July 23, 2019 Show with Nate Pickowicz on Small-Town Ministry in the Liberal Mission Field of New England

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues

facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens

another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to

have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with

your own questions, and now here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth who

are listening via live streaming at IronSharpensIronRadio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this 23rd

day of July 2019, and I'm thrilled to have back on the

program a returning guest named Nate Pickowitz.

He is pastor of Harvest Bible Church in Gilmanton Ironworks, New Hampshire.

He is the author of Reviving New England and Why We're Protestant, is working on a new book that we'll have

him mention in a bit, and today we are addressing small -town ministry in

the liberal mission field of New England, and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio,

Pastor Nate Pickowitz.

Thank you, Chris, I appreciate it.

Well, for our listeners who have missed you on your previous guest appearances on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio,

I don't know if you would call it, rightly, an appearance on radio when no one can see you, I can never figure that out, but

anyway, your last times as a guest on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio,

those of our listeners who are unfamiliar with the Harvest Bible Church in Gilmanton

Ironworks, New Hampshire, why don't you tell our listeners about that?

Sure.

So Harvest Bible Church is very different than Harvest Bible Chapel.

I always want to make

that very clear.

That's also in your hometown there?

Yes.

So we're in Gilmanton Ironworks, New Hampshire, so I grew up in this town.

It's a small town, a fraction of what it used to be in its heyday.

Not much doing ministry.

And do you mind telling us why it's such a horrible thing that people may confuse you with Harvest Bible

Chapel?

Well, so Harvest Bible Chapel, for those who don't know, was a ministry

either founded or it's just not

gone well for

them, a

denominational

church.

And you already had that name when they moved into town and decided to call their church something nearly

identical.

Yeah, so we, I mean Harvest Bible Chapel goes way back for several years, so it was just one of those

things I didn't, you know,

we were launching with, but I just like the name

and any region that's

different, they're very

challenging.

No, no, what I meant was, did you have the name first before Harvest Bible Chapel moved into town?

So they're not in our town.

Oh, I thought, I guess you misunderstood me earlier.

I said they're in the same hometown as you are, and you said yes.

Oh, no, no, no, no, no, there's a, we have one blinking light in my town.

Yeah, no, they're not, they're not here.

They're not here.

So yeah, I don't think on this area even know what that, I

mean, controversy going, I don't think most people really know.

So it hasn't been an issue for us here.

No one's really given us a hard time.

It's been fine.

I mean, it hasn't.

Okay.

And now we've got to know about the Fellowship Conference New England in Portland, Maine, where you are

speaking along with my dear friend, Pastor Mack Tomlinson of Providence Chapel in Denton, Texas,

and a number of other folks.

Why don't you tell us about this conference coming up?

Yeah, so this is the third year that I've been a part of this conference.

They started

this and they

really have, but

they're not large.

It's not

a

far

of the word.

There's nothing real.

And I know that the speakers include Pastor Anthony Mathenia, who's Paul Washer's pastor at

Christ Church in Radford, Virginia.

Pastor Lee Dodd, who I've had on this program, really enjoyed interviewing Lee,

who is actually going to be my guest on the 31st of July, Wednesday, the 31st of July.

And as I said before, Pastor Mack Tomlinson of Providence Chapel in Denton, Texas.

And you.

So I know one of the things that is unique about Fellowship Conference New England is that

there is never one central theme.

They allow the pastors just to preach on anything that is burdening them, burdening their hearts and

minds to talk about.

Have you yet selected what you are going to preach on?

Yeah, at least I think I have.

I haven't heard

back if this

is

in one.

I'm going to be.

And it's

really just

John Chapter 15

years now,

even

in

minutes.

Well, I plan on repeating this information later, but in case anybody has to leave listening

to the program earlier than normal, the the conference will be held

August 1st through the 3rd at the Deering Center Community Church in Portland, Maine.

And if you want more details, go to Fellowship Conference New England dot com.

And once again, that is August 1st through the 3rd.

And that's in the Deering Center Community Church in Portland, Maine.

And those days of the week are Thursday, Friday and Saturday.

So a great way to have a elongated weekend at a Bible conference.

Now, tell us something about the new book you're working on.

So I know

you and I

before the one that I'm working on, a friend of mine.

We're writing a book on the American Puritans

right now as of

by June.

I've been working on Puritans.

Well, you've just reminded me I've got to call Dustin Benj again because we have been playing

email tag.

He is supposed to be my guest on Iron Trip and Zion Radio to discuss his doctoral dissertation, The Angelology

of Jonathan Edwards.

And so I hope to get him on very soon.

He actually was an instructor for one of my pastor's

mother, Mary, who is actually a listener in this audience for Iron

Trip and Zion Radio.

She lives in Cork, Ireland.

Oh, yeah, that's right.

Yeah.

And she has an instructor, Dustin Benj, if I'm not mistaken.

I believe that's even when I first heard.

Actually, no, actually, I first heard about Dustin from you when I was helping him find,

helping him candidate for a church that was without a pastor at the time.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, really, you should hang up the phone and call him and have him on.

Oh, I'm sure you're equally fine.

