Wayne Hazen Interview

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ, based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the apostle Paul said, "'But we did not yield in subjection to them "'for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel "'would remain with you.'".

In short, if you like smooth, watered-down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you. By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King.

We're here to take your calls as well. Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.

Reading Books and Introducing Mary Rollinson

Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth, and I'm your host. Every day of the week, we usually do something different here on WVNE 760 AM. Today, I wanna talk about books. I think it's important to read.

John Wesley once said, "'If you don't read four hours a day, "'you ought to get out of the ministry.'". I think of President Truman saying, "'Leaders must be readers.'". And today, we have a very interesting book.

We have the author, Wayne Hazen, talking about his new book, Mary Rollinson, subtitled, An Illustrated Narrative of the Captivity and Restoration of Mrs. Mary Rollinson, written by her own hand. Wayne, welcome to our show.

Well, thank you very much. Pleasure to be. Tell us a little bit about the book and what you wanted to do. I love the illustrations. Give us the idea and background regarding this book, regarding Mary Rollinson.

Mary Rollinson's Captivity and Puritan Faith

Sure. This book is a book about a woman of faith. She was a Puritan lady, and she lived during the King Philip War, and she was taken captive here in Lancaster, and she was in captivity for 90 days. And during that time, somebody in captivity, February 10th, 1675, and as she was walking and being sort of pushed and prodded along, she was undergoing some of the most difficult.

She, when they left the garrison house down here in the field in Lancaster, her daughter was shot through the hand and through the stomach, and the same bullet went through Mary's side. And the next nine days, her daughter...

Well, tell us a little bit about Mary's background and her faith. I know she was married to a pastor and she was a staunch Calvinist. Tell us a little bit about her faith, Wayne.

Well, but she had... She had a weak...

Well, I noticed, Wayne, maybe it was when I read the extended book or maybe it was when I just reread your book, one of the Indians as a gift gave her the Bible, and that was a great comfort to her, right?

Yes, I believe that. But when they finally got there, she met up with, well, they had...

Wayne, it reminds me of Corrie Ten Boom in the hiding place in Nazi Germany and when they took over Holland, where here Corrie Ten Boom is in a concentration camp and she actually ends up getting a Bible and keeping it, and it was such a great source of strength to her.

And that reminds me of Mary Rollinson as well. Now, the book was originally titled, written by Mary Rollinson. I like the long title and you probably know it, but I don't know if you've got it memorized.

"'The Sovereignty and Goodness of God, "'together with the Faithfulness of His Promises Displayed,' "'being a narrative of the captivity "'and restoration of Mrs. Mary Rollinson, "'commended by her to all that desire "'to know the Lord's doings to and dealings with her, "'especially to her dear children and relations.'".

Sovereignty of God in the Long Title and Its Historical Context

Why don't we write books with titles like that anymore?

Well, maybe we don't have the time to read a title that long. But anyway, I think that part of that came, part of the reason for that title is that in those days, especially 17th century, in those days, when it was a book, when that one was published, it was published under the auspices of a church.

And I would believe probably that it wasn't necessarily her choice to make that statement. It was probably Increase Mather's choice, and he was the one who wrote the foreword to the book.

I didn't know that. That's interesting from a preacher's perspective and Mather's perspective. He writes it from the sovereignty of God. The English edition, which was published in 1682, is more from the suffering perspective or the Indians' aggressiveness perspective.

It's called A True History of the Captivity and Restoration of Mrs. Mary Rollinson, a minister's wife in New England, wherein is set forth the cruel and inhumane usage she underwent amongst the heathens for 11 weeks' time and her deliverance from them, written by her own hand for her own private use and now made public at the earnest desire of some friends for the benefit of the afflicted.

Here we have the capture focused, with the focus of the capture, and the Americans emphasize the sovereignty of God. Any comments about that?

Yeah, I think that that's probably a pretty true portrayal of how people thought at that time in general, especially people that were maybe in the safety of the Bay Colony communities like Boston or Taunton or any of those communities.

New Bedford, they had relatively good, they were seats of power for the church, especially for what we would call the Puritan concept of religion. Of course, Puritan was a negative name that was stacked onto them by others looking on from the outside.

But the average person sort of on the street in Boston or on the street in Taunton probably would have felt that they were barbarians, that they were given at times by some of the authorities and the dehumanization of them.

But that was something that Israel fought for. And as well, you convert these, they actually...

Gospel Outreach, Historical Injustice, and the Book's Purpose

Well, let's talk about the book a little bit, because we could dive into some theological issues. My take on the whole Indian settler issue is I hate to see what some of the settlers did to the Indians, although I do believe that Christianity is the only right approach to God.

And so in a direct way, in a providential backwards way almost, I was glad that the gospel went through the whites to the Indian culture, but we could talk about that for a long time. I wanna promote your book, Mary Rollinson, illustrated by Wayne Hazen.

