Catholicism Analysis Aftershow from M2M

Okay, doing an after show so just hold on it'll we'll get people in here a little bit.

So doing this take a little bit for people to come on.

Sorry about the

I'm listening.

Okay.

All right.

Okay.

There we go.

For some reason.

It's not working on rumble right now.

Don't know why it isn't but.

So this is an after show.

We'll see if anybody shows up.

I said 10 or 15 minutes, so I might just get some people some time here before they they come in.

I started it right away.

I was working on the The information to get this so people can come in and talk and hopefully some Roman

Catholics will.

There we go.

Get a little cool air in here because it does get a little warm in this office with four monitors and a bunch of lights.

There we go.

Laura's in.

I was not ten minutes.

No, it wasn't Laura.

The rumble one won't won't kick in.

Oh, I think I know why I could have to do something with it.

I have to do something differently with the rumble each time.

That's what it is and I didn't do that.

It's been a while since I set up the rumble.

So I guess we won't have the rumble thing.

I'll just do the I'll just do the YouTube and

here and that'll be that totally good for now.

All right.

So you want to come on in?

We'll see if anybody shows up.

We'll see if anybody shows up.

I don't think they're going to.

Did you watch the whole thing Laura?

Did you were you paying attention?

You can let me know I'm Correct.

Of course, I'm correct.

I mean that just goes without saying.

She wrote in it in the chat here.

I don't think we can see that because you're correct.

Yeah, that's right.

All right.

That's some coffee in here.

It's been sitting in this cup for a while and it kind of Clumps up a little bit.

Yeah, I thought it was interesting

and I Noticed that some guys have trouble sticking with it the time

constraints.

I try and keep it right there.

What they said I say just tell me what time to stop at I'll quit at that time.

That's what I tell.

So anyway.

Alright, let's see.

It was great.

Good Joanne and humbled clay and Laura.

I'm hoping some Roman Catholics come in because that's right because I am so slick, you know.

When you're slick, you know, what are you gonna say?

It's just how it is.

I Like being slick, you know, you gotta probably tired of that like tall man.

Let's see what he's got here.

Let me go over here.

Not that.

And I'm talking and filling things in and I got the outlines done.

Oh, that's right.

They're gonna tell Let's see quick and slick

that's right during the show.

During this you saw me doing stuff.

I was working on karm and So I got the outlines

updated for the schools I did them all FYI to tell Dave he's gonna do some stuff

with it, but I did it already.

I finished all The all three schools

outline things.

I did it while.

Waiting on.

The Saturday.

What it was that Catholic analysis conference thing.

Analysis.

I just did them.

Oh, yeah, cuz it okay.

See Matt is much like this.

Okay.

Well, you know you guys are welcome to come in here if you want.

I'll put this URL here and you can come in and check it out If you come in.

So get this, okay, I'm gonna tell you something.

I'm really discouraged about something.

This I'll ramble here a little bit.

So you guys know that my daughter's car went on the kaputs.

So I had this car I've been using for years and years.

2012 Ford and So long story short, we sold it to our daughter

and then we put the money into getting me another car with some other money.

So we spent three four weeks looking for a car and finally ended up getting one

and got a Lexus RX 350, you know, it's like eight years old and

Okay, it's been running great.

So yesterday.

Was it yesterday yesterday?

I go into the garage to Get the car and go do an errand.

It won't start.

That's interesting.

Won't start and It goes which usually is a sign of a dead battery.

I'm going what the heck is going on, you know, is it because I left the lights on but it has an auto feature so

shouldn't do that and It just didn't feel right.

It didn't sound right.

So, okay.

Okay.

So this morning I jumped it with my wife's car.

Jumper cables got it running.

I let it run for an hour you know supposed to let it run 20 minutes a half hour and.

Then.

That's when let me see.

I get audio.

Good.

Yeah, that's good and.

And then you're supposed to charge the battery.

I figured the battery was dead for some reason.

So I got an hour running on an hour.

I turn it off go to turn it right back on it won't start

and while it was running I Looked at it and I

realized the one of the headlights is out.

Don't know if it's a starter.

Don't know if it's the alternator.

Don't know if it's the battery.

But that has me concerned obviously,

and so the headlights is out and.

Okay, so that's not good and.

And then you know, I'm working.

You know, I get it started and I turn it off and it starts beeping in different ways.

You know beep beep beep three beeps.

And what the heck's going on.

I tried to open up the Latch in the back.

I'm gonna hit the starter.

I used to work on cars, you know, you had crawl underneath you gotta find it.

You gotta bang it.

It started the starter.

It can just happen something's wrong with the electrical.

It's the battery or the alternator.

So anyway, so I couldn't get the tailgate to open up.

I.

Was trying to get it started.

That was interesting.

And then I you know, I finally got it.

The car started.

Then it would open up the tailgate.

Okay, then I once the car wouldn't start again ago.

I'm done with this.

This is ridiculous.

So I just went in the house and did a few things.

It came out like 10 minutes later and I go in there and the the engines running.

I'm like what the what the heck the engines running.

But I turned it off.

I.

Mean.

Just dumbfounded.

So then I get in the car and I realize it's not running something in the engine is

just spinning real fast like the Radiator fan like what the heck is

going on?

So I hit the brake and hit the turn off button, you know start stop then everything quits.

Get these beeps I said I'm done and

so what we're gonna do is Sunday night.

I'm gonna jump start it again and I'm gonna drive it over to a place that we already have

a schedule just to have it looked at by our mechanic and So they're gonna look at it and

Then that night I'm supposed to drive it over to where I got it CarMax.

Because there's a slight ticking in the engine which is not the can or it cannot be a big deal.

But I figured because I spent that much money in a car.

It's fun.

You know, just have it checked that's all it could be just cold lifters, which isn't a big deal and

So I went over there and I and we made an appointment.

So that's Monday night I got to take it in because they want to listen to it cold Tuesday.

So what I'm gonna do is Sunday get it started drive it over to the.

The.

Mechanics place we have a great mechanics place.

Put the key in the ignition.

Tell them we're having trouble starting it.

Then have them look at it.

Tell me what's wrong with it.

I'll probably see the battery the alternator whatever it is.

And then I'm gonna have them to say call me and then I'm gonna say but don't fix it.

Just get it started because if it runs it runs and hopefully I can get it to.

You know to CarMax, all right, I'll just get my cables and because it ran for an hour.

Okay, it ran for an hour.

So I don't think it's the alternator.

I think it's the battery.

That's what I think so that I'll just drive it over there Sunday night

or Monday night and Leave it so that Tuesday they can check everything and I'm gonna say

the ticking.

Maybe the battery one of the headlights is out.

Why is it you guys haven't caught this stuff

and I'm concerned that it might be a lemon now do I and I have

30 days to turn the car back in?

I'm in my third a week like three and a half weeks.

So I had this ability to say look, you know what?

I don't trust it.

So I'm gonna you know, give it back and then go through the process of trying another car, which I hate all this stuff.

So that's what I'm dealing with today.

Okay, I feel a little bit kind of almost better but not really kind of I hate car trouble.

Also, I used to work on cars.

I mean I should build them.

And I mean I've literally have built engines from the ground up where all the parts to the

engines are in boxes.

And you put you pull everything out laid out and I mean you put the block you put the crank you crank bearings

you put the grease on me, I mean all the way up and Done it

I've been doing if I'd be doing that if it isn't the batter the batter

Doesn't come with a batter.

You mean pancake batter or do you mean baseball batter?

Yeah, it should be good.

It's a nice car.

But what I'm concerned about now is is it a lemon?

But this model in this year supposed to be really good.

They you know the review say yeah, it's a good it's a good model.

It's a good thing.

So it could be just one of those coincidences.

So I'm just gonna you know, see I love working on cars.

My body doesn't allow that anymore I used to like working on cars used to sleep under and So

we also we got the car we got the Extended warranty on it

so that anything happens they have to take care of it.

Anything.

So if the engine needs to be rebuilt because of the lifters.

Praise God is I tell my wife I say When something goes wrong, I say just wait.

Something usually goes better because of it.

So.

If it goes wrong and I say the lifters the headlight the battery you guys check it out.

You got to make sure it's right or I'll turn the car back in.

I'll just tell them and We'll see what happens so maybe I'll end up something better

which I would not complain about.

Okay.

Looks like none of these guys are going to show up.

So, okay, let me ask you what did you think of the The

presentation that they did that he's the guys on all of us on and talking.

Did you like that?

I would like to see that like to see karma do I can arrange the same thing.

I Just want to know and karma the lady.

She did a good job of moderating.

I'm gonna have her do mine, too.

What book did the believers teach out of since a New Testament was not completed?

Old Testament and whatever was provided for by the Apostles.

At that they had in their local area so

so do you guys like my presentation of Stuff on Mary.

Oh, man, I didn't listen to other guys, but man I get so irritated by Catholicism.

Oh I do not like it.

Yeah, seeing

a new feature or something on a new Program.

Oh, I get it.

Interesting.

Huh?

Microsoft meet is you know meeting thing is in with my phone.

Enjoyed all the speakers.

Good.

She's gonna replace me.

Ernie and Laura and Charlie.

Not sure who this she is.

Wish the kayak look would have joined get another few minutes.

They don't.

I don't come out just fail.

Yeah, I know all those guys and could I can call them up and say hey one do something similar.

But I had to tell him when your time's up your time's up.

Don't just keep going.

And because some of them are rather verbose and they just go way beyond.

I Like to be quick and slick.

Get it done get it done.

Yeah, Carmen.

Yeah.

She's great.

It's worth with George and I've met George several times.

He is such a good man of God.

He is so great and He runs a ministry to Muslims.

I mean Carmen's gonna replace us.

What does that mean?

She's gonna replace us.

I mean all of you guys.

Yeah.

Do Catholics have in fighting especially if they disagree with their Pope?

Yes, they do.

Yeah, there are.

They keep it under wraps.

But there are priests and stuff that don't agree with the Pope in a lot of areas and it's it comes

up.

It does happen.

I haven't documented it, but it does happen.

Okay.

What's this

what is this for?

Anybody want to guess?

What is that?

It's something special.

What is it?

I have a Conan wants in.

I can't see the send link.

