September 2, 2021 Show with Frank Brito on “How Eschatology Effects Missions & Church Planting (& the Challenges of Both in Brazil)”
September 2, 2021
FRANK BRITO, translator, missionary, church planter & Pastor of Igreja Presbiteriana Reformada de Campo Bom, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil, who will address:
“HOW ESCHATOLOGY EFFECTS MISSIONS & CHURCH PLANTING (& the Challenges of Both in Brazil)”
Transcript
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At the very strong and enthusiastic urging
of my dear friend and one of my favorite guests, Dr. Joseph C. Moorcraft
III, who is pastor of Heritage Presbyterian Church in Cumming, Georgia,
and the urging of his wife, Becky, I have on the program today someone who they
think very highly of, to say the least, and I take Dr. Moorcraft and his wife
Becky's opinions very, very seriously.
Today my guest is Frank Brito.
He is a translator, missionary, church planter, and pastor, and I'm of course going
to have to have him correct my pronunciation of these Portuguese
words here.
Igreja Presbyteriana Reformada de Campo Bom in Rio
Grande do Sul, Brazil.
How did I do with that?
And what does that mean?
It means Reformed Presbyterian Church.
And by the way,.
I forgot to ask you if I was even pronouncing your name correctly.
Is it Brito or Brito?
Well, yes, that's correct.
Brito.
Oh, the second one is the way.
Okay, now that's it.
Yeah, Frank Brito.
That's interesting.
So in Portuguese, they would pronounce that Brito, not Brito,.
As a Spaniard would.
Well, actually, it depends on the...
All right, great.
Well, tell us about your church.
Well, our church is in southern Brazil.
We have been here and we are
part...
Obviously, as a true Calvinist, you would say that God used him as the earthly instrument.
Oh, yes, amen.
It's really God's providence.
And this is a very conservative, I'm assuming, Presbyterian Church, very
confessional.
And would you also share Dr. Morecraft's.
Theonomic and Reconstructionist views?
Oh, yes, that's one of the main reasons I'm there.
It's very conservative.
I understand
you do not yet have a website, but
folks can find out more about.
You on Facebook.
Yes.
And how would they find you on Facebook?
What would they type in?
Well, just type in the name of our church and spell it.
And Campobom is spelled C
-A -M -P -O -B -O -M.
Well, before we launch into the specific subject we are addressing today, how
eschatology affects missions and church planting and the challenges of both in Brazil,
since you are a first -time guest, as we always do on this program, I'd like you to
give us a summary of your salvation testimony, including the kind of religious
atmosphere you were raised in and what kind of providential circumstances our
Sovereign Lord raised up in your life that.
Drew
you to Himself
and
saved
you.
Okay.
We came
back
to
Brazil.
When you
say
our, who are you
referring to?
Okay, I was referring to my family.
You mean your parents and your siblings?
Oh, yeah.
At the time, I had not yet turned 18.
It was just before turning 18.
And it was my mother.
Are you saying New York City?
Yeah, New York City.
Okay.
For some reason, I thought you said France before.
Did I misunderstand something?
Oh, no, not France.
All right.
I don't know how I
got France in my life.
Okay.
Praise God for that.
How did you discover Reformed theology?
Well, the first, when I became a Christian, I came back to Brazil
to read
the Gospel of John.
When
you
say
that was in the
back of your mind,.
Are you talking about just from what you were reading and
hearing read from the text?
Or did you have some kind of experience hearing or reading a Reformed
preacher or theologian before this?
No, up to that point, I had
never heard of an
estimate.
You said
up until the point in your.
Story that obviously non -Reformed people were saying, oh, that's not what's in there.
You're.
Misreading it.
You're isageating this or something.
Yeah, they were telling me that that was the wrong way to understand it.
And I would
accept that.
Understanding
of
the
Portuguese
language,.
Which is the dominant language of both Portugal and Brazil.
Were your parents from Brazil?
Is that.
What gave
you a
heart and
passion
for that
country?
Oh, yes.
In New
York City, which of the five boroughs are you
speaking about?
Well, I lived in Queens.
Okay.
A story of Queens.