And no, he's he's a great friend.

I really I mean, we both have an appreciation for one another in terms of

ministers, a very dear brother.

So can I.

I've been slowly learning more about it, but

a show, but

planting network.

And it's a way for them to get

to Munster Bible College.

What's that?

Munster Bible College, Munster Bible College.

That's right.

He's flown out there and just done a great work.

And I mean, between you me and the wall and of course.

Great.

Well, let's get into our theme now.

Our theme is small time, small time.

I meant to say small town ministry in the liberal mission field of New

England.

And one of the things I may have even brought this up with you before,

because we've discussed similar things.

In fact, obviously, reviving New England is sort of your book.

Reviving New England is a lot to do with what we're going to discuss today, I'm assuming.

But one of the things that has always one of the things that has always amazed me

is how New England went from being a central hub

in the United States or should I say America, because this began before we were these United

States.

Central hub of Bible believing, genuine, authentic

Puritan Christianity.

This is where the Ivy League schools were born that were at one time

very faithful to the Holy Scriptures, very faithful to historic Protestant

doctrine and theology.

And can you give me any clues as to why you think New England went from

being this bastion of biblical orthodoxy to the

apostate region of the nation that it is now?

Of course, I mean, you could almost say any part of the nation is apostate, but few had

the rich heritage of the Puritans and so on that New England had.

So it's a farther leap, it seems.

Yeah, so it's interesting because I've been playing, you know, I

probably got about

five or why

did things go.

You see

that

in the history

of disparity

into it can fall very.

But one

thing I

keep

on noticing

is there is

another

thing

that's

unique

about your

situation.

It's right in our title of our discussion today, the topic that we're discussing,

small town ministry.

What can you think of that is different?

I mean, I know you were born and raised in the town that you're in.

I don't know how much ministry you've done in big cities, but there are cities

in the United States such as New York City, huge city that might

be equally opposed to the scriptures, to

Christians attempting to evangelize them.

I'm talking about obviously the average person.

What could what immediately pops into your mind as far as the difference between that same kind of

atmosphere, but in a much smaller scale in a small town?

Yeah, so when I when I read one of the comments I keep on

I kept on hearing was that are my

state.

It's not unique to New England.

Number one.

Now that can be a good thing.

And

even

in

the

Bible

belt

attitude

is

pervading

hardness

against

counties.

Twenty five years.

Anything that doesn't exist.

Yeah, you when you were talking about how abominably leftist

your governor is, it just reminded me of a guest that I've had on this program

from Massachusetts, a pastor.

The first time he was on to discuss his problems at

attempting adoption were done anonymously because the adoption

hadn't gone through.

But then when he had the successful adoption, he came back and revealed who he who he is.

Pastor Mark Lukens of Providence Baptist Church in Norfolk, Massachusetts.

And he because of the fact that he is an evangelical Bible believing pastor, he actually

had a harder time adopting than a same sex couple would have had.

And it's just amazing.

It's frightening when you think about an adoption agency.

You would have thought that possibly, especially a couple of decades ago, that even a

secular adoption agency would be like, oh, wow, isn't this great?

We have a minister and his wife are going to try to adopt.

That's just wonderful.

What a what a safe place for a child to be.

And now that is actually a huge strike against somebody in Massachusetts for

adopting.

Just just an abomination, I think.

Yeah.

So where I am in New Hampshire, there are a lot more

stories.

They're not used to seeing you there.

And they

any kind of I

know that many of my listeners

who listen daily will remember this story because I've told it several times.

But something you said about comparing what you might experience to the if you're

comparing between the Bible belt and where you are, even though you might be in an area

in the Bible belt that is equally dead, where you have a lot of people

raised in the faith, they may be in their family tree, you know,

ministers going back hundreds and hundreds of years.

But they may be just completely lost.

And they think they're Christians just because that's what they were born and raised as.

But it reminded me of a Presbyterian pastor from Mississippi a number of years ago.

I was having a conversation with him on the phone and he asked me

where I was from.

And I told him I was from New York.

That's where I lived at the time.

That's where I was born and raised.

And he said, well, you got it easy in New York.

All you got to do is get people saved down here in Mississippi.

You got to get people lost first and then get them saved.

Yeah, right, right.

So at least you don't have to get people lost first.

Yeah.

No, I mean, the funny thing about it is, and not funny haha, but just ironically, I'm really thankful

for the ministry that we have here.

I mean, I, you know, my wife and I talk all kinds of ideas and what

the Lord could do here and there.

And, I mean, I don't want to go anywhere else.

This region, I love the people.

I agree.

You don't have to

worry that he

had me

born here.

I mean, it's,

and I

lament

the

region.

We have to go to our first station break.

If you'd like to join us on the air with a question for Pastor Nate Pickowitz, our email address is

ChrisArnzen at gmail .com.

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Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back with Pastor Nate Pickowitz of Harvest Bible Church in Gilmanton, Ironworks, New Hampshire,

on the theme, Small Town Ministry in the Liberal Mission Field of New England.

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Arnzen.