It's right there and I'll put it in the private show.

Nobody's in private chat.

You can see it, but It's there.

So that's it and it is on here if

you go here.

It should be let me check to make sure it worked.

You're right.

It's a backscratcher.

It's exactly right.

It's what it is.

My mom had it.

So it's like 40 years old or 50 years old or something.

So, where's the count see if it didn't show up.

I believe it did.

Because I sent it to do it after so there it is see right there.

To participate join right there.

It's all right there list it

it's listed.

They should.

Okay.

Excuse me,

huh?

Pretty cool.

I'm waiting and.

Okay, here I am here.

I am.

This is Matt.

All right.

So if anybody in here wants to come in or whatever, there's the link.

And you can just join in.

If you don't want to do it, that's fine.

Give it another few minutes and if it no one wants to come in all this bail.

I got things to do as.

Always, how can they

uphold?

How can they they can't because they can't you're asking me to tell you how to do something that they can't do.

They can't do it.

So you're saying how possibly could have you say, you know, I don't know.

Lost audio.

Did y 'all.

Can you hear me?

Test one two, give me a test.

I'll check the settings.

Test one two three now the settings are still working and the audio is still working.

Good here.

Ryan says that's what I was wondering.

John a it's like they needed reformation from their hair a radical Pope.

That's for sure.

They do you know, I'm looking in the text here in the feed.

So do you guys want to find or just throw some questions in on any topic?

I'll be glad to answer some of them and if you don't want to that's fine.

Okay.

And I'll give it a few more minutes to the maybe the top of the hour if isn't pick up a little.

It's just an offering to the Catholics when they come in.

That's all.

Yeah, that was good,

yeah.

You guys ever use these

ever use this.

By the way, Ernie you got enough now to get that

Computer almost there though.

Okay, we're good.

So.

Nobody's ever use it.

I love the Oculus thing 3d worlds you can hit your thumb on the controller and you

just walk really fast.

I like that.

Close.

Okay good.

Okay top of the hour if people aren't coming in asking questions, I'll just close it not a big deal and

Nick's not doing well today.

So We can hear you Matt.

Don't worry Sky apologetics, that's really up there.

That's good.

No was my answer to the virtual headset.

Oh, okay.

Yeah, I've shown people some stuff.

They have one of the things they had it under construction again dinosaurs

and It's automated in it.

It walks you through and I mean they're around you and they're coming with it like like this close.

You're like, whoa, it's awesome.

And.

I've really bad acrophobia.

I mean, it's ridiculous.

I don't like being on the sides of buildings when I get a hotels.

They say what room do you want?

You know, 17th floor ago.

No down low, please.

I really have a bad fear of heights.

I got traumatized when I was a kid.

Never got over it.

So sometimes people have these places I go they'll invite me to go into.

To chat right.

And they make these things sometimes like the edge of a precipice.

And I'm like, ah, you can't do it.

So that I tell people what are you doing?

You know.

What's my interpretation of Revelation 8 3?

It's a good verse.

That's what my interpretation is.

Revelation 8 3.

Another angel came and stood at the altar holding a golden censer and Much incense was given to him so that he might

add it to the prayers of all the saints of the golden altar.

Yeah.

The book of Revelation is a very symbolic book and what Catholics like to do is take aspects of it and.

Then say that it's literal and they'll say they'll say they'll do this.

Okay they'll say.

Much incense was given him so that might be added to the prayers of the Saints I say see the prayers of the Saints

that go to heaven and it's related to incense and therefore you can hear everybody.

And they just do stuff like this because they're looking to find anything they can to make it fit their heretical

doctrines.

You're terribly afraid of heights.

Your name is sky.

Interesting.

So that's what they do and More often than not someone will say what does it mean in Revelation?

I'll say I'm not exactly sure.

Okay, so there you go.

So how many of you have a phobia?

Tell me what your phobias are write them in.

I Hate clowns.

I don't like them and Heights that's about it.

Oh and heresy, but I kind of enjoy heresy.

I don't know.

Those are my I don't like clowns.

Do not like them at all.

Okay.

Needles.

Yeah, I don't like needles either, but I can handle it now.

So needles public speaking.

That's easy.

Public speaking is so easy.

Miss me in clubhouse.

Well, okay.

I Miss me.

Oh sky, okay rats.

Don't like rats.

Okay, I don't like rats rat a phobia.

My wife has claustrophobia fear of enclosed places and I

have okay sky.

How are you on airplanes?

Because I'm afraid of heights, but I can be in an airplane and in a jet.

Not rational.

That's what it is.

How about that that skywalk they have or something the skywalk?

Over the Grand Canyon where you walk out over pretty glass thing.

Not happening.

I was in Laodicea.

When we're doing a tour five six seven years ago Laodicea and

They had this exhibit where you could walk over glass a plexiglass

Ceiling to a room underneath and I couldn't do it.

I can only get near it.

Oh crap.

Oh It gets in the way.

And in Israel last time they had the court of the upper room.

When it's just like where Jesus was I couldn't go up to the the narrow

Precipice of a staircase just swayingly hanging on an edge with all

kinds of people.

Cramming in it and you got to go in like a snake living snake around this edge.

I'm like not doing that you'd have a stroke

and we're doing part of the tour and The bus was leaving one area going to another area and I

had to walk down an edge of a building with a narrow staircase with nothing

underneath it and The only way I could do it is Eric Johnson who runs the tour.

He talked me through I held on to him and then I went down the stairs and I had to get as fast as

I could.

It really is terrifying.

I Was a kid my brother friends duct

tape me to a merry -go -round and kept on spinning it yeah, see

my wife doesn't like putting closed places because her four brothers would put her under the bed and put a

Bedspread over her and then sit on the corners and it's to offer from getting out.

So she's traumatized from that.

It's interesting how things do this to you.

So Joanne has a problem with rats now.

What came up her toilet?

Yeah, that could be.

That could be disconcerting.

Okay, depending on the situation I've already written a lot on or Eastern Orthodoxy.

So yeah, I could do that.

Not scared of gophers.

You're not scared of snakes not scared of not squeamish.

But Heights, you know, I had problem it was the devil.

All right, I think we'll do is just close this up and I'll delete this thing because it wasn't any good.

You know that didn't nobody showed up.

That's on Jay Dyer.

He's not bad as for what he does.

He makes mistakes and he he doesn't know the problems he makes

logically and I'm looking forward to having another interaction with him.

I've learned a lot of stuff since I've talked to him lately and others.

So.

Thanks a lot.

What you guys having fun in here having fun

work something like that a wrench.

I've heard you're gonna make some articles.

I don't make articles, but I do write them having fun, too.

Guys want me to tell you a joke?

I can tell you a nice joke and if you've heard the joke, you can't you can't give the

The punchline now, that's the only problem.

I.

So if you've heard me tell you this joke before.

You can't put any information in and ruin it.

All right.

It's called the monastery joke.

The guy at the monastery you guys heard that one.

How many have heard me say that one?

Love the Karma family a lot of good people there fellowships always a blessing as it is.

So You've not heard it.

That's tempting you haven't.

No, okay good probably okay, if you remember go.

I have her don't type anything out.

All right.

All right.

So here's here it is.

You ready?

It's one of my favorite jokes period but takes a long time.

It's not a short joke and you'll see why.

There's a mechanic a car mechanic and he's moving from one job to another job from one city to another

city.

He's got his tools with him in his car he's driving along a dark and secluded night.

Dark and stormy night as a matter of fact and he takes a detour and he goes down this one road and it turned out To be a bad

choice and all of a sudden his car dies.

Well, he's a mechanic he can fix it, but it's dark and very very rainy and windy.

What's he gonna do?

Well, he could sit there in a car and just huddle down all night, but he sees a light.

Do the windshield wipers going back and forth he sees this little lights the window.

So he goes.

I'm just gonna go there and see who it is.

Maybe you know get in for the night there and he just gets out and within 10 feet.

He's drenched.

Okay, and he jogs on up to this light and it turns out.

It's a big stone Building and has a name over it something like

monastery.

Wow, there's this big honking set of doors wooden doors and a big, you know, clanker knocker on her he.

After about a minute.

The.

Door.

And there's this hooded man Standing there looking at him from the darkness and there's the lights are

kind of outside and you know, and he's.

And the man puts his hood back goes.

Uh, yeah.

Are you okay?

What what?

Wow, I didn't expect that and the mechanic says, you know, I'm I'm.

My car it broke down back here and I'm traveling.

I took a detour and I can fix it, but I'd have my tools, but I the guy goes Oh just come on in no

problem.

And so a Bunch of monks are there at this monastery they're really cool guys and they They love having the

company unexpected company and they show him around and they show him well, they give him a monk's robe to wear because he's drenched so they

get him out of the The they get him out of the hey Anthony.

I'm telling a joke Anthony and they'll get you in here in a sec.

And so then he says, uh, you know, he said oh I can fix the car.

So they they they they dry his clothes.

They give him a Monk's robe to wear and he is going through the place.

He loves everything.

They feed him.

Everything's great.

He says in the morning, I'll get up and I'll work on my car and so right before he goes to bed.

You know that they're showing him where they got it was going to go to small room.

Just a bed and a little desk and a window not much but it's nice and the head monk says to

the mechanic says.

Um.

It was there anything you'd like before you retire and he the mechanic goes well.

No, it's okay.

No, no, really.

It's okay.

What do you what would you like?

We're here to please don't get any guests goes.

Well, it's kind of embarrassed.

It's over there my good.

No, no, really and so they kind of argued about it.

And finally the monk guys got him just to what do you want?

He goes?

Well, please we'd be glad to help.

And he looks and he kind of looks around if the mechanic does he says well.

Okay, he says do you have any old cheese?

Preferably with some mold on it and I need some barbed wire, but if you don't have barbed wire I'll take any kind of a

shoelace and I need a ladder and assume cooking oil

and.

The.

The monk goes Well, what are these things for?

He said well, it's a family secret.

I can't tell you it's really embarrassing and you insisted.

So that's why I'm out, you know.

Okay, so these monks they closed, you know, he closed the door he kind of hides in his room and amongst.

And they go and they get all this stuff.

