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00:30

Well greetings and welcome to The Dividing Line. My name is James White still on the road get home next week, thankfully

00:37

I'm sure my wife. Well, I hope my wife I Just noticed

00:45

I just saw on Twitter that Phoenix has set a new temperature record for the day at 117 degrees

00:54

Yeah, that's pretty toasty Sort of what

01:00

I'm learning from this is if summer takes June off then it's well -rested

01:07

When it hits into July it gets pretty ugly I haven't looked to see what the

01:13

What the dew point is because if dew points up Oh ugly But I haven't heard about any big damaging storms or anything.

01:21

So I'm not where it's that warm at the moment in Colorado, obviously

01:26

We have gotten a lot of storms and stuff here as well But we are still on the road and I am running on a backup computer.

01:35

So I hope everything goes well today I was actually recording a

01:40

Program with dead men walking podcast. We're gonna have to find a time to finish recording that and all of a sudden computer shuts down and The way it happened so quickly

01:53

I'm like because I've been having power problems with there's something wrong with the charging circuit and When I Got it plugged in someplace else and let it charge and stuff like that.

02:06

It came back up Logos was running You know,

02:13

I'm so you know how old I am I am so old I Remember when

02:18

Logos was called libronics We installed it on disks.

02:24

I'm not sure if I had five and a quarter floppies Or only three and a half

02:30

I don't remember now But you you installed it Using big old disks and It has always been a memory hog, it has always been a system hog

02:42

Once you fired that up, you just had to make sure nothing you didn't you didn't have to do anything else

02:47

Maybe a note program you might be able to survive that but it's just always been the way it is and then when it when it's indexes

02:58

So what had happened was it has started indexing and I hadn't noticed it I I'm focused on doing the program and it has started indexing and it just Slammed that that shouldn't kill your system.

03:10

Clearly. I've got a charging problem, but it killed it and it killed it dead So I am on a backup system now the other ones already recharged but I had already done all the work of getting everything loaded onto this one and We'll see how it works.

03:24

We'll see how it works all right, so today I suppose

03:30

I could put this over here and We could we could look at this together

03:40

The only problem is I'm using Kindle and Kindle is questionable as far as How it does stuff and I I suppose

03:54

Let me see how big I can get this Yeah, it's good enough

04:03

It'll work it'll work we'll use it so you can see it as well Sometime yesterday someone posted a graphic and it

04:17

Was titled what is biblicism and It said that it was from the new

04:27

Matthew Barrett book Reformation is renewal and I know that I would assume the paper copy is

04:37

Sitting in my office or someplace. I'm not sure But it came out while I was on this trip and I I read through the graphic and I'm like, okay,

04:48

I I Don't want to necessarily send more money. Dr. Barrett's direction, but I need to make sure this is accurate before I comment on it and so we got the

04:59

Kindle edition of the book and I noticed it was very early on in in the book itself

05:08

And so I started looking at I confirmed it was accurate. It was the text from from the book and I Was looking this morning started reading through the through the book up to that point it's like I said, it's early on um,

05:27

I Don't think we're gonna have to worry about too many people just picking it up and reading it. It It is not designed to be

05:38

Easily understood or anything like that and What was odd is

05:48

This section on what is biblicism just seemed to be Just dropped in It didn't flow naturally from what came before It's very strange

06:04

I'm not sure why the editors Did what they did or maybe there wasn't anything they could do about it.

06:10

I don't know. It was it was very very odd very strange and So I Want to Wrote a little article.

06:23

I don't know about six months ago. So now about reformed biblicism because until Just the past couple of years.

06:33

I Cannot possibly imagine any context Amongst Reformed Baptists and conservative

06:42

Presbyterians and and Just believing evangelicals and stuff.

06:47

I I just can't imagine a context in which Someone would have if someone had said yeah,

06:54

I I I'm a biblicist that someone would have said. Oh, I Can't believe that you'd be such a radical

07:02

We considered the term to be a Compliment It indicated a

07:11

Central focus on Scripture as the Word of God as authoritative certainly for me dealing with Roman Catholicism dealing with Pseudo -christian

07:28

Cults that Have other books of scripture other sources of authority

07:36

It Would never cross my mind to be offended at someone

07:42

Who would say that they were a biblicist? Now at the same time You know,

07:49

I don't have the information in front of me Sorry just lots of things going on right now, but the index for Fully searchable index for the dividing line,

08:05

I think is pretty much ready to be used We're gonna have to I Don't know if maybe

08:14

I'll have one of our guys be on the program to help explain all this because I've I Don't know how to really use it yet But I was told a couple days ago that it's it's probably ready to go and I don't know yet Exactly what it's covering.

08:35

I think it's all the dividing lines and all the debates right now I don't think the sermons are included, but hopefully we'll be eventually and That's gonna be really neat obviously we're gonna need to have sort of like a portal to it so you can just go there from our website and And all sorts of neat stuff like that and I obviously really need to learn how to use it

08:57

But if we were to use that and go back I think you would find me talking about You and your

09:09

Bible under a tree we could search for Bible plus under a tree and We could go many many many many many years back where I have been speaking to those who attempt to Isolate the

09:32

Bible from the church Isolate themselves and their Bible from the church

09:39

From what God has done been doing in the church Building the kingdom of God All of this type of stuff.

09:48

I've been talking about that for a long long time and Saying you know, it's not you and your

09:54

Bible under tree. It's not you reinventing the wheel with with each Generation we stand on the shoulders of Giants and We should be very thankful for those have come before us at the same time

10:08

I Have often made reference to the former professor of church history

10:15

I was gonna look it up, but again once the computer went wacky and had everything else didn't have time to but at the

10:23

Old Covenant Seminary Fellow who taught church history there for years I listened to his series a number of times and one of the things

10:31

I really liked is He would finish each class either with a quotation that was a positive

10:41

Thanks to God for what he had done in the church in the past Or More of a

10:54

Help us to learn from the errors and the mistakes of those in the past and and look in a lot of lessons

11:00

You wanted to quote both of them and you could have quoted both pretty easily and That's what church history is all about is

11:13

In a mature fashion learning to take the positive and Learn from the negative but a biblicist will always a reformed biblicist

11:29

That's a term that I I used I wrote a article I interestingly enough used

11:40

Calvin's response to satellito 1539 as the foundation for that I had done some dividing lines where we had looked at least one where we had looked at Calvin's response to satellito as an example of reformed biblicism because he is making the argument that because the

12:04

Reformers are Teaching what the Apostles taught and testing it by Scripture that they are more small see

12:15

Catholic and more Connected to the ancient church then the

12:21

Roman Catholic Church of the 16th century because of all of the accretion of Massive amounts of unbiblical tradition

12:31

Barrett starts his book at the same place and I don't really have time to do it today, but I would

12:40

He starts that chapter with a citation from Calvin's response to satellito.

