Have You Not Read - S1:E30

2 Corinthians 3:18 and the New Covenant Veil

Welcome to Have You Not Read, a podcast seeking to answer questions from the text of scripture for the honor of Christ and the edification of the saints. Before we dig into our topic, we humbly ask you to rate, review, and share the podcast.

Thank you.

I'm Dylan Hamilton, and with me are.

Michael Durham.

David Kassin.

And today we'll be dealing with a question that comes in from one of our listeners and congregants. In fact, our pastoral intern, Joe DeForest, has asked us, in 2 Corinthians 3 .18, what is the meaning of this text?

And we'll go ahead and have Michael read it and kick us off.

Okay, so 2 Corinthians 3 .18 is the final verse in chapter three, an ongoing development of an idea that we're gonna need to look at. But verse 18 reads, but we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.

The Old Covenant, the New Covenant, and the Veil Over Moses

So there are some themes here that are closely packed in to this verse. And as I was saying to someone yesterday, God loves to mix his metaphors. And as we see the way in which theology is expressed in the scriptures, we have metaphors that are developed and then brought together.

And we're usually looking at something very glorious when that happens. But here we have an expression of an unveiled face. We have an expression with the mirror. We have the idea of transformation from one image to another as well from one glory to another.

What's going on here? Paul is getting at what does it mean to be changed, to be made holy? What does it mean that salvation is being worked out in our lives? And he begins the chapter by talking about his relationship with the church in Corinth.

And he expresses it in his relationship through Christ to them and begin to talk about how are things different in the new covenant versus the old covenant. And how are we to understand holiness and so on.

So when you go back at the beginning of the chapter, one of the issues of course that in the church in Corinth is who should they be listening to? Who are the authoritative voices in their spiritual growth?

And so he says, do we begin again to commend ourselves or do we need as some others epistles of commendation to you or letters of commendation from you? And so he's getting at how things have been happening in their midst and how it is that they are evaluating those who are trying to shepherd them and to help them to grow and grow into Christ.

And Paul picks up on this custom that they had about the letters, epistles of commendation. And then he says, verse two, you are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read by all men. It's important to remember that Paul spent about 18 months with the church there in Corinth and he labored there among them and he poured himself out there.

And for Paul, who was always traveling about and trying to strengthen churches and plant churches and preach the gospel. And he would say things like, I don't wanna build on another man's foundation. And he was very much a pioneer.

For him to stay somewhere that long, I think he stayed three years in Ephesus. And he stayed 18 months in Corinth. And so what is he saying here? He's saying, why should you listen to me? Why should you trust me?

What credentials can I put before you? How about just you? The time that I spent with you, the way I labored among you. And so he says, verse three, clearly you are an epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but by the spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone, but on tablets of flesh that is of the heart.

Here, Paul reaches back to the Old Testament and uses the language found within the promises of the New Covenant, where in the Old Testament prophets, such as Jeremiah, were looking forward. In Ezekiel, were looking forward to how things would be different in the New Covenant.

No longer would one member of the covenant say to another member of the covenant, hey, know the Lord, fear the Lord, serve the Lord, meaning I'm gonna repeat the commandments to you. No longer will it be an external type of pressure, but it'll be internal.

The heart of stone shall be taken away and a heart of flesh will be put in and the law of God will be written upon these hearts of flesh. And it's really interesting, this language, because remember that the Old Covenant was written on tablets of stone and it was placed within the Ark of the Covenant.

And now in the New Covenant, we're talking about something else being placed within, but not tablets of stone, but a living heart, true, eternal, spiritual life, and written upon these hearts are the laws of God, the truths of God, the Torah of God, the instruction, the word of God is written up on the heart.

And so what is he saying here? He is saying, he is bringing forward this New Covenant language and he is saying, you are alive in Christ by the power of the Holy Spirit. Why should I have to bring anything forward as to the authenticity of my work when by my labors among you, you can see in your midst the realities of the New Covenant, the realities of Christ's life, the realities of true holiness in your midst.

And then he continues to talk about, from verses four and following, the contrast between Old Covenant and New Covenant, wherein the Old Covenant, the letter is set forth as a standard that condemns, and rightly so, and expresses the character and the glory of God and how we fall short.