If you just tuned us in, our guest today for the full two hours with a little less than 90 minutes to go is Nate Pickowitz, who is

pastor of Harvest Bible Church in Gilmanton, Ironworks, New Hampshire.

He's an author, and we are discussing the theme small -town ministry in the liberal mission

field of New England.

If you would like to join us with a question of your own, our email address is chrisarnzen at gmail .com,

chrisarnzen at gmail .com.

We have R .J. in White Plains, New York, who has a question for you, Pastor Nate.

He said, I'm assuming that this great need for pastors and church

plants and evangelists is well known throughout the evangelical community

in the United States.

Why is it that more churches and even mission organizations are not sending men of

God to plant churches and to evangelize in the area in which you live, since it is such a barren

wasteland theologically and spiritually?

Well, there's a lot of reasons.

There's a lot of ground in that.

I think, for one,

when

you're

talking

about or

looking into

this,

a lot of folks in the

area, maybe you're newly married, maybe you have a small child.

If you're

going to

go pack up

California

or

Missouri

planting, that's also

being in planting churches.

The

EFCA's planting

needs

were

already

had.

I was already in depth

with

the opportunity.

We have Arnie in Perry County, Pennsylvania, who says, I do not know if you prefer

expository preaching over topical, but I was wondering if there is any difference in emphasis,

knowing of the background of the geography from where you are pastoring, than a

pastor in another part of the United States might have in the way he might deliver a sermon on the same

text that you are delivering.

So, I'm very tempted to respond in one fashion, but I'm going to try to respond in a different fashion,

only because my focus is on

pretty hard, and I've gotten some criticism

about it,

and there

are

some good

things in a long term.

And for the listener who is unfamiliar with those distinctions, expository preaching is where you

would be going through long sections of the Bible, perhaps a book, a book of Romans or

something, and every Sunday you are exegetically going verse by verse

through those chapters, and through those books, rather than every week

something different, like we're going to talk about lust this week, and next week we're going to talk about

bigotry, and so on.

You're going through the text of Scripture, and taking the lead from the God

-breathed words that are found there as to what kind of topic would be formed out of that.

Yeah, and I think to just put a finer point on that as well, I agree with everything you just said.

The issue also goes, if I'm just relying on

my own, I

mean, I know them,

but I'm God, and

so I

want financial giving, and I want

to have eight and

nine with

the Bible, and what God, what I want

to tell them.

So, more than just a method,

And I'm

assuming that

even those

churches.

That are most dedicated to expository preaching, something

like the tragedy on September 11, 2001 occurs, when we have a

terrorist attack that brought down the World Trade Center, and a plane flies into the

Pentagon, and another plane crashes in Pennsylvania.

Even the most expository dedication might be

requiring a break in the stride to shift to something that was more topically focused on something

that has global significance like that.

Yeah, I mean, I frequently will stop, I mean, frankly, just on a practical level,

I'll preach one of the psalms.

There might be

events where...

Otherwise, I mean, you could fill your preaching calendar with 25 holidays and always be doing...

be harsh on anybody, but yeah, I mean, if you're going to...

you need to deal with it

biblically important.

Yeah, and unfortunately, in the media, the response from a

multitude of ministers around this nation was a very unbiblical approach.

I'm not saying that, of course, all ministers were reacting unbiblically, but many, especially the

ones that were highlighted in the media, were, God had nothing to do with this.

Right.

You know, this has nothing to do with the sins of our nation.

How dare anybody even think that?

Or, you know, you could go on and on with...

Sure.

As if God was asleep or something when this happened, or, you know,

just sat and watched and had nothing to do with, in his providence, what had

occurred.

So that's also a very sad thing indeed.

But we have to go to our midway break right now.

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Don't go away, God willing, we'll be right back with Nate Pickowitz after these messages from our sponsors.

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Chris Sorensen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio here.

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Hi, this is John Sampson, pastor of King's Church in Peoria, Arizona.

Taking a moment of your day to talk about Chris Arnson and the Iron Sharpens Iron podcast, I consider

Chris a true friend and a man of high integrity.

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This is a day of great spiritual compromise and yet God has raised Chris up for just such a time.

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I'm pleased to do so and would like to ask you to prayerfully consider joining me in supporting Iron

Sharpens Iron financially.

Would you consider sending either a one -time gift or even becoming a regular monthly partner with this ministry?

I know it would be a huge encouragement to Chris if you would.

All the details can be found at ironsharpensironradio .com where you can click support.

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They are one of the first advertisers we ever had.

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Sometimes Mike Adosh, the founder of Solid Ground Christian Books, will keep me on the phone for 10 minutes just

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Iron Radio.

Well, we have to just make a couple of announcements before we return to our guest, Nate Pikowitz.

Nate will be returning and he's got a story.

I'm looking forward to hearing him tell about his hometown.

But before we go back to our discussion, there's a couple of events coming up that I want you to be aware of,

events that I hope that as many of you as possible will attend.

First of all, we have the conference that we mentioned in the beginning of this show, the Fellowship Conference New England.

That's being held August 1st through the 3rd.

And that is being held at the Deering Center Community Church in Portland, Maine.

And the speakers at this conference include our guest today, Nate Pikowitz.