12:45

I would encourage everybody to read about two pages before and two pages after to get a

12:51

Significantly more accurate understanding of What Calvin was saying in that in that quote anyway?

12:59

So we've we've talked about Biblicism we've talked about the importance of it and what you know, what's what are the what are the alternatives and So when

13:11

I read this section of the book And like I said, it just it just drops out it just drops into the text it very strange

13:23

It is not Historical scholarship at all. It's a diatribe.

13:29

It's it's an argument. It's a It's a straw man argument, but it's an argument anyways and in fact someone in our chat channel

13:43

Noted that my son -in -law Eric had posted a 10 tweet thread on Confessionalism and I verified this but the reason he did that was he was

13:59

Illustrating how easy it is to straw man another position He's going after confessionalists

14:06

But it's not fair and it's not even handed and it's obviously got You know a point that is trying to make and it ignores all sorts of other things that a confessionalist would believe or say and So it's it's easy to do this kind of thing and here it is the beginning of this massive book

14:26

What does this say here 981 pages, yeah, okay, so that's that's that's that's a lot of verbiage and And It just it strikes me that Matthew Barrett credo magazine

14:43

Midwestern These are the people that are promoting this

14:51

Thomistic Renaissance this Reformation is renewal whatever you want to say.

15:02

This does not reflect well on The Mindset and attitude that is behind this book.

15:11

It really really really doesn't But we need to look at it. I think it's important to think through these things

15:17

Because a lot of people are confused or sitting here going. Well, I thought we were Biblicists but now there's all these people saying that we're not

15:24

Biblicists and and the Biblicism is dangerous and what what's the what's this all about and Unfortunately for a lot of folks the lines have already been drawn that's it

15:36

There's nothing more to be said but well, uh, we'll take a look at this and Make some comments as we as we go along.

15:46

So let's uh, let's look at it and Oops, that's not what I wanted. I wanted that one. There we go.

15:54

And One over there, there we go And I'm wondering if we've still got this

16:04

Yeah, but it's the teeny tiny again. We're back to Minutes go me but that's sort of actually allows you to read the text.

16:13

So that's that's fun What is Biblicism to be

16:18

Protestant? Is to believe in biblical authority. That's a much of a

16:27

Observation however Biblical authority and Biblicism are not synonymous

16:36

Again, two sentences in a row that really don't say anything who would think that they are

16:43

Biblicism moves beyond believing in the final authority of the Bible to imposing a restrictive hermeneutical method onto the

16:54

Bible really Says who I don't know evidently dr.

17:03

Barrett gets to define these things now What what Herman is are we saying that Biblicism that the hermeneutic of Biblicism is

17:18

Such that Scripture is

17:24

Unique ontologically as being the honest us and That your hermeneutic

17:32

Has to take that in consideration. Is that what we mean by? some restrictive hermeneutic,

17:39

I don't know so here's here's sub points number one a

17:45

Historical mindset Biblicism is a haughty disregard

17:52

Chronological snobbery in the words of C .S. Lewis for the history of interpretation and the authority of creeds and confessions

17:59

Chanting an individualistic mantra no creed, but the Bible which in practice translates into no authority

18:06

But me now this is exactly What Trent horn and the

18:11

Roman Catholics say about all Protestants? I? Pretty much word for word pretty much word for word

18:21

And as I've said to Roman Catholics all along stop straw manning us now I say to Matthew Barrett stop straw manning us

18:29

Now again, can you find people? Can you find people on Twitter that believe that let's let's just ask a different question

18:41

Don't you think that on Twitter you could find someone who believes almost anything yeah,

18:47

I'd say so but As a reformed biblicist

18:56

I teach church history and have since 1990 so almost quarter of a century

19:06

So reformed biblicism is Not a disregard of The history of interpretation in fact

19:16

I think it's vital for us to recognize for example the the deep damage that was done by origin and the acceptance of origins

19:30

Perspectives and influencing people for many many generations

19:38

Into the medieval period all the way up to the Reformation So history of interpretation you mean like Reading Burkhoff and understanding the development of Christian doctrine and the different kinds of you know looking at Augustine and and seeing when he got it right and then also when he got it wrong and Sometimes right and wrong on the same page is that looking at the influence of neoplatonism on Augustine and his development in theology

20:13

No one's saying you should ignore any of those things are there people that don't know anything about any of that stuff.

20:20

Yeah Doesn't make them biblicists And the authority of creeds and confessions, that's a really really major major topic

20:31

I Personally, I'll just be honest with you. I'm just being straightforward with you here.

20:37

I I hope dr. Barrett does not Engage in any debates with Roman Catholic apologists because I I think the result would be

20:47

Pretty Epic epically bad Because I'm not sure how he would even engage

20:59

With a With Roman Catholics who are really promoting the authority of Rome The Allegation of Abandoning creeds and confessions that was of course aimed at the reformers themselves and how they responded to that was not by an unbridled and unquestioned reaffirmation

21:27

But by an appeal to apostolic authority. It's too bad that Calvin never finished his

21:36

Responses to Trent. Well, obviously goodness is he died? Um, but When he was responding to Trent's decrees

21:47

It's fascinating how you know, here's here's create a confession. Yeah, but you don't have the right to do these things

21:53

You don't have you don't have the right to create this kind of dogma That has to come from Scripture itself so, um

22:06

No creed, but the Bible well Church of Christ has been saying that for a long time So is this if this is only about the

22:14

Church of Christ I didn't realize they were such a Such an important and vital movement in our day

22:21

That in your opening chapter that you drop this Anti -biblicism bomb right in the middle of it

22:29

That doesn't seem to be who they're aiming at But No creed, but the

22:36

Bible, you know, I've heard a lot of people say that I hear Unitarian say that which in practice

22:44

Translates into no authority, but me so there that again That's Jimmy Akin.

22:50

That's Trent horn. That's Patrick Madrid. That's Mark Brumley, that's

22:58

You just go down the line in Fact think about it go back to the dividing line from from Monday That is exactly

23:08

What Trent horn says when he defines sola scriptura at the beginning of his comments member?