And he shows that that was a good and right ministry of the word, but how much greater is the ministry in the New Covenant of the Spirit that in the righteousness that we have in Christ, we are made more and more, we are made right in our walking and our living by the power and the life of the Holy Spirit.

And so he's talking about glory. He talks a great deal about glory in verses seven through 10 about the kind of glory that is in the New Covenant, exceeding that which is in the Old. And then in verse 12, he says, therefore, since we have such hope, a New Covenant hope, right, we use great boldness of speech, unlike Moses, who put a veil over his face so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the end of what was passing away, but their minds were blinded.

For until this day, the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament because the veil is taken away in Christ. It's very important that Paul is trying to help the Corinthians to understand something.

When Judaizers are coming in and saying things like, real holiness is following all the customs of the law, Paul is, first of all, not denigrating the law. He is not disregarding the Old Covenant. He's saying, no, there was a glory there.

There was something good there, but there is something far greater in the New Covenant. And he begins to explain how it is that these Jews who have had the Torah and the prophets and the writings, how is it that they don't understand the meaning of it all?

How often did Jesus say to these religious Jews so familiar with the text, have you not read? And they didn't understand what it was that they had read. Paul says, because just like with Moses, there was a veil over Moses' face, and the children of Israel couldn't see Moses for who he really was after spending time in the presence of God, his face all aglow.

See, Moses was with Christ in the tent. And as he was staring at Christ and communing with God face to face with the mediator, he came out and his face was all aglow. And you know what sets Moses aglow?

Christ does. Christ sets Moses aglow. But Moses had to put the veil over his face so that the people would not be scared. And so Paul is saying, that's like what it is today, that the Jews, when they are reading the Old Testament, the veil is still over Moses and they're not catching the glow of Christ that is there in Moses.

And so he says, the veil is taken away in Christ, right? Once when you take the veil away, then you see Christ in Moses, Christ in the Old Testament. Now, verse 15, but even to this day when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart.

Nevertheless, when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. So Paul is saying, you know, the big difference here between a Jew who rejects Christ and a Jew who believes in Christ has to do with the veil being taken away.

Once the veil is taken away, then they see the glory of Christ in Moses. And they can see Moses' writings all aglow with the glory of Christ. And now this takes him back to the New Covenant details of what true life is, what real holiness is, spiritual existence is.

So he comes back to that theme in verses 17 and 18. Now, the Lord is the Spirit and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. There's a difference in the New Covenant versus the Old Covenant.

Verse 18, but we all with unveiled face, so those of us who were in the liberty of the Lord, those of us who were in the New Covenant, those of us who have God's words written upon the flesh of our hearts, okay?

But we all with unveiled face beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord. So when we look at Moses, the veil is gone and we're looking at Moses and what we're looking at is like a mirror. And what we see is the glory of Christ in Moses, that which was hidden from the Israelites back then and today.

He says, but when the veil is gone, we look in a mirror, we're looking in the word of God and we see the glory of the Lord, glory of Christ. And what happens is we are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory just as by the spirit of the Lord.

So again, it's not of the flesh, it's of the spirit, okay? And we're being brought forward glory by glory into conformity with Christ who is the head, who is the epitome of who we are to be. He is the image of the invisible God and we are being renewed into the image.

And so this is a passage that in reflecting upon, we have a prayer that we may pray accordingly that as we look at Christ in the word, that we will look like Christ in the world, that as we behold him, this is how we become like him.

The Trinity, Scripture, and Christ Writing Himself in Us

You had said that Paul does like to mix his metaphors and he's using veil over Moses, his face to cover the glory. And now he's using it more as a condemnation against the Jews, saying that that same veil, although it was necessary then, is now something of an impediment today.

And then you brought up, this is really a discussion of the superiority of the new covenant.

Correct.

This passage, as we were going through it, it is a real Trinitarian passage.

Oh yes, yeah, deep.

And in the new covenant, the idea of the Trinity is more clear. The Trinity was in the old and you see through a mirror darkly, as it were, but in the new covenant, it's so much more clear. So you have, in verse 14, you have, through Christ is this veil taken away.

And in verse 18, it's taken away by the Lord, who is the spirit.

Yes.

So who takes it away? Well, yes.

Yes.

