Tobias Speaks, So Finally, So Can I

Alpha & Omega Ministries

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00:32

Dividing loud we there you go greetings and welcome to the dividing line I'm gonna make sure that those levels are not too high and they look like they're about right, okay?

00:43

Welcome to the program this evening Two big issues right off the top

00:49

Bryson de Shambo the golfer guy He he made his hole -in -one over his mansion

00:56

If you don't know about it, don't worry about it. I just I have a friend who's a golf fanatic and so I see golf stuff on my feed and he's been trying to Make a hole -in -one into his backyard from his front yard over his house for I think two weeks and he finally he finally did it and There if I was doing that there would not be a window left

01:23

He never hit a window He did he did a good job

01:29

So, yeah, so that happened and then the other thing two days ago

01:35

At age 95. I was just informed by a friend of mine at age 95

01:42

How Lindsay passed on into glory at age 95 two days ago and I'll just say

01:53

What I've said many times before I used to have to take something called the California achievement tests in high school and I was found them rather Boring and simplistic and so I had lots of time to sit around after finishing sections and I just remember so clearly

02:14

I remember what the what the room looked like. It was the amphitheater. We had an

02:19

Independence High School and This would have been Late 80 or I think it was early 80 81 because I graduated anyone sitting there on the front row in those theater style seats and When I get done with the test

02:38

I got out like great planet Earth and the red the red one the red paperback and I remember it very very

02:48

Very clearly and very well, so Allen's II dead at at 95.

02:55

So, all right, I Wanted to do some other stuff. I wanted to talk a little bit about You know

03:01

Thanksgiving tomorrow. I did stuff on Thanksgiving last week This is the first day that I've had the opportunity to set up The entirety we have actually believe it or not

03:16

We have Two cameras now

03:24

The problem is I can't see myself so we have two cameras and you you look at the

03:30

I'm looking at the image here and That worked out really well.

03:36

You got to understand rich at which put a lot of work into that to get that background because there's a there's an

03:43

RV window back there and It just didn't look right to not have it covered with the same you know stuff the

03:52

Those are big heavy rocks. I mean our gas mileage stinks now because of how heavy those rocks are if I if I blew at it they

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Anyway, um I've got a thing Somebody else's message, okay

04:16

So we have we have two cameras now and this is this is the camera I will use for For personal more intimate state

04:30

Yeah, anyway, so I am I am in prior, Oklahoma, we're all be speaking this weekend

04:36

I'll be spending Thanksgiving tomorrow and Friday I get to Thanksgiving at least

04:42

I'm making up for having lost my family Thanksgiving dinner Which I really missed having but I will

04:49

Get to have two Thanksgiving dinners over the next two days, and then I'll be speaking over the weekend at Grace Life Church and prior and I want to thank dr.

05:02

Frist for Adjusting me a couple hours ago. I I don't know what

05:08

I've done to it But I We're I've so far avoided taking any pain meds.

05:16

I hate taking Advil Tylenol does nothing for me Advil is really bad for your liver and stuff like that.

05:24

And so I've avoided it, but it's not it's it's it's not fun right now and so Hopefully the good doctor will help me with that, but I really am thankful for Folks.

05:36

I mean he cuz he came in the day before Thanksgiving into his opened his office up just simply to see me and so I'm very very thankful for people like that who

05:46

Helped to make my life a little bit easier as I'm out here Traveling around and it's gonna be pretty nippy here.

05:53

It's gonna be getting below freezing the next couple nights and I'm sorry looking forward to that. I enjoy

06:00

You know, I'm wearing one of my nice tundra sweaters right now I enjoy all that and I'm gonna be able to enjoy all of it so much more after this program

06:13

So It's been about a month now since Tobias Lehman Schneider, it's not difficult to say by the way, you don't have to say

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Lehman Schneider I mean, that's that's a nice German way of saying it, you know Get lots of spit going all over your computer and stuff like that, but you can just say

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Riemenschneider. That's okay It's not quite German But but it's it's alright.

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Um It was about a month ago when Tobias Sent me

06:53

The I think I don't remember if it was just the audio or If I stripped the audio out so I could listen while driving

07:00

I I was on the road of his response to Joel weapons has been about that amount of time and When he released that Everything that has happened since then has certainly been enlightening as to the nature of Of Online interaction amongst ostensibly reformed people and I say ostensibly reformed because I think a lot of the people that have been the worst examples of slander and Just every kind of childish behavior on the planet

07:47

A lot of them. I don't think are in churches or they're only marginally involved um

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The ones that are in churches are the ones I'm most concerned about to be perfectly honest with you and At some point early on I think after Eschatology matters pulled his webcast

08:13

I Said something about going on the dividing line and Tobias Specifically asked me not to until he had an opportunity to respond personally and I I need to honor that request

08:29

Because this is about him and so I said fine and At that time he was traveling in in The UK Flew home had a big conference that my fellow pastors

08:46

Jeff Durbin and Luke Pearson were attending and speaking it I did a little 20 -minute thing by a zoom and So that was the next that was the next weekend and So Then a whole nother week passed until the recording was done this past Saturday and now

09:11

My understanding is that has now been posted and is available for people to listen to which means

09:21

Those of us who were under a gag order of an appropriate one Can now speak now the problem is that the dead air?

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Should not amongst mature people have been an issue Amongst mature

09:38

Christians It should have been well, we need to hear both sides and So we will wait to hear that other side as long as it's not, you know, three months down the road or something

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We will we will wait and make our judgments based upon what is then provided But that's amongst mature

09:59

Christians and there aren't many of them in Twitter these days Sadly, or at least that are that's what this way the mature

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Christians aren't Living there and posting memes and doing all sorts of other insane stuff like that and So This is my first opportunity to finally respond to things now.

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What's fascinating and sad is that I've already had numerous conversations over the past couple weeks

10:30

With people and it it was in the context of saying well, this is why

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You're not getting an immediate response There is a logical rational adult reason for this and I Can't tell you how many times

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I had people say I don't care what Tobias has to say He slandered

10:55

Joel Webben and so of you and You all need to be canceled and you need to leave the ministry at a bunch of people say you're disqualified liar leave the ministry and I'm like How can you come to that conclusion

11:12

Before you hear both sides, I don't need to hear both sides what I've heard is enough Okay.

11:19

All right. Well, so that's where we are and The more

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I've thought about it the more I've realized what this past month has has shown is

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What whatever Ideas anybody has about what quote -unquote

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Christian nationalism is You have to have mature

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Christians To give guidance to a society and Man we ain't ready for primetime and of course,

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I've always said the only way that anything like that can ever happen is after the

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Puritan hope the major conversion of The nation's to true disciples of Jesus Christ and The idea of doing it as a minority

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Christian princes all the rest this kind of sacralist stuff is

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Foolishness and will implode so fast. It's not even funny and that's what we've seen over the past four weeks

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I have a list and I will I will pull it up I'm not sure where I exactly put it, but I will pull it up that pastor

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Peter Schilt put together Excellent excellent list of all the stuff

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My goodness, I've gotten so many emails since I last Since this morning, it's funny.

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There it is. Um He has put together a tremendous list of the things that he has

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Taken screenshots of and seen going on Over the past four weeks that I think is extremely useful and it will help me to remember because I've I've been driving for hours and hours over the past few days and I'm guarantee you

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I've done some really I've said some really cool things but only my truck heard it so I'll not remember all those things this evening, but I do want to Finally get an opportunity to address this this situation

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First of all, I've already seen a number of people Well, I guess that first of all, but I've seen a number of people

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Setting up to say hey Don't let them that would be Myself Doug Wilson Joe boot, etc

14:07

Andrew Sandlin Don't let them separate the

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Antioch declaration from this situation So what that tells me is they want to conflate these things

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There is a desire to conflate these things so that you don't actually have to deal with the fundamentally obvious assertions

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That are made in the Antioch Declaration because that's that's the issue the issue that started all this

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Was a pastoral concern on the part of the pastors in Germany Where they know something about Nazism, you know

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Sort of have some first -hand experience there their concern that These ideas and that it's not just a swastika or the

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White boy summer stuff where you had the Nazi imagery all through it but it is a fundamental white supremacy idea for the

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Nazis it was Aryan supremacy, but People United States don't care about that.

