Extreme Calvinists

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Apostle Paul said, but we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.

In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you.

By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her

King. Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth. Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry. Mike Abendroth is your host today, and I haven't really spoken that much today.

I haven't talked that much. You know, sometimes if you don't talk all day, then you almost kind of sound stuffy.

I think that might be me today, but I do have my Pete's coffee here, and so we are ready, locked in.

I'll try not to yawn today. That would be good. I have all kinds of things sitting here on the

No Compromise Radio studio desk, downtown

Burbank studio. I think we've got about 25 to 30 more author discount books.

My new book, The Sovereignty and Supremacy of King Jesus on day one, and you can go to the website, nocompromiseradio .com,

and you can pull it up. $10, which includes shipping. I think if you want to go the Amazon route, it's going to cost you around 15 total.

So I've got about 25 more of those, and when they are gone, they are gone. Gonzo. Bye -bye.

See you later. So on No Compromise Radio today, I think I'm going to continue talking about the stuff that was on Tom Askall's founders blog, which

I found quite fascinating. Remember how to sniff out a Calvinist pastor and then fire him? There's more dubious information.

Now, of course, Askall is a Calvinist, founders movement of the Southern Baptist Convention.

He's involved with that because the founders were more Calvinistic. That is the sovereignty of God and salvation and everything else.

And so he said there's a second document that he found, theological differences between Southern Baptist and extreme

Calvinist. Excuse me. So that seems to me like it makes good radio.

It's good fodder for radio. Now there's the same group in snake handling

Tennessee or wherever they are. Now, see, that's not fair. We probably have listeners in Tennessee.

There are some snake handlers in Tennessee, but not all Tennesseans are snake handlers, right?

We have to use just simple logic. Simple logic. You can get the Isaac Watts book, Logic, and you can go through the different parts of logic.

But I'm sure these people who are attacking extreme Calvinist they wouldn't want any logic because if you have logic, then you must be tied to some system.

Well, here we have a little article, theological differences between traditional

Southern Baptist and extreme Calvinist. I wish he would have said between original Southern Baptist and extreme

Calvinist. Now up here in New England, we don't have many Southern Baptists. And the ones that we do are typically and sadly seeker sensitive and probably would fall into this camp of Arminian.

And so this is an odd duck in New England to have a more reformed Southern Baptist kind of church.

That's usually odd. Here it says Fisher Humphreys put in his book, some of the things were in his book,

God's Love the World, Traditional Baptist and Calvinism. So Askel said, basically you have, this is kind of a redo of what was in this guy's book.

Now, here we have theological differences between the two. And I've just got a list here and I'm not gonna do a two part show this time.

I don't think, but we'll have to see. Number one, concerning the sovereignty of God and predestination.

So really what are the differences? Traditional Southern Baptist and Calvinist agree that God is sovereign.

Okay, so far so good, right? Traditional Baptist hold to the belief that God exercises his sovereignty in which those created in his image.

Remember the spelling and grammar on the last thing wasn't very good. So if you hear me say something poorly when

I'm reading, either A, I'm a bad reader or they've made a mistake here.

Have the God -given gift and capacity to make real spiritual and moral choices.

Man has this freedom because God initially gave it to him. Therefore God takes the initiative in all his acts.

Even in salvation. Well, that's kind of a big hodgepodge. I mean, what are they trying to say?

The Bible certainly teaches and I'm not going to try to stand up for extreme Calvinism. What's extreme Calvinism?

Anyone who's more Calvinistic than you are. Here's what I'm gonna try to stand up for. What does the Bible teach?

Southern Baptist, what do they believe? I really couldn't care less. What does Calvinism teach?

I really couldn't care less. In light of scripture, I do care historically.

I do care practically how it affects, do we associate with churches, this, that or the other.

But in terms of lining it up to scripture, what does the Bible teach about sovereignty of God and predestination and man's will?

Well, here's the thing. We do not believe that we are Roman Catholics with the view of the will.

Our will is not free. When an unbeliever considers his will, his will is tied to his nature and his nature is

Ephesians chapter two, one to three, fallen, dead. Second Timothy chapter two, 24 and following, slaved to do what

Satan's will is. Can you imagine thinking you're free but you do Satan's will? That's real enslavement.

Romans chapter six, you're either a slave to sin or a slave to righteousness. And so we believe that man does have choice.