The glory of the Lord being transformed into his image. Well, whose image? Well, Romans 8 .29 says you're being conformed to the image of Christ. And here in verse 18, it says that we are being transformed into the same image, the glory of the Lord, from one degree of glory to another.

This comes from the Lord, who is the spirit. So who are you being conformed to? Well, the glory of the Lord. Who's the Lord? Christ.

Who does it? The spirit.

Repeatedly, you see the idea, now that we have said before, Trinity, the word, may not appear in the scripture, but Trinity appears in the scripture. And we're looking at it.

Yes.

Right here.

Yes.

Think about the doctrine of scripture, okay? That what the Father speaks of his Son by the spirit, we have through holy men, every one of their words superintended with the truth of God. When we think about the doctrine of scripture, why is, for instance, Leviticus just as much, you know, important and profitable for doctrine, reproof, correction, training, and righteousness as Ephesians?

What is consistent? Well, Jesus Christ is the same. Yesterday, today, and forever. And it's Christ by his spirit in his servants who has given us this word. So remember that it's Christ by his spirit giving us the word.

He is the word of God, and he gives us the words of God by his spirit.

Okay.

When we think about that, and we think of the doctrine of scripture, how it is assumed throughout the Bible, and sometimes explicitly said, this is what this gift is to us. When we look at the beginning of the chapter, we're told, Paul is saying to the Corinthians, you are a letter.

You are an epistle, an epistle of Christ. And the word has written himself in you by the spirit. Right? Isn't that the doctrine of scripture? He wrote his words by the spirit. And now, look how closely holiness, sanctification, eternal life is unfolded in connection to the word, wherein Christ, the word, like Moses, right?

Moses is a prophet of God. How did he write down the words of God? Well, it was the spirit of Christ within him writing the things down that we now have. And as that happens, and as that is unveiled to us by the grace of God, Christ is writing himself in us by his spirit.

Look how central the word of God is to our liveliness, right? To our real living. Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God. How can we possibly truly live unless we have his words?

And we think of the prophets who were eating the words of God and so on.

Reading Galatians Beside 2 Corinthians 3

So this makes me think of the next epistle over in Galatians, where it seems like the veil is trying to be put back on in a certain way. So thinking about how Paul deals with the Galatians and an apologetic type of conversations you might have with somebody who wants to go back to the law or a type of law in and of themselves.

We have in Galatians three, where he actually lays out, did you receive the spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith? Are you so foolish? Having begun by the spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?

Did you suffer so many things in vain? If indeed it was in vain, does he who supplies the spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law or by hearing with faith, just as Abraham believed God and it was counted to him as righteousness.

In that text there, it looks like it's kind of perfectly laid out to where we have the doctrine in Corinthians and then him actually implementing that exact teaching to the Galatians in a rebuke of what was going on there with circumcision.

So like, I guess the, if I had a question here, is it right to superimpose that summation of second Corinthians three as what he's actually having to deal with here in Galatians?

Yeah, I'm a big fan of reading scriptures in parallel. This is one of the beauties of scripture that is unparalleled in any other type of literature, wherein we understand that there's a particular context, grammatical, historical, contextual context to each passage, unique, special, and so on.

However, because it is the same author and this is ultimately the same message and everything coheres in Christ, we have the opportunity to read passages of scripture side by side, three at a time, four at a time, if you dare, but to read these passages in their fullness next to one another and to meditate upon them and then glean the fruits of that labor.

So when we think about the way in which Paul is trying to guard against the error in the churches of Galatia, and we read about what he's talking about here, the kind of holiness that Paul is 100 for is the kind that comes by the power of the Spirit.

If we live by the Spirit, let's walk in the Spirit, look at the fruit of the Spirit, look what comes about by the Spirit versus that which comes according to the flesh. And so his metaphors here in 1 Corinthians 3 about how holiness happens and about how spiritual life flourishes and grows in people, this is gonna be a very helpful passage lay alongside his concerns in Galatia about false approaches to what holiness looks like.

It sounds like it's stemming from a false view of the Spirit, right? Because that's the thing he's hammering home with, is by the Spirit. It's through the Spirit, by faith. This is how we are supposed to read here, and obviously it bleeds into your doctrine of Scripture.

