Ed Shaw, Church Split, Provisionism

Well, greetings. Welcome to the Dwayne line. This is just popped up on my Twitter feed. How many trucks can Trudeau tow if the tow trucks won't tow trucks? How many trucks can Trudeau tow if the tow trucks won't tow trucks?

That's, that's, that's classic. That, um, how many, he's gotten 54 .5 K likes on that, that, that Will Chamberlain is, uh, is who posted that. Congratulations. Very good. Uh, well, well done. I just want him to go to Washington DC.

That's what I want to see. I, I, you know, Trudeau is just such a beta male. Um, I don't even know how to describe him, but, uh, what would, what would Joe do? Don't even, don't even know. I don't even want to, anyway, welcome to the program.

I am safely ensconced in the, uh, woods of East Texas, somewhere out here. Um, and I've made the commitment. I have made the commitment. I made the wrong choice last night. I made a wrong choice last night.

Um, I stepped out of my, uh, my unit here and I looked up and I can't, most of the, most of the sky is obscured with tree branches, but right outside my unit, I could look up, it was clear and there was Orion.

And that means those of you with better eyes than mine, look, if, let's say you're a city dweller. Okay, fine. I, I understand you're a city dweller, but once in a while you get out, right? Once in a while, you get out of the city.

If you find yourself out in a dark, dark place, far away from the city, light pollution today is just unbelievable. Um, and out here, there is, there just is not a major city within 50 miles of any direction.

You get out here in the quiet, I think this will bother some people in the quiet and the darkness on a clear night. If you've got better eyesight than I can, you look at the constellation Orion. Everyone can find Orion.

Um, you see the belt, those three stars that form his belt, you know, and he's got the arrow and he's got his legs and they're sort of bent and stuff like that. Uh, the, what would, I guess would be the back rearward, the back leg, what would be in essence the knee.

Even I, with my eyesight, can see something there. On a real good night, I can see something. Um, that's where the nebula is. And with even, all I carry is this tiny little, it's a four and a half inch scope.

I mean, that's nothing. And that's because it's, I have to keep it light, you know. Uh, if I wanted to carry my big scope, that baby weighs 65, 70 pounds. That's a lot of weight to put in something you're towing for.

Anyway, um, even with my four and a half inch scope, I will see color variations and gradations and that thing. And it is simply one of the most beautiful things in the sky that you can see in the northern hemisphere anyways.

Albireo, the, the dual star, which may not be a dual star. Um, and then Orion's nebula. Just do yourself a favor. Find out what God has hidden in the skies above you and realize there's something honestly pleasing about recognizing that no matter what happens in Ukraine, no matter what happens with COVID, um, that beautiful thing has been up there from creation till now, and will be until the Lord pleases to do something with it.

But it's a, it's, there's a, in fact, go on YouTube and look up Orion flyby. NASA did a thing where they created a flyby video where you, you go through the nebula and that obviously that's fake and no one's been through the nebula.

It's like 1400 light years away. Um, but they took various shots from like, um, because most of what we, you see in published pictures, in magazines, online, stuff like that is not in the visible light spectrum.

It's primarily ultra, ultraviolet, infrared, stuff like that. And the colors have been artificially assigned as well. Um, but they took all of that and glommed it all together and did a bird's eye run through.

It's gorgeous. They also picked beautiful classical music to go with it. They didn't, that's, what else would you use? Anyway, look it up. It's beautiful, but I'm going to tell you something. I've, I've shown people and the park here is pretty quiet.

So I doubt anyone's going to go wandering by, but I've said many times, if you want to do full-time RV park, um, evangelism, you could, you really could, uh, set up a telescope out there and everybody walking the dog is going to come over and want to take a look at Saturn, Jupiter, whatever your focus, you know.

Um, but, uh, I've seen so many people who've seen this stuff in the magazine online, but when they see it through the telescope, oh, it's much smaller. It's much smaller, but it's with your own eye. You look up and you see what you're looking at and you look, changes everything, changes everything.

Um, and, and people just love it. They, they remember that. So do it, that just take my advice and do it. You need to, you need to have that moment. Anyhow, I'm sorry. I, I, I even told somebody else could do this, something where I was top of the hour and I didn't do it.

And I, I apologize for that, but that's what happens when stuff appears on the, on the screen in front of me. And then I start wandering around and breathing cool, fresh air and not hearing, not hearing sirens, not hearing jet planes.

