Christian Nationalism

Campaigning yeah, so I am seeing yes drew your YouTube is not on Yeah, I I mean,

I don't know how to do that through any of this. That's an Andrew thing It says it's checked on YouTube up here.

I know nothing about that Let me just check yeah, it says everything's linked

I guess it's not No clue about that. Sorry guys. Sorry head on over to Facebook and check it out on Facebook Are you using stream yard?

I am using stream yard. Yes But so so indictments went out.

They're trying to to Get him to spend all his time in court not campaigning which is interesting because even with all this stuff continuing to come out

He's still the Republican front -runner He's he's still killing everybody in the polls

So he probably doesn't even need to campaign anyway, but they're gonna be talking about Trying to get him on overturning the election and the fact that they indicted him means that now they get to argue for election fraud in court and That is exactly what

Trump wanted in the first place He wanted to be able to go before the courts and present evidences of election fraud

So they're giving him exactly what he wanted so that this can come out in court to show election fraud

It'll be interesting to see what happens. But Drew, let's see Okay, yeah, thanks

John for clarifying that in the comments I see we have a guest backstage I don't know this guest, but let's bring him on Dave Pratt How you doing, yeah good man, how you doing pretty good pretty good.

What's up? Sorry just to me up. Um, I just thought it to come and have a look because I actually

For how long now? I've listened to you guys on through Spotify. Mm -hmm, and I'm actually in Australia Okay.

Yeah. Yeah, I I can slightly tell because it's the accident Yeah, but bluey is is my favorite show

Yeah, it's uh, it's pretty good. My kids love it Yeah, my one -year -old when it's on he will just sit there and even though we've seen every single episode a hundred times he's like No, it's um, yeah been yet Started getting on to you guys.

I know how long ago about two months ago. So so I'm a whole truck operator So I drive those big mine trucks and in it

We can just put out, you know USBs on or you know, touch your phone to listen to things So I just been listening to you guys

And it's um, I've been finding a very encouraging and very informative Yeah, yeah, it's been really good

So I thought oh, well, I'm here Actually, I was on night work last night and I was playing around on your site and I thought oh

What does this button do? I'll give it a go and and obviously now here. I'm I didn't expect you guys to be actually on at the moment.

That's all Okay. Yeah. Yeah, so so our time for for broadcasting is

Thursday nights and because I Are you in the future? So is it Friday? It's it's 10 a .m.

Friday. Okay. Yeah, so so our time would be American Thursday 8 o 'clock

Till I think 10 o 'clock. I think that's usually when we go So, so yeah, it's so it's 10 a .m.

There yeah 10 a .m. Yeah or 10. Oh wait, yeah. Wow. Nice so so when you're when you're listening like Do you have others around you that are also listening that no, it's just just me by myself in the truck

Okay, so my it's a 12 -hour shift So it's like I listen to yourself and say like, you know messages whether it be like from Steve Lawson John MacArthur RC Sproul all those guys

Okay. Yeah, that's a good group to listen to for sure. Yeah, Todd thrill Ray comfort.

Yeah Yeah, yeah, that's good so So are you active in your church

There in Australia. What part of Australia are you in New South Wales? So I'm in a town called

Muscle Brook Okay, and that's about three hours north of Sydney, okay, yep

I've been I found a church finally at Singleton Baptist, which is actually half an hour south and The preacher there was actually is quite good

Pretty surname. He said it first names Andrew and my first Sermon there that I listened to he

Brought up solar scripture okay, and that and this sermon was about you know, putting off your old self and putting on the new and all that sort of stuff and I've said to them as well.

I was encouraging them if I wasn't sitting down. I would have fallen over that's I was pretty impressed with The sermon because I was looking for that standard of like you

John MacArthur's and all that sort of stuff And to finally found find someone who has that standard and have that Doctrine it was actually quite mind -blowing for me.

Now. Is that hard to find there in Australia? Pastor like that a preacher like that.

Oh Yeah, I have found it hard Mind you my when I grew up my dad was a pastor

Baptist pastor. Okay for 13 years of my life so I sort of had that I have that background and then just to try and find a good church because I'm Lived in Queensland for 12 years and now

I'm back down here and trying to find a church around there It was just really difficult because you know, they've got all that new

Obviously They're trying to be popular with their doctrine so whether it be like female preachers or you know, same -sex with that sort of stuff and It's a that's quite frustrating so as soon as obviously

I'll find out they agree with that or Then I'm just out of there, you know So No with this church,

I'm going to now I've been there for now three months Okay. Yeah often on because of shift work

But it's been quite encouraging and and that's a there's good group of guys there

Which is good So we've just finished Colossians Hmm.

Yeah, so that was really good. That's awesome. Yeah, that's great. So so are you getting?

So you've been there for three months are you getting like plugged in as far as service serving in the church or are you

Looking for areas within the church to serve. Yeah, I'm looking for areas within the church. So because of my shift work

I Pretty much go forward only So it makes a little bit harder to connect

But I've had you know coffee with the pastor and stuff like that and I went to the they have a men's breakfast And two weeks ago,

I went to that and I had a working be, you know So, yeah, I'd help out work at the church and do odd jobs

So I'm trying to get myself involved in that Next week, hopefully I can go to the church camp

Which is over a weekend? And then there's a men's conference coming up, which I'm not too sure what date it is

I've got an email but haven't read it yet. So I'm hoping to get into that as well but no, I do want to I want to get in involved and But I'm not sure

Where God wants me? because I have like I find it very encouraging listening like to yourself and Andrew and And the guys that I listen to it

It'd be like Todd frill and all that sort of stuff even right company you know how they go on streets and preach and stuff like that and Just how they talk to people and I have a real burning and passion or a desire to do that But at the same time actually

I haven't done Study theology yet, but I want to So I was looking at you know, either

Ligonier's or John McArthur's one. Is it the master seminary?

That's their seminary. Yeah. Yeah, I looked at those two and then I'm see, I'm Bits, I don't know.

I haven't really found anything in Australia The reason being is because my dad actually had a bad experience with Morley College Which is the

Baptist one here. Mm -hmm I mean things could have changed by then but just I don't know.

I really like The doctrine and everything from obviously where you guys are in the u .s.

Right? Yeah, so And just trying to fit that in with family and work and trying to so yeah

No, I really want to get out there and do something, but I'm still not sure Even if I want to be a pastor or not,

I'm not sure you know Yeah. Yeah, that is a it's a high calling I'm just calling

Now as far as learning Theology, I know

I want to say on Ligonier's website. I believe they have like courses that you can do for free so I and I know you can get like DVDs of RC Sproul's lectures and stuff on theology on apologetics and everything like that so there's ways where you can you can get all the information and Not have to pay like a tuition

You can get it for cheap and You know Those are those are really helpful because I know some people that do the

Ligonier stuff just from their websites and they've grown Exponentially, so you'd have to I'd have to look to see what the resources are where to actually

Exactly find them on the website, but I know they have them and it's basically just Theology courses online for free, you know

You you can listen to lectures and and they may I think they give you you can print out like a syllabus that has

You know recommended books to get I always recommend going Straight for the

Puritans right the Puritan paperbacks. You can learn in the Puritan paperbacks.

They are They're condensed. They're abridged versions of much larger works

But they're easier to digest they're easier to swallow and a lot of them are sermons that have been turned into these books and The theology that they present of course is big

God theology But it's Christ exalting and it's just it's works that really hit you in the heart

That kind of a lay it open to where you lay it before the Lord and you go I don't even know if I'm a believer, you know reading these some of these guys, especially reading guys like Watson or John Bunyan the

Pilgrims Praga progress is one of my favorite books. I read it all the time I reference it all the time whenever I'm talking to people

So Puritan paperbacks are a good way to start getting into some of that so that you especially if you're if you are feeling that inkling of Pastoral vocation

It's a good way to see how the the men that we look up to and how and they're preaching in their theology how they organize and structured their sermons and how they presented

Christ because like you're talking about with a lot of the The preachers in Australia who are trying to be popular

Right a lot of them probably follow a lot of NAR new apostolic Reformation Doctrine the

Bethel's and kill songs and stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean being in Australia.

I mean, I'm sure But you see in their sermons they're trying to be really really popular right and it's it's pragmatic

Hmm in the sense of we need to do and say whatever we're to draw people in so that we can have them

Keep coming back and then they look at that as success if you can get more people in Then we're sick.

Sorry No problem But but that's not how we how we measure success in the church right, we measure success in the church by Looking at those whom

God has given us to shepherd and say are they growing in holiness? Are they growing in Christ likeness?

Are they growing in the knowledge and understanding of the Lord? Then we know we're doing a good job.

That's success and you see that a lot in the Puritan writings In those

Puritan back. I love them. And I mean, but also you can get Systematic theologies that that really as well for looking up specific doctrines

I have several over there I Think my favorite though is

Puritan theology, of course by Joel Beeky okay, that's definitely my favorite because I'm a big

Puritan guy, but But those those are some good places to start

I would I would definitely utilize some of the free resources that Ligonier has and I think

I think on YouTube the master seminary has a lot of Hold on KTN.

Jesus has given a good one. This is a good one biblical doctrine by MacArthur and Richard Mayhew Yeah, that's that that's a really good one actually got that one for my father -in -law.

I don't know if he's cracked it open yet, though But I think the master seminary has some courses on YouTube that you can look up.

I think they've got some courses on preaching as well so now when you're talking about Listening to Ray Comfort having a passion for some of these things is your passion like to Do street evangelism go out do street preaching street evangelism.

Is that what I heard? Right? Well, see that's why I'm not sure But I'm not afraid to talk to people about my belief my faith

God Jesus, you know, and it was only like Probably a month or so ago

Where my job it's boring as Driving around circles moving dirt. I do

I do FedEx here. So I totally understand. I'm delivering It is so boring.

I get it. Yeah, so I was thinking what I want to do like I don't really want to do this

I don't know and Then one of my mates Carney I was talking to him and on my

I've got some tattoos and on my forearm. I've got some Hebrew writing and One says it's it's forgiven

Child of God no judgment an amazing grace And so the reason why I got it in Hebrew is because I wanted in a sense for that to be a point of discussion

Okay, so people saw it. Oh, what's that? And then it goes from there so Connie saw it and he's actually from Iraq and He he was a kid.

