Giving Mormons the Gospel

I don't know how he got on the cross, but like, um, what he did beforehand, like he

prayed for all our sins, and he bled out of every pore, and...

Do you believe, though, that faith in Christ is what saves you?

Oh, definitely.

What about works?

Works?

Yeah, I definitely think good works plays a big part in it, and, um, yeah,

just doing your best, trying to put in an effort towards, you know, God.

Would you be willing to come have a conversation with us about the gospel?

This is actually what we're sharing.

This is what's in here.

It says, Are You Saved by Grace?

And we're talking here about what the Bible says, that we are saved by faith alone, and Christ alone.

And we're showing comparisons between the Bible and what the LDS Church is

teaching about works.

Because the scriptures do say that you cannot be saved by works, but it's only through your

faith.

Right?

That's consistent.

But see, for sure you believe that.

My problem is, the LDS Church teaches that you're saved by

faith, plus all you can do.

So that's like a contradiction, right, with what the Bible says.

So we're sharing the gospel with people because the Bible says that if you add

anything to being saved by faith, that you're actually

what's called apostate.

That you're not truly a believer, that you're actually outside of the faith.

And the scriptures teach that it is merely by your faith that you are saved, not plus

anything else.

So we're concerned for our LDS neighbors because we believe, the scriptures are clear,

and that the church is teaching something contrary and opposite to what the Bible says.

Does that concern you at all?

Um, not so much, because I know that, well, we

do make mistakes here on earth.

We have a God that is merciful towards us.

You know, he'll forgive us for anything, and eventually we'll all make our way back to him.

No, and I believe that as well.

I believe that grace is sufficient to save, and that that grace covers my sin.

Yeah.

Right?

But I also, the scriptures also show that no amount of works that I

do are going to get me closer to God, are going to get me to another level.

And I'm not going to become a God one day.

So, there's a verse, Isaiah 43, 10, where God says, There's no God formed before

me, none shall there be after me.

But do you know that the LDS church teaches that you can actually become a God one

day, right?

So, that's something else that I'm concerned about as well.

The Bible teaches there's only one God, right?

In fact, the Jews believe there's only one God.

They're monotheists.

So, only one God, right?

That was the God who revealed himself to the Jews, and he continues to reveal himself to believers.

So, that's a contradiction, though, right?

If there's only one God, but it seems that we can all become God today, right?

That doesn't work.

So, I would ask, how would you reconcile that?

Are you going to go with what the Bible says, that there is only one God?

Or would you go with, you know, you can become a God one day.

In fact, there are many gods, an endless amount of gods.

And you will be one, like, one day, if you do these things and believe.

Does that make sense?

Yeah.

I don't know.

I think that's just the revelation that's been given to me.

It's something that I believe, because it's something that, you know, our prophet has told us is going to

happen.

What would you take, though, if the Bible doesn't say that?

If the Bible didn't say that?

If your prophets are saying one thing, but the Bible says that there's only one God,

and that you can't become a God one day.

I think that the Bible has, um, it's been translated quite

a few times.

And I think that the King James Version is probably the only

version that is true.

What would you say, though, if the King James Version also said that?

I don't know.

I think that would be something I'd have to...

Can I show you?

Sure.

So, let me pull up, this is just a Bible app.

Yeah.

Okay, so I'm going to go to my versions here.

King James Version.

Okay.

And I'm going to go to the same verse that I just shared with you.

And it's Isaiah.

Isaiah 43.

Verse 10.

So, the reason why we're sharing these things is not, is for you.

If you have a King James Bible, go check this out, right?

Check this out for yourself.

Because if you have the wrong God, you have a God that you cannot save.

And that's our concern for people, is that you would come to faith in one true God.

And that the Bible would consistently share this message.

And that you would believe it.

And that you would, if something contradicts it, that you would believe it.

Because the Bible is clear about these things.

And that's not the only verse.

There's Isaiah 44, 6.

Thus saith the Lord, I am the King, there is no God besides me.

So, there are multiple.

It's not just this verse.

There are many.

So, I just ask people to go to that, to themselves.

Do you have a King James Bible yourself?

If you check out Isaiah 43, 44, 45, consistently over and over.

You will see God saying that I am the only God.

There are no other.

I know not one who says.

And that you would see that for yourself.