23:15

identical now coming from the head of the

23:20

Department of Theology or whatever it is at Midwestern So next line sola scriptura is radicalized into solo scriptura

23:31

Okay As we said many many times. This is a standard canard We've demonstrated it to be a canard

23:42

I Remember when I think it was Mathison Popularized this in a article a number of years ago.

23:50

I remember Bill Webster David King Myself, we all discussed whether this was a useful phrase or not and The idea again

24:06

If all we're talking about is a small sect of the

24:12

Church of Christ, maybe no instruments Handling snakes in West Virginia someplace.

24:23

Okay, but that we all know that's not who's being addressed We all know that we know what this is actually being aimed at and Anyone who says that in my book scripture alone in the

24:42

Roman Catholic controversy in The debates I've done in defending solo scriptura that I'm pretty

24:48

Presenting solo scriptura is a liar or they're just so confused.

24:54

They shouldn't you shouldn't really bother listening to them One of the two it's both are possible.

25:00

It's astonishing to me how many people Are making comments about me who've obviously never watched this program wouldn't even know how to find it

25:11

Have not read my books have not listened to the debates You Know you you may have seen on social media

25:21

We are Looking at well,

25:28

Chris Arnson has pretty much lined up Someone for the debate in just now less than two months and in God's Providence, by the way

25:38

Taking a brief detour here for a second. We'll come back This may be providential the reason

25:45

I say this Is if we end up debating the individual that we're looking at right now who's already said it should be able to work

25:58

His Position and Argument is

26:06

Very directly relevant to the movement To create an affirming

26:17

Affirming An affirming allegedly conservative evangelical acceptance of gay

26:24

Christianity Why is that so important right now? Andy Stanley Andy Stanley We have been talking about his trajectory his arc for quite some time and I was informed a few days ago that there is a conference coming up At his church churches

26:48

Campuses whatever And when I looked at the names of the people that are gonna be involved with it

26:53

One just leapt off. I was gonna say left off the page, but you really can't say that You can't say that These days so it left off the screen maybe

27:06

I don't know doesn't have quite the same panache to it David Gushy David Gushy's could be speaking now

27:16

I noticed and The information was given to me had to give me this information had to tell me this

27:22

I didn't recognize the other names but The vast majority of the names are people that are involved with affirming ministries people that are seeking to affirm the propriety of identifying as gay

27:36

Christians and accepting gay Christianity and things like that and So With all those coming but as soon as you see

27:45

David Gushy, you just know now a lot of you Newer listeners. I Don't remember what year it was again.

27:52

Once we put the page up or we can search this We'll be able to pull this up very very quickly

28:00

But a number of years ago I spent I'm thinking that when I respond to the

28:06

Matthew Vines The Matthew Vines response was five hours long. His talk was about an hour and ten minutes so he played all of that so you can figure out the rest from there and then

28:18

David Gushy spoke at Matthew Vines event and I Again I think we total on that was six hours including the hour -long talk so We provided a deep response to David Gushy If he's speaking, then, you know, what's coming at North Point?

28:45

and a lot of people called this when His Andy Stanley's father died that this was probably what let the dam break and the direction the unhitching

29:01

From the Old Testament would become the unhitching from everything else in the process Becoming a red -letter

29:07

Christian and that kind of progressivism that we see all the time and so Hopefully that debate will be will be very useful but starting to move back to our topic here

29:24

Next February Lord willing a lot of things can happen between now and February The economy could collapse

29:34

We could have Chinese troops in the streets invited here by the regime who knows but Lord willing and We still have food fuel the ability to travel we are looking at a marathon month of February I I must hate myself to schedule what we're scheduling in that month but right now we're looking at Five debates minimally in the month of February and Trent Horne has already

30:17

Mentioned on social media that we are looking at sola scriptura and purgatory as Debate topics in Houston There are two other individuals

30:34

That One hasn't responded yet one has that we're arranging

30:41

In talking about as far as the debates are concerned One of those is

30:47

Dale Tuggy on is Jesus Yahweh and Then outside of the

30:55

Houston these are in Houston the Lutheran Church in Houston that has been just been so helpful in Scheduling so many things as far as debates are concerned

31:06

There's one be one more there. Hopefully be have information on that person's acceptance of the challenge and then a debate in Tullahoma at Jeffrey Rice's conference same month on the subject of Calvinism so It's the the issue of Sola scriptura will once again be addressed and It's gonna be very interesting to challenge

31:46

Trent Horne if he attempts to use Poirier, I will challenge him on the basis of the actual data

31:57

The TLG databases Semantic domains If you're going to if you're going to Use the if you're gonna present those argument arguments

32:08

You need to be able to back them up same thing with Dale Tuggy Dale Tuggy will present a lot of secondary language arguments but he is not in any position himself to evaluate the validity or consistency of said arguments because As far as I can tell he he does not possess

32:24

The scholarship training in biblical languages semantic domains Issues related to that to be able to to do so We saw that in regards to textual criticism too in an earlier response to him anyway

32:41

So February is gonna be pretty amazing Very very intense and the church in Houston does live stream the events and Yeah, we're already already talking about making sure that when we live stream them.

33:00

You'll be able to see the screens easier They have the same board that I have sitting right here

33:08

And so there are ways of doing that that we're gonna work on with the audio -visual guys so pray toward that end pray for the church in Houston and And Ed McClanahan the pastor there who's doing a lot of this work is we're not paying him to do it he does it because he feels that these are useful just like we do and so we're very

33:29

Thankful to be able to partner with him and doing all of this stuff So those are some major things coming up and obviously that's gonna require a tremendous amount of work on my part to prepare and at this time

33:41

I'm being straight up. I'm putting together folks to help me do research. I My debates in the past have almost always been just me myself and I partly because if you're in cross -examination

33:53

You didn't do all your own research It's gonna come out but when you're doing trying to do this many debates on Widely divergent topics

34:07

Yeah, I'm I'm more than happy to say and I know my opponents always have people

34:12

I've watched my opponents I'm not just talking about a glacier I'm not talking about having a bunch of setting up bunched tables behind us and have people running around books

34:25

No, we're not gonna do it. Um But I know That when

34:31

I debated in Houston against Ratton on Molinism There was a whole bunch of people that worked on the on on that presentation and And so I we've been up against that before but this time

34:46

I'm just like with this this amount of this breadth of information to cover

34:53

We're gonna we're gonna we're gonna need to have some folks give assistance with all that because little old me just Yeah, it's a lot.

