Grace Life Church of Edmonton, Alberta

This is Apologetics Live.

To answer your questions, your host, from Striving for Eternity Ministries, Andrew Rappaport.

We are live, Apologetics Live, here to answer your questions.

Anything you have to ask about God and the Bible, we can do that here, because we can

answer any question you have about God and the Bible.

Yes, we can.

You doubt that?

Well, go to ApologeticsLive .com, click the little duck icon that gets you into

StreamYard.

You can join us and, well, try that challenge.

But any questions you have, we're here to answer them.

Any challenges, I will say that there were a bunch of people, I'll bring Pastor Justin in, we had a

number of people, and I'm going to blame Donald Jacks for this, by the way, just get this right out from the gecko.

Donald Jacks, some time ago, invited me to a group that was called

Calvinism versus the rest of Christianity.

And I thought it was like a Calvinistic type group, that they were more open to Calvinism.

And so I posted a link to the recent Rappaport podcast, which was

basically just from my First Peter Bible study that I've been doing.

And folks, if you want to be part of that Bible study, Wednesday nights, we do it live, but you can always go to the

YouTube channel for Striving for Eternity.

And if you go there, you will be able to basically get the

teachings that we have.

So that's out, just go to youtube .com slash C slash Striving

for Eternity, and you could get to those.

But I did one on First Peter because there's these two words that are mentioned in First Peter 1

-2.

It speaks about election and foreknowledge.

So that's all I did.

I just titled it Election and Foreknowledge.

Nothing controversial there.

Yeah.

Well, I was being challenged by a lot of people, being called all kinds of names too, not

so nice ones.

So I quickly realized that actually wasn't a very friendly group to people that might be even close to, I mean,

they were all triggered.

They were triggered.

It was just one person even said, she doesn't need to even listen to any of this Calvinist

dribble.

And I'm like, well, you know, and she said, I know you're going to say because I didn't listen.

I don't have the right to talk about it.

Well, yeah, because you don't know if it actually is Calvinism, Calvinist dribble.

Like I'm just taking the words right from the Bible.

Election, foreknowledge, those are biblical terms.

I would hope that they would agree with it.

But supposedly the fact that I said that I believe in election, like Peter talks about,

makes me a Calvinist.

So I guess as I responded, I guess Peter was a Calvinist.

I guess.

Yeah.

I mean, Peter must be a Calvinist before Calvin was even a thought.

Are you saying the word elections in the Bible?

Yeah.

Can you believe that?

What do you mean?

Yeah.

I never have seen that before.

That's what I was getting at.

Yeah.

So let's start with this before we get to the topic tonight.

We're going to deal with, we want to play a video for you guys until some folks come in, ask some questions.

We want to play a video.

I think it's going to be very helpful, not just for what's going on up in Canada with Grace Life Church, but

to also see how a lot of open air evangelists should handle the police.

I think it would be a very educational thing.

And without Dr. Silvestro here, we'll be able to give a biblical perspective without his whining of

cut the fence.

Actually, I think that was his response when I sent that video to you too.

I think his immediate response without even looking at the video was cut the fence.

We see he has a knee -jerk reaction, but he plans to bring in some extra help.

He has some people he wants to come in that already agree with his unbiblical position, and he

would like to have them help to give credence to that, but we'll see.

We'll see.

This is going to be a serious thing that I want to do, is read a message that I

got this week from one of our supporters.

This is someone who listened to a previous Apologetics Live show, a couple of episodes

before when we dealt with the issue of biblical counseling.

It's a pity that our friend John, aka Cluck Commander, is not here.

He's mentioned here, and I like how he's mentioned.

I'm going to read exactly how this person mentioned him just so that people don't

accuse me of making fun of him.

I'm going to remove names and things like this from Protect the Guilty.

Well, okay, maybe they're innocent too, but no, but really, seriously, I'm not

going to give all the details that were given, but a lot of this, I think, is really helpful for us.

So, hey, Andrew, that live show you did on biblical counseling may have

been a lifesaver to my husband.