It takes a while, but they do they they come back knocking the door he opens it up just a little bit and they slip the stuff in there and and

They said what you're gonna say.

The door closes ain't like okay.

So in the morning, you know, they get up and he gets up.

He's a little embarrassed, but he's working on his car all day.

You know, he's got the tools with them he's getting the car ready and the storm had passed and Lo and

behold.

He needs one more half hour or so to work on the car half hour an hour and the lights gone because they don't have.

They don't have candles in the monastery.

So he's got to spend the night again.

So they show him where they fix Bibles where they make wine.

They show him this and they show him that in the whole bit.

Everything and then there's time to go to bed.

Is there anything we can get for you?

And he looks at him and they said What is it?

What do you need?

Just a lot of no, I mean, you know, it's okay.

What do you need?

Well.

You have a right sandal that's fresh that'd be the right one and I need a

compass a mirror in a Ladder,

so they're all staring at this guy and he goes, but if you don't have a ladder, I'll take some Crisco cooking oil.

Okay, okay, what do you think's for you got to tell us and he goes.

I can't it's just too embarrassing and and he closes The door and it will they insist it.

So what he they do they what is this?

They're just bumping into each other trying to figure out this stuff.

So they they go out to the monastery and they get all these things and they get it people like what did he get?

What you would need it?

We don't know.

We don't know what it's for.

Next day he gets up.

Next day, he gets up.

He's working on his car.

Their monks are watching them.

And he finally gets the car started.

It's gonna work.

Okay, he's gonna drive out of there gonna get out of there.

He's totally embarrassed, but they're cool guys.

They gave him a basket of fruit.

They give him a nice Bible.

A monk's robe.

Could he like the monk's robe a bottle of wine?

He's in the car and he puts it in gear.

The monk head monk goes.

No, no, no.

No, no, you look you can't go before you tell us what's going on.

You have to tell us what these things are for.

You've destroyed the monastery.

We are now gossiping about what all these things are for and when brother Thomas over here.

He's been on a vow of silence for five years.

We said what you needed he went what and you messed him up.

There's guys over here.

They can't sleep at night.

Look so and so over there brother Joseph.

He's got a bandage on his arm because he bumped into some studies.

He fell asleep.

You destroyed us.

We're gossiping now.

We're thinking that we shouldn't think you gotta tell us what these things are for because you're killing us.

So the monks he's looking at the monk the monkey baggy eyes all the guys around him, you know, they want to know.

What are these things for he goes?

Well, the please tell us well.

Okay.

Okay.

I'll tell you I'll tell you.

I'll tell you.

Okay, I'll tell you.

But you got a promise.

He's talking to this monk.

He goes you got a promise me though.

You won't tell anybody else.

Monks, I promise to this day.

He's kept that promise.

I wasn't even here for the whole joke.

And I'm thinking I'm I'm wasting time paying attention because I'm not gonna get it.

I missed the setup everything else and.

That was pretty good.

I.

Had been one time.

I told the guy the joke and I love this job.

And he looks at me goes.

You do realize now I have to kill you for this.

It's it's great.

So I was at a at an amusement park and I was doing a youth retreat.

And it was his ride just a transport down from the top of the hill down to the bottom of the hill.

It's all it was.

The youth group is with me like four or five kids.

And so this that he was like a ten minute little ride.

So I started telling this joke to these kids right and the entire car the transport car went

quiet.

They're totally listening to the jokes.

I raised my voice.

So everybody could hear it.

This kids going to his dad.

What are they for?

What's he thanks for?

I don't know.

Let's listen.

So I got this whole thing.

I timed it so that the punchline came in right when the doors opened, right?

And what do you do it to give the time to this day?

He's kept that promise, you know, that's it.

People are staring at me for five seconds.

I go.

Yeah, oh man, and they go walking out and I started thinking about this the next day.

Because the people are waiting to get on this little transport.

This goes like this up the hill, you know.

And people coming out.

We're all moaning.

Oh, man.

Oh, jeez.

I just wonder what they were thinking.

Okay, Anthony, sorry, I was just gonna shut it down.

I said you guys want to hear a joke joke in the meantime, and here you are.

So yeah.

I mean, whatever you are interested in doing.

I don't want to.

That's all right thing up.

I just thought.

Maybe maybe some lingering questions were around.

Maybe there's some interesting festivities going on.

Other than that, I'm happy to fix myself some food.

So you did soteriology, right?

No, I talked on the clarity of Scripture.

Oh, that's right perspicuity.

Yeah.

Sure, that's right.

And it was my intention to pull no punches.

So good good for you.

I talked about a great number of things.

One of the things that I talked about and I thought you know this this needs to be addressed It annoys me to no end

is you've probably run across this Roman Catholics in order to prop up the Magisterium of Rome.

It's necessity and so forth.

They of course attack the clarity of Scripture and they'll say it's even unclear on cardinal

doctrines like the Trinity The personhood of the Spirit the way of salvation.

I mean I read this over and over again.

It makes me Wanna go crazy every time I read it.

Most recently I was looking at this book by Catholic Casey Chalk called the Obscurity of Scripture and he

talks about how he was reading the works of Nt Wright and a bunch of other people and he was all confused

about salvation.

So this led him to doubt the clarity of Scripture.

Well.

Anyways, I quoted a number of Roman Catholics Karl Keating Patrick Madrid a lot of these guys saying scriptures not

clear on the Trinity.

And so.

One of the reasons I wanted to do this is because Number one, it's not true.

Number two it undermines.

It's not a slight matter.

It undermines.

The confidence or the basis that Christians can have for confidence in this is true and from God.

Number three it actually gives some oomph if you will to the cults.

A lot of cultists will quote these things from Rome and say see it's a man -made doctrine Rome is admitting.

It's not in the Bible and that it comes from their authority.

And of course that's irrelevant to us because we don't accept it on Rome's authority we don't think it's absent from the word or unclear in

the word and.

But but they also like to blame us for the proliferation of sex right that when they say there's all these

Protestant denominations.

They're including JWs Mormons Christadelphians all these heretical groups that are just like them they

deny the clarity of Scripture you need to listen to their prophet that you need to listen to their group and.

And they're following Rome and believing that the Trinity is not clearly in the Bible.

So I'm thinking this needs to be exposed just for the sake of that and then I also thought you know It'd be good to

challenge a Roman Catholic who believes this sort of thing, you know I'd be interested in debating a Roman

Catholic on whether or not the Trinity is in the Bible.

Wouldn't that be an interesting debate.

That would be.

Or maybe you could defend how it's not clear.

Well, if it's not clear, how do you know it's there?

Yeah.

So that's one thing I thought it was just a small part of it but it was a significant part I think because I think every Christian ought to

look at that and just recoil from it and be.

Like.

This is.

You know if you're a Christian and you see the Trinity in the Bible, then you know Rome's doctrine is in error.

Right.

I was a Christian.

I became a Christian in 1993.

I think you've heard my story.

I I was incarcerated I was running with gangs got in trouble started reading the Bible and

The Trinity was all over it to me.

I I Believed it.

I'm not pretending.

I was an expert and in all things biblical, but it was there.

I understood that this is who God is and Many other things Rome says are unclear.

And so I'm thinking I Didn't have to hear from a Roman Catholic priest to know these things.

It was later that I talked to a Roman Catholic priest for the first time.

And heard about I mean prior to that I did come from a Catholic family, but we never participated in anything.

I didn't know anything.

So anyways I'm just saying that it's incredible to me, you know for people to say this sort of thing when

I know that it was clear enough to me To believe it and it was clear enough that I was always capable of

defending it against cultists without any need for the Roman Church.

Yeah.

You know, I've been since I was 17.

I was a believer.

I'll be 67 here next month.

So almost 50 years but The Trinity I don't remember ever having to learn

it.

It just it's just like.

You know, if someone told me what it was, I'm sure at one point I went.

Yeah, that makes sense.

Because you read the Bible.

You know you read the Bible and that's just what it says.

It's just yeah He's God and Jesus is God and the Father's God and the Holy Spirit's God and they're divine and all these things.

That's it.

You know, I have a friend that reminds me I asked him once we've been friends for years.

And I said, are you reformed in your theology goes?

Oh, yeah.

I said, what would you learn that because for the Bible?

No one told me.

I just looked at it and it all made sense.

I think that's the case.

I remember other things.

I won't be too specific.

But I remember people at times I'd say something and they'd put a label on it and I'm thinking who's that right?

They'd mentioned some person's name.

They'd mentioned something.

I'm thinking I don't know you're talking about.

I've never read this guy in my life.

Never even heard his name.

I just believe this because I read it here in the word and.

You know, so.

Even apart from hearing the word Trinity or Hypostatic Union, I'm not saying there's no

usefulness to these terms or there's no benefit from learning these things from others in history.

I think that's all legitimate.

It's just Pretending that you can't get this from the word when that's where these people all

claim to have gotten it, right?

So yeah.

I.

Like what you said those listening and going that's good.

Those are good points about the clarity of Scripture.

It's there.

And how I liked what you did using the Scripture to interpret the Scripture and so many citations of that.

It's great.

But I always tell people when they say the Bible is not clear about this.

You need an authority.

Well, where'd you get that?

How what interpretation of Scripture did you use to say you need an authority to interpret Scripture?

Because if you think about that you're submitting everything to your own personal opinion about what authority has to be.

Where do you get this from?

They don't realize that they you know, they Undo their whole argument just by asking the question.

Yeah, that reminds me of another point that I didn't make but thought of including before I realized I don't

have enough room for all this stuff.

But I.

Thought of how often Roman Catholics will turn right around and

Pretend that certain doctrines distinctive to them are clearly in the Bible, right?

So for example the mass or transubstantiation, they'll say this verse is clear.

This is my body right and I'm thinking here's a group that attacks the clarity of Scripture because its

doctrines aren't there.

Then it turns around it wants to try and get a Protestant to believe these things.

So they use the Bible as an authority, but they know they can't do that unless they can claim it's clear.

So for a moment they set aside their Romanist assumptions and You know run with it

being clear.

Not realizing what they're doing, right?

In fact, this is funny.

So I mentioned this book.

This is one of the first thing I mentioned in this book or I noticed in this book I was reading the blurbs has a number of

Catholics celebrating how good the book is, right?

