Mike Gendron Interview

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ. Based on the theme in Galatians 2 verse 5, where the Apostle Paul said, but we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.

In short, if you like smooth, watered down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you. By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King.

Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.

The Program Format and Wednesday Guest Interviews

Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth, and I'm thankful to be your host today on Wednesday. As you know, Mondays is typically a sermon that has been recorded at Bethlehem Bible Church that we play.

Tuesdays, Pastor Steve and I, as we discuss issues in the local church. Thursdays, I try to teach something, a positive doctrine. What does the Bible teach about confession? What does the Bible teach about the deity of Christ?

Something like that. And Fridays, we usually go after people and do some critiquing, some discerning. And on Wednesdays, we like to have guests on who've written books, who have ministries that help us understand the majesty and greatness of Christ.

And today is no different. Today on the phone, we have Mike Gendron, who is the Director of Proclaiming the Gospel Ministry. And Mike is specializing in giving the good news of salvation to Roman Catholics.

Mike, welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry. Well, thank you, Mike, for having me. Mike, give us a little background, your personal background, which leads us into the ministry, because here in New England, 80 of the people here say they're Roman Catholic, even though they don't all practice.

And I know you have a real desire for Roman Catholics to know what the truth is so that they might be saved. What's your background?

Mike Gendron's Conversion Out of Roman Catholicism

Well, I was Roman Catholic family. My uncle was a Roman Catholic priest of 60 years. And I grew up as an altar boy for seven years in high school Catholic Christian doctrine. And then even later after that, I taught the first Little Rock Scripture study in a Dallas Catholic, with a couple of evangelical Bible studies, such as Bible Study Fellowship and Community Bible Study.

So that was when I first got into the Word of God. And as I got into the Word of God, Mike, I had a crisis, because what I was reading about the plan of salvation was diametrically opposed to the plan of salvation.

I was taught as a Roman Catholic. And so I struggled with this. I had a crisis of faith. I didn't know what to do. And as I dug deeper into the Scripture and what the Catholic Church had taught me with the Bible.

And so it was at that point that I cried out to the Lord and he granted me repentance, which as we know is a change of mind. I no longer believed what I was trusting in as a faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

And he became my all sufficient savior. I repented of everything I was doing to try to save myself and Christ alone became my savior. And it was at that time that I had a peace that surpassed all understanding.

I recognized the weight of my sins were placed on Christ and he bore the punishment I deserved. And so ever since then, my life has been radically changed. I no longer live for the temporal things of this world, but I live for the glory of my savior.

And it's my heart's desire to reach out to Roman Catholics who are where I was for so many years of my life. That is believing I was on my way to heaven, but yet destined for a Christless eternity. And I came to realize Mike, that we can be wrong about a lot of things in this life and still survive.

But if we're wrong about what we're trusting for our eternal destiny, we will pay for that mistake forever and forever. I had the joy of growing up in the Boston area. My dad was an army colonel stationed at Fort Devens in Eyre, Massachusetts, just 30 miles from Boston.

And so I grew up being a Red Sox fan. And I've since had the chance to come back to the Boston area and teach in churches on how to reach out to Roman Catholics and effectively give the gospel.

Evangelizing Roman Catholics With Grace and Truth

Well, Mike, with your ministry, Proclaiming the Gospel, and you can go to proclaimingthegospel .org, I've been very encouraged and also helped as a pastor because specifically two of your tracks that you have available, one is called Roman Catholicism, Scripture versus Tradition, and the other one, Have You Ever Been Deceived, subtitled, Which is Worse, To Be Insulted, Embarrassed or Deceived.

Those two tracks I've really been able to use as I sit down and talk with my Roman Catholic friends. So I appreciate that. And that's one of the reasons why I want you to be on. But I didn't know the air connection.

I ride my bike past Fort Devens all the time. Did you know that? No, I didn't, wow. Yeah, we're very, very close in that regard. Mike, tell us a little bit as we're listening today about hating. People talk about, well, it's hate speech, or you're just a Catholic hater.

I'm sure there's a way to talk to a Roman Catholic with hate and with bitterness and with anger. But in light of the second great commandment, love your neighbor as yourself, how can we evangelize Roman Catholics and not be haters?

How does that work?

Well, outside of laying our life down for someone, I think the greatest act of love we can do for anyone is to share the glorious gospel of grace, to show people how they can be forgiven and reconciled to God.