He was actually in Baghdad And he moved to Australia when he was a kid and then we had a discussion obviously about Israel and whether or not

I think Israel should be where they are and with Palestine and all that sort of stuff and I told him what

I believed and and how I think they should be and He goes, oh really and then we got a discussion about What I believe about Jesus about you know all salvation and Why I believe and then it was good.

There was another guy there who I didn't really know but he knew he was a Christian, too so he was sort of backing me up with what

I was telling Connie about and Connie's brought up as he's not he's not a practicing

Muslim. He's not but his parents were and they both passed away near so he

He's definitely not a practicing Muslim. Okay. Yeah, he's not but well, I was able to have a Decent discussion with him and I felt a real

You know a burn in my heart for it And I just I was so In a sense excited about it.

So after talking to him when I had to get back on the truck I went wow, this is what I need to do

Okay That's that's what it was, I mean, I know that's not straight evangelism because I actually knew the guy

You know him but I just had that real It was right, you know, yeah.

Well, I mean evangelism really it starts With those that are closest to us, right?

Those are around us, right? Well, I mean our our first ministry, of course is to our family making sure our family

We're growing and leading our family in the Lord But I mean also our co -workers right those whom we work with that we see on a daily basis

And you know the they see how we act they see how we respond to thing to things the things that we say

Then you know, so so that's a point of contact where we can minister to people and then going out on the streets as well

Because you know, I've gone out on the streets and I've had people almost run away from me

Yeah, you know one one story is I went with a group of friends we went

To this little town square in Marietta, Georgia And it was with an older church well a

Church, I was previously at and we went to just sing songs pray for people

Things like that and so I saw this These group of girls and I said, well, I think they need

Jesus Yeah, so so I grabbed one of my one of my other friends who was a girl because I'm not gonna going to go approach

Them, you know by myself as a male and so I went over and I and I said, hey, you know

How are you? How are y 'all doing? I you know, I'd like to tell you guys about Jesus and they said oh, no.

Thanks. No, thanks We're good, we're good and and I said, okay. Okay. Why do you why do you think that and they oh, well, you know we grew up in the church and and We we're good.

We don't we don't want to hear about About Jesus. We just we just kind of worship God our own way.

He knows he understands He knows my heart and I said I said could it be that you don't want to talk about Jesus?

because You don't actually know him Right the the you know that you're living wrong

And that because I was because the first thing you notice was how they were dressed And it was you know, you're living wrong and and you don't want to talk about Jesus, you know, there's some sin going on And they said well, no, we just we just don't want to talk and then

I proceeded to tell them about Jesus Anyway, and then we were walking me and my friend We were walking back and she just looked at me and she said

I've never seen that before So what are you talking about? You see me talk to people like hundreds of times.

Like what do you mean? That you asked if they wanted to talk about Jesus. They said no and you did it.

Anyway Obvious So it's you know, people are gonna they're not gonna want to talk to you

But you're just gonna have to do it. Anyway is is what I found Yeah, it's but it is one of those things that sometimes it can be

Oh Because I've I've gone out with friends that have been okay. We're gonna go we're gonna go evangelize and we go out and They they're too scared to approach people.

They're too scared to talk to them as I just got to grab them and say, okay No, we're gonna go do it.

Like let's just go talk to people. They're just people right? Yeah. Yeah They don't know you from Adam, but and as soon as you walk away, they might forget you that they may but Unity to tell them about Christ, you know, so take that opportunity.

I forgot I Was listening to a sermon this morning It's an older sermon by The guy's name is

Sean Sean something he's a pastor in in, Tennessee the state of Tennessee and Well, he was guest preaching and the the pastor that was introducing was basically telling this guy's life

Mission statement and his mission statement was never pass an opportunity to tell someone about Jesus So whenever you have an opportunity to tell someone you tell someone

Right. That's what we're to do. Anyway, right? Yeah hard to tell people about Jesus I mean,

I think it was yeah, it was last week. Andrew was telling us about the car accident that he was in.

That's right Yeah, and he was the the person that that hit him

He gave him a gospel track told him about Jesus the person that he hit and he gave him a gospel track told him about Jesus right?

I mean, he's just that's an opportunity. Everyone's there the He's he's there.

Yeah, you know, so so we just got to Get over fear and I think a lot of people don't do it because they're fearful and when they're full

That just means they love themselves too much, right? It's more of that. That's true.

It's more of a I I'm afraid of what they'll think of me Well, who cares dude get yourself out of the way, right?

Yeah, so but I mean if if that's where you feel your passion is

Then you have to pursue that now. I would say that should be a passion for all Christians All in the name of Christ should be going out and telling people about Jesus Yeah, so that should be all of our all of our passion now in terms of Serving in the church because and I know you you said because of your shift work, that's hard, but you're also trying to find

Kind of where to plug in Yeah, you know I would say

Take an inventory of what are your gifts talents and abilities that the lord has given you

Look at those And then take those to the church and say this is what I can do. Where do you need me?

Yeah, that's a good idea. Yeah, and then just give yourself to that so what I um, you see when

I was in um, Queensland in Makai and tieri and tieri is actually a real small mining town and I was actually a police officer for 13 years and In that town.

I was the actually officer in charge um, and What I used to do because it was difficult there was a church next door, but it was hardly ever on if at all so That's when

I started just in a sense having church in the police car When I was just driving around I listened to podcasts and music and what have you?

Um, but You know you're talking about Trying to tell everyone about god where everyone you interact with see then when

I was in that position I would always pray for an opportunity And while i'm talking to that person i'd be like lord, please

Pray, I pray there's an opportunity for me to say something and then more often than not there was like they might mention something or And I just go.

Oh, yeah about this and what about you know, and I'll talk about My faith and what have you and stuff like that? So and it led to Other opportunities as well from that because the town started knowing.

Oh, hang on. Don't pray. He's he's a christian So for instance, we have like, you know

Anzac day, right? So we remember the the um, the anzacs fighting the world or the world wars

Right, and so I was asked even though I was a police officer in charge. I was asked to do a prayer Okay.

Okay, so I was able to do a a proper prayer as such which i'm saying that is because I know who i'm praying to Hmm.

Well, there's other people that would do it. They're just it's just like oh, yeah This sounds like a prayer.

I'll just do that, you know This is just words in vain pretty exactly right so what

I wanted to do is Have an opportunity but in that prayer I was mentioning about you know, thanking god about dying for us, you know

And saving us from our sins, you know, so those are the things I was trying to implement and just like throw in there um, and even one time we

Uh, I led a prayer for a christmas lunch that we had with the town So it was just the opportunities which was really good and obviously now i'm not in that position

Um, so I don't have those Opportunities as much But i'm still i'm trying to find them again

So, um Yeah, but I know I really have like I said before I really have that desire. I just want to Almost pretty much want to do it as a job.

You know, I mean, but Yeah Yeah Now another I should have said this also as a good source.

I don't know why I didn't If you go to striving for eternity I'm sure andrew has tons of uh of uh articles

Uh, probably some uh some teachings on there Uh, it's been a while since i've actually been to the website

So I should probably I should probably know it in and out now that I do I'll do the podcast Um, but I I do know andrew has a lot there are a lot of articles

On there from just from pastors from theologians Uh that have just been collected now.

I will also say listen to the sermons Of jim osmond, you know, uh jim osmond products.

So we've had jim on several times He's a friend of the ministry and that's that's actually where I think that's where uh,

Andrew is now at probably it but I have found

Oh i'm cutting out. Uh, yeah, it's come back again Yeah, my internet is messed up.

So It's pretty windy over here so I thought it might have been that No, my internet is uh, we've been having issues with it

Yeah, but uh, but jim is one of the best expositors of scripture

Yeah that that i've listened to and so, you know, it's it's kind of a privilege to get to call him a friend

Because I listen to him and I and I can I can never not listen to him without pen and paper in hand

Okay, because I know he's going to give me so much information That's going to be beneficial to my soul that I could probably use to pass on to somebody else

Yeah, and so even even when he's a guest on the show I kind of sit back

And just let him do his thing and i'm taking notes You know while he's on the podcast

So that's uh, I mean I would say Listen to as many jim osmond sermons that you can.

Um, yeah, he's great So we do have a question for you from bond servant for jesus. Is dave pratt single just curious?

No I'm married and I have three children Three kids.

Okay. What are their ages? Brianna she's 10 brox eight and jordan seven

Okay, so they're all kind of close together. Yeah, they are. Yeah, we end up having three under three So that was that was a bit rough but it's good now

Yeah, well there was a time we had two that were two and under and so that was

Uh, uh, but it's it's starting to get a little bit better but so do your uh, uh, do your do your kids, uh know christ or To them.

Okay, great. Yep. Um, the school is actually quite impressed When I end up doing like, you know when

I do their little bible because I go to a christian school. Okay, and um, They they go when

I do their little bible studies in the morning and stuff like that or they go to scripture um, they're pretty impressed with Their knowledge as such for their age

Because what I want to do is obviously I want to teach them The best I can but also

I want them to know more than what I did when I was their age because just in the past 10 years or so uh

Or even just in five years. I've just learned so much and I even said to my dad

I said like What was it? Um About two three years ago.

I mean I only stumbled across rc sprawl And i'm like Where have you been?

You know, and then then I found out obviously he passed away in 2017 so like I watched like just a recap of that the funeral and um, then

I saw obviously john mccarthur and stuff like that and Um, and then a long time ago and I can't remember how old

I was probably i was probably a teenager or something My dad actually gave me a bible study book And I didn't realize but it was written by rc sprawl.

It was actually walking with jesus. Okay, and i've still got it nice and um

Yeah, no, it's like oh, okay. So he has actually introduced me, but I just didn't Pick up on it.

Yeah, you know, yeah, but um Yeah, just just learned so much and in that time

I was thinking I wish I had known Just some of the stuff that I know now back then

So that's yeah, so that's what i'm doing with my children and they've also asked If they if they could be baptized and I said oh

Well, yeah, i'm sort of maybe my daughter tan but Like i'm sort of when i've listened to other preachers even like, you know, whoever it is

But I I believe there's an age where you might be a bit too young to actually understand what you're in a sense getting yourself into See I was baptized when

I was 17 But I was still I still made mistakes after it, right? Yeah.