35:04

So anyway all this to bring us back to Um When we want that one of those debates

35:14

Will be on solo scripture. It will be with Trenthorne and we know exactly what it's gonna end up focusing on as well, it must as well it needs to and What I will defend is solo scripture and not the absurd misrepresentation of solo scripture

35:36

You know, I I believe That Fulgentius of Rusp was a

35:50

Fellow believer of mine. That's what makes so many of this when when

35:57

Remember I did the response At the beginning of the last trip one of the first things

36:04

I recorded in here by myself To the

36:09

Roman Catholic argument that was being presented. How can you believe that, you know, Martin Luther was the first Christian after 1 ,500 years.

36:17

I don't and I can see how a solo script or a person might come up with something like that.

36:24

But that's That's straw man argumentation. It's it's irrelevant and So anyway get that out there continuing

36:34

The solo scripture is radicalized into solo scripture as a result Biblicism fails to let theology and form exegesis, which is designed to guard against heresy as a result

36:48

Biblicism fails to let theology and form exegesis well oops

36:57

There we go, um, oh, I'm sorry I didn't well I'll Pull it up after I make my comments here if by theology inform exegesis

37:13

You mean that we recognize that we are handling the

37:19

Word of God and we Interpret the Bible in light of its entire canon and in light of what

37:27

God did with Israel bringing the Messiah The the gospel going in all the world

37:35

If that's what you mean, okay But I want to know what someone means when they say theology

37:45

Informs exegesis Because I have every time

37:51

I have debated Roman Catholic their theology informed their exegesis right out of the

37:57

Bible I have when when you When you stand in Rome And I'm not gonna get to any of the other topics.

38:08

I was gonna cover today. I'm just I'm realizing that right now I'm not gonna get to any of them. I'm looking at the clock and It's like well,

38:16

I know what we're gonna be doing on Friday but I Was gonna get to gravel sharp in Titus the second

38:24

Peter, but we'll do that and I'm also going to respond To Steve camp because Steve camp

38:32

Has said that if you're a post -millennialist you mistranslate Matthew 28 and he doesn't even mean mistranslate

38:40

Means misinterpret. I'm not sure why he said translate, but we'll respond to it on on that time

38:48

At that time but this is pretty important stuff and The people promoting this stuff they have the publishing houses and most the seminaries and We have our

39:05

RV And I think we're winning anyways, but anyway, um

39:14

Biblicism fails to let theology inform exegesis. Well Christian theology has as its basis

39:22

Exegesis So, this is a chicken -and -the -egg thing which comes first and It sounds like what they're saying is what look we

39:36

We're not reinventing the wheel Okay, we're not reinventing the wheel But the wheel doesn't come off the axle in other words

39:50

The wheel has to first have been formed out of the very substance of divine revelation you can't get past that and once you get past that as Has happened many times in the history of the church once you get past that You end up with doctrines

40:14

Being taught with the authority of dogma that are utterly

40:21

Absent From the preaching and teaching of the Apostles of Jesus Christ, let's use as an example purgatory

40:30

Purgatory developed over centuries Purgatory is a natural development of human religion rather than divine revelation

40:39

But it developed slowly over time until it finally reached its final dogmatic form in the 15th century and Became the basis of some of the most

40:54

Outrageous Blasphemies against the gospel you could ever see you stand there again in In Rome, that's where I was going before and you look up at the cupola in the

41:07

Vatican and you have Matthew 16 the alleged Petrine promise in gold solid gold up there in the ceiling

41:20

And Every time I've debated a Roman Catholic on the papacy

41:27

That theology has informed their exegesis

41:35

Their theology of the papacy does not come from exegesis But is their exegesis is informed by their theology

41:47

So, that's why I look at these guys that Blithely say these things and go.

41:52

I hope you guys stay out of the debate realm because It it's ugly when you all wander into it because you'd get run over like us like run over by by a steamroller because if you want to start talking about the great tradition and everything else

42:16

If you're sitting there and and you you're so Emphasizing certain aspects of historical theology that your students are drawing pictures of Thomas Aquinas for you

42:28

You're gonna have a hard time in a debate with Roman Catholic if they're sharp Because all they have to do is go

42:35

Really glad that you see the importance of Thomas's deep understanding of the doctrine of God But let me show you what that necessarily means

42:47

Good luck with that. So so evidently the idea is

42:54

Theology informs exegesis, which is designed to guard against heresy. Okay, if what you mean by that is

43:01

That we're not a tabula rasa we don't just come to the text and we don't care about its history or its context or its language or Hermeneutics or anything like that and then

43:10

Pete and when people do that, which they do every day in Twitter They come up with all sorts of wild and wacky and strange stuff

43:17

Okay, but that's not what that's aimed at that's not what this is aimed at he's not talking about Twitter At all so got to think these things through number two irresponsible proof texting oops

43:38

Ta -da irresponsible proof texting biblicism treats scripture as if it is a dictionary or encyclopedia as If the theologian merely excavates the right proof text chapter and verse tallying them up to support a doctrine

43:56

Biblicism limits itself to those beliefs Explicitly laid down in Scripture and fails to deduce doctrines from Scripture by good and necessary consequence.

44:06

Oh How long before Barrett becomes a paedo -baptist I wonder

44:11

I don't know But I know we're good and necessary consequence comes from and I know how it's used Oh, yeah.

44:17

Yeah. Yeah Heard that one before it's why the Baptist used a different phrase

44:22

Okay Again This is not meant to be a fair treatment.

44:29

And this is what these guys are doing is In their talks in their podcast, they'll take shots

44:37

I'm really have to I'm really sad to have to announce That after four attempts and the last three

44:45

I know got through to contact dr. Carl Truman To ask him are you talking about me you talking about me you're looking at me

45:00

To to ask him you know, you're talking about this conservative

45:05

Baptist and Philippians chapter 2 and Everybody's saying that's me Carl. Is that me? Because hey, we've done stuff together in the past.

45:13

We stood in a graveyard with Phil Johnson and Mike Abendroth in New England and talked about the gospel and stuff like that and and afterwards we kept in contact and we talked about tour de

45:28

France and All sorts of stuff like that Four times Last three times were to the email address specifically listed on the website at the school at which he is currently teaching

45:43

Won't respond to me won't respond to me. So if if if you write to someone saying are you talking about me and You won't even respond to them.