Our contact information is in fact on these.

If you want to reach out to us, we're a Christian church that's in Sandy.

But we have, our pastor is actually here.

He's right there.

And many of our members are here.

And we're all just sharing the truth with people.

So, would you maybe consider that?

Let me give you this one as well.

But would you reach out to us maybe?

And if you have questions, you know, contact us.

Alright, what was your name again?

Mia.

Mia, Dusty.

Nice to meet you.

Noel, come on, let's go.

Can I introduce you?

This is my pastor.

Hi, I'm Wade.

Hi, nice to meet you.

Nice to meet you, yeah.

So, hanging out?

What you doing?

Yeah, just walking around.

Right on.

You go to school over here then?

No, I'm not in school right now.

Oh, okay.

Yeah.

So you're done with high school?

Yeah.

Nice, cool.

So you went to high school and you're here then?

Yeah.

Okay, nice.

You, uh, supposing you're a Latter -day Saint?

Yeah?

Okay.

Do you have kind of questions coming up or, I mean...

Not really, no.

Yeah?

Not at the moment.

Oh, okay.

Yeah.

Did you, uh, did you have questions ever kind of for your bishop or your parents growing up about it?

Um, a little bit.

I've always really been the kind of person that kind of just...

I've always had a strong faith in what I was taught and what I believe.

And I... I would have those questions and I always kind of had the mentality that, you know what, I don't know all the answers now, but...

Yeah.

I'll figure it out one day.

Yeah, sure, sure.

Simple faith or whatever?

Yeah, yeah.

Okay, nice.

Um, are you going towards sacrament meetings weekly and stuff like that?

You're going with your family?

Mm -hmm.

Yeah?

Okay, nice.

What are those like for you?

Um, I love it.

It's so awesome.

Yeah?

Yeah.

They have, um, your bishop speaks or they appoint certain men to speak sometimes, some

ladies?

Or is that just on testimony night, testimony day?

Um, no, they'll usually, um, pick a couple people to...

Yeah?

You know, share talks, share experiences, things they've learned and...

Yeah.

Do you guys do Sunday school right now?

Yeah?

Are you going through the New Testament?

Um...

Or what are you going through?

Right now?

I think so, yeah.

Book of Romans?

Or...

No?

Um, like Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.

You've gone through those?

Okay.

We're really doing it.

Nice.

Yeah.

Okay, cool.

Um, what did you and Dusty talk about?

We were just talking about, you know, um, the differences between our two churches and, you know, some

concerns she had and...

Yeah.

What do you think about those?

I think it's interesting to see other perspectives, other points of view.

Yeah, yeah.

Things I don't really think about because it's not really, you know, what I've learned.

Sure, sure.

It's cool, like, to see those other points of view.

Yeah, we, um, we've, uh...

We basically believe that the Scripture, the Bible alone, is the sole infallible

rule of faith and practice for the Church of God.

And so, like, we're concerned, you know, obviously about

extra revelation, things that the prophets have said that maybe differ

from what the Bible has spoken and said.

You know, like, you have moments, like, I'm sure there's one famous

one, like blacks in the priesthood, stuff like that.

People bring that up.

Yeah.

You know, what do you make of that?

Like, did God change His mind?

Or, you know, why were they accepted and not accepted at one point?

What do you make of that?

I would say that it's just one of those things that I don't really know.

And I also haven't really looked into it that much.

But, I don't know, it's one thing that if I, I think if I really

researched it and really studied it, I could figure it out one day.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, it might be worth checking out.

Yeah.

You know, I don't know.

Did he talk to you about our concerns with eternal progression?

Becoming a God?

Yeah.

Right?

So it's not like, it's not like becoming like Jesus.

You know, the way it's taught is you're fully taking on His nature.

Yeah.

And that's foreign to the Bible completely, where we see

that there's one God.

He's the only God over all the universe, over all creation, seen and unseen.

He even says, the Lord says, before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

He says, I know not one other God.

So it's kind of like I've heard my, you know, LDS people who I've met.

They're like, yeah, yeah, I can become a God one day.

You know, Brigham Young has talked about the fact that, you know, being the

rulers of universes and having, you know, planets and things like that is something that men can

eventually progress and obtain.

But again, that's not in the Bible.

So that's just one big thing to us is I think the treasure of

eternal life will be Jesus and living with Him forever.

