August 25, 2023 Show with Jim Mogel on “Food Freedom & Agriculture from a Biblical Perspective”

Live from historic downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, home of founding father James Wilson,

19th century hymn writer George Duffield, 19th century gospel minister George Norcross, and sports

legend Jim Thorpe, it's Iron Sharpens Iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning

issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us iron sharpens iron, so one man

sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to

have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener,

with your own questions.

And now here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity

living on the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Friday on this 25th

day of August, 2023.

I have another update for you for my brother Andy.

As those of you who listen to the show every day may recall, the last several days on the program,

I have been announcing prayer requests for my brother Andy, who is 75 and living in a

local nursing home here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania, after a massive stroke a

number of years ago left him completely paralyzed on his left side.

And recently he had developed pneumonia, and he also more seriously

developed a life -threatening blood infection known as sepsis.

Andy has been on intravenous antibiotics.

They appear to be holding the sepsis at bay.

I am still waiting for an update from his doctor, who has not yet called me back, which is

quite infuriating.

I have called several times asking for a conversation with him, and I

never receive a call back, which I would appreciate you praying for that as well.

But when I visit him, his appetite seems to be very good,

sometimes even voracious, and I've been bringing him food that he likes to eat because he hates the food at the nursing.

Home.

I want to make sure he eats and gets the appropriate nutrients that are going to help him

get healthier.

And so I just ask of you to continue to pray that the Lord

guides the physicians in everything they do, the nurses, etc.,

and even more importantly, that our Lord

makes my brother's salvation testimony crystal clear.

I have not reached a point where I have a settled peace over the

authenticity of my brother's profession of faith in Christ, and we appreciate you praying for that

more than anything.

And of course, in addition to guiding the doctors, I would pray that if

the Lord chooses not to use physicians but a divine miracle, that that would happen as

well.

I just want to make sure, God willing, that my brother sticks around a number of more years so I

can not only enjoy seeing him and spending time with him, but

also that I can continue to evangelize him and pray for him so that I am completely

confident before he departs this earth that he has placed truly

his entire trust for salvation in the finished work of Christ.

So please join me in that prayer.

We have a first -time guest today.

His name is Jim Mogul, and he's a board member of the Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society.

Those of you who listen regularly to Iron Sharp and Zion Radio will recognize

the name of that ministry because we've been advertising it pretty heavily lately.

The Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society is hosting a three -day special event, a

conference, in Mannheim, Pennsylvania, which is in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania.

And this is featuring the keynote speaker, Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, a very dear friend

of mine dating back to 1995.

And not only is this a conference, but on Saturday, September

16th, from 3 .30 p .m. to 6 .30 p .m., the conference includes a

debate that Dr. White is having with Dr. Gregory Coles on the theme,

Is Gay Christian a Biblically Acceptable Identity for a Member of Christ's Church?

The entire conference is Friday, the 15th of September, through Sunday, the 17th

of September.

And if you would like to register for this event, go to futureofchristendom .org,

futureofchristendom .org.

I hope as many of you as possible will attend, and I'll be able to meet and greet

all of you who listen to this program, who are able to make it to Lancaster

County, Pennsylvania for this exciting three -day event, September 15th through the 17th.

But today, I'm going to be addressing a subject that I don't believe I've ever addressed before on Iron

Sharpens Iron Radio, especially for a full program.

Our guest today, Jim Mogul, is going to discuss food freedom and agriculture

from a Biblical perspective.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio for the very first time, Jim Mogul.

Thank you, Chris.

Good afternoon, and thanks for that good plug for our conference coming up.

We're pretty happy with the way that's shaping up.

Glad to have Dr. White coming, and for some of our regulars, we do this conference

annually, and we have some of our favorites are coming back, Matt Truello and Paul Michael Raymond.

And just a great lineup of speakers.

There's going to be 12 rapid -fire presentations on Saturday, followed

by the debate.

So it's going to be a good time.

I encourage anyone who can make it to come on out.

Great.

And I am very excited about it as well, and I'm honored to be serving as the moderator of the debate.

And typically, people recognize me from emceeing Dr. White's

debates and doing a little stand -up comedy routine, but I'm not going to be emceeing this time.

I'm going to be doing something that I very rarely do, actually, and that's moderating the debate.

I have done moderation for debates, but that is not the typical thing I do.

I usually prefer sitting in the audience and just watching, but this time I will be moderating.

So pray for me as well, as I have a very important role in this event.

Although, if the role is performed

accurately, and if the debaters behave themselves

and perform accurately, you'll hear very little from me at

all, other than to say, your time's.

Up.

But that's when you know a debate is going well, when the moderator doesn't need to do much more than

announce the segments of the debate and tell people when to start speaking

on each segment of the debate, and then tell them that the time is up.

And Dr. White...

How does that work out, Chris?

Is that pretty difficult to do?

Typically not.

In most of the debates that I have orchestrated, the debaters

both were behaving themselves and keeping to their time limits.

In fact, James, who has a computer for a brain,

he always finishes his segments exactly on time, if not a few seconds early.

So I've never seen him had to be reprimanded for going over

time or anything like that.

The worst debate, as far as keeping to the rules that I ever moderated, was a

debate between Frank Turek, who is an apologist,

and an atheist whose name escapes me right.

Now.

It was held at Stony Brook University on Long Island.

And neither of the debaters were following the time allotments and

restrictions and rules.

And it eventually became a free -for -all, and it eventually became

obvious that there was no point in me even really sitting where I was, because

even though I tried to rein in the atheist at one point, Frank

Turek said, no, I prefer it this way.

Let's just keep doing it this way.

And there was not much I could do.

They wanted it to be more of a heated discussion or argument than an actual

rigidly timed debate.

But anyway, that's just to say, most of the time that doesn't happen.

And I'm confident that that will not happen this time either.

So again, I hope that most of you listening, or many of you listening, will be able to attend

September 15th through the 17th in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania, and

register at futureofchristendom .org, futureofchristendom .org.

Well, tell us something, first of all, about what your role is at Mid -Atlantic Reformation

Society as a board member.

Well, we have regular meetings, obviously, as a board.

A lot of our work now is setting up these conferences.

We've, in the past six months, made a decision to focus more on the conference

ministry.

And so that's working through the details of that as a job.

In the past, I've done a lot of writing for the group.

I have not done as much of that recently, but I do some writing.

And just pretty much handling the nuts and the bolts of getting these

things put together.

I've been on the board since we founded the group back, I guess,

about ten years ago.

By the way, I just wanted to let our listeners know that Ted in Moundsville, Alabama, reminded me who the

atheist was at that debate.

Michael Shermer was the atheist who debated Frank Turek, and I was the moderator.

Thanks, Ted, for reminding me.