That's how it starts out.

That's powerful.

So, I was finally able to communicate with him about his bizarre behavior, and

that has not added up.

It has bewildered me since he said he was moving out.

Well, it turns out, since he was off his medications back several months ago,

he added it back in, but he was only taking it every few days, which is very dangerous.

He's having all the textbook symptoms, extreme lows, untrue feelings and thoughts,

feelings of extreme detachment, physical manifestations, brain zaps, lightheadedness,

stomach trouble.

So, I was able to talk to him yesterday and get to the of what's going on, and now he's going to see a

doctor, first thing tomorrow.

He even stayed at the house with us last night and agreed that he's not in a position

to make any big, life -altering decisions.

He sees how erratic he is and agrees with me that he has to address the

SSRI withdrawal, which is a very real medical

condition.

Also, had I not watched that show, I might not have taken

such a thing seriously.

So, I'm going to stop there, just so we can dialogue with this.

So, here's a person who watched the show.

In that show, there was some discussion on people who are on these mood -altering

drugs, especially when they're on them for a long time.

It affects behavior and a lot of people make a mistake.

They don't want to be on the drugs and they just get off on the, just cold turkey quit.

And that has serious ramifications when you do that without medical advice.

And that's what happened to this individual.

Just wanted to quit the medicine and it had some adverse effects.

Let me go on with the rest of this.

He has been spiraling out of control to the point he feels like a complete

stranger to me for several months.

Had I not watched that episode and also listened to the gentlemen, parentheses,

with the chickens, parentheses.

So, just so you know, he's just the gentleman with the chickens, not Cluck Commander.

See, we would have called him Cluck Commander.

Anthony would have called him Chicken Man, but the guy with the chickens.

She's kinder to him than we would be, huh?

But had I not listened to the gentleman with the chickens, I might have missed the signs

and not put aside my hurt and had pride

and really dug in with him.

So, in other words, what we end up seeing is John's testimony helped for her not to dig in her

heels with him and not to get to a point where

she might have just made the situation worse.

And that's what would happen with that.

So, she goes on.

He told me he's not suicidal, I believe him.

But as his wife, someone observing him, his lows were rapidly getting lower and lower.

So, she says, I'm not sure if my marriage could be restored,

but it's gotten to the point that I am just grateful to God that it sounds like he can be

stabilized with a doctor's help and the appropriate medical supervision.

We decided we're going to take it step by step walking through this together, which

is a positive thing.

And then we got into some more discussion and then she mentions this.

I guess he had realized he was yo -yoing off on the medication just by not taking the proper

dosage, taking it when he felt like he needed it.

And so, she ended up saying that yesterday was an actual breaking

point for us in a good way.

I was able to ask him informed questions.

He hit rock bottom, one of those crazy lows, and he reached out to me.

She says, then I put aside all of this hurt and

confusion I'm going through and just firmly told him that he needs to see a medical professional

and we need to get him stabilized.

And everything opened up from there.

God wanted me to see that show.

Everything just came out into the open and I understood

what he's been going through.

Actually, I missed this because she mentioned some of this earlier.

The guy with the chickens had just really had my ear in everything he said

by everyone.

The Pastor Justin really went straight to my heart and made me take action.

You and I were talking about this before.

I read some of this to you.

Let me just let you give your reaction from what you were

thinking, what you started saying beforehand.

Well, a lot of people just kind of see us cut up and kind of play around a little bit, but

we take this very seriously as ministers of the gospel.

And sometimes you just don't know what kind of effect you're having.

You don't get a lot of emails.

You don't get a lot of conversations.

You don't get a lot of people really talking with you.

And so you don't know.

And you wonder from time to time if anybody's been affected, if we're doing

the good thing that we want to be doing.

And I tell you, when we get emails like this, it causes all of the stuff to be worth it.

We're not here to grandstand or show off.

We're here to be a blessing to the body of Christ and to the lost.

And when things like this are sent, it's hard not to just break down

and praise God crying and being amazed.