So there's father kajit on Cuddy.

There's Eduardo at Chavarria.

Paul fig pen number of Roman Catholics.

There's there's five that are given here.

There's a forward and so forth.

What's interesting is four out of the five.

Celebrate how clear this book is.

They're like this.

Thinking what in the world so God's Word the God who made man's mouth who made man's ears

who made man's.

He can't speak clearly.

But this guy I mean he's he's God's gift to clarity here, you know.

Well, you know one of the I don't know if you mentioned it, but you know mark 4 10 through 12 Why do you speak in parables?

So you will not believe and be forgiven.

So sometimes people when they bring that issue up.

Well, it's not as clear as it needs to be and sometimes I'll say maybe it's because you're not Predestined to be one of God's sheep and he

wants to make sure that you're not going to understand.

Because only the sheep of God can hear his voice and understand what is meant.

And I go to that verse for it and they it shakes him up.

At one thing I would point.

I think I made the point.

I don't know how I made it exactly but it certainly occurred to me to do this and I

did say something about the parables, but the interesting thing is so sometimes people mistake a

account of somebody being.

Confused in.

The first century with the scriptures being unclear as they tell us about the event.

So for example the parables the the parables tell us that Jesus said these things and he said them so that those without wouldn't

understand.

But in the account of the parables Jesus interprets them, right?

So in Scripture we have the interpretation.

It's sort of like the book of Job, right?

If if all you had to go on is What Job and his three friends had to go on?

You'd be at a bit of a loss, but we don't.

We have the introduction to the book.

We have the the first two chapters telling us about Satan.

You know and his challenge and the test and all that kind of stuff.

So we're not running into this blind.

It's the same thing with John's gospel it's not like we're.

We're not in the same position that Nicodemus was in or the woman at the well was in or the Jews in John 8.

We have the whole gospel.

We have the the prologue.

Introducing the theme of the book.

We have the epilogue.

We have the thesis statement at the end.

These are written so that you might believe so just because it records somebody on an occasion being

confused.

Doesn't mean that Scripture leaves us confused.

It disambiguates itself.

You know, I just thought of something kind of it one thing you said remind me something else and also this is a little off -topic but not I put in chat

a Church fathers cross -referenced thing.

I don't know if you've seen that.

It's an incredibly valuable resource if you go to that I put the link in there you go put

up like for example If you go to John 3 16, whatever you type it in.

It's brilliantly done.

It's done by Catholics and what it does is it finds?

Basically every reference in the church fathers to that particular verse.

And what they say about it.

I just want to pass that along as a Neat find.

I've been using it for a couple of years.

So if you type in like John 3 colon 16, and then it gives you a whole bunch of stuff I'll put it in for everybody else to

you want to see it, but it is really useful very usual.

Yeah, I've been gathering up.

I kick myself for not starting this a long long time ago.

I I've been gathering up quotes for different things and to have them handy.

So for example when we were doing the thing I had a lot of things at my disposal.

But I should have been doing this 30 years ago.

Yeah, I I Have always been able to rely on Being able to remember

things I read so I can easily pick up a book that I read 20 years ago and find what I'm Looking for but Wow it

I should have been you know, it's a lot of work now.

Like if I write an article I got to go grab this book and I got to try and hold it open while I'm typing.

And you know to all this other stuff that I'm sure you've done a hundred times a thousand ten thousand times.

But I'm thinking man if I was just busy long ago writing collecting all these things. I'd have

so much Easily at my fingertips.

Yeah, so and I know you I know actually when I now that I'm thinking about I'm talking to you about this.

You you you're the guy that's actually, you know made reams of books and other things for notes and all that

kind of stuff but I really wish I had done that because You know 30 years of reading it would have been

Really handy to have all that just at my fingertips.

Well heck my notes on Catholicism everything and there's a lot of Repetition in there, but it's a hundred and

seventy nine pages in Word.

I'd send it to you.

Because you know, it's all hey.

This is what it is and I just put things logically and put it in order and repetition and just list things.

But I'm always looking for quotes.

Who was it saying some stuff?

I was like, oh, I didn't know about those quotes.

You know, there's so much I've told people.

I said you could spend your whole life studying Catholicism.

It's so vast.

It's so deep.

There's so much stuff there.

But it is just it's all it's horrible.

Oh, yeah.

You know, it's interesting too.

I'm sure you know that.

Well you mentioned being I think you said Mexico.

You mentioned somewhere where you spoke Spanish to a lady.

Yeah, when you go to these other countries where Protestantism has had less of an impact the

Catholicism there tends to look a good bit different, right?

So I.

Was considering with my wife as I was getting out of seminary going and helping

with a church plant in Italy.

My family backgrounds Italian and I speak Italian.

No, I'm gonna learn it.

I mean I you know a little bit but nothing nothing good enough to Do all the

all the work I'd need to do so it'd be a lot of work.

But I was willing to do it and eat the good food while I was there learning it.

But we went there and.

What what changed it is our youngest daughter had gotten sick and we had to provide care for her and we knew we couldn't go Over there

and get that care for her.

So we stayed back here and I'd started doing prison work but anyways, we went there initially spent

several weeks there and We were going into these churches and I was like I have never in my life seen some of this

stuff in Roman Catholic churches back home.

So, I mean I'm not obviously I haven't been in every Roman Catholic Church.

I can't say that there's no church here that has it.

But it was like if some of these people could see this they would be mortified.

This is like ghastly some of this like there's dead bodies and sarcophagi, you know.

Right up there in the church like you're sitting there in the middle of the church with these dead skeletons and stuff.

You know like sitting there on either side of the supposed altar all sorts of things.

Mary's larger -than -life, of course huge statues of Mary always an itty -bitty Jesus in her arms and

dependent and all that but everything is just you're inundated with it and

you could see how this dominates their whole life and You know.

And of course Mary is the the central stage of everything.

Yep.

Yeah, there's a Catholic Church here.

I've gone into a couple times before and you walk in and to the right are Statues of Saints

and you go through and you do stuff until lefters pictures and stuff like that in the middle you go up.

There's a big statue of Mary.

That's central.

I mean of Jesus.

Excuse that central but just off to his right is Mary a Big statue Mary not as

big as him, but Mary so that when you're up there Worshipping Jesus you're

seeing Mary next to him.

Hmm and You know, I remember once I did prison ministry and I was talking we had to

go for two hours.

And the Catholic priest was preaching and teaching for an hour.

Then he had to sit while I was preaching and teaching for an hour.

Well, you know.

Yeah, and so the Catholic prisoners were there then we'd swap and that's just how it was.

You had to take take it, you know, that's what it works in prison ministry.

So this guy the Catholic priest he offered a prayer to Mary he prayed to Mary, you know

Mother Mary blah blah blah this and that please be with us.

Please help us, please.

So, you know and the whole bit and so on the way out.

We're talking I'm never gonna forget this and I said, so I'm just curious.

I'm trying to be very polite.

Why'd you pray to Mary?

We didn't pray to Mary.

But.

Yes, I thought you did and he said no we didn't pray to Mary.

I Said well, what'd you do?

We showed her veneration.

I Jesus please help me.

Please.

I repeated the sentence.

He said to Mary Jesus did whatever it was I forgot.

Now, you know, is that praying him to to Jesus?

He goes.

Well, yes I said you said the exact same thing except to Mary it was you weren't praying to Mary.

I Was done at that point because it's just the incredible of rationality.

That reminds me of I so I mentioned my context I was converted

in in prison.

So I was reading the Bible.

I read the Bible through repeatedly while I was there.

So after a year of reading the Bible now understand I'm talking about having a lot of time on my

hands.

So I read my you know, my Bible every day many hours a day I got through it many many times

after a year had ended.

So this was the first time in the location I was at that a Catholic priest was coming out and I don't really know

much I don't know much about Rome from my Italian background.

I and I just assume he's like another pastor.

So I was eager I was eager for him to come out I'm going there with full expectation of hearing good,

you know preaching and so forth and we go in there and he gives this 10 minute little

homily.

And I was like, well, that was a letdown.

You know, I'm I'm excited.

Somebody's come out here it's eight hours in the middle of nowhere and he gives this little 10 -minute homily and Then he

stops and he starts to ask questions and here was his question.

He said, how does a person get faith?

And I thought oh, that's an easy one I know this one I thought this to myself and I said faith comes by hearing

and hearing by the Word of God and He said without any hesitation.

He said no and he starts looking around the room and I'm over there flabbergasted.

What are you talking about?

I just quoted Paul.

I Literally just quoted Paul.

How do you tell me?

No and as he's looking around he's finally Exasperated and he says through

baptism and I thought what are you talking about through baptism?

You know set aside the question of infants and in that question, right?

There's there's debate among Christians, but right.

If how does an adult adult coming to baptism Presupposes faith, right?

Why would he come unless he already believes that just it's an assumption of the activity, right?

So But it explains to in part if you know anything about church history, I don't mean you but like anybody

right in general why some Roman priests and so forth forced baptized

people because they thought they were giving them faith through this act.

Well, anyways, I was so flabbergasted like I don't understand how this guy just disagrees with me well, then

He got to the real business I didn't understand at first that the reason the homily was only 10 minutes and then a few minutes of

questions I didn't understand it was so short because the real business was when he was going to do the

mass.

So.

He gets up and he starts to do all the hoopla and I'm looking at this thinking.

Well, this is an interesting sight to see.

What are all these things mean?

And so I'm watching him and At one point this, you know besides moving the little thing around that's got

smoke coming up and doing all this other stuff.

He raises the host the the the wafer, right?

He raises it up and then he bows down and I think I'm misunderstanding.

What's going on here?

Because it looks to me like he's bowing down to a piece of bread.

So, I mean, I don't get it.

I'm looking at this.

I'm like what in the world it just looked extremely odd to me and.

And.

You know again, I knew my Bible I had read my Bible many many times over and I saw I saw nothing of this in There

so I don't know what's going on.

I leave there.

I'm thinking this is this is absurd.

I'm not likely to go back to this sort of thing again.

And then I go back to my bunk and I continue to read.

I picked up a book I had been reading Fox's Book of Martyrs.

Sure.

You're familiar with.

Oh, yeah.