So, you know, um and Yeah, so I don't

I want to try and protect them and do the best and I wouldn't do the right thing Mm -hmm But um,

I wanted to also have a proper understanding of what they're getting himself into right? Yeah, so i've even i've even told them

I said The i've even told them the world's getting worse And it's wasn't what it's not what it was when

I was a kid And I said it's going to get to a point where we may be um persecuted for our faith

And i've even said to them I said like for instance the government Whatever government may be

I actually explained, you know, I sort of gave an example of uh, china you know They might not like the government might not want you to you know

Be a christian or express your faith and if you do so you'll get in trouble. You could be arrested or even executed and I said but What I want you to understand is that you never ever deny jesus no matter what?

So they have that sort of understanding That's how that's pretty much because I kept asking questions as well.

So I sort of got to that in depth Good Yeah Yeah, so I just want them prepared, you know

Yeah, that's good. That's wise. Yeah Now it would be really funny if uh, they go to uh, they go to bible study and go

Well john macarthur says about this passage, you know, uh, that would be really

Yeah Yeah, yeah, yeah Now I was listening to charles burgeon and um, there you go.

We're gonna ask Oh, no, go ahead. Go ahead. Oh, I was just making another comment about you know They could quote from charles burgeon or something like that.

Right? Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um now In australia

Is there or are there parts where The church is persecuted or or you're kind of looked down upon for being a christian or or anything like that uh

There I wouldn't I'm, i'm sure there's like persecutions throughout. So like in just especially with through covid

Definitely in like, uh, victoria and western australia They were definitely there was persecution there like with churches and stuff like that Because you know they weren't closing down or they were meeting and you know

And they weren't allowed or they'd have like it got to the point where It was in musselbrook here

Though when they met at a park, they're only allowed to meet in groups of 10 Okay Like they weren't allowed to meet as a congregation interesting

Yeah, that's weird And then obviously they didn't do church at the church

They had to do it online And anyway that I had a discussion with the pastor about that.

I'm just like Yeah, we got a comment here andrew grant. I think andrew is in australia as well

Okay Every church was forced to meet online Yeah, yeah. Yeah, there's no one.

I don't believe there's anyone that had a backbone like john macarthur And that's what needed

I believe that's needed to happen Yeah, so so there wasn't anyone that Like in australia that could be given the title of like a christian nationalist right, like we're going to We're going to overthrow australia and take australia for christ

Not that i've heard. No, okay No I mean, they might be out there.

Um, but I haven't heard anything like that Um, but in relation to I believe in comparison to the u .s

and I could be wrong and I'll and i'll copy it if i'm wrong, but I I believe the the christian sort of things is is looked down upon here

Um Like when you tell people that you're a christian or what have you you just like oh a christian.

Are you one of those? I remember, um When I was in the police Uh, I was in mccoy and I was in the watch house where they you know the jail section part

And um, I was sitting there I knew there was another junior officer. I knew he was a christian and People knew that he was christian, but they didn't really

Like him or they just thought he was weird or what have you and I actually liked him him and I got on quite well and I was just sitting there and one of the senior officers behind me said

Oh, he's a christian. I was one of those and I said I turned around I said one of those what

And I said i'm one of those He goes. Oh, no, no, no, no, you know what I mean? No, you're not like you like i'm like Well, what does that mean?

That sounds even worse. Yeah. Yeah, I know I know but Like there's there's that so that looked down.

It's looked down upon And um But yeah, but I I felt good about that because I was able to step up and Stick up for him as well

And also, um with my faith too but Yeah there's

Yeah, obviously what depends on where you are where you're living as well because where i'm at now muscle book. There's not there's not really any

I want to say like my innocence I don't want to be sound so self -righteous, but my my standard of doctrine, uh

I don't believe he's in muscle book okay, um because they seem to like All agree with each other with things and they participate with each other and things like for instance the anglican church here

Their lead pastor is a female So I'm like what what?

And yet they're supporting them like the baptist church here is supporting them with what they do and vice versa they you know, they have community events where they all get together and Stuff like that.

I'm like, so there's no real conviction No, and that's what I picked up that there's a lot of um

You know how we all say by grace, right? But there's that extreme say by grace as in oh, it's just a free ticket to do what

I want, but i'm still saved. Yeah And that's what I hate You know, um, and that's what

I found and I felt that the particular pastors Here and here Encourage it

But like I said when I went down to this church where i'm going to now that's He's even i've even been told by other deacons at that church when he was first in a sense interviewed

He actually held the bible up in the air and said this is what I preach from and nothing else from this

Nothing else but this you know And it was quite encouraging, you know Nice yeah, so Yeah, that's that's what

I found. It's very You know innocent like the australia she'll be all right, mate, you know

But um Yeah, I mean that's just my experience here at the moment. Yeah.

Well, let me bring in All right, my uh co -host here from From matter of theology chris huff.

What's up? Hey It's I mean, hey if you can't get here on time, dude

That's good work baby work Work who works at eight o 'clock at night? Uh, well when some most of your team or some of your teams on the west coast

This guy will tell them tell them to get on normal people time I know right get on get on the don't don't be on the west coast get on the best coast, right?

That's right We don't do west coast. No, man Like when when the rap wars of the 90s of east and west coast it was all east coast all day, dude

My man Oh, that's awesome. That's awesome. What's up, buddy? Well dave

Um, it was it was really great chatting with you if you want to hang out backstage. You're more than welcome to Uh, yeah, appreciate it.

Thank you So so chris, I don't know if you were listening earlier, but uh, it was not but dave is uh out in australia

And he's been listening to the podcast for for a little bit And he was just on the website messing around and he said well,

I wonder what happens if I do that and he ended up here What happens if I press this duck right here? Oh, I end up talking to these guys

Yeah, so, uh, so he didn't know we would actually be on right now. And so we've just been kind of chit chatting

Hope you didn't say anything bad. Dave. Can't take it back, bro It's out in the world forever

Yeah But yeah, uh, you're more i'm gonna put you backstage Yep.

I appreciate it. Thank you. Tom. Yeah, no problem. And uh, um, very thankful for for dave and that conversation there and You know

Just him, uh finding a faithful church out in australia awesome Uh chris, what's up, dude?

What's up, bro? Living the dream, you know You know what I do and doing it. Well, I was waiting for you to say that man living the dream

I was gonna switch it and say dreaming to live but that doesn't work. It don't but uh, so so I started off the show by reading the great commission

Because You know, we're we're going to be talking about christian nationalism Yeah And that is a a hot hot button topic right now

Now I I did before the show I went and I found I found some things. Okay.

Oh some things It's from it's from a blog called truth over tribe. I've never heard of it before.

Okay but It's how do you know you have fallen for christian nationalism?

Hold on my wife sent me Um Okay, so how do you know you've fallen for christian nationalism?

Okay first You think america's founders were evangelical christians?

Some of them were some of them were I would actually say a lot of them were yeah Now and that's just historical fact.

Now. A lot of people would say that they were deus That's actually and they would say george washington was a deus

I would disagree I've got a really big Very accurate biography of george washington down there george washington

Spent a lot of his time, especially when he was when when the american revolution was going on and he was on the battlefield

He spent it in prayer Deus have no need to pray because they don't believe god is actively involved in his creation

What Interesting, how dare you? I know but if you believe that you might be a christian nationalist

So, okay. Here's another one. Okay All right, you want your church to fly an american flag in the sanctuary

Okay Let me let me um Gosh, you see brother. Golly.

There's so many different Directions we could go with this, right?

Right. Um And and so let me let me start out by saying, uh the following um

For and and it was interesting because i've had some people over the last couple weeks, um As this topic has come up and i've i've i've taken a you know

Every I think a lot of people know I took a step back from social media and I still am not very involved Like I used to be um

But I did make a comment after I saw someone said something to the effect of um, oh it was dale partridge it was dale partridge saying

We won't get into why never never the rabbit hole. Um you know that this lady came to his church and joined the church because They're theonomic post -millennials

Um, and she was just i'm paraphrasing, you know, so no one jumped down my throat here.

Um that she was sick of the defeatist attitude mentality through and through um, and So I I made a comment.

Um, I addressed something in a very broad way that's what i've been trying to do especially on twitter or x or Um twix whatever you want to call it

Um, I like twix by the way twix are good. I haven't had one in a minute though But but anyway, but the point is is

I had someone you know, someone oh, oh, oh, that's what it was I I tweeted out that if you are villainizing someone

Based upon a secondary or tertiary issue like eschatology You're villainizing another believer.

You're doing it wrong. All you are You're you're immature you're pugnacious You're divisive and you're quarrelsome

If you're a pastor You're not supposed to be those things, right? um And somebody somebody was like well

Somebody like clapped back at me and you know me man. I usually just read it and then ignore it. Um, but I Like he he was just like well, that's because your eschatology is this this

I can't remember what they said and I was like Okay, I didn't get loser eschatology I didn't even well, it's not but I I didn't even say anything about What my eschatology was it was right and I said on whether you're on both sides of the aisle

Okay, it doesn't matter which side you are So I say all that to say this I am a patriot through and through I mean i'm i'm wearing a hat right now

This has the uniform of eddie penny who is a former seal team six dev group and operator tier one operator um

These guys Right. I train with these guys virtually not not in person gbrs group.

This guy's named dj shipley cole fackler Same thing seal team six tier one operators.

Okay. See this hat. Look Oh, look, there's another one like I love this country

I am a patriot through and through However I am a citizen of heaven

Before i'm a citizen in the united states of america Right i'm and you and I have talked about this a ton a matter of theology

That and and this this came up a ton during after george floyd in 2020

Um, lecrae talking about you know, he's black before you know, you're not black before you're anything else You're a child of god and a citizen of heaven before you're anything else, right?

so Of course, I love this country And I would I would gladly fight for the values of this country

However My love for this country should never emotionally Intellectually or physically supersede my love for christ his church

And to glorify him in all that I do and to operate to operate according to what this says

Not what the constitution says first Right first and foremost my love for country should look like hate compared to my correct

Right, right. I count it all as right rubbish. Okay, so So I I you know,

I I want to preface all of this But by saying I say that like of course,

I desire laws to be in place that would that would abolish

The holocaust that is abortion Of course, I want laws and i'm saying this as a historic pre -millennial

Okay, of course I want laws in place That are that would prohibit minors

From from deciding whether or not I identify as the opposite gender than I was born with that the lord

Crafted me with of course. I want laws to prohibit that Absolutely, I do however

That stuff does not I mean it does by god's common grace But apart from if all i'm doing is fighting for those laws to to To to take hold to prevent those things.