Tell us more specifically about the Mid -Atlantic

Reformation Society itself.

Well, we started about ten years ago, and our purpose was to address things that are

sadly neglected by the Church.

Things along the area of engaging the culture, trying

to get a hold on some of the political things that are going on, and that sort of thing.

Things that the Church shies away from.

And our thought was that pastors were either afraid or

it was distasteful to them to handle that sort of thing.

And so our initial idea was to offer

help to come alongside pastors and handle some of those things, whether it's through meetings or

information or whatever they might need to better address those sorts of things.

And we learned the hard way through a lot of effort and work that unfortunately

most pastors pretty much just don't want that.

They would rather ignore those things, and when we look around today, we see the

result of it.

Yeah, go ahead, Chris.

Well, I was just going to say, if you're finished with that, we have a tradition here on Iron Trip and Zion Radio.

Whenever we have a first -time guest, we have that guest give a summary of their salvation testimony, and that would include

the kind of religious atmosphere in which they were raised, if any, and what kind of

providential circumstances our Sovereign Lord raised up in their lives that drew them to himself and saved them.

And so we'd love to hear a summary of your story.

Sure, I'd be glad to do that.

Actually, I grew up in a great family.

I had great parents.

I was the youngest of four.

I had two brothers and a sister.

We grew up in a pretty rural area.

It was an old -fashioned family neighborhood.

I grew up about a mile from the house my mother was born in and about two miles from the house my father was

born in.

So that's the kind of area and neighborhood it was, a farming community.

We had a family prayer at every meal.

We went to church every Sunday.

Historically, our church was a German Reformed church.

But when I was very young, it joined the United Church of Christ

denomination, I think, in the late 50s.

I believe that denomination was formed in the mid -to -late 50s.

Now, how left -wing was it back then?

Well, it wasn't very left -wing at all.

I mean, by today's standards, it would look far right.

I would say we were Pennsylvania Dutch in this area.

Most Pennsylvania Dutch people tended to be Democrats.

My family were Democrats, but not at all leftist as we would see it today.

Would the driving force of the Democrat background have something to do with a

more pacifist approach to things?

No, I would say not.

I would say not.

If you're speaking about pacifism in a military sense, definitely not.

There would have been no reservations whatsoever to military service or anything like that.

It was a completely different world.

It would be unrecognizable today.

Yeah, and today, even those that are to the left of us,

there are many war hawks amongst those on the left, and

today, those who are in the forefront of politics are no longer

really liberal.

They are leftists, and there is a difference.

There is a difference.

Yeah, the liberals have gone by the wayside.

I think Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is a liberal.

He's a liberal Democrat, but most of what we have today in the Democrat Party, I pretty much just

consider communists.

At any rate, that's what the environment was.

Now, theologically, the church was not a Bible

church at that point.

I grew up believing what most of the people, I think, in the church believed, and that was

that if my good works outweighed my bad works, we had a

great Savior Christ who would save us on that basis, which was obviously

erroneous, but I think that's pretty much the predominant view.

Even still today, that's the predominant view of many people who fall under the broad

category we call Christians.

So historically, it was a German Reformed church.

I knew very little of Reformed doctrine.

So in other words, when you say German Reformed church, it's going by the name that would have been

connected with its ancestry, but not the way that they were currently teaching and preaching.

Pretty much so.

It was a somewhat liturgical church, so you had the Apostles' Creed, you had the

gospel.

The gospel was there.

It was there in the creeds.

It was there in the liturgy.

It was there in a very small extent in the everyday teaching of the church, but

not very predominantly.

Well, when...

Yeah, continue, please.

Well, in the early 70s, it was about 1973,

our church sponsored what was called a lay witness mission.

I believe probably some of the listeners have heard of that.

It was an arrangement where people from another church would come for,

I believe it was a Friday, a Saturday, and a Sunday, with some

very informal meetings and just talk about their...

These were saved people, and they would talk about their

relationship with Christ, how they came to know Christ, and what it meant to them.

Just basically giving their testimony in various forms throughout the

weekend.

It's interesting that that happened because it was...

It actually, on an organizational level, it turned out to be harmful for the church because

a good number of people got saved and eventually left the church.

The people who came to our church were from a Presbyterian church, and

I believe the whole concept of the lay witness mission came from somewhere in

Methodism in the 1950s.

So basically through that, I came to understand that there's more

to being a Christian than just relying on your good work

to get to heaven.

I could see that there was an element of, a big element of

sin that characterized me as a human being, and that there

was a need for Christ's work in order to

save my soul.

And that very weekend, I made a profession of faith in Christ,

along with my mother and father, all the same day.

Wow.

It was a rather remarkable thing.

My sister was present, and it led to her coming to Christ sometime after that.

You know, we're going to pick up your testimony when we return from our first commercial break.

Okay.

And I hope that we hear how you eventually came to discover and

understand and fall in love with and embrace the true doctrines of Reformed theology,

as opposed to what was called the German Reformed denomination.

And if anybody would like to submit a question to Jim Mogul, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail dot com.

Chrisarnson at gmail dot com.

Give us your first name at least, city and state and country of residence.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back with Jim Mogul after these messages.

The Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society presents The Future of Christendom 2023.

The Gospel at War.

September 15th to the 16th in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania.

Featuring Dr. James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries.

We are excited to be including a formal debate in this year's conference.

Dr. James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries will be debating Dr. Gregory Coles, author of Single Gay Christian,

A Personal Journey of Faith and Sexual Identity.

The debate topic.

Is gay Christian a biblically acceptable identity for a member of Christ's Church?

So come join us for the 6th Future of Christendom Conference.

The event will take place at Spooky Nook Sports in Mannheim, Pennsylvania and will run from Friday evening through all day Saturday

with an invitation to the Sunday morning worship service of the Independence Reformed Bible Church.

This will be a weekend packed with practical teaching with a theme of the Gospel at War in many areas of our culture including

government schools, the Supreme Court, missions, feminism and even the church pulpits.

Head to futureofchristendom .org.

James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries here.

I'm very excited to announce that my long time friend Chris Arnson of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and I

are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia again for the G3 National Conference that's Thursday, September

21st through Saturday the 23rd on a theme that I've been preaching, teaching, writing about and defending in live

public debates for most of my life, the sovereignty of God.

I'll be joined on the speaking roster by Steve Lawson, Voti Baucom, Paul Washer, Virgil Walker, Scott

Anuel and Josh Bice, founder of G3 Ministries.

And there's more great news.

Chris Arnson of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio can get you a 30 discount off the registration

fee.

Go to g3min .org, that's g3min .org and enter promo

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Chris Arnson, I look forward to seeing you all Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd at the G3

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Make sure you stop by the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Exhibitor booth and say hi to Chris Arnson while

you're there.