Evidently there aren't any airports around here either. And you know what? I bet my blood pressures, five, 10 points blow what it would be in another situation. I got to admit, this would be a great place to write a book at.

I got it. I got it. I'm going to keep this one in my, in my list. It'd be a great place to write a book at. All right. Sadly we have to leave that, the happy place where I have been to look at a dear friend of mine.

I'm not going to force him into, he's a public figure, so I'm not going to force him into the middle of this until he's, until he wants to be in the middle of it. Well, he is in some ways already, but anyhow, dear friend of mine sent me this clip and I listened to it and he said, what do you think of this?

And I listened to it and I'm like, oh man, I can either sit here and type up a few sentences or I can do this on the dividing line tomorrow and hopefully bless other people at the same time. And he said, that'd be fine.

And, but then I'm like, so who is this? Cause there wasn't anything in what was sent to me that identified who this is. Well, it turned out to be Ed Shaw. And as soon as I saw the name Ed Shaw, I went, I think that this is a guy with living out that Tom Buck specifically focused on about 18 months ago-ish when he was dealing with Sam Albury's relationship to something in the SBC, I thought.

But he is a quote unquote homosexual Christian. And as you will see very much British. And so it's a, it's like a one minute clip. It's not long, but to say, I told you so doesn't mean a whole lot. Because if you remember back when two, three years ago, there was all discussion going on because all these people promoting celibate homosexuality as a gift from God, blah, blah, blah.

We kept saying, it's not going to stop here. It can't stay here. This is a fundamental departure from a recognition that what God's law says is good, is good. And what God's law says is destructive, period.

There's nothing more to it than that. And so just listen. And what's worse is evidently this podcast is for homosexual kids. And this guy is writing for TGC Australia. Now I know TGC Australia isn't TGC US or Canada, but does it have, have we not learned anything yet?

What, what starts out there in those places that are farther to our left, just a matter of time, just a matter of time. So let's, let's listen in and then respond to this. And so actually the first time I was asked this question in quite a direct way, I was on a panel sort of slightly recovering from the question and a friend of mine stepped in and said, why are we so, why are we so afraid of this?

He said, some of my, some of the Christians I most love and admire, and I most want my children to be like are gay and they are godly and like Jesus because they're gay. He's used that to help them become more godly and Christ-like.

And if actually our biggest desire is for our kids to be like Jesus, why are we so troubled about the idea of their sexuality not being normal? Because God seems to take and use really powerful things like sexuality in people to help them become more and more like Jesus.

So, you know, once he said that, I was sort of recovering from the question of what I said as well, but I found that really helpful because I think, yes, actually my sexuality is the thing that God has most used to help me grasp the gospel, to help me grasp my need for the gospel, but also to help me grasp the power of the gospel.

And so, you know, if you rewind back to my child and said, you know, take away the gay, do you want to? I'd probably, I'd be thinking, well, do I want God to take away the thing that has made me more and more like him and help me grasp the gospel more?

And we need to really believe as Christian parents, you know, that Romans 8, 28 verse that God can take and use all things for the good of those that love him, including confusion over sexuality or gender, including long-term same-sex attraction or gender dysphoria.

Now, notice the utilization of language that is used there. I think it's really, really important because the people that are bringing this into the church, they're incredibly intelligent individuals.

They speak very well and they use language very purposefully because, see, you could take what was just said and if you substituted something like something God had brought into someone's life, like being a quadriplegic, having a tremendous physical challenge that obviously forces a person to be completely reliant upon others, upon God.

You're never going to have physically the things that other people have. If you replace that, then much of what was said would make sense because a very wise person once said to me, her husband has a physical issue and her husband had said, why me?

Why do I have to go through this? And her response was, because you will never be more like Jesus than you will be because you're going through this, which is brilliantly insightful. So what they always do is they grab hold of an element of truth.

And that element of truth might be so strong that it results in the normal discernment process to become short-circuited. Because now, if what this person was saying is, I do not identify as a homosexual.

I do not allow myself to be defined in this fashion. I am a Christian. I realize that same-sex attraction is displeasing to my Lord, that the acting out upon these desires is something that Christ died for the forgiveness of amongst his own people.

Such were some of you, as Paul said to the Corinthians. And if the context was there is to be more like Christ is to recognize that the law, even yes, the law of Moses came from his hand. Remember Genesis 18 and 19?

When Yahweh and the two angels come to visit Abram, remember? And the two angels go into Sodom and Gomorrah, and we know what happens there. And Abram in physical and Yahweh in physical manifestations walking with Abram by the Oaks of Mamre.