45:51

That is not as clear a way of saying yes, I'm talking about you. So unfortunately

45:58

What you hear and this the last one was Carl Truman with Matthew Barrett So they're throwing this stuff out and they're they're making accusations but they won't name names because if they name names then they actually have to do their homework and back up what they're saying and If they don't back up what they're saying and they misrepresent what's being said they know that we can demonstrate that that we can document that very very clearly and so that's what you've got in this is this is just a

46:35

Blast that's dropped down in the middle of nowhere in the book That contains all the canards and all the straw men

46:46

That again, you can find people like this over here and then over here they're not going to be consistently in any one place and those those who have been saying hey, your your fascination with Thomas is misplaced and And it's gonna result in more people like the young man who was received in the

47:06

Roman Catholic Church just a few months ago Who was a student of Matthew Barrett? It's gonna result in more and more of that Not in some simplistic sense.

47:17

That's what they want to do. They're all gonna be swimming the time right? They just dismiss it laughingly

47:24

It's when your best students think through what you're saying and Take it to its proper conclusion

47:35

That they are going to be asking authority questions and Epistemological questions that you're not addressing and I don't think you're ready to address.

47:48

I would love to know what Matthew Barrett said To that student of his if he even addressed it

47:55

In Maybe but did they meet? I don't know. I don't know. I'd like to know what he would have said

48:04

I'd like I'd like to be a fly on the wall or a gnat on the wall and By the way, we've evidently have a storm coming in.

48:13

I'm hearing lots of thunder outside, but I'm sort of Busy, so I haven't been noticing it. Let me see here.

48:19

I don't see any Raindrops on the window. So if it's not pouring down, we'll we'll probably be fine.

48:25

Anyway These The Idea of well, you're you're ignoring

48:38

The context of Scripture you're ignoring the fact that it it's not in a dictionary or encyclopedia

48:46

This is not obviously these people are not doing proper hermeneutics at all just accurately handling the text of Scripture and biblicism limits itself to those beliefs explicitly that lay down Scripture and Fails to deuce doctrines from Scripture by good and that's a necessary consequence.

49:05

Well, okay. Exactly. Where do you draw the line there? Um, It does seem you guys are willing to Dogmatize Particular developments that took place centuries and centuries after the

49:25

Apostles I Mean if you're gonna dogmatize Thomas and you're talking, you know, 1 ,200 years down the road but There there is that we do have to ask yourself the question.

49:41

How far can you go? How far? do the headlights of Scripture shine and Allow us to make secondary and tertiary

49:56

Applications and Where do you draw? the dogma line

50:05

Do where is Scripture enough are the Apostles enough or Do we need to have all sorts of stuff beyond them and once you get there

50:18

Once you get to that point How do you not invest in?

50:25

the church some kind of ultimate interpretational dogmatic authority

50:33

And at that point I I don't see how you avoid Rome Eastern Orthodoxy You know, those are the big major ones

50:45

You can they might be some little ones running around trying to make some type of apostolic claim. But how do you avoid that?

50:53

Good question. I'm not sure if you're able to hear that but Nice nice thunder rolling around outside right now

51:01

So I'd like to know what these good and necessary good and necessarily consequent

51:07

Doctrines are specifically Number three anti metaphysics

51:14

Biblicism undervalues the use of philosophy in the service of exegesis and theology

51:21

Biblicism is especially allergic to metaphysics Failing to understand how the study of being should safeguard who

51:29

God is e .g. Pure Act. Ah Aristotle, yes Thomas yes in contrast to the creature because you're not gonna find that in the

51:39

Bible anywhere, right? I Mean Isaiah 40 48 ain't enough for that My thoughts are above your thoughts ain't enough for that.

51:48

No, come on. Those are just those are just prophets Yeah, you silly biblicists you you need something much more than that Sorry, um as a result

52:06

Biblicism conflates theology and economy as If who

52:12

God is in himself can be read straight off the pages of Scripture When these pages are often focused on historical events crucifixion historical event

52:27

Wow highest ultimate revelation of who God is we've ever seen

52:33

Happened in history and I'm well aware of the fact that Isaiah 40 to 48 trial of false gods smacked out in the middle of history

52:42

Huh, so I guess we cannot read straight off the page of Scripture who

52:48

God is without Aristotle Is that we're being told here? Is that what we're gonna because I think that's what it is.

52:59

That is where it's going and That's why I am quite confident

53:06

That if I live as long as my dad lived which I don't know that I will That's all in God's hands.

53:13

But if I live as long as my dad lived I Will see this movement in the rearview mirror as It careens off into the same wrecking

53:26

Yard as all the rest of them That have happened Every couple generations, it's gonna happen

53:35

Because you know what? God Has revealed himself in Scripture with clarity and with beauty and with depth and Not a single writer of Scripture ever ever dreamed that you needed

53:53

Aristotle to understand not once not once and if if the men with whom

54:03

I have served over the years and defended

54:09

Christian theology Want to go this direction, I'm just simply saying to you brothers

54:16

Have a nice journey and we'll be here when you get back Well, we'll keep your room open for you unequivocal

54:28

Predication. I'm sorry univocal univocal predicate biblicism assumes language used of God in The text should be applied to God in a direct fashion as if the meaning of an attribute

54:47

Predicated of man has the same meaning when predicated of God By consequence biblicism risks historicizing

54:56

God by means of a literalistic interpretation of the text why

55:09

Who assumes who assumes that? If you listen to the Bible God says my thoughts are not your thoughts.

55:17

My ways are higher than your ways. I'm not like you and if you take that seriously Then you're not gonna do what

55:25

Joseph Smith did and Take passages of Scripture and Turn it into some absurd statement

55:35

About God being a man Or something along those lines. So as if the meaning of an attribute predicated of man has the same meaning predicated

55:46

Who does that? I? Mean, I don't even think the Church of Christ people do that Who does that?

55:53

I don't know. I don't know But we're certainly creating a boogeyman out of biblicism, aren't we?

55:59

Oh, it's it's bad. Oh, this is this is horrible Hearing the rain. Yes, the rain hath arrived

56:07

So biblicism risks historicizing God by means of a literalistic interpretation of the text

56:17

Literalistic. So do we need origin here? Do we need a do we need an allegorical interpretation?

56:23

Do we need to do what? What Thomas did? when so often Commenting in Scripture completely missing the direct meaning and Going elsewhere.

56:34

Is that we need to do? Is that what they're teaching a Midwestern? I really do you Do you

56:40

Southern Baptists whose churches are supporting Midwestern? Are you listening to this?

