How Marxism Invaded the Church: Trevor Loudon Explains

Conversations That Matter

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

00:02

Welcome to the conversations that matter podcast. My name is John Harris, and I'm honored to have with me today,

00:08

Trevor Loudon. Trevor, thank you so much for joining me on this episode. Look, I look pleased,

00:15

John. It's great to catch up. Now, Trevor's become a friend of mine over the past few months.

00:21

He has been featured on Glenn Beck and all sorts of conservative talk shows.

00:27

Trevor, you write a lot. I just saw an article that you sent me that you wrote in the Epoch Times, which was fantastic on critical race theory.

00:34

I know you're an author, you're a filmmaker. Where can people go to find out more about you or purchase your books?

00:41

Look, go to trevorloudon .com, which is my daily blog, or go to Amazon and look at Enemies Within.

00:50

And that's our movie that was done in 2016. And it looks at the heavy

00:56

Marxist and Islamist penetration of the U .S. Congress and Senate.

01:02

So we say there's about 100 members of the U .S. House that couldn't pass a background check.

01:07

They're so involved in Marxist or Islamist groups. And our new project, which will follow on from that, is

01:15

Enemies Within the Church. And people can just go online and look at enemieswithinthechurch .com,

01:23

see a trailer, see what we're trying to do. Because if the Enemies Within politics was scary,

01:29

Enemies Within the Church is even worse. These people have penetrated the churches so badly that it's going to have major impacts in this country for years to come.

01:42

Trevor, you're one of the people that has helped me understand a little better. I thought

01:47

I understood it, but you've just clarified some things for me that I was a little bit confused about when

01:55

I was sitting in seminary and hearing some of the things that I was hearing. I thought, man, why are they taking this leftward turn?

02:00

Before MLK50 happened, I even said, this sounds like Marxism. I remember to a student friend of mine,

02:06

I said, this is Marxism because it's exactly what I got in my secular education. But you seem to have just a full picture on it.

02:15

And I know some of the resources, one of the things that I know that I think either you or Judd has sent to me is this

02:21

Kiwiki website. Kiwiki, I think it's dot com. Dot org actually.

02:28

Dot org. Kiwiki .org. K -E -Y -W -I -K -I .org.

02:34

And it works, it's like a Wikipedia of the American left, both the secular left and the religious left.

02:43

Yeah. So I started plugging in some names on that website of authors that were displayed on the library shelf at the seminary.

02:50

I went to things like that. And lo and behold, people were coming up as communists, as connected with communist groups.

02:58

And I was just like, oh man, this is happening at an evangelical institution. They're marketing this.

03:04

So the times are very serious right now. And I'm hoping you can help everyone as you've helped me explain what in the world is going on.

03:14

Why is the church that I go to or the institution, seminary, whatever, why does it look different than it did even 10 years ago?

03:23

Why can't we just get back to normal Christianity? So if you would, can we start at the beginning?

03:30

Where did the Marxist infiltration start in the United States from the beginning?

03:37

Well, probably the earliest infiltration was after there was an attempted communist revolution, a

03:47

Marxist revolution in Germany in 1848. Now that failed and the authorities cracked down on the revolutionaries.

03:55

So where did they flee to? Thousands of them actually fled to the United States, particularly the

04:02

Midwest, Milwaukee, Chicago, that sort of area. And they helped to establish the

04:10

Republican Party, believe it or not, in Wisconsin. Many of them became generals in Lincoln's army.

04:19

And many of them stayed in Chicago where the Communist Party was formed in 1919.

04:26

So there's been a Marxist current in the American Midwest and New York, which came with later immigrants in the 1880s fleeing

04:37

Russian pogroms, etc. There's been a huge Marxist influence in the

04:42

American Midwest for a century and a half now. But with the foundation of the

04:49

Communist Party USA in 1919, it obviously stepped up a notch.

04:55

But the very first communist front in America was set up just before the

05:02

Bolshevik Revolution. It was called the Methodist Committee for Social Action, set up by Harry Ward from Union Theological Seminary.

05:11

And it was designed to bring communist ideas into American Protestantism.

05:19

And so the Marxists decided very early on that though they hated religion, it was a lot better to use religion to spread

05:30

Marxism than it was to directly come up against it. They understood that to have a world revolution,

05:37

America would have to be part of that. And the heart of America is

05:44

Christianity. So if you're going to turn Americans towards Marxism, the

05:49

Christian churches would have to be a major target. So right from the early 20s, there was huge infiltration of the

05:58

Christian churches, the Protestant churches in America. It started in the 30s with the infiltration of Catholic churches.