And if a person is trusting in a false religious system, then the worst kind of hate would be to allow them to march proudly towards hell's gate without intervening and sharing the truth. You see, every born-again Christian has been entrusted with a truth, and it's our responsibility and our privilege to share that truth with those who are perishing.

And that's my heart's desire, is that more Christians will get involved in this huge mission field. The Roman Catholic religion, from afar, looks like a Christian denomination because they share some of the fundamentals of the Christian faith, but that's but a veil of truth that hides a false and fatal gospel.

The Roman Catholic plan of salvation is a works righteousness system, whereas the plan of salvation that we see in the Bible is by grace through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, trusting in His righteousness, not our own, and trusting Him as our all-sufficient Savior.

As I witnessed to Roman Catholics, there's probably two things that we have to, and number one is simply that the Bible is our supreme authority in all matters of faith. In Roman Catholicism, there are three different authorities, and so we have to show Catholics that the Bible reigns over the traditions of their church and also over the teachings of quote-unquote infallible men.

In one of the verses I like to take Catholics to is Acts 17, 11, where we see the apostle Paul preaching in the synagogues of Berea, and as he's teaching, the listeners are checking him out with scripture to find out if in fact he's teaching the truth.

In other words, they're testing the veracity of an apostle's teaching with the Word of God, and so I encourage Catholics, if the Bereans were commended by Paul for testing his teaching, shouldn't your pope and your bishop and your priest and anyone come under the same scrutiny as the apostle Paul did?

So that's to show scripture has authority over men, and then we also look at the rebuke the Lord Jesus gave in Mark 7 because the religious leaders of his day were using their traditions to nullify and oppose the Word of God, and so we clearly see the Word of God has supreme authority over traditions and over men.

Now, Mike, the other thing of utmost importance as we witness to Catholics is to show them that Jesus of the Bible is indeed the all-sufficient Savior because Catholics trust in Jesus, but by his death, he merely opened the gates of heaven, and so Catholics must do their part to gain entrance through those gates.

They do not know the Jesus of the Bible. They do not know that he paid the complete penalty. It was nailed to the cross. All the sins that we commit, past and future, are paid for by Christ when we trust in him.

We see in 1 John 1, 7 that the blood of Jesus purifies us from all sin, which means there's no need for purgatory, which, as you know, holds Catholics in bondage, not only in this life, but in the... And so we need to present Christ as our all-sufficient Savior.

His righteousness is our passport into heaven. Our righteous acts are but filthy rags in the sight of a holy God, and so we must repent of our own righteousness and trust the righteousness of Christ, which is given as a gift, as we see in Romans 5, 17.

Amen.

The Need for Catholics to Trust Christ Alone

Well, Mike, we're talking about the gospel to Roman Catholics today. What a mission field we have. If you're listening today and you'd like to read more about this, great articles on the website, proclaimingthegospel .org, talking today with Mike Gendron.

Mike, in light of 20 years, almost, post-ECT, evangelicals and Catholics together, groups of people trying to come together and say we believe in the same God and the same gospel, almost two decades later, what I find interesting is if I ask my congregation, how many of you were saved out of the Roman Catholic Church?

I'd say probably 60 of the people will raise their hand. And if I say to them, is it loving for you to go back into the Catholic Church, family members who are in the church, and tell them about the real gospel?

They seem to be the most fervent, the most artists when they have about, when they have a desire to preach the gospel. Shouldn't evangelicals who got saved out of Roman Catholicism have the most enthusiasm to go back into that system and tell people about free grace?

Absolutely. In fact, I think that is the sign of a true conversion. A quick story, I was privileged to share the gospel with a devout Roman Catholic, the wife of a professional golfer. And after she heard the gospel, we went and visited her priest, and she told the priest she could no longer worship there in the Catholic Church, and she had to remove her son from the ranks of the altar boys.

And so afterwards, she said, I'd like to put together three ring binders of all the verses you shared with me that afternoon. I'd like to send them to all of my family members so that they can know the truth as well.

And so she put together 17 three ring binders for the point of the kingdom of God. That's the sign of true conversion. Now, on the other hand, if you see someone that has no desire out of the Catholic religion,.

Whether or not they're truly born again. Mike, when you look back at the ministry that God has granted you, could you tell us a story about someone who maybe was super mad at you because of what you would say, and then how God converted them, and then now they're partners with you or support your ministry?

There has to be someone like that.

A Hostile Catholic Audience and a Conversion Story

Yeah, there's many, but I'll never forget one Sunday morning, I was preaching at a church in Northern California, and the pastor had encouraged the congregation to invite their Catholic friends. And so after much the pulpit, and they were visibly upset, but they said, Mike, you provoked our thinking.