And that's when Abram's doing the, what if there's 50 righteous people? He knows there's 50 righteous people in Sodom. He's been there 40, and he's doing the negotiation thing. And the two angels, you know what happens, the men surround the house and bring them out that we might know them, yada.

This was not the welcome wagon. These people were not looking to welcome them to the community. This was very, very clear. And when Lot says, do not do this evil thing, they lose it and they start trying to break through the door and the angels strike them all blind.

And the amazing thing is a lot of people miss. Even once they are struck blind, they still try to find the door. I remember that first kidney. It was in writing the same sex controversy. And I wrote the chapter on the Sodom and Gomorrah saga.

And I'm looking at that text and all of a sudden I realize, this is saying even when they were struck blind, they didn't stop and go, what we're doing is obviously wrong because, I mean, at first you'd think you're the only one that was struck blind, right?

But as you start listening to people crying out around you, you would realize we've all been struck blind. And so if there is any rationality left, everybody would go, uh-oh, Lot was right. What we're doing is evil.

We need to repent. No, doesn't happen. They continue trying to find the door. And the, you know how you're in the woods in East Texas? You hear somebody shooting somewhere off about five miles away. It's like going to Georgia, preaching in Georgia after church on Sunday, you go shooting.

That's just sort of how that works. So the angels deliver Lot, his family. And then what happens? Yahweh on earth, the Yahweh who has been meeting with Abram, who came with the two angels, rains fire and brimstone on Sodom and Gomorrah from Yahweh in heaven.

It's not that there are two Yahwehs. You can't have multiple Yahwehs, but there is a pre-incarnate picture of what's going to happen. This is Jesus. Jesus said in John chapter eight, Abram rejoiced. Abram saw my day and rejoiced and was glad.

When did that happen? I think it's Genesis 18 and 19. So the same Jesus who rained fire and brimstone on Sodom and Gomorrah was the same Jesus that gave the law that contains Leviticus 18 and 20 and so many other passages as well.

And so if you're going to be like Jesus, then you are going to love his law. You're going to love the holiness of God, and you're going to hate that, which God says is an abomination in his sight, right?

And so when someone says, this has made me more like Jesus. Well, if what's being said is, I have dedicated myself to fighting this temptation, and I am in no way, shape, or form saying that this is acceptable in God's sight, and it is toevah, it is an abomination, and I have become more like Christ because I honor his law and I honor his holiness, then you could make an argument there.

From what I've read, this guy has said some pretty amazing stuff. So for example, Ed Shaw tells parents on Gay Kids Podcast, this is Reformation Charlotte, not to desire their kids be straight because God uses homosexuality and transgenderism to make them more like Christ.

Now, I didn't hear anything in this one little clip. I didn't listen to the whole thing about transgenderism. You can't even start to go there as a Christian. You can't even begin to go there. And then there was something else.

Yeah, and here is a direct quotation posted by TGC Australia. I want young people to know that Jesus is the one person that they can fully trust with their sexualities, identities, and gender because he is both their creator God and a human who knows what it's like to grapple with asexuality.

Okay, so many wrong things right there. Okay, fully trust with their sexualities. No, if you're a Christian, you recognize Jesus is your creator and he made you male or female. Okay, so the first thing is to trust that he got it right the first time.

Okay, identities, nope, identity is defined by Christ, defined by scripture. And gender, again, same thing, because he is both their creator God, quite true, and a human who knows what it's like to grapple with asexuality.

What? What? He was a human being, but there is nothing that says he grappled with asexuality. This is perversity. And it comes slowly, and it often comes from people who are trying to hold things that are disparate, that can't be brought together.

And that's what's going on here. That is amazing. And then it's also said that he says it's good for families to invite gay married couples over for dinner and expose their children to them. That is perversity.

That is perversity. What children need to see are loving mothers and fathers. There is no such thing as a married couple of two men, two women. We have to stand there. Jesus taught it. It is not loving.

It is not possible to go to that point. Once you've gone there, there's no stopping place. You've jumped off the cliff. There's no place to even hit a rock on the way down. It's done. It's over. So to say it's made me more like Jesus makes me go, you're making Jesus in your own image.

We're not talking about the Jesus of the New Testament. We're not talking about the Jesus who is the one who gives us the law and who honors that law by dying on the cross so that God's holiness is demonstrated, his wrath is fulfilled, his justice is established, and his love and mercy are forever known.