06:08

Bella Dodd, who was a Communist Party member, returned to the Catholic faith, talked extensively before government committees in the 1930s, about the 40s, how she had helped to infiltrate hundreds of young communists into the

06:27

Catholic priesthood. And that's culminated now where you have a Marxist Pope and Pope Francis.

06:35

But the one area that remained pure, the one area that was the branch of American Christianity that remained pure for a long time, was the evangelical movement.

06:49

Now if you're a Marxist revolutionary, and you saw these conservative evangelicals doing crazy things like electing

06:58

President Ronald Reagan and Donald Trump, wouldn't you want to do something about that?

07:06

Wouldn't you want to get inside the evangelical movement to shift that left?

07:12

Because if you knew if you could do that, the whole American culture would shift left, and American politics would shift left.

07:21

And that is exactly what has been happening in the evangelical churches in the last 10 years especially, and it's gone on steroids basically since the election of President Trump.

07:34

The left are going full on to turn the evangelical churches left.

07:41

Wow, that's all I can say. There was a recent article I know that came out about a

07:47

Justice Democrat founder, and I didn't really even know about this group.

07:52

I knew there's so many leftist groups you can't keep them all straight, but that this Justice Democrat founder I guess had a blog where he was explaining exactly what you just said.

08:01

We need to infiltrate the evangelical institutions. There's a social justice movement going on there. Let's encourage it.

08:07

Let's use this. Let's neutralize their vote or swing it to be Democrat. And it's frankly scary because this is a political movement, and obviously there's theological ramifications because it comes from a false religion, which

08:21

Marxism I think probably is. But it's in the church, and it's kind of like a virus that has sucked the soul out of true

08:30

Christianity, the core doctrines of the faith. I mean to give one really quick example,

08:35

I know there's a book that was, I covered this on the display shelf at Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary that said that Jesus couldn't really look past his

08:44

Jewish male privilege. I mean now he's God. So if that's true, then you're saying he is limited in some way, that God should not be limited.

08:51

And that's kind of a crazy idea to me, that this would be touted, but it's because it comes from this

08:57

Marxist worldview. And I'm so glad that you're fighting this, and the enemies within the church movies are going to fight this.

09:05

Yeah, well if you look at Justice Democrats, that is a front for Democratic Socialists of America, which we all know, you know,

09:14

Ocasio -Cortez is a member. They've got about 60 ,000 members in the country.

09:20

They have a religious commission, many leading church members, theologians are members of this group.

09:30

The Communist Party USA, which is allied to Democratic Socialists of America, also has a religious commission.

09:38

And I just want to backtrack and give a little example of one of the major Protestant Christians, theologians in the 20th century, and just a little bit of an impact that he had to show the listeners just how one man can change a nation, one

10:00

Marxist. Now there was a guy called Joseph Fletcher. He was a top guy at Union Theological Seminary, I believe.

10:08

He was also one of the top people in the Episcopalian Theological Seminary.

10:15

He was regarded as one of the leading Christian Protestant theologians of the 20th century.

10:21

Now he is the man who gave us what we now know as situation ethics, right?

10:28

And we've all heard this term. It basically means anything is ethically justified as long as it's done in the spirit of love.

10:39

Now he wrote this book in 1966 and it transformed American Christianity. It was perfectly timed for the free love generation of the 60s and the hippie generation and the influence of the

10:53

Frankfurt School, which basically gave us political correctness. All of it came together in the 60s and the idea was that, forget the

11:03

Ten Commandments, that's all old -fashioned stuff. Christian morality should be about love and only feminine love, the welcoming love of the mother where everything is okay, where everything's accepted, not the harsher love of the father who will kick your backside if you don't clean up your room or disrespect your mother.

11:28

And the feminine love is all through the churches now. Masculine love has almost disappeared. No question. And you need both.

11:35

Any family needs masculine and feminine love. Every church needs masculine and feminine love.

11:42

You need to be welcoming, but you also need to be chastising when necessary. You also need to make people accountable when necessary.

11:51

So Joseph Fletcher introduced this concept, anything is okay as long as it's done in a spirit of love, which spread through the churches like crazy, spread through America like crazy.

12:08

So most people now make their moral decisions not referencing the Ten Commandments, but is this okay given the circumstances?

12:18

Every Christian pastor who says, well, should I preach the

12:26

Bible as it's written, even the harsh bits, the tough bits, or should, in a spirit of love,

12:33

I tone it down a little bit so I can bring more people into the church and get more people coming to know

12:42

Jesus? Well, the old paradigm would be you tell the truth and let the chips fall where they may.