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So more just a white supremacy idea So it includes ethnic animus toward everybody else

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So if you don't like your Hindu neighbor You don't like your Buddhist neighbor your black neighbor your

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Jewish neighbor your Muslim or Arabic neighbor This has something it offers something for everybody and So the the statement the the declaration is a statement unto itself it

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Our hope is that There will eventually be proper

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God honoring private arbitration, I Don't think calling it a church council or court is necessarily the best way but but arbitration by by godly

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Christian men To Bring about reconciliation between Tobias and Joel Which it's interesting to note in What Tobias released today?

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He talks about the fact and I remember this during kovat Tobias had

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You know, I would I was doing church history lessons for the church there in Frankfurt and he had mentioned to me at one point that he was he was considering trying to get to the

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United States to get out of the the Lockdowns that were much more strict and scary in Europe and in Germany, especially then in most places in the

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United States and that he was in contact with Joel Levin and Was even talking to him about possibly going to that church and pastoring

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And I had oh, I sort of thought to myself not sure how exactly that would fit but okay, you know, uh,

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I had Done a webcast with Joel. I had been and spoke at one of the conferences along with Joe Booth and So I'm like, okay, that's interesting.

17:51

So there had been a positive Relationship there at at one point in time and so What gave rise to the now infamous zoom call was a sincere concern?

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Pastoral concern on the part of Tobias Riemenschneider and Peter Schilt concerning a former member of their church and his

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Not Not a meme but his Communications with not only the pastors but former best friends

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In regards to being a self -avowed or Convinced anti -semite.

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How did that happen? What what brought that about? What was the nature of that? So that's what the that that was the issue

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That unfortunately has been completely eclipsed by a narrative from only one side

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That hopefully now at least for those again, I realize nothing that I say this evening nothing that Tobias says in his response is

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Going to mean anything to a to almost all of the red avatar blue laser -eyed guys

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They don't care They have a Narrative they're gonna live with it.

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They're gonna run with it and That's all there is to it I Get that but for the people who really want to understand what has this been about?

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and When I look at the Antioch Declaration, is this just simply a shot at Joel Levin?

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No, it's not and that's absurd But again, there's a lot of absurd stuff going around in certain groups these days so going back in time, um,

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I Sat down I was gonna start trying to put together a timeline. I just couldn't There's just so much

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To try to remember and and put in in in some type of order but At some point earlier in this year

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Tobias had expressed to me his concerns About what he was seeing in the

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American Church and That's when I learned about This individual who had left his church and moved to the

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United States. I I Don't know that I've been told about that before. I knew the man Only well,

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I I don't think I don't remember me. I may have met him in Germany I'm not sure but I remember in the zoom calls where I was doing the church history stuff that I remembered his name and so It's not just a complete stranger as far as that's concerned and At some point

20:57

I forget what the date is. I didn't bother to look these things up, but it's all on believe me

21:02

It's all out on the on the web. There is a Not so anonymous individual who put out a video recently, you know accusing me of all sorts of lying and things like that taking clips and then

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Weaving his own narrative in to try to make me look as bad as possible I know who he is.

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I've worked with his dad And so I'm not gonna say anything more than that But since a lot of the stuff's out there just only in a partial format anyway

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Doug Wilson in blog and may blog made reference to a meme that Tobias had told me about and Had described to me.

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I'm not sure if he sent it to me or not He may have I don't remember But it's now the infamous meme

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Where the little girl is asking the mother What was the Holocaust and mom says the Holocaust was when the

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Jews were forced to do manual labor and they said it was killing Them most rational people when they first hear something like that are just stunned.

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They're shocked But the the

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Blue eye blue laser -eyed guys are like you shouldn't be shocked. There's nothing wrong with that. This is just simply a questioning of the post -war consensus

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When in reality The meme first of all as Doug had pointed out contains

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Ethnic animus toward Jews saying that they won't do manual labor anyone who's seen the

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IDF Setting up a defensive position or something knows that Jews do do manual labor

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So it's a it's a Attack upon a whole group of people and then of course it contains an inherent

22:57

Holocaust denialism Because it says they said it was killing them

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So Doug mentioned this and Pretty much in passing.

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It was a it was short. I remember looking right over there I was sitting right where I'm sitting right now

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And I remember Commenting and being rather forceful in Stating that from my perspective

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Anyone Who would not repent of this kind of attitude this kind of Animus this kind of ethnic prejudice

23:44

Um Should be put on church discipline. Now, by the way putting someone under church discipline is not the same thing as excommunicated

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Church discipline is meant to actually avoid excommunication because that's the that's the last step after everything else has failed

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But should be put under church discipline if they refuse to repent then that would be you know, the final outcome of that and I Said if elders in a church refused to act on some of this or encourage it or just turn a blind eye get out of there

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Get out of that church those those people should step down they shouldn't be Shepherding Christ's flock if they allow this kind of cancer in I was very strong in what

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I had to say and I stand by that because This is a cancer and we had

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I had absolutely no idea That day None of how widespread this was.

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I've had some people say well you were ahead of the curve on that. No, I wasn't No, no,

24:48

I wasn't I was not ahead of the curve. I'm gonna move the microphones. It's up facing this direction.

24:54

It might work better anyway, I was not ahead of the curve in any way shape or form because over the next 48 hours after that program

25:08

I My block list on Twitter exploded and Stunningly to me,

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I mean the behavior of the people the anger the hatred I Was just taken aback but the thing that blew me away

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Was at least 50 % of the people I was blocking because you have to go to their you know

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You click on the name on Twitter Anyways, you go you click on the name their bio comes up and it says follows you or doesn't say follows you or whatever

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And there's a little three dots. You have to click to choose mute block, whatever

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Half the people in that first 48 hours that I was blocking Had 1689 or LBCF in their bio

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London Baptist Confession of Faith 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith their fellow Reformed Baptists. I I don't

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I'm still stunned and shocked even after these months That that was the case.

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That was the first indication I had of How widespread? this cancerous

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Animosity This Mindset that is not based on the grace of Jesus Christ and salvation

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It's not great based on the view of the body of Christ as men from I've every tribe tongue people nation

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It is it's Christian theology squished down under the weight of a

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White supremacist political system You know, for example the

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Philia concept from Aristotle that was reposted by people

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Even though that section was written by a Nazi Well, he went through a number of stages in his life.

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Two of them were a Nazi stage and there are others anyways That stuff is out there and I didn't know it

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I Did not know that it was in Reformed churches,

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I've seen OPC guys PCA guys You know, the the

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Lutherans are doing their own thing with Cory Mahler It stunned me and so I think the next week now now

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Here's here's the most important part about that particular program I didn't name any names.

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I Said I I when I was saying you need to get away from these people I said and I will name names

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I was talking about if I found out about a church that was actively promoting this stuff.

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That's what I was referring to But both Joel Webben and Tobias Riemenschneider Assumed that because I knew

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About the meme That I was calling for Joel Webben to step down and that actually never crossed my mind and I'll tell you why

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When I decide to make those comments, I don't I almost never type stuff out and have a

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I'm just Flowing rather freely most the time on the dividing line

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When I decide to make those comments and I started talking about Blogging may blog

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Off top my head. I remember sitting I remember looking at that chair right there and the thought was going through my mind

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Did that guy go to Joel Webben's church? Did he did he go to Ogden?