I mean, we do stand in amazement at what God can do with the simple

proclamation of His truth.

And that's just special.

Yeah.

I mean, you get an email like that to think, we do a show, and someone

could say that their marriage could

have been saved or that it at.

Least prevented it from getting worse.

It's humbling.

Yeah.

And you think about it.

The question that she started with was asking, one of the questions she asked was, or said

that she wasn't sure about the marriage.

From my perspective, this is God beginning to work on those situations.

And we can pray that God will restore her and her husband back to spiritual and physical and

marital health.

Yeah.

That's what we're hoping for.

That is what we're hoping for.

Amen.

Thank you, Melissa, for saying that.

I really appreciate it.

I might as well put up.

You're like responding to someone that people can't see.

Put it up and then read it.

Do I really have to teach you how to do this again?

I was about to, but you interrupted me.

So Melissa Owens said, striving for eternity is an absolute blessing in my life.

Thursday is my favorite day of the week now because of your ministry.

I really appreciate that.

That's humbling.

And other than how to put it with Andrew, it's great.

Ouch.

If I had feelings.

If you had feelings, that would hurt, but it doesn't hurt.

Yeah.

So it's a good thing I leave those feelings locked away in a box.

All right.

So I mentioned last week about a video and I

do want to play this video that I mentioned.

We mentioned last week about the fact that there are, we're going

to be talking about Grace Life Church in Canada.

We're going to talk about that we have just showing some of the stuff that's going on

up there, but this is what we saw up in Canada as well.

And I want to play, this is only about 41 seconds.

Okay.

But I want you to take a look at this and see what was going on

in the case of a

mosque, what a mosque can do on Ramadan.

See whether they have the restrictions that we see Pastor Coates having at his church.

So I'm going to play this.

This is going to blow your mind, but here we go.

And so this is from a Facebook user, Garrett Jones, Islamic

community center in Milton, Idaho or Ontario.

So let's play this.

Just watch the number of cars and notice.

The police.

Here we are.

Good Friday.

Milton at the Islamic community center.

Just packed, packed, but the kids can't play hockey.

Here they are.

Sorry for the terrible camera.

Our finest.

Alton's finest.

Just pouring them in.

Just lined up and my kids can't play hockey.

We've got a pay duty cop here and they're all going to pack inside.

Wow.

So there you go.

You have a case there where in that case, they're allowed.

No, no, no.

I saw them in body armor and they were blocking the roads and they were stopping them.

Right.

That's what I saw.

I mean, I don't know what you're talking about.

Yeah.

I mean, how many cars were in that car?

That parking lot looked pretty full.

Well, they had their limit at 15%, right?

Yeah.

I mean, you know, and this is the thing,.

Like this is what I'm pointing out.

You end up seeing for Grace Life Church, because they had the

audacity to want to meet in person and actually worship God.

They have three fences around their building, one with a privacy fence, the innermost so that no one can see what the police are doing

in the building.

They have a fence around the building with privacy.

They have a fence around the parking lot and the building.

Then they have a fence around the whole property so no one can get in and

they have 24 hours security and they're charging the church.

For all this, by the way.

Oh, really?

Yeah.

They're charging the church, you know, to be able.

To pay, like, after the fact, the church is going to have to pay all this back.

Like, they're not allowed on their own property.

So, you know, this is what you end up seeing.

And then you see that this is the same thing that we saw last year.

Resurrection Sunday, churches had to be closed.

You know, for Passover, synagogues had to be closed.

But for Ramadan, hey, the state comes in and helps them get set up.

Here you had the police directing traffic.

Now,.

Why were the police not enforcing the 15 % rule?

Humble Clay says exactly why.

Because it's proof that Allah is not God.

Yes.

I mean, the Bible makes it clear that they will hate us, they will hate the gospel, and they will hate all Christians because

they hate Christ.

And this is, I mean, Humble Clay, you knocked it right out of the park.

That's the answer.

Because Allah is not God.

