Joel Beeke And Encouraging

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Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the apostle

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Paul said, "'But we did not yield in subjection to them "'for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel "'would remain with you.'"

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In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you.

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By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her king.

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Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth. Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth, and as you know, the format of No Compromise Radio, we have

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Mondays, is a recorded sermon that I've preached here at Bethlehem Bible Church. Tuesdays, I talk to my associate,

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Pastor Steve, about issues in the local church. Thursdays, I talk about a doctrine, what is repentance, what is the imputation of Christ's righteousness.

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Friday, we usually look at some false teaching, how to discern things better. But on Wednesdays, I like to talk to authors, pastors, theologians to help us work through theological and pastoral issues.

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And so today, we have Dr. Joel Beeky on the line to help us with that very thing. Joel, welcome to No Compromise Radio.

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Thank you for having me, brother. Joel, this is the second time you've been on, and so I'd like to especially ask you today to help us in the area of encouraging pastors.

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I have in front of me your book, Encouragement for Today's Pastors, subtitle,

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Help From the Puritans that you wrote with Terry Slachter. Is that how you say his name?

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Right. Okay, and this is, of course, on Reformation Heritage Books. Give me an idea,

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Joel, I know you are a pastor as well. What are some of the struggles pastors go through, and then we can talk about how a congregation can help encourage their pastors, and then eventually we'll talk about where pastors can go for their soul's refreshment.

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So why are there so many troubles in pastoral ministry, do you think? Well, pastoral ministry's always been challenging,

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Mike. You're dealing with souls, you're battling against the devil, you've got the most important job in the world, you're looking at eternity, you're fighting against the powers that be.

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So there's much to discourage a minister, and always has been. But particularly,

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I think, in 21st century North America, there are just huge expectations placed upon ministers, and that in a culture that, even in a

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Christian culture, that often thinks that everyone should do that which is right in his own eyes, and that the authority of the ministry is not what it used to be.

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And so when you see your congregation dwindle instead of increase, when you see

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God's people backslide instead of go forward, when you see young people get caught up in worldly ways, these are all the kinds of things that can really discourage a minister.

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And then I think, too, you gotta remember, Satan attacks a minister more than anyone else because he knows if he can get the minister to fall, he can divide the sheep.

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So the ministry is very challenging. On the other side, it's also extremely rewarding.

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And when it comes to the subject of encouraging ministers, I think we need to pick up on those rewards and also look at what the

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Holy Spirit does over against Satan and what God's people do over against the worldly people.

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And so to be a minister of the gospel is to be in the midst of extremes, extreme hatred, extreme love.

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Paul puts it that way, I think, in 2 Corinthians 6. We were pressed in on every side.

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We were unknown yet known. We were defamed yet renowned. And he has a whole list of things.

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We're sorrowful yet rejoicing. And so that's the life of a minister. He's got great sorrows and great joys at the same time.

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Well, Joel is a pastor and a professor, and I'm sure, Joel, you've received much love from your church there at Heritage Netherlands Reform Congregation, and I have as well.

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But what about those churches out there that have pastors that are really struggling? You say at the very beginning of your book, 1 ,500 pastors leave their churches.

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And if you would have said each year, I still would have been shocked, but I was flabbergasted at the next line, each month due to conflict, burnout, or moral failure, according to Christianity Today.

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What advice would you give an average congregant in ways that they could encourage their pastor?

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And like I said, I've been encouraged by the church. I pastor, you have as well. But what about some of those folks out there that see their pastor is down and depressed or discouraged and anxious?

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How can a congregant come alongside of a pastor to spur him on and be used by the

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Lord for that very purpose? Well, that's a great question.

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Robert Murray McShane, by the way, a 19th century Scottish pastor, once wrote an incredibly good article on how to encourage your pastor.

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One of the ways I think that really encourages ministers is when they feel that people really grow under their ministry spiritually.

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The greatest encouragement, of course, is when you see people converted under your ministry and you realize you've been the vessel in God's hand to lead them from darkness to light.

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And that's phenomenal. I've never had anyone tell me that in truth and really mean it without me just weeping in their presence.

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The tears just spring into my eyes. It's just wonderful. That's the greatest encouragement.

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Second greatest encouragement probably is just to see them grow in grace. And they can encourage a minister so much when they come up and say, you know,

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I've never saw that before in that sermon. That's really helpful to me personally. And then give something specific. To say, you know, it's a wonderful sermon, it blessed me, that's a bit of an encouragement,

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I suppose, if they really mean it, but it doesn't have a lot of meat to it or content to it. But to tell your pastor this particular thought struck me and helped me, and I want to go home now and implement it and do the sermon,

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I find that extremely encouraging. Also, when people tell me,

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I'm sure you have that too, Mike, that they're remembering you every day at the throne of grace. Wow.