12:52

The new paradigm is, no, let's just be soft -sell, let's soft -soap it, let's just act in a spirit of love.

13:01

We'll welcome anybody into the church. We won't call them out for their sin. We won't chastise them in any way.

13:08

That is situation ethics, and that is American Christianity today. Now, we've got to understand

13:14

Joseph Fletcher, after he did his damage, renounced Christianity, became an open atheist.

13:23

He was a founder of Planned Parenthood, the founder of euthanasia societies.

13:28

But what most people don't understand, right since the 1930s, he was actively involved with the

13:35

Communist Party. He was very heavily involved with the Communist Party USA in Massachusetts.

13:41

He worked with major Soviet fronts like the World Peace Council. He was involved in the 1930s with the

13:49

Tenants' Union in the South, which was a Communist Party front. He was involved in communist union activism.

13:56

The man was a communist. But as a leading Protestant theologian, he transformed

14:04

American Christianity in a not very good way. So I just want to give a little bit of a background, how the moral underpinning of Christianity has already been transformed by an actual communist.

14:19

And now you've got Marxists and the evangelical churches promoting critical race theory, promoting social justice, promoting welcoming of refugees,

14:31

Islamic refugees, promoting illegal immigration amnesty, all

14:37

Marxist programs. And it's dressed as Christianity, and it is transforming the evangelical churches and turning them into clones of the larger

14:49

Protestant, of the old traditional Protestant denominations, which are mostly the

14:54

Communist Party at prayer now. Wow, that is certainly incredible to think of.

15:02

And I did not have a name for this. A couple of years ago, I was a praise and worship leader at a church.

15:09

So I knew about the Christian music that was out there, the industry that cranks out the music for worship, the music for Christians at home.

15:20

A lot of these stations, Caleb, I guess, would be one of them. I always thought there's something wrong with the music that's being cranked out, because so much of it is exactly what you just said.

15:32

It is just this kind of squishy, feminized, even the men, without getting too deep into this, but the men sound feminine to me.

15:40

A lot of them that sing this type of music. And sometimes it's like an adolescent boy whispering, sweet nothing's in my ear.

15:49

How often do you hear onward Christian soldiers? Exactly, exactly. Christianity has a masculine side, or it used to have a masculine side.

16:02

It was the side that fought the Civil War. It was the side that ended slavery.

16:08

It was the side that stood up. The missionaries who risked everything, who risked their lives to go into some of the most horrible places on the planet, with great courage.

16:20

And now this is, oh, let's just love everybody. You cannot criticize people.

16:29

That would be unwelcoming and unaccepting. God is love. Jesus is love.

16:35

But remember that love has two sides. Just like your mother and father, your mother loves you.

16:43

She'll accept you. She'll put up with your indiscretions. Your father, if he's a real man, will kick your backside if you need it.

16:53

And he did. My backside was kicked. I'm sure you're a better man for it today.

16:59

And the same with the churches. There has to be both sides of love. And American Christianity is now largely a feminized form of Christianity, which is betraying the core message.

17:13

Yeah, so this is interesting. I want to put the puzzle pieces together to get to where we are, because probably not everyone can see the jump from the situational ethics to critical race theory and everything.

17:25

I know this just being sort of an insider in evangelicalism. Most churches don't do church discipline.

17:31

That was dropped years ago. Of course, the music industry is very feminized. What pastors are preaching now, very positive for the most part.

17:40

There are exceptions, obviously, but it's talking about sin, the serious nature of sin.

17:47

I mean, I can't believe how many Christians that I know don't think things like premarital sex are a big deal.

17:52

Obviously, there's forgiveness for that. But to think that God doesn't even care about it that much, that he's more concerned with your prideful attitude or so forth, that's already kind of happened.

18:06

Moving forward, you know, now we last few years, there's been an influx of this neo -Marxist movement.

18:14

I'm hearing terms now, like white privilege. I mean, you mentioned welcoming refugees, the

18:22

Me Too movement, so feminism, empowering women, that's another term I hear.

18:29

Now, I don't know if this makes it to the chart of the Marxist terms, but human flourishing is now all of a sudden mentioned a lot.

18:37

Gospel issue, immigration is a gospel issue, that kind of thing. There's a new vocabulary, engaging culture.

18:44

So I was hoping that you could maybe tell us, okay, where did all this come from? Let's start with white privilege.