And I happen to be just getting to that section where it's talking about how Protestants were persecuted by

Romanists For refusing to partake of the mass because it was idolatry and it was there that I learned for the

first time that Roman Catholics Believe that when the priest utters the words of consecration

Hoc est corpus meum.

This is my body.

They're actually causing the bread and the wine to turn into Not only

the actual body and blood of Christ, but also his soul and his divinity.

So that when you chew on these elements You are literally gnashing Christ with your teeth and ingesting

him and you know the rest of the process and I'm looking at this.

I'm like, that's what that guy that's why that guy was bowing down.

That's why he was doing what looked to me So hideously idolatrous.

I couldn't believe it.

It is.

Oh.

Yeah.

Yeah, I remember once I got asked to to be in a Catholic wedding.

It's an interesting story, but I was in a Catholic wedding and I told the guys I said look.

You know, I'm a strong Protestant and I'm not gonna do a lot with rituals.

I'll be in your wedding to help this guy out a great deal and he really is appreciative and he really wanted that and blah blah blah and

so I was in this wedding party and they were all Catholics and they went over to bow before the Statue of

Mary and Thanks and have Mary bless the thing and I just stood there by myself

as they all went over and they're all staring at me.

Why am I this guy not going with everybody else?

The guy wasn't offended.

He knew.

But it's just more ritual more symbol more paganism.

That's what I call.

I call a Catholicism.

I call it a pagan religion.

It's so full of paganism and but one of these I think is It's just

ridiculous are Sacramentals.

These devices these objects that Pope people will bless.

You know the bishop might bless one or the Cardinal might bless one.

Whatever it is is blessed and you wear it and you get grace through it and it protects you from evil.

I said it kind of that's a talisman.

That's what a talisman is in the occult.

You have a certain object that you wear upon your body and then it protects you from evil.

That's what the Roman the Mormons have that there's sacred garments.

I said it's a talisman.

It's because of pagans.

Oh, man.

And it's it's rampant it's rampant.

And there was a lot of good stuff In the conference.

That's why I was encouraging people at the end because I'm thinking, you know This is a four hour five hour thing.

A lot of people Probably didn't spend their whole Saturday sitting there and popped in here and there and I thought

I got to make sure people go back and listen to all that because You know, there's a lot there to digest.

There is and.

I'm thinking of I don't know what you do with this sort of stuff, but I usually go back if I participated.

I think I have some rights to it.

So I go back and I take the video and I'll make other videos out of it.

You know, I'll I'll splice it up and take you know.

Portions of it and make smaller clips for the for the people that don't have the stamina to listen longer or

Don't have the time perhaps.

So I'll probably do that.

I.

I'll ask George if we can do that.

I mean, I just like to ask it if he doesn't want to take my segment and put it someplace, too.

What we've been doing for the radio show.

I sit right here do the radio and now we've got a guy who'll take segments of what I say in the radio and

Tremendous stuff.

So that's that's nice one of these days.

I'll get a guy that can do that.

Well, yeah, it's it's evolved.

We've got a lot of people who are helping in fact.

We got people in here who help there's there's Ernie and there is Joanne and there's

Laura and they've been with us for a while and helping a lot and I'll tell you I don't know if you know what it's like to be in ministry

because There's a lot to do.

I don't know if you're aware of that.

And.

You know, I'm hoping tech gets into cloning.

I approve of cloning.

Because I want to clone myself.

A poor wife couldn't handle it.

I want to clone myself to be able to do all this stuff.

You see that my wife just goes.

I don't know.

Maybe she will.

Yeah, I mean I know part of why it's hard is because it's kind of like you know what

you want to do and.

And.

Telling somebody else that takes the same time of you doing it in a sense.

I mean it just it you know, so It's it's kind of hard, you know,

just delegating things but yep, you know, and then there's other stuff.

I mean But for me here's part of the problem so I I

Have sort of a my mind Can focus on certain things and it's worthless when it

comes to other stuff.

So if If it comes to reading love to do it do it every chance I get

writing teaching that sort of thing, but There has to be some medium right there, you know,

so like this using this I'm thinking of if we're doing it online or something and

Anything that involves me learning the steps for

Editing a video Like I'll do that to some degree but I hate spending a lot of time on that watching

videos.

I could make great videos if I just take some time to figure out how to do that I bet but I anytime

I get doing it two minutes in I'm like, I don't want to do this I want to read this book.

I'd rather teach people this stuff than edit a video about it.

You have a newsletter list.

No, I've never done that.

I should.

Absolutely should.

It's one of the most helpful things.

A newsletter list.

And so each Tuesday I do a newsletter and we have a few thousand on it.

And one of the things someone suggested is a wish list for karm and

When it's empty people actually contact me and say put something up there.

So, you know, I've got stuff that I've ordered, you know like this right here system wipes.

You know and and someone sent them.

But you put a wish list up in the and you get the newsletter and it helps.

Not that we're trying to get that for That but I mean people really want to help.

There's a lot of people want to help and so what's your website?

You should get a newsletter sign up thing and there's different ways of doing it.

But that's it's just it's worth it because the benefits are great.

Sky.

Says if he needs clips, I'm your guy.

You know talking to you.

So how could he get a hold of you and you know.

Let me tell you though.

I've learned this over the years.

Always check them out always vet them because a lot of times they don't know what they're getting into and you got to know.

Something else too, but you know, you you got to know this.

I warn people you want to work with karm.

You're asking for trouble.

Spiritual trouble you're asking for trouble.

Better know what you're getting into pray about it to get but.

How could they get a hold of you?

Yeah, so, let me see.

I don't know if I'm able to put links in there.

You probably haven't blocked like I do.

In the chat or the main.

Yeah, I'll do it.

Yeah, I put okay.

I'll put it in private.

I just put my email.

So see part of it is Oh What is that?

So I Haven't That's just my email where he can contact

me but I haven't put my email out there generally because it's I

Know how busy I get and I've tried it's not that it's impossible for people to get it I just think you know

what I'll sort of I'll make it a little difficult to the people that just want to troll and Send me

evil nasty comments.

We'll have to work out a little bit.

It'll it'll get rid of some of those and then the people that really do want to contact me for a legitimate reason

will You know won't have a problem looking at what but I I gave the I gave my email I'm fine with it

on this.

Yeah on this, you know, it's a I'm not on my channel People would have to really be looking for

it to come over here and get it, right?

I mean, they're not gonna do that.

So And I'm just saying I'm not opposed to having it out there.

It's just I'm sure you get a lot of hate mail and.

I.

Get so busy.

It's hard for me to keep up with certain things.

So I just try to limit it when I can.

There's nothing I do.

What I've done is Because I'm a computer tech kind of guy, but I have 20

email addresses of all different kinds and in Outlook Microsoft Outlook I can access them

all and then I can drag from one place to another place and it will transfer among those Email accounts

so you can have Yahoo.

You can have AOL I don't think you have a well you can have hotmail and Google Mail

and things like that.

So I actually have an email address that is for private and I only give it out to certain people like I'd give it out To you and

I give it and you know a few other people and and that's one of the things I have.

And so you can make private ones and you can say only use this one.

And then I can show you if you wanted how to use Outlook and you access all of them.

It is awesome, and you can search through Every one of them for a particular word or

phrase and they'll go through every single email account that you've got.

Hmm, so I have an Outlook email.

I have too many emails as part of the problem.

Because of different stuff I've done over the years like I had a blog one time and then that had an email that came with

It and then I had an AOL one that was from like 30 years ago or so I had I still

have it.

I didn't want to get rid of it because I have old friends.

What if they after 10 years of silence decide to contact me?

I you know, so I got that then, you know.

Every time I've had to get a new computer or something At least it used to be it would come with like some

email or something.

Like when I got an Apple, I got an Apple product and and it came with an Apple email.

Or I.

Do.

Prison ministry, so I have a prison ministry email.

It's just too many emails.

They all add up and they're all over the place and and then some of them I have sitting there that

I forgot the email passwords to.

You can get those reset and.

You should use.

I don't know if you know this but I was a computer tech for years at Hewlett -Packard.

So I can build them.

I can do all kind of stuff.

So you don't like Mac.

I bet I just don't use it.

I'm a PC guy.

I just don't.

And I know it.

Well, I know.

Every person I know that knows something about computers tends to not like Mac.

With Mac.

I've just never worked it but I Use PCs and I can build them from the ground

up and I know all kinds of tricks.

I know all kinds of stuff.

But I could always if you were on a PC I could help you I could tell you what to do what not to do And all kinds of stuff, but I love

computers.

I had a job just fixing computers for years.

But the thing about Outlook is I think you can do it Outlook comm.

Also, you can put all your accounts in but if you have office 365, for example.

You can get the feature or just order it and then you can go in and put all your email accounts in there.

I'm telling you it is super easy.

In fact when I was trying to find the link for today's show I put in George's name and I went through

every account looking for his name.

I couldn't find the link.

So I have his phone number and I texted him and I have my the on my one of my screens I have four 27 -inch monitors

and one of them.

I have my connection to my phone.

So I'm a tech guy.

See this phone right here okay, so I got one of those and

So it's connected to my computer.

I just typed it in on my keyboard and then he responded go here it is.

Here it is.

And that was it.

So and then this right here.

This is I have a speech recognition program I paid hundreds of dollars for it and this is

a $200 set up because I can go 180 200 feet with it and I can talk

and it's free.

I mean free from the from the Accord so I can I can go all over the house

and have a conversation with you and so I'll use that in my program for For text

so I can just talk like this and it'll go into the text and I could write books with it I could do whatever I want.

I just hit enter Hmm and it goes into the text that fast

and so.

And I do all my books now in Kindle.

I've got like 600 books in Kindle.

I used to have a lot of books like you do and it and I've I mean I had you know thousands I'm like, I don't use

them and I don't know where to find something in them I got to sit there and go through the index look at but if I have it on Kindle I open

up a book to a phrase within two seconds.

I'll find it Constantly and that's that's why I go to Kindle and and

stuff like that.

So I had a.

Hard time.

Getting into some of the digital stuff being so used to just holding a book and stuff like that and and part of the difficulty Is

for me every page looks different, right?

Every page looks different to me so I can remember where I read it every you know, I could open a book I read

20 years ago.