In addition, Pastor Anthony Mathenia of Christ Church in Radford, Virginia, who is also Paul Washer's pastor.

Pastor Lee Dodd, who's going to be my guest again on Wednesday, the 31st of July.

Really wonderful brother.

And Pastor Mac Tomlinson, who is the main individual involved in spearheading this

conference, the Fellowship Conference New England.

He is pastor of Providence Chapel in Denton, Texas.

If you would like to attend this conference, go to fellowshipconferencenewengland .com.

Fellowshipconferencenewengland .com.

That is August 1st through the 3rd.

That's a Thursday and Friday and a Saturday coming up not too far from now.

We have another conference that overlaps that one a bit, but it's in a different part of the country, a

completely different part of the country.

We're talking about the Providence Theological Institute Conference

at the Church at Friendship in Hockley, Texas, featuring my dear friend, Dr. Tony

Costa, professor of apologetics and Islam at the Toronto Baptist Seminary.

This is no doubt going to be an excellent event.

I've seen and heard Dr. Costa speak many, many times, especially since I have also

used him as a speaker, as a keynote speaker at a number of events, debates,

conferences, and so on.

And I'm never bored of Dr. Tony Costa.

I'm always on the edge of my seat, and I'm sure you will be too.

Some of the topics he'll be speaking on are the meaninglessness of life without

God, the authority and inerrancy of Scripture, the Promised Land and the New Covenant,

the glorious New Covenant, and more.

And that is August 2nd through the 4th.

That is Friday through Sunday.

And if you live near Hockley, Texas, or can take a plane, train, or automobile to get there,

this is at the Church at Friendship, as I said.

And the website that has all the details is churchatfriendship .org,

churchatfriendship .org, and then click Events at the top of the page.

Then in December, Thursday and Friday, December 19th and

20th, I am going to be packing up my bags and heading back to my old stopping grounds, New York City, for the

Foundations Conference being held again in the heart of Manhattan during the Christmas season, and what

better time of year to go to Manhattan during the Christmas season.

I can't wait.

That's Thursday and Friday, December 19th and 20th, and the speakers at this event

are phenomenal, as they always are.

Dr. Stephen J. Lawson, founder of One Passion Ministries, is on the roster.

Paul Washer is on the roster.

Rev. Jeff Thomas, Rev. Armen Tamassian, who I keep telling you, I'm

not exaggerating when I think, when I tell you that I think Rev. Armen Tamassian is going to be a household

name amongst Reformed Christians over the next decade.

He is that powerful and gifted.

He's a young man, a young pastor, but with gifts and abilities and wisdom

far beyond his age.

I just look forward to every moment that I have, every occasion in Providence that I have to hear

Rev. Armen Tamassian preach.

Richard Colwell Jr. and Andrew Quigley are also on the roster.

I've not yet heard these brothers preach, but since Sermon Audio selected them, I am very confident

they are phenomenal.

If you'd like to join me Thursday and Friday, December 19th and 20th, at the Foundations Conference in New York

City, go to thefoundationsconference .com, thefoundationsconference .com, and it

is a conference for men in ministry leadership, so I hope to see you

there if you are in that category.

Then in January, I'm packing up my bags again and heading down south to Atlanta, Georgia, to the Georgia

International Convention Center, technically in College Park, Georgia, a suburb of Atlanta, for the G3

Conference 2020.

That's Thursday, January 16th, through Saturday, January 18th.

The G3 stands for Gospel, Grace, and Glory, and the speakers

are extraordinary as they always are at this event as well.

One of the largest lineup of speakers I've ever seen at any conference.

Kosti Hinn, who, believe it or not, is the nephew of the notorious false teacher,

Benny Hinn.

Kosti, on the other hand, is a really gifted, biblically faithful,

scripturally dedicated, doctrinally sound pastor.

He's a Reformed Baptist pastor and a cessationist in California and spends a lot of his ministry,

outside of his own pulpit, that is, exposing his own uncle and those that affiliate with him in the Word of Faith

movement for being the deceptive, dangerous, deadly, and damning deceivers

that they really are.

He's on the lineup.

Daryl Bernard Harrison, who is a new addition to the team at Grace TU Ministries, the ministry of John MacArthur.

David Miller, a really phenomenal old -school preacher.

Derek Thomas, who is a name that is definitely familiar to the vast majority of Reformed Christians.

My friend, Dr. James R. White of Alpha and Omega Ministries is on the roster.

Joel Beeke, president of the Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary, who

I've also known, going back to the 90s, and have the privilege of having called him a friend all these

years.

Again, we have at this conference Paul Washer and Stephen J. Lawson.

Phil Johnson, executive director of Grace TU Ministries, the ministry of John MacArthur.

Stephen J. Nichols, the president of Reformation Bible College, the college founded by the late R .C. Sproul and Ligonier Ministries.

Todd Friel of Wretched TV and Wretched Radio.

Tom Askell, executive director of Founders Ministries, the Calvinistic ministry within the Southern

Baptist Convention.

Vody Baucom, extraordinary, extraordinary, powerful speaker and teacher

and preacher that you've got to hear and see if you've never been at a Vody Baucom event.