Go to g3min .org and enter promo code G3ISIR for your

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We're now back with our guest today, Jim Mogul, who is a board member

for the Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society.

We are discussing food freedom, agriculture from a biblical perspective.

But before we enter into that topic, we are still in the midst of hearing Jim's salvation testimony.

And if you could pick up where you left off and eventually get to the point where you came to discover,

understand, fall in love with, embrace the doctrines of sovereign grace, also known as Reformed

theology.

Yeah, sure.

I'd like to back up just a little bit into the background of the Reformed church I grew up

in, just because I think it's interesting.

I've often wondered exactly how and when the church went from a

biblical, Reformed church into what it eventually became, and

even worse, into what it is today.

It certainly had a lot to do with the German higher critics of the late 18th century casting

doubt on the authority of scripture, the accuracy of scripture, and

all sorts of apostasy there.

But historically, I often wonder how far back do you have to go to see the

different conditions of the church.

I've never been able to really figure that out.

I guess it's written in history somewhere, but I haven't found it.

I do know that my grandmother, who was born in the 1880s, wrote some

very godly poems, and I actually have them handwritten in my possession.

And from reading those poems, I have very little doubt that she was definitely a Christian.

My parents, who were born in the 20s and the 30s, when they got saved,

used to say, how come nobody ever told us about this?

So that kind of gives a more recent time frame of what happened.

But anyway, moving on from that, once I

was saved, at about the age of 17 or 18, I

really fell in love with doctrine and theology and started reading a lot.

This was in the 70s, so I was going to the Christian bookstore and

buying books.

This was back when Christian bookstores actually had books.

So, whatever I could get my hands on, I was very interested.

And it didn't take too long until I started seeing what was going on

in a church.

This was at a time when liberation theology was really gaining a foothold, and

I saw those things happening.

And of course, being a 17 or 18 -year -old guy, I figured that all I had

to do was alert people, and everybody would say, oh yeah, this is awful, let's

fix this.

Obviously, that didn't happen.

The church was probably more than half of the congregation were relatives of mine.

My mother's side of the family and my father's side of the family went back in that congregation for

generations.

So, I was butting heads with friends and relatives.

I've heard this dilemma from many, many people who have a similar

experience of being saved while they're active in a church like that.

It's always a dilemma.

Do I stay and try to fix it, or do I move on?

I stayed, I guess, for about a year or two, and then moved on,

I guess, for two reasons.

One, I just felt that I needed closer fellowship with

like -minded Christians.

And two, I could see that I was

not real severely damaging, but I was damaging relationships with people who were either

my family or my friends.

Decades later, looking back on that, I'm glad I left for both of those reasons.

Those people who I knew

back then and was sort of butting heads with, those relationships came back,

and I still have good relationships with those people.

So, for different reasons, it's a good thing I left.

I left and went into a dispensational church with

a brethren background and stayed within

dispensational pre -millennialism for decades.

During that time, maybe about halfway through that, through

my reading, I became thoroughly convinced of the doctrines of grace and became a

Calvinist, which wasn't too much of a

problem in the various churches that I was in.

It wasn't a horrible hot button for most people.

Here and there, it was a hot button for some people, but that didn't cause me a lot of trouble.

Over time, again, through reading and studying,

when I was probably in my late 20s or my early 30s, I took some seminary courses,

evening school seminary courses that learned some more doctrine there.

Eventually, I really began to question.

I was actually teaching dispensationalism in an adult Sunday school class

in the church I was in.

It was a Baptist church.

It was a little bit difficult because I had to make the excuses for

some of the things that are held in dispensationalism and pre -millennialism that are very difficult to

defend.

Eventually, I started looking into those things and really trying to set aside my biases

and going to the scripture and looking, what does the scripture actually say about this?

Long story short, eventually, I

rejected dispensationalism.

Now, I pretty much call myself a post -millennialist.

I believe that post -millennialism best describes the work of Christ and

his church throughout history and into the future.

The Great Commission and everything fit very well

with the post -millennial viewpoint, much more so than the others, I believe.

I guess you made the change to post -millennialist so you'd have a much larger group of friends.

I'm only kidding.

Well, yes and no.

Actually, I have a lot of very good post -millennial friends, some of whom

follow a very similar path to me.

I mean, to the path that I took.

I'm really amazed how many post -millennialists I know who

were not that long ago dispensationalists.

To be honest, maybe I wouldn't call myself a

hardline post -millennialist.

It seems to me that there are so many things that are not clearly spelled out in scripture.

So, as I said, I believe post -millennialism is the best model.

I do call myself a post -millennialist, but it's not something – I love to discuss it.

I don't mind arguing about it, but it's not something I want to lose

friends over.

It is interesting, and please, my premillennial and dispensational friends

listening, don't take offense at this, but I'm stating something that just happens to be true.

If you know something to the contrary, I would love for you to enlighten me about it.

But I have personally never met someone that

was either an amillennialist or a post -millennialist who became a

dispensationalist or even became a premillennialist.

Maybe they're out there.

I just have never met one.

In fact, I don't even know if I've heard of one, especially when you're

talking about dispensationalism.

Going from a non -dispensational view, I'm talking about a person who's actually regenerate,

who understands the scriptures.

I'm not talking about somebody that may have been raised an amillennialist, and then when they got saved, they became

dispensationalists.

I don't mean that.

I mean somebody who is fairly knowledgeable, at least in a cursory

level, about what the Bible teaches about eschatology and so on.

I've never met one who went from being amill or post -mill to

premill and dispensational.

And the same thing really goes hand -in -hand with I have never

met that I am aware of.

I'll give one exception, Michael Brown, who makes this claim.

But I've never met anybody who was, for any reasonable length of

time, an evangelical Calvinist

who became an evangelical Arminian.

I have met and know about many professedly Reformed Christians, Calvinists,

who have apostatized, who became Roman Catholic, who became Eastern Orthodox, who

became members of a cult, who dropped out of Christianity altogether.

But I've never met a biblically literate Reformed Christian

who became an evangelical Arminian.

I don't know if you have.

I just never have.

That's a good point.

It's pretty hard to study yourself into the Arminians.

Right.

And you will find that many who are Arminian, either by

using that actual name for themselves, which is a minority, most people who are theologically Arminian

do not call themselves that, even though that is a correct label for what they believe.

But most of these folks that I know that would fall under the category of being an evangelical

Arminian, a great number of their heroes of the faith are Calvinists.

They might not even be aware of that.

But I know many vehemently anti -Calvinist Baptists,

especially from the independent fundamentalist Baptist circles, who hate the

Doctrines of Grace and love Charles Spurgeon, and love John Bunyan and

love George Whitefield and love Jonathan Edwards.

And I could go on and on and on.

And these are all Reformed Christians.