He has free agency, but his choice is always going to be no to God. His choice is always going to be no to Christ Jesus.

And so because of the fall, Adam's fall, man is still responsible, yet man is unable.

That's why there's a fall. Before the fall, tend the garden, obey God. He had both the ability and the responsibility.

Is there anyone out there who would say Adam couldn't do what God said? No, he could do it. And he had the responsibility.

God told him to do it and therefore as a created being, he had to obey the creator.

But then what happened? Adam fell and as the New England primer would say, in Adam's fall, we sinned all.

There's lots to talk about when it comes to Adam's fall and federal representation and everything else.

But we in Adam certainly sinned and now we still have the responsibility to obey

God, but we no longer have the ability. That's why we need the last Adam. We don't need the second Adam. We need the last

Adam, Jesus Christ. And so when it comes to the will, the will is fallen.

And of course people have free agency and they can make decisions, but they can never make a decision to follow

Christ Jesus. They can never make a decision to repent and believe short of God's initiating sovereign grace.

Who's on first? God causes salvation and we respond with faith and repentance, which are even gifts of God.

Philippians 1, verse 29, Ephesians 2, 8, 9, and 10. In the book of Acts, they believe by grace or through grace.

And so the God -given gift and capacity to make choices has been affected.

The mind has been affected by the fall. The will has been affected by the fall. There's no island of righteousness called the will that was unaffected by the fall.

That is a figment of imagination. Here it says, traditional Baptists believe our sovereign

God has chosen to provide for forgiveness and salvation through Jesus Christ. And it is for all who will accept his offer of grace through repentance and faith.

Well, that's true. Extreme Calvinists believe that God has decreed in advance or decided in advance to save particular people and to damn the non -elect.

We'll see, here we go. Here we go. We do believe that God has decided in advance to save a particular people.

That's because God has one decree. That's because God's sovereign. That's because God's not looking down some corridor of time trying to figure out his plan,

A, B, C, all the way down to Z, if, then, watch out, be careful, circuitous.

God has one plan, Ephesians 1, 11. He has one purpose, Ephesians 3, 11.

Singular decree. You ought to get a book called Sovereignty and Supremacy of King Jesus. There's a whole chapter on the singular decree of God.

And that decree of God started in eternity past with the Father, Son, and the Spirit, covenant of redemption, this pact, this agreement where God the

Father would choose the some, not the all, the son would go save the some, not the all, and the Spirit would generate, regenerate the some, and not the all.

That is an extreme Calvinism. That's Titus 1, where there's a promise made before anybody was created.

So who did God promise this to? His own triune self. That's who. Some extreme

Calvinists translate John 3 .16 as for God so loved the elect that he gave his only begotten son. Well, that might be true.

Some might translate it that way, but I translate it this way. For God loved in this manner, that he gave his only begotten son, that those believing in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

When you try to pull out the word whosoever, theologically, I think it's in there, the

Bible, theologically, whoever calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved, but even there in Romans 10, the focus is not whosoever, meaning that you have the ability of yourself.

That's not the focus. If you think that's the focus of the verse and what it's trying to teach, that you have the ability to choose or not to choose, then you've missed out on this great verse.

Traditional Baptists believe election is God's initiative in salvation. That's true. That's just Calvinism. That's just Pauline.

And God has an eternal plan for mankind. God has always sought the sinner. He sent Jesus to make salvation possible.

Well, no, he sent Jesus to accomplish redemption. There's no possibility. There's no potential.

There's no Jesus did this, you add that. You need to read John Murray's book, Redemption, Accomplished and Applied.

It was accomplished at Calvary. God the Son made propitiation. God reconciled.

That's, it's all language of it was accomplished. Did Jesus accomplish anything at the cross? The answer is most emphatically, yes.

He made, sent Jesus to make the salvation possible and through various spiritual agencies, he calls and draws men to salvation.

Yeah, well, that's true. So that's what extreme Calvinists believe.

That's what Calvinists believe. Here it's to them, Calvinism is extreme if it's five point.

If it actually determines who goes to heaven and God then by his not choosing them, passes over them, or if you want to use double predestination language of first Peter chapter two, verse eight and Proverbs 16, four and Romans chapter nine, well, you can use that as well.