Yeah.
And as I remind my friends from Queens and Brooklyn, since I am a
native Long Islander, although I live in Pennsylvania now, Carlisle, Pennsylvania, I am a native Long
Islander, and I always remind my friends from Queens and Brooklyn, you are Long Islanders, too.
You don't cross a bridge to get to Manhattan.
Now we are reaching the point in our discussion where we are addressing the theme today,
how eschatology affects missions and church planting.
And we will continue after that into the challenges of both of those in Brazil, the unique challenges.
But why don't you define eschatology for those of our listeners who are perhaps new
Christians.
They've never heard that term.
Perhaps they're not even Christians at all.
So just define that for.
Us.
Okay.
The word
eschatology,
obviously,
since you are
the one who chose
to speak on this subject,.
You believe this has a powerful effect on both missions and church planting.
And even before we get to that point, we might as well spill the beans.
If our listeners didn't already guess when you said that you've learned much of what you
believe from Dr. Joe Morecraft, and you've described yourself as not only a Presbyterian, but a theonomist and a
Christian Reconstructionist, you are post -millennial, aren't you?
Yes, I am.
And I just thought we might as well spill the beans on that so people wouldn't be distracted by trying to guess
or wondering where you're coming from.
So tell us both in a negative and a positive way
how you think eschatology affects missions and then church planting.
Let's start with the negative, and then you could go on as we continue the discussion.
Into
the
positive
things
and why this
really matters.
All
right.
Are
we
beginning?
Yes.
Well, I can guess a negative way right off the top of my head
that eschatology can affect church
planting, can affect missions, can affect a lot of things, even general
evangelism.
If you have an overly pessimistic eschatology, and that is
coupled with the fact that you believe the church is going to be
rescued off of this sinful planet very soon, and many would
say alive today that are hosting television and radio
programs and writing books on the end times or the last days, many of them, if
not the vast majority of them, and perhaps even all of them, who are
more towards a bent of dispensationalism and also
very pessimistic about their eschatology, they would say that Christ's return for the
church, at least, the rapture, as they would refer to it, the
secret rapture, that's going to happen within our lifetime.
So, if you think that Christ is with certainty
going to be coming to rescue the church off of this planet any day, and
it could be within this year,
but it's certainly going to be soon, you may be not
focused on other parts of the mission of the church that is our
duty to fulfill here on this planet.
If you think it's going to be a waste of time because we're going to be raptured away very, very,
very soon, that's going to have a negative impact on being salt and light in the world,
is it not?
If the person who believes that is logically consistent on those beliefs, there are
many dispensationalists that don't behave that way, but I think it's because of the fact that,
thankfully, they're not logically consistent.
But anyway, go ahead.
Well, yes, you think
you
have, as
a part of
that whole
concept,
what
other things
are
being.
Hindered or harmed in the life and duty of
Christians individually in the church as a whole.
By having
an
overly
pessimistic
eschatology?
I
think
we have
the
power
to
do it,
but as a church,.
Positive ways, does eschatology affect the life of
Christian individuals in the church?
Well,
there are many
positive
ways.
We can begin
talking
about great -grandchildren.
Let's pick up right where you left off there.
We have to go to our first break right now.
If anybody has a question of your own on eschatology, on the
end times, on the last things, the last days, and how our
understanding of those things affects missions and church planting, and also how
they involve the unique challenges in Brazil in
both missions and church planting, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.
Chrisarnson at gmail .com.
Give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence.
If you live outside the USA, please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and
private matter, and I understand that there may be some in the audience who are
thinking through some of these things that we are addressing, and you are in a church, for instance,
that is vehemently anti -post -millennial or even amillennial for that matter,
and you really don't want to identify yourself at this point anyway.
Well, I understand those things.
You might even be a pastor going through these same challenges in your
thinking, and you don't want to identify yourself because even your fellow elders may
disagree with you or your denomination.
Whatever the case may be, we understand in circumstances like that you would want to remain anonymous,
but if it's just a general question on eschatology, on missions,
on church planting, on Brazil, on the scriptures, if it's just a general question,
please give us at least your first name, your city and state, and country of residence.