We'd like to ask you some questions. They invited me to lunch. And so for the next three hours, as they asked me questions, I turned in their Bible, and I let God answer their questions for them. And after about three hours, they were ready to leave.

And I said, Sergio, before you go, can I ask you a question? I said, remember this morning, I gave an illustration that as Catholics, we are told to cling to certain things to save us from the fires of hell.

And I gave an illustration, imagining there was a set of monkey bars suspended over hell. And as long as we're clinging to our baptism and our sacraments and our good works and keeping the law and the sacrifice of the mass and indulgences, then we no longer have to fear hell.

And then I said, imagine that Jesus is suspended between you and hell. And he's saying, let go of those things that cannot save you and put your trust in me. And I promised. He said, yeah, I remember that illustration.

You're ready to let go of those things that cannot save you and put all of your trust in the Lord Jesus Christ. And he just began weeping. And I sensed that he was processing all of this. What am I gonna tell my family?

What am I gonna tell my priest? What am I gonna tell my friends? And I let him go for a couple of minutes and then I put my arm on his shoulder. And I said, Sergio, this will be the wisest and safest decision you ever make in your life because every one of your questions have been answered by God.

You've seen his answers in the Bible and it's the safest decision. Better to trust for your salvation than the Savior himself. And so I asked him again, are you ready to let go and trust Jesus? And his wife blurts out, I am.

Sergio says, well, what do I need to do? And I said, let's let God answer that question too. So I turned to Mark chapter one and I let him read verse 15. The first command of Jesus is to repent and believe the gospel.

And then I turned to Romans 10 verses nine and 10. You confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart God raised him from the dead. You shall be saved. And then I said, Sergio, look at verse 13.

He read, whoever calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved. He bowed his head and prayed the shortest prayer I've ever heard. Wrapped his arms around me and we praise God for bringing salvation. Well, this young man that was converted that day is now one of the Sovereign Grace Church in Modesto, California.

It's truly a work of God's grace. Him come out of darkness into the glorious light of our Savior, just by seeing the word of God, seeing the answers to his call.

How great is that? On your website too, Mike, you have testimonies of grace. People can click on the site to read testimonies of God's grace, which the Roman Catholics need. And I've got another question for you on No Compromise Radio.

Why Born-Again Catholics Must Leave the Catholic Church

Mike, if there is a Roman Catholic, well, let me back up. If there's a person who's been born again, regenerate, and they're still in the Catholic system, that is to say, and even on your website, you've got an article, Catholic Christians, is this an oxymoron?

I believe that there could be some born again folks and they're still trying to get out of the Catholic Church. They're saved by grace. They're bad Catholics. They don't believe Catholic doctrine. What advice would you give a bad Catholic, that is a Catholic who is still worshiping at the Catholic Church, even though they know it's by sovereign grace and Christ's death confirmed by the resurrection alone?

What do we tell them? Well, that's why the Great Commission.

Is to go and make disciples and not go and make decisions, because when a person makes a decision to trust Christ, the discipleship begins. They must now learn to obey everything Christ has commanded.

And hopefully they have a mentor that is teaching them the word of God. But if not, they have to recognize that the Lord seeks worshipers in spirit and in truth, as we see in John 4, 24. And so they cannot continue to worship God in a false religion.

They must come out. And furthermore, the practice of worshiping the Eucharist is the worst sin of idolatry. And we know that God will not share his glory with another. How do we know the Eucharist is a false Christ?

Because Jesus said, and through the word of God, that he will come back a second time and not in relation to sin. That's in Hebrews 9, 28. And so clearly the Eucharist is a false Christ. And so a born again person must come out of the Catholic Church and not participate in that sin and find a church where they can worship God in spirit.

And I agree with you, Mike, there are born again Christians still in the Catholic Church but eventually the spirit of God will lead them out of the Catholic Church as they abide in the word of God and know the truth.

And the truth sets them free from any kind of religious deception.

Roman Catholicism as Apostate Church, Not a Cult

Well, we're talking to Mike Gendron today, Director of Proclaiming the Gospel Ministries. And you can go to his website, proclaimingthegospel .org. If you don't have a copy of Roman Catholicism, Scripture versus Tradition, or have you ever been deceived, you ought to write our email.

You can call up as well, 972 -495 -0485 is the phone number, 972 -495 -0485. And if you can't afford these tracks, you write us at infoatnocompromiseradio .com and we'll go ahead and send you a copy of each one of those tracks for no charge.