And this January, for the first time ever at G3, John MacArthur himself

is on the roster.

And I am so excited about that because in all my years of being a Christian since the 1980s, I've never

been in the same room with John MacArthur.

I've never been in the presence of his preaching and teaching live there in the

same building.

So I am so looking forward to that.

If you want to join me January 16th through the 18th at the G3 conference, go to G3conference .com,

G3conference .com.

And oh, by the way, the theme is Worship Matters.

Obviously a very vital theme and a very controversial theme in the 21st century, unfortunately.

So many battles amongst evangelicals, amongst themselves, about worship.

And so, if you'd like to join me, go to G3conference .com.

Also, I strongly urge you, if you have a parachurch ministry like I have, the Iron Trip and

Zion Radio program, if you have some kind of a parachurch organization or business or a

special event or even a church that you want to promote to the body of Christ, this

is an ideal place to set up an exhibitors booth because there's over 5 ,000 people that attend this every year.

And with John MacArthur there this January, I think they're going to have over 6 ,000.

I can't guarantee that, but I am very confident they're going to have over 6 ,000 people there.

If you want to join me at the G3 Conference, go to G3conference .com, G3conference .com.

And I would suggest, as I said, that you not only register to attend, but register for an exhibitors booth before they

run out of room if an exhibitors booth applies to you and what you do in

regards to ministry or business.

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By the way, if you are not a member of a local Bible -believing church and you're not even prayerfully looking for one, you're living in

rebellion against God, please rectify that situation.

Send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com and put in the subject line something like, I need a church home.

I have lists of biblically faithful churches all over the world, and I've already helped a number of ironsharpensironradio listeners

find churches, not only that they have joined personally, but churches that they are looking for for

family, friends, and loved ones, and also churches they're looking for when they're going on vacation.

So send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com, and I will do my best to help you find a church near where you

are living or near where you are vacationing or near where your loved ones live.

That's chrisarnson at gmail .com and put, I need a church home.

Also, if you want to advertise with us, as long as whatever it is you're promoting is compatible with what we believe, send in

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That's chrisarnson at gmail .com.

That's also the email address where you can send in a question to our guest, Nate Pickowitz, the

pastor of Harvest Bible Church in Gilmont and Ironworks, New Hampshire, and we are

discussing small -town ministry in the liberal mission field of New England.

And, Pastor Nate, if you would, you were going to tell a story about your hometown.

Sure, it's good to be back on here.

Just something we were talking about off

the thing into, I

never knew the history of,

so I went on

a Puritan -style meeting house,

and he says to us,

he's the first church in Gilmont and New Hampshire.

He held strictly to the doctrines of grace

and exemplified the truths of the gospel and his life and death.

On top of this tombstone, and he says, who in the world is this?

Because I don't know, you know, what are his,

to find out,

reform theology to the

academy, a training, 20 years later, there was a

farm boys on how

to preach.

It's like I'm, my

goodness, it was fantastic.

So, in about a month or so, I'm scheduled to preach at a local church in the area.

There's a whole sermon or

a lecture,

his old sermons, and so I'm going to be preaching the gospel from his old sermons,

seminary,

find these things.

Four weeks that I was springing my step,

old sermons, journals, whatever.

You just never know what kind

of way.

Of course, that can backfire on you.

I have a friend, I'm not making this up.

I have a friend who was a deacon at a Baptist church in eastern Suffolk County,

Long Island.

Keep in mind, eastern Suffolk County, Long Island.

And he was digging through the church attic.

They were cleaning out the church attic and throwing stuff away.

And he found the, what do they call those notes at a meeting?

It just flew out of my head.

Getting senility at an early age.

Yeah, right.

Like meeting notes. Yeah.

But anyway,.

In the early 1900s, this church was on the verge of a

split over the issue of whether or not you could be a member of the Ku Klux Klan.

Oh, my word.

Well, obviously, yeah.

We have to repudiate that.

That's horrific.

Some churches, I mean, you know, you go digging around and you never, I mean, I've heard of that where churches find,

you know, buried in their archives the New Hampshire Baptist Confession or the Westminster.

And they start reading it and say, what is this?

And, you know, I've actually heard of it.

And they've lost their way

again.

The faithful, sometimes, especially as a church planter, I mean, you feel like you're, you know, you're

on uncharted territory.

You just don't even know where, what.

We have,.

Let's see here.

We have Susan Margaret in Dauphin County, Pennsylvania, who has a question.

She says, in the scriptures, Jesus had a different approach when he was

facing false religious leaders than he did with your run -of -the -mill

sinner that might even be involved in scandalous sin, sexual sin, and other kinds of sins like

that.

But he seemed to be always much more righteously indignant and

angry and forceful with his words than he was with those who are prostitutes and other kinds

of sinners.

Do you think that churches and pastors and Christian individuals,.

Therefore,.

Should be taking different approaches, possibly depending upon where they are located?

You might be more righteously indignant on a regular basis with those in the Bible Belt who are

deceived into thinking that they are Christians but are truly as lost as lost can be.