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My best friends are those that take my worthless name, said John Newton, and carry it to the ears of the

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Lord of Sabaoth and whisper it in his ears. And I think people that pray for us give us a surge of strength and encouragement.

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And then finally, I think little acts of kindness, little notes of encouragement, warm responses to teaching and to preaching, the freedom to open up themselves entirely to you, even with problems,

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I actually find encouraging so that you get the feeling these people really care about me, they love me just like I love them.

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And so when they look to you as a spiritual father and really respect what you say, as you try to bring them guidance from the word of God, that's encouraging.

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All of that stuff that helps them be more conformed to Christ and they acknowledge to you that they are more conformed to Christ through your ministry is far more encouraging than just telling you that you're a great minister or whatever.

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Talking to Joel Beeky today on No Compromise Radio, Encouragement for Today's Pastors is one of his books.

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And I think that would be a good book to buy for your pastor. If you're listening today and you're a Lutheran or a

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Methodist or a Baptist, Presbyterian, Congregationalist, this would be an excellent book because it has biblical advice sprinkled throughout with Puritan quotes.

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Joel, tell our readers, you've got your book, Meet Puritans, that you wrote with Randall Peterson as well.

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Why do you put an emphasis on Puritan writings and how can our listeners benefit from reading some good

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Puritans? Oh, I love that question, Mike. I know, it's too easy.

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I have harder questions to ask you, but that's for a different show. It's okay. I've been reading the

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Puritans since I was nine years old. So I've got 50 plus years into it. And I always try to keep one

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Puritan book going all the time. I think they're the most savory group of writers ever in terms of bringing you spiritual meat from the word of God.

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They convict me, they exhort me, they allure me. They're full of spiritual substance.

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They're very quotable, picturesque, full of illustrations, exciting to read.

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But they're by far the most exciting group of writers in church history to read and the most substantive.

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They're as familiar with Habakkuk as they are with Romans. And they bring all of scripture to bear on situations.

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And so, yeah, I've been reading them all my life and I've been writing about them all my life. My two major books are

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Meet the Puritans, in which I, with Randall Peterson, give the life story of all 150

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Puritans that have been reprinted in the last 50 years, and give mini reviews or summaries of all 700 titles of the

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Puritans that have been reprinted in the last 50 years. So that book is biography and bibliography.

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And then the other book, which is larger, called A Puritan Theology, Doctrine for Life, which

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I co -authored with Mark Jones, is the first Puritan systematic theology ever written.

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In other words, we talk about the doctrine of God, doctrine of man, and Christ, and salvation, and the church, and the last things in Puritan thinking in 60 chapters.

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We look at 60 areas where the Puritans contributed substantially to good theology, and then ask the question in each chapter, how does that theology that they taught pertain to our daily lives, our family life, our church life, what can we learn from it for today?

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And then I, of course, I have the book that you just mentioned, Encouragement for Today's Pastors, which is just a small couple hundred paperback, couple hundred page paperback, which looks at maybe 15, 20 areas where the

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Puritans helped lift up the spirits of pastors, and encouraged them to be zealous again, and to get back into the means of grace, and not to look back, but to press forward, and do the work of the

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Lord. Joel, when people think about how many Puritan writings are out there,

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I often tell folks, why don't you start with a Thomas Watson book, because he will give you rich theology about Christ Jesus and his word, but it is easier to read.

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Is that good advice, or who would you recommend, our listeners, if they had to pick up one

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Puritan book that was written by someone 500 years ago, who do you recommend?

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Well, I used to say years ago exactly what you said, but since then, what we've done is we've got a number of simple 100 -page paperbacks that we've edited, so they read like they were written yesterday, without sacrificing the meaning, called, it's a mini -series called

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Puritan Treasures for Today, and I usually start people out on that, Mike, so that they don't even have to struggle with the old words at all, and that whets their appetite.

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As soon as they pick up, for example, John Flavel's The Triumph Over Sinful Fear, and read that 100 -page paperback on good fear and bad fear, and how we triumph over sinful fear, they are hooked, and then

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I direct them to the actual writings of several hundred years ago in Thomas Watson, I also direct them to John Flavel, John Bunyan, and by that time, after they've read one or two of these easy, simple, contemporary

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Puritan edited volumes, they are so excited about reading the

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Puritans that they have no trouble reading some of the simpler Puritans, and from there,

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I try to get them to graduate to some of the more challenging Puritans, like Thomas Goodwin and John Owen.