That's that's temporal That's good, and it's good. Don't get me wrong But if i'm not doing that according to the word of god

Using the gospel of god and of our lord. Jesus christ and here's the biggest thing that i'm seeing right now

And if I can't shelve my emotions And put them

If I can't bring that my emotions into subjection to what this word teaches that my attitude should be

I and everybody else hear me clearly if you cannot keep your emotions in check if you are

Blasting other believers on twitter because they're calling out joel webbin because they're calling out dale partridge

Because of x y and z if you cannot control yourself Sit down and shut up Yeah, period

I am so tired of the name of christ

And the beautiful words of of scripture being maligned

Because because we can't control ourselves Does it make me angry?

Do I feel some sort of emotion everybody knows I love john mccarthur I can't pull it down right now because it's tacked up against the wall

I have a picture of john and I right here that he signed for me Does it irritate me if somebody attacks him?

Yeah, but guess what? Let's keep going I I don't

I don't need not every fight is our fight brothers and sisters And if you can't engage in that that battle without being gentle kind gracious Reflecting the attitude of christ notice how jesus christ himself

The way he operated towards sinners And and his his his disciples the way he spoke to them

Was much different than speaking to false teachers You know, like let me give a prime example

You and I have talked about this offline and i'm gonna open up a can here. Okay? I am i'm gonna open a can

I personally I personally okay I am not a fan

I want to say this carefully. I don't know him. I've never met him personally, but based upon what

I have seen lately Dale partridge needs to step away from ministry own his sin

Seek counsel discipleship and maturity And then let the lord do whatever he's going to do there

Okay, but I haven't I haven't spoken into that I don't know him I don't know that situation

And and just because that is my opinion based upon what I read in scripture and based upon my experiences doesn't mean

I need to blow it up and blow it out and Blast him everywhere. Like I just man.

I know I said a lot right there. I'm gonna stop talking but but I mean, it's just I I was talking to chris honholtz today, man, he and I'm Chat like you do you and I do

You know and and it's interesting right you got this guy, I don't know this this oliver guy who wrote this song

I listen to this and that's something you and I Yeah, we're gonna talk about tonight. Yeah, right, right.

I mean, I I don't I've listened to song once um, am I a fan i'm a southern boy, right am

I a fan of You know a guy getting up there with a hollow body guitar And with the with the woods in the background and a raspy voice and just Singing some truth truth that we're seeing in our nation right now

Sure, but we are so stinking emotional That we latch on to it.

Oh, there's a song that says exactly what we as christians We latch on to that and we elevate this person and we don't know a thing about him, right?

like just Take a breath people And that's something i've i've not been the best at in the past but take a breath

Bring your emotions into subjection Under scripture first and foremost, and if you can't you don't need to be speaking about anything.

So i'm sorry Yeah, well, I mean the the next question is chris. Tell me how you really feel.

I know right? Oh, it's somebody uh, andrew graham comment to try that in a small town That's a good song i'll just say

Good one. Okay. Uh, so in in this is this is one of the things about uh,

About this song right because because you and I were when we were I approached you about coming on tonight, you know finding

I I said we can talk about this or we can talk about this Yeah, and one of the things was this song and christian nationalism now this song

When you listen to it there's There's profanity in it, right? Yeah There's profanity but what what we saw was a lot of those who are

And people on here know me as being in in the post mill camp the post mill theonomic camp

No Yeah, I know hard to believe. Um, because I hang out with such dis bees and and such but uh

They were taking the song and elevating it to the point that it was almost there it became their hymn

Right, it became it's become their battle cry And and people were calling this song out because of the profanity in it

Like why are you elevating this song that utilizes profanity? And and people were missing the point and I enter well,

I I I quote tweeted someone else today who who Posted this video on twitter that was normal everyday people

That was that was what she said who were not saying a word about his cursing

They resonated with the words And i'm going okay First of all, we don't get our cues from normal everyday people

That's not our cues Secondly how many of those normal everyday people how many of their uh native tongue is profanity

Right They now they resonate with the words. Sure. Hey, guess what?

I am a working class guy I work really hard for very little pay

Yes, I resonate with the words of this song very much. Oh, yeah

But at the same time I don't have to elevate it to the pedestal of a new anthem

Right. I understand it because I live it But i'm also not going to say promote it and say hey christians listen to this

This should be our battle cry No, no, it shouldn't christ in him crucified is your battle cry period end of discussion exactly

And then and then and then here here's the other part right so I I get the song right

I resonate same Same, you know and as musicians as well, man as musicians.

Yes Um, and and so when when I hear a lot of the things that he says right it it does hit me in the heart

Sure, because he is kind of formulating How a lot of people in this country feel?

You know Right betrayed by our government

And that's that's left and right, okay, it's not absolutely it's left and right and I've said

You know the difference between the democrats and republicans is democrats want to take all your money

Now the republicans want to do it slowly over six years. Okay, either way they both want your money.

That's hilarious. Okay So so I get the song I resonate with it But when did we stop caring about holiness?

Oh, bro When did we stop caring about the language? That we that that we use right

When did we stop caring about that? And and one of the things now now there and I don't know anything about this guy.

I'm sure he's a great guy I'm sure he's a really nice guy and especially the the fact that he's he's a working class guy same struggles

I'm sure he and I could pal around for a little bit, right? I mean he even opened that that first show he did after that song went viral reading psalm 37

Right, and and that's what i'm looking to get into um to kind of shift into because because after the criticism of the utilization of the language

People were sharing that and saying we'll see he's he's reading scripture. He's reading scripture and come to find out

That He's 30 days sober, which hey, congratulations Right, you know, that's that that's a feat in itself for anyone who who has battled with addiction

Um, but he's also a a new believer Right. He he's he's a new believer now

What we don't need to do Is skyrocket him to a pedestal right?

what we need to do is We need to disciple him.

And so my prayer for him is that He be in a a bible teaching church

With a god -fearing pastor Who will say hey

Let's sit down and go through some of these things Yeah, so let me address a couple things that you said just off the cuff.

Um So you know, um This is what

I was this is what I was thinking through today and I didn't really have much of an opportunity to sit down and kind of work out my thoughts I wanted to but um

This is what I mean, okay, like I you know For a conservative,

I mean look at the way the song just blew up for a conservative working class.

Um Whether whether you're not working class, you know, I I saw some I saw some dudes, uh, uh that are not working class that are just like this is a minute ahead all day and and this is right on and this is spot on and You know guys, uh, and and i'm like, okay right on.

Okay, good good for you but for the For the unbeliever that is their anthem

For the unbeliever To whom the lord has shown? Some grace grace to and restraining grace and that they are conservative in their politics that they

Um that that they may lean politically where align where where a believer may

Sure. Sure. I get that. I absolutely get that um for the believer, I think you can listen to a song like that and say

Uh number one from a from musicality standpoint right on um Number two from a message standpoint and the way

I mean use some discernment right right from a from a message standpoint Um, you know, you look at the way it blew up And that gives you a pulse of of where things are in our country politically right now

You know before the believer no, that's not that shouldn't that that should not be your battle cry your battle cry should be regardless of what happens regardless of of um

Whoever god sovereignly appoints as my leader Um, whether I like it or not, whether I voted for them or not my my command is to Is to be obedient to what the scriptures teach to go and to make disciples

Baptizing them in name of the father the son the holy spirit and teaching them to obey all that he has commanded understanding that the sovereignty of god ensures the success

Of you being obedient to that If you're striving after holiness And and also that the sovereignty of god ensures the success of the any evangelism that you're going to be engaged in That's your battle cry your battle cry are the scriptures your battle cry is that christ has won

That the victory is his and regardless of what transpires That nothing formed against you as his child as a part of his church

Will harm you romans 8 nothing nothing Therefore we operate from that place of victory we

Again, it goes back to in our attitude in the way that we engage the world in the way that we engage other believers and and so I you know

I think it's very you know With social media right information travels like that Right.

We knew what was happening in maui like that. Yep Whereas you know i'm

I was i'm just nostalgic in this way. Like I recently visited ground zero like 9 11

I think about how long it took us To understand and realize and the information to be disseminated as far as what was happening on 9 11 that doesn't happen anymore

Right, it happens like that. And so what happens is you have believers You have believers that are frustrated rightfully so you have believers that do have emotions rightfully so but they're not

Checking those emotions with scripture, right? And then so when something like this comes along Where this dude writes this this great sounding song.

It's catchy. It's got some solid words and it's like throw right on but then you listen to it and you're like, but That's not my battle cry christ is my battle cry um

So I think we just need to be we need to be careful not What you what you just said there where you know, since you know, when do we not care about holiness?

I I would say I'm gonna i'm gonna quote you okay, um

You know that uh, most of if not all of the problems, uh that we see in today's modern church stem from the charismatic chaotic movement

That is that turned into now a seeker oriented movement Um where you find churches like that are within 25 miles of where you and I are right now where They don't care if you're singing songs written by heretics

The gospel is not proclaimed and heralded from the pulpit. The word of god is not the not the buttress of those churches right, um

And and and so what happens? what ends up happening is you have a bunch of False assurance of of salvation you have a bunch of people who think that they're christians

Um, but they don't ultimately have that that eternal hope and so they can't go You know ecclesiastes 7 to 14

Whether the lord ordains the good and the bad doesn't matter. It's it's whatever he has ordained is right Yeah, look here

What you got on holtz is in is in the comments. Hola, senor. Hon holtz. I just was talking about you

I was sharing Conversation is we need yeah, we need hon holtz in here. Oh bro on the show

Y 'all y 'all want to see hon holtz go skirts go I think hon holtz has some thoughts on this topic

Well, I know he's been dealing with some ac issues at home today. So It depends on uh, so it just He's got a cold

And he's got a cold so but anyway, man, I just you know Like it's one thing

It's one thing again to appreciate it right and to Use some discernment and go man.

Yeah That that gives you that gives you you know pause and and lets you know where things are but for the believer, it's like You know, you gotta wait.

You gotta you gotta push pause and you gotta think well, hang on guys Like let's not elevate this guy too soon kanye hello um

You know and and and a whole host, you know, and I was thinking about that too the the whole kanye situation

Because on the surface it looked like whoa Something's happening with kanye.

