Are We Entering The Great Tribulation? New Discussion!

Matthew 16 and the Signs of the Times

In Matthew 16, Jesus chastised the Pharisees who could interpret the appearance of the sky but failed to interpret the signs of the time in which they lived. Who are the Pharisees of our day?

This strong hold of sort of whiteness and white identity and pristineness is really part of what keeps us from making progress.

We need to do better. The Church, rich in theological scholarship, has lingered in academic sanctuaries and ivory towers, failing to translate its lofty doctrines into a tangible and practical cultural apologetic.

At the Worldview Youth Academy we bridge this critical gap. Here theological depth is not an end in itself but a means to engage with contemporary cultural issues for the glory of God and the expansion of his kingdom.

Our mission is to cultivate thinkers who can articulate and apply Christian truths within contemporary societal challenges. So embrace this call to worship God with all your heart, all your soul and with all your mind.

We will do better as this next generation tears down the idols of our modern culture and works to build a brighter future toward Christendom. 2 .0.

Desperate times call for faithful men and not for careful men. The careful men come later and write the biographies of the faithful men, lauding them for their.

Courage.

Go into all the world and make disciples, not go into the world and make buddies, not to make brosives, don't go into the world and make homies, disciples.

I got a bit of a jiggle neck. That's a joke, pastor.

When we have the real message of truth, we cannot let somebody say they're speaking truth when they're not.

Behold the day of the Lord comes, cruel with wrath and fierce anger, to make the land a desolation and to destroy its sinners from it. For the stars of the heavens and their constellations will not give their light, the sun will be dark at its rising and the moon will not shed its light.

I will punish the world for its evil and the wicked for their iniquity. That's Isaiah chapter 13, everybody.

What's up?

Welcome back to another episode of Apologia Radio. This is the gospel heard around the world. Today we are talking about the Great Tribulation. Are we about to enter into it? Is it in our future? Let me whet your appetite and tell you, no, it already happened.

Giving it away up front.

I'm going to go ahead and just tell you that. Why are we even doing the show, right? Is that what you're saying?

I'm just going to. Also, we'll see you guys later.

I was so excited. I got so let down.

The answer is no, it already happened. Jesus promised it to the generation he was speaking to. He said that it was going to happen before they all died. And today we're going to extend the discussion we've been having the last couple of weeks.

We did an episode called End Times Made Easy. We did an episode called something like the Great Tribulation. Is it about to happen or something like that? And so this is now.

Part three.

Part three of this discussion. I think it's an important discussion to have right now in light of all the conversation taking place. Just do a search on YouTube. End Times Rapture is about to happen and you will just see you go down a rabbit hole of videos that are always fresh every morning, new ones being made talking about the Great Tribulation.

And the problem is, is he goes back as it's as old as the Internet. You just go back and it's as old as time, actually, but you just go back and people are saying it's going to happen in a week. It's going to happen in six months.

People are trying to figure out like the dating and the timing and all those things. And they talk about the Great Tribulation as though it's something that we should anticipate in our future. And we want to argue biblically from the Bible that the Great Tribulation promised by the Lord Jesus on the Mount of Olives is something that already occurred in history on time and as planned or Jesus is a false prophet.

And that is not a possibility. And so we're here to talk about that today. Very excited about today's show.

I'm Jeff.

They call me the Ninja. That's Luke the Bear.

What up?

That's Zachary Conover. Director of Communications for End Abortion. Now I want to encourage everybody to go to apologiastudios .com. That's A-P-O-L-O-G-I-A, apologiastudios .com. Go there, get all the past episodes from cultish, from shiologians, provoked, Apologia Radio, and you can sign up for All Access.

When you sign up for All Access, you partner with us in everything you see happening with Apologia Studios, all the on-the-street evangelism, all the teaching ministry, the public debates. Everything happening there is because of ministry partners just like you who do this ministry.

With us.

So thank you to all of our All Access partners. When you go to All Access, you also get access to all kinds of additional content like the Academy, Collision, the After Show. All the stuff that's there is there to bless all of our All Access partners, including the time we sit together every month and hang out together.

You can ask questions with Ask Me Anything and we have some new stuff in the works right now that's coming. And so just be prepared for that. That's some really cool stuff we have to bless you guys with.

And so, actually, very exciting announcement to make right now.

We're going to make it.

I think we might have sort of hinted towards it a little bit before.

I think we announced it last week.

Oh, the cat's out of the bag.

Did we?

It's up publicly.

Or two weeks ago. Two weeks ago.

Well, guess what? The most awesome Christian conference that has ever existed.

On planet Earth?

Ever.

Anywhere. At any time.