So it's a it's a interesting phenomenon.

So before we go to our midway break, why don't you set up some of the background for our topic today?

And for those of you who just tuned in, our topic today is food freedom.

And agriculture from a biblical perspective.

First of all, what led you to even study this issue and become so concerned over it?

Well, when I grew up, my my father was an avid gardener.

And to the point where he was he was one of the early readers of Rodale.

Did you say that your father was Ava Gardner?

I'm only kidding.

Oh, Avid Gardner.

Oh, OK.

Avid Gardner, yeah.

And he he became one of the early readers of Rodale Press.

Anybody who's into organic farming or gardening probably is familiar with Rodale Press.

I don't need to go into what that is, but it's a very, very competent

group that that writes and practice organic gardening and farming.

Rodale himself was a leftist, but had many good

ideas and a lot of principles that that mesh with some of the some of the

guys I'm going to talk about later.

Who are who are part of this, this community and this movement from a Christian

perspective.

So anyway, he is very much into organic gardening to the point where when I was

probably about six or seven years old or even earlier, he converted

our family garage into an organic gardening store and ran that for a few years.

And then actually moved that into a nursery.

He was a nursery man for a while, supplied some of the local

builders with with plants for their projects and so forth,

as well as as well as individuals who would come in and buy things.

So so through that, I was around that all the time.

My father was a hard worker.

And and when I as a kid, you know, you look up to your you look up to your dad and you do things

to to mimic your father.

And when I wanted to mimic my father, I would work because because that's what that's what my dad did.

He worked.

Then as I was as I was a teenager, I worked.

There was a dairy farm just up the road from us.

I worked on a dairy farm for maybe.

Well, through my teenage years, I worked on a dairy farm and I liked that.

I really I was just always around around farming and gardening.

My wife grew up around the same type of thing.

Her dad is a was and still is an avid gardener.

He's out there working and

cultivating his vegetable garden at the age of 96.

And they're still still growing their own food.

So we both we both grew up with gardening and canning and freezing and all that stuff.

So that's that's my that's my background.

Can you explain the actual phrase food freedom?

Yeah, food freedom.

We have we have a we've worked ourself into a really bad situation with with the

government, with the Department of Agriculture and the various state agencies where it's very

difficult to especially when you're talking about meat.

Very difficult to to.

Grow food and sell it to your neighbors.

Difficult to go to somebody and just buy a cut of meat because it's all become so

regulated and dominated by the large corporations who are

in pretty much in bed with the government to grow the government and their business.

And and.

That's that's what we're talking about when we say food freedom.

So there are there are things some some movements afoot to try to free that up, try

to get the government out of some of it and get us to the point where we're able to

grow and buy and sell and trade food as free people.

One of the things that I find interesting about certain topics, and this would definitely be

one of them.

I don't know how much you are in support of or interested in.

Homeopathic medicine and all natural kind of health remedies

and things like that.

But it seems that when it comes to.

Food nutrition health.

These subjects attract people on polar opposite ends of the

religious and political arena.

You will find people who lean extremely in the direction of

the right.

Born again, Christians, patriotic and,

you know, very active in trying to return this nation to

sanity with a biblical worldview and that kind of thing.

And then you have on the on the 180 degree opposite side, people on the left who seem to be very

attracted by this arena of or area or sphere of of

thought.

So it makes excellent opportunities to declare Christ to

people that you might not ever have a conversation with otherwise.

And that's absolutely true.

Yeah, I'm glad to see that I was correct in that, because that's seems to be from

the people that I have met.

And even going into, you know, I've been recommended to visit

certain health food stores and all natural places by very

conservative Christians.

And then I go in there and the people that actually own and work there are

wackadoodle leftists.

So it's kind of interesting that you have these folks on polar

opposite ends and not that this is necessarily involving the same subject.

But it is interesting how Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., who is running for president on the

Democratic ticket, he is being interviewed far more often by

conservative folks than liberal.

So or should I say leftist?

So it is quite quite a fascinating thing that you do have these people on opposite ends

of the spectrum that have a very similar, if not identical,

interest and passion in certain areas.

But we're going to pick up where we left off there.

We have to go to our midway break.

And just to remind you, folks, the midway break on Iron Trap and Zion Radio is a little longer than the other breaks in the show.

Because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida, who airs this program, in

fact, twice a day in a prerecorded format in morning drive and in the

evening.

They are required by the FCC to localize geographically this program to Lake City,

Florida, where they're located.

And in order to do that, they use the middle of our show to air their own public service announcements and other

local things.

While they do that, we simultaneously air our globally heard commercials.

So please use this time wisely.

Please write down as much of the contact information that is provided by as many of our

advertisers as possible so that you can more frequently and successfully contact our advertisers.

And we hope that means you will frequently purchase their products, use their services, visit their churches.

If you really are grateful to God that there are people out there and organizations and

churches and ministries that love this show so much, they share their wealth with us

so that we can remain on the air.

If you're really grateful about that, thank our advertisers for it.

Just simply contact them and say, thank you so much for sponsoring Iron Trap and Zion Radio.

This should go a long way to convince our advertisers that their money is not being spent in vain

and that they should continue renewing their advertising contracts with us.

So please write down as much of the contact information as you can from as many of our advertisers as you can.

And send in your questions to Jim Mogul, to chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

We'll be right back.

Don't go away.

The Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society presents The Future of Christendom 2023, The Gospel at

War. September 15th to the 16th in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania, featuring Dr. James

White of Alpha and Omega Ministries.

We are excited to be including a formal debate in this year's conference.

Dr. James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries will be debating Dr. Gregory Coles, author of Single Gay Christian,

A Personal Journey of Faith and Sexual Identity, the debate topic.

Is gay Christian a biblically acceptable identity for a member of Christ's Church?

So come join us for the sixth Future of Christendom conference.

The event will take place at Spooky Nook Sports in Mannheim, Pennsylvania, and will run from Friday evening through all day Saturday, with

an invitation to the Sunday morning worship service of the Independence Reform Bible Church.

This will be a weekend packed with practical teaching, with a theme of the Gospel at War in many areas of our culture, including

government schools, the Supreme Court, missions, feminism, and even the church pulpits.

Head to futureofchristendom .org.

James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries here.

I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and I

are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia again for the G3 National Conference.

That's Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd, on a theme that I have been preaching, teaching,

writing about, and defending in live public debates for most of my life, the sovereignty of God.

I'll be joined on the speaking roster by Steve Lawson, Voti Baucom, Paul Washer, Virgil Walker, Scott

Anuel, and Josh Bice, founder of G3 Ministries.

And there's more great news.

Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio can get you a 30 discount off the registration

fee.

Go to g3min .org, that's g3min .org, and enter promo code

G3ISIR.

That's G3ISIR for the 30 % discount.