56:46

Hello? anybody out there Are any the are any of the the the people in charge, you know?

56:55

Addressing this North the idea it's raining pretty good out there right now.

57:02

I'm not sure rich if you can hear that rich is price it Rich is by sitting there at the

57:07

ATEM controls going. I will be able to filter it out It doesn't matter if it's raining hard under the roof.

57:14

I can get rid of it Coming down good.

57:28

Oh Yeah, I mean this is a nice Soaking rain, it's not gonna wash this away or anything

57:37

But like I said, it's 117 in Phoenix right now you probably wish it was raining Yes, I I can't see the

57:45

I can't see my my temperature thing down there Wow Okay.

57:52

Now I hear it. Yeah, I can't hear it at all. Okay. Oh We reserved two hours on two.

57:58

Oh you have to reserve a certain amount of time. Oh Time limitations, okay.

58:05

All right, I will keep that in mind. We're coming up on one hour. So Mega is the longest we can do on Twitter.

58:13

So Okay, we will we will keep that You have to fill it off So if I don't go two hours on this one topic, which obviously rich wants me to be talking about anyways then

58:29

I have to pay for the extra time. We don't use Anyways, okay

58:36

Little break there to enjoy the sound of the rain actually This is perfect for napping

58:45

And at my age, it's like it's about right time for nap Actually, I can't go very long because I have a dinner appointment this evening with dear friends

58:54

So I I will I will just press on here, okay number five restrictive revelation

59:03

Biblicism is a suspicion or even dismissiveness toward the diverse ways and This is obviously a typo because it says

59:14

God's God has revealed himself Limiting itself to the book of Scripture while shunning the book of creation biblicism is often suspicious towards natural theology well

59:31

Obviously since the Bible says That God has revealed certain aspects of his being

59:40

Through nature then if you're a biblicist you believe that But yes a

59:49

Biblicist is going to very much be suspicious of people who use uninspired non -revealed categories and standards to limit what the

01:00:01

Bible can actually say and Going farther to say that without these external categories

01:00:10

You're not to be able to understand what divine revelation actually says and so if we're when we talk about Natural again see dr.

01:00:22

Johnson's books I Think is very helpful book is coming out very soon.

01:00:28

I read it a number of months ago That will Reignite this argument, but yes

01:00:37

Natural theology has been used as an excuse to smuggle in external categories that fundamentally overthrow

01:00:47

Biblical categories exegetical categories apostolic prophetic categories, and there's a long history of this in church history

01:00:54

There is no question about that There is no reason to shun the book of creation but the book of creation always is secondary to and interpreted in light of The categories provided in Scripture.

01:01:08

I'll stand on that one any day No problem Number six over emphasis on the human author.

01:01:16

Here we go Biblicism neglects the divine authors intent and ability to transcend any one human author as result biblicism struggles to explain the unity of the canon and Christological fulfillment nor does it provide the metaphysics necessary to explain attributes of Scripture like an inspiration and inerrancy well

01:01:40

We have already seen so many times That when we challenge

01:01:47

When people are going beyond the apostolic testimony we challenge them and they're like well there's a there's a deeper meaning you see and You shouldn't be limited

01:02:00

To what the human author understood. Well, of course no one's saying That you are limited to what the human author

01:02:07

Understood because that human author only had access to a certain amount amount of divine revelation

01:02:13

But the point is if you're going to interpret a passage of Scripture You have to interpret it as the author intended it when he communicated it now when you see how it

01:02:23

Relates to this other author over here and relates there are themes that are woven through Scripture No one

01:02:30

I've said that over and over and over again for a long long time but be very careful what these people

01:02:38

I'm just gonna be honest what these people want to do is they want to open the door to external sources of Definition and external sources of limitation as to what as To what

01:02:56

Scripture can possibly be saying? Again history is full of this.

01:03:02

It's happened over and over and over and over again and Of course eventually what you have in Rome is church

01:03:11

The church has the ability to not only interpret the written aspect of tradition but the oral aspect as well and the church has this living insight and and so you end up with all these dogmas and teachings and doctrines and You're supposed to accept them like anything else and the

01:03:31

Reformers come along and say no We're not going to do that. The Apostles didn't teach that so the question is

01:03:38

If we're talking about Paul, let's listen to Paul Biblicism neglects the divine authors intent and ability to transcend

01:03:48

Paul as Result biblicism struggles to explain the unity of the canon.

01:03:54

Why? Why I mean if what's being said here is

01:04:01

That you don't believe that all of this was intended by God from the beginning to be a

01:04:11

Singular revelation given to his church that it had binding authority at each time during history

01:04:19

But that it was God's ultimate intention That he would give to his church a completed canon we all believe that every biblicist

01:04:28

I know believes that and So I'm not saying that That that Isaiah When he received his when he receives the revelation of Isaiah 9 6

01:04:48

That Isaiah had a full understanding of what that was going to mean not saying that But It was

01:04:58

God's intention that Isaiah 9 6 be in the same canon with John 1 1 and Hence give to us in the church today a full understanding of the deity of Christ so When you when you don't start

01:05:18

With the original intent of the author I'm suspicious that you're gonna be going someplace else

01:05:26

That does not mean that you can't see the unity of the canon

01:05:35

Or Christological fulfillment in the New Testament doesn't mean any of that. That's a pure strawman canard canard

01:05:43

Again, this is not This is like this was something that was written for credo magazine that just accidentally got dumped in the middle of stuff here

01:05:53

Um, this isn't historical theology going on Nor does it provide the metaphysic necessary to explain attributes of Scripture like inspiration and inerrancy

01:06:03

Okay, what what? Where's where's those what metaphysics are those?

01:06:10

Where they come from Do we need do we need Aristotle now to have inspiration and inerrancy?

01:06:18

What but tell us what like to know what because I've always discussed inspiration and inerrancy on the basis of Scripture and So Since that's now wrong what's what's the basis that we need and Once you explain that basis,

01:06:39

I'd really love to see you defend even your definition of solo scriptura be really interesting to see

01:06:49

Um These points are taken boy. Is this obvious or not? These points are taken from my forthcoming systematic theology

01:06:57

Baker academic. Oh We can't wait. We're so benighted till then

01:07:05

For a critique of biblicism today and a call to return to the Reformation understanding of authority see our

01:07:11

Scott Clark Recovering the Reformed confession As for the origins of the word the earliest use the word biblicism in English occurred in 1827 and a word by in a work by Sophie Fingen in criticism of biblicism in 1874

01:07:27

JJ van Oosterzee defined it as idolatry of the letter and Then it just shifts.