And obviously in our day, that wrath, justice, power, that part, we need to contextualize that. There's a serious problem. So I want to respond to that. Where'd that one go? There it is. I wanted to share some, just a beautiful, encouraging, these brothers obviously just have my best at heart.

Yesterday, I think it was yesterday, it was two days ago, Will Hess of The Church Split. Now I was on their program last year, and it seems to me, honestly, that at least for Will, he may have like a multiple personality thing going on here because he wasn't like this with me.

Not even close. He was quite nice when I was on. But I noticed that he was on with other guys at that particular point in time. About the only other person around here just drove by. It's really not anybody else around.

I mean, there are two units over there, but three. Anyway, but then it becomes quiet again. It's lovely. It's wonderful. But everything's dirt road. There's no pavement here. Anyway, he was quite nice to me.

Maybe it's because the other guys were on or something like that. I don't know. But they did mention that he wasn't reformed, and that's fine. I'm like, okay. But he and David Paulman, David Paulman's popping up everywhere.

He's a busy, busy, busy, very, very, very young man. And so they decided to do a review of The Potter's Freedom, which they wanted to make sure to emphasize, had nothing to do with the fact that David Paulman did a hot take recently where he basically said that myself, my fellow pastor, Jeff Durbin, Saiten Bruggenke, and basically all modern presuppositionalists, are shallow thinkers, not original thinkers.

I didn't really respond to almost any of that. I mean, my motto is, you look at what someone's done in their life. And if what they've done in their life merits giving consideration to their criticism, then fine.

And if not, then why bother? And that was the whole point of a single little comment on Facebook that, if I recall, had two sentences in it, maybe a sentence, maybe it was just a complex sentence, maybe it was only one.

But anyways, two sentences, tiny little thing, that included the graphic completely from David Paulman. He put this, this is from his own Facebook page. Anyway, so they want everybody to know, this has nothing to do with any of that.

It just only happens to be, you know. Now, a couple of things. I'm going to play it. I'm going to share. I need to find Zoom here. I'm going to share it so we can watch it. But there will be a few interesting things.

I'm not going to play a whole bunch of it, just a couple of minutes. But you'll notice they both have the old edition of the book. They don't have the updated edition of the book. And the update's been out for, what, about 10 years?

Something like that. But I'll make a few comments along the way, and then we'll move on to something significantly more important and interesting. But let's, now the question is whether you're going to be able to hear this well.

And I'm trying to remember, what did I do with the sound last time? I'll just sort of watch Rich here, and if he's going, I can't hear it, then we'll figure out something from there. Something along those lines.

Okay. So, let's start with this one. Share. You got it? All right. Here we go. In a nutshell, I made a post a week ago,.

Yesterday. Yeah. Basically saying that I thought that basically Calvinist and precepts, most of their scholars were kind of shallow, or at least a lot of them, a lot of the prominent ones were. And yeah, I just, it was an exhortation for them, you know, don't be taken in by rigor.

That tells... Okay. Rich, you're holding up a microphone. What does that mean? So, we're going to sound up off your mic. So... Yeah. I just, I don't know how else, I don't know how else to do it. Maybe point your mic down a little bit toward the...

Yeah. I don't, I don't know how to fix that or how to route it any other way. So... Let's see what you want to.

Hear. Make sure there's actually sound representation behind it. And it was just a.

Short post. It was like... Okay. Now, let's correct this. The hot take, while it was a short post, did not just say that. It specifically said that Greg Bonson was a, not a particularly original thinker.

And, you know, one of the sad things is, I only saw one person that had the insight to go, theologians should not be original thinkers. They should be clear thinkers. They should be submissive to the Word of God.

But the most dangerous theologians in the world have always been those who decided that they could come up with something that no one had ever come up with before. And that's the danger of, quote unquote, Christian scholarship, is, oh, I'm going to come up with something that I've, no one else has ever come up with, and that's going to how I'm going to prove how bright and brilliant I am.

But then the key to what he said, oh, I'm sorry. Well, very quickly, the key to what he said was, they're only popular because of their rhetorical skills. So Greg Bonson, it wasn't because of the debates he did and the depth of the things, and it was because of rhetorical skills.

Same with me or Jeff Durbin or anything else. So he didn't sort of mention that little part of his attack upon people who have been engaged in, I mean, you put me and Jeff and Greg and the rest of the people he mentioned together in hundreds and hundreds of situations of defending the gospel and things like that.

He didn't sort of mention that part.