Chris Arnzen and I look forward to seeing you all Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd at the G3

National Conference in Atlanta, Georgia on the sovereignty of God.

Make sure you stop by the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Exhibitor booth and say hi to Chris Arnzen while

you're there.

Go to g3min .org and enter promo code G3ISIR for your

30 discount off the registration fee.

It's such a blessing to hear from Iron Sharpens Iron Radio listeners from all over the world.

Here's Joe Riley, a listener in Ireland, who wants you to know about a guest on the show

he really loves hearing interviewed, Dr. Joe Moorcraft.

I'm Joe Riley, a faithful Iron Sharpens Iron Radio listener here in Atai in County Kildare, Ireland.

Going back to 2005, one of my very favorite guests on Iron Sharpens Iron is Dr. Joe

Moorcraft.

If you've been blessed by Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Dr. Moorcraft and Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming,

Georgia are largely to thank, since they are one of the program's largest financial supporters.

Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming is in Forsyth County, a part of the Atlanta metropolitan area.

Heritage is a thoroughly biblical church, unwaveringly committed to Westminster standards, and Dr. Joe

Moorcraft is the author of an eight -volume commentary on the larger catechism.

Heritage is a member of the Hanover Presbytery, built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets,

Jesus Christ himself being the chief cornerstone, and tracing its roots and heritage back to the great Protestant

Reformation of the 16th century.

Heritage maintains and follows the biblical truth and principles proclaimed by the reformers, scripture alone,

grace alone, faith alone, Christ alone, and God's glory alone.

Their primary goal is the worship of the Triune God that continues in eternity.

For more details on Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming, Georgia, visit heritagepresbyterianchurch

.com.

Or call 678 -954 -7831.

That's 678 -954 -7831.

If you visit, tell them Joe O 'Reilly, an Iron Sharpens Iron radio listener, from a tie in County Kildare, Ireland,

sends you.

Hello, my name is Anthony Uvinio, and I'm one of the pastors at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Corum, New York,

and also the host of the reformrookie .com website.

I want you to know that if you enjoy listening to the Iron Sharpens Iron radio show like I do, you can now find it on the

Apple's iTunes app by typing Iron Sharpens Iron radio in the search bar.

You no longer have to worry about missing a show or a special guest because you're in your car or still at work.

Just subscribe on the iTunes app and listen to the Iron Sharpens Iron radio show at any time, day or night.

Please be sure to also give it a good review and pass it along to anyone who would benefit from the teaching and the many

solidly reformed guests that Chris Arnzen has on the show.

Truth is so hard to come by these days, so don't waste your time with fluff or fake news.

Subscribe to the Iron Sharpens Iron radio podcast right now.

And while you're at it, you can also sign up for the reformrookie .com podcast and visit our website and the YouTube

page.

We are dedicated to teaching Christian theology from a Reform Baptist perspective to beginners in the faith as

well as seasoned believers.

From Keech's Catechism and the Doctrines of Grace to the Olivet Discourse and the Book of Leviticus, the Reform

Rookie podcast and YouTube channel is sure to have something to offer everyone seeking biblical truth.

And finally, if you're looking to worship in a reformed church that holds to the 1689 London Baptist Confession

of Faith, please join us at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Corham, New York.

Again, I'm Pastor Anthony Ovinio and thanks for listening.

If you love Iron Sharpens Iron radio, one of the best ways you can help keep the show on the air is

by supporting our advertisers.

One such faithful advertiser who really believes in what Chris Hansen is doing is

Daniel P. Patafuco, serious injury lawyer and Christian apologist.

Dan is the president and founder of the Historical Bible Society.

Their mission?

To foster belief in the credibility of scripture as the written word of God.

They go to various churches, schools and institutions to publicly display a rare

collection of biblical texts along with a fascinating presentation by Mr. Patafuco

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To advance the cause of the gospel, they created a beautiful, perfect facsimile of the

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Thanks for helping to keep Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio on the air.

Hi, I'm Buzz Taylor.

Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio has had a long -time partnership with our friends at

CVBBS, which stands for Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service.

They specialize in supplying Reformed and Puritan books and Bibles at discount prices that make them affordable for

everyone.

CVBBS has been a family -owned book service since 1987, operating out of Carlisle, Pennsylvania.

They seek to bring you the best available Christian books and Bibles at the best possible prices.

Unlike other book sites, they make no effort to provide every book that is available or popular because, frankly,

much of what is being printed is not worth your time.

That means you can get to the good stuff faster.

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Please let our friends at CVBBS know that you heard about them on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

This is Pastor Bill Sousa, Grace Church at Franklin, here in the beautiful state of Tennessee.

Our congregation is one of a growing number of churches who love and support Iron Sharpens

Iron Radio financially.

Grace Church at Franklin is an independent, autonomous body of believers which strives

to clearly declare the whole counsel of God as revealed in Scripture through the person and work

of our Lord Jesus Christ.

And, of course, the end from which we strive is the glory of God.

If you live near Franklin, Tennessee, and Franklin is just south of Nashville, maybe 10 minutes,

or you are visiting this area, or you have friends and loved ones nearby, we hope you will

join us some Lord's Day in worshiping our God and Savior.

Please feel free to contact me if you have more questions about Grace Church at Franklin.

Our website is gracechurchatfranklin .org.

That's gracechurchatfranklin .org.

This is Pastor Bill Sousa wishing you all the richest blessings of our sovereign

Lord, God, Savior, and King, Jesus Christ, today and

always.

Do you know what they all have in common?

They all require training, assessments, and certifications.

But do you know what requires no training at all?

Becoming a parent.

My name is A .M. Brewster.

I'm the president of Truth Love Parent and host of its award -winning podcast.

I've been a biblical family counselor since the early 2000s, and what I've discovered is that the majority of Christian parents have

never been biblically equipped to do the work of the ministry in their homes.

That's why Truth Love Parent exists.

We serve God by equipping dads and moms to be the ambassador parents God called and created them to be.

We produce free parenting resources, train church leaders, and offer biblical counseling so that the next generation of

dads and moms can use the scriptures to parent their children for life and godliness.

Please visit us at truthloveparent .com.

Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said, Give yourself unto reading.

The man who never reads will never be read.

He who never quotes will never be quoted.

He who will not use the thoughts of other men's brains proves that he has no brains of his own.

You need to read.

Solid Ground Christian Books is a publisher and book distributor who takes these words of the Prince of Preachers to heart.

The mission of Solid Ground Christian Books is to bring back treasures of the past to minister to Christians in the present and

future, and to publish new titles that address burning issues in the church and the world.

Since its beginning in 2001, Solid Ground has been committed to publish God -centered, Christ -exalting

books for all ages.

We invite you to go treasure hunting at solid -ground -books .com.