And then when we look at who his pastor was A a master seminary graduate andrew, yeah, and but then we go

What happened? Kanye went off the rails, you know, here's something else too, man You know, I was talking about eddie penny right this dude.

That's whose uniform is behind this flag right here You know eddie, um eddie's got a pretty incredible testimony.

Um, I believe that the lord saved eddie um, but eddie is

Involved with some dudes. Yes. We're talking about the country song guy chris um

Eddie eddie's hooked up with some dudes from a theological standpoint. That's very charismatic and His I mean, he's a brand new believer he's

I love eddie. Don't get me wrong. Let me just say this like he's just had an incredible life as you can imagine as what he did and married a few times and kids and Uh, then the lord saved him

And you know, one of my prayers has been god I just wish that guy would just get in a solid church and there's another guy named sean ryan who does a big podcast.

Um, and I mean he's He's talking. I mean he recently professed faith in christ as well

Uh, so it's cool to see these guys coming to know the lord I just I just am praying so hard for them that they would get plugged into solid churches

And that they wouldn't take This newfound faith as they like to call it and use that as a platform right to sell merch and to join patreon and Everything else.

I mean, it's just Yeah, so yeah. Anyway, I know i'm going off on some rabbit trails here, but yeah, so there's a lot to talk about there is there is so Let's get into the to the main topic christian nationalism

Um now this is a Hot button topic it I mean in in the socials

It's huge huge It's huge. Okay. I mean it's so big so big right now so hot so hot.

Um Um, why is that well, where did this come from?

Why is it So huge and then why is there so much? drama

Right. There's so much drama attached to it With some people in social media.

Yeah Wow i'm loving some of the comments that i'm seeing right now,

I mean you gotta put some of those up I heard christian nationalism is just crt But Uh bond servant, let me uh, let me just say it like this, um

Depending on where you fall again definitions matter, right? It's just the other side of that coin yeah, and that's that's important too because Depending on who you talk to about christian nationalism.

It's going to mean different things, right? There's it's like baskin robbins. There's 52 different flavors of of christian national

Are there 52 flavors? Is that what their thing is? baskin robbins 30s,

I think 31 30 or whatever. I don't know. I don't remember there's multiple different baskin robbins even still around.

I don't think so Oh, okay but uh The only one

I knew about in kennesaw closed down years ago bear parkway. Yeah. No, no, no, uh, 41

Oh, oh, I mean it was over by where minchie's uh, by the crow. Oh, oh, that's right.

That's right Okay But uh, you know depending on who you ask you're going to get a different definition of christian nationalism, right?

So at the beginning of the show, I said Anthony silvestro, dr. Silvestro might join us a little later

Um, I you know, I invited him on I said, hey, we're going to be talking about this I know you probably got some thoughts about this and so he called me today and we talked a little bit and he was like Now, what do you mean when you say christian?

I just want to make sure You know and so so we talked about it but When so, so let me ask you first chris before I get into mine

When when we look at the discussion of christian nationalism, what is it that you're seeing?

As the main I guess flavor of christian nationalism and why is it a problem?

uh let me uh Let me caveat my answer with this

I have not seen at all okay, this is just the When I log in then i'm seeing these conversations happen the flavor

Of christian only one or two people who probably hold the same flavor

Yeah, I mean it's it's the it's the the christian nationalism that says

Uh The lord yeah darren's did what's up brother Dude, I love that guy.

By the way. Hold on. He's coming to georgia He is let me interject here if I need everyone to keep darren in your prayers big time

There he's having uh, he hit his head when he was here in atlanta for the um for the osa conference

He hit his head pretty bad and he's he's feeling some some repercussions of that And so there's treatment that he's trying to get that he's coming actually to atlanta to receive so if you guys could be in prayer for darren and Family, and I think

I now I didn't square this with andrew to uh to mention this or anything Uh, but I think darren might be setting up a gifts and go.

Um In order to help fund some of the treatment Yeah, so when that's not cheap, yeah, it's not cheap.

So darren, um, if you get me that information i'll try to get it For sure, bro.

Me too Me too, bro. Um, yeah, so I mean the the uh, the flavor that i've seen um

And that uh, and i'm like wow um is the flavor of of christian nationalism that says

Let me just give you an example Uh, the lord gave my kids to me

Instead of my pagan neighbor So he's definitely going to save them The flavor of christian nationalism that says we've got to follow stuff like the seven mountain mandate um and having a conference

Around something like that I don't know that I would say seven mountain mandate because I think

The seven mountain mandate but I would say you can kind of see england it's like okay How do you not hold to the seven?

Yeah, because because you're you are talking about Kind of hitting a lot of these things in the political sphere, right?

Um, are you trying to take over politics, right? It's I mean, it's it's it's the flavor right,

I mean, it's it's the it's that flavor of christian nationalism that is full preterist it's

Yeah, I and and it's it's Another example would would be the you know, the no women shouldn't study theology

Oh, yeah women shouldn't study theology I mean it's okay if they want to talk about theology so they can apply that to being a better wife and a better mom and But they shouldn't study theology.

It's they shouldn't read r .c. Sproul Right. No, they shouldn't read r .c. Sproul or john macarthur or lloyd jones or anybody like that?

So, um, so it's it's it's that kind of christian nationalism and the reason The reason that it's wrong is because it is either it's it's

Usually not always it's usually taking a a concept from somewhere in scripture

And running so far right with it that we're reading into what it doesn't say

Um an example and I don't i've got my bible here, but I would need to open it and look for it but in titus,

I believe it is when when paul is giving the uh examples of of Women and what women are supposed to do teach the things that are in accordance to sound doctrine

Is how that that chapter starts? Before it gets into what older women should teach younger women older men should teach younger men, etc

So on and so forth teach the things that are good. Well, what is good? We've got to go back to verse one of that chapter sound doctrine so it's it's the flavor of christian nationalism that uh, that that is

Implying and enacting extra biblical In that way where they're just they're just the text does not say that the text does not say that women should not study theology

The text, you know scripture nowhere in scripture. Can you defend? That because the lord chose to sovereignly give you your kids

Instead of your kids to your neighbor that he is 110 Absolutely going to save them right now.

Let me caveat that statement with this one That doesn't mean that you should not operate like he will right

In how you lead your family in in in how you elevate the scriptures And how you elevate the the lord is central in your home um

But it's it's stuff like that, man. Yeah, what did han hall say? He said they tried to make a distinction in that women can teach theology to other women within the confines of titus 2

They can learn all kinds of theology from biblically qualified men only now again, like not again, but this is one of those things man where i'm like What Why are we why are some people so black and white on some of this stuff?

There are things in scripture that are black and white, right? I wholeheartedly believe

In the church in the local church That it should be the elders that are over Whether it's sunday school or or life groups or whatever you want to call them

That the con and you and I have experienced this right that the content that is that is uh given in those times is to be

Overseen it has to be overseen by the elders And if at all possible, it should be elder led

But that doesn't mean that women should not get together and discuss Theology right read sproul read macarthur read the puritans.

That's not what that means so Yeah, okay Yeah I could keep going but i'm gonna shut up.

Yeah. Yeah, no and uh One of the things that I have seen on especially on on twitter is the vilification of some people

Who may push back On secondary and tertiary issues i'm talking

When you disagree with me And you're the nail i'm the hammer and i'm just going to town

Here's one Have you noticed? That if you disagree

With with someone in that camping crowd That you are labeled A feminist and or a feminine feminine.

Yeah That has exploded over the last couple of weeks. Yes To which to which my response

I have refrained as much as I have wanted to I have refrained because i'm like That advice that I gave when

I jumped on like unless you can keep your emotions in check. Shut up I I say that to myself all the time

But I want to ask the question of these of believers professing believers, let me

Calling other believers effeminate i'm like Come here

Do you know what that means? Biblically, do you understand that when you call another believer effeminate?

biblically Malacost. Yeah, you that that is a homosexual term

The past and you are thank you. Yep, you are the passive partner in a homosexual relationship

You have called another believer Effeminate that's what you're saying.

That's because they disagree with you on holds again. They they don't care

Yep, that's right, which and This blows my mind, right?

So so a couple things one i've seen this from Ladies on twitter

Who who are a part of the ultra patriarchy? um

You know movement And they're usually correcting men which goes against the anyway

Exactly right now. Hey, i'm for biblical patriarchy. I'm for it all for my wife.

She's all for it Okay. Um But You're on social media engaging in theological

Arguments with other men who are not your husband and and it's like And you're emotional about it and you're emotional in a way

Yes, people like you can't tell tone. Oh, yes, you can And it's like I don't think you believe what you think you believe

Because if that were true, you wouldn't be engaging in this way. You wouldn't be doing these things.

Yep So so that's that's kind of the first thing I see The second thing that I see is people who engage in this

Right, whether it be we need to we need to Implement god's law.

Hey, look i'm all i'm all for if bills are introduced Right, like you talked about abolition bills

Um, i'm I gotta say i'm not even necessarily against fornication bills.

I'm not against Homosexuality bills i'm not against those things right if they are introduced to be voted on I will vote for them right if they come up on a ballot

I will vote for them because I will go that is a biblical bill That I can get behind.

Mm -hmm but when we see people

In their behavior online I'm wondering where is christ

Because I see them promote all of these things over and over and over again But I never see them elevate christ and especially those who call themselves pastors

I never see them elevate. I never see them say Hey I want a christian nation

Because I want Souls to be saved that is

I never see them say that in fact if I okay, so I was gonna say

I want everybody to do this, but I don't because You'll end up getting into wars with people but Just ask the question of people be like, okay, so you want to see you want to see a christian nation preach the gospel

And watch the lord convert And and as he has promised to do his elect

And then just say that watch how many people will clap back at you who profess to be christians

Well, not only that but who profess to be reformed Well, bro, right and all they've done is is display a a new group of rhinos reformed in name only

I I think this is just another sect of the young wrestles and reform to be honest. Yeah, I I could see that as well and it's

It's ridiculous man, it's it's ridiculous and and it's so funny man when you notice It doesn't surprise me when you see people who

The way they behave online the way that they behave publicly um You know, some people don't have a problem with you know

Hey two pastors three pastors and a beer. Let's watch that video on youtube And then it doesn't surprise me that someone would like oliver's song right but because that that just is right, it just goes along in in the wheelhouse and so So They're also the same ones that make justification for it's okay for me to use foul language

Right. I mean scoob along right paul did it? Okay. No He didn't

Check out mike riccardi's, uh explanation of that word Okay, but uh, but also what

I see in that is people will also take descriptive texts And try to use them as prescriptive texts in justification for using foul language.