And they're perfectly fine with that.

Yeah.

You know what we should have mentioned, the review that we got earlier, is that if folks want to give us a review, get them read,

go to lovethepodcast .com slash ApologeticsLive, and the A -N -L in ApologeticsLive is capitalized, all spelled

in one word.

Lovethepodcast .com slash ApologeticsLive, that link will be in the show notes.

And there's something I want to do.

You know, Justin, we have our sponsor, which is MyPillow.

Here's what we'll do, folks.

I know that some of you have already gone out to MyPillow.

You've purchased pillows or different things from there.

Here's what I want you to do.

I would like to get pictures of you with the products that you sent.

We'll show them on air.

We'll put them up here.

You can email us.

Just go to info at strivingforeternity .org.

Info at strivingforeternity .org.

Send your pics there.

We want to put them up on screen.

But how do you do that?

Well, you got to first go to MyPillow.

Go to mypillow .com.

Click on the Radio Listeners Square.

And from there, use the promo code SFE.

That stands for Striving For Eternity.

Or you can call our 1 -800 number that we have with them, which is 1 -800

-873 -0176.

That's 1 -800 -873 -0176.

Use promo code SFE when you call and you'll get the discounts.

I'm actually bummed because I didn't buy...

They had their premium pillows, the queen size premium pillows for under $30, the

lowest it had ever been.

And I didn't get them in time for myself.

I was getting a bunch that I wanted to get for Christmas gifts and wanted to replace some of ours that we have here.

And now they're up to $39.

So I missed it.

Don't miss out before they go up because...

Everything's going up.

Well, yeah, Biden.

We'll just call it a moment.

It's going to be...

But yeah, if you want to go to mypillow .com, they now have the MySlippers and they got

robes and all kinds of things out there.

Also, we'll send in pictures when you go there to us so we can

show those on air.

So let's do this.

I want to go to the footage that we have here that is provided on rumble .com.

And on the podcast version, I'll put the links to both videos in the

show notes so that we'll have that there.

But what I want to do, Justin, is you and I, we're going to go through this.

And any time that you want me to stop, just say stop and I'll stop this.

And we're just going to go through this footage here that we have.

This is so that you know, this is at Grace Life Church before they obviously...

It's before they put the fences in.

You see that there's cars in the parking lot.

And you're going to hear the way this gentleman talks with the police officers and this health

official.

And I want you to notice a couple of things as we go through it.

I'm probably going to stop it and talk about it, but I want you to see how the guys from Grace Life,

we're not...

They're willing to accept whatever consequences are given.

They are being polite.

They know the law.

They're not trying to give the police a hard time.

You're actually seeing that Grace Life is willing to work with the police, but the health

inspector wants none of it.

It's his way or the highway.

And that's the reality.

Josiah Nichols says that he got the mattress topper at MyPillow, fixed his wife and his back

issues.

So cool, Josiah.

Thank you for that.

Now you got to take a picture with you and your wife's mattress topper and send it in to us.

And so, you know, so we're going to go through this.

And, you know, Justin, just see if Josiah can stick around for a while till after this, or if we get to his questions

beforehand.

But the thing that you're going to see with this video is this is the thing with

the totalitarian regime that we see all over the place is they do not accept

anybody having a different opinion than them.

And what you end up seeing here is you end up seeing that they want it their way.

There is no other option.

And here you're going to see a bunch of Christians trying to work with him.

They're even going to tell them at one point, we're not in compliance, like point blank.

We're not in compliance with you.

And they're okay with whatever the ramifications are.

So let's, let me play through this.

Justin, you just let me know when you want to stop.

You guys going inside, you would be saying that you're guilty of interrupting emergency.

No, I'm not saying that.

No, but you're saying that the public health orders override criminal code 176.

But that's why we kind of let you in then, because code 176 makes it illegal for you to interrupt a worship service.

And our worship service has begun.

And we're stating that to you very clearly that your presence in this building will be interrupting our worship

service.

Because your presence intimidates our people.