Don't go away.
We'll be right back with Frank Brito right after these.
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Frank Brito, who is a translator, missionary, church planter and pastor in Brazil.
Today we are discussing, if you just tuned us in, how eschatology affects missions and church planting
and the challenges of both in Brazil.
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One of the other things that I have known and I have heard from
missionaries, especially missionaries who were formerly a
part of a non -reformed denomination who sent them out.
Those with overly pessimistic eschatology and, on top of that,
those outside of a reformed understanding of God's sovereignty
over all things, including salvation, they tend to, these mission boards and these denominations, tend to be
very impatient with missionaries they send out.
And if they do not see numeric growth rather quickly, they will very often
yank them off of that mission field.
Do you believe that what you are talking about today is one of those positive
things, actually it's both when you think about it, because on one side it's a positive thing if you have an
optimistic eschatology in regard to missions because you're going to be more patient.
You're going to say, I might not even be used of God within my own
lifetime to bring about enormous growth in a particular area, but
I know that those from out of every tribe, tongue, and people, and nation are going to come to
Christ, and therefore the seeds that I am planting here in this foreign
land, I believe that they are going to bear fruit, even if it's not while I'm alive.
Whereas the negative effect concerning the one
who is overly pessimistic in his eschatology, they're going to be not only impatient themselves, but those who
sent them are going to be impatient typically and say, okay, that's enough, get out.
They're not looking at the big picture because they think everything's going to be over
very, very soon, especially in regard to the church's work on this
planet.
So have I made sense so far?
Oh yes, totally.
All right, let's get into right now specifically Brazil and the
unique challenges that you have faced in regard to missions and church planning.
And the challenges?
Yeah, the dominant religions of the culture that might oppose what you are
teaching, you know, a lot of things that are going on there.
Yeah,
well
Brazil,
that
with...
Well, if you could, because this word is used a lot,
probably especially amongst Reformed Christians, but not exclusively, please
define worldview.
What does that exactly mean?
Okay, in simple terms, a worldview that
you...
A contrasting theology and a contrasting worldview.
From, let's just take the dominant religion where you are, Roman Catholicism,
what would be the dominant problems with a Roman Catholic worldview that would conflict
with what you're saying?
Well, one of the chief characteristics...
You're
going to
become Christian,
you know, things like
that, even
the church and that...
Yeah, one might be able to compare
socialism in a political way with Roman Catholicism in a religious way because
both...
Yeah.
Both entities basically say, trust us, we
will take care of everything for you.
Yes, we're the specialists.
Yes, Roman Catholicism did not even encourage
private scripture or study until the 60s after Vatican II,
and then that gave birth to all different kinds of movements, the Charismatic Catholic Movement and so on.
And by the way, there are people out there who think that
Charismatic Catholics are somehow closer to the truth
than the traditional mainline Catholics and perhaps more Protestant.
I have found that not to be the case at all.
In fact, Charismatic Catholics...
Oh, I don't agree with that either.
Yeah, very often Charismatic Catholics tend to be more involved in Marian
devotion and things like that.
But having said that, and I'm not broad -brushing,
there are people who are Roman Catholic who have intense personal
Bible studies in their lives that are devoted to
reading and studying the scriptures.
So I'm not saying that this applies to everybody, but you will
know if you are a Catholic long enough that those that dominate
the population of Catholicism, they leave that up to the priests.
They really don't delve into the scriptures.
In fact, honest Roman Catholic apologists have actually
mildly rebuked their own audiences over this fact, especially if they happen to
be Catholics that were formerly Protestant.
But I have to go to our midway break right now.
If you have a question of your own that you'd like to ask Frank Brito
about how eschatology affects church
missions and church planting, and also we'll be getting more involved in some of the unique challenges in
Brazil, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.
Please be patient with us as this is the longer than normal break in the middle of the show.
Use this time wisely by writing down as much of the information as you
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Getting a driver's license, running a cash register, flipping burgers, passing sixth grade.
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Greetings in the.
Matchless name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
My name is Bhanu Gadi.