It's the same thing charismatics do right It's the same thing. It's just applied to a different subject and topic brothers and sisters

Drew Explain for us the difference between descriptive and prescriptive and how should we approach both in scripture?

Well descriptive just tells us what's going on correct describing something prescriptive texts

Uh can also be can also be imperatives, but they're they're things that are prescribed

They're issued for you to do correct for you to live out now That can be a command right an imperative imperatives are commands do this um, but it's it's laying out something for you to accomplish something for you to do now, let's say a a a text that would be prescriptive and an imperative would be

I don't know tame your tongue Self -control, especially among a pastor, right?

The pastor is to be self -controlled Yep, let's go

I mean You don't have to look very far on twitter to see pastors who are not self -controlled

Right. Well That's been my biggest frustration

Is the the mockery the the immaturity the the deceptiveness

Uh that you're seeing from from people, um And and it's just it's got to stop it

It does and and that's what i'm saying. Oh, and here's something else too if I see another person using a parable

As defense For some social cause I have not seen this.

Oh my gosh, whether it I mean i've seen supposedly professing reformed christians using parables which parables, um

Two things parables were a judgment of the lord number one number two every parable that our lord taught has

One theme the kingdom salvation Are you sure it's not the kingdom?

salvation and same same difference it just Salvation in the building of the kingdom.

There we go. How about we say it like that? so it's Come on you guys

Yeah now There is a flavor of christian nationalism that I would say i'm for And i'm for it, obviously because you know

I believe it, right and that is Our goal shouldn't be to try to overtake government um

Our goal should be first to take god's law And implement it in ourselves

Self -governance is where it begins We implement god's law

In ourself because we love god's law because we love god Right if the lord has saved you he is

Here's a litmus test. Do you love the law of god? The law of yahweh is perfect. Psalm 19 7

The law of yahweh is perfect. Do you desire that same chapter in psalm 19? Do you desire it more than gold much more than fine gold?

um You you should want to obey god's law because you love god's law. Sorry, go ahead

Yeah, so it first begins with self -governance Secondly, it moves to the family

I govern my family According to those laws, right? So I have self family the family sphere

Then it goes into the church the local church church governance Now the church

And I know you say this a lot But Daryl, harrison has said this a lot

And john mccarthur has said this a lot. I know what you're gonna say So it's almost like you know that in the office, right the the wayne gretzky quote

Chris quoted daryl who quoted john. Yeah This is a quote from john mccarthur daryl harrison chris huff.

Okay it is and really it's going to be a paraphrase because I can't think of the exact quote, but it's

We are not to go out and transform societies Right our our job is not to go and transform societies jesus came to save sinners not society

There you go came to save sinners not societies Now I understand

The sentiment of what's being said And so so i'm going to i'm going to try to explain it chris.

You correct me if I get wrong It's the it's that we're not to go out

For the purpose of saying i'm going to turn cartersville into the christian cartersville

Right. I'm not going to just go with the intent to turn cartersville into uh christian city but What I do because of where the gospel first begins in in me

And then the application of the gospel and god's law First in me then in my family from the church

There should be an effect from the local church that resonates with the community so that As we go out from the local church

And we do life we proclaim the gospel to those whom we meet and the community

Comes to christ then the community is transformed as a result

Of the gospel having effect in our life and going forth from the local church.

Let's push pause for a second. Okay? okay, so Starts with self right the lord saves you um by his miraculous efficacious work through the completed works of the lord jesus christ

Um on the cross for our sin lived the life that we could only hope no not even hope to live um and Died in our place for our sins rose three days defeated the last enemy which is death

And the lord through the power of the holy spirit through the proclamation of the gospel has as efficaciously Applied that work to our lives replacing our heart of stone with the heart of flesh giving us faith

Giving us hope and assurance eternally Understanding that we like I said earlier that we that that is a victory that has been won

The last victory is the victory over death um, and and and the

When the lord looks when god looks at us when the father looks at us. He sees his son He sees the works of his son as we are covered uh in in that and so with that new heart comes a new love and new desires to honor the law of god to Understand that we've been sanctified positionally

But now the lord through the working of his word and the spirit in our lives is going to prune and chisel away at our flesh

And prune and chisel away at us to conform us more and more into his image. And so we love his law

We love his word. We operate our lives everything we think say and do Should be driven by the word of god

And then moves to that next sphere Okay, so but let me let me say this that this next sphere of influence outside of you personally

Is going to involve other people And yes, you are absolutely correct in that What has happened in us is going to resonate with those around us

But we have to understand that it could resonate in a couple ways To where the lord could be using that work in us

As we proclaim that gospel the the saving the good news we as we

Proclaim the whole counsel of god the good news the bad news and the good news It is going to resonate with people

It absolutely is and as you desire to live your life according to the word of god It is going to resonate with people but there's a chance there is a chance and we have to accept this and understand this

That that resonation could be negative You know, it's interesting that you say that because I was thinking about this earlier today and I was

I was I was going to mention it to some to some people but I didn't and it's

Uh, steve lawson has said That the same gospel that softens the soil hardens right so when you so In this we'll just take the christian nationalists right in their goal to go out and christianize societies

Or we'll just say we'll say the nation Can the same gospel that can soften the clay

Can it also if the goal is societies Can it also turn whole societies into clay?

Yep, right Yeah And and that's my point is you know, I gotta put this up.

I saw that I saw that she's like what? Yeah, um, that's why you haven't been paying attention girl because i've already heard one i'm on number three right now

So I have I got that one Yeah, but that one's empty.

It is empty. So Anyway, so no and and that's and that's exactly what i'm saying is For the christian nationalists.

They're like no we are going to christianize this nation And and it's almost like they want to avoid suffering

Sometimes they want to avoid that negative resonation Well, guess what? You can't

Not on this side that will not happen on this side of eternity It doesn't mean you shouldn't try it doesn't mean you shouldn't keep proclaiming the gospel regardless of what opposition you face

And you have to you have to be at peace with that As a believer understanding that the results are not up to you so you may have people that are like that the lord is drawing them in and softening them and working on their hearts and they see that they're like Man, can you tell me a little bit more about what's going on with you and your life and and who's jesus?

And then you're gonna have people like what happened to me When the lord saved me 18 years old

And i'm talking about wanting to be baptized. Well that hacked my mom off because I was baptized We were lutheran.

I was baptized as a baby and she thought I was just saying that was null and void and i'm like And i'm trying to explain to her the purpose of believers baptism

You know, she also was for abortion That was an awkward conversation and it did it hardened and there was some of this that happened like we have to understand something brothers and sisters that that the world the worldly systems and and Those who are apart from christ they hate the law of god

They hate it Do you really think apart from the? salvific efficacious work of the lord jesus christ that you are that you're just Gonna gonna take somebody who hates god's law vehemently violently viscerally

And and you're not gonna have any opposition right, I mean Now the lord may show grace.

I mean there are plenty of non -believers out there who do hold to certain aspects of god's law But but it's not because they love it

That's a grace of god um So I just I just wanted to put a pin in what you're saying

Right there just because yes, it's going to resonate with your family and then yes, it's going to resonate at your job

Lord willing and yes that wherever you go the gym, uh school systems, um fill in the blank

I mean conversations that you have with image bearers each and every day in your circle of influence

Um, so but just I mean, yes, it should resonate with them and it may soften them or it may harden them. So yeah

Yeah, exactly Um So so all of those things will

At least our our prayer is will Have an effect a positive correct.

Absolutely on our community right, but what we're not saying is uh

We need like I need to go out and run for mayor of my town and then issue ordinances

That says okay now everyone must go to church everyone uh must be Yeah, go for it you try that let me know how that works out for you

Yeah, but but another thing that's interesting is when when we look at the great commission, right? now

I would say um I would say that uh

As a as a post -millennialist That god has given the nations to christ, right?

So so jesus Is lord over all nations

He's lord now. It's not whether they eventually come to accept him as lord. He's lord now

He's ruling and reigning now over every single nation now, I also believe that The nations will be discipled

Where I would disagree with some of these christian nationalists is how we go about doing that Because it doesn't go from top down It goes from bottom out

The the gospel Starting with me going out into everyone whom

I see right And it spreads. Does that make sense? Am I am

I saying that? Okay Just wanted to make sure I would You should go and listen to uh, james coates's uh

Series that he did at grace life on the kingdom Yeah, because it's probably super dispy pre -mill.

Is that why? It is very biblical By the by the way bond servant for jesus asked what fresca tastes like Tastes like dispensational tears.

It's a bit salty You stupid

But uh, I love you But so do I believe the nations will be discipled

Yeah, I do But I believe we have to go about it the right way, right? I do believe god has given the nations to christ because the because when we look at the great commission

We have to ask will the nations be discipled? Will they well if christ has all authority in heaven on earth and the command is to go forth and uh,

And and disciple the nations well, will they Come on, chris, will they?

Go, I mean, you know i'm going to disagree with you. Um, it's not The nations won't be discipled no there will be people from every tribe tongue every tribe nation and tongue.

Absolutely but um the nations themselves, uh apart from the

Um Again, i'm going to go back to apart from the salvific efficacious regenerative work of hearts, right?

Um, That will influence right? Yes, but As far as the nation's being discipled,

I think in the ways that you are thinking No, I I would actually I I would agree.

I would agree that when it's speaking of people from every tribe tongue and nation um

Yeah, I would I would agree but Um now when I look at The great commission and the christian nationalists

Okay, it's almost like we need to christianize america But what about the other nations

What about the world You're focusing on one what about the other here's another thing, okay

Here's another thing. Let's bring another macarthur sermon into this Because I think we've touched on a couple already

Let's bring another one in When we look at the sins of romans 1 Okay, america has gone through all of those sins.

Oh, yeah And what the thing about romans 1 is when you get to those points

That's because god has already turned you over So now chris

Is america already turned over? To those sins as judgment from god.

