Jeff Durbin Answering 'The Problem of Evil'

For me it's not it's not simply a question of playing an intellectual game. I've sat in front of people who have been gang raped people who have some terrible things. And the first thing I would do is this is say this when you and I have a discussion about evil first of all as a Christian the powerful thing is with starting with him is that I actually have a basis to call something evil and complain.

So for example if we don't start with him if we say that he must not be there because this look at this evil. What we're assuming there when we call something evil is that there's an absolute standard by which to measure this is evil.

Because if we take him out of the picture and we deny him we say he doesn't exist or he's absent or whatever he doesn't mean he must not be there. We can't call any action evil. What happens just happens.

It's just what it is. And I you know and philosophers will say oftentimes they'll say like you can't get an offer from an is. And that's true. If there's no God it's we. There's nothing we ought to do if we just are if we're just stuff in the universe that doesn't care without God.

No ultimate standard of good. And I don't really have a basis in morally indignant at all. But if I start with him I have a reason to cry with the girl who was getting raped. I have a reason to cry over the person that was molested.

I have a reason to cry with a person that was abandoned as a matter of fact as a Christian I have a basis to do these sorts of things. And then I do. Now the question then comes okay got it. If I reject him I can't call anything evil.

The Moral Basis for Calling Evil Evil

Okay so now I got it. That doesn't answer the emotional problem right. Well how come I have to deal with all that. So now that would move to this second thing to think through. And then if I start with him I can call things evil.

If I start with him I can indict somebody for what they've done to me. And I can actually say no it was wrong and I can't actually complain. But then you have to ask the question why is there evil in the world.

If he's so good. And I would answer first only because I want to give you a tough answer. Okay. And that that's this. This solves the problem is that God has a morally sufficient reason for the evil that he plans or allows.

Okay. So that's the first thing from philosophical standpoint. But that isn't even beginning.

Do you believe that he does have divine foreknowledge that everything that we do so I mean people that do the terrible things. Yeah they didn't really have a.

Choice. You know. Oh that's a good question. No. No there's differing views on foreknowledge. What that means. I would say the biblical view about foreknowledge is really important to get right. The God of the Bible does not take knowledge in.

In other words we'll say something like that's like God look through time and he saw this person would do this. Yeah he's eternal. And so when we say we talk about foreknowledge as a Christian a couple things.

God says he declares the end from the beginning that he does according to his will and the host of heaven and among the inhabitants of the earth and that he works all things after the counsel of his will.

So we talk about the foreknowledge of God. We're saying that God's knowledge is wrapped up in his decree of what doesn't doesn't take place. But it doesn't mean he does he actually decrees all things that nothing happens in this universe apart from his will.

But we asked the question about human responsibility. What about human responsibility. Yeah. And the truth is is the scriptures really show something very important happening. And that is that we talk about evil events in history.

Divine Sovereignty and Human Responsibility in Evil

Let's go there let's go to the most evil event recorded in history and that is that when God became man he was righteous and blameless and perfect and he was murdered on a tree. And so as a Christian we would say that's the most evil event that happened in history because here is the righteous now being murdered.

And it's interesting as you look at the tax and about the backs how the Christians pray when it happened. They said when they were praying in this city gathering at your holy servant Jesus were Pontius Pilate.

Okay. There's a Roman governor that has totally different motivations as to why he had Jesus delivered over. Okay he was a coward. He was afraid of the crowds. He said he was innocent. I washed my hands.

Right. In history he says I find no fault in them. And then he gives them over to him to kill him. So he's afraid of the crowds. The second thing is the people of Israel. He had exposed them in many places the leadership and so they wanted to kill.

And then it says the Gentiles. Well that was like the Roman citizens of shoulder soldiers. They they just kill people so like that they do that on their tree. So all these people had different motivations.

God was not putting a gun to their head saying you kill Jesus. The truth of matter is though it says this they were gathered against Jesus to do whatever your hand had predestined to occur. They wanted to kill Jesus.

It was in their heart to do it. God determined to allow them to have what they wanted which was to kill Jesus. And it was according to his sovereign plan to allow them to kill Jesus for the salvation of his people.