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Did he go someplace else? I had known I I've been told but as I sat there

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I was going I'm not sure So I didn't name any names

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Because I wasn't and I and I wouldn't have because that's not the time That's that's not what I was thinking about what

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I was thinking about was making a very strong statement that this kind of ethnic animus is poison wherever it shows up and We're gonna warn anybody about it but Because Joel knew what it was and Tobias knew what it was

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They made that assumption and that comes up in the zoom call and in fact, they're operating

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Joel was operating and Tobias was operating on the assumption that I had called

30:16

For Joel's resignation, which I had not so That's on me

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Except that the only people that would have taken it that way were the people that already knew about the situation And that was like what two or three people that might be listening

30:32

Um, because this is before the zoom call and so the next week

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I Tried to explain what it was

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I was talking about and In fact,

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I Forget when it was but at some point in that time frame.

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Oh, that's right. Um When the zoom call actually took place

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What's really interesting? Most people don't know this Well, most people who've already made up their minds didn't know about almost any of the background at all.

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Um When that took place, I think the same day

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Tobias texted me and he he said that there had been this conversation on zoom and And My recollection is he felt positive about it, but the one thing

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I'm absolutely certain of is That he said to me That I should contact

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Joel and tried to be of encouragement to him He wanted to see Joel encouraged and I think

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What was behind all that was he was still working on the assumption That I had called for him to step down and to leave the ministry and so on so forth

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So at some point I was in I was driving westward into Mexico, so Would have been at the end of my last trip,

32:13

I think anyway, um I'm starting to try to index things by what where was

32:22

I and I 40 when this happened? Um, I Was driving westbound in Mexico when I Got hold of Joel on the phone.

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It was a brief conversation He was busy. I was on the road. I was there's various issues with the cells and stuff like that and I Assured Joel I wasn't calling for your resignation

32:51

That was not what I intended. I'm sorry if you took it that way I guess

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I could have been clearer, of course No one else knew what the background is. So no one else would have come that Assumption and the people that have come to that assumption since that's only because that all that information has come out of later time

33:08

And he said that's cool. We're good. No problem, you know, and It was it was fairly brief

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And of course since then I've also explained it to bias that that was not what I intended to communicate.

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So in so far as You know if that Was functionally relevant and important To the zoom call and how it went then

33:38

I apologize for that misunderstanding And I I wish that had not been a part of the conversation

33:52

Because that part of the conversation was where Tobias had sort of turned to Joel and said you're changing

34:02

You're not you're not saying the same things. You're not focused on the same things that you were previously and Tobias is right about that.

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I've said that to Joel as well and I think if he would consider it he would recognize he is changing and I Have the gut feeling that by April there's gonna be a lot more changes in Joel's theology

34:30

I think he's going to be moving away from places that he was only last year the year before and if Those comments in the dividing line were relevant to that part of the zoom call then that's on me and I Should have tried to find some way

34:51

I should have thought well there might be a couple people who will take this wrongly if they have the background information, which nobody else did and If the zoom call hadn't happened all the rest of stuff that happened.

35:03

No one ever would have even considered That that's what I allegedly was calling for So anyway

35:16

The zoom call takes place. I have the conversation with with Joel Say hey,

35:22

I'm not trying to nuke you or what's not what that's not what I was calling for Okay, we're good.

35:28

We're fine and moves on. I Don't know how long after that Couldn't have been that long after that It couldn't have been that long after that that Joel came out with the out was an hour and 45 minute webcast where He says hey, we're the ones that they were talking about This is our church.

35:54

This is our and our member. I'm going to be defending my member and I That was prompted in my understanding

36:07

By the fact that somewhere in this timeline timeline Tobias Was on iron sharpens iron with Chris Arntz, and he had talked about his concerns about the rise of Nazism white supremacy anti -jewish hatred

36:29

Holocaust denial ism the whole complex of things that are running around together in various forms

36:38

And I have not heard that program But I do know from what

36:44

Joel has said what Tobias is said that When he was talking about that stuff, he did not name names, but then toward the end of the program a

36:58

Listener wrote in and said who? Who's putting up with this stuff?

37:04

Who's encouraging this stuff? Who's providing a context for this stuff to thrive and That's when he named

37:12

Joel and the Ogden folks, I think Andrew is Kerr I think

37:19

That's when he quote -unquote named names And So evidently that was

37:29

What then prompted? Because I was a little surprised by this again. I hadn't heard the iron sharpens iron program

37:37

That's what then prompted the hour 45 minute to our Webcast from Joel where he went after Tobias big -time

37:49

He said he lost his mind He said he was trying to get what was the term used a dance monkey dance.

37:56

He talked about boomer brain He really just and It's funny, you know

38:06

You would think if there was some kind of consistency in What's going on on line these days?

38:14

There would be people who were calling for apologies and stuff for that But you're not gonna he really really went after Tobias And I listened to it and it was troubling

38:29

And so I responded partially on the dividing line

38:39

Just partially and This is the reason is very very clear now

38:46

When I did my response both Tobias and Peter well, especially Tobias were really disappointed in my response

38:54

Tobias had wanted me to defend him and I explained to Tobias. I said I can't because I wasn't part of the zoom call.

39:02

I Didn't hear what was said. I Can't comment on stuff like that not meaningfully and so Eventually, I think

39:15

Tobias understood. Well, yeah, I guess that's that's correct But that may have also been part of what convinced

39:23

Tobias To do his response as well. He said a number of people encouraged him to do it.

39:29

He had been attacked even lots of stuff have been said that just simply wasn't true about him and So He recorded that and like I said at some point in time he said okay,

39:46

I have recorded it and Not sure why my iPhone is thinking that I'm trying to Anyway, um it happens

39:59

I've recorded it, but I want you to listen to it and I and I want you to Give me your honest opinion

40:07

Okay, I'm driving tomorrow. I'll I'll give it a listen. So I did and I called him up on signal.

40:16

I Said well That's an atomic bomb It's gonna

40:24

It's gonna get things going which Certainly did not in ways that we've really imagined

40:30

I said, you know, there's there's gonna be a lot of a lot of pushback. You need to be prepared for it, but You know, if that's what

40:38

That's what was going on. Then you need to say what was going on. So Let me at this point,

40:50

I think it's very important Already a number of other people yesterday on Chris Arnson's program

41:00

There were those who know Peter and Tobias Who gave personal testimony of their character

41:13

And of their pastoral concern the things that I've seen over the past month the memes the mockery the just vile behavior of Ignorant people people who have no idea what the actual background is

41:36

I'm Astonishing to me Absolutely astonishing.

41:46

I met Peter at the Frankfurt Airport because I tweeted that I was stranded in Frankfurt between flights

41:53

And he said hey, I live real close to the airport Would you like to have lunch and Peter comes over and we have a grand conversation?

41:58

He says hey, you know if you've ever fly through here again Try to spend some time.

42:03

We'd love to have you speak at the church so I don't think it was even a year after that until we arranged that and So for a number of years there not a big number of years, but for a number of years the late teens

42:21

I Visited Frankfurt I spent time with Tobias and Peter and the folks there at the church and Gave seminars and Tobias would translate for me and we just have a grand grand time.

42:34

I was there The things that have been said about Tobias. I saw someone someone

42:43

Literally said none of you had ever heard about Tobias Riemenschneider before but now you have and That's why this was all done.