Yes And what is the only way to come back from that? Uh the lord stepping in The lord stepping in period being are being faithful with the gospel

Right not arguing over I mean, I know we kind of do it here jokingly but not arguing over eschatology

We don't argue over it we have we have we have fun fun conversations Yeah, but not arguing over eschatology not even arguing over christian nationalism but elevating christ

Growing in holiness and christlikeness So that so that others may come to know christ and here's that.

Yeah Here's the other thing when you look at social media and the way some of these pastors behave on social media

Against other brothers, like you just said calling them effeminate when non -believers like someone like james lindsey who does who's an atheist who works with Uh for some reason christian ministries.

I don't know why they partner with him when he looks at the bickering of over stupid stuff of believers

Can they say oh they love christ? Absolutely not, you know why because christ is not even elevated in any of those conversations

He's not he's not honored Not only is his name not elevated and spoken but I mean the way that I know

I've already said it a couple times so I won't belabor the point But the way they operate um and The optics of that situation and of the way they operate

Show that I mean if you're just going on the optics of how they operate on social media, you just kind of go

I have to go Sincerely You proclaim to be a little christ.

How important is christ to you? How important is honoring christ how important is is operating with the character of christ?

important to you what Here's the here Okay so one of the things that I heard, uh recently is the group before the individual

Right if what you're doing If what you're doing doesn't elevate the group Don't do it at any at any given point

So taking that and that's a business principle so but but let's let's let's put a pin in that for a second and say this that If you're a believer in the lord, jesus christ

Do you understand that you represent him first and foremost and then you represent his church second? So if how you're operating how you're what you're thinking what you're saying and what you're doing does not elevate christ

Doesn't glorify christ stop Stop if if you can't if you're gonna write a tweet

An x or whatever it is Like if you're gonna post something on there Like does this elevate christ and does this show that the lord that The character of christ romans 8 29 being conformed more and more into the image of his son like if that's

Not the case then stop Yeah, now there was there was a question up here uh from tracy

A good one. What about christian politicians? Yeah, this is a a really good question so i'm all for If there is a politician

That We can look at we can we can examine biblically That that we would say checks all checks all the the boxes, right?

um the problem is I don't think there are well, let hold on.

Let me rephrase that I think uh out in oklahoma I think dusty deavers is actually running for state senate um bro

Yeah, yeah, uh Dusty is is hardcore Uh abolitionist.

I mean he is he's one of the leading guys in the abolitionist movement Um that's responsible for introducing bills.

Um for abolition so Now are there christian politicians i'm all for if you're a christian

And you feel that you are called to serve on that in that arena

Right in in the area of politics If you can do it without being corrupted

You know, that's gonna be a really hard thing You know, yeah go for it it's

I mean if you're walking with the lord, you know Everybody always delight yourself in the lord will give you the desires of your heart, right?

That verse is taken out of context a ton, but if you're walking with the lord um and You just walk in with the lord seeking and desiring after holiness sanctification

And that's that's what you want to do or chosen to do for a career And the lord puts that opportunity in front of you and you want to do it go for it

Just make sure you do colossians 3 17, right and whatever you do Whether in word or indeed do it all in the name of the lord

Jesus giving thanks to god the father through him Whatever you do So if that's what you want to do go for it, but understand the uphill battle that you are going to be

It doesn't matter whether you're left right in the middle. That doesn't matter where you fall. I mean it better not be left But I mean you can you cannot consistently be left and be a christian

Sorry But I mean when we look at the parties, I mean left and right neither one of them are conservative enough

Uh, neither one of them would hold to biblical standards I mean just even on the case of abortion alone

You see people that will always say we want to get rid of abortion, but then they always compromise

Always they don't hold to that conviction that they say they have about it um, but If there were a christian politician, you know running for president or my local

Uh local offices or things like that and I could I could actually examine them talk to them and You know, sure vote for them

Uh, I think it would be I think it would actually be a duty to vote for them. But um

Yeah, there's a uh, let me see there was another comment here

From kathy lindsey speaking of james lindsey knows the ins and outs of crt marxism and etc

So i'm assuming um when you're asked when I said, you know, why are christian ministries partnering with him

That uh, you said this You know, that is a lot that that is the argument. Well, james james lindsey knows a lot of this stuff he does

There's also a lot of Christians who knew this stuff already That saw it coming down the pipe.

I mean vody bachem spoke on this in terms of Ethnic gnosticism

I think in oh my goodness the 2019 No, I think no it was before that.

Was it really he was on he was on the dividing line years before that Uh, it might have been like 2012 2010 20.

Oh wow like that like it was a while ago Vody bachem was talking about it. He was seeing it james white was seeing it andrew, uh and anthony

So we're talking about it. Yeah Both Daryl and virgil daryl y 'all i've seen daryl's library

Trust me if y 'all we do not need to go to outside Unbelievers and partner with them to understand the the ins and the outs of socialism marxism, etc.

So on so crt Intersectionality, etc. So on and so forth you the lord has sovereignly placed people for years

In our camp who we can go to and be trusted and even if he didn't pick up a book boys and girls

Yeah straight up like i'm Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's no there's no reason to partner with unbelievers

I mean scripture is clear for what fellowship does light have with darkness I mean evangelize them

I mean and if you want to spend time with them Outside of an influence kind of you know circle of influence kind of thing then yeah sure go for it but partnering with them um platforming them careful

Yeah, so hold on. There's another comment, but lindsey was fired. Uh, i'm guessing years ago and facing it in the university

That's true. So so I know what you're talking about. So I don't think I don't think it was him that was fired

I think it was his buddy Uh Pete Bogosian something like that Um, they actually did uh, they wrote some of these papers

Uh that were in that ended up in scholarly journals that were using crt language

Uh to kind of be right back. I gotta take something to my wife real quick. She needs something I'll be right back Yeah, you do you bro?

Um, they were exposing it in Yeah, bogosian. Yeah, peter bogosian. Yeah Uh, they were exposing exposing it in the universities then there was a uh,

I think it was up in washington state kind of the experiment that was going on um with Utilizing crt in one of the community colleges there and it it absolutely failed it backfired uh it it

It was an an awful thing and one of the one of the professors there was actually called a racist and he was super progressive liberal uh, it yeah, but Yeah, but the thing is, you know, we don't we still don't need to partner with uh atheists with unbelievers

We don't need to invite them to our conferences. We don't need to Uh have them on our podcasts and and get their takes on things because we already we have people within the christian camp

That already know these things that have been seeing these things that have been studying these things I mean we can read the same books

We understand history and politics and other forms of government like socialism marxism all the same

Uh, so there's there's absolutely no need to partner with unbelievers Han holds here says it's one thing to read

And uh resource their material to help understand the topic but to partner promote and invite to your conferences that should not

Happen that's absolutely right And welcome back to the show chris huff ladies and gentlemen

Now, hold on. I see kofi put a hot take in here and I got because it's real kofi. I got kofi.

What's up, dude? Hot take bro. He even tells us hot take american christians are pragmatist

American christians are pragmatist first, you know, so if it works, we'll ignore the issues Lindsay speaks to issues.

We think are important. So we turn a blind eye mic drop That's very true

And I don't really get it but no one asked my opinion so I keep my Kofi I like your radical views in your hot takes brother.

No, but he's absolutely right american christians are pragmatists And and and it's so funny how those same

The same brothers i'm going to be gracious here and say those same brothers Joel webb and dale partridge, right the extreme the the extreme

Patriarchy folks the extreme christian nationalist folks the steven wolf's even They're the same people who wouldn't say well, we're not going to play bethel.

We're not going to play hillsong We're going to sing psalms because we want to be regulative Same with folks following jordan peterson.

Exactly. Yep. Yep Yep Absolutely. Absolutely um, you know, it's

I mean I love the dudes over at gbrs, but i'm not going to partner with them on something

And do the guy to do like do something like that because they're not believers Right. I love the guys.

They're a lot of fun and i've learned a lot from them just from a Practical temporal sense. Yeah, they're not allowed to have ads on matter of theology.

No, no, they won't So So, but yeah, I mean the same people who are say we want to be regulative principle people of worship

Well that applies not just to what you do on the lord's day that applies to what you do each and every day

That's right exactly Yeah, that's you know, and where does this pragmatism come from man

It comes from all the wolves fleece in the flock Right american christianity is a joke

For the most part, yes, sir. Hold on d just keeps going or even ben shapiro Yeah, if you're gonna go on ben shapiro's show take

I mean learn from vodie and learn from john Preach the gospel preach the gospel.

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So there are a couple of comments Yeah, maybe maybe one day your library will go into an adult library and actual bookshelves.

Yeah uh, okay, which one uh Well, somebody somebody uh, d uh d otero said, uh, also what about prager?

Did you handle that while I was gone? No She said, uh, wait Shall I go on?

Why am I not seeing this? I don't know. It was at 9 58 p .m. According to my little screen here anyway, um

Yeah, dennis prager. Yeah, okay. Oh, oh right because of uh,

He does have some weird views on uh porn that should absolutely be he oh here because of those views he should be rejected

Yes, he but isn't he jewish? Uh, I think so, but there's there's literally like that's one of the things it's like well, you know

Like these guys like ben shapiro or not ben. Shapiro. That's a bad example I'm, not comparing prager to shapiro in any way shape or form

But prager for example, um, no you don't there is nothing

Everything we need All of life Is right here in the bible

We do not need It's like steve lawson says okay that look the bible is more up to date than yesterday's newspaper or tomorrow's newspaper

Or however, he says it. How does it say drew? Do you know why he says it? The bible's more up to date than Yeah, so yeah the point is

This is the living and active word of god. This is the one that that that is the double -edged sword that um separates the bone from the marrow, uh,

Judging and and and bringing into account the intentions of the heart Like we don't need outside sources to understand what's happening in the world around us.

We just have we have scripture That's not saying don't listen to people if you don't if you want to but then you get people like prager who

His views on pornography and child pornography No, yeah, and d d d said again.

She said prager can constantly quotes. Oh on his facebook page. There was a video

There there was a video Of of him with a bible in front of him talking about how looking at pornography is not wrong

It's not a sin And and then he had some comments that i'm not going to repeat about child pornography with the bible open in front of him

I did not hear those but I did hear his comments about pornography, but I did not hear those

Wow, yeah, I mean it's amazing what we fall for. Yeah, right. I mean even just just The american church in general.