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Joel, when I was reading your book, Encouragement for Today's Pastors, in chapter one, you talk a little bit about John Flavel, and I'm sure some of our listeners are thinking

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Puritans and they're Victorian, prudish in their actions and attitudes, and they weren't really real people, there are a lot of negative things that we hear about Puritans, but when

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I read about John Flavel, and you said, he preached in the woods, in the dark night, and even on island rocks near the shore before the tide submerged his makeshift pulpit, and then this is the one that got me, on one occasion, he dressed in women's clothing to reach a secret place for worship.

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I was hooked, I think it would probably be fair to say you and I are both conservative people, and would

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I ever dress up as a woman, I'd automatically say no, but in this particular case, I like Flavel's actions, you have any comments to those?

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Well, if you knew that, if you got caught on that occasion, that you'd be thrown in jail for a number of years for preaching, you might not hesitate to disguise yourself.

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Flavel has a fascinating life, and was a great man of God, and he would preach the gospel, like most

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Puritans would, at any cost. I mean, John Bunyan was in jail for 12 years for preaching the gospel, and the court brought him out of jail, put him before a judge, and said, the judge said, if you promise not to preach the gospel anymore,

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I'll let you go home to your wife, and your four children, and your blind daughter,

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Mary, who desperately needs you. And Bunyan said, you know, it grieves me so much to be separated from them, but I wanna tell you, sir, you let me out of jail today,

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I'll be preaching tomorrow, and he said, back to jail with you. The Puritans just loved preaching, they'd preach at the cost of their life, because they believed preaching was

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God's primary instrument to save souls. Joel, when it comes to the media these days, of course, we can use it for good, but what happens when a congregant has just a regular pastor, a plain pastor, ordinary pastor, and with any click of their mouse on the computer, they can listen to world -class preaching, the most gifted men in all the world can just enter their homes.

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What kind of advice could you give to the congregant that has a plain pastor, and then what kind of encouragement can you give a plain pastor who's preaching the gospel?

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Well, it's interesting you say plain. I said plain because Flavel said plain, that's why

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I said it. Yeah, the Puritans really stressed that men of God must be plain pastors, plain teaching, plain preaching, plain godly walk of life.

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And that's who God blesses. God doesn't always bless the extraordinary preacher.

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I say to people who, you know, I mean, my church, they've listened to me for 27 years.

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Of course, it's more refreshing to go online and download a very, very famous pastor.

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And so I say to them, well, that's okay that you do that during the week, but on Sunday, you're part of this family, and God has given you the pastors he's given you, and you are to be fed by those particular pastors on the

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Sabbath. Now, what you do from Monday through Saturday, that's up to you. And I hope and pray that you do go on and listen to great preaching.

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That can only help your soul, but do appreciate whatever minister you have as long as he preaches the truth to you.

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And appreciate him for the gifts he has, and don't look for the gifts he doesn't have. Because the next one that comes along after your present pastor leaves, probably won't have some of the gifts that this pastor has.

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And what ends up happening when you get a critical spirit, you're perpetually critical and disappointed. And the real advice is, appreciate every under shepherd

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God has sent you, who is endowed with exactly the kind of gifts God wants him to be endowed with at this particular time for this particular church.

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And how about for the pastor, is it true that - Oh, yeah. Yeah, I think about pastors who preach the gospel, and maybe you know who said this.

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I only know it in general that a lot of people preach the gospel better than I do, but no one preaches a better gospel.

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For the pastor that does follow 2 Timothy 4, one and following about preaching the word in season and out of season, any words of encouragement for him?

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Yeah, I once said to my wife, I mentioned a certain minister,

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I think it was Sinclair Ferguson. And I said to my wife, can you just imagine how God could use you, this is in a foolish moment, how

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God could use me if I had the gifts that Sinclair had. And Sinclair is a very good friend of mine, and I just admire his gifts.

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And my wife said to me, you know, she said, God's given you the gifts he's given you, and I think you better be content with those.

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And it hit home like, oh, yes, you're right. That's a wise word, my dear wife, so wise.

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God doesn't ask you to use gifts that he hasn't given you. He has asked you to multiply, not to bury your talent in the ground, but to multiply the gifts he has given you.

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So I try to look at it this way. I think God has given me a little bit of a gift for writing.