Are we using like apocalyptic hyperbole here or are we speaking for literal terms?

Literalistically.

The last ReformCon was amazing. We had so much great feedback and people were truly blessed by it. The teaching was awesome. The fellowship was awesome. The time together. The time to relax together. The fun time we had together.

It was just a different kind of experience than you've experienced from many Christian conferences. Especially that ridiculous fight, laugh, feast one. This is better.

We're fight, laugh, feast without the middle finger.

See?

That really does need to be on the page.

No, we're going to do an ad.

I don't require live or I don't recall live martial arts demonstrations either at the other ones.

Martial arts demonstrations.

Things like that.

Meals together and it was great. People were out having cigars out together. It was just fantastic.

It was really a great thing.

So ReformCon 2025 is official. It's going to be in Tucson, Arizona and I'll let Pastor Luke give all the details of ReformCon 2025.

Yeah. It is in Tucson. It's good.

He did not sound excited about it.

He said, yeah, it is in Tucson.

I'm trying to be excited about it.

Yeah.

I'm not a fan of Tucson, but it's going to be great. Seriously. And it'll be like a little mini vacay.

Can any good thing come from Tucson?

No.

ReformCon can. ReformCon is going to make Tucson amazing. I'm not doing a good job of selling this. It's going to be great. And we're partnering with the Ezra Institute. Hopefully forever. For the rest of time.

That's right.

So April 24th to 26th in Tucson. And we just put ticket sales up today. So you can go to ReformCon .org. We're up on the Facebook page as well. Tickets. The early bird are up right now. So if you get in now, it can save you some some skrilla.

And we do have some speakers that we've announced. So obviously Pastor Jeff, Dr. White, Doug and Nancy Wilson will be there. Toby Sumpter, Andrew Sandlin. Of course, Joe Boots.

That's a lineup.

More to come.

If I ever heard one.

All right.

So ReformCon 2025. Get your tickets soon as you can. Let's get your ticket before it fills up.

And there you go.

Very excited to be doing that. And I'll just tell you, and I think they would tell you themselves, Ezra Institute was with us at that last ReformCon. And they were so impressed with the quality of everything, just the experience itself, that they wanted to be a part of this whole thing with us because they think that's how Christian conferences should be done.

And so they're a part of this with us now because of the last experience of ReformCon. It was really, really a blast and it was something so unique and so different. And so it's coming again. ReformCon 2025.

We're excited about it. Hope to see you all there. Put my hand in your hand. And let's get right to it. We're going to talk today about the Great Tribulation. So what I tried to do is do this discussion in as coherent a way as possible.

One that would be edifying for someone who's just getting into this discussion and for somebody who has been studying this for many, many years. And so I wanted to make this something that everybody can get something out of.

And so the first thing that I did talking about End Times Made Easy is I talked about the major, overarching, thematic issue and that is the issue of the Kingdom of God. The rule of God in history. I made the argument as something that is said from the Old Testament through the New Testament.

It is a heartbeat theme throughout the entire scriptures. All of God's revelation emphasizes the rule and reign of the Messianic King. And I made the argument that the Old Testament has specific prophecy about when that kingdom was going to arrive in history, what the nature of it was going to be, how it would unfold into the world.

And I made the argument that the New Testament authors are arguing that Christ, in fact, has brought that Messianic Kingdom into history, that he is ruling and reigning on the Davidic throne right now, 1 Corinthians 15, and that he must reign, as the Apostle Paul says, until all of his enemies are made a footstool for his feet, quoting Psalm 110 .1.

And then he says,.

Based on that,.

Last week I made the argument that if we're going to do Christian eschatology right, if we're going to be faithful to the Bible, we cannot do what many people have done, and that's newspaper exegesis, or we look at our current circumstances and we impose those things upon the scriptures and we proof text the Bible, we proof text verses from the book of Revelation, which is highly dangerous to do, and that is, I think, it always should be what does the text say, not what do I want it to say, what does my tradition teach me to impose upon it, but we need to go to the Bible and do exegesis, draw out of the text its meaning, and not eisegesis, not put something into the text and read it through the text.

And so what I argued was is if we're going to do Christian eschatology right and we're going to talk about Matthew 24, Mark 13, Luke 21, if we're going to look at those passages, I argued that we actually have to start the discussion further back in the revelation of God, further back in history, and I argued that what you see unfolding in the Synoptic Gospels with the Olivet Discourse and the Great Tribulation, and of course this is elsewhere through the New Testament, what you see unfolding.

In the eschatologies,.

