Matt Slick Live - Discussion with a Jehovah's Witness

Call me.

I'm telling you.

Call me.

Call me.

Let's get to Justin from Nampa.

Hey Justin.

How are you doing?

I'm doing good.

Good at the cross

versus the cross versus the state.

Steak steak.

Oh, oh, yeah. Yeah.

Uh -huh.

Okay.

Staros can mean a steak or tree.

It's a vertical piece of wood of some sort.

But I've done.

The Romans didn't care.

They would Tell you on a minivan if that's what they found.

I mean, yeah, they could.

Right.

Uh -huh, but the issue issue is.

Like tree.

I mean, yeah.

The question on this is that you're not supposed to generate like stuff like a

heaven and earth.

Why isn't the Christian culture have like process and that kind of like worship and almost you agree?

I mean the Roman Catholics have.

Are you a Jehovah's Witness?

Are you a Jehovah's Witness?

Yes.

Okay.

Okay.

We're not venerating nor worshiping nor bowing down before anything at all.

And I know that the Watchtower will tell you that that's what we're doing.

That's not what we're doing.

I don't even have a cross.

Yeah, and

she's wrong for doing that.

Absolutely.

The Roman Catholic Church is apostates a false church, I'm sorry.

Okay, well.

Let's get back to the first issue though.

It really doesn't matter if he was Crucified on a tree literally a tree that grew or

a single beam or a cross beam.

The issue the issue here at the point of the article is that gee

Thomas said in John 20 25 unless I see in his hands the imprint of the nails and put my

finger to place of the nails.

So hands and nails the implication is that his hands were out wide and not over his head.

Which is what a single stake would imply and the early church fathers not that we make doctrine out of them.

But they universally said but as far as I understand that it was a cross.

So, you know, it's cross is the best the best thing.

Yes, they could have but.

The implication is that it was a cross now.

Let me ask you.

Why are the Jehovah's Witnesses so to speak?

Against the cross.

Yeah, cuz like it's brighter.

You know, I've noticed that the Mormons also don't have the cross.

I've noticed other groups will not allow the cross.

It's hard to understand you.

I'm sorry.

Maybe there's a muffle or something in the phone, but it is a little difficult.

But maybe mouth is too close to the phone, I don't know.

Well if you don't want a cross in your home or a stake.

That's okay, but it doesn't mean.

As the watchtower implies it does not mean that we are bowing down before to worshipping it now.

No offense meant.

But the watchtower and I've read a lot of them.

Very often misrepresents the Christian Protestant position and it does.

Which you know is tantamount to bearing false witness.

And so I'd be concerned that it.

Okay, well you're not listening.

I said it very often.

The watchtower will misrepresent Christian theology.

I'm an expert in Christian theology.

Okay, I've been studying it for a very long time.

And I know what the Bible says and I know certain things.

I've been to Kingdom Halls and I've read watchtower magazines and gone through a lot of it and a lot of times it just misrepresents

and You know, I try never to misrepresent an opposing view.

Sure.

This is a Biblical yes.

No.

No, I'm saying that is because I've seen a lot of things in the Bible,

but they.

The people do up like faith healing.

Yeah, but well, hold on.

Hold on.

You're jumping all over the place.

Oh, I'm trying to stay with the Philippines because you look at some person.

They said they're a Christian.

They should have it.

Theology this is what from the Bible what

you're saying the Bible.

Let me ask you a question.

Do you think that every single detail?

About all kinds of churches has to all be in order in an agreement in order for them to be unified.

Do you understand?

Okay, so then citing these differences is meaningless.

The issue is what does the scripture teach are the main doctrines of Christianity and those main

doctrines are the issue?

And without those main doctrines, we cannot call ourselves Christians.

So if someone said for example that God didn't exist.

Well, you and I both would both agree.

He could not call that person a Christian, right?

Right.

I agree with that.

Okay, so if you went to a Baptist Church or where they baptize adults.

And another and then they baptize them forward and other church baptizes them backwards.

Does that mean that they're in contradiction and no longer Christian?

No.

Those things are what we call adiaphora, the non -essentials.

It's the essentials of the Christian faith that make us Christian.

Inverses immersion.

Well Sprinkler, let me ask you some questions.

Let me ask you.

Do you know why I'll answer that.

You know why Jesus was baptized.