But as we know, most heresies are stemming from a heresy within the triune God himself, right?

Good point, good point.

It's just interesting, the passage that you chose there, just right after that, it talks about Abraham. You know, what's more old covenant than Abraham? And Paul, as we just read in 2 Corinthians, talks about the superiority of the new covenant and what the old covenant, it was veiled, there's things there that are important, but that veil has to be removed.

You have to come into the new. And then Paul, he doesn't like turn right around and say the exact opposite in Galatians. He actually says, this was always the plan. Look at Abraham, that the what? That the blessings of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.

He's incredibly consistent. He has a different audience here, Galatia versus Corinth, but he's incredibly consistent, appealing to the old, what does it always intend, moving forward, looking at it through the lens of Christ and saying, this is what was always the plan, that the blessings that come by grace through faith, just like in Abraham's time.

Yes, there's the old covenant, but it was always moving towards a purpose, towards a telos, towards an end, and that end is Christ himself.

Freedom, Sanctification, and the Ongoing Transformation of the Christian Life

Yeah, and in the passage in Galatia, as he talked about the difference between the old and the new covenant, he talks about being a slave versus being a son, and that, and he says the same thing here in 2 Corinthians 3, where he says, where the Spirit is, there is liberty, right?

There's something new here, there's something different here. And in Galatia, he's saying, having begun in the Spirit, are you now gonna be making your progress by the flesh? And back here in 2 Corinthians 3, he says, he sets an example in and of himself, in verse five, not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God, just hammering this.

I really appreciate the language from the Heidelberg Catechism and the care from someone like Herman Bavinck in his Reform Dogmatics, where care is being taken when it comes to sanctification, that even here, even here, where we are following Christ and laboring and fighting against sin and all of this, it is still understood as by grace alone.

And I think these are the kinds of passages that just underscore that point.

And like you said, it's freedom, but it's not, like Paul says later in Galatians, it's not an occasion or opportunity for the flesh, but through love to serve one another. And in a sense, it kind of leads us right back to how do we serve one another, but by loving one another?

And how do we love one another, but our loved neighbor? And some people can do all the twistings and turnings in order to continue to veil their face. But I just, he makes it so clear, especially going from Corinthians to Galatians, of the freedom that we have in Christ.

It's glorious. Like we said, superimposing three, four, five texts together, it's just, like you talk about glory, like that's, every text you had is way added.

So this idea, though, of one degree of glory to another.

Yes.

The image of Christ, the image that is wrought by the Spirit, the image to which we are being conformed. What is this one degree of glory to another? Because if you are saved, and you are engrafted into Christ, and you're part of the body of Christ, and you are seated with him in the heavenly places, and you are part of that body, from one degree of glory to another, how does that work?

Because I thought we had all of Christ. This isn't talking about, well, you get a piece now, you get what you can handle, you get a little more of a piece, and then I've got step three, step four, step five.

You have it all at the beginning. You are baptized into Christ, and then baptized in the Holy Spirit, and you don't have a second blessing coming along. You have all of Christ. So what is this from one glory to another?

Well, we can think of some of the expressions in the Bible where Christ washes the bride with the water of the word, which is very much a metaphor that fits with this passage in 2 Corinthians, right? It's the word that is being used to sanctify, and as he does that, isn't the bride more glorious after every act of washing that he does for his bride?

We can think of the language in Peter that talks about being refined by various necessary trials, and think of the precious metals. Remember, glory is not only brilliance in the washing of a bride to be more white, more pure, more clean, more glorious, but also weightiness is in the idea of glory, from glory to glory, wherein the gold is made all the more pure, and as the impurities leave the gold, the gold gets heavier, doesn't it?

Because the impurities are taken away from glory to glory. In Colossians, the end of Colossians 2, and then in Colossians 3, this very same discussion comes back because there is the veil of the old covenant practices, the box of do nots, do not handle, do not touch, do not taste, observe all these days, and all this, and Paul says, these things have a sense that, yeah, this might be effective, yeah, this seems like it's godliness, but it's not, it has no power in it, and then he says, here's real holiness.

If you wanna have real holiness, here's what you need to do. Colossians 3 begins this way. If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above. Where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God, set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth.

