still on my space Alone because everyone has left my space and they're on Facebook so I joined Facebook and I start connecting with friends from my childhood and college and high school and Then with a guy who was trying to the woman pastor and I was like, oh That's not true.

And Then he tried to convince me that God was sovereign over salvation and that God has elected a people unto himself Before the foundations of the world. I was like, yeah, you're crazy. And so I reached out to a mutual friend this guy that I'm arguing with.

I mean, we're going at it keyboard wars. I'm I'm going in and I reached out to my childhood friend. Like who is this guy? I can't stand him. He's preaching all this false doctrine and stuff and he's like listen.

No what he was saying is biblical. I was like, I don't believe it and so what those arguments did it drew it drove me to the pages of Scripture and One day I read it and now I'm sitting in I can't unsee what I just saw I like this clearly does say like I I don't know much about context, but the Lord Gave me a moment of sentience to where those those words on that piece Just jumped out at me and I was like, you know what I am dead in my sin I've never had any you know when you spin, you know, you know God forgive me, but I never had any sorrow Over my sin.

I lived my life for myself doing what I want put a little sprinkle little Jesus on top every now and again when it was convenient or when I was in trouble or if I Just really felt like you know, I really need some spiritual guidance, but there was no Rooting ground in there was no relationship with God.

My heart was not changed I was literally dead in sin just like Ephesians 2 and I can't tell you the exact day. All I know is when I saw that text and I'm trying to reconcile what this guy on Facebook is telling me Against what I'm reading in Scripture.

I was just like I can't stand this dude. He's what he's saying is correct. So it was just this season in my life where now I'm questioning Everything that I was taught about what it meant to be a Christian what it meant to be saved Who is God who is Jesus?

What is the church and it's just driving me to the scriptures and all I know is I went from hating God and hating church people and not really wanting to have anything to do with them and only doing it as a Religion and then one day all of a sudden I'm loving God.

I'm loving his words I am abandoning every false teaching and false doctrine that I want to tell and the scripture without even Thinking twice about it. Like I wasn't fighting against the scriptures something supernaturally happened to me, which is you know, what John 3 describes as the new birth and my husband noticed the change and It was like everybody was just like, okay, that is not the same girl and That's it.

That's that's just how the Lord drew me to himself He took a Facebook beef with someone that I absolutely just despise Use it for his glory to draw me to the text of Scripture So I could no longer argue and say that these things were not so.

Well, praise God by the way just out of curiosity this person who was annoying the living daylights out of you that you eventually Discovered to be speaking truth. Was it just the truth that you did not yet?

Understand and embrace that was bothering you or was he adding to the truth things that were unnecessarily Offensive to you. Because sometimes we Christians Perhaps even especially caged staged Calvinist which many of us who are reformed at one time When we first discovered the truths of the doctrines of grace, we can behave in a way that is inappropriate.

We can be too much filled with rage and anger of falsehood and use ad hominems too many times. Was was he saying or doing anything? Other than speaking the truth that was adding to the offense.

You know, there was a little probably a little arrogance there, but you know, I I can argue I will I can argue. Like I was like, okay, well, you know you're being a jerk. I can be a jerk too now mind you I was loud and wrong right.

But when you honestly what he was doing he was just Dismantling a lot of deeply held doctrines like, you know, he was talking about, you know. You know male headship, you know women can't be pastors speaking in tongues have to be legitimate languages and I was like wait.

What are you talking about? Like that's not true. You know, he was just core Christian doctrine. Christianity one-on-one things that I should have known. Having been raised and being a church pew, baby like I should have known these things, but I just did it.

I was steeped in a lot of religious. It was Christian ease, you know, but it really it was low on doctrines. I mean, I knew that the Trinity was a thing but I could not articulate that. So we weren't arguing about the Trinity or anything like that.

It was just it was a lot of charismatic false doctrines like, you know being slain in the spirit speaking in tongues. Female creatures tithing that really messed me up when he told me I was like now wait a minute.

You're going too far now. It was Things that were just it was just breaking me down and I couldn't. I was like this is not true. But I know that the Bible teach these things, but I couldn't defend it.

I couldn't. I could not support my position biblically, but those arguments like I said, it drove me to scripture. I don't even he may have posted Ephesians 2. I really can't remember but when I read that all of a sudden that scripture had new meanings to me.

It wasn't the first time I had. Remember, I went to an Episcopal high school and I remember in my modern European history class. We were studying the Reformation and Ironically, I had to argue for the Presbyterian position.