He tells us It was to fulfill all righteousness.

Which means he had to go into the old we have to look at the Old Testament in order to understand what he meant to

Fulfill righteousness that's to fulfill the Old Testament, right?

Okay, if you go to Leviticus chapter 8, Exodus 29 and Numbers 4 you will

see in those chapters that Jesus in the New Testament was a priest

after the order of Melchizedek.

Okay.

So and he entered into the priesthood at some point we find in those Old Testament Chapters that in order for a man to be a priest he had

to be a man.

And he had to be 30 years of age and he had to have oil applied to him.

Which is symbolized of the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit came upon Jesus at his baptism and a verbal blessing had to be given and

the father said my beloved son whom I'm well -pleased and Water was applied to it to

the person the water that was applied was by sprinkling.

That's the Old Testament law.

If Jesus was fulfilling Old Testament law, then Jesus had to be sprinkled.

Now this is something the watchtower is never going to teach you.

But you can go to my website and you can look up why was Jesus baptized.

Go look at the references and you can see.

So is sprinkling biblical?

Absolutely especially when we see the prophecy of Joel talking about the pouring forth of the Holy

Spirit that comes out in Acts 1 and 2 and the pouring forth of the Holy Spirit comes upon people and

then they want to get baptized and The word Greek word baptizo.

He has cognates baptizing.

Baptized things like that.

One of the cognates in Greek is Baptiste Moïse.

Which is trend translated as sprinkling in Hebrews 9 because it's talking about Old Testament sprinklings.

They can do immersion.

Romans 6 4 through 6 implies immersion.

Okay, but I'm just telling you you mentioned sprinkling and one more thing.

Could a man be a priest or could a person be a priest if he was not a man?

Answer is no.

Okay, and if and the Bible says in Hebrews 6 20 and 7 45 It says

that Jesus 6 25 and 7 40 It says that Jesus is our high priest and he lives forever to make

intercession for us.

So he's our high priest according to Hebrews and he intercedes for us.

You with me?

Okay.

Now if Jesus is if he's not a man right now, he can't be our high priest

and in Jehovah's.

In Jehovah's Witness theology, he's not a man right now.

So you cannot biblically have a high priest interceding for you.

That means you'd be in trouble.

I Understand Christian theology.

Well, I would love to have a Jehovah's Witness in here.

Wait, wait, wait, I bring up a point that is critical that is crucial

and you ignore it.

You just jump to holidays.

Um, look.

It says in Hebrews 6 20 that he's a high priest forever.

After the order of Melchizedek, that's what the Bible says and it also says that

Jesus Makes intercession for us.

That's Hebrews 7 25.

Now if he's not a man according to Scripture, he can't be a high priest.

Your theology teaches he's not a man right now.

So the question is how can you have a high priest interceding for you if he's not a man according to Witness

theology.

This would mean that you're still dead in your sins because you don't have an intercessor.

Do you see the significance of this?

And then you say oh we can talk about holidays.

That's true there are.

I just explained to you from Scripture I gave you the references.

You need to go check this out.

I have checked it on that.

Really?

Then how come you didn't know about what I just told you?

You think how do you know you're

not brainwashed?

Because I've studied the anti -literature and I studied the watchtower literature.

So John 14 28 Jesus is not God because he says the Father's greater than I right?

Yes.

Does that mean that he's not God?

Well, wait a minute.

Does it mean he's not God when he says God?

Wait a second.

Wait a second.

Does it mean he's not God when he says the Father's greater than I?

Is that what that means?

Are you married?

Okay, I am.

I am in greater spiritual authority than my wife.

Does it mean she's not a human being?

You're believing what they're telling you to believe.

You're believing what they tell you to believe.

I heard it one time.

Yes.

You taught people, you went to seminary.

I taught.

No, I know it's the same thing.

They were.

To a degree.

No, it's not the person goes and prays and there's an only search actually in

John 1 1 the Greek.

It's there's a part that can't be translated.

It's to be correct.

Tove which is the definite article to be teal.

No, it can.

I know John 1 1.

I've had three years four and a half years of Greek of college and seminary and John 1 1 is not that big a deal.

All right.

I don't go to that with Jehovah's Witnesses.

Okay, there's different ways.

I could show you something that that you won't be able to answer as a Jehovah's Witness if you want.