01:07:36

It's like I mean this was whoever the editor here is should be whipped with the wet noodle because this is

01:07:47

Really bad. I mean, this does not flow. There's no connection. I mean,

01:07:53

I've written more books than Matthew Barrett has and This is just bad.

01:07:59

This was rushed This was not edited appropriately at all because it just sort of ends there.

01:08:06

I'm gonna take a shot. I'm gonna I'm gonna drop a A an argument from my forthcoming systematic theology book from Baker academic and I'm gonna drop it in here and then we're just gonna move on from there and I'm just gonna let leave you wondering

01:08:24

What just happened? Why did this just happen? I don't know but there it is

01:08:32

So I saw it and I'm like Who is this aimed at because there's there's no references

01:08:44

There's no illustrations. It's so easy. These guys just find it so easy because they are so good.

01:08:52

They're so sheltered in They're little academic halls of covered with ivy that we don't have to do that.

01:08:59

We can just throw stuff out and Everyone's gonna go. Oh, you're so wise. Well, so are you?

01:09:05

Oh, man, you're so smart Okay What good is it?

01:09:11

Other than result in a book that's next to impossible to follow Yeah, that's

01:09:19

That's amazing stuff. That's amazing stuff. So like I said If you'd like to see a really well -written.

01:09:28

It's short. It's brief but we rebuttal to this

01:09:34

That appeared on Twitter Eric Yeager at milk toast on rye

01:09:44

At milk toast milk toast o n r y e

01:09:50

Did a 10 Tweet thread on Confessionalism where he did the same thing to confessionalism that Barrett did here to biblicism and that is just I Don't have a straw man

01:10:05

And I am I do have something to light up a straw man if I had a straw man with me But I don't have a straw man with me.

01:10:11

I do need to have a mobile straw man so someone sent us the

01:10:18

Straw man that we we have in the in the studio, but we don't have a mobile straw man and that's that's problematic but Yeah on Twitter, which is where we are, which is so nice.

01:10:31

Don't leave here yet, but but Eric put together a good thing. It does it does same thing to confessionalism that Barrett just did to the straw man of biblicism and It's all it's all part of the program it's all part of the program.

01:10:48

So there you go. Um, So obviously don't have time to do the other topics

01:10:55

I was going to be doing we've gone ten minutes over that's fine let me just go ahead and and wrap up with Just a couple comments to our dear friends

01:11:07

Steve camp who I Don't know

01:11:14

I'm not sure exactly what Steve spends his time doing but every once while he just comes out Lobs a few bombs and then disappears again for a while and I'm not sure exactly why that works, but He posted a

01:11:29

Twitter thread Started off like this Not one

01:11:36

Postmill theonomist translates the text of the Great Commission accurately not one now obviously

01:11:47

What Steve meant to say? Was that not one post mill theonomist?

01:11:54

Understands the text of the Great Commission the way that Steve camp does okay.

01:12:00

That's what he should have said Steve camp doesn't read

01:12:06

Greek to my knowledge Do you Steve because back when I knew you You'd ask me questions about stuff like that number

01:12:13

I remember I don't I don't think you're Greek literate

01:12:19

So I'm not sure this is a little bit like when I was asking when I asked

01:12:25

Trent horn About his capacity to analyze poor years

01:12:34

Poirier's arguments TLG CD -ROM semantic domain studies stuff like that That's a relevant question because he's making conclusions based upon these arguments and I want to know

01:12:46

Can you consistently? analyze the arguments When I ask

01:12:52

Dale Tuggy Where did you learn Greek? How many years?

01:12:57

Where have you taught Greek? What kind of Greek have you taught? he makes Overarching conclusions about entire grammatical.

01:13:06

Oh, it's just it's just floss. That's just ridiculous. This is absurd and it's like Okay, you're giving me a conclusion that requires you to have a basis for being able to say it

01:13:18

Now we apply the same standard to Steve camp Where have

01:13:25

I mistranslated Because he says at the end even Douglas Wilson and James White As accomplished as they are get this wrong, okay, where have

01:13:36

I mistranslated Matthew 28 19 to 20 Demonstrated Steve prove it from the

01:13:43

Greek what your your argument here is not about translation at all your argument is interpretation and application in Specific as to what it means to disciple the nation's

01:14:04

Baptizing them in the name of the Father Son Holy Spirit That's what the issue is about.

01:14:09

And so please try at least to be somewhat accurate when when people accuse you of Accused me of Mistranslation I you know take that fairly seriously and that's why

01:14:25

I'm taking the time to respond to you here so when we look at Matthew 28, we all know this text.

01:14:33

I'm well aware of that. But when we when we look at it Jesus came up and spoke to them saying

01:14:45

All authority has been given to me in heaven and upon earth therefore go

01:14:57

Disciple ponta ta ethne. Okay, ma.

01:15:03

They choose satay means to make disciples and the problem here

01:15:11

Honestly, you roll this up and we can do this thing again The the problem here is for example

01:15:25

There are a lot of verbs in Greek that we don't have corresponding verbs for and so we have to turn them into nouns and then use a helping verb along with it

01:15:39

So the problem is not in Greek. The problem is in English and Ma they chew

01:15:46

Oh is to is to teach with a with a goal of making a disciple

01:15:57

But see we we don't have a disciple verb Well, I suppose you

01:16:03

I discipled him. Yeah, I suppose you you could actually Squeeze that one in there, but the issue is all in English here.

01:16:10

It's it's not a problem it it literally says To disciple all the nations

01:16:20

That's what it says now what you're saying is no it means to make disciples

01:16:30

Okay, but that's an application you're making an application because the the next

01:16:39

There are are two participial phrases That are attached to the the command baptizing and teaching and you don't baptize nations you baptize individuals and We're told how to do that baptizing them in the name of the

01:16:59

Father and of the Son of the Holy Spirit That is an authority Act That's what baptizing in the name of someone is why it's not just repeating a name

01:17:13

It is a submission to the authority of the name into which you're being baptized baptizing them in the name of the

01:17:20

Father Son Holy Spirit teaching them so the altoos is a plural and Technically The Antecedent defining it is taught ethnic the nation's so the reality

01:17:42

Steve is that you are the one who has a particular interpretation and You are saying it must be this because of the individualization of baptizing and teaching and I agree, but the reality is

01:18:06

The the reason up here that Ta ethne is a plural accusers because it's direct object of disciple so it's the nation's that are being discipled and Then you make application by saying and the participial phrases that are modifying this

01:18:31

Indicate Personal reality Baptizing them in the name of the

01:18:38

Father Son Holy Spirit and teaching them The infinitive

01:18:44

Tehran to keep to observe all Whatsoever I have commanded to you and behold.