I'm a pharmacist in New York, which is the epicenter of the latest crisis the world is going
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In Psalm 139 verse 14, the psalmist offers praise to the Lord like this, I praise you because I'm
fearfully and wonderfully made and wondrous are your works that my soul knows very well.
He saw God's goodness and mercy, kindness and the beauty in what God has
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In any crisis or problem, brothers and sisters, our only fallback position is to trust God's
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And once we do, there is nothing for us to do but to erupt in praise to him.
When the whole world is searching for a solution, God in his infinite mercy has given us what we need to
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Knowing that design, how can we not add up in praise to our great God like the psalmist did?
May God bless you and give all of us wisdom.
To see greater
things
in his design.
Thank you.
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Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said,.
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He who never quotes will never be quoted.
He will not use the thoughts of other men's brains proves he has no brains of his own.
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Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.
And always remember folks that solid -ground -books .com is
one of the most very important advertisers on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio
and without their continued financial support through their advertising campaigns we would likely not
continue to exist, barring a miracle from God financially of course.
So please go to solid -ground -books .com frequently and
purchase generously and always mention that you heard about them from Chris Arnzen on Iron
Sharpens Iron Radio.
And remember folks you're not only going to be doing solid -ground -books .com a favor
by purchasing books from them and you're not only going to be doing us a favor by keeping one of our most important
advertisers happy, you're going to be doing yourself and anyone for whom you are purchasing gifts
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already, has become a post -millennialist.
But go to solid -ground -books .com, solid -ground
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-edification.
Before I return to our discussion today with Frank Brito who is a
translator, a missionary, a church planter, and a
pastor in Brazil and our discussion is on how eschatology affects missions and church
planting.
Before I return to that discussion, I just have a couple of important announcements to make.
If you are a man in ministry leadership, I ask of you please to
do whatever you can to rearrange your schedule in order to be in Carlisle, Pennsylvania on Monday,
September 27th, 11 a .m. to 2 p .m. at the Bongiorno Conference Center in
Carlisle.
I am having my next Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Pastors Luncheon there at the Bongiorno Center
and it is going to be, I am anticipating, one of the best
luncheons that we've ever had because my favorite preacher on the planet Earth,
and I'm not exaggerating, Dr. Conrad M. Bayway, who is pastor of
Kabwata Baptist Church of Lusaka, Zambia, Africa, he is going to be my guest speaker
at the next Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Pastors Luncheon.
So not only are you going to be fed for free and hear Dr. M. Bayway for free,
you're also going to be leaving there with a heavy sack of brand new free books
personally selected by me that have been donated by major Christian
publishers all over the United States and the United Kingdom.
So I really hope that you can be there Monday, September 27th,
11 a .m. to 2 p .m. at the Bongiorno Conference Center in Carlisle,
Pennsylvania.
For more details, please send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail
.com, chrisarnson at gmail .com, and put Pastors Luncheon in the subject
line.
I hope to see you there.
Also, folks, continue to pray for my sister -in -law Jan,
the widow of my late brother John, who just passed away and entered into
eternity with Christ several weeks ago.
Jan is in the hospital battling COVID and
pneumonia, and she has been in the hospital for quite a number of
weeks, and apparently the doctors believe she's going to be remaining there for a number of
weeks at least, maybe months, maybe longer.
Please pray for her, pray for her physically and spiritually.
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We really do need your advertising dollars as well to remain on the air.
We are facing some very serious financial struggles largely because
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So please help us.
Remember folks, having said all that, I don't want anybody siphoning money away from their regular
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Please never do that.
I have said this many times, but I think it bears repeating.
One of the main reasons I founded Iron Sharpens Iron Radio was to be
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Those two things are commands of God and scripture providing for church and family.
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Also, if you are not a member of a local Bible -believing church that's biblically faithful,
theologically sound, doctrinally solid, I have lists,
extensive lists, spanning the globe of biblically faithful churches, and I may be able
to help you find a church in the world where you live.
I have helped many people in our audience in all parts of the world find churches, sometimes even within a few minutes of their
houses, that they didn't even know existed or they didn't know that the churches that they passed by every day were theologically
sound.
So, no matter where you live, and that includes Brazil now,
send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com, and put I need a church in the subject line.