I Can show you something about Christ.

You cannot respond to.

You want me to tell you what it is?

What's that?

Okay.

There's an Old Testament phrase Call upon the name of Jehovah.

And it has different forms calling upon the name of Jehovah called upon

Jehovah things like that and it's always and only used in a prayer adoration and worship

of Jehovah.

You with me so far.

Okay.

Okay.

You do you know if the Septuagint is?

I'm what the Septuagint it's the Greek translation of the Hebrew Old Testament done by

Jews Around 250 BC.

So the Jews took the Old Testament translated it into Greek.

When they got to the phrases in the Old Testament Call upon the name of

Jehovah. They translated it as Calling or call upon the name of the Lord.

Ha kurios the ha and kurios is Lord.

That's what they did.

This is before this is two centuries before Jesus was born.

Okay.

You with me?

Sure, okay the Greek New Testament Greek.

It actually says in first Corinthians 1 2 talking about the church and all who are everywhere Call

upon the name of the Lord Jesus.

Call upon the name of the Lord Jesus.

Why is that phrase which is used in the Bible only of Almighty God applied to

Jesus.

Can you answer?

I don't know but you know, that's an honest answer.

Is that.

You know, I do study what I believe.

I'm not sure if you really come from that respect.

I believe that you study what the Watchtower tells you to believe because it controls your thinking.

You could say that about the people in your church.

I was.

I was raised in a Methodist Church.

I went to a Baptist Church United Methodist and I say that they're the same way.

They didn't they didn't say the Bible.

Well, the Watchtower says 1981 February 15th.

We all need help to understand the Bible we cannot find the scriptural guidance we need outside the faithful and discreet slave

organization.

And get this now, is it not true that the Trinity?

The Trinity is a false doctrine and it's from the devil right apostate doctrine, right?

Okay.

Well, this is what the Watchtower says in 1908.

1981 August 15th.

From time to time there have arisen from among the ranks of Jehovah's People those who like the original Satan

Have adopted an independent fault -finding attitude.

They say that it's sufficient to read the Bible Exclusively that means no Watchtower.

No awake.

Just read the Bible.

Okay, it is sufficient to read the Bible exclusively either alone or in small groups at home, but

Strangely through such reading such Bible reading they've reverted back to the apostate doctrines that

commentaries by Christendom's clergy We're teaching a hundred years ago.

So the Watchtower is telling us that if you read the Bible by itself You'll end up believing the apostate

doctrines including the Trinity.

Why is it that if you just read the Bible without the Watchtower telling you what to think and believe you end up believing?

The Trinity.

How do you know?

Maybe it's because you're not saved.

Well, you would what you had to do works right to keep yourself saved, right?

Oh, no.

You don't in Watchtower stuff?

Really you don't have to keep commandments and stuff to be saved.

In the Watchtower teaching I'm sorry.

I can understand you say that again.

No, no, I didn't say that.

I said that the Watchtower organization teaches you that you must keep God's commandments in order to be saved.

Yeah.

Yeah, I understand that.

But it says there's four requirements for salvation.

This is February 15th, 1983 to page 12.

Many have found the second requirement more difficult.

It is to obey God's laws.

Yes to conform one's life to the moral requirements.

So let me ask you.

Are you obeying God's laws?

It gives us references at first Corinthians 6 9.

So neither fornicators adulterers adulterers effeminate homosexuals things like that.

And also first Peter 4 3 4 Sensuality lust drunkenness carousing drinking parties and things like that

don't live like that.

So you have to in other words honor God love God and love your neighbor.

You have to do all the things that are right to keep God's commandments because that's what that's just talking about.

The Bible says if you try and be saved by keeping his commandments that you're damned.

I didn't say it wasn't important.

Okay, you don't listen exactly what I say.

You and I mean this, you know, you know, just an observant way.

What you do is you take my words and you misrepresent what I say.

See the Bible tells us for example in Romans 3 20 8 we maintain that a man

is justified apart from the works of the law.

Apart from the works of the law.

Did you know that the works of the law? include loving God and Loving your neighbor.

You're made right before God justified without loving God and without living your neighbor as a Paul the Apostle taught

Romans 3 28.

And also in Galatians 3 10 and James 2 10 if you try and keep yourself right

by keeping the law.

You're under a curse.