01:18:52

I am with you make sure it's still yep behold. I am with you Always and to the end of the age so these two

01:19:03

Participial phrases I believe rightly Tell us that this is that this involves

01:19:14

Individual activity You baptize individuals who are members of ta ethne the nation's you teach them

01:19:28

To keep Everything I've commanded you but the antecedent is ta ethne you have to make the application you have to make the argument you assumed

01:19:38

It you just assumed it and accused us of mistranslation when in fact You're the one making the assumption and not proving it real common to have that happen people do that with their traditions all the time now

01:19:53

I agree and If this verse is being applied and you are living in a period of time

01:20:04

Where God is judging a nation or judging a culture

01:20:13

Then the number of people being baptized and the number of people being taught

01:20:21

It's not big there have been times in church history where that was the case

01:20:28

But that doesn't mean it's always the case.

01:20:33

That doesn't mean that that's always a situation. There are certain There are certain

01:20:39

Eschatologies that do assume that that will always be the case. I get that And maybe you assume that I don't know but You said so none of us translated accurately, here's what the text actually says and you gave the citation and You used the translation make disciples of all nations

01:21:02

Okay, but the and but you are Understanding that to mean make individual disciples out of the nations because of the following two

01:21:17

Participial phrases that's where you're getting it from and I agree in general but the fact remains that the foundation for going and doing this in all nations is that all authority in heaven and earth has been given to Jesus Christ and He commands us to go into every nation

01:21:43

Okay So you said here's how the PT's I guess that's post mill theonomist

01:21:48

PT's wrongly divide the word of truth They say go therefore and disciple all nations see the subtle obvious error

01:21:56

The problem is Steve that if you read Greek, you'd know that's actually the accurate translation so you need to understand the difference between translation and Interpretation and application and you're not showing you're not showing that you understand that and in accusing us of Subtle obvious error and mistranslation and all the rest of stuff and it's just baloney

01:22:22

There's nothing to it All you're saying is you disagree with me Okay, then say you disagree with me, but don't accuse us of mistranslation subtle obvious errors

01:22:33

And the rest of stuff you're gonna say The text is not saying all nations are to be discipled

01:22:41

But that we are to make disciples of all nations well

01:22:47

You could understand both of them to say the same thing but you are making an assumption and again,

01:22:56

I agree the participial phrases indicate the individuality of Baptism and the individuality of teaching

01:23:06

I Agree but what if there is in fact a fulfillment of All the nations seeking

01:23:17

God's law. What if there is in fact a great move of The Spirit of God in our future.

01:23:28

What will that look like? Would that not be would that not be entire nations? Coming to come to the feet of King Jesus and Then would your distinction really have any meaning?

01:23:42

No, it wouldn't not in that context. That's the point you have to put it into a context In other words believers discipled of every nation not all people of all nations without distinction without exempt exemption

01:23:59

Maybe there's some post mill theonomist out there somewhere that actually believes you should just Force baptize everybody

01:24:08

I've not met them That's not what I believe and you named me here. So try representing my view once that'd be nice.

01:24:16

I'd appreciate that that'd be helpful if you'd represent where I'm actually coming from and it's not that my view isn't well known because I've discussed this for example with Doug Wilson in the sweater vest dialogues

01:24:31

But Steve you have filters on you've got glasses on you only hear what you want to hear it's common with you

01:24:41

And so not all people of all nations without distinction without exemption again

01:24:50

I've never taught anywhere. I've never heard Doug Wilson teach anywhere That we should be engaging in forced

01:24:59

Discipleship forced baptism that kind of thing. Um, I Haven't seen it

01:25:07

Maybe that's what you're thinking. This is how inverted and Unreliable post mill theonomy adherents are today.

01:25:15

Well, thank you except that we've just demonstrated that your entire argument was bogus

01:25:22

Isagesis is not a spiritual gift. It's skewed opinion Boom nothing there.

01:25:30

It didn't go off because you didn't provide any argumentation. We've refuted it Even Douglas Wilson and James White as a compensator get this wrong wrong.

01:25:42

You got it wrong. Not me Tragic actually tragic and then you went on to say it's so good to be on millennial

01:25:49

Were you on millennial when we first met? I don't that sure if you were You were a grace. I don't think you were on millennial then

01:25:56

So maybe you've changed and everything's good now and fine and wonderful, I don't know maybe you went and learned

01:26:02

Greek somewhere I don't know but come on campy. Uh, that was Pitiful it's just pitiful and not too difficult to Review review, but I hope you hear it and go.

01:26:16

Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah, I missed that one Hopefully anyways, okay, so we did not get back into The Granville Sharp construction, but we'll do that on Friday and who knows maybe something will happen on Twitter Maybe something will happen in the world

01:26:35

I don't know if you'll Y 'all y 'all see Joe Biden almost fall asleep while mumbling with the president of Israel or something there

01:26:45

I running that man for president is an insult to the

01:26:54

United States it is an absolute insult to the United States Rich says you have to keep going

01:27:04

Twitter is still going you can't stop Well, you know,

01:27:12

I know that you're over here, but I can press buttons faster than you can because there's a delay. So And you can't control my computer

01:27:23

So you can try to keep it going But all I have to do is hit stop on the record and it will stop and I can probably hit stop off on on air too, and that was stopped to feed to Twitter and I think that this would actually override anything that you did so Go ahead he says he's rolfing

01:27:47

Rolfing is normally when you've had had Food poisoning

01:27:55

He's supposed to be ruffling but we're laying on floor laughing but anyways, we're having too much fun here

01:28:02

So, all right, so we will we will continue on we'll do the gamble sharp stuff on Friday and some more of the

01:28:13

Unitarian responses. Hope you caught all of the Debate announcements maybe by Friday We'll have the other debate announcement to be able to add to that for what we're doing in Houston in February is gonna be

01:28:27

Incredible and in fact see two So, well,

01:28:33

I'll be getting close to 190. Yep. We'll be getting close to it I might make it to 200 before I croak.

01:28:38

I don't know. I don't know. We'll see. We'll find out but Anyways, thanks for listening to dividing line today, and we will see you on Friday Lord willin.