Like I said, and I'll I'll pretty much know where it's out on the page.

I'll know if it's in the first, you know, 10 20 pages or in the middle or in the end.

I just that just sticks with me and what happens with digital devices when I look at them.

The page is always different it changes on you, right?

You turn it one way it changes you turn it another way it changes.

But having said all that I see the value in having the digital stuff and wish I could get

into it.

There have been times when I have broken down and gotten a digital book one because it's so quick.

I wanted a book quicker than it was going to come in the mail so I broke down and got it on digital and then I was

able to skip around.

I was able to I mean in the sense of like Looking things up and just you know, obviously you could

thumb through a book if you have it.

But it was more like I could skim around with with some.

You know, so I knew what I was.

I could look for something deliberately, right?

I could put it in like you're saying and I could just tell from this that there's so much that's useful about this that I

really wish I was more inclined to that but.

Yeah, I don't think it's gonna happen.

People are used to what they're used to.

I used to know a guy named Perry Pellett.

Perry Pellegrini.

What was his name.

He's an apologist down in Southern, California.

Oh, I hate it when I remember it forget his name.

He used to read a book a day and then review it in his dream in his dreams.

He'd go over it.

So it took him years to develop that habit took him years.

He told me that you review it in his ass.

And Tino Passing.

Oh.

Gretchen patch and Tino and Bill or.

Gretchen, you know.

The guy yeah, his wife's name is Gretchen.

Yep.

I do remember them from CRI back in the day, right?

But he told me that that's what happened he also told a good story once I think was Machen.

I'm trying to remember which name it was but Gretchen Machen.

I think it was the Greek scholar was over his house.

Yeah, I think it was him.

I may have got that name wrong, but that caliber of that level it was Machen or is it?

Anyway, the Jehovah's Witnesses Came to on it to his door.

Well, this I'd mention or whoever it was.

It's the other Greek old Greek book.

They were using for coin a don't Know before that

before that like 40 50 years ago.

Anyway, I can't remember his name.

It's a green book I can see it.

I got it went on the garage.

I do believe Machen has a Greek text.

Great.

Yeah grammar or something.

So maybe it was Machen.

I don't know but I'll just use him as the example, but Bob Passantino Bob and

so Bob said that Machen I guess it was Machen.

It was over his house one Saturday and knock -knock the J dubs are there.

So Bob goes to the door and there's Jehovah's Witnesses and here here's the Greek scholar right here.

Maybe this guy could talk to you about this stuff and he comes up, right?

And he Bob told me he said the J W's Actually quoted Machen.

How's grad be great?

Bob's going.

Just.

Just watch it and he said he couldn't believe it.

It was just too perfect and it makes you goes.

No, that's not correct.

He goes.

Yes, it is.

We've quoted a scholar Machen.

He says blah blah blah blah blah and you know, it's gonna be actually gonna fall here.

But he just reeled him in as far as he could he goes.

Well, I know for a fact that that's not correct that they'd say that a context.

Well, you can't because our scholars Bob because I'm nature.

That's me.

They're quoting and.

And he then proceeded to tell them why and the whole bit it was a great story.

It's just a great story.

I love that story.

Yeah, I imagine he well, he probably had opportunity for well Not not that that exact thing would

happen very often, but it probably was Quite surprising every time

somebody popped up on his door and and.

He.

You know could pull out his own grammar and say here's a great scholar that says this that I

Remember this one JW group, you know how they used to do it.

I don't know if they still do I Live in an area where there's not a lot of JW.

So I haven't been able to keep up with new tactics.

But yes, I'm here back in the day the opening used to be for a lot of them.

One of one of the openings would be something like, you know, God's true name, you know, we're we're we know God's true name we use

God's true name other Christians don't and so forth and then they'd quote all the passages where it talks about the name and

How would be your name and this sort of thing?

And so one of the thing I started doing when I would meet Jehovah's Witnesses is I would say

Do you guys know the name of the Holy Spirit and they'd say what and I'd say yeah the name of the

Holy Spirit and they'd say what are you talking about?

He doesn't have a name.

He's not a person and I say well Wait a minute.

You guys are supposed to be Jehovah's organization and you don't know the name of his spirit.

That's a problem.

I think and That's you know, I'd really I'd drag him along a little bit I'd like to just

you know five minutes maybe where I'm saying really you don't know the name just so they're like on the edge of their seats and

Then I and then I would quote Matthew 28 to him where it says baptize them into the name of

The Father and of the Son of the Holy Spirit.

I say well look it says right there.

He has a name, right?

So I'm playing their game now.

Yeah, it's always it's always a lot of fun because I just know it's it's eating at them.

Because this is their tactic and here's this guy Doing their game and they're used to

doing this at people's doorsteps and.

You know, we could do this sometimes just do a get -together invite people in and you and I just share for example

Approaches for the J dubs approaches for the Catholics, you know, you got one, you know, we could email each other.

Okay, all you will let's go back and forth between these.

All right, here's the you know.

This one like that's a good one.

I've got something I use for them as well.

And you know, you've got that we could learn from each other, but I always love to hear that different approaches different people use.

I think they're awesome.

See how.

Yeah, that's a great idea when I yeah, I'm often.

Sometimes you you have this experience where you're you're talking to somebody and then you say something and as the words

are coming out of your mouth, you're like.

In a sense, you know that you're saying it but you're thinking.

I never even are you know?

Formulated that thought in my own mind much less articulated it and it's almost like in this very moment.

You're saying something and learning it at the same time.

You know what I mean?

Like.

Well, how about when you.

How about when you say something you didn't know you knew?

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

Like it's sort of like that like I'm so I'm saying I often hear people and I think man that you know another reminder of God's

Spirit at work and I Mentioned Fox's Book of Martyrs the other day or earlier and I

Remind one of my favorite stories in there is of a woman.

I think her name was Miss Pruess and it talks about how she was a wife of a

Catholic guy, she became a Protestant and Everybody starts ridiculing her her husband

her older son towns people and they're calling her stupid and just making fun of her and

So John Fox says I'll just record the story for you and you decide for yourself if this

woman was stupid or not and he He gives this account and I'm like, man, that woman would put a lot of us

to shame.

She was so brilliant in her responses.

So what part of the it's worth looking up, but there's a couple of parts I remember that I

looked and I thought man that was brilliant as a response.

But at one point the She's brought before the Inquisitor to answer

certain questions and he says to her how can you deny that Jesus

body and blood are really received in the sacrament that it really turns into Christ's body and blood and

She says how can you deny your creed?

Which says he sits at the right hand of God not on earth and a piece of bread and he just goes on and on.

And she's just a brilliant woman and I'm like man, I you know.

But I say that only because it just reminds me of how much wisdom God gives to

people, you know, you could have your own way and it could be very effective very useful and all together legitimate and

still.

Learn tremendously.

Oh, yeah people and I had that happen about two months ago with a rabid anti

-calvinist and I was debating in a chat place.

I was debating a Catholic this rabid anti -cat.

We've gone at it.

We've you know, like snarling dogs with a fence between us kind of thing.

This guy's he's an obstreperous anti -calvinist and at any rate he taught me

something and it was like so good so brilliant that I've Actually had an

effect on some stuff.

But anyway, the whole context was people were talking with Catholics were talking I said you're not supposed to bow down before idols.

You're not supposed to have these instruments that have grace in them and this and these Catholics see well What do you do with the

Ark of the Covenant?

What do you do with the the serpent on the thing and What do you do with the handkerchiefs in the New Testament, you

know, and I gave a good a good answer.

Okay, I did I gave a good competent answer, but he gave a better one.

And he said he jumps in he says to that did the guy he goes look he said those are the

things God commanded that you you built.

The Bible says don't build for yourself this stuff.

White went ding, of course.

Because it a huge difference between what God commands and what men do for themselves in their own idolatry.

You know, it was a subtle thing, but it was really an important thing.

It's a good example.

I even told the guy I Told him later when I met him a week later.

I said look I want to thank you for that part.

That was really good.

And I learned from it.

No, thank you.

He wasn't used to that from a Calvinist.

I'd rabbit Calvinist.

I'm a rabbit.

I'm a rabid Calvinist.

He's a rabid anti Calvinist.

Yeah, so I bring up the observation.

So the.

Roman Catholics, of course, they proliferate statues Eastern Orthodox do their icons and

so forth and then they'll point to things like What you mentioned the Ark of the Covenant?

Imagery of cherubim and stuff Pomegranate trees things like that in the temple and this is supposed

to warrant that.

And I say imagine this imagine if Moses said you know what I think it'd be a good idea if I make a picture of Myself and

Aaron and put it up in the temple.

How do you think that would have gone over?

Right.

Do you think they had that Liberty just making a flat image?

I don't care how what you want, you know, we you want to be a statue you want it to be a flat image whether.

Icon.

Imagine Moses thinking he could just do that at a whim what would have happened?

Well, Aaron and Nadab tried out a similar experiment.

Right when I when I read the account of Aaron or a need happen to buy who I think you know What these guys

are like a lot of contemporary people they thought My motives are genuine here.

I want to bring to God Something that I think will be pleasing to him.

But they didn't bring to him what he commanded them to they brought what they thought Without any divine

warrant and that was reputed.

It was it was not accepted and so what we learned from the whole tabernacle system is you've got to do things God's way in

worship and.

And and of course the images that even with the cherubim on the ark, for example

There was no God didn't Give them an image of himself above the ark, right?

So there's there's no image of God there.

Secondly they weren't supposed to bow down to the cherubim on the ark that there's no

command given there.

But the whole idea is this does symbolize God's presence.

So when you have people bowing down towards the ark, it's not because the ark itself is a fit object

of veneration or prostration but because it signifies the presence of God right.

God is present between the cherubim and of course this the incident with the Serpent on

a pole is is Counter evidence against their whole thing.

They were told to make this Serpent on a pole for a particular purpose and once they

started to venerate it It was a it was ordered to be destroyed, right?

So.

Sorry, I smelled something burning I had to go check it's.

Tacos you're making us.

Know it was.

It got stronger and stronger.

I'm like, okay something's really burning.

I have a window open.

I want to smell off the window and it was.