You're under a curse because you have to keep all of it.

And if you fail in one point, you're guilty of everything James 2 10 says.

True salvation is this we we believe in God in flesh Jesus Christ Who

did everything we need on the cross and we trust in what he did not what we did.

Because Justin and I'm not insulting you when I say you're just not good enough.

I'm not good enough.

We're both Sure

Christian.

No, I said justification before God is Without the law

being declared legally righteous and saved from his damn damning work.

I Know we're

supposed to do that.

Once you're saved.

This is this is how it works.

This is what the watchtower fails to understand and fails to provide in a proper representation of Christian

theology of biblical theology.

Well, let me let me tell you.

Okay, all false groups teach you have to keep the law to some degree in order to be right with

God and keep yourself saved.

Yes.

Yes, but what we're saying is let me explain this let me back up a little bit.

Okay, what we're saying is this you're a sinner.

All right, I'm not pointing accusing you.

I mean you're just a sinner.

I mean we all are and You've broken the law of God the law of God when it's broken is

sin.

That's first John 3 4.

That's what it says now.

Jesus therefore became one of us and fulfilled the law perfectly first Peter 2 22

and Oh, hold on one sec, okay, and because

he did that When he offered a sacrifice to the father, it was perfect and acceptable.

He fulfilled the law.

He fulfilled everything that was necessary.

And so therefore our justification our Reckoning of righteousness are

righteous because if you've broken the law, then you're not righteous By the law and

Sin is breaking the law of God first John 3 4.

So we need to be made righteous.

We need to be justified before God according to the law so what happens is Jesus

fulfilled the law and when we trust in what Christ did we receive the righteousness?

That's not our own.

That's Philippians 3 9 says that we have a righteousness.

That's not our own.

So how is this righteousness received by faith alone?

That's why Romans 3 28 says we maintain that a man is justified by faith.

Apart from the works of the law if it's apart from the works of the law.

Which means including God loving God loving your neighbor doing good doing this not lying not fornicating not committing

adultery.

Because these are all works of the law.

What he's saying is that our righteousness before God is not by anything we do or don't do but by faith alone in Christ alone.

Who then grants to us his righteousness and because of that and our salvation him living in us.

Then we manifest our salvation and our justification by going out

and living according to what the Word of God says.

Now what always happens and I'm gonna use this word, please don't be offended but in cults what always happens

is.

Okay, what always happens in them though?

Is that a person is told by the organization that what they have to do is believe in

God and Perform good works in order to demonstrate to God and to others that

they're Savable and they have to maintain their position with God by keeping

commandments.

That's a false gospel.

This is why Paul says in Romans 4 5 but to the one who does not work but

believes His faith is reckoned his righteousness.

He says when it does not work.

But believes get the Watchtower says the four requirements of salvation and the second one is more difficult is to

obey God's laws.

So it's saying you got to obey God's laws in order to be saved.

But Paul the Apostle says the one who does not work, but believes his faith is reckoned his righteousness.

Romans 4 5 now is The Watchtower right when it says you have to obey God's laws in order to obtain

salvation.

Where's Paul the Apostle right when he says?

That the one who does not work But believes his faith is reckoned his righteousness does not work versus the

Watchtower saying you must keep the commandments which is work.

So which is correct?

I'm not.

You can't you can't without either contradicting scripture or contradicting the Watchtower

you see the problem see the Watchtower.

I think that a person needs to.

But That's unbiblical.

That's not scriptural.

The Bible says that our believing is the work of God.

Of course you should but they.

Of course he's talking to believers.

Of course, but that's that's not justification.

That's sanctification.

Justification is how do we get right with God and once we're right with them?

Well, we're supposed to not sin.

But you don't understand and I don't mean to be offensive, but you don't understand what the biblical doctrine

of salvation is.

So we have a sinner who's a bad guy and he does bad stuff and he receives

Christ by faith.

Trusts in what God and flesh has done on the cross for the forgiveness of his sins the Holy Spirit then moves in him and He lives

in him.

He's regenerated now.

He walks across the street at that same bad bookstore.

But now he doesn't want to go because of the change in him.

Of course he says he should make a choice like that.

Of course he should but that's not what saves him and it's not what Keeps him saved.

Of course.

Of course you're right.

Exactly that's what we say as Christians.