18:53

What is that, and how did that make its way into the church? White privilege was founded by a guy called

19:00

Ted Allen, who was a pro -Maoist member of the Communist Party in the 60s.

19:07

He left the Communist Party to form the Provisional Organizing Committee. He was a pioneer of white privilege.

19:14

It was further developed by a man called Noel Ignatin, sometimes known as Noel Ignatieff.

19:20

He was another Maoist communist, and he introduced this. This movement became part of the central doctrine of the

19:31

Freedom Road Socialist Organization, which is the main Maoist Communist Party in this country.

19:38

They just changed their name two months ago to Liberation Road. They're very active in North Carolina.

19:46

Some of the people in the churches in North Carolina overlap with these people, actually.

19:52

But the idea was, white privilege, see, the thing is, most of us would think of racism as a personal failing.

19:59

It is a lack of, where we judge people by their skin color rather than the content of their character.

20:05

It's a, you know, you see somebody of a different race, you automatically react in a negative way.

20:11

That's how we would see racism. But critical race, but no, white privilege sees it differently.

20:17

Only white people can be racist, because racism is an intrinsic part of capitalism, and it's an intrinsic part of the dominant culture.

20:30

If you do not have power, you can only be racist if you have power, if you have the power to dominate.

20:37

If you are part of a subclass or subculture or a non -dominant race, you cannot be racist in these terms, in white privilege terms.

20:49

So therefore, to end racism, we must overturn the dominant culture.

20:55

We must overturn capitalism. The term white privilege comes directly from the

21:06

Freedom Road Socialist Organization, comes directly from a pro -Chinese communist group.

21:13

And it is pumped up by guys like Christian Smith and others who wrote the famous book that's now being used all over the country.

21:24

And, you know, Freedom Road Socialist Organization, coincidentally, is also the group that gave us

21:30

Black Lives Matter. That is a front for that organization. Now there was a, it's going to be in our movie actually,

21:38

Enemies Within the Church, is a little clip with Michelle Higgins. She is a black pastor from St.

21:45

Louis, Missouri. There's an evangelical convention of young teenage evangelicals in St.

21:52

Louis, and all these young Christians are fired up. And Michelle Higgins gets up there and tells them that the thing that God wants them to do more than anything else is to end white privilege.

22:06

And this is how you get to Jesus. This is now an intrinsic part of Christianity.

22:13

Well, Michelle Higgins is a member of the Organization for Black Struggle, which is a front group for the

22:19

Freedom Road Socialist Organization. These were the people behind the rioting in Ferguson a few years ago.

22:27

So these young teenage evangelicals are now all fired up about critical race theory and ending white privilege, which is a 100 % derivation of pro -Chinese

22:42

Marxism -Leninism. And this has been sold to them as Christianity. It's so frustrating.

22:51

It really is. Because blatantly anti -Christian, if you really, truly believe what the

22:56

Bible says, you know that you're not going to adopt those ideas. I wanted to highlight something real quick.

23:04

On the website, Enemies Within the Church, there's an article up now that was just posted last night called,

23:11

Why is Crew? Echoing Democratic Party talking points. Crew used to be called Campus Crusade.

23:16

For Christ, yeah. Right. And I think the example you just gave of this young lady, she was in, I think, speaking for an inter -varsity group, if I'm not mistaken.

23:26

Crew is kind of on that level. They're one of the other big campus ministries.

23:32

And they just held their national conference or international conference. And they had a keynote speaker,

23:41

Sandra Van Opstel. And some of the things that she said were absolutely incredible.

23:46

And they go along with what you just told us. She talks about American exceptionalism, racist structures, greed, idolatry.

23:55

These are the things the church is just complicit in. And the church has to stop being complicit if they want young people to stick in, to remain in the church.

24:03

And one of the most disturbing things was she said she studied the book of Amos for 10 years.

24:09

And then she went to seminary, learned Hebrew, studied the book of Amos in the Old Testament. And she didn't really quite understand it completely, though.

24:19

She saw Amos differently after she started reading it through the lens of the oppressed, meaning she went and did prison ministry.

24:28

And the inmates showed her that this and I'm going to quote in the book of Amos over and over again, he tells us that trampling on the poor through purchasing through companies that exploit workers and harm and endanger human lives and cause war for our luxurious jewels and our electronic batteries is not worship.

24:45

Now, I've read the book of Amos many times. I don't remember that in the book of Amos. No, I'm sure.

24:52

And I don't think credit credit. I don't think ending white privilege was the 11th commandment either.