We'd be glad to do that. Mike, regarding Franklin Graham's recent scuttle with Billy Graham Association Ministry, is Mormonism a cult? Let's take it off the cult list. Is Roman Catholicism a cult? Why or why not?

Well, I don't believe Roman Catholicism is a cult. If you look at the classic definition of a cult, a cult is that organization which denies the triune God, denies the Trinity. The Roman Catholic Church lifts up the Trinity and they do believe in that and teach it.

I would call the Roman Catholic Church an apostate church. And it, I think, departed from the faith around the fourth century when Constantine made it the official religion of the Roman Empire. And so many people entered the church there through no repentance.

They came in with all of their pagan traditions and pagan practices and were called Christians. And that's when I believe the Roman Catholic religion really began. It was the Genesis when they departed from the scriptures as the supreme authority and started following pagan traditions.

There's always been two streams of Christianity operating side by side, even since the inception of the church. And we see that in 1 John 2, they went out from us because they were never part of us. All apostates in the fourth century is when the apostate Roman religion became apostate.

And then in the Council of Trent in the 16th century, they officially and dogmatically departed from the Christian faith with over 100 anathemas that condemn people that believe the Bible as their supreme authority and trust Christ alone as their all-sufficient Savior.

Assurance of Salvation and Eternal Life

Mike, tell us a little bit about assurance of salvation. When I talk to Roman Catholics, I love to show them about Christ's sufficient death, Hebrews 9, being offered once to bear the sins of many, this great Savior who has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.

But I also like to talk to them about assurance, how you can know, the Bible says, that you have eternal life. And I feel for my Catholic friends. I felt for my Catholic grandmother because she didn't know of assurance.

We've got about three minutes or so left. What would you tell a Roman Catholic about the gospel and that they might know for sure that they're going to heaven? Because I don't think Catholics know that they're going.

I don't think they think they can know.

Well, in fact, I like to lead out with 1 John 5, 13, where John writes to those who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that they may know right here and now that they have in their present possession, eternal, everlasting, never-ending life with the Savior.

That's a powerful promise that we see in 1 John 5, 13. And the reason, Mike, that we have assurance is because the two things that keep anyone out of heaven were both accomplished by Christ. He paid the eternal sin debt that finite man could never pay when it was nailed to the cross at Calvary.

And then perfect righteousness is required for entrance into heaven. And the Lord Jesus gives us His righteousness as a gift. So as long as your sins are fully paid for by Christ and you have His righteousness, you have the assurance of eternal life based not only on the promises of God, but also on His power.

We see in 1 Peter 1, verses one to four, that our inheritance is reserved in heaven in the power of God. He's the one that holds it there. Jesus said, I will never lose you or forsake you. Stay that is trusted in Him.

We sit in the palm of the Father's hand, the palm of the Son's hand. No one can snatch us out. And we also see a great promise in Romans 8. Those God justifies. These are the promises of God who can never lie.

And these are the verses we need to show Roman Catholics so they can trust in Christ alone and also know the salvation in Christ by His grace.

Closing Encouragement and Ministry Resources

We're talking to Mike Gendron, proclaimingthegospel .org. You can go to the website. There's great articles about assurance of eternal life. Does the Vatican still condemn Christians is on the front page.

You can get the e-newsletter sign up. Mike, you've got a DVD, a new DVD out there. They might need to know about where will you spend eternity. Go to YouTube and listen to some of your debates and lectures and sermons.

I really appreciate you being on No Compromise Radio. Anything new coming down the pike from you regarding your writing ministry?

Yes, I'm working on some more tracks. We're also hiring a master's seminary graduate to come on board full time in January. And if there's one thing I could share with the Roman Catholic who might be listening, if they want the assurance of salvation today, they need to leave everything behind and come to the cross of Christ with empty hands of faith, bringing nothing but their sins, forsake their baptism, their good works, their sacraments, their law keeping, leave it all behind, come with empty hands of faith to the cross of Christ, trusting Him alone.

And if you do that today, I'd love to hear from you. And also visit our website. We'd love to encourage you in the faith.

We've talked to Mike Gindron today, proclaiming the gospel, certainly good news. Mike, thank you for your time on No Compromise Radio. Thank you, Mike.

Thanks for having me. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life transforming power of God's word through verse by verse exposition of the sacred text.

Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at six. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston. You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.

The thoughts and opinions expressed on No Compromise Radio do not necessarily reflect those of WVNE, its staff or management.