And it won't be being Him or being God and and then starting

over and having a creation of my own.

You know, I just can't even imagine that.

You know what I mean?

Yeah, I think.

I know.

I think that's something that the Bible was written a long time ago, but we have a lot of

modern revelation now and a lot more revelation that maybe people weren't ready for back then.

And I was looking at something that we can't really comprehend right now.

We can't really understand.

But one day I know that maybe we will.

Gotcha.

You know, in the next life, like we'll probably like we'll figure it out.

We'll learn how to do that and the importance of that.

How do you think.

How do you think someone can be saved?

Right.

Like, you know, it says that

apart from Jesus, the Bible says we're sons of wrath.

We're sons of disobedience.

It says in Romans chapter three that no one is good, not even one.

There's venom of asps is under their lips.

All have turned aside together.

We've become useless.

Paul speaks to the nature of who we are, that we have totally rebelled against the

one true God and that without him intervening, we can't

be with him.

We can't go to heaven.

And, you know, obviously, I think a lot of Latter -day Saints

say that everyone's just going to be saved.

But it also makes me wonder, then why does Jesus talk about hell more than he talks about heaven?

You know, there's something we're being saved from.

Yeah.

We're being saved from the penalty of our sin, which would afford us an eternity in hell.

That's what it says.

It says the place of weeping and gnashing of teeth, where the fire never dies and the worm

dies not.

This place of torment he talks about.

So we're saved from that.

So, you know, how is someone saved according to your beliefs?

Well, I believe that we have a very merciful and forgiving God.

And he sent us here knowing that we were going to make mistakes.

We were going to mess up.

And the natural man in us, you know, wants to rebel against God.

But I know that, you know, that's the whole purpose of his plan is he wants us to

strive to become like him.

He wants us to strive to do good, even with the natural man in us, you know, wanting to rebel, if that

makes sense.

He wants to see us put in that effort to return back to him one day.

Yeah.

Jesus.

Yeah.

The only thing is Jesus speaks to like the covenant breaking Pharisees and he's like, you're whitewashed tombs.

Woe to you.

You know, he talks about how judgment is coming for them.

Destruction is coming for them.

When Aaron made, you know, reverse backwards, when Aaron made the

golden calf and the Israelites worshipped it, the Hebrews worshipped it.

They had the Levites, the priests, killed all those people

at God's order.

You know, God is perfectly righteous and he allows for no sin.

And that's why we need someone to die for us to take away our sin.

Right.

So, so that's that's kind of the biggest thing is like it's not

just simply making mistakes.

It's that we, according to Scripture, our nature

after the fall in the garden has fundamentally changed.

It says that Jesus says in the Gospel of John, he says, he who sins

is a slave of sin.

You've become a slave to it.

And apart from him making us alive and making us born again, we can't do anything to remedy that.

So.

Anyways.

Perfected in what way?

Sure.

What do you think about what's going to happen to the

Muslim that kills a bunch of Christians in suicidal jihad?

What happens to him?

I think that God understands.

Like I said, you're going to run into Christians who will ask you about it.

He understands everyone and what they're thinking is best for their purpose and for their religion.

Because you know, some of those Muslims, they think that it's part of their religion.

Yeah. Yeah.

They're sincere with their beliefs.

Yeah.

And so I think that God's very understanding of that.

And he knows that their hearts are in the right place, I guess, if that makes sense.

Even though it's not necessarily the right thing that they're doing, but they're doing it out of their,

you know, out of their relief and out of their faith.

You know, he knows they're doing it for like someone to give them rest.

Yeah.

Thing is, in Revelation 21, Jesus says that all the murderers and

liars and cowards will have their place in the lake of fire that burns forever.

Yeah.

So it doesn't sound like, like unrepentant, it doesn't sound like unrepentant

murderers who die in jihad will make it to heaven.

That's just what it says.

I think that in the next life, there's more realization in the next life.

And there's more, there's just, you know, you'll

know more when you get to the next life.

More will be revealed to you in the next life.

And so once you get there, you know, you'll be able to repent once you're there.

That's the thing, though, is it says you must turn from your sin now.

Right.

The Bible says that.

But anyways, I'll let you guys get on with your night.

It was good talking with you.

Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely.

Good to meet you.