To me. But I just didn't believe it and I think I kind of glossed over it like it says that but I don't think it. But I actually won the debate. But I didn't believe anything that I was debating or arguing for you know.

The affirmative position that I had taken. I was given the I was supposed to be defending John Calvin and Presbyterianism. I didn't believe any of that stuff and I was trying to defend it through the scriptures and it was in high school.

Fast forward to you know late 2000 this is around 2013 or 14 ish and He's telling me these things and I'm like, that's not true. Like I just was fighting my flesh was fighting against the clear teaching of Scripture.

But I'm so grateful for it because the Lord used it super now he used that adversity and that controversy and the Contention to drive me to the scriptures to verify it for myself. And then when I couldn't.

It'll work in my heart. Amen. Was that a Episcopal parochial school a conservative school. Because it's amazing that they would have you do that kind of an exercise where you were told that you had to defend a historic position of Christianity like Calvinism, it's pretty.

Wonderful that they would have you do that.

Even back then it had Liberal leanings, but I wouldn't have called it a staunch conservative school at all. I mean it was very You know prestigious and you know, it was a vigorous process to get in. I got in on scholar I think I was actually I was an actually an affirmative action Enrollee because I was in a special program.

I mean I had to I still had to compete Academically and I had to score well on the test. But it helped that I was highly melanated right that part helped Recruit I was like one of three black girls there.

But it was it's pretty liberal now. I mean it is really liberal now I think they have like their parish priest is a woman who might be a lesbian. Oh, wow. It's heavy on feminism girl power. Yeah, it's very liberal now.

I don't remember being in indoctrinated with those types of messages then but I do remember. Because it's an all-girls school. We were taught a lot of female empowerment You know heavy on them. It's an amazing school and I want to disparage the school.

But I would I would never send my daughters there. No.

Reformed Theology, Church Background, and the Doctrines of Grace

Now when this antagonist that you mentioned earlier was correcting you much to your dismay originally on key issues of Christian life and practice and belief. Was he a theologically reformed Christian?

Is that where you discovered the doctrines of grace?

Yes, I think he would definitely especially back then he would identify And hold to the doctrines of grace now, I Can't say what he's affirming. But it's these kind of gone off the deep end. But back then yes, he would Absolutely identify the Calvinist reformed doctrines of grace and I had never Heard of the term doctrines of grace or anything like that.

I had just had issues with Calvinism because I couldn't reconcile. You know, it's my free will, you know, I couldn't. I just struggled with that. But it wasn't until something happened in my heart that I could say I would not.

Anyone who knows me before Christ would know that you know being this Bible something homeschooling mom. Submissive wife that that's not April. No, no one in a million years. No one even thought that I'd get married and have kids.

You know do great things and have this illustrious career. I never wanted to be married never wanted to have children. And so and then definitely I was I was a feminist Liberal. I was a raised a Democrat.

I I just I had no. Only the Lord does something because it's just not who I was. I wasn't. I wasn't raised males raised a social conservative, but that's the and maybe you know. Yeah, socially in terms of just being a good good person good church girl.

Christian girls. Don't do eggs. I was raised like that, but it's you know, very maternalistic, you know, not a lot of male headship definitely. Nowhere in my upbringing do I ever remember affirming God's sovereignty being you know.

Juxtaposed with man's responsibility and those holding an equal attention. No, not at all.

So I know from our conversations before the program began that eventually you were initially a Member of the church where my old friend of Roger Skeppel is the pastor. I've had Roger on this program quite a while ago.

I'd love to have him back on the program but back in the days when I was broadcasting it up, Long Island, New York on WNYG 1440 a .m. Radio I Had Roger on the program along with all of the contributors to the book Glory Road Which was a book? featuring Black Christians who discovered and embraced the doctrines of Sovereign Grace As we were saying Also off air before the program.

It is tragic that Quite a number of those authors have become woke and I'm hoping that they Regain their sanity and abandon that very dangerous ideology. But what was Rogers congregation the first reformed church that you and your husband attended.

Church Membership, Shepherding, and Finding a Biblically Faithful Congregation

Yes. Interesting because we knew that the churches we were in were not where we were supposed to be. But we didn't have anyone to say hey go here or do this or you know avoid that. So we ended up in a secret friendly Church that you know, we picked it because we're like, okay, what's that this crazy charismatic stuff going on?