42:54

This is all brand building. This is all getting a platform in America and all the rest is just oh

43:04

Could not be farther from the truth Um There are there are a number of times when

43:10

Tobias has said what do you think now? I've been invited to go do this, but I just don't know You know when when when

43:16

Tobias preached at Apologia this past summer I Was sort of late spring

43:24

I guess I think about it when when he preached at Apologia that was the first time he'd ever preached in English and I have said this many times before Tobias speaks better English than almost all of his

43:41

English -speaking critics by a long shot and So I've had to encourage him.

43:46

I've said Tobias your English is is clear. It's it's great. It's compelling You've got good things to say.

43:54

Yeah, if you if you're given opportunities to do stuff do it You know, you've got a unique perspective to bring

44:03

Christians who live under The horrific restraints of the secular state of Germany, they can't homeschool their children

44:16

That that gives you the ability to speak that a lot of other people don't have

44:22

So yeah, I've had to encourage him to do that kind of stuff all this stuff about Him being a slanderer these guys are just trying to break into the

44:35

American scene all this stuff is completely false I Can tell you without any hesitation that Tobias and Peter are pastors

44:50

They bravely stood for Christ's truth in Germany their motivations are pure and All of this stuff all of these ignorant people

45:04

Who without any knowledge of their background any hearing anything from what

45:10

Tobias was gonna say who have slandered him mocked him

45:18

You will answer Because you are completely wrong You're lying and you may believe the people who are lying to you doesn't matter you're still one

45:31

These are two Genuine men who love

45:36

Christ love the church and are seeking to do the right thing and That is not that is not questionable.

45:43

I am NOT the only one who says have said these has said these things and So Let he who is out without sin cast the first stone there's a lot of people have

45:59

Skeletons in their closets I don't believe they do They're they're the real thing and I'm proud to call them brothers proud to call them colleagues proud to call them friends so I Want to make that very very clear

46:19

That no matter what else is going on Their motivations in this they may never do anything like this again and may never try to help the

46:29

American Church again I don't know. I couldn't blame them if they didn't But their motivations have been the right motivations from the beginning

46:41

Okay, so his Response drops and it's only a few days before His response is pulled by eschatology matters why well because they're contacted by Joel and he says

46:57

I have a recording of the zoom call Now you need to understand

47:05

That's illegal in Germany and so it never crossed the minds of Tobias and Peter Or probably there were two other men on the call only one spoke

47:20

But there are two other men on the call I've spoken to one of those other men

47:27

Had a good conversation with him anyway Then the weird stuff starts

47:36

Because if the real issue is well Tobias said that We never talked about excommunication, but here's where he talks about excommunication then what you do is you you provide the call but here's the problem, this was a pastoral call and the young man

47:57

Benjamin Didn't want it released Now from my perspective if he doesn't want released and you don't release it

48:08

But at the same time if you're going to release part of it, like my understanding was there was a 26 second clip

48:16

That was used now, I I never did find out whether eschatology matters was given the whole call or just that 26 second clip, but it's pulled and The narrative begins he lied about everything reality is now that Tobias has responded and he's provided screenshots and and Clips from the zoom call and and all this stuff

48:44

Took some time to do this and to do it well and to do it, right They did talk about excommunication and when they were asked if Benjamin was in their church

48:58

It was said you would be put under church discipline but not about the mean and the whole thing the whole

49:09

Narrative was In Joel's webcast had been they wanted me to Excommunicate this wonderful man and his wife and his kids and that wasn't part of it, but his wife and his kids

49:22

Simply for sharing a meme that questions the post -war consensus

49:29

But when you listen to the zoom call Over and over at least more than once It was said strongly

49:38

It's not about the meme it's about the attitude that he continues to have

49:46

That's not what it's about and besides that not once they say you need to excommunicate this man

49:51

You need to put this man a church discipline. They were not saying that their concern was why isn't there more concern here?

49:57

What's going on here? this man has radicalized since he left us why what's going on and so I'm like, well, wait a minute so so 26 seconds has been released and But you're not gonna give so so Tobias says well, can

50:20

I hear this could you give me the call? No, and Joel even according to eschatology matters forbade them

50:32

From sharing even that whatever whatever it was they were given whether it's just a clip or the whole thing. I don't know you're not to give any of this to Tobias and So a couple days we're all sitting there going.

50:44

Well, wait a minute all of a sudden There's this chorus of anons primarily

50:51

Tobias needs to repent. He's a slanderer. He lied about Joel and it's like Well, but that means you need to give him the zoom call

51:02

I mean look pastorally You could protect the member of the church

51:11

By giving the zoom call only to people who were on the zoom call

51:17

Right. I Mean, you know here here refresh your memory. This is a number of months ago

51:23

Here's here's what the recording is but they wouldn't do that and Then we start seeing and this really bothered me we start seeing this immature back and forth between Certain people.

51:40

Hey, you think we should release the zoom call? I don't know. What do you think this guy's tough? That's when

51:46

I start going. Okay, something's rotten in Denmark here or Germany What what what is this and when

51:55

I saw other people? Starting to comment about the content of the zoom call

52:03

Then I knew it was being passed around. I knew and confirmed

52:10

That Benjamin did not want it being passed around. So where did it come from? Well, there's only one person in control of it.

52:16

There's only one side in control of it and Now that it's everywhere and everyone has heard it.

52:23

There's only one side that allowed that to happen and that's that's that's just a fact and once I saw that there were these blue laser eyed guys

52:38

Who had seen? this material I'm like, it's only a matter literally of hours or days

52:54

Until we will have the zoom call Because once you start passing that around in the little shady chat rooms and with the blue -eyed laser guys

53:05

They're not all that sharp and they're gonna give it to someone who's gonna go. I think

53:10

I'll pass this over here and That's exactly what happened It was made available to I don't know how it

53:20

Came to Tobias, but we ended up with the zoom call And so That was that was just rinky -dink childish that you that's not how you do things

53:32

It was rinky -dink childish if you're gonna say hey, we've got the evidence

53:38

Then you need to make it available because Tobias is like look if if I misspoke if I misremembered

53:45

Give it to me. I'll apologize Not we won't do it We'll just let the mobs roll for a while get them really going and and you know

53:56

That'll accomplish what we want to want to accomplish. It was It was bad that that's not how any of it should ever ever have been dealt with But then once I got a chance to listen to it

54:10

It was extremely troubling The stuff that was being said,

54:16

I mean I Don't I'll be honest with you. I do not understand How anyone can sit there and Listen to someone talking about the

54:28

Jews as prisoners of war prisoners of war

54:34

You mean all those Jews that were in the Warsaw Ghetto and then shipped off to The cow and Auschwitz and Buchenwald and wherever they ended up at their prisoners of war

54:48

They're non -combatants Even if you could say well, there may have been some Jewish guys that would go fight with the resistance.

54:56

Okay 99 % of the Jewish men who died in Auschwitz or Dachau or Buchenwald or wherever they

55:06

Sachsenhausen Were non -combatants 100 % of the women were non -combatants the babies and children were non -combatants and So to hear that even being allowed that that should immediately be what are you talking about that that's that's absurd that's ridiculous and I was like that this does not and then all the way through it as I was listening to it

55:39

Something just wasn't jiving Something just didn't make sense to me. I'm like, okay

55:45

Um the one time that the British fellow Piped up and he was animated

55:54

Most Brits aren't quite that animated but he was quite animated and When he did speak up I could sense this

56:05

Frustration and he's basically saying Benjamin this is not what you've been saying to us You you are not coming out honestly and saying what you have said to us

56:19

You're you're parsing things differently and I I got that sense.

56:25

I really did I'm gonna quit turning to the one side Go back to the normal stuff here.

56:32

I just wanted to so that rich could go man. I do such a good job So Rich is already fall asleep.

56:40

Anyway, so it doesn't really matter. Um so, uh

56:47

I'm my phone continues to to buzz and it's all this stuff.

56:52

It's been all consuming it's been I Think I'm gonna turn my phone off all day tomorrow.