24:58

No, this is pure 100 % Marxism. There's no other word for it.

25:04

This is revolutionary Marxism. And they put a little bit of Christian terminology on top of it.

25:11

And they try and sell it to Christians as a tool for furthering the faith.

25:18

Now she says exactly, I just want to cut you off real quick. She says, God so loved the world, not just the people in the world.

25:26

Jesus came to start a revolution against injustice that was posted on the crew website as a direct quote from her.

25:32

And crew used to be one of the main conservative evangelical groups in the country reaching out to young Christians.

25:41

And now it's to the left. Now it is echoing not just democratic party policies, but Marxist concepts.

25:50

And this must be shocking to the donors out there who support crew. And remember being in Campus Crusade for Christ back in the 70s or 80s, when it was a very straight up conservative

26:04

Christian organization. The same thing has happened to World Vision, for instance, which was once a very conservative

26:11

Christian charity. The Marxist used to hate World Vision because of its work spreading the gospel in the third world.

26:20

Now World Vision was caught recently giving money to Hamas, the communist terrorists in Palestine.

26:30

So you know, World Vision is very much to the left. Many of the traditional

26:35

Christian charities out there and organizations that people are still donating money to, thinking they're sound organizations, have very much been taken over by Marxists.

26:47

You know, what do Marxists want? They want influence and money. The Christian church has got a lot of both.

26:54

Wouldn't you want to get into the Christian churches and use their influence to further your cause and siphon off their money to promote it?

27:03

If you're a good revolutionary, what would you do? It's the biggest target in the country, most influential target in the country.

27:12

Yeah, really amazing. I wanted to ask you another question because there are objections out there.

27:19

They might hear what you're saying and say, well, look, I'm against Marxism. I think that's a horrible ideology, but we can use critical race theory, intersectionality, which

27:31

I know we haven't defined those things quite yet, but we can use those things as analytical tools, and that's perfectly fine, which is what

27:39

Resolution 9 said, which is what I've been told by professors at Southeastern who can't seem to, you know, they can't fathom that they would be

27:47

Marxists, but yet here they are using these analytical tools. What do you say to that? I know you wrote an article on this.

27:53

Well, critical race theory is basically the extension, and this was, as you say, passed as part of the

27:59

Southern Baptist platform at their recent theory, you know, pushed by Walter Strickland, amongst others.

28:09

Now, critical race theory is basically applying, see,

28:14

Marx, original Marxism was all about the class struggle. It was the workers against the capitalist bosses, but critical race theory extends

28:23

Marxist concepts into race, so it is not just workers against bosses, it is oppressed nationalities against the dominant culture, white capitalism, and intersectionality says that you can't just compartmentalize the class struggle with the race struggle, you've got to add in the sexual struggles, women's struggle, the gay rights struggle, all of them intersect, so the real enemy is not just capitalism, it's white heterosexist, homophobic capitalism.

29:05

It's white, racist, sexist, homophobic capitalism, so therefore to end these sins, to end the sin of racism and the sin of homophobia and the sin of sexism, we have to end white capitalism.

29:22

In other words, we have to downgrade and overturn the dominant culture.

29:29

This is just extending the concept of Marxist revolution into the racial and gender and LGBTQ fields as well.

29:41

All it is, is it's just Marxism extended, and the prime movers of critical race theory were one

29:48

James Cone, who was an active supporter of Democratic Socialists of America, worked with many of their religious activists, went to Cuba in 1984 with meetings of several

30:01

Soviet front groups. One of the people who went with him was

30:06

Jeremiah Wright, the famous pastor of Barack Obama, famous for his statement, down with KKK America.

30:16

James Cone wrote books like, what does

30:21

Black Marxism have to teach

30:27

Christianity? He wrote books on liberation theology, which is just Marxism with a

30:34

Christian veneer. The other main founder of this idea, critical race theory, was a man called

30:41

Derrick Bell, who was a Harvard Law professor, a mentor to Barack Obama again, and a member of, used to write for Freedomways, which was a

30:52

Communist Party publication aimed at the Black community, which was subsidized by both the

30:58

Soviet Communist Parties and the Chinese Communist Parties. Derrick Bell was also a member of the

31:04

Association of Black Lawyers, which was affiliated to the International Association of Democratic Lawyers, a

31:12

Soviet front, and openly stated it was the legal arm of the

31:17

Black Revolution, and they stood in solidarity with rifle -toting Black revolutionaries.

31:24

Critical race theory is 100 % a Communist tactic.