I couldn't smell it out there like now I have to go check out the house, so.

But it's nothing burning.

So that's why I was gone, but I was listening to everything you said and you're right.

Yeah with the Ark of the Covenant God's presence was actually there and so you can bow to the presence of God.

But.

Yeah, there's.

So much, you know, I'd like I have a t -shirt that says so much heresy so little time.

Yeah, you know what?

I just saw the other day that I want to get that was interesting.

I don't know if you've ever seen the Roman Catholic Michael Lofton.

I Forget the name of his program.

He has a YouTube channel.

But he's kind I think he's bounced back and forth between Eastern Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism.

And he's currently in his in a Roman Catholic phase.

But he wrote a book Responding to Eastern Orthodoxy and I always

like watching it's like It'd be like watching a modalist and a Mormon argue, right?

It's just it's to me.

It's interesting watching these guys.

They're both wrong and They're both pointing out error in the other side.

So so that to me is a little interesting, but but also you you get some

devastating useful statements.

So.

One of the differences between Rome in the East is that Rome is comfortable as you know Asserting

doctrines that have no precedent in earlier history, right, right.

So Rome is comfortable with some of her Marian doctrines the the bodily assumption of

Mary you can't find that for centuries.

Nobody's even Hinting in this direction for centuries in the early church much less is

it predominant or Official right it's it's just not there for hundreds and hundreds and

hundreds of years.

So Rome at one point wanted to say well our doctrines are are what were

handed down by apostolic tradition.

Well, you have to tinker with that once you start Accepting doctrines that have no precedent.

So they talk about the development of doctrine, right?

Cardinal Newman talks about the development of doctrine and development ends up looking less like

what you think of as development where You know like a child growing and it's more like

Goldschmidt's hopeful monster thing right where he Remember Darwin.

Darwin had the the gradual evolution idea.

But Goldschmidt was the guy who said, you know a chicken lays an egg and out pops an alligator.

There's this sort of sudden thing that wasn't there before not even in initial, you know

stages.

So What they try to say is well the logic for these things is there but

people don't end up making the Connections until later and so you don't expect to find certain things

in the Fathers, but you can find Some things that will be building blocks for this.

Well, the Eastern Church on the other hand says no these things are all there from day one

explicitly and the church is doing this so that if you read like the The Idolatry Council the

Second Council of Nicaea not the Orthodox Council.

But the the Second Council of Nicaea they not only say that you're to worship icons or can worship icons.

They say you must worship icons and this is what the father's always taught.

And so you have to if you're an Eastern Orthodox person find this in the early fathers, which you

can't it's not there.

Right origin repudiates it.

Tertullian repudiates it.

Roundly like they don't even like many of them don't even like pictures, right?

Some some people will say well you could have pictures but you can't make pictures of God.

They'll say the father at least and none of them can be used for veneration.

That's just out of the question and many of them would make a distinction and say, okay.

You could have a picture but not in the church because you don't want to confuse people.

So but in any case there was never any objects in the church with with pictures that

would confuse the worshiper.

So You've got this to these two different views well Michael Lofton I saw some quotes from

him that made me interested in this book.

He has this quote where he's saying he's trying to argue against the row or the Eastern view of

tradition and For the Catholic view of tradition and so he points out the early fathers

didn't worship or venerate idols or icons.

So he's using this against this Eastern The Eastern view in order to prop up the the West the Catholic

view and say that that Tradition doesn't have to be supported by the early fathers.

It could just be based on the say -so of the Roman Church, but he's admitting when he does this that there's no

Endorsement of idols and icons in the early church.

And so I'm thinking he's arguing against this Eastern guy.

But what he's saying is just pure gold because I can use this against both of them, right?

So I want to get his book and find out more no more stuff that he's admitting in there.

Well, that's the way of the cult mind.

You know, it's what's it called a cognitive dissonance.

It's just it's just what happens and it's ridiculous.

I was talking to a Muslim last night for a couple of hours and We're talking about surah 86

86 5 to 7 let man but think from what he's created.

He's created from a drop.

He made it proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs.

Well that says a man's seed comes from his chest hence chesticles and I said no no, no and

He's actually studying medicine.

He actually was starting to become a doctor.

He was I know about this.

He started making this convoluted argument to justify this because it's surah 42 if there's any discrepancy in

the Quran.

It's then the Quran is false.

So that's what the Quran says.

So that's how you prove Islam is false.

It's one of the many ways but any rate so I said look is that where where the seed forms and and anyway the point is

all the irrationality and illogic and justification to make something

work and Then they can't see their own problem and he and I and then I we went to surah 4 157 where God

deceived people.

Into thinking Jesus was crucified when he was not I said, that's your God doing that, right?

He said yes, I said so he deceived people, you know, he only deceived us deceivers.

I said really.

So then you admit he's a deceiver and you know, I said how you know You're not a

deceiver and therefore deceived by your God.

I mean You know.

It's just so easy and they can't see and won't see are not able to see because we know God has to

open their minds and it's sad.

But you know as a friend of mine said We're in sales not production.

So, you know, it's true, but yeah the irrationality of the cult mind is is

so bad.

You know surah 7 99 says nobody considers himself from Allah's deception except

those who are perishing.

So if you're a Muslim you have to fear that Allah could be deceiving you.

Otherwise, you're automatically one of the perishing according to the verse.

That's that's a hopelessly bad position to be in isn't it?

But oh, yeah.

It says you reminded me.

Yeah, go ahead.

Yeah, you reminded me of another thing.

So one of my favorite stories of the silly Quran and

the Hadith the traditions of Muhammad is.

There's a so we believe as Christians that God reveals himself to all people through nature and conscience, right?

He he's made his his existence known to all things to all people and.

And.

Muslims superficially do too.

They would say everybody comes into the world knowing God.

But their reason for saying it is so bizarre and and most people don't know this so they'll they'll mention just

superficially.

Yeah, we think all people know that God exists and so forth.

But the real the good stuff is getting down, you know to where that comes from.

Well, according to Muslims it says in surah 7 that Allah

Brought forth Adam's descendants at the beginning of history and the Hadith filled us in the idea is that

Allah stroked Adam's back and he brought out all of his progeny and made us stand

before him and acknowledge him as the only God and then he put us all back into Adam

and.

Then history comes along so that when we're born into the world we've already had some acquaintance with

Allah and Some sources would even say we were even told at that time that Muhammad would be the final prophet and all the rest.

Well, so but but here's the reason I bring it up.

It's it's it's humorous.

Why do you suppose in order for Allah to get out all of Adam's descendants?

He stroked Adam's back.

It's because boy see you see where it's gone.

Oh, it's reinforced is the silly Idea of the Quran that semen proceeds from between

the backbone and the ribs.

So Allah's addressing the right part of Adam's anatomy to to get out his progeny.

It's why I need to know where that is because I would like to put those together.

It's it's wild.

And it's yes.

This whole thing gets even worse.

I mean think about it.

So here's Allah stroking Adam's back.

Well in Christianity, we believe that God can condescend so he's infinite he's not limited

or constrained by anything and Precisely because he's not limited by anything.

He's able to reveal himself in Our experience right that doesn't

limit him.

It's because he's unlimited that he can do that.

Well Muslims often balk at that.

They don't believe that God can condescend.

They don't believe in the Incarnation.

God can't enter into the world that sort of thing.

So you got to ask yourself what in the world's happening here that Allah's stroking Adam's back.

How's that happening?

Where does he get the hand to do that with if he can't condescend?

This seems to suggest if there's no condescension on God's part then Allah must just be like this

contrary to their.

You know if any Muslim says he's infinite this would be contrary to it or else you're admitting that he condescends, right?

But you don't want to do because you want to argue against Christianity and the Incarnation and all the rest.

So when I started thinking about this, I was I started thinking man.

I wonder what else these sources say about all this and one one more funny story from

from the Islamic sources, so There's a story catch this.

There's a story in Al -tabari a famous Islamic

Historian and Tradition tradition is TC taught various traditions.

Well Tabri tells this story of how Allah made Adam as

a Steep he's formed a statue of Adam and before breathing life into it He caused it to

stand upright for a long extended period of time.

So we're talking many days I don't remember if it was 40 days or 40 years, but it was a period of time

and Then we're told that a group of angels was coming

along and they saw this statue of Adam and they were afraid.

So imagine it there's these angelic creatures and they see this statue of Adam and it frightens them.

Well, why are they frightened that doesn't make a whole lot of sense if you are thinking of these Supernatural

beings why with a statue frightened them.

Well, then we're told that Satan Joined them at some point and in their

fearfulness Satan decides he's gonna allay their fears.

He's gonna go over there and inspect the situation and then come back and tell them what the deal is

so Satan goes over to this statue and it says he entered in through its mouth and

Exited out through its rear and then it came back to them and he said or

Satan came back to them and said Don't worry fellas, that's my paraphrase.

I don't think he called him fellas, but don't worry.

He said that is hollow.

But your Lord is solid.

In other words because he was able to go in through its mouth and out through its rear that proved It's not Allah

because Allah is not a hollow statue.

He's solid.

Now this is this is bizarre.

It seems to suggest that Allah is a Physical being of some sort now what makes this even

wilder if you look at surah 112 of the Quran.

So the third to last chapter of the Quran one of the shortest the most memorable.

It has this statement there say he is Allah the one the eternal.

He doesn't beget neither if he begotten and there's nothing like unto him.

Well Muslims they think this is such a grand text proving monotheism refuting the Trinity.

Well, here's what's interesting.

So the the occasion for the revelation of that is that a group of

Jews and Pagans had asked Muhammad.

What is your Lord made out of?

They want to know the stuff of Allah and This surah is supposed to be addressing that.

Well, when you look at the the translations when it says in some translations, he's eternal say he's Allah the one the eternal.

He doesn't beget nor is he begotten.

The word eternal is is wildly Translated in all these like there's no consistency in the translations.

Hmm and it's because none of them want to say what the word actually says if you go back to Tabari.

It's the word is actually the same word that means solid.

So it's saying he's solid and that's why he doesn't beget and isn't begotten.

It's not because of You know, he's not a physical being or something like that.

It's because he's not hollow.

There's no there's no cavity, right?

There's no way he can.