56:58

Just just to get away from it. So there seemed to be Something not jiving there was something that didn't didn't sound right and I found out what it was

57:12

Both you know, of course Joel knew it was being recorded but so did Benjamin It was planned to record it

57:21

So they've got a microphone and phone. See there. Here's my microphone right here. They've got a microphone in front of them and So you're gonna be very careful how you phrase things and how you parse things and and and and How you handle all this kind of stuff?

57:40

That was purposeful they knew that and Tobias and Peter and the other guys they just figured they're talking to Benjamin and Concerned about his soul and concerned about where he's going and so they're just Pouring their hearts out not knowing that the whole thing is being recorded and That changes how you express yourself very clearly

58:07

So That was like, huh? That's That's really interesting how that all ended up turning out.

58:16

So Once the zoom call comes out and once Tobias has it my recollection is he he probably got it

58:26

Well, it was it was I listened to it while driving out driving out and back

58:34

When I was in Fort Worth the FLF It was that Sunday because I was preaching that Sunday at Jeff Neal's church out in Granbury which a wonderful time up there

58:46

A great church if you're in the area highly highly recommend it and So, I don't know that was

58:59

Okay, so that would have been before yeah, that was before the

59:05

Frankfurt conference because I Zoomed in to participate in that conference when

59:12

I got back from that trip so that was three or four days on the road back from Fort Worth is when the

59:20

Frankfurt conference took place and So what was that?

59:26

Ten days ago Something like that. No longer than that Anyway, that that was the that was the the time frame now

59:39

I've already gone for an hour and 23 minutes and And I Can only imagine that Just the blue laser -eyed guys are still listening

59:51

There are a couple other things that I do need to get to I want to go through Peters list and that will help me remember all the other stuff, uh

01:00:04

I recommend to anyone and and I I think a Web page should be put up someplace that has links to Everything that has come out so Joe boot had

01:00:22

Doug Wilson on the Ezra Institute podcast to talk about the Antioch Declaration Yesterday iron sharpens iron

01:00:32

Joe boot and others on that topic Doug has done a bunch of things the

01:00:41

Self interview thing. It's just amazing to watch the Nasty hate -filled

01:00:51

Responses from people who a year ago devoured everything that Doug did and He even says in in that one article that he did that he's now recorded.

01:01:02

It's on YouTube as well He says how you know the interviewer which is himself Asks him, how do you respond to people who say you've changed so much?

01:01:12

His response is um, if you're on a boat pulling away from the dock, it looks like the dock is moving but it's actually not you're the one moving and He's right

01:01:25

All you people who are good I just I've we've learned so much from you and you taught me reform theology, but now you're just a boomer

01:01:32

We're not the ones to change You are You have embraced a

01:01:41

Sociopolitical theory and Cause and you have

01:01:51

I'm trying to figure out what Siri is hearing all this stuff because what's really freaky now is

01:01:58

I have my hearing aids It's so Siri you're sitting here talking and all of a sudden a disembodied voice that's talking to you.

01:02:09

Oh I I see what it was. I said repeat. Okay, that's I get it. I understand.

01:02:15

Um, anyway, uh You have laid a this this whole post -war consensus

01:02:25

Crusades Masculinity Stuff on top of the gospel and We're just going guys.

01:02:38

It's not gonna work. And so you're thinking we've changed we haven't

01:02:43

You're actually the ones who who have changed so before I go through the list,

01:02:52

I'm gonna keep this brief because Anyway, I Was again on the road and I Will admit that There are times

01:03:09

I look at my phone on the road. That's not a smart thing to do. Okay, but there there are times And if you're sitting in the stoplight or something like that You've got a couple seconds that you can you can glance at things

01:03:21

Though I am very careful not to ever be sitting there while everyone else is waiting behind me drives me nuts

01:03:26

So I don't ever do that. So I do I can do some quick glancing at a few things and this

01:03:33

Watch of mine. It's not a it's not an Apple watch It's a Garmin watch But it's very useful traveling because it'll it'll give me enough of the message to at least give me an idea of what

01:03:44

I look at anyway Somewhere along the line early after Eschatology matters and by the way, they got caught in the middle of this thing

01:03:56

I I I think they should just be left alone to do their own thing. I'm not angry with them there

01:04:01

I guess there's been division amongst them because of all this and I'm sorry about it. Um Early on in I'd say within the first week after eschatology matters pulled

01:04:13

Tobias's webcast 80 Robles Tweeted Scott annual now,

01:04:21

I know Scott in Scott annual is a fellow professor at Grace Bible Theological Seminary.

01:04:27

He's an incredibly godly man a wonderful family Just know so much about the

01:04:34

Psalms and worship and music and all that stuff and a lot of Reformed guys don't like him

01:04:44

Because he's sort, you know, he's g3 and all the rest that kind of stuff and and I'm just like, you know rolling my eyes anyway

01:04:50

He tweeted Scott annual and said that you should

01:04:55

Scott annual had linked to Tobias's Webcast so anybody who linked to that evidently is responsible for everything

01:05:05

Tobias said and So he said to him should delete the tweet and Close your account your

01:05:14

Twitter now when I first saw that and I can't when you go back in Twitter if you go back to something you saw a month ago in Twitter First of all, good luck finding it

01:05:30

But everything that was around it as far as responses and stuff will be different now

01:05:37

That's one disadvantage. I mean Twitter's well last bastions of free speech.

01:05:45

I think we should support it while we can for lots of other reasons, but it's not ideal Facebook's even worse in my opinion.

01:05:53

Um, not only because the censorship, but it's not ideal. I Was absolutely certain that I read ad

01:06:02

Robles saying That he that Scott annual should leave the ministry What probably happened is that was a response now if you know how

01:06:15

Twitter works sometimes when I respond to someone I Will then respond to my response if I I respond something to go real quick I put it and you know

01:06:24

I also want to say that then I'll respond the response because it'll at least initially put it right below it

01:06:31

So I'm sitting here and I've you know, oh Okay, yeah,

01:06:39

Rich just said you only got an hour and I now I just realized I'm looking at the on -air thing and That's actually yeah, it's an hour and six minutes.

01:06:48

You're right. Thank you We had started the feed early to make sure that it was a stable connection. So you're right

01:06:53

It's only an hour and six minutes. Okay. Anyways, I'm sitting here looking at this little screen in you know between stoplights or at stoplights and I think what

01:07:08

I saw was a reply because the replies you know,

01:07:14

I Think ad Robles was being a jerk but he wasn't as much of a jerk as I thought it was being the people who responded to it were being a jerk and The one thing

01:07:25

I've definitely learned is if you're on this side of stuff You can say anything you want and nobody will call you down Nobody will call you down So I've been told you need to apologize 80

01:07:35

Robles because you said he said to leave the ministry and he never said that okay if he never said that then

01:07:41

I apologize for thinking that a response that somebody else wrote was his and That's how it happened

01:07:48

Now how many hours of video has 80 Robles put out against me in the past month? based on his own abject ignorance

01:07:57

Does anyone call for him to apologize to me? I Can misread one tweet?

01:08:04

You're a liar and he can do hours Of attacks on me and everything's cool.

01:08:11

That's where we are right now So yes, if that wasn't him if that was a response,

01:08:19

I can't go back and find it I don't know how anybody finds anything anymore on Twitter but man, all you've got to do is

01:08:31

Is read some of these response threads and You'll want to give up on America you want to give up on ever talking to anyone ever again.

01:08:43

It's astonishing and I never see anybody Saying oh man, come on You can't say this type of stuff you and these people themselves don't seem to care

01:08:56

That their stuff creates us so I would invite anybody go find the comment threads when 80

01:09:03

Robles posts one of his many anti James White videos over the past couple of weeks and Read the responses yourself and see if my miss reading a response

01:09:15

Means that I'm disqualified, but everybody else is just fine for their behavior That's that's where we are.