I think literally a few, it was Isaiah 65, I did Joel 2, and Malachi, the last chapters of Malachi, and so what I argued was is that what was anticipated in the prophetic writings from the Old Testament is when the New Covenant came in, when the Messianic King came into history, there would be salvation and judgment.

Salvation and judgment. Salvation, atonement, purification, and judgment, and that judgment is specific upon the covenant breakers of God, and so there's a lot of like law of God violations mentioned when it's promised that there is judgment coming.

Salvation and judgment at the coming of the Messianic King, and so I mentioned those passages,.

You can go,.

I'm not going to rehearse them all today, Isaiah 65,.

Pentecost,.

And I argued that you have to keep reading in Joel, the quotation, keep reading after the outpouring of the Spirit of God, which Peter says this, what you're seeing at Pentecost is that which is spoken of by the prophet Joel, and Joel 2, after the outpouring of the Spirit, it's immediately going to dramatic judgment language.

There's going to be judgment associated with the outpouring of the Spirit of God, and then I mentioned that in Malachi 3, when it talks about the messenger who's coming before the Messiah, it then says that the Lord whom you seek will come to his temple, so Yahweh himself is going to come to his own temple, there's the God-man, there's the incarnation, God himself, the Lord coming to his own temple, but then it says as soon as you enter into Matthew, immediately, Matthew 3, John the Baptist, the forerunner, the messenger that's promised, Elijah, Jesus says he's the Elijah who is to come, that's the incarnate one telling you, identifying, yeah, when I wrote that, when I spoke that back then, I was talking about John, that's what Jesus says.

As soon as John enters in Matthew 3, what's he saying? Well, the thematic issue, repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand, repent for the kingdom of God, the rule of God is at hand, and then it immediately goes into John the Baptist, that Elijah, that messenger before the Lord's coming, indicting the Jewish leadership of his day, calling them to repentance and saying judgment is coming and he says it's this close,.

He says,.

The ax is laid at the root of the tree, he says his winnowing fork is already in his hand, the work is getting ready to be done, like that's how close they were to judgment and what's amazing about that is that's precisely what the Old Testament said was going to happen, messenger, Elijah, judgment, outpouring of the Holy Spirit, judgment, Isaiah 65, judgment upon the covenant breaking people of God and God giving his people a new name, that's what was anticipated, so now the story's unfolding, this is divine revelation, John the Baptist comes in and he says the one who's coming in after me, I'm not even worthy to mess with his sandals and then he says, I baptize you with water, John says, but he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit, oh, that's interesting, that's salvation, that's the purification, that's all that we anticipated and then he says, and with fire, salvation and judgment, Holy Spirit and fire and by the way, anybody who thinks that baptism of the fire is a good thing, like God baptize me with fire, don't do that, don't do that, don't ask for that and if you have any question about like exegetically like is that a good thing fire there, just keep reading literally what he says after about unquenchable fire in terms of judgment,.

It's clearly judgment.

But it's salvation and judgment, he anticipated the Elijah who was to come,.

The messenger,.

The forerunner and he says, Holy Spirit and fire, salvation and judgment. So that's what I argued last week was that in order to understand the Olivet Discourse and that whole setup and scene itself from Matthew 20 through 24, you have to understand the Old Testament and what was anticipated and the glory of that.

And I'll let you guys speak here.

But there's a hodgepodge.

Of different things happening. I mean the Bible was written over a long span of history depending on where you date Job and all those things. You're looking at somewhere around 2000 years of composition.

You have over like three dozen authors. You've got 66 different books of revelation coming different geographical locations and amazingly it looks like there's only like there's a lot of human authors.

But it looks like actually there's only one author because the story is just the same all the way through. And the point I'm making there is that actually the study of the Great Tribulation as something that already occurred vindicates Jesus as Messiah.

That's the point of this. When we argue that the Great Tribulation that Jesus gave in the Olivet Discourse is something that is in our past we are making the point.

That vindicates the scriptures.

As divine in origin because God told this story as a thread and everything happened on time and as promised so it's not a matter of saying. I want to take something amazing away from you. The Great Tribulation is not in your future.

How sad. You know what I'm saying. How sad. No I'm not trying to take anything good away from you. Jesus actually is vindicated as the Messiah because what he promised in the Olivet Discourse actually happened on time and as planned.

That's the argument.

I also think he's vindicated in his prophetic ministry. Of course both in his denunciation of the covenant breakers but also in the telling of what is going to occur. He's vindicated in that office. He's vindicated in his kingly role in the unified story of God's revelation in scripture.

It's amazing. I was just reading Leviticus where it talks about the role of the high priest in inspecting a house that has been filled with leprosy.

Leviticus 14.

The job of the high priest is to go in and inspect and if there is an infection leprosy within the walls he waits. Then he comes back stone by stone and intersect that with the temple.