He doesn't go to the bathroom because there's no hollowness there he's plugged up if you will right he can't.

He can't produce, you know, the semen can't flow from between the backbone and the ribs out of Allah that's why he

can't have a son.

Muhammad was a pagan to the core and.

And you know, so they they try and forget all this stuff and make us forget it.

It's just pure paganism, right?

Yeah, have you heard of?

Christian Prince.

Yeah, I haven't listened much but I've heard of him yeah.

Yeah, he's told me some things that in the Hadith what it says in the Arabic, you know.

One of the what I remember is that a woman's rear is two miles wide

and in the one one place and that Either Muhammad or somebody had to go from one to

the other to the other two.

And I was like, are you kidding me?

So there's all I mean, it's so obvious that he's pagan.

Paganism.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

And.

What.

So he knows a lot about it, but we got some questions.

I think.

Let's see Catholics, let's you get back up a little bit.

Don't put them together.

Something's gonna break.

Sam Shimon has so much hatred toward his ex -wife.

Yeah, that's another issue.

Question.

Catholics believe propitiation happens in mass because it present the present a present tense.

Why is this so long?

Present tense to make propitiation.

Jesus ongoing work of the high priest.

Any response.

Okay, so.

Let's see if I can find that.

Put that in here.

I'm just trying to pull up.

Hebrews 5.

Here we go.

All right.

Okay, so part part of the problem here is That

Hebrews 5 1 isn't talking about Christ's work, right.

So it says every for every high priest Being taken from among men on behalf of man

is appointed in things relating to God that he should offer both gifts and

sacrifices for sins.

And unless I'm missing something I don't see The

word for propitiation there to make propitiation.

But in any case Hebrews 5 1 just isn't talking about Christ's work is talking about

the priests of old and that's.

A session and holds a priesthood, okay.

I'm going through them.

Oh.

5 1 3 2.

I'm sorry.

I see how it says 2 so.

Being able with those being ignorant and going astray since also he himself.

Well that didn't help.

I'm going through the other one.

It doesn't say that so.

Hebrews 9 23 Necessary for the

copies of things on heavens to be cleansed with those with these but the heavenly things themselves better sacrifices than these.

Yeah.

Not very good.

Yeah, they don't have to do with Propitiatory sacrifice of the mass,

but that's it.

Yes.

Oh, okay.

So maybe in 724 through 25.

There might be some confusion over what's Still true what's still ongoing and what isn't

in in 24?

It talks about Christ being able to intercede for those who draw near to God and

There it it's a Present and so forth, but we agree his intercession is ongoing.

But it's on the basis of the once -for -all sacrifice his propitiation on the cross.

So the propitiation isn't Ongoing.

So I see there there's a reference to singenis.

So I guess maybe singenis mentioned this.

I'll have to check his I don't know.

It's probably in his book not by faith alone, I'll have to see if that

clarifies the argument.

Any but.

Yeah.

Propitiation is clearly presented as a once -for -all thing.

And that's part of the contrast that the author of Hebrews is making that these priests have to make these Continuous

sacrifices because they're not adequate.

But Christ is able to sacrifice himself once for all and it's a done deal, right?

You always like their argument I mean I like to get them and know exactly what it is they're asking and in my file like I just put

it in my Catholic file and okay, so what I'll do is go

through and See what the context of these verses are trying to understand.

What's being said is if they come up with a response I've learned over the years if I don't have a good response already practiced.

I generally don't like to ad -lib but you know,

but still.

By the way, that's an aside.

Huh?

Were you not?

No, go ahead.

Oh.

You mentioned it is finished.

The other day I was talking about Psalm 22 online and it's interesting I

A lot of people skip past the superscriptions of the Psalms and think they're not overly

relevant and unfortunately, some of our translations aren't great here because

They they assume certain things Because of

their own difficulties and Making sense of certain things.

So anyways that often in the superscriptions.

It'll say in some translations things like To the chief musician or for the chief

musician Upon the tune or something like that of so -and -so or the of such -and

-such but interestingly When you look at ancient Jewish Interpretations of this so if you look at

the Septuagint you look at the Targums you look at the various midrashes.

There are two different ways that they understand the first expression for the what we sometimes translate for the choir

master in Some cases they think it's a way of saying for the leader not specifically a

choir master somebody who leads in music.

It could be used that way but just for the leader more general.

Other other ways they translate it is as for the end.

So the Septuagint for example says Ice top tell us meaning unto the tell us the end

and the reason I think this is interesting is.

Is.

Well, and by the way the midrash sometimes it says for the leader sometimes it says for the eternal one so it's

taking the leader to be The the.

When it says the end they're taking it as meaning like the beginning and the end the title for God.

When you so when you read it this way it already sets you up in the psalm to think of this messianically.

If this is for the end if it's for the tell us the future or For the

eternal or the one who is the end then you're thinking messianically.

Reason.

I bring it up.

I'm not trying to say this is how you have to take this is but it's very interesting.

Because the word tell us is the word from out of which we you know, get the word to tell us

die.

To tell us die when Jesus says on the cross it is finished if you read

the Psalms this way It's almost like he's saying This is this is it this is the fulfillment of all of that.

There's like 50 Psalms that have that in the title 50 Psalms.

And so it'd be like Jesus saying, you know all that stuff that's written in the Psalms.

It's written about me and it at the end of Psalm 22.

It has the expression.

I Mean, I think he is saying that even apart from this observation.

He's saying everything's fulfilled in me and it's been paid for right but In at the

end of Psalm 22 which begins with this expression it says

of God it says.

He has.

Performed it or he has finished it.

That's how the Psalm ends.

And of course Jesus quotes Psalm 22 on the cross, right?

Just interesting thought came to mind.

I cross -referenced that with Colossians 2 14 that says he canceled the certificate of debt the Chiragraphon

Consisting of decrees which was hostile to us.

He took it out of the way having nailed it to the cross that to me is one of the best verses for Calvinism

it necessitates a Predestination election limited atonement eternal security.

Because if he canceled the sin debt the chirographon Then he only did it for the

elect because you can't go to hell for a debt that doesn't exist anymore and it Implies

election predestination and limited atonement.

And so anyway, but it goes along with John 1930, you know.

It's a tell us diet is finished.

It has been done.

It's taken care of no more.

It's it but we know.

There's another thing that reminds me to the side note.

Sometimes I'll do this with Catholics and I'll be talking I'm trying to lead them down a road and a lot of time.

They about half the time they fall for it.

I've half.

I'll say well, so let me get this straight.

So you're saying, you know Soteriology say so you're you're you're telling me then that you're saved by grace

after all you can do.

And I'll go.

Well, yeah.

And I say well, that's I just quoted you third Nephi 1918 in the Book of Mormon.

I Love doing that it says I don't quote to the Watchtower 1983 page 12

April 1st.

About the second requirement for salvation which is keeping commandments now I'll quote these to these guys without them knowing I'm coding and they

say yeah, we it is a you know small thing, but.

Yeah, that reminds me.

I mean I I do like I you know.

Keep you know how the the game goes, right?

So if you if you quote something from the Bible to a person and they don't know where it's from.

Then they'll just flat -out disagree with it, right?

Yes, if you tell them it's from the Bible or they already know it's from the Bible.

That's not what they're gonna say if they're trying to appear Christian or whatever.

They're gonna say.

Oh, you're misinterpreting.

That's right.

So I mean I learned that's a long time ago.

I had this Mormon friend I was only a believer for a short while and every time I

pointed to him, you know Pointed him to something in the Bible.

He'd always say that's just your interpretation and I was thinking how do I respond to this?

Because in a sense, yeah, obviously that's my interpretation, but it's not like I did something Clever here or something I just

took it for you know, if if my dad when I was a kid said take out the trash and I took out The trash yeah, I'm

interpreting him in a sense, right?

But I'm not not I'm not doing something weird or esoteric here.

I'm just His I'm processing his words and understanding what it means.

There's there's no hijinks going on.

So I just didn't know how to respond to it that early in the game.

And so anyways, I one day he was coming up to me.

He was so mad from our prior conversation that the first thing out of his mouth not even hello or anything else.

He said Jesus is not God.

And I'm like in my mind.

I'm like, well, hello to you too.

And but then I but I quoted John 1 1 I said in the beginning was the Word the Word was with God and the Word was God

and he just he fired back and Said you're you're misinterpreting that

He goes Jesus is not God and I said, wait a minute.

I said I didn't give you my interpretation.

I gave you a quotation and said and I said by you responding that way.

You've just showed me, you know what it's saying as much as I do.

Right, so I I learned from that if if at any time I could quote something Without the

person knowing what it was I could get their honest reaction.

And so it doesn't work as much if if a Catholic is familiar with certain statements or whatever.

But but I'll tell you something as a little aside.

There are some things I said in my statement about the clarity of Scripture where I at points I quoted

Early church fathers, but at other points I made some pretty.

Clear.

You know statements that could have been almost verbatim from church fathers because I'm setting up our

Roman Catholic critics when they come along they're gonna you know Roman Catholics are gonna take that video and they're gonna respond to it and I'm

thinking this is how I'm gonna catch him because I've got hundreds and hundreds of quotes

from patristic sources on the clarity of Scripture and.

So I thought you know what?

Here's here's one way to get them is I'll make a statement about the clarity of Scripture that's almost verbatim what a church father says

and I'll watch them attack it and then I'm gonna quote them and say You know.

So I it's strategically it's grand isn't it?

I think you muted yourself.

Huh, I guess I did.

Yeah.

I do that with Proverbs 16 for which says God makes all things even the wicked for the day of evil and I'll say You

know, I you know defending Calvinism.

I think God makes everything For his own purpose.

I even even the wicked for the day of evil.

That is not right.

He would never do that and you know do that or I like it.

When they say I took it out of context I say okay took it out of context.

That means, you know what the context is.

You can tell me what it is.

Please tell me what the context is.

And they did they don't know.

You know, there's just I'm amazed at and I'm grateful for God that he is Enlightened and

saved me and you too and is you know there but for the grace of God go I but it is amazing.

How blind people choose to be want to be it's amazing to

me.

Hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah, well, I do have to go help my wife now.

I was just gonna say I gotta go to ah.

Help my wife.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It was great though.