One paragraph, it was a hot take. I didn't really think much was going to come of it. But yeah, some people in the Calvinist community didn't like it. Most notably, Dr. James White, who, yeah, more or less, he made a big long post about it.

And did you all see, did you all, did you all see the big long post? You didn't, because they didn't write a big long post. Like I said, it was either a run-on sentence or two sentences with a graphic, and it was a Facebook comment.

How did, how do urban legends get started? I don't know, but that's all I said. And once everything blew up, then I've addressed it here on the program. But this has all happened, like I said, over the past week.

I've been a little busy with lots of other things, some about which you know, and some about which you don't. But I've been sort of busy with other things. How did that become a big long post? It was a single comment.

It was, it was in a, Facebook comments just hardly count for anything. Anyways,.

The gist of it was that because I work at Dillard's and I'm under 25, that, you know, my opinion just can't count for anything. So just so. Okay, so that's not what I said.

That is not what I said. That's a lie. I mean, this kid's making stuff up. I did not say that. I put what he has on his own Facebook page. And I said, why? And I'm, because I'm talking to my fellow, why do we care?

Why did people write all this stuff up about Greg Bonson and everything else? Why do we care? But that's not what I said. The graphic included what he had. There's no editing. It's just here's what, here's how he described himself.

And my point was, he describes himself as an Arminian, as an evidentialist. What do you expect as far as a fair analysis of Greg Bonson's work? But then to say, oh, it's just, it's just all because they're good speakers.

From someone who has zero standing, no standing whatsoever. That's all it was about. And notice how things change. And he's not going to get challenged here, but things change. And he's just like, what?

That was only last week. How can things all of a.

Sudden get changed like this? So people know this review doesn't have anything to do with that controversy. We've been planning this since last year. And this is just when we finally got all of our notes together on it.

And so yeah, it has nothing to do with that. It has nothing to do with hating on James White. But there'll definitely be some sassiness and some spiciness.

I can guarantee that. Well, of course, this is the church split. If there's no spiciness, is there any reason to watch it? You know, that's, no, that's, that's one thing I did want, we did want to make clear.

We were planning this as 2021 folks. Okay. But hey, if y 'all, it makes y 'all come out and check us out. That's cool. Otherwise, David is a long friend of the channel. So we've had him on a couple of times, and you'll probably continue to have good relations with him.

So of course, check out his YouTube channel Faith Because of Reason, because that's also another thing that you got accused of never citing the work in your post. Like you never cited Benson. He never cited any of these people like who?

Ezra Taft Benson, maybe the the prophet of the Mormon Church. I don't who's Benson? Oh, you mean Greg Bonson? Oh, yeah, we did talk about him. But that sort of tells me you will have no idea who we're talking about.

Do you? You have no way of knowing whether what he said was even slightly truthful, which everybody who knows Bonson knows it wasn't. It was an untruthful statement. It was a foolish statement. He should have immediately withdrawn said, man, I was, I was doing something I shouldn't have done that night or something like that.

But Benson? Yeah, Greg Benson, I remember Greg, the great Greg Benson, Gordon Stein debate. This sort of tells me that you've not listened to any of his lectures, read any of his books on any of the broad range of topics that he addressed from eschatology to biblical law to his PhD in in self deception.

And everything in between. Really? Okay.

No, he just has an hour long video citing all these people and talking about the problems.

Within their thinking. So, but that's not my business. Okay, that's just false. I mean, it's just silly. I mean, why even bother doing this? I don't I don't know. I have no earthly idea. I do not believe that Paulman has any meaningful grasp of the breadth of Bonson's material.

I don't. If he does, then what he said was even more culpable than it was. But I happen to know someone on Twitter. And I was he linked to three lectures on eschatology and said he was listening to that.

I was listening to the same three while I was driving to this very place. And Bonson was a great speaker, but that was because he really could organize his thoughts and could bring a great deal of background information to bear that was very, very useful.

And so I go to Bonson U, Apology at Church, was given all of his seminary lectures. There's a massive amount of information out there. And I cannot tell you how many people have told me that they literally learned more from spending hours listening to Bonson than they had going to most of the seminaries that are around today.

And that's the reality. And I just hope the Lord will use this to direct those that he wants to direct it to, to listen to Greg and find out that he was taken from us at a young age. And who knows how much more he could have done had he been given.

I mean, I've lived longer than him. So yeah.

So yeah, that's the thing there. Also, we are, of course, we're going to be getting spicy because we are both ardently not Calvinistic. I'm sure David and I have disagreements theologically somewhere.