In this, he's not saying, don't care about your family, don't mow your lawn, he was just talking about holiness, and if you're gonna think about holiness, how is it that we grow in holiness in the spiritual life, don't look at the box of do nots here on earth, look at Christ at the right hand of God, and he goes on, for you died and your life is hidden with Christ in God, and then he begins to talk about putting to death all of the evil passions, all the sinful things, go to war against your sin, especially in light of the glories of Christ, and then he says, verse 10, you have put on the new man, you're putting off the old man, but you have put on the new man, who is renewed in knowledge, according to the image of him who created him.

How are we renewed? In knowledge, the knowledge of what? The knowledge that comes by God's word, as we pay attention to Christ, as we look at the glory of the face of God in Jesus Christ, look at Moses, his face all aglow, it's Christ, look at David in the Psalms, his face all aglow, it's Christ, all the way through the scriptures.

Why are these authors of scripture, why is their face all aglow? Because they have been born along by the Holy Spirit to write Christ, and as we stare at that, and as we rejoice in that, we are renewed in knowledge, according to the image of the one who created us, so that we are now being brought up into the image of the invisible God who is Christ.

So, back at the beginning of Colossians 3, where it says, seek those things which are above, where Christ is sitting at the right hand of God. How in the world do I do that? Binoculars, telescope, what do I do?

Read the word, read the word. The glory of the ascended Christ in the face of all these different authors of scripture, born along by the Holy Spirit, you wanna see Christ, you wanna see him, focus upon him and be renewed according to his glory, it's the scripture, the washing of the bride with the water of the word.

So, back to what he brought up.

He being me?

You, yes, David, from one degree of glory to another, are we seeing that as something that is a continual being brought along to different levels of glory, or the way I was reading it was, back at the beginning of that chapter, the glory of the veiled face in Moses, and then being unveiled, I was reading that as going from old covenant glory to new covenant glory.

Unless I'm reading that wrong, I don't know.

Well, just check the tenses of the verse 18, which I think Joe is right to look at this one verse and say, hey, wow, what's going on here? Because, I mean, think about the way it's being expressed. But we all, not those who have a veil on their hearts, but we all who have the unveiled face.

So, identifying those who are in the new covenant. So, we are in the new covenant, and there's a present tense ongoing action here. But we all, with unveiled face, beholding, as in a mirror, the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the spirit of the Lord.

So, it seems to me that there's an ongoing.

Right.

Like, for instance, Paul, when he's talking about the various trials and tribulations that he goes through, and so on and so forth, and the outer man is being afflicted and broken up, and we're just clay pots, and so on and so forth, but the inner man is being renewed day by day, right?

And there's like this ongoing transformation occurring in the Christian's life.

Okay, yeah. So, I guess my question, actually, more pointedly would have been, the glories he's talking about, the first glory is that old covenant, and then the new glory is new covenant? Or are we looking at, because of the context of that sentence.

I see what you're saying. Yeah, yeah. The context of that sentence is basically like, well, now with an unveiled face, you go from this old glory to this new glory.

That would fit with the overall context, except that I think that present verb, that you are being transferred now, is the reality of we're standing in the new covenant. Now that you are in the new covenant, this is what's happening to you now.

And that fits with the rest of those scriptures that basically talk about sanctification. I mean, I can see your point, that it wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility to say that one glory of the old, which was, it was glorious, to the glory of the new, except for the fact it doesn't say, you have been transformed from one glory to another.

It says you are being transferred presently. It's a present reality that seems to be happening now.

And it might even have a hermeneutic here, but it's going to be very profitable. And just looking at the context, and I think that Dylan's point is well made when we look here in verses seven through 10, very much the elements of one glory to another are established there.

So forwarding that here to the summary verse in the ongoing life of the Christian, a use of all the scripture, all the scriptures inspired by God, profitable for adoption, reproof, correction, construction.

How then do we use Moses? So here's the, with unveiled face. With unveiled face, we take up Moses. And how is it that we're using Moses? Not in terms of just mere condemnation where the letter kills. But because we see the glory of Christ in the face of Moses, because we have an unveiled heart, we don't have a veil.

Because we see the glory of Christ in the face of Moses. Of course, Moses often just stands in for all the different authors of the scriptures. But because we can see that, because of who Christ is, because of what he has done, and the work that he does by his Holy Spirit, our being in the new covenant, we are being transformed from glory to glory.