You self-published it, I think, or it's on Endeavor Printing. If people wanna get a copy, they can go to our website. Or how would they get a copy? Tell me a little bit about how you designed the book and the striking illustrations that you've put throughout the book.

It's just fascinating to read through all the removes with these illustrations. Tell us a little bit about those illustrations.

Sure. The illustrations began about three years ago, and they were 30 hours each. I actually did 480 illustrations for the book. There's only 200 illustrations in it. There are parts of the book, eventually I just ended up illustrating her own words, but there is a foreword and there's an epilogue that go along with the book, which add up to another 200 drawings.

And they deal with the different reasons behind why King Philip. And then the epilogue deals with her, the beautiful things that she was able to accomplish. And it deals with the various places that she lived and things that she did.

So Mary was, her light shone throughout that time until her death, of course, and she was an inspiration to me. But I think that the actual layout of the book was done, started out as a graphic novel and through some conversations with librarians and thought, no, it needs to be illustrated and so on.

And they didn't want the bubbles, graphic novel, you have bubbles and so on. And they just didn't think it was a good idea. And I tended to agree with that, kind of. The layout of the book was

Illustrations, Layout, and the Visual Story of Captivity

Wayne, I thought it was just excellently done. And when I would look at some of the pictures, some would be very dark and very picturesque of what she must've been going through from tears to people almost getting hit on the head, just excellently done to help you get a feel of what was going on there.

And so I wanna say you did a great job. Well, thank you. Interestingly, you were talking about her life and how she got redeemed. And is this true? I read that Joseph Rollinson preached a sermon in 1678, and it was called A Sermon of the Possibility of God's Forsaking a People that May Have Been Near and Dear to Him about her captivity.

And then three days later, he died. Yeah, I think that's true. I do think that's true. If people wanted to go to Lancaster, I happen to live in Lancaster as well, and they wanted to visit some sites and just take a little tour, could you give us an audio tour of the place of her capture and historical markers, Redemption Rock, or any other place that they'd like to go?

Sure.

Touring Lancaster: Garrison House, Marker, and Redemption Rock

It would be good to visit. Now, this is just before you cross the, then to the Nashua and then up into Lancaster on the little hill there, just on the left before the Nashua River left. And that marker is indicative of what was in the field.

It tells you about Mary Rollinson's garrison house. It's a marker that you should read. It gives you just a little bit of insight. And then as you look out into the field, it's easy to see now that there's snow on the ground.

You can see a fair mansion property, and you'll go by the fair mansion on the left as you go to this site. You will see an up, which is actually a stump. And it's quite prominent right now, a dark piece of wood sticking out of this stump.

And as you look toward that, and you look down across the marsh that's beyond that, that is the direct up through the marsh to where that stump is. The stump signifies it was planted in the late, or I guess the middle 1800s, and it's fallen over.

The tree's gone now, but the stump is there. And it signifies where the garrison house, and we are doing a feature, and we're actually rebuilding the garrison house. You feel free to, you can go to that stump,.

A Mary Rollinson's. Well, with the new movie, I'm sorry, I was gonna say with the new movie, you could be making some, you can put a tour guide deal together, and you could be the tour director.

Sure, that would be awesome.

School Names, Christian Witness, and Closing Remarks

You know, Wade, it's interesting. My children go to Mary Rollinson's school in Lancaster, and I found it interesting. In Taunton yesterday, some kid drew a picture of Jesus on a crucifix and was sent home from school and given a psych evaluation.

I wonder how many teachers at Mary Rollinson, if they actually knew the Calvinistic background and exclusive faith in Christ Jesus that Mary had. I think if teachers knew of Mary Rollinson's real faith, they'd probably wanna change the name of the school, don't you think?

They might. I think so. I think Luther Burbank is much more, it's an innocuous title, versus this five-point Calvinist Mary Rollinson name. But I'm glad it's called, go ahead, I'm sorry. No, that's okay, go ahead.

Tell us a little bit about, as we wrap up, I've got about two minutes to go. If people want to read the book, they can buy your book, and I encourage them to do it, Mary Rollinson, illustrated by Wayne Hazen, and you can get that on our website.

If they want to read the larger, expanded version, how would somebody go about getting that larger book? Is it found anywhere?

That book is the largest. It's a larger, illustrated version, and it covers the gamut of her. That, what I wanted to say, places where people could buy the book, is you can purchase. It is, you have to go, it's not in those.

Well, Wayne, I think it's a very important book. I know you do as well. Mary Rollinson, illustrated by Wayne Hazen. Some might say captivity narratives are important in American literary genre, like with James Fenimore Cooper and other things.

I think it's important because it talks about her faith in a sovereign God. Wayne, thank you so much for being on No Compromise Radio. I really appreciate you and your book.

Well, thank you very much for having me at any time. God bless.

No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible-teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life-transforming power of God's Word through verse-by-verse exposition of the sacred text.

Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at six. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston. You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.

The thoughts and opinions expressed on No Compromise Radio do not necessarily reflect those of WVNE in staff or management.