This is all part of the discussion.

This is the amazing part when we say it's one unified story I mean down to the role of the high priest under the old covenant and that points to the office of Christ that he brings in vivid color visibly for us to see in inspecting the house of God and then executing judgment.

Because that gets us into the Mount of Olives and the Olivet Discourse and this unified story it's in Leviticus 14.

Verse 33.

It says when you come into the land of Canaan which I give you for a possession and I put a case of leprous disease.

In a house.

In the land of your possession. Then he who owns the house shall come and tell the priest. There seems to me to be in the house be declared unclean. That's an interesting point everyone's got to get out.

Pronounced it unclean.

I love how everybody's driven out.

Did you get it?

So to go.

Everyone has to get out of the house. When Jesus goes into the temple. What's he doing? He's driving everyone out of the house.

I never saw that before. That's pretty sweet.

Then the priest shall command that they empty the house and declare it unclean and afterward the priest shall go in to see the house and he shall examine the disease and if the disease is in the walls of the house with greenish or reddish spots and if it appears to be deeper than the surface then the priest shall go out of the house to the door of the house and shut up the house seven days and the priest shall come again on the seventh day and look if the disease has spread in the walls of the house then the priest shall command.

This is powerful and I'm so glad you brought this up.

It's one of the first things I thought of.

And I knew you would.

Because I already had it up here on my screen.

I didn't even see it.

I knew it was going to come up. It has to come up everyone catch that? What's interesting here is that ignorant atheists and skeptics and critics of the bible have often times tried their darndest to show discrepancies in the biblical narrative.

Of the ministry of Christ.

And so in John the beginning of John, John chapter 2 you have cleansing of the temple but that's at the beginning of Jesus' ministry. He comes in, drives everybody out and of course you have the famous scene of Jesus saying destroy this temple speaking of the temple of his body and in three days I'll raise it up again.

But you have Jesus coming into the temple driving people out, cleansing the temple and that's at the beginning of the ministry for John. But then at the end of his ministry he now says I'm going into Jerusalem they're going to kill me and I'll rise again.

And then he goes and of course everybody knows that next section there is like the Hosanna Hosanna, he's here. And then Jesus goes to the temple and drives people out of the temple cleanses the temple and so again.

At the end of his ministry.

First cleansing of the temple he comes in, drives everybody out as the true priest and he examines the house.

Right?

At the end of his ministry when he's going to be killed and he's going to rise again he goes in and drives everybody out again and he comes for the next inspection. And interestingly soon after that inspection after there's a lot more indictments given by Jesus and the seven woes then he says behold your house is left to you desolate.

There should not be left one stone standing upon another. That is the true priest. And what they were rehearsing in the Old Testament with leprous houses. That rehearsal that God gave to them to rehearse this thing to practice this thing with the priest was in reality pointing to this greater fulfillment and true story of his people and the temple.

And Jesus comes as the true priest cleanses the temple at the end of his ministry comes in, checks it again and then says what? Your house is left to you desolate. There should not be left one stone standing upon another literally taken apart stone off of stone.

That's the story.

That's where all this is going.

And all of that indicates too the displacement of the center of worship for God's people. Post old Judaic Aeon. Because he is the center of worship now he says destroy this temple and I will raise it again in three days.

Speaking of the fact that he tells the woman in John chapter 4 God is spirit and you must worship him in spirit and truth a time is coming and now is when you're not going to say let's go to this mountain to worship or this mountain.

What's he saying? That the center of worship the gravitational pull of God meeting with man is in me. He's the tabernacle he's the center of worship now. And of course all those who are filled with his presence God dwells therein.

I don't know if you're going to get this later or not but for those that don't understand this explain historically how this temple was literally torn apart one stone from another. When I learned this my mind kind of exploded a bit.

So the interesting thing that I think we should all praise God for whether you guys are whether you're historic pre-mill dispensational pre-mill a-mill, post-mill or whatever the case may be the vindication of Jesus as Messiah in this point of the Olivet Discourse where Jesus tells them there should not be left one stone standing upon another and he says that this generation.

Will not pass away.

Until all these things take place he says that throughout the Olivet Discourse things like that before that generation had all died. Of course Rome turned on the Jews. There was a period of time where they were sort of working in tandem in terms of persecution of the Christian Church.

It was Jews and Rome really trying to destroy the Christian Church. It was of course Nero that was really just sold out to the idea of slaughtering the Christians. They wouldn't say Caesar is Lord they were saying Jesus is Lord just a violent, vile disgusting beast.