But what the Watchtower is teaching that in order to obtain that salvation you have to obey God's laws the Bible Clearly teaches to

the contrary.

Come on.

Do you think you can keep the laws of God in order to keep your salvation?

Do you really believe that's possible?

I didn't ask that I said, do you believe that you can keep salvation?

By a by obeying God's laws.

That's the question.

Okay, and that's a third question.

You're not gonna answer.

I.

Well, you know, I don't have any problem with you not answering it, you know.

Like you said before you don't know how to answer a question.

That's okay.

That's honest and I have no problem with that.

But what I'm able to do because I understand biblical theology and Jehovah's Witness theology I'm able to ask you

questions.

You can't answer because I understand them both and I see what the problem is.

Please try.

No, no, no, don't say that.

It's not what I want to hear.

That's another misrepresentation.

I've quoted you scripture.

It's not an issue of what I want to hear the Bible tells us we maintain That a man is

justified by faith apart from the works of the law Romans 3 28, you should read Romans 3

4 5.

You should study Romans 3 4 and not in the Jehovah's Witness Bible Note or not.

Want me to prove it to you?

How much of a difference go to Colossians chapter 1 you got your new world translation in front of you.

Okay, let me do this for you Colossians 1 starting at verse 16 talking

about Jesus.

This is what it says in the New I mean in the excuse me the

new world translation the Jehovah's Witness translation For by him Jesus all other

things were created both in heavens and on earth visible and invisible what are thrones of dominions or Rulers or authorities all other things

have been created and through him and for him before he's before all other things and in him all other things hold together.

The word other is added four times.

In Greek, there's two words for the word other alas and heteros.

Alas is another of the same kind.

Heteros is another of a different kind.

I can read the Greek and believe it or not.

Neither one of those words occurs there in the Greek.

Now Paul the Apostle chose not to put those words in there.

Even though and I've taken Greek is very specific and very precise a very powerful language.

It says actually by him all things were created.

Both in the heavens and the earth visible and invisible the watchtower altered the text in order to make it fit their theology and

to prove It all I got to do is go to Isaiah 44 24.

Where it says this thus says Jehovah your Redeemer and the one who formed you from the womb.

I Jehovah and the maker of all things.

Stretching out the heavens by myself and spreading out the earth all alone.

So Jehovah says he did it by himself all alone.

How is it then if Jesus is not God in flesh according to the watchtower that he's the one who

did the creating?

When God Jehovah says from your perspective, he did it alone.

How's that gonna work?

Are you there?

I'm there.

That's just another.

Okay, that's four.

Can I try for a fifth?

Sure.

Okay, let's try for a fifth one.

Okay, what I'm gonna do is go to Exodus 6.

And I'll just read.

I'm reading a new American Standard.

I'll just put the word Jehovah.

I wish we did this like actually like the new world translation that I wish you put the word Yahweh actually not

Jehovah because it's not really that it's but Yahweh, but nevertheless, this is what God says.

This is Exodus chapter 6 verses 2 and 3.

The text says this is what the verses says.

God spoke further to Moses and said to him I am Jehovah and I

appeared to Abraham Isaac and Jacob as God Almighty.

But by my name Jehovah, I did not make myself known to them.

Now the Bible says God spoke to further to Moses.

It's not an angel because it calls him God.

It says God spoke God is one doing the speaking not an angel.

It's God.

God spoke to Moses said to him I am Jehovah, that's what it says.

You can check it out later.

So God is saying he's he's Jehovah and he says I appeared to Abraham Isaac and Jacob as

God Almighty.

So God says he appeared as God Almighty you with me.

That's what it says.

So God Almighty is the father, right?

You got a problem now.

Because in Jehovah's Witness theology in John 1 18 no man has seen God at any time.

They'll only be gotten one in the bosom of the father.

He's explained him, which is fine.

When Jesus says in John 6 46 not that any man has seen the father.

Except the one who's from God.

He's seen the father.

I agree.

The father's never been seen.

Paul even says in 1st Timothy 6 16 that the father dwells an unapproachable light whom no man has seen.

Nor can see.

We know there's no contradictions in the Bible, but we know was not the father.

Who was seen?

But but we know that the Bible says that what was happening is.

It says that God appeared to Abraham Isaac and Jacob as God Almighty.