But the point is, is that when I'm going to be giving from my perspective, he'll be given from his perspective. And we'll just go from there. Is there anything else you.

Wanted to share, David? Yeah, a couple things. So yeah, I mean, yeah, you gave one of those qualifiers that we are both non Calvinist. And so even if we have some differences, right, like I'm, I'm very much classical Armenian, you're sort of like a Molinist Armenian, even though like, I don't oppose Molinism.

I just, I feel like you might make a little more use of it than I do. And like, that's totally fine. But you know, some of that may come out and how we interpret some of the biblical passages and stuff.

I think I'm a little friendlier to, you know, being okay with using the term total depravity, I think you'll want to shy away from that, you know, and that's okay. Well, we'll give you know, our nuances and our understandings.

The point is, we're two non Calvinists coming together and reviewing this book, which we should also probably talk about a little bit why we picked this book, because this is not the best defensive Calvinism out there.

People who really want to understand Calvinism, not the first book I'm going to point you to. The reason we're reviewing it is because it's so popular out there among people in the Calvinist community.

It's like, it's like the book that's meant to defend it. And so the reason we're going after it is not so much because we think that this is the best that the Calvinists have to offer. At least for my part, it's just because it's so popular, right?

It's like William Lane Craig going after the God delusion, not because it was a great book defending atheism, but because it was a bestseller, right? So that's similar to the mindset that we have here.

We're going after what could be considered low-hanging fruit, just because it might be low-hanging fruit, but it's popular fruit, so.

Low-hanging fruit, I see. I hope eventually they'll mention that. It's of course, defined by the book that it is rebutting, chosen but free by Norman Geisler, but low-hanging fruit. Just keep that one in mind.

When we, when we get around to doing some Radio Free Geneva's and examining the exegesis of this young man, remember it's low-hanging fruit.

That's why it needs to be addressed. I do, I agree with that, and that's exactly why we've talked about, because it's always that and Sproul. Like these are the, those are two, it's always James White's book and that Sproul said this.

Those are the two things. Oddly enough,.

Sproul does the forward in the book. Really? That wasn't R .C. Sproul. That was R .C. Sproul Jr. That's his son. It wasn't R .C., and Will doesn't seem to know the difference between the two of them, which does not shock me or surprise me at all, but that is a little embarrassing.

Which is just funny. So I'm like, of course he does. So yeah, this is, like you said, it's because it's extremely popular in the Calvinist community, and I'm not gonna lie, when I first picked up this book, so I'm not a Calvinist, and I was for a long time going, there's no way I'll probably ever be a Calvinist, but if the textual evidence, if someone could convince me of it, I will be one.

I just feel like there's a lot of issues.

Within it. So when I picked up this book, I was. Okay, I'm gonna leave the rest of that for later on. Sorry, because I really want to get to something a little bit more in depth. But that's the nature of the, so we got low-hanging fruit.

You know, when you haven't done anything, it's real easy to shoot at folks. But it just sort of seems like, well, let's double down on this stuff. Let's not show that we have gone, well, you know, maybe I did overstate.

No, we'll just double down, and there you go. Anyhow, I saw a clip that was posted last night, and I was like, I need to find this. And I'm gonna tell you something. I am so thankful. I try to be thankful for stuff, but I am so thankful.

I am thankful for the transcript function on YouTube, because there's a clip from Leighton Flowers, and as normal, it's two hours and 11 minutes long video. And it's only a short clip. How in the world are you supposed to find it?

I'm not gonna even bother. What you used to have to do is extract the sound, play it at 1 .8, but still, you're wasting nearly an hour's worth of time trying to find something. With that transcript thing, you just pop up the transcript, copy it, stick it in a word processor, find a particular phrase, word that was used in the quote you want, boom, there it was.

That is so... It's hard for us to realize how fast information can now be accessed. In some ways, it's great. In other ways, it's not very good at all. I'll be honest with you. But I found it. And so I grabbed it.

And so I'm going to play you a section from Leighton Flowers here. I just want you to think about this. Okay, ready? Here we go.

And... Ian, you put over here, two plus two is four. I think you were commenting on, that's the truth statement. It's something... We can believe that, right? We can believe two plus two is four. Can we believe Jesus is the son of God who died for our sins?

It's just as true as two plus two is four. It's for some reason, God by nature made us able to acknowledge and believe two plus two is four. But for some reason, our nature is incapable of believing the truth.