31:30

What it says is, racism is capitalism, racism is white supremacy, to end racism we've got to end capitalism, we have to have a revolution to overturn the society.

31:44

So if the Southern Baptists believe that racially divisive

31:50

Marxism is a tool for analyzing society, this is just absolutely delusional.

31:59

This is Marxism, 100 % revolutionary doctrine, with a little bit of a

32:04

Christian veneer, and I mean a very little fig leaf of Christianity attached to it, actually now part of the

32:13

Southern Baptist toolbook, you know, it's adopted as part of Southern Baptist analysis, that shows that the

32:24

Southern Baptist is willingly accepting Marxism. Willingly.

32:30

Revolutionary doctrine. There is no, I'm going to be completely unequivocal about this, this is purely revolutionary

32:39

Marxism, and the Southern Baptists under Walter Strickland and J .D.

32:44

Greer and others seem to think this is just fine and dandy. That seems to go along with a controversy that happened last week over this, there's a documentary that was supposed to come out by Founders Ministries, which

32:58

Tom Askell, who actually opposed that resolution, his ministry, very bravely from Coral Gables in Florida, he said at the convention, this doctrine is rooted in philosophies incompatible with Christianity, and he was 100 % right.

33:15

And of course he was voted down, and now there's this documentary that they want to put out, and they put out a trailer for it about,

33:23

I don't know, a week and a half ago, and immediately four seminary presidents, other bigwigs in the

33:28

Southern Baptist convention came down on them, that this is divisive, this is wrong, and of course, you know, none of this ever happened when critical race theory like MLK 50,

33:37

Revoice, you know, etc, etc, etc. But when you challenge that, there was this backlash, and after that backlash occurred, some folks started pointing out that Matthew Hall, who was the provost at Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, Al Mohler's right -hand man, essentially,

33:58

I mean, he'll take over for Al Mohler in all likelihood. He was filmed, now

34:05

I think some of these recordings are a year ago, maybe a few years ago, but there's multiple recordings. I've seen about four or five articles or recordings of Matthew Hall promoting the ideas that you just said, and in one of them in particular, which went viral, which they deleted when it went viral, he says,

34:23

I am a white supremacist, essentially. He's a white man, he says,

34:28

I'm a white supremacist, I'm a racist, I'll always struggle with white supremacism, I'll always struggle with racism, because of who

34:36

I am. And that, I think, shocked a lot of Christians when they saw that.

34:42

It's like, who in the world would have a white supremacist as the provost of the seminary?

34:49

But I don't think he meant... No, he doesn't mean he's a white supremacist. What he means is, he is imbued with the white capitalist culture.

35:01

He's an unconscious racist. And this is what, you know, white privilege means.

35:07

Doesn't matter who you are, you can be married to a black person, you can have black children, as long as you're white, you're an unconscious racist, because you're a part of the white capitalist privileged class.

35:20

And this is imbued in you. This is the original sin, right?

35:27

This is part of who you are. So as long as you're white, you're always going to have to struggle with racism, that you are a white supremacist.

35:35

So he is saying, I accept the tenets of white privilege,

35:41

I accept the central tenets of Marxist critical race theory,

35:47

I am effectively a tool of Marxism. That is what he is saying. And I have read some of his stuff,

35:54

I've looked at some of his podcasts, and he is 100 % on board with this agenda.

35:59

And as you say, he may become the top man in the Southern Baptists. The guy is a

36:08

Marxist, whether he would consciously say he's a Marxist might be a different thing. But he is absolutely imbued with critical race theory, white privilege,

36:19

Marxist concepts. Yeah, amazing. He's been there for as many years,

36:24

I think since 2000. And this has not been addressed. He's just climbed the ladder there under Al Mohler's watch, nonetheless.

36:31

Look, Al Mohler has turned a very blind eye to a whole bunch of this stuff. You know, Al Mohler, who spoke recently at the

36:38

Western Conservative Summit on, you know, which shocked me, on preserving religious liberty, has allowed this doctrine to become dominant now in the

36:53

Southern Baptists. It is the guiding parameter of the

37:00

Southern Baptists, once the most conservative, you know, straight up Orthodox, biblical, you know,

37:07

Protestant denomination in the country now is led by people imbued with Marxism.

37:14

There's no way to soft sell that. Trevor, what you're saying, I mean, I think your analysis is gold on all of this.

37:20

I want to zoom out, take a real bird's eye view for a minute and see what you think of this. So situational ethics, pietism, that kind of,

37:29

I think, neutralized the church as far as it gutted it. The moral, the ethical framework was taken down, and it was just this general love, love, love, this vague, kind of emotionally charged concept, which isn't really a biblical love.