So here's the question Who is God Almighty in the Old Testament?

Who's not God the father?

Who were they saying who's God Almighty, but Jesus says was not the father.

Who were they saying God spoke further to Moses and said to him?

I am Jehovah, and I appeared to Abraham Isaac and Jacob as God Almighty.

But Jesus says not that any man's ever seen the father.

So who were they saying in the Old Testament?

Who's God Almighty, but not the father?

Okay?

And you're gonna find that you might try to do something.

I don't absolutely.

Well, we're not talking about all those churches and I tend to agree with you.

There's a lot of them don't do much research.

A lot of people don't but this is we're talking about you.

Alright, but at least I do try to.

Do you have a relationship with Jesus?

Do you have a relationship with Jesus?

Okay.

That's not what we teach.

No way.

That's not what we teach.

No way.

No way.

That's not what Christianity teaches.

That would have been that would have been the United Church of Christ, which is apostate.

Okay.

Within Christian denominations, there are some good ones and there's a lot of bad ones.

Don't judge the whole by the one.

They've.

I speak against the United Church of Christ.

I was just in a chat room with a member of the United Church of Christ just a Week ago.

The guy didn't believe in the Trinity didn't believe in the deity of Christ a resurrection.

Come on.

He's a Church of Christ person a United Church of Christ person.

But let me ask you you see.

There's this interesting word in Greek koinonia.

It means common.

It means fellowship.

It means intimacy.

Okay.

First Corinthians 1 9 God is faithful through whom you're called into fellowship communion intimacy with

Jesus.

So let me ask you do you have a fellowship an intimate communion in relationship with Jesus?

You were commanded to do that first Corinthians 1 9.

Do you have that with Jesus?

Truthfully, that's how I want you to answer it.

Best you can.

No, no, no.

No, no.

No, it's the church.

Isn't it?

Not a church.

Okay, what church you go to?

Church,

okay.

I'm asking you about this.

If you have a relationship with the Son Jesus but the question is if you don't pray to him,

how do you have a relationship with him?

How do you have a relationship with someone you don't talk to?

Well, then you're praying to him but

But you're not supposed to pray to him according to the Watchtower only God is to be.

But I didn't ask that.

I said do you talk to Jesus.

How do you have fellowship with someone you don't talk to?

Do you get in your knees how to speak and talk to Jesus and say Jesus?

I have a problem today.

Could you help me?

You don't do that.

You can't and I know you can't.

But yet as I brought up in first Corinthians 1 5 The church that called upon the name of the

Lord Jesus and call upon the name of the Lord is used in In Psalms 116 4

and he says I called upon the name of the Lord.

Oh Lord.

I beseech you save my life.

It's a prayer.

Who gives a flying Rick what he says?

Why do you keep bringing up all other churches when I keep bringing up Scripture?

I think it's it's a disrespectful and ungodly way to to refer and there's such a youth pastor

needs to be set down and just talk to and told look you need to be more respectful talking about God.

Okay, but that has no bearing on whether or not Christianity is true or false.

What the Watchtower will tell you to do and will try and do is get Examples of things like this within

Christendom and say see this is how Christendom is.

That's not it doesn't represent Christianity.

Right.

I just spent three and a half weeks in in the Philippines and you know.

My back is still hurting because of it and that was a month and a half two months ago.

Well, what about that does that mean.

Christianity is true now because of what I did.

Anymore than this this guy says God farts, whatever it is.

And that's how that means it can't be trusted.

You're not No offense meant but the Watchtower does not teach you how to think critically.

It teaches you how not how not to think critically so that it can get its teachings in your head.

I know how to ask you the questions.

You can't answer.

But if you just adopt Scriptural teaching without relying on the Watchtower, you'll be better off.

Even though the Watchtower has made false prophecies.

You know, it's made false prophecies.

And it claims to be the prophet of God.

It claims to be the prophet of God.

The Watchtower claims to be the prophet of God.

It's made false prophecies.

The Bible says if a prophet makes false prophecies is not of God.

Why do you not believe Scripture?

Why do you believe the Watchtower over the Word of God?

I'll tell you why.

Because it controls your thinking.

February 1952 page 79 and 80 we shouldn't this is a Watchtower.

We should meekly go along with the Lord's theocratic organization and wait for further clarification.