So there was a time where there was sort of a union in terms of persecution. But then at a certain point before the war against the Romans and the Jews before the full destruction of the Temple in 70 AD Rome turns on the Jews and we'll probably get into some more extended discussion of this.

But they actually come around in the city they turn back around and they head away and then all of a sudden they turn back around they come and they re-sack the city again. And it was the three and a half year war between the Romans and the Jews and it was a horrible.

Horrible slaughter.

The accounts you can read Josephus he was a God he was allowed to survive and he wrote a history.

Of the Jews.

And of the Roman-Jewish war. And so we know about the accounts of blood just like river going through the street. We know about the account of like people cannibalizing and the famine being so bad they're eating dung and children.

One woman was recorded in that war were the Christians.

They were told to flee.

Because Jesus told them to flee it's in the Olivet Discourse he said when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies flee don't go back and get your cloak don't do any of those things flee and it's a matter of historic record that the Christians after Rome surrounded.

The city.

And then went away. The Christians because they were warned by Jesus fled the city to a place called Pella. And as soon as they fled and they were saved from that Rome turns back around and re-sacks the city.

But after this horrific slaughter and this long long war and famine and all kinds of disgusting evil things happened. They come in sack the city set fire to the temple.

Titus right?

And as the story goes there was gold melting between the cracks of the temple and the Roman armies were trying to get to all this stuff and they took off the stones from the temple and there wasn't left one stone upon another.

In terms of temple proper it was taken completely apart exactly as Jesus said before that generation it all passed away.

It was a thorough decimation.

It was a thorough thorough decimation and it was a horrific horrific scene and again the only people who were able to escape it were the Christians because they were warned by Jesus to do so and so. Anyway we're getting I think way ahead of ourselves because there's so much information.

But what's interesting is this point none of us can avoid and we shouldn't even want to. It is over and over and over again soon coming judgment Christ coming in judgment and we're not talking by the way about the final resurrection.

Final judgment.

It's a judgment coming of Yahweh that happens. The day of the Lord happens in the Old Testament over and over again. You have the judgment coming of Yahweh. You have Isaiah 19 Yahweh coming against Egypt.

Yahweh comes riding on a swift cloud. Well Yahweh never literally came and rode on a cloud. They weren't looking up at the sky going. Oh here he comes. That was judgment language that God used often in the Old Testament.

I just read to you some of it at the beginning of the show today. That was from Isaiah 13 that was God talking about the destruction of Egypt when he talks about the constellations stars falling from heaven.

That's what Jesus was quoting quoting from by the way. And that didn't happen literally. But God literally did destroy their world. That's what it was referring to. But the day of the Lord happens in the Old Testament that judgment coming of Yahweh.

But you see this in the New Testament this promise of soon coming judgment it's throughout the Gospels. One example can I show here Matthew chapter 10. In Matthew 10 Jesus is sending out his disciples out of sheep in the midst of wolves.

That's in Matthew 10 16. That's very specific. I don't think any of us are being planned to be beaten in any local Jewish synagogues. Think about it. That's very specific. And you will be dragged before governors and kings for my sake to bear witness before them.

And the Gentiles when they deliver you over. Do not be anxious how you are to speak or what you are to say. For what you are to say will be given to you in that hour. For it is not you who speak. Brother will deliver brother over to death.

And the father his child and children rise up against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved when they persecute you in one town flee to the next.

For truly I say to you you will not have gone through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes. What's important to note here is that not only do you have the promised coming of judgment from John the Baptist the Elijah, the forerunner.

But then Matthew has already started to amplify that coming judgment in Matthew chapter 10 where Jesus says to his disciples you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Well wait a second. Are we talking about the second coming. No, Yahweh came in judgment coming of Yahweh that was anticipated by the way Isaiah 65, Joel 2, Malachi chapter 3 Malachi chapter 4 it's all there.

But here he tells his disciples. You're not even going to finish going through the towns of Israel.

Before I come.

In judgment and then it just gets worse in terms of that soon coming judgment. You can go to Revelation these things soon to take place all those different things in terms of if you don't just let the text speak and you have a tradition that conflicts with it you're going to struggle with it.

But in Matthew chapter 16.

Verse 24.

Here's what the Lord says. Then Jesus told his disciples if anyone would come after me let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me for whoever would save his life.

Will lose it.

But whoever loses his life is going to lose it. Words of Jesus one of my favorite.

Sections.

But then it says this for the son of man is going to come with his angels in the glory of his father and then he will repay each person according to what he has done.

Truly.

That's Jesus saying amen verily amen.

Truly.

To you.

There are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the son of man coming in his kingdom. And so there's the promise some of you guys aren't going to die before this coming this judgment coming.