01:09:23

So here is And I'll be honest with it that may if If it is up to me, that is the last time

01:09:32

I will ever say that man's name By the way, I've not listened. I listened to the first few minutes of One video early on it was had something started off with something about the

01:09:43

World Series. I've mentioned this That's it. I've not listened anything else and I won't and I have no interest in so doing

01:09:51

And I hope I never have to ever mention that name ever again So Peter Man I should have

01:10:03

I should have been wearing it's it's because it's sort of ironic now back in When when

01:10:09

Peter and Tobias visited apology and Tobias preached Peter gave me a Crusader ring And that would make all these

01:10:15

Crusader guys really jealous But it's it's actually it's about 900 years old From the

01:10:21

Crusades made in Bethlehem and I have it in the truck and I should have put it on just simply go.

01:10:27

Hey got it right there I frequently put it on when I'm going in some place when I'm in the truck. Anyway, I love

01:10:34

Peter and Tremendous brother and very quiet, but scary quiet You know deep quiet you're wondering what they're thinking

01:10:48

He's been watching all this stuff and he put together a list and it was a good list and It will help me to cover a lot of the stuff that I've been thinking about while driving

01:10:59

That I knew I wouldn't get around to and I'm sure I've forgotten stuff already In in what

01:11:07

I've said so far Here's here's his list

01:11:12

The use of the strongest slander mockery and ridicule of anyone who holds a different opinion Yeah, that is

01:11:21

This is it. The receipts are everywhere My screenshot folder is filled with Astonishing statements from people and again, most of them are announced not all

01:11:36

Not all but most of them are announced and the the

01:11:43

Slander mockery ridicule boy for that side. That's That's their bread and butter that's what they do and Look people say oh it goes on on both sides 95 % of it's on one side 95 % of it's on one side if you've got a red avatar with blue eyes, there's there's no restraint

01:12:08

There's no restraint It's nastiness is us Mockery of physical appearance

01:12:19

Yeah, yeah, in fact I I need to I need to get this

01:12:28

Let me see here Yeah, there it is, let me see if I can do this

01:12:52

Yeah, I guess that's the best I'm gonna be able to do Let me see if this

01:12:57

I'm not sure if this is gonna come up. Let me try. Oh, it will okay

01:13:04

Here we go. Yeah, okay here is a meme that I saw off the first time this morning and Here's the guy said

01:13:16

I won't talk about anymore Eric Kahn Joel Webben and Stephen Wolfe and they're all cool in there.

01:13:25

Well three of them suits. Um, and they're really cool sunglasses and so here's a

01:13:33

Tobias and here's Joel and Here's me now one thing.

01:13:38

I will point out Evidently people don't understand what a

01:13:45

Coogee is And they just can't get them right no matter how hard they try but but there you go and notice

01:13:53

Sacralism sacralism This is obviously infantiles childish, it's it's

01:14:04

How do you even respond this kind of stuff But these are you know, whoever put this together probably has never read an early church father

01:14:12

I never read a book on church history at all Has no idea what sacralism is but knows how to mock it and Believes the people who have taught him to mock it.

01:14:24

Um, I can guarantee you this person has no idea who Leonard Verdine was has never read any of his stuff and Could never have argued with him if he had tried this movement

01:14:37

Lives off of abject ignorance And succeeds on the basis of abject ignorance.

01:14:46

This is this is the kind of you know, you know say they made you know They Made I Don't want that to be full -screen

01:14:56

Doug look like he's you know, ten thousand pounds and this kind of stuff and I saw a

01:15:08

Tweet from a pastor Doing a fat joke talking about fat jokes and And Included Tobias in it and a number of people have attacked

01:15:23

Tobias for his weight. Well, actually he's lost a lot of weight They don't care about that But Tobias has said that he would say he's been heavier in the past.

01:15:35

I am controlling myself right now if you're a pastor if you claim to shepherd the flock of Christ and You Engage in this kind of fat jokes

01:15:57

That are going around right now. I doubt you're gonna remain a pastor very long

01:16:05

Because I don't understand how you can do it. Let me let me point out I'm listening to the wind really blowing.

01:16:15

It's gonna be really cold tonight. Um, I Remember Number of years ago when

01:16:21

I was in my weightlifting period there was a We had what we call the dog hair gym in the back of my yard in backyard

01:16:28

I had some good stuff I Had a vertical leg press. I had an incline bench.

01:16:34

I had a flat bench. I had lat pull downs. I had good Equipment in the backyard.

01:16:41

We call it dog hair gym because we had a dog named Lexi and so there was dog hair Anyway on Monday nights, we'd get together and we you know

01:16:48

We'd get all buff and we had a lot of fun and help each other push toward PRS Look, I understand the enjoyability of The exercise the working out

01:17:02

Pushing of weights around, you know, I'd get up at two o 'clock in the morning and slam a protein shake just to stay anabolic whole nine yards

01:17:13

So I get it We had a gym nearby that had some other stuff I didn't have at home and I remember going to that gym one day and I had at the time

01:17:22

I had a PT cruiser and it was a manual transmission and I did a massive calf workout

01:17:30

Because I was a cyclist before I became lifter and so man my legs I was always my best stuff was calf raises and leg pressing and stuff like that.

01:17:43

Very very strong anyway, I could barely walk out of the place after just shredding my calves and Like couldn't

01:17:52

I couldn't get the clutch in because it would Start shaking. It was

01:17:58

I barely got home and I thought to myself About this situation.

01:18:04

I thought you know let's say I was driving home and I go through a intersection and I get t -boned by someone who's high on meth and I become a paraplegic.

01:18:16

I will never Feel those muscles Again, I will never move those muscles.

01:18:26

Am I less of a man when you're making these fat jokes

01:18:35

Have you ever been to a hospital to visit people that Have various medical conditions that for example, they might have to Take certain steroidals

01:18:48

Because of arthritis issues and things like that that caused them to balloon up Do you have no one that might have that problem?

01:18:59

Do you not realize you're going to age? Do you not do you have you not seen these these basketball players these incredibly arrogant basketball players and They're both going going up for a rebound

01:19:17

They come down and one basketball player lands on other basketball players leg Appropriately and they're out for the season or maybe done

01:19:26

Permanent damage done. Are they a less of a person because they can no longer do what they once did you're gonna age and I Look at pictures myself.

01:19:42

I could show you a picture if you wanted to from the top of Mount Evans in 2016. I Just completed the

01:19:50

Mount Evans Hill climb, which most of you could never do by the way Even you big buff guys

01:19:58

I Think back on that that summer two weeks earlier.

01:20:03

I had done the double triple bypass in two days 240 miles 21 ,000 feet of climbing and You're at altitudes between seventy five hundred and twelve thousand feet of Osu Two weeks later

01:20:15

I do the Mount Evans Hill climb the finish lines at fourteen thousand one hundred and thirty feet of Osu and I did it fast.

01:20:25

I Was so strong. I Could run I could row Just so strong That was my best year and I was 54 years old 54 years old shredded 9 % body fat then my heart condition became random.

01:20:48

I had my worst Heart Rhythm experience two days ago doing great right now, but randomly

01:21:00

I don't know You know how what you know It's like to try to train to do something big when you don't know what your heart's gonna allow you to do and when

01:21:11

Blew a hernia in 2020. I'd already had doubles repaired before that. It's genetic. My dad had him too

01:21:19

Um Now I've arthritis You know, my shoulder right now is absolutely killing me because I'm driving some

01:21:29

Arthritis, especially my right hip Really impacts what you can do how long you can do it my grip strength things like that Kidney stones.