So here you have a murder of Jesus. A most heinous acts committed in history that God does is the sovereign determiner of all things. And that is why you and I just got saved through grace. Or grace. Yes only.

Yeah. By grace but by his grace not by works. Yeah. No it's okay. So I would say the reason this is helpful is a lot of times people will try to have they'll try to get God off the hook in some way. Let's say well this evil event happened.

How do we get God off the hook. Say I didn't want that to happen. Or he'll fix that. Or he couldn't mess with your free will. The truth is is that all those answers make God unworthy of worship. Because if an event happened that was evil that God could do nothing about because of some free will of man.

That means there's something operating outside of God that he's dependent upon. Or what's that in.

What sense explain that. There was an example that we went over. That's class where I would say it's just there's a deer in the woods and tree falls on it. Lightning struck a tree hit the deer broke its leg back.

Whatever it's now up.

In flames on fire couple things just to look at assumptions here real fast is that I've that resonates with me when I think about a deer crushed by a tree set on fire. First of all what are we assuming when we think about that scenario.

Goodness of creation and the value and the deer in the tree and everything else we think about that. Oh why is this happening. It doesn't feel right. And the truth is is that as a Christian I have a reason to complain about that and also to say there's a basis as to why why.

That is the way that it is. And the Bible teaches that when the fall occurred God created us in his image and so Adam was the image of God in creation. And when he fell and he rebelled against God's covenant which is really what it was he rebelled against God's covenant.

God promised not only his separation from God but that also all of creation itself fell because man is the image of God represented all of creation and when man fell all of creation falls with him. And so we look in the world around us and we call anything not good or that's that shouldn't be.

It feels wrong. That doesn't feel right to me it's because we live in a fallen world and that just gets to the glory of what I wanted to get to you. Because I don't want to just give you the full sample of answers I want to show you that the philosophical rigorous answer.

But there's also an emotional content to this you have to get and that is that the glory of the gospel which makes it so beautiful is that even though this is the God we've offended even though he's the God we're actually rebelling against sometimes in the world we're collateral damage of somebody else's sin.

We're not the ones that did it. We're collateral damage of their sin. Right. But many times we're the perpetrators daily against God. We're all sinners everyone. So even though we're sinners they're sinners.

Sometimes we're collateral damage. Sometimes we're perpetrators. The glory of the gospel is that God we've all offended actually entered into this fallen world. And he didn't. This is really really important.

He didn't just die for people for their sins and then conquered death and rise from the dead. He also had a whole life lived before he got there where he suffered among us. So when someone says to me Jeff I was raped or Jeff I was molested or Jeff I was assaulted or Jeff I was lied about or Jeff there was someone who betrayed me.

I would say you have a high priest who symbolizes with you. Because when God saved us he didn't just save us on the cross. He actually suffered among us. And he tasted deception he tasted abandonment.

He tasted physical assault. He knows what it's like to for someone to take him somewhere that he shouldn't be taken to be assaulted. He knows it's like to be accused falsely of something. He knows what it's like to be homeless and hungry and enraged.

He knows what it's like to be tortured. He knows what it's like to have people bear false witness around him. He knows it's like to have family not there for him when he needs them. He knows what it's like to have friends abandon him when he needs them most.

And so the beauty of the gospel is not only does Jesus come to save sinners but he suffers and experiences everything that we experience in this fallen world. There's nothing that you and I can't take to Jesus that he had doesn't actually understand.

That's the glory of this God. It's we're not talking about some God that just spins the universe off and the evil things happen. And we're like trying to figure out some answers. He's the one that actually despite us running from him and loving our sin he actually chases the rebels and on the way to chase them tastes everything that we take.

And there's a good and sufficient reason with purpose for every event that happens in history including the murder of Jesus. Even that event is murderous as it wasn't as evil as it was God had predetermined for the good of his people and for his glory.

And so as a Christian I look at the world and I have a basis to call anything evil and to cry about it. And I have a basis to say that this is not purposeless at all. There's no purposeless event. Cool.

Are you riding a motorcycle. Yeah. You're awesome. You're awesome. Thank you so much.