37:45

And then now, once it was broken down, the ethical framework of the church, now it is being built up again in a

37:53

Marxist framework. That's what I see. Because now, as you just rightly pointed out, there are commands. Thou shalt not be a racist.

38:00

Thou shalt not be a sexist. Thou shall not be a homophobic. There is a very strong moral code now, and if you deviate from that, the long knives will come out for you.

38:13

Is that the design from the beginning was to take out the tradition? Deconstruct.

38:18

Deconstruct. And I think you have now analyzed it beautifully. Pietism was the concept that came from just after the

38:28

Reformation in Germany, that Christians should not be involved in the affairs of their nation.

38:33

And that spread right when these Lutherans and German Christians came to America in the

38:39

Midwest. That spread to American Christianity, so neutralized

38:44

Christianity. Behind that became Marxism. That's how fascism arose in Germany, because the

38:54

German churches were so gutless and so neutralized, they didn't make a stand against it.

39:01

They put swastikas in their churches. So what you've got now is a

39:09

Christianity that's been very watered down, which has turned a lot of people off.

39:14

Because young Christians, they want to go into church. They want to be idealistic. They want to stand for something.

39:19

They want to stand for principles. And they're listening to their pastor, who's as weak and soppy as you could possibly imagine.

39:27

And that does not inspire them. So what comes in? Marxism comes in.

39:33

Let's be Christians. Let's fight global warming. Let's stand on the border and welcome invading refugees, immigrants across the border.

39:43

Let's get all on board with ending white privilege. Let's get all on board with social justice.

39:50

So the churches have gone from being weak and soppy to now standing for something.

39:57

But the problem is they're standing for exactly what Christianity is not. They're standing for the exact opposite.

40:04

And all these young idealistic pastors who want to stand for something, who want to bring back some backbone to the church, are being fed these

40:15

Marxist ideas. And they think that they are restoring the church by doing this.

40:22

No, they're not. They're dragging the church to complete destruction. And it's very sad, but it's very clever.

40:31

It's by design. See what they're doing electorally right now. And you mentioned it before, that guy from Justice Democrats, which as I said, is a front for Democratic Socialists of America.

40:44

Let's neutralize the evangelicals' conservative vote.

40:51

Let's neutralize the vote. And if we can, get them voting Democrat. So the first thing is neutralize them.

40:58

Wean them off the Republican Party. Wean them off conservatism. That's the first step. Then if we can, we actually move them to the left.

41:07

So the first step is break their allegiance to conservative or traditional Christian principles.

41:14

Then we've neutralized them. And then we start to move them to the left.

41:20

That's the way they go. That gentleman's name is Zach Exley, by the way. Zach Exley, the

41:26

Justice Democrats, is heavily involved in the Democratic Socialists of America, which is more left -wing than the

41:33

Communist Party, which has ties to former East German communists, which has ties to Latin American communists, supports the

41:43

Maduro government in Venezuela, supports Cuba. Zach Exley is in that milieu, and he is openly working to shift the

41:54

Christian churches from the conservative movement to the left. Andrew Breitbart used to have a great saying, he would say, politics is downstream from culture.

42:06

The culture shapes the politics, but culture is downstream from religion.

42:13

So if you can shift American Christianity to the left, or at least neutralize its conservative base, you can change the culture of the nation, and you can completely change the politics.

42:28

Even if you're totally secular, even if you're an atheist, but you're a conservative, you should be concerned about this, because this is going to shift

42:38

American politics to the left. It's going to basically usher in a socialist

42:43

America, if it is not checked and counterbalanced. On that note,

42:50

I so appreciate your work, and the work that's going on at Enemies Within the

42:56

Church. You can go to enemieswithinthechurch .com if you're listening or watching this and want to contribute to our efforts.

43:02

I know, Trevor, I talked to Judd not too long ago, and we need a chump of change. If you can contribute to that effort, man, that would be really helpful.

43:13

We can expose this. What this movie is going to do is draw a line, because most

43:19

American Christians are going to socialist churches and don't know it. They're sincere

43:25

Christians who want to be good, who want to follow the

43:30

Bible properly, and they're being fed a bill of goods. We need to show how this is happening, and we need to draw a clear contrast between biblical

43:41

Christianity and socialist Marxist Christianity. If people see the difference,

43:48

I think we'll see a major, major change and a rejuvenation of American Christianity.