That's solid -ground -books .com, and see what priceless literary gems from the past

or present you can unearth from Solid Ground.

Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

And please, folks, as I've been saying the last few days, all this week actually, solid

-ground -books .com is facing a huge and frightening slump in book sales.

I don't know if they've determined why yet, because their books are just as excellent as they always have been.

So I'm urging you, please, if you value Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, please, today,

go to solid -ground -books .com, purchase generously, and mention

that you heard about them from Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

And remember, you're not only going to be doing solid -ground -books .com a favor by

purchasing books from them, and you're not only going to be doing Iron Sharpens Iron Radio a favor by keeping one of

our most important advertisers happy, you're going to be doing yourself and anyone for whom you are

purchasing books from solid -ground -books .com an enormous favor of

incalculable value, because they publish nothing but the very finest in Christian

literature, including books that they bring back into print,

dating back as far as the 16th century Protestant Reformation.

And also, they publish books for the first time by current authors in our

present day, like Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, who's going to be speaking at this conference we've been

promoting, being hosted by the Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society.

So, as I said, you're not only going to be doing them a favor and Iron Sharpens Iron Radio a favor, you're going to be doing yourself and

anybody that you're purchasing books for an enormous favor.

So, please go to solid -ground -books .com today, purchase frequently,

also in the future, and purchase generously.

And also, always mention that you heard about them from Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Before I return to my guest today, Jim Mogul, I have some important announcements to make.

Folks, if you really love this show and you don't want it to disappear, I'm urging you, please go to

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You can donate instantly with a debit or credit card in that fashion.

If you prefer snail mail, mailing a physical check to a physical address the old -fashioned way from your local

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Also, if you want to advertise with us, whether it is your church, parachurch ministry, your business, your

private practice, such as a law firm, a medical firm, or maybe it's just a special event that you want to promote,

whatever it is, as long as it's compatible with what I believe, I would love to help you launch an ad campaign as quickly as possible, because

we're just as much in urgent need of your advertising dollars as we are in your donations.

So, send me an email to chrisarnsen at gmail .com and put advertising in the subject line.

Keep in mind, folks, I say this every day, I never want anybody who is donating

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I never want anybody giving their own church where you are a member less money than you normally give your church on

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Please don't cut into the money that you have set aside for Lord's Day giving to your own church in order to bless us

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Never do that.

Also, if you are really struggling to survive and make ends meet, please wait until you are back on your feet and more

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The two things that are very crystal clear in the Bible about our finances is that God commands us to provide for

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giving to this program nearly vanished, and we've never bounced back.

We've gone from an average of 20 donors every month to about 4 or 5 at the most.

Please help us.

We need your help.

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Click support, then click, click to donate now.

Also, please don't forget that First Love Ministries, who runs First Love

Radio, the internet radio network that livestreams Iron Sharp and Zion Radio, they are

having this weekend, Saturday and Sunday, a conference.

That's August 26th and 27th at the Reformed Baptist Church of Tama,

Iowa.

And this conference is featuring Joe Jackowitz, president of First Love

Ministries, and Austin Huggins, pastor of First Baptist Church of Baghdad, Florida.

The theme is sanctification, how to grow in holiness, and it's absolutely free.

Go to firstloveministries .org to register, firstloveministries .org.

Also, don't forget about the three -day conference that my guest is involved in.

That's the conference of the Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society on Friday, September 15th,

Saturday, September 16th, and Sunday, September 17th, which includes a debate

featuring Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, who will be debating Dr. Gregory Coles

on the theme, Is Gay Christian a Biblically Acceptable Identity for a Member of

Christ's Church?

That's 3 .30 p .m. to 6 .30 p .m. on Saturday the 16th.

But, as I said, the conference is three days, from the 15th through the 17th.

If you want to register, please go to futureofchristendom .org, futureofchristendom

.org.

And last but not least, if you are not a member of a

Christ -honoring, biblically faithful, theologically sound, doctrinally solid church, like

the Independence Reformed Church located in Lancaster County,

Pennsylvania, pastored by my friend Joel Saint, who is the founder and president of the Mid

-Atlantic Reformation Society running this conference we're promoting, if you're not a member of a solid

church, I have extensive lists spanning the globe, and I've helped many people in our audience all over the

world find biblically solid churches, sometimes even within just a couple of minutes from where they live.

If you are in that predicament, you don't have a biblically faithful church home that you're a member of, and you don't even know

where one is located near you, I may be able to help you, as I have done already with many people.

So send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com, and put I

need a church in the subject line.

Last but not least, if you're a man in ministry leadership,

I invite you excitedly, enthusiastically, to attend the

next Iron Sharpens Iron Radio Free Pastors Luncheon.

This is going to be held on Thursday, October 5th, 11 a .m. to 2 p .m. at Church of the Living

Christ in Loisville, Pennsylvania, which is Perry County.

My speaker this time around will be Jeff Noblitt, founder of

Anchored in Truth Ministries and senior pastor of Grace Life Church of the Shoals in Muswell

Shoals, Alabama, one of the most powerful preachers I've ever heard, and I am thrilled that he has accepted my

invitation to speak at this upcoming luncheon, free of charge for men in ministry

leadership, and not only is admission free and lunch free, everybody attending gets a heavy sack, maybe even

two heavy sacks, of free brand new books, personally selected by me and donated by

Christian publishers across the United States and United Kingdom.

And so that alone is well worth traveling to Perry

County, Pennsylvania, to attend this luncheon.

So send me an email if you are a man in ministry leadership and like to attend to chrisarnson at

gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com, and put pastorsluncheon in the subject line.

That's also the email address where you could send in a question to Jim Mogul, and that is

chrisarnson at gmail .com.

And let's see here, we have

Larry in Baldwin, Long Island, New York, and Larry says, I have

seen on some conservative outlets that there is much

fraudulent rhetoric being spewed about in regard to

the superiority of organic food, and some of it may be even more

dangerous than food that has been sprayed with pesticides.

Have you heard this, and what is your opinion?

I can't imagine that properly raised organic food would be harmful

in relation to non -organically raised food.

I'm not sure what he's specifically referring to.

Well, you know, I remember seeing, I don't know if you know who John Stossel is.

John Stossel was, I believe he was a part of

the ABC News program, 2020 perhaps, or primetime,

and he was saying that there was a lot of false advertising

in regard to the far superior nature of organic food, and he was saying in some cases

there was no difference at all after people did, scientists did experiments

and tests and so on, and I think that some of the danger that was involved on

some occasions was the manure or something,

that perhaps it's just that they're not being properly cleaned by people when they eat the organic food,

but anything like that ringing a bell?

Well, yeah, I mean, obviously any food you raise, whether it's organic or not, if you don't raise it

in sanitary conditions it's going to be a problem.

There's a, it's a multifaceted thing.