You might be taking a different approach there than you would, such as in New England, where most of the people

are totally foreign to Christianity, are pagans, were not raised in any kind of a biblical faith,

and yet are people who are in great need of a Savior, nonetheless.

Would this difference of approach make any sense to you?

For the sake of taking my righteous indignation for times of

sparse use, if I can, I think the point of the question is a good one,

no matter where you are.

Or maybe they just don't know.

When people were coming

into

her life, you know,

when he dealt with her

and

then just

berated a friend of mine

who didn't

know what was going on.

And, you know, he struggled to fit in, but he just wanted to hear the Bible.

We hear a lot of...

Yes, amen.

And I think the... I'm assuming the heart of a lot of what

she was saying, at least when she was referring to the Bible Belt

part, not that that would be the only place in the country or the world where this would be

applicable, but it is very dangerous to let professing Christians

be at ease and to coast through life thinking that they have eternal

life when they really don't.

Yes.

And that may be something that, unfortunately, many churches, many pastors, many

elder boards are too fearful of rattling the cage of professing

Christians because they don't want to lose the...

They don't want the collection plate to be thinned out.

Right.

No, yeah, it's...

You know, it's messy and it can be really hard because there's so many things you have to navigate and it's hard

to give a blanket answer for every situation because...

And what encouraging things can you tell us about what you are seeing

in regards to the faith in that area

of New England that you are in?

We've heard some of the negative things that exist there.

Tell us about some of the things that give you a lot of hope.

Maybe you're even getting optimistic about a true revival again

occurring by the grace and mercy of God in that area.

Anything that you could tell us about the positive things you see happening?

Yeah, there are tons of things that are going on right now that give me cause for great encouragement.

In the last, even five years or so,

two wagons I want to hitch myself is sound doctrine.

I'm really talking about Reformed theology.

But when I...

When

I...

More Bible preaching, more churches and

denominations in a

couple of years

on

a

journey,

a pastoral journey to find themselves a Bible teacher.

There are churches that are doing that.

So God has a remnant for sure

on gospel ministry that I've

never seen.

In fact, that reminds me I'd like to have our listeners pray for a friend who is actually

experiencing something nearly identical to what you just said.

And perhaps it is identical, not that the outcome is exactly the same.

But I know a man, I'm not going to mention his name because of the personal nature of the situation.

But he is a pastor, an evangelical, Bible -believing, Reformed pastor who was called

to a church within a notoriously very liberal

denomination.

And the folks there were totally sick and tired of the

rapidly leftist direction that this denomination is racing to, has

already landed in, but is even racing further and further to the left.

And a lot of the people are older people and they just, they wanted somebody who was going to be

back -to -the -Bible kind of a guy.

And they called this man, he is their pastor.

He was used successfully by God to lead this congregation out of that denomination.

But, unfortunately, there is such a thing as people who

are morally and socially conservative, but they're not necessarily born again.

And he was actually having a hard time from some of the congregants

who were furious with him because he did not allow into membership a heterosexual

couple that was living together without being married.

So, you know, it would have been fine with them for him to ban the homosexual couple, but as far as the

heterosexual couple,.

No, no, no,.

You gotta let them in, they're nice people.

So, please pray for this brother.

He's going through some interesting challenges.

Yeah, I've seen this up here,

even just in my...

I

think

we have to

be careful

when

we're

flying and just see if maybe I know this brother.

Oh, yeah, definitely.

In fact, he would probably love it if you were to contact him.

Sure, excellent.

Just to give him some encouragement.

Let's see here.

We have...

We have somebody that has a question and I'll ask it and then I'll have you answer it when we come back from our final break.

We have CJ in Lyndonhurst, Long Island, New York, who says, in your

area, I'm assuming that a lot of churches are the mainline Congregationalist churches that

once were Puritan -filled and now are filled with apostates and liberals.

Have you ever heard of the denomination called the Four Cs, C -C

-C -C, that many who have become Bible -believing Christians who

are former pastors in the liberal Congregationalist churches have joined into

the Four Cs because of its Bible -believing stance?

So, we'll have you answer that when we come back and I am familiar with that denomination.

I have a friend, actually, in Manhattan who is the pastor of the...

I think it's the New Village Congregationalist Church, which is a conservative,

reformed congregation that has adopted the Savoy Declaration.

But that's the Conservative Congregational Christian Conference.

That's the Four Cs.

But we'll have you answer that when we get back.

This is our final break.

If you want to join us, the email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back after these messages from our sponsors.

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Learn more about us at thehavenli .com, and join us this Sunday at 4 .30 p

.m., 33 Bayshore Road, Deer Park, New York.

Got to tell you, for my money, Chris Arnzen's radio program is just the best.

Iron. Criticizing. Iron.

I think that's what it's called.

This is Todd Friel of Wretched Radio and TV, with Phil Johnson of Grace To You, inviting

everybody to come to the G3 conference, which has almost instantly become one of the best conferences in the country.

And it is.

It's a great conference.

I love it.

And Chris Arnzen was there last year.

He's been there, I think, every year.

It's great to see him there.

You and I actually did some recordings in the lobby at that place, which is a highlight for me.