43:55

If you can spare a few dollars, go to Enemies Within the Church. You go to your

44:02

Marxist churches every Sunday and put money in the collection plate. Go to enemieswithinthemovie .com

44:09

and put some money there, because this is going to do more to save American Christianity than anything else

44:17

I can think of. I'm not saying this to promote our own project. You know what we've found,

44:23

John? You've seen it yourself in the seminary you went to,

44:29

Southeastern. You saw the Marxism in there. You saw the young future pastors swallowing

44:36

Marxism. They're going to be out there in the next few years spreading it all over the country.

44:43

That's got to be stopped now, and this movie will draw a clear line in the sand and awaken people to what's happening.

44:50

We'll actually make them woke in the true sense, okay? Not the false

44:55

Marxist sense that's now being promoted. Two things to add to that.

45:00

Number one, if you care about the gospel, you're a Christian, and for you, that's the main issue.

45:07

I mean, that's kind of what got me into this. We will be sharing the true message of Christianity, redemption in Christ for real sins that the

45:14

Bible actually calls sins for individuals, not systemic injustices, but individuals who sin out of their human hearts, which is what the

45:24

Bible teaches. We're going to share that message that Christ can forgive that, that you can be made new and have the Holy Spirit.

45:30

That message is in there, the true message. Then the other thing I wanted to mention,

45:35

I totally forgot because it slipped my mind, but I'm sure it was important. Man, Trevor, thank you so much for joining us.

45:43

Oh, I remember what it was now. Some of the most damning information. I mean, we released some stuff and the reactions have been interesting to say the least.

45:54

I'll just leave that there. Some of the most damning information has yet to be released. We're sitting on it for this film.

46:00

I just want people to know that. We haven't fought all our guns off yet. The big ones are being saved.

46:08

Trevor, I really appreciate you joining me. I'm going to ask you a fun question kind of at the end. I know you and I have talked a lot about our love for barbecue and other foods.

46:20

You said, I think you told me your favorite food is barbecue, genre food. Is that right? Yeah. Look, especially beef brisket, burned ends of beef brisket.

46:30

One of the greatest gifts we have. I'm getting hungry now. What's your favorite style? I don't know if you're familiar.

46:35

There's Texas style and Memphis style and Carolina, North and South. So what do you like? Look, I would probably have to say

46:42

Texan style beef brisket. I've been to some of these little cinder block barbecue houses, barbecue places in the back blocks of Texas.

46:54

You sit there and there's all these guys with ZZ top beards and overalls around you.

47:02

And you just get this big pile of brisket with all these burnt ends.

47:09

It's just divine. It's just heaven. They don't have that in New Zealand, do they? No, they don't. See, barbecue in New Zealand is just, you put a chop on a grill.

47:18

You put a sausage on a grill. I didn't know what barbecue actually meant until I came here.

47:25

And it's been one of the great joys of coming to America is having barbecue, you know? I told my parents the other day,

47:31

I was talking to them about this project a little bit. And I said, you know, it seems like everything I love is being destroyed. It's kind of discouraging.

47:37

The Boy Scouts is destroyed. I love the Boy Scouts. You know, I was involved in that. The church is now being attacked.

47:43

Look, the Communist Party was trying to take the Boy Scouts down in the 20s. Because of its patriotism, its

47:49

American values, all the good things about the Boy Scouts have now pretty much been destroyed.

47:55

And the Marxists are behind it. So yeah, you have the Boy Scouts, you have the American Christianity, conservatism, even just being proud of our history.

48:04

Just everything's going away. And I said, they haven't taken barbecue yet. I said, if they ever lay a finger on it,

48:10

I'm going to go ballistic. Like that's going to be, I'm going to lose it at that point. So I'll tell you the next movement in the next few years will be anti -meat.

48:18

Yeah. So I'll tell you that. So, so look, look, this is why we got to fight back. Yes. If you love your barbecue, we got to save American youth.

48:28

We got to save barbecue. There's some important things we have to save and liberty.

48:33

All right. Sounds good. Well, you want to be a socialist vegetarian, an atheist socialist vegetarian.

48:41

Cause that's what the left would like to have us. A soy boy, a soy boy, a soy boy.

48:46

Yeah. And you know, soybean is so full of female hormone. Okay, here we go.

48:53

Well, Trevor, thank you so much. People want to check you out. Which is great for females. It ain't good for guys.

48:59

I just want to emphasize that. Enemieswithinthechurch .com, Trevor Loudon, wasittrevorloudon .com.

49:06

And yeah, check Trevor's work out. He's got some good movies and material out there. Thank you,