I grow a lot of food, and I try to stay as close to organic

practices as I can.

Sometimes I don't, sometimes I find better ways, and

some people would criticize that.

If you're not careful in how you grow food, you're going to run into a problem however you grow it,

but I mean, the fact is, organically raised vegetables are,

you're pretty much raising something the way God designed it.

And that's, when we get into the Christian viewpoints of agriculture,

that's one thing we're looking for.

How did God design these things to grow, whether it's animals or vegetables?

Take a look at the nature of the plant, and how he designed it,

and raise it in a way that's consistent with that.

I, for example, use some herbicide.

I'm very careful with it, I don't use it heavily, I don't use it near anything that's being

grown.

So that's not an organic method, but I need to use it sometimes to control weeds.

So it's not always a black and white line between organic and

non -organic.

Also, there's a lot of food out there that says it's organic, and how

do you know it's organic?

You go in a grocery store and you see all these beautiful, perfect apples, and they're

organic.

Well, if you've ever grown apples, you have an

understanding of how difficult it is to grow organic apples without using any

chemical pesticides.

It's not impossible, and there are organic apples.

But you need to be careful when you see something called organic.

Is it really organic?

How do you know?

And that gets into something I wanted to talk about anyway, which is it's good to

buy food locally, where you know the person who grew it, or you at least have

contact with the person who grew it.

And that's one of the aspects of food freedom, where through government regulation and

the corporate marriage between the big companies and the government, small

growers are getting squeezed out.

Everybody knows that there are far fewer farmers every year because the small family farms are getting

squeezed out.

And when you do that, you lose contact with the people who have grown your food.

So I would say you cannot do any better than knowing someone who

raises organic animals and grows organic vegetables and buying your food from them.

I just don't think there's anything better than that.

Well, thank you, Larry.

Let's get into some of the very primary things that you wanted to address that

involve the biblical evidence for what you're talking about.

Yeah, just to back up a little bit, before the break you mentioned

how this topic brings together a lot of a very broad

and varied group of people.

I think the guy who best typifies that is Joel Salatin.

I don't know if you've heard of Joel Salatin.

Not at this moment, I can't remember.

Okay, if there's a guru of this topic, he's it.

If you talk to anyone who's involved in the organic food

movement, they've heard of Joel Salatin and a lot of them read him.

This is what he calls himself.

He calls himself a Christian, libertarian, environmentalist, capitalist,

lunatic farmer.

Sounds like my kind of guy.

Yeah, and if you want to see a really fascinating video, it's an hour or two long, but if

you go on YouTube, Joel Salatin spoke at the Acton Institute.

Yeah, I remember I promoted another event by them.

I can't remember specifically what it was right now, but that name is extremely familiar to me, the Acton Institute.

Okay, he did about a two hour address there.

That was a really good observation you made.

He goes into exactly that, the huge variety and diversity of

viewpoints that enter into this.

He comments that he's been asked to run for political office by every political party that he's ever heard of.

So it is a tremendously, in a way it's a unifying thing between

people of various viewpoints.

As long as they're unifying on something good, I guess that's a good thing.

This gets into what you just mentioned, some of the biblical

aspects of it.

His farm is in Swoop, Virginia, and

he uses very, very innovative organic farming methods.

The farm started when his father bought it in the 50s.

It was eroded and farmed out pretty much

useless land.

Not much would grow on it.

From the 50s until now, it's turned into one of the most highly productive farms in

that area of the state through organic farming practices.

He says he's never put a bag of chemical fertilizer on the ground, but you can

visit there.

He welcomes you to visit.

It's a beautiful, lush farm that's all done with natural

organic practices, and it's tremendously productive.

It's just really interesting how he does it.

He wrote a book called The Pigness of the Pig,

and what he means by that is a pig has certain characteristics

that are designed into it by God.

If you want to raise pigs and use pigs for food, the best way to do it is to observe how

God created it, and then give it an opportunity

to operate within those parameters, and you'll be more successful than if you try

to buck the design that God gave to the pig.

That's interesting, because if someone were to say to me, I want to give you some advice on what to

eat biblically, pig would not be the first thing that popped into my head.

That's a good point.

One of the things that he'll show you, well, I say he'll show you.

You can stop at the farm and look around as much as you want at any time.

If you want a tour, you have to schedule it ahead of time with a group.

Anyway, you can go on YouTube and see videos about this.

He observed how

animals behave in nature, for instance buffalo and bison, and

he noticed how he said, well, buffalo don't stand in one

little area for three months and eat it down to nothing.

They move along.

He noticed that after the buffalo move along, other animals come in behind the buffalo, and

they do their thing after the buffalo are there.

He looked and he said, well, this is how God designed this to work.

He does it that way on his farm.

He has it divided into paddocks, and he'll put the beef cattle

in an area and let them there until they eat the grass down to about six

inches tall, and then they move on.

He has reasons why he regulates the height of the grass by the

cattle eating it.

We probably don't have time to go into a detailed description of it, but

he has what he calls chicken tractors.

They're large.

I think they're 10 by 20 foot chicken cages with about maybe

30 or 40 chickens in each cage and they're on wheels.

After the cattle go through, he brings these chicken tractors in there, huge

long rows of them.

They move them every day across the field.

They move them, I think, 20 feet per day.

These chickens then eat

the flies and larva and so forth that infest the cow manure

and digest that, and they spread the cow manure so that the cow manure fertilizes the land,

and then they move on to the next step.

Basically, the principles involve using animals the way

God created them.

T -W -E -E -D -S, and the owner of the restaurant owns a bison farm, and man, oh man,

were those bison steaks out of this world.

If anybody listening either lives on Long Island or is visiting there, my former

hometown of Amityville, Long Island, but I used to love to go out east to

Riverhead to Tweed's on occasion, and it will be well worth your trip.

Really love their bison.

Let's see, we have Paul, and Paul lives

in Belmore, Long Island, New York, and Paul asks, what specifically are

the ways in which the government is trying to restrict our food freedom?

A lot of it has to do with the regulation of the meat industry.

There are four meat companies who provide 80

of the meat that we consume in the United States, and those meat

companies work with the Department of Agriculture.

It's sort of a symbiotic relationship where they feed each other, much like

during the COVID thing, we learned

how the pharmaceutical industry works with the

government, and through the regulation is able to

make a lot of money.

It's a similar thing where the large meat corporations use the government to

squeeze out the little guy.

When that happens, you wind up with things like, if you go and eat a fast food

hamburger, the meat in that hamburger probably came from over 100

cows.

So, you know, you talk about food safety, what would be safer to eat

a hamburger from one cow that came from a farmer who you can talk to,

or eating a hamburger from 100 cows that came from who knows where?