So tons of stuff going on.

Yeah.

Tons of great speakers.

And no matter where you are in the building, you will hear Chris Arnzen's laugh.

And that's worth the price of admission alone.

If you would like to join Phil, me, Chris, and a cavalcade of great preachers, so it should be

a cavalcade of great preachers, and me, g3conference .com, g3conference

.com.

And now there's even more exciting news.

John MacArthur himself is now also on the lineup at the G3 conference, Thursday, January

16th through Saturday, January 18th, 2020.

Go to g3conference .com, g3conference .com.

See you there.

Did you know that all believers are priests?

In 1 Peter 2, verse 9, the Apostle Peter describes Christ's church as comprising a chosen

race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God's own possession, so that you may

proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light.

So if you're a Christian, you're also a priest.

Now you can find the newest styles in Reformed and Protestant apparel at CitizenPriest .com.

CitizenPriest .com specializes in Christian -themed t -shirts and clothing, especially for

Reformed Christians.

CitizenPriest .com's merchandise is purposefully scripture -based and meant for the edification of the

saints and the furtherance of the gospel.

Let everyone know that you stand firm on the doctrines of the Reformed faith by wearing apparel from

CitizenPriest .com.

Visit CitizenPriest .com today.

As host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, I frequently get requests from listeners for church recommendations.

A church I've been strongly recommending as far back as the 1980s is Grace Covenant Baptist Church

in Flemington, New Jersey, pastored by Alan Dunn.

Grace Covenant Baptist Church believes it's God's prerogative to determine how He shall be worshiped and how He

shall be represented in the world.

They believe churches need to turn to the Bible to discover what to include in worship and how to worship

God in spirit and truth.

Grace Covenant Baptist Church endeavors to maintain a God -centered focus.

Reading, preaching, and hearing the Word of God, singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs,

baptism and communion are the scriptural elements of their corporate worship, performed with faith, joy,

and sobriety.

Discover more about Grace Covenant Baptist Church in Flemington, New Jersey at

gcbcnj .squarespace .com.

That's gcbcnj .squarespace .com.

Or call them at 908 -996 -7654.

That's 908 -996 -7654.

Tell Pastor Dunn that you heard about Grace Covenant Baptist Church on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

I'm Dr. Gary Kimbrough, pastor of Bethlehem Baptist Church in Laurel, Mississippi.

God tells us in James 1 -27 that pure and undefiled religion is a visit to fatherless and widows and their affliction.

In the providence of God three years ago, I discovered a poor, small church outside Lusaka, Zambia, in a township called

Kabanana, who are taking care of 24 orphans.

I found them just at the time when they had lost all their funding.

What was I to do?

Could I just say, God bless you and walk away?

The situation of the children set heavily upon me.

As I was praying concerning this need, it came to me, I trust from the Lord, to tell the orphans' plight.

To a broader audience.

The entire need for their clothing, food, education, and some medical services is $73 per month per child.

If just 50 of us would give $35 a month, we could meet the need.

Bethlehem Baptist Church will pay the fee to get the funds there, so if you give a dollar, a dollar will get to the orphans.

In this season of hope and giving, will you consider giving hope to 24 orphans?

Please send your gift of any amount to Bethlehem Baptist Church, 838 Reed Road, Laurel, Mississippi

39443, or donate through our website, bbclaurel .com.

Again, the address is Bethlehem Baptist Church, 838 Reed Road, Laurel, Mississippi

39443, or bbclaurel .com.

Thank you.

My name is Steve Lawson, founder and president of One Passion Ministries, as well as teaching fellow for Ligonier

Ministries.

I serve as professor of preaching and oversee the Doctor of Ministry program at the Master's Seminary in Los Angeles.

I would like to recommend the church where one of my preaching students, Andy Woodard, serves as the pastor.

It's called New Covenant Church, NYC.

They are a Reformed Baptist church that meets in Midtown Manhattan.

You can find their service times and location on their website, which is www

.ncc .nyc.

They believe in a sovereign God who commands all men everywhere to repent and believe the gospel.

If you're looking for a church that believes in expository preaching, which is simply biblical preaching,

in New York City, I'd like to recommend that you visit New Covenant Church, NYC.

Again, their information can be found at www .ncc .nyc.

Have a great day.

Iron Sharpens Iron welcomes Solid Rock Remodeling to our family of sponsors.

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understanding, and exceeding your expectations.

They deliver personalized project solutions with exceptional results.

Solid Rock Remodeling offers a full range of home renovations, including kitchen and bath

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For a clear, detailed professional estimate, call this trustworthy team of problem solvers

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Call Solid Rock Remodeling at 717 -697 -1981,

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Solid Rock Remodeling, bringing new life to your home.

Lindbrook Baptist Church on 225 Earl Avenue in Lindbrook, Long Island is teaching God's timeless truths in

the 21st century.

Our church is far more than a Sunday worship service.

It's a place of learning where the scriptures are studied and the preaching of the gospel is clear and relevant.

It's like a gym where one can exercise their faith through community involvement.

It's like a hospital for wounded souls where one can find compassionate people and healing.