01:21:41

Hey three operations in one year so far For kidney stone

01:21:48

I'm still riding. I'm gonna try to do a long ride tomorrow My bikes right there

01:21:56

That's one of the reasons we do the RV it's right there on a trainer I'm gonna try to I'm trying to push on I'm trying to continue to get to goals

01:22:06

But it's so hard It's getting so much harder and I you know, I'm just watching the numbers that's called age and If you're young like I was fit

01:22:22

Can get down to 9 % body fat like I did look at some of my old dividing lines Look at look at dividing lines between 2013 and 2018

01:22:31

I'm in great shape. I Can't be in great shape anymore. I've gained a lot of weight. I Can't run anymore

01:22:41

I got the hernia fixed. I wasn't gonna do that, but not the hernia fixed but My knees couldn't handle my running right now.

01:22:50

My metabolism has changed everything you're gonna age You may get an injury, you know,

01:22:58

I might my right Elbows torn up. I Was doing standing curls.

01:23:04

I remember the day. I remember I can Olympic bar 245s doing standing curls tore this elbow up that was the

01:23:15

The beginning of the end of my weightlifting career right there I can still do the leg stuff but couldn't do much anything else

01:23:23

You're gonna age you're gonna be injured Are you gonna be less of a servant of Christ?

01:23:29

Let me tell you something if you're running around telling a bunch of young guys who are working out the gym.

01:23:35

Hey Kings And you don't realize look if you've got that if you've got that health

01:23:43

Then every time you lift that bar you should be thanking God That you have that health knowing you will not always have it and to make that the standard

01:23:58

Let me tell you something the standard must be and always will be servant not

01:24:04

King Thankful for whatever I have. I know

01:24:12

That when I was big and buff that was an opportunity for the sin of pride

01:24:20

Looking down on other people. I don't hear much warning about that and every one of you

01:24:29

That is mocked pastor Freeman Schneider in your ignorance based upon looks that mean it's sin and you need to repent of it and You know it

01:24:43

Every one of you knows it if you're a pastor my goodness.

01:24:48

You need to repent to your fellow elders every one of The extreme boasting of masculinity while everyone else is a wimp

01:25:00

Yeah That is that is a part of this movement. No question about it pushing advocating for or relativizing

01:25:09

Mahler and the Stone Choir or at the very least Coexisting with them peacefully without any inclination to challenge them as harsh criticism of them is deemed excessive

01:25:21

Yeah, I've had a conversation with somebody about and you know it and It's right

01:25:27

It's right Stone Choir is a cancer and if you won't warn the church

01:25:35

You're helping people to develop this cancer It's true To see our main problem this world in the post -war consensus, especially in the

01:25:45

Jews, it's everywhere it's everywhere and all these

01:25:51

Guys I had some guy saying I'm Sola post -war consensus Look, most of these guys picked up the term post -war consensus from Reno's book but if you read his discussion of post -war consensus for him the post -war consensus is

01:26:15

Globalism and open societies, it's The you know the

01:26:20

United Nations and European Union they look at what happened in Germany and they see too much emphasis on Family and religion and country and nationalism.

01:26:36

And so yeah, we're gonna we need to get rid of all that So this doesn't happen again

01:26:41

Okay, that's one use of the phrase post -war consensus and anybody

01:26:49

Who thinks I am an Open society globalist um

01:26:57

Are are you functioning in any way? It's it I I don't even know how to how to respond to something like that I'm not a globalist.

01:27:08

I'm not an open societies guy It's painfully obvious to me that the vast majority of people using this phraseology don't have a clue what it means

01:27:21

Don't have a clue what it means It's just become the buzzword. You just picked it up.

01:27:27

You read Reno or you heard somebody else who read Reno and You're just running with it it's

01:27:33

It's sad, but it's it's the case claiming that that we those of us who aren't joining your cabal your mob

01:27:45

That we have made the post -war consensus the touch touchstone of Orthodox belief you've got to believe the

01:27:50

PWC or we're gonna Excommunicate you has nothing to do with anything

01:27:56

You want to get excommunicated? Easy deny that the body of Christ is made up of men from men and women every tribe tongue people in nation

01:28:06

Hold on to F to your animus Be one of the people who would have responded to Paul in Colossians 3

01:28:14

When he said there is no Scythian you would have said I ain't having the Lord's Supper with those

01:28:19

Scythians They are warlike people. They murdered my grandparents if you're a

01:28:26

Scythian, I'm not sitting at the table with you There's the issue There's the issue.

01:28:31

You have to understand That the gospel changes all and if you have animus towards blacks all this all this stuff where these people have gone after Kofi and Samuel say and K dove

01:28:50

Sin, it's simple sin your hearts not right The Spirit of God's not in you doing that If you're really a

01:28:59

Christian man, what are you doing to suppress? the Conviction of the

01:29:05

Spirit for what you're doing That's what I want to do. I mean my goodness

01:29:14

Okay Playing with clear Nazi ideology footage terminology or even blatantly embracing these things as laudable

01:29:24

Well, yeah, we certainly see the stone choir people but more and more people

01:29:31

Are going well, you know, we're just we're just questioning the post -war consensus. Are you not? And by the way

01:29:38

Listening to the zoom call Listening to Benjamin parsing. I wasn't mocking

01:29:44

Jews who died. I was mocking a narrative I don't buy it.

01:29:49

Sorry There was no consistency if you listen carefully Follow along there was no consistency.

01:29:56

He was trying because he knew it was being recorded He was trying but there was no consistent.

01:30:02

Don't buy it. I don't buy it I'm Deliberately attacking opponents together as a mob to silence them

01:30:10

Cancelling of anyone who contradicts their consensus threatening to destroy the relevance of the person in the ministry

01:30:15

Wow I'm now irrelevant Doug Wilson's irrelevant

01:30:23

Joe boots are relevant Andrew Sandlin's irrelevant all these people all of us who

01:30:30

Gave to so many of these men Foundational understanding we're now irrelevant

01:30:36

Because we've changed no because they've changed. Yeah, you're not keeping up with us

01:30:41

We're gonna take that we're taking the keys from grandpa. Let me tell you something the red avatar blue laser -eyed guys

01:30:54

If they get the keys to the car are going to wrap that car around a tree so fast it's gonna make their head spin and everybody else's to I see no maturity

01:31:07

You need maturity to build stable institutions

01:31:15

And right now maturity is being mocked we don't need no maturity.

01:31:22

Yeah, okay The manifest fun and enjoyment of attacking people online and showing no mercy to opponents

01:31:32

But even praying that God may curse and destroy them This goes hand -in -hand with a proud satisfaction when their strategy appears to succeed now, it's only appearing to succeed within their little world

01:31:45

Thankfully the vast majority of Christians are busy being Christians in their own lives and have no idea what any of this stuff is

01:31:54

Until it starts sneaking in the back door of the church, which it is doing and That's the problem

01:32:02

That's why We will continue to warn pastors.

01:32:10

This stuff comes through Here it comes through social media.

01:32:17

It comes through webcasts and That's up. It's not coming from your pulpit.

01:32:22

You're not preaching it comes in secret and So people are like hey, have you heard about this heard about this webcast?

01:32:33

It's really interesting you're talking about this They're talking about the Nephilim. Well, that was just stupid stuff but then

01:32:41

Once you've got them interested in something weird like that, and then have you heard about what really happened?

01:32:47

you know when the Jews did this or the Jews did that and You ever really thought about you know, why?