That's also the email address where you could send in questions to our guest today, Frank Brito,
who is a translator, a missionary, a church planter, and pastor in Brazil,
and we are talking about how eschatology affects missions and church planting.
Our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com, c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com,
and send in your question, and give us at least your first name, your city and
state, and country of residence.
Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.
And we have an anonymous questioner who is remaining
anonymous because his family is Roman Catholic.
He doesn't want to offend them right at this point, but he
is saying, in regards to the Catholicism that you are surrounded by in
Brazil, is it different in any meaningful way from the Catholicism
you experienced in New York?
I know that sometimes when people go abroad, especially in Latin American countries,
they find a striking difference in the level of idolatry that takes place
and the level of ferocious attachment to Roman Catholicism that exists,
whereas here in the United States, there are probably a
predominant number of Catholics that are more nominal, and perhaps have even been
Protestantized, and not so often in good ways.
I'm speaking more to the effect of blending in with modern wishy -washy evangelicalism.
But if you could, tell us what your own experiences are in Brazil.
In
regards
to
Catholicism.
Okay,
that's
a
good...
Having said
all
that
you
said
about
the
church,.
The Roman Catholic church, that is, having less they need in their minds
to capitulate to the whims of the non -Roman Catholic
surroundings that they have, how, if at all,
do Roman Catholic priests and bishops and any in authority
publicly address the adopting of
Roman Catholics in Brazil of the pagan
culture?
Now, obviously, we as Protestants believe that much that is intrinsically
a part of Roman Catholicism is already pagan, but as far
as the African animism and idolatry and the
specific things that have their origins outside of Catholicism, that
have been incorporated to the piety and devotion and worship of Roman Catholics in Brazil,
how is the church standing.
Against that, if at all?
Well, I think that's that capitulation.
That's actually how they would
be
something
that
the...
B .B. in
Cumberland
County,
Pennsylvania,
and B
.B. says,
how do
you
respond.
To the opponents of post -millennialism who say that it is a
product of 19th century liberalism that
taught that things would just keep getting better and better and better, much in the
same line as Darwinian evolution, that things just progressively improve,
and therefore post -millennialism is just a part of that false liberal concept?
Okay,
that's
a
good question,
and I would
say
that...
And
it
is
interesting,
I'm
no
historian,.
But from my cursory knowledge of history, during the rise
of the biblical critics, the textual critics and
leftism coming out of Germany, especially, and beginning to pour into the United
States and England, there was a decline in post -millennialism.
That's when...
Yeah, I mean, the 19th century is the era in which dispensationalism was
born.
Pre -tribulationalism did not even exist before the 19th century.
Pre -millennialism did, but it
was not a dominant eschatology throughout the prior
18 centuries, and so therefore
it can't be a product of 19th century liberalism, because
that's when.
Post -millennialism nearly disappeared.
Yeah, I would say that post -millennialism...
John and Bangor Maine, who says, some enemies of post
-millennialism accuse post -millennialists of being far too
involved in ecumenism with Roman Catholics and those of other religions
who are trying to change the culture for the better in
regards to things like the holocaust of abortion and same
-sex marriage and other things that all Christians who love the Lord and his word should
vehemently and adamantly oppose, but the problem comes
when we link arms with those who reject the gospel and Christianize them merely because they
agree on the social and moral aspects of the fight being fought.
Would you agree that post -millennialists far too often do link arms with those
who reject the gospel in order to.
Rescue and transform the world?
Well, I think that there may be, and
I think
it is,.
Stern Suffolk County says that I have heard those who reject post
-millennialism accuse it of works righteousness in
that the world will be Christianized through human effort.
How is
one
to respond to
such
accusations?
Well,
that
accusation
means that I
did God...
To our final break, if you have a question, send it in immediately because we're rapidly running out of time.
ChrisArnzen at gmail .com, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.
Give us the first name, at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live outside the USA.
Don't go away, we're going to be right back with Frank Brito right after.
These messages.
Hi,
I'm Phil Johnson, host and executive director of Grace to You, the media.
Ministry of John MacArthur.