Here we have the second theological difference between traditional Southern Baptist and extreme Calvinist posted by Askell, but he didn't write this because he didn't believe this.

He just was critiquing this and I thought this was pretty amazing. All right, oh, this is interesting.

A belief statement in pastor's pledge. We're just going to change it up here. No compromise radio for a minute.

The next page has a belief statement in pastor's pledge. I find this fascinating. I, and then it's got a long underlying area there.

I don't know if that's because you got super long names in Tennessee, I'm not sure. I, Mike Avendroth, you'd put my name in there if I believe this, state that my theological beliefs and practices are in accord with blank

Baptist church. How about the Bible? But I guess you could do that because I believe in statements of faith too.

I wish to state that I do not hold to a reformed or Calvinistic doctrine and the pastor search committee, how about pastoral search committee, has questioned me comprehensively in this area of concern.

With integrity of heart, I've heard the statements of the pastor search committee and can say with certainty that if my theology ever changes to a

Calvinistic doctrine, I will share with the deacons my new beliefs and work with them and the personnel, misspelled, personnel committee in transitioning me and my family to a new place of ministry that is more in line with my new theological stance, signed by pastor, signed by chair of pastor search committee, personnel signed by chairman of the deacons.

Well, let's smoke out these Calvinist boys. Let's smoke them out. It's interesting that people are worried about this doctrine that extols the supremacy of God and they will make caricatures of what the

Bible teaches for their own good. I think people better consider this before they play fast and loose with the church that Christ has purchased.

And if God wants to magnify his sovereignty in scripture, then we have a choice.

You have a choice on No Compromise Radio. The choice is either to submit or resist.

And the choice is yours every day. And when you read about God doing something in scripture and you say, well,

I don't get God killing all the Canaanites and wipe them out. I don't get this, that or the other.

Well, maybe you don't get it. Maybe as you study it more, you'll understand it better. But your main task is to submit to the word of God and to say, if God has said it, then it must be good.

If God has decreed it, it must be right. And whether you like something or not, the sign of a mature

Christian is beginning to accept what God has said with fewer and fewer reservations.

That is what we call faith. I believe what God has said. I take

God at his word. And that's what you need to do. I know if you've met me and you would say, I don't believe the man,

I don't take him at his word. You can't trust his word. That would not be a good way to get an autograph.

I'm just kidding. You would not endear yourself to me if you constantly questioned my word, or even if you did at one time.

So what about God? How much more? When you think about God and what he said, you accept it.

And Jacob have I loved and Esau I have hated. Why? Well, because to show

God's sovereign hand. And these aren't arbitrary choices. God has a reason for these things.

We just don't know the reason. Can you imagine God saw fit not to tell us. We don't get to know the reason why

God chose some and not others. Short of God should have damned everyone, but chose some to put his love upon.

And that it would be give him more glory. And it would show the elect how great they had it compared to the damned.

Short of some of those kinds of things, we don't get to know. We're not God. See, that's the problem with all this.

It takes away the transcendence of God. And when you read J. Gresham Machen's 1923 book,

Christianity and Liberalism, I'm reading that with a group of guys at church on Sunday mornings before church service.

He talks about this great transcendence of God that needs to be around local churches, not just eminence.

I want God close to me. We celebrate Christmas, the incarnation, God with us. Obviously that is a wonderful, wonderful truth.

Wunderbar. But without the transcendence of God, you are going to have a problem.

You're gonna get into liberalism and social gospel and other things. And so I feel, actually I feel sorry for some of these people.

I don't know what school they went to. They didn't go to Southeastern. They didn't go to Southern. I don't know where they went, but I just wish they would say, the scriptures obviously teach the sovereignty of God.

And instead of playing around with it and trying to figure out how this can fit into our system, why don't you just let it ride and say,

God is great and God is magnificent and God is over us and God is a great God.

And by nature, He is transcendent. And by will, He is eminent. That makes it so much better to me.

Well, back to the theological differences between traditional Southern Baptist and extreme Calvinist. And again, if you just tuned in,

I don't believe this statement. And the statement is to smoke out Calvinistic pastors in Southern Baptist churches.

If you're in New England, there are not many Southern Baptist churches. There are not many churches, unless they're Unitarian Universalists for unity.

I drive by one in Lancaster, Congregational Church, no Unitarian Church right there on the common and come celebrate your faith journey.