Rather than balk at the first mention of a thought unpalatable us to us Theocratic ones will

appreciate the Lord's visible organization not be so foolish as to put against Jehovah's Channel.

Their own human reasoning and sentiment and personal feelings.

Okay,

if

a group an organization that you're submitting to says you're not allowed to teach anything

contrary to what it tells you.

What do you call that?

What do you call it when a group?

Church.

If you went against the doctrine, it was still so.

Yeah, what they not.

Look, I don't know a particular experience you're talking about.

I'm talking about the Watchtower organization and what it says.

I get that you not pray and say

hey, I think passion's going to depend on

this or the mean or do you just Let your ideas fill up.

That must be right.

I go check.

I check the scriptures a new a new idea.

That's going up.

I pray and I think about it.

Okay.

That's good.

But as far as doctrine goes you're not allowed to think in a manner contrary to what the faithful the screed slave tells you to

believe.

Know you but do you pray to Jesus?

But Jesus says ask me anything in my name and I will do it.

John 14 14 and in first Corinthians 1 2 They prayed to Jesus because they called him their Lord

and their God.

Well, just give me Thomas at that.

I'm just my brain just hiccuped as John 20 20 28.

But the Christian Church Paul the Apostle tells them

that all and everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord Jesus to call upon the name of the Lord is a phrase used in

the Old Testament dealing with prayer worship and adoration of God only yet.

It's applied to Jesus.

Because you're a Jehovah's Witness.

Because you've not got the true God because you've got not got the true Christ and you don't have the true gospel.

Your prayers will not be answered.

You're in a non -christian cult.

Oh, so sincerity is what makes us right with God.

Are you appealing to a good quality in yourself?

Hey, I'm sincere Lord.

So therefore I get to be with you you get to hear me because of my sincerity.

Look at how good I am inside.

Yes, you are.

Look Mormons.

Mormons are sincere.

Mormons are sincere, but they teach that God came from another planet.

He has a goddess wife.

They're sincere doesn't mean that they're right.

Yes, and you and Jehovah's Witness teach that there is no Trinity that Jesus is Michael the Archangel who became a man

died on torture stake died for Adam's sins only and that you have to keep the commandments in order to be saved

and that Jesus did not rise from the dead physically, which he prophesied he would and that

he's just an angel again.

And so he's not a man so you don't have a high priest in heaven who intercedes for you.

You're in a state of damnation as a Watchtower believer.

And I'm not trying to be mean.

But I'm laying things out left and right and I've kept count.

There's six things you have there are critical things.

You've not been able to answer Really?

No, you believe Michael the Archangel.

No in Watchtower theology.

He died for Adam's sins.

I don't have everything memorized.

Okay.

Let's see.

I did have one more question.

No, sure.

Oh, you know what?

I.

Just found a quote Jesus ransom sacrifice did not include Adam.

So, you know, it's been a while my apologies.

I always try and do things accurately, but go ahead.

Is there a biblical reason.

What I'm sorry say again

adultery and abandonment and I would say that abandonment can include.

Physical assault and beating.

If a man is doing that to his wife She has the right to divorce him.

Because it's a form of abandonment.

So what so what.

I was emotionally abandoning my wife back early on in marriage and the counselor said Matt What do you think loves got to do

with being married?

I thought he was an idiot and he said if you're gonna love her as God loves you Then you should do it whether you feel like it or

not because love is sacrificial.

Once he corrected me. I learned how to love my wife biblically and the feelings followed.

When I counsel people I say look if you don't love each other.

So what you're married now act like you're married and trust God and you both become what you're supposed to be and your

love will grow.

If they have been divorced on biblically which would it sounds like then they have sinned against God.

It doesn't mean they can't go to heaven.

It means that they need to trust in Christ and repent of that to the best of their ability and each Circumstance like that needs to be discussed.

Because they're usually particulars.

Well,

I would have to discuss that with them.

If you're in Christ, all your sins are taken care of and wiped away.

He removed the certificate of debt to sin debt at the cross.

That's Colossians 2 14.

It's not removed when you believe it's removed by Jesus on the cross.

That's what the Bible says.

Okay.

Hey, man, we're out of time.

Music's gonna start here any second.

So I'm gonna get going.

Why don't you do some research and call me back?

Okay, sounds good.

All right.

Thanks a lot, Justin.