It's like oh, well someone calls themselves christian well, who are we to say that they're not right we just We're not going to judge them we're just gonna we're just gonna believe that they are

They went to they went to youth camp they threw their pine cone in the fire, okay I believe that they are.

All right, I believe Yeah, yeah Yeah, somebody asked kt asked if this is a flag on a hat back here.

Yes That's a very obnoxious embroidered with over 24 000 stitches on a trucker hat

From the boys at gbrs group. These are sold out right now. Otherwise, I would Give drew the link to post it

So, but uh, so we do have have explain yeah explain regulative now, this is something you and I Uh the hours we have spent talking about the differences between regulative and normative principles

We're in anthony time by the way We are in anthony time, that's okay. That is okay. Send it and We have

We can go all night if we want. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Jason cave gold fringe. Yes, sir.

I know what you mean Dude, yeah, so we drew and I throughout the years bro

I I can't even tell you the number of hours you and I have spent Talking about this studying this and podcasting on this topic

Mm -hmm So um, let's boil it down this way

I'll use I'll use vody bachem's explanation Uh, this is just a very simple because I I need it way of explaining the difference between regulative principle

And normative principle, okay So as our vody explains it, okay and you can go find this message by the way in the 2019 truth matters conference at grace community churches when he gave this message

And he said the difference between regulative and normative is this here's an example, okay Normative principle would be like, okay.

It's my wife and I it's our anniversary Okay, I really like watches

I like watches So i'm gonna get her and I love my wife and I love my wife

I'm gonna get her the nicest watch I can find Because I love watches and I love my wife

Regulative principle would be and i'm going to use vody's words here because they're just genius. He goes Regulative principle would say

I needed to get a degree in my wife ology and I need to study her listen to her know exactly what she wants and likes and needs

And that's what i'm going to get for her so So another easy way to explain it is would be regulative is we're regulated

By exactly what is in the scriptures? Normative Says well, the bible's not against this and I like to do it

So we're going to do it. It works pragmatism. It works and it's not the bible says don't

Doesn't say don't do it. So we're going to do it Right, yeah anything you'd add to that Yeah, I mean,

I would just say that that's usually where how I lead off with it is

Regulative we are regulated By what scripture says we don't go beyond what scripture says we don't add to what scripture says right normative

If it's not in scripture, therefore we can do it or therefore it's right right, and so now the problem is people would

Who would hold to the normative principle They would say that well I mean, it's not in scripture.

So it so how can it be wrong? Scripture doesn't speak against it it does

If you look at nadab and abihu It's the prime example Because nadab and abihu when they offered strange fire

God didn't say they couldn't offer that fire. Yeah They just had a regulated a specific fire that god told them to offer and they didn't do it

So it wasn't that the fire they offered was prohibited. It just wasn't what god required

So they offered strange fire that god had not not They offered not the fire that god required and they died correct.

So the normative principle will lead you to death Is what you gain from that? Okay That's what a christian nationalist would say

Bro that needs to be a new segment What a christian nationalist would say

Nice, nice. That's awesome I like that Oh, man.

Yeah, so that is that that's the normative and the regulative principle And what we see in churches today is a lot of churches want to be normative and they want to be normative because They can make the argument.

Well Scripture doesn't speak against this The people like it.

It's bringing more people in We can continue doing it But you're not honoring god in that way and I think there are levels too, right you've got the the folks that hold to the normative principle of worship who

They they truly do love the lord, um Um They they do

I would say they just Well, I would say some I would say That there are those they they do truly love the lord

But some of the normative things that they're following are more tradition

Than they are prescribed So there's just a habit of doing it in the church, right, you know things like altar calls, right, right, right

They're not Necessarily sinful When we understand the origins of it we go.

Well, it can be problematic But it's not necessarily sinful to do an altar call it's not necessarily against scripture but most people follow it because and they like it because It's a tradition that they've grown up with and so to not have it would be uncomfortable

So so they kind of they latch on to things like that Right, right, but but so that's one level right

And then the other level is like an andy stanley you know to where it's in the Andy stanley does not believe um in practice

I mean or or in word. I mean in word or indeed that uh, That the scriptures are sufficient and that the holy spirit is able to save Uh when the word is heralded um, you know, there are

Tons of churches that think that take normative to an extreme We have to entertain and if we don't entertain people won't show up and Well, the church is not for people we benefit but the church is for the lord.

It's for christ That's right That's it All right. Well Wait, wait, wait something han holt said that I want you to grab

That I wholeheartedly agree with He says, uh, he said can I just say one thing?

Okay. I got it Can we put to death the idiotic term baby christian?

Yes Bro I'm all for that I'm all for it because oh that does irk me when

I hear that because You never see that term in christian in in scripture.

You never see paul going Well, I was a baby christian man, like give me some leeway like no paul got saved he went and preached

Which he probably shouldn't have done But then he went back to the elders and then he would he learned from them and became examined and then he got sent out

To go to go plant churches But I think I think where people are getting it from is first corinthians three

I gave you milk to drink not solid food for you were not able to receive it Indeed, even now you are still not able um you know, but That doesn't mean they're baby christians.

That means they're being disobedient Yes, remember the first corinthians is a rebuke to the church in corinth um on multiple levels so Uh, so yeah,

I I agree buddy Get rid of that thing and The the other thing that irks me

Is people going looking at someone who's like five or six years professing christian and going

They're still growing They just they they're just they're growing. It's like well, what have you been doing for five years, dude?

Well, don't use it as an as an excuse. Yeah, it's it's justifying behavior Yeah, that's that's all

That's all it is like I mean It's like oh they're still well we all are like sanctificate your progressive sanctification only ends

When either the lord himself returns or calls you home That's when that stops so It's always a process.

I mean, oh, yeah, he's just a baby christian. No You are a christ follower be obedient.

Yeah, he's just I hear that all the time. Oh, he's he's still growing He's still growing but like who ain't

Who ain't still growing i'm not where I was but i'm not where I want to be But i'm also not sitting on my hands.

Oh that runs in that vody bottom click or a clip when he's like um

Uh, I haven't I'll have to find it. It's um, our brother jacob arthur who uh had a podcast on the bar network

Um, it was in his intro when vody was talking about, you know, i'm not who I want to be but hallelujah

I'm not who I was like vodis and tears um Proclaiming the gospel at that at that point.

So yeah Yeah All right. Well, dude, we need to get out of here. But before we get out of here.

Um What I want you to do Is I want you to give the gospel

But I also want you to give the gospel in the context of what we've been discussing tonight

Oh, man, ah good luck don't need luck, bro

Um Well, let me start out by saying this that um apart from christ any

Good morals you think you have? Is just as damning as if you reject god altogether apart from christ, um

Um moralism humanism moralistic therapeutic deism dams just as much as Um as as rejecting god altogether um

Apart from the salvific work of the lord. Jesus christ for the forgiveness of sins you and I have no hope period um, we are

Sinners by nature we were conceived in sin the bible tells us We sin because we are sinners

We are born with hearts of stone We are born enemies of god we are by nature children of his wrath because of our nature

But thank god Thank god that he did not leave us there and does not leave us there for those to whom he has elected to save To those to whom he has said you are mine.

He has said I will adopt you He sent his son Born of a virgin

Living a life that that that honors the law of god in every way in every jot with every tittle he

Lived the life that we should have lived but were unable to because of our sin And then he died on the cross a sinner's death a criminal's death

That we deserved because we have transgressed the law of god in every way But didn't stay there three days later god raised him from the grave defeating that last enemy which is death

And to those to whom he saves he replaces our heart of stone with a heart of flesh and applies that work

Of the lord jesus christ for the forgiveness of sins to us It isn't just that that our sins are forgiven

It's now that the the righteous life of christ has been imputed unto us as if we lived it, but we did not

So to anyone in the sound of my voice listening to this apart from christ when you see where our nation is going when you see

What happens in the world around us with laws being passed that that give credence to abortion that give give support to to to trans -activist and and and Minors and children being able to have these surgeries and everything else when you see all of that when you see the the the dysfunction and All of the nonsense happening around us.

It just seems like there is no hope well apart from christ. There is no hope So my my plea to you

If you're listening to my voice is repent and turn to the lord Lord confess jesus christ as lord

Fall on your knees fall on your face. Beg him to forgive you And understand that if he has

That you have all hope That nothing absolutely nothing Will come against you

Because nothing comes against him So I would beg you today. I would earnestly beg you to repent and turn to christ

No longer living for yourself, but living a life of holiness Because you love god understanding what he has done for you in your place

And that he loved you first Nice.

Amen Now everyone. I know there's no such thing as luck. Okay, I I i'm reading the comment and i'm going

No, there's no such thing as luck. Okay Oh, dude, like you put me on the spot too because I was like, oh in the context of christian that I mean, dude, there's

How long you got? Right. So so hon hold said oh sure just throw him out there

Well now okay, so usually when i'm hosting I do try to make a point that it's me who gives the

Presentation I always try to make that happen but I figured this time I would throw chris out there and let him do it

Well, and you know, I mean always be prepared in season out of season, you know, like I mean somebody

That's that's that's a that's some good advice right that somebody gave me once it's like, you know you're not ready at every moment to to proclaim and herald the gospel and And don't be too proud to beg people to repent

Then what are you doing? Yep, that's right. And uh, this was a while ago, but melissa owens says

I completely agree with everything you gentlemen have said me too, uh, especially the part about uh,

My fresca tasting like dispensational tears, you know I'm glad you agree with that melissa.

We're on the same page Just kidding just kidding. Uh, man, it's late and i'm tired

But I hope you have enjoyed this discussion tonight. We've kind of went all over the place.

I talked about a lot of things um But we hope that it was edifying to you.

We hope that uh We uh We hope that we explain things well at least our position in how we view things that uh we don't

There are people we disapprove of But there are people that we would still call brothers

Oh, yeah christ But we also don't approve of their behavior online and we would call them to repent

And we also think If we're if our goal is actually to take america

It first begins with you and self -control And elevating christ in your own life.

Yeah, come on before you start going to promote uh christ, you know politically

Okay Hmm, did that make sense because I feel like i'm half asleep right now. Yeah, it made sense

Okay, it made sense great, so Chris we need to head out of here

Everyone we will see on the next one. Well, at least I will I don't know if chris will probably Probably okay good.

Well as we head out from here strive to make each day an eternal day for the glory of god We will see you later.