So that, for instance, we don't pick up Moses with a veiled face. We pick up Moses with the unveiled face. And that Christ takes up this word and he uses it in the light of who he is and what he has done in his accomplished work, who is the end of the law and the righteousness for all who believe.

And that with unveiled face, we take up Moses. And Moses is profitable for our sanctification and our transformation from glory to glory. And it is effective and it is, shall we say, safe? And shall we say, uncondemning?

But rather transforming and sanctifying? Because we see it and we receive it in Christ. So the, for instance, so we take up, let's say, the Ten Commandments. We don't take it up in a veiled way, but in an unveiled way, meaning that we don't take it up and we're not slaves, we're not condemned, we're not game over.

We take it up and we still have liberty. We're still in liberty. Why? Because we're in Christ. And that Christ will do his sanctifying enlivening, reviving work in our lives, conforming us to his image through Moses because now it's unveiled.

So seeing from old covenant glory to new covenant glory, why do Christians still use the Old Testament, right? Because Moses is unveiled for us. When we look at Moses, we don't just see Moses by himself.

We're not reading Leviticus and saying, oh, Moses, you're so peculiar about all these little rules. No, we're reading Moses with an unveiled face and we see the glory of Christ in his face. And that's why it is effective for our transformation in liberty and our sanctification.

I liked how you used the metaphor of gold earlier and how from each purification, it becomes more weighty and the impurities are out of it. You can look at David, Moses, Abraham, you can look at all the prophets and here are nuggets with impurities in them and then the incarnation.

And it is pure, unadulterated, glorious, weighty bullion that we can look at and like you said, look back at all the other things with impurities, those men with impurities in them, not what they wrote, but that metaphor works really, really well when we think about Christ and his scriptures.

So there is an element that Dylan brought up that is definitely true as far as going from one glory to another, from the old to the new. The old is definitely glorious and that's brought up in seven through 11, that's definitely there.

We have for what was being brought to an end came with glory, the what did end did have glory, much more will what is permanent have glory. So it'll be even more glorious, it's a more glorious glory. But in 18, that summary statement, although that first part is true, you're really taking it more as another statement, another way to express the sanctification that comes with life in the body of Christ as you're being conformed more and more to his image.

It is a transformation to a more glorious glory.

And the clause right after it is great, right? Like for this comes from the Lord who is the spirit. To make sure you know this is not by works, by the way. We're just gonna toss that in there as well.

Talk about being consistent with Galatians, yeah.

Yes, and when we move forward into chapter four, obviously Paul's not ceasing his thought neatly in chapters here, but when we go into chapter four, we see that he continues to talk about the veil and he continues to talk about the glory of Christ.

So in verse three, he says, but even if our gospel is veiled, right? It is veiled to those who are perishing, whose minds the God of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ who is the image of God should shine on them.

So read that in reverse. What about those who are no longer veiled and blinded? Those who do believe. Those who do believe. Those who have been brought out of their blindness by the grace of God, while the light of the gospel, the glory of Christ who is the image of God has shone upon us.

Isn't that amazing? He says, for we do not preach ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord. Meaning, going back to the idea, I didn't write you an epistle of commendation, right? Here's my introduction and my credentials.

He said, I didn't do that, okay? The proof of my ministry is in your pudding because you're changed and something happened and it's Christ writing himself into you as his epistle. He comes back to that now because he says in verse six of chapter four, for it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness who was shown in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

This, this is eternal life,.

That we know God and Jesus Christ whom he has sent.

Amen to that. Well, I think we've wrapped that up as best we can. I'm sure there's more we could pull out of this because it's such a rich text and there's so many other rich texts to read it with, but we're gonna move on to.

What are we thankful for? Michael, we'll start with you.

Well, I am thankful for you. I'm thankful for Dylan, for David, thankful for Ryan, for Joe, for Andrew. I'm thankful for you as my friends and my brothers in Christ and thankful for the work and the labor that many people did, including Edgar Hovarter and really helping us get started.

Thank you, Edgar.

Yes, very thankful for all of that so that we could do this podcast and it's been far more, I think, far more enriching and enjoyable for us than any of our listeners, but we are also thankful for the listeners as well.