So maybe this is where we're supposed to be but didn't take long. The Lord was really working in my heart and in my husband's heart for us to recognize real life. We didn't know what these terms were like seeker sensitive.

We were just like. This is more like a motivational pep rally. We don't think this is biblical Christianity. So we didn't stay there very long. Then we ended up ended up in another church That would probably fall in line.

I would call it like a hybrid of the the stone Campbell Campbellite movement it was the Christian churches. They weren't Church of Christ they were kind of maybe like an offshoot of that and we felt relatively safe there or Little bit until we started to notice that the pastor Seemed to want to Compromise and not really mention the word, you know.

Really because that's not something that's well, at least it used to be. Not a prominent thing among those churches known as the restoration churches. Because I'm very familiar with them. I Have spent a lot of time with both the Christian Church and Church of Christ Ministers and members and they were very at one time.

Anyway, I haven't I haven't been in a congregation From that background in many years, but they were very quick to point out The the the sinfulness of mankind and the necessity to repent. So this is kind of interesting this development that you're telling me.

Undergoing their own reformation, you know. They went from being a very large large congregation here to losing most of their membership to I mean I hate to use the term like white flight. Um, it was just a huge change in the community.

So their congregation they had this big facility, but it was very very small Faithful few that remained and in an effort to kind of attract More people I Noticed and I remember saying something. I was like, listen, that was a great sermon I said, but you should never feel like you can't use the word sin.

I was like you say that word sin say it with me. He was just like. But we stayed there for a little while until I was like, okay this this church is nice. But I was like, I feel like I'm theologically starving.

So we went online and I I cannot remember but I think we found pastor skepticals church and It may have been nine marks at the time and I remember I was like, okay I am tired of this church hopping thing.

So I said I'm gonna do a better job of bedding. So what my husband and I did we sat and we listened to several of his sermons and I was like, wow. Okay, this is the real deal. I said, all right first Sunday the new year.

Can we go here? Robert's like yes, we can go we get there that first sermon devil preaches on the intertestamental period like the 400 years where God is not speaking and I'm sitting there like How do you preach?

Exegetical sermon. On a time period when God's not saying anything and we don't really have a text to appeal to. But it was brilliant the way he masterfully Helped connect the Old Testament to the New Testament and how all of these things God is not speaking.

But he's working and how God literally had to Sovereignly orchestrate so many things such as the Roman Road the crucifixion had to be a thing. You know the the Pharisee the system the synagogue system all of these things had to be developed before the advent of our Savior and When I sat there and heard that man preach that I was like, babe, can we stay here?

I think this I was like, this is it and I remember going up to stepple afterwards and I said now You don't know me. I've been stalking your sermons on her. How did you preach a whole hour sermon on the intertestamental period.

I like there's no text for that. That he just laughed like who is this crazy girl cuz I'm not a shy person. I've never met a stranger. So I'll just walk up to you and I will start the conversation like we grew up together.

So I'm talking to him like this, but he's just sitting there looking at me like this girl is so special. But I think I like her. Okay, and so we kind of talked about it and That was so Berean to answer the question.

I know I went all the way around Brooklyn sick across town. That was our first Convict church that affirmed the doctrines of grace and you know had a Calvinistic Soteriology and the Lord truly grew us there when I tell you pastor Schepel has a true shepherds heart.

He personally shepherded and discipled our family. There wasn't a question that we could not ask a phone call that he ever did not take. Just logistics at this point we were so far away. And I served there Faithfully we were there, but we ended up having to find a new track.

I love my new church. I do I absolutely so I can't even compare them. It's like how do you compare your two favorite desserts, right? You really can't cuz you're like, well, I love them both right, but they just they're different.

But they're they're both amazing. I can still call Schepel right now and say hey, I got a question about this. What are your thoughts and he he will take our calls. It's it's like he is still a true shepherd and we have such a great well praise God.

We have to go to our first break right now. If anybody has a question for April Chapman They'd like to ask. Our email address is Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Please give us your first name at least Your city and state of residence and your country of residence if you live outside of the USA.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter. Let's say you are on a similar or perhaps nearly identical journey that April went through and you're not ready yet to Bring your identity to attention publicly.

You don't want your pastors yet to know where you are theologically. You don't want your family to know whatever the case is and you'd rather remain anonymous. I understand that. But if it's just a general question Please give us your first name at least Your city and state of residence in your country of residence if you live outside of the good old USA.

Don't go away. We're gonna be right back with April Chapman right after these messages from our sponsors.

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