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And so I'm gonna use that gift to the max. Other gifts I don't have in ministry,

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I probably will minimize those particular aspects of ministry. I won't forego them completely, of course, but you do the best you have with what

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God has given you, and you look to him to add the blessing. And don't be coveting or chasing after gifts that you don't have.

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God wants to use you, brother, just the way you are. Joel, it reminds me of Exodus chapter four, and God commissioned

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Moses to proclaim his truth. And you don't see the Lord as angry as he was there very often with Moses, which leads me to a quote here from your

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Puritan books. You have the Puritans alphabetically listed, and the first one is

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Thomas Adams. And so just to give the listeners a quote from Thomas Adams, that shows how vivid they are in their writing.

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Adams said, unthankfulness, this is the witch, the sorceress whose drowsy enchantments have made us even forget

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God himself. I think that's good advice for either the congregant or the pastor when they're wanting different or more gifts than the sovereign

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Holy Spirit has given their pastor. Wouldn't you say so? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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And the other thing, Mike, I might add to that is, you know, if you can come home with two or three thoughts from a sermon that can really be used to help you grow in spiritual maturity, that's a good sermon.

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And so my dad used to say, when you listen to sermons, you should be like chickens, pick out the good food and leave the rest.

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And I think that people need to remember that. Not every sermon is going to be gripping from beginning to end, but if you really pray ahead of time,

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Lord, let there be a few good thoughts in this sermon that I can really take home with me, like that quote you just had from Adam.

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Well, you can meditate on that for an hour, couldn't you? Absolutely. How about this one from Joseph Elaine?

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Put yourself often into your graves and look out from the fence upon the world and see what judgment you have of it then.

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Yeah, that's powerful. It's powerful. It reminds me of Spurgeon's quote. He said, if you're getting worldly, just remember you're carrying your coffin on your back and one day you only have grave dust in your mouth and you have to leave all your possessions behind.

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Joel, we only have a few minutes left here on No Compromise Radio. You know, in the old days here in New England, I live in Massachusetts, the cemeteries, the graveyards were adjacent to the church.

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And so I can imagine families walking into the building to worship the Lord on a

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Sunday and thinking about the mother they had lost, the children, their first wife or two. And there was a real gravity, a real sobriety when a gravestone is right next to the church.

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Now we've moved them off to cemeteries named Forest Lawn, Rolling Hills. Without being morose about it, what is the right way, the pastoral way to think about death as we live?

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That's a great question. Well, the Puritans would say you've got two eyes and one eye should always be focused on death, judgment, eternity, heaven, the last thing.

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And the other eye should be focused on your responsibilities here and now. But even that eye, as you go through your daily responsibilities, should not forget eternity.

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Jonathan Edwards said, as a 13 -year -old boy, he wrote in his diary, oh God, stamp eternity upon my eyes.

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And I'd like to say, stamp it upon my eyes, my hands, my heart, my whole being, my will, my affections, because this life is just a drop in the bucket compared to eternity.

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And so I think we need to remind our parishioners that too often people spend more time planning a two -week trip than they do planning, preparing for the great and never -ending eternity.

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So we need to tell people, death is the most certain thing coming. It's the only thing we're sure that's coming.

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And it's an inevitable appointment. We just don't know when the appointment is. Could be tomorrow, could be today, could be 50 years from now, but be always ready to meet the

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Lord. Repent and believe the gospel and don't ever rest short of being ready to meet the

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Lord. You know, I think of Martin Luther who was asked the question, what would you do differently if you were, what would you do today if you were to die tonight?

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And Luther said, I'd go out and plant an apple tree, which sounds very strange, but what he's saying is

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I'd continue on my daily business because I'm washed and cleansed in the blood of Christ and I'm always ready to die.

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Or Spurgeon put it this way, the best way to live is to so live so as to be always ready to die.

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Great words from the Puritans, from the Word of God and from Joel Beeky. Joel, thank you for being on today,

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No Compromise Radio. You can get more books from Reformation Heritage, excellent books, wonderful quality, godly,

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Christ -centered. He's also the, Joel is the professor and president of Puritan Reform Theological Seminary as well.

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Joel, thanks again for being on No Compromise Radio. Thanks so much, Mike, God bless you. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible -teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life -transforming power of God's Word through verse -by -verse exposition of the sacred text.

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Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at six. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston.

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You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.

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The thoughts and opinions expressed on No Compromise Radio do not necessarily reflect those of WVNE its staff or management.