I hope you plan to join me and Chris Arnzen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, for the G3
Conference in Atlanta, Georgia, Thursday, September 30th through Saturday, October 2nd.
The theme this year is Christ is supreme over all.
My friend Chris Arnzen and I will be joined by several of our other friends, including Fody Valcum, Justin
Peters, Daryl Bernard Harrison, Virgil Walker, and James White.
More than 20 other speakers will be joining us, and the lineup this year includes my pastor, John MacArthur.
For details, visit g3conference .com.
That's g3conference .com.
Chris Arnzen and I hope to see you September 30th through October 2nd.
At G3 2021.
This is Phil Johnson reminding you that Christ is supreme over all.
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If you love Iron Sharpens Iron.
Radio, one of the best ways you can help keep the show on the air is by supporting our advertisers.
One such faithful advertiser who really believes in what Chris Hansen is doing is
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Hello my name is Anthony Uvino and I'm one of the pastors at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Quorum, New York
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I want you to know that if you enjoy listening to the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio show like I do, you can now find it on
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Well, before we run out of time, I want to have priority in
your summation of what you think is most important about this topic before I take any more
listener questions.
So let us know what you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners today before we run out of time today.
Well, Matthew 28, his apostles...
By the way, just a word.
One of our previous questioners was asking how
to counteract or respond to the
accusations that the post -millennialism
involves works righteousness because they claim that through human effort
the world will be converted and Christianized.
Well, the thing that's somewhat ironic about that accusation is that the vast majority of
post -millennialists are Reformed, and Reformed Christians don't even
believe that their own will, the will that
exists in the heart and mind of a unregenerate,
lost individual who has a heart of stone, we don't even believe that is involved
in our salvation, let alone the salvation of others.
So it's actually somewhat comical that Reformed people could be accused of
believing in works righteousness.
I've even heard some anti -Calvinists say that about
perseverance in the saints, the fact that we believe that persevering is a
sign of someone truly being of the elect and truly being justified,
that persevering involves some kind of works righteousness, which is ridiculous because we believe
that it is God that is preserving us.
God himself is the one preserving us.
So, you know, these are easily refuted accusations, especially
when you're talking...
Go ahead.
And by the way, folks, you might
hear me, you're listening to the show today,.
You might think that I am also a post -millennialist.
I have not yet been convicted or convinced of that position.
I am not anti -post -millennial.
Many of my guests are post -millennial, and I love post -millennialist
preachers, teachers, theologians, scholars, and authors.
I would consider myself an optimistic amillennialist, but I am also open to the fact that I might
one day become a post -millennialist.
I just wanted to throw that out there because some people think that I'm always identically in
agreement with my guests because I'm affirming so much of what they are saying.
We have Grady in Asheboro, North Carolina, who happens to be a
very faithful supporter and listener of this program.
Greetings, brothers.
Are the biblical Christians persecuted by their families and friends?
I'm assuming he means in Brazil, and I'm not really sure what level of
persecution he's speaking about.
And then he asked the second question, how big of a problem was slavery in Brazil?
So let's start with the persecution.
First of all, what kind of persecution of believers exists in Brazil, and is this
happening by the born -again.
Believers'
own
family
and
friends?
He was asking about the history of Brazil in regard to slavery.
How big of a problem was slavery?
It was much, much, much a bigger problem than it was in the United
States.
It was a country in the
New World.
What
is the
ethnic
diversity.
Like in Brazil?
Obviously, it's considered a part of the Latin American countries, but
are there a large number of African descendants, Caucasians, etc.?
What is the diversity like?
It all depends on what
part of the
country.
I believe the boys from Brazil are definitely.
From German descent.
I'm only kidding.
That's a movie that I won't go into right now.
But we are actually out of time right now, and I want to make sure that you provide any contact
information that our listeners can use to get in touch with you if they care to.
Well, if they enter...
Specific website that Frank Britta was speaking about is
heritagepresbyterianchurch .com.
Heritagepresbyterianchurch .com.
Mona, thank you so much, Frank, for being an excellent guest today.
I want to thank everybody who listened.
I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior than you are a
sinner.