01:32:54

You were taught that Hitler was you know That's that's how it gets in be very very when you hear people talking about this stuff be very very aware

01:33:09

Not Shying away from the use of the most evil means and tactics such as memes or pictures of people including ministers are used shamefully

01:33:16

Composing mocking songs or spamming pages such as signing the declaration with faults often

01:33:22

Nazi mocking names Mostly done anonymously. Yep It's all over the place

01:33:29

And when you like that stuff you share that stuff You do realize that Jesus said you will answer for every word spoken and that includes what you type

01:33:39

It includes what you have a an AI bot generate for you

01:33:45

It's all gonna be judged and the motivations behind it You need to realize that maybe you're not being told that but that's what's gonna happen

01:33:59

Constant reference to Astonishing me how many times I've seen on the

01:34:04

Jews and their lies Martin Luther. That's the later Martin Luther That's the post 1525 Martin Luther Not Jesus was a

01:34:11

Jew pre 1525 But yes, I've seen the cover just simply posted as refutation over and over again on the

01:34:20

Jews and their lies Return the strong gods Reno though I think he would just Scratch his head of what a lot of people trying to use the book for and of course

01:34:31

Stephen Wolfe spoke the case for Christian nationalism as their foundational works. Yes, exactly most definitely

01:34:40

And since Wolfe's Christian nationalism, which is sacralism

01:34:46

You can mock that all you want. It still remains a fact Since His position is a natural law position

01:34:56

That does not require the Puritan. Hope that is the work of the Spirit of God and converting the nations

01:35:04

They have no way of fighting this stuff. You can you can they can talk about we don't want to go there we don't want to that's useful, but they don't really have a

01:35:16

Christian nationalism if you don't ever if you have regeneration, you don't have Christian nationalism So you're stuck with this stuff you're stuck with this stuff and yeah, that's a it's a real problem

01:35:27

And I think it's gonna be pretty fascinating to see what comes out of this April conference with Joel and the

01:35:37

Ogden guys and Stephen Wolfe and Andrew Isker and whoever else they're dragging up there

01:35:47

Over there, I guess I Think we're gonna see the next level because they have to you see you have to keep you have to keep coming up with new stuff and Going back to old stuff ain't gonna work.

01:36:02

Not with not with the people you're trying to keep excited about you

01:36:08

You know remember the meme I put up there If you want your followers

01:36:15

Putting you in those fancy suits with the cool glasses and Mocking me and Doug and Tobias if that's what you want

01:36:24

If you think that's cool if you get a little buzz out of that You've got to keep going farther and farther and farther and farther and farther

01:36:32

To keep them happy or they will turn on you. They will turn on you

01:36:40

Just be prepared Um The constant references to non -biblical worldly thinkers and role models

01:36:51

So I'm talking about putting a political theory on top of the gospel the use of boomer as Addressive name for their opponents who need to be redeemed from their false

01:37:01

Ideology and our poor pastors and fathers to the new generation. Wow. Is that all over? I think

01:37:07

Doug's already addressed a lot of this stuff And he's pointed out that generational divisions are foolish and Irrelevant You had good boomers and bad boomers you've got good

01:37:25

Gen Xers and bad Gen Xers good Millennials bad Millennials The whole

01:37:33

Attempt to pretend like there's a boomer brain is Is childish rubbish

01:37:42

It's absolutely destructive of your Not your argument, but your credibility as well

01:37:49

Well, y 'all y 'all gave us this mess You know if you want to use

01:37:55

Reno's definition of post -war consensus There have been a lot of a lot of us have been fighting that secularization our entire lives before you were born

01:38:06

So don't give me that it's a lie You may feel good that may make you feel good

01:38:12

But it's why The proud self -conception of being a new generation

01:38:18

Finally brave and strong enough to see through the lies and fight evil in a meaningful way that truly will change something

01:38:24

Peter is exactly right But what are you changing? What are you building?

01:38:31

All you're doing is tearing down. You're not building anything. I'm sorry memes online will not change the society

01:38:40

You can communicate truth that way or you can communicate lies But just simply having memes online

01:38:47

Changes nothing it changes nothing Yeah, the melodramatic wallowing in self -pity

01:38:57

That they have been treated so badly by the world Especially by the boomers and that all they really want our kind understanding fathers in the faith

01:39:10

There's a tremendous amount of rebellion being expressed when you rebel against what scripture says about loving neighbor as self

01:39:23

And who's your neighbor Wow How's that being answered today in this movement who's your neighbor

01:39:36

When you're saying your neighbor shouldn't be your name Your neighbor doesn't look the way you want them to look

01:39:43

If this nation is ever gonna be great again Then I need to get rid of my Hindu neighbor or my

01:39:48

Mexican neighbor or my black neighbor or my Jewish neighbor or whatever else That's just rebellion absolute rebellion

01:40:03

This goes hand -in -hand with the distrust of normal pastors and churches We're generally suspected of wanting to impose church discipline for made -up sins

01:40:12

Finally breaking with Moscow apologia and white Ezra g3, etc

01:40:18

By the way, I'm part of apology. We could have just put alpha to make it there And I speak it and a part of Ezra and I speak at g3

01:40:26

By claiming that they are not reformed enough woke and out of date

01:40:32

They were good enough for fighting back then but for fighting today, they are too feminized and need to disappear into irrelevance

01:40:38

Well, there are a bunch of folks That do think that Okay, then you better get to work because those of us who have spent 30 40 years of work to build ministries

01:40:55

To address real issues you better get to work. I'm sorry Webcasts where you're sitting on your couch with a phone on your belly or Just making jokes and doing memes and stuff

01:41:10

I ain't gonna cut it I'm not gonna cut it. That's not gonna build anything. That's gonna last

01:41:17

It'll fall down before you know it. You're not building anything.

01:41:24

You're just tearing stuff down and I just wonder if you have the maturity to even know how to Since you're being rebellious

01:41:36

Yeah, so I Appreciate that list from Peter because I think that's an excellent summary of Of what is found there

01:41:52

In the in the record that has taken place so here's what I would say to everybody And I'm sorry to do this on Thanksgiving Eve but we

01:42:04

We've been delayed and being able to respond appropriately. I Don't want to be having to be thinking about this stuff over the next couple days

01:42:13

I'm gonna get to be teaching on the atonement and being with brothers and sisters and That's that's that's what

01:42:22

I want And so I've got to get this done and get it out there There's plenty of information now

01:42:31

Listen to listen and watch Tobias's response because he's including

01:42:39

You know the clips from the zoom call and from Joel weapons webcast and from his webcast and saying here's what's going on here.

01:42:50

Here's what's going on there You know that kind of stuff listen to that listen to the

01:42:55

Ezra Institute podcast with Joe boot and Doug Wilson The iron sharpens iron program from yesterday

01:43:05

Doug's Interview thing on blog of May blog that I thought was really really useful cross -politic

01:43:15

Did it chocolate knocks isn't involved a this stuff and he kept reminding us of that But listen to to the cross -politic thing now you've got this

01:43:27

And I really think if you then compare What's on the other side and especially

01:43:37

What's been being cranked out hours and hours of stuff over the past three weeks

01:43:43

That was being cranked out without the other side providing the rest of the information

01:43:50

That's embarrassing I wouldn't be surprised to see a number of those things just disappear

01:43:58

Because it's embarrassing It really is now again, this isn't gonna convince the blue laser -eyed people they're not listening

01:44:10

That you know if I mentioned before I've talked with people who said

01:44:15

I'm not gonna listen to what Tobias says I've made up my mind Okay, there's nothing

01:44:20

I can do for folks like that. So it's not gonna just fade away tomorrow It's gonna it's gonna go on But there's no reason to keep investing huge amounts of time in going back over everything

01:44:36

That's why I say there needs to be an archive page Here's the stuff you want to know here go listen if you want to spend an hour and a half two hours

01:44:45

Well more than that. I mean my goodness if you just listen to everything. I just look I just listed That would be what six seven hours