Faith journey, I just have a problem. The only celebration there's gonna be is on earth now because that is a denomination,

Andy. Faith journey, that's leading you straight to hell. Celebrate our plunge into Hades.

That is bad. All right, concerning God's knowledge. Traditional Baptist believe in an all -knowing

God, but they're not determinists. What? Who writes these things?

God knows everything, but he just kind of lets things go. God is a micromanager.

God is hands -on. Psalm 103 is sovereignty rules over all. You cannot run from that.

God's sovereignly doing things. God's sovereignly causing sin. How about that?

Acts 2 and Acts 4, sovereignly causing the crucifixion of the innocent son of God.

That's pretty amazing. Causing, making happen, determining.

How do these guys read prophecies when you don't think God determines things?

Well, yes, it's not a Islamic determination because there's the personal hand of God, personal relationship, because they do not believe

God has planned everything that happens. See, there needs to be even a little more nuance.

What does that mean? That's open theology, and once you let go of the sovereignty of God over everything, then you've got to talk nonsensically like this and foolishly.

This is not how we talk. How do you comfort cancer patients? How do you comfort people that have lost loved ones?

With a doctrine like this. Through his eternal foreknowledge, he knows what is going to happen, but he doesn't override man's free will.

Then that makes man God. God's will is bound by man's will.

That is not the God of the Bible. I refute that. I contradict that. I cannot live with that when

I think that people say that God can't do something unless man allows him. That is ridiculous.

The creature is going to say to the creator, sorry, I'm going to trump you. That is irrational and it is unbiblical.

And sadly, folks like this don't even know what foreknowledge means. If you look at the word Yadah in the Old Testament, to know, to personally and intimately know, as men would know their wives in the bedroom.

Here we have the knowledge of close intimacy where God knows us. He knows us ahead of time and sets his love on us and he predestines us.

As simply, if you look at the word foreknowledge in the New Testament, you are not going to find foreknowledge ever associated with what happens in the future.

You will find the word foreknowledge in Romans eight and first Peter. You will find it what? Associated with people, not the events, not what they believe, not what they do, but they themselves.

And so God sets his love on us ahead of time. That's the point. And anyone that knows anything about language and grammar and Hebrew and background will realize that God loves us ahead of time.

That's the point. It's not that he sees what we do and then chooses us. Get that out of your mind. He sees us ahead of time.

He personally sets his love on us ahead of time. Get it, just type in A .W. Pink, foreknowledge of God, attributes of God, Google, and it'll come up for you free, free of charge to read about God's foreknowledge.

And if you were just gonna try to slip me a Mickey of foreknowledge with a English only definition, then when you look up the word love, are you gonna do the same with that?

No, you realize that there are four different Greek words for love, brotherly love, erotic love, self -sacrificial love, family love.

You'll say, oh yeah. And so the same thing, when you look up foreknowledge, you better make sure you don't default to English only.

Same with the word jealousy. Well, jealous, we think of negative connotations when

God is jealous rightfully and righteously. Concerning sin, traditional

Baptists believe we are made in God's image and we have all sin and fall short of God's glory. Mankind is totally depraved due to sin.

Every area of our life has been corrupted by sin. Extreme Calvinists believe in man's total ability to see, hear, and respond to the truth.

Yep, that's right. That's not extreme, that's biblical. They believe that a person has to be regenerated before they even believe.

Well, can the dead believe? They believe a spiritually dead man can't hear or see or respond.

Well, yeah, that's right. I guess I win the argument. Traditional Baptists believe that we were dead in our sins, we are still able to hear, understand, and respond to the gospel by repenting.

So then you get to repent and that's in and of you. So what do you do with repentance as a gift? What do you do with the

Bible when it teaches repentance is a gift? So you have to reach out and accept that gift and now that reaching out and accepting the gift is meritorious.

Friends, this is just nonsense. So read your Bibles, type in C .H. Spurgeon, salvation is from the

Lord. And you'll be really encouraged to know that God is sovereign. God's sovereign over who goes to heaven and who doesn't.

God's sovereign over skin color. God's sovereign over weather. God's sovereign over who the next president is. That is comforting.

That is reassuring. That is thanks stimulating.

We thank God and we give him thanks for all that he's done. God is sovereign.

No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life transforming power of God's word through verse by verse exposition of the sacred text.

Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at six. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston.

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