I spent my career working in the electronic industry, electronic manufacturing, and one of the things

that was always stressed there was that you can't inspect in quality.

You can't expect what kind of quality?

You cannot inspect in quality.

In quality?

Yeah, you cannot inspect quality into a product.

Oh, I see what you're saying.

Yeah, so you can't have a sloppy manufacturing process and then fix your problems by inspecting

the product.

You have to have a process from the beginning to the end that's efficient and well

made so that the product has inherent quality.

Then a little inspection is good just to make sure everything's okay.

But that's kind of how the meat industry is.

It's all based on these USDA inspections that are done in the

large meat houses.

A farmer now who raises cattle finds it difficult

to get a USDA inspection done on his meat so that he can sell it because

the inspection is tied up with the larger and larger companies.

So this is something that may even originally have started with a

genuine concern for the safety of consumers and citizens

that seems to have spiraled into something perhaps even sinister where

that has nothing to do with the concern.

It has to do with control.

Am I right?

Yeah, well that's an aspect of it.

It's not entirely corrupt to that degree but that's a definite aspect

of it.

Just like things involving the FDA and things involving

experimental pharmaceutical products or all -natural products

that are being investigated and are the subject of

experiments where there are people who believe that there are certain all

-natural things that have qualities that may lessen the safety of the

product.

The possibility of cancer in someone's life and the Food and Drug Administration does not want anybody to

know about that or touch that or take that because they are the kings and

queens of what we use to help improve our health or save our lives

if we're dying of something.

It's really the government getting involved to so deep a

level where they have no business being where we have lost the

sovereignty over our own lives.

That's right.

Not even to mention that the federal government has no business whatsoever inspecting a piece of meat.

That's not even the job at all of the federal government.

But even if you set that aside, the way the system has been

captured by large corporations, it's really not working to

make us more healthy.

There's a difference between food safety and the

quality of food.

Food can be safe.

In other words, it won't make you sick.

But it can be drained of its nutrients and the mass farming practices that are

being implemented because the government policy is driving toward larger and

larger agribusiness.

And they're producing massive amounts of food by

dumping chemical fertilizer on ground that has a short -term benefit

but in the long term wears out the soil and depletes nutrients.

And part of the health problem in our country is likely

due to the fact that our food that we typically eat has fewer and

fewer nutrients that would naturally be in the food if it was grown in a more organic practice,

which is more and more difficult to do because a small farm doing that finds it hard to survive.

We have to go to our final break right now.

And folks, if you have any intention to submit a question for my guest Jim Mogul, do it quickly because we're rapidly running out of

time.

ChrisArnson at gmail .com.

ChrisArnson at gmail .com.

We'll be right back with Jim Mogul.

Do not go away.

The Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society presents The Future of Christendom 2023, The Gospel at

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White of Alpha and Omega Ministries.

We are excited to be including a formal debate in this year's conference.

Dr. James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries will be debating Dr. Gregory Coles, author of Single Gay Christian,

A Personal Journey of Faith and Sexual Identity, the debate topic.

Is gay Christian a biblically acceptable identity for a member of Christ's Church?

So come join us for the 6th Future of Christendom Conference.

The event will take place at Spooky Nook Sports in Mannheim, Pennsylvania and will run from Friday evening through all day Saturday

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James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries here.

I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and I

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And now we're back with Jim Mogul to conclude our discussion on food freedom and agriculture

from a biblical perspective.

I want to make sure before I take any listener question that you summarize what you most wanted to say

today, that you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners about this topic.

Yeah, well, thanks for that.

As far as the food freedom issue is concerned, it's a lot of it has to do with getting

the government out of where it doesn't belong.

And Thomas Massey, Congressman Thomas Massey, has

a bill in Congress called the Prime Act.

And that would allow farmers to bypass some, not all, but some

of the regulatory overreach of the federal government.

And that's a good thing.

He spoke at a conference down at Joel Salatin's Polyface Farm back in May.

My son and I were down to that conference.

It was well attended and a lot of good stuff there.

So if you're interested in the food freedom aspect of it,

that would be a good thing to look into.

I highly recommend Joel Salatin as a resource for this.

You can find his stuff online.

Another man who I have not mentioned is a man named Noah Sanders.

Noah spoke at one of our Future of Christendom conferences a few years ago.

He has written a book called Born Again Dirt.

And if you're interested in a very explicitly Christian view of

agriculture, I highly recommend that book.

His name is Noah Sanders.

You can Google him.

He also has an online organization that you can

join to get a lot of information if you're interested in growing things.

And basically, gardening and farming by God's design is the core of all of

that.

So that's a summary of what I wanted to get across today, Chris.

Great.

And I took the liberty of looking up the website of Joel Salatin

so I can announce that to our listeners.

The website is TheLunaticFarmer .com.

TheLunaticFarmer .com.

And not to be confused with the lunatic talk show host of Iron Sharp Insider Radio.

Oh, hey, one other thing I want to throw in.

Just food for thought.

You can digest this a little bit.

The total farm output annually for the United States is about $175 billion.

And the budget for the United States Department of Agriculture is $196 billion.

Higher than the total food output from our farms.

Wow.

Now, perhaps you could conclude by responding to the knee

-jerk instinctive reactions of many people.

It's not only liberals.

It's a lot of Christians.

A lot of Christians that would profess to be conservative Bible believers.

Where they automatically would say, are you out of your mind?

You want the government out of food inspection and all this kind of thing?

There are going to be people dying all over the country because they're getting poisoned by people who are greedy

business owners.

Greedy food companies who just don't care about the purity and

healthy quality of their food.

People have looked to Big Brother as their protector for so long.

It was very made evident during the whole COVID crisis with

people in churches masked up even long after the mandates were ended.

So just give us a word about why there are people who are wrongly responding

to this thinking that we need Big Brother, the government, to protect

us from ourselves.

And to protect us from people who are selling

food or meat or produce to us.

Yeah, well, you summarized it pretty well.

We need to get away from this mindset that we need the government to protect us every step of the way.

We're responsible for our own lives.

Every decision we make is a cost -benefit analysis.

And so if you're afraid that the meat

you're going to get is not safe, would it not be better to learn where your meat comes

from and take responsibility to buy

meat that's locally grown?

And in fact, we're out of time, brother.

And just wanted to repeat the websites first for Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society,

midatlanticreformation .org, midatlanticreformation .org.

And also the website where you could register for the upcoming conference the 15th through the

17th of September in Lancaster County featuring Dr. James R. White.

And a debate that he is having on the theme, Is Gay Christian a Biblically Acceptable Identity for a Member

of Christ's Church?

That's futureofchristendom .org, futureofchristendom .org.

I want to wish everybody a very safe, happy, and healthy and Christ -honoring weekend and

Lord's Day.

And I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior

than you are a sinner.