We're a diverse family of all ages.

Enthusiastically serving our Lord Jesus Christ.

In fellowship, play, and together.

Hi, I'm Pastor Bob Walderman and I invite you to come and join us here at Lindbrook Baptist Church and see all that a church can

be.

Call Lindbrook Baptist at 516 -599 -9402.

That's 516 -599 -9402 or visit LindbrookBaptist .org.

That's LindbrookBaptist .org.

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here.

If you've watched my Dividing Line webcast often enough, you know I have a great love for getting Bibles and other

documents vital to my ministry rebound to preserve and ensure their longevity.

And besides that, they feel so good.

I'm so delighted I discovered Post -Tenebrous Lux Bible rebinding.

No radio ad will be long enough to sing their praises sufficiently, but I'll give it a shot.

Jeffrey Rice of Post -Tenebrous Lux is a remarkably gifted craftsman and artisan.

All his work is done by hand from the cutting to the pleating of corners to the perimeter stitching.

Jeffrey uses the finest in buttery soft imported leathers in a wide variety of gorgeous colors like the

turquoise goat skin tanned in Italy used for my Nestle All in 28th edition with a navy

blue goat skin inside liner and the electric blue goat skin from a French tannery used to rebind a

Reformation study Bible I used as a gift.

The silver gilding he added on the page edges has a stunning mirror finish resembling highly polished

chrome.

Jeffrey will customize your rebinding to your specifications and even emboss your logo into the leather

making whatever he rebinds a one -of -a -kind work of art.

For more details on Post -Tenebrous Lux Bible rebinding go to

PTLBibleRebinding .com.

That's PTLBibleRebinding .com.

Paul wrote to the church at Galatia.

For am I now seeking the approval of man or of God?

Or am I trying to please man?

If I were still trying to please man I would not be a servant of Christ.

Hi, I'm Mark Lukens Pastor of Providence Baptist Church.

We are a Reformed Baptist Church and we hold to the London Baptist Confession of Faith of 1689.

We are in Norfolk, Massachusetts.

We strive to reflect Paul's mindset to be much more concerned with how God views what we say and what we do

than how men view these things.

That's not the best recipe for popularity but since that wasn't the apostles priority it must not be ours either.

We believe by God's grace that we are called to demonstrate love and compassion to our fellow man and to be vessels

of Christ's mercy to a lost and hurting community around us and to build up the body of Christ in truth and love.

If you live near Norfolk, Massachusetts or plan to visit our area please come and join us for worship and fellowship.

You can call us at 508 -528 -5750.

That's 508 -528 -5750.

Or go to our website to email us listen to past sermons worship songs or watch our TV program

entitled Resting in Grace.

You can find us at Providence Baptist Church MA .org.

That's Providence Baptist Church MA .org or even on sermonaudio .com.

Providence Baptist Church is delighted to sponsor Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Welcome back.

This is Chris Arnzen and this is our final segment of today's interview with Nate Pikowitz.

If you have a question you better send it in immediately because we're rapidly running out of time.

ChrisArnzen at gmail .com is the email address.

Pastor Nate, if you could summarize in about three minutes what you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our

listeners today about our subject.

Yeah, I think one of the big things is that there's hope.

You know,

God

is

always

patient.

Oh yeah, I forgot the four C's.

That's right.

No, just very quickly about that.

I mean, I have heard about churches doing that.

It was a huge takeover of the Congregationalist movement back in the 1820s.

But, you know, churches are finding

the fine denominations.

Land on that.

Trust

that.

Yes, and I don't know if you're familiar with the exact denomination he was referring to, but that's the four

C's group mainly made up of people formerly in the United Church of Christ who left

there because of the apostasy and leftist leaning.

Not even leaning.

They've jumped over any fence that would be leaning totally into the leftist apostasy.

Yeah.

I don't know a bunch about it, but I do know of them and I know churches who have gone that route and

have gone beyond that just because I've read about them.

Yes, and if anybody wants more information about that denomination, our listener sent in the

email.

It's cccusa .com.

Cccusa .com.

And my friend Pastor Kirk, who pastors in Greenwich Village at a church

in that denomination, Kirk Vanderswag,.

He's a pastor.

His website is.

Well, I want to thank you so much, Pastor Nate Pikowitz.

I want to make sure you also give your contact information.

I know that your church website is Harvest

Bible.

Uh, wow, I need glasses.

Hang on.

Before you go too far, we've actually got a different website.

We've made it a lot easier.

Let me, I'll give the contact info.

Here we go.

Ready?

So our church's website is

nh .org.

And the conference, don't forget, it's August 1st through the 3rd at the Deering Center Community Church in Portland, Maine.

That's where our guest will be one of a number of speakers, one of four speakers, I believe.

That's the Fellowship Conference, New England.

If you want to attend that August 1st through the 3rd, go to fellowshipconferencenewengland .com.

Fellowshipconferencenewengland .com.

Don't forget, tomorrow, my guest is Dr. Tony Costa, Professor of Apologetics and Islam at Toronto Baptist Seminary.

I hope you all always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior than you are a

sinner.