That's your perception.

Okay, pause for a second.

What I want everybody to notice is they are giving the legal reasons for why it

is that, they have civil code, legal code on their side.

And they're being very respectful.

They're not trying to be defiant.

There's the dual problem here.

The problem that's being interacted with is being interacted with by the

law enforcement on behalf of this gentleman.

You're going to find out his name.

If you don't know yet, his name is Dragon.

I just, I watched it a little while ago.

This man's name is Dragon and he's a code enforcer.

The problem is, is his civil call does not override the

written law that is part of their code or our code or anything else.

It doesn't, you know, somebody does a civil mandate.

It doesn't override law.

And so they're standing on the law and they're saying, look, we have the right to peaceably assemble, to have a

religious assembly without being harassed and having our people intimidated, which is what's

going on.

And they're trying to be very respectful about it.

And if you noticed one of the things the police officer just said was, well, we have a

code, you know, we have a civil mandate or whatever, and you have the law and we're not trying to

override your code, but actually they are.

And I'm going to, I'm going to hold it.

We'll.

Kind of come back to this because Pastor Josiah only has about 10 minutes.

So I'm going to bring him because he's got some questions that he let us know.

So Pastor Josiah, how are you, sir, tonight?

Better than I deserve.

I like that answer.

Dave Ramsey.

No, no chief.

Because I'm blessed with.

Every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places.

That's right.

Everyone knows of it from Dave.

Ramsey, but you know, people think I'm quoting Dave Ramsey when I say it, although Anthony says the first time he heard it

was Pastor Josiah, I think.

So he thinks that I got it from him, but I got in seminary.

It was my seminary, the founder of our seminary who used to say that everyone just called him chief, but it was E

.R. Jordan.

So yeah.

Anyway, so Josiah, what do you.

Have for us tonight?

What questions you got?

Well, I talked about it a couple of weeks ago.

I'm starting a sermon series on first Peter this weekend.

Sounds good.

And everyone else stuff's

happening in Canada and the Biden administration heavily attacking Christians,.

At least verbally.

No, no, no, no, no.

Biden is so loving.

He's a Christian.

I mean, well, he's a Catholic and historically, you know how the Catholics like Protestants.

Well, yeah, but he's a good Catholic.

Can you feel the love tonight?

Yes.

There's a good anti -Christ, right?

Yeah.

So what questions you have?

Well, I noticed I'm

reformed -ish, but I preach in

an Arminian church.

Right from the get -go, you're going to have problems.

Yeah, you're going to have a whole.

Lot of fun.

Yeah, I'm trying.

I'm just praying that God will let me keep the church after I preach the sermon.

But yeah, I was listening to your

podcast.

I know you don't really go into election and

destination.

I've actually been finding there's different views on when Peter wrote it.

Because one thing I like to do in my sermons, I like to give the historical context behind it.

And I can't really, every scholar has a different opinion on the historical context.

You heretic, you mean like grammatical historical?

What are you thinking about?

Well, in case you don't know, Pastor Nichols has a few books on the proper

way of interpretation.

One, actually, let me see if I move my head just right.

It's right there.

You can't really see it too big, but it's When My Ox Gourds My Neighbor.

Great, great title for a book.

You'll never forget the title now.

But based out of, I want to say Leviticus, but I think it's Numbers.

Exodus 28 -32.

So great, great primer for learning how to interpret.

You can get that at strivingforeturning .org.

You can get that at our bookstore that's available there.

And oh, you got a bigger copy.

But you know what?

I should make him feel bad.

He went and got his copy.

All right, let's do the test.

Ready?

Here's my copy.

You have your copy?

Okay.

And yours is what?

Signed?

Mine looks shinier than yours, though.

Yeah, yeah.

Look at that.

Yeah, you're right.

Mine is signed.

Okay.

With a note in it.

But you know what else?

You know what else?

Let's do the bang test.

Bang it on the table.

You hear that?

Yeah.

Now you try that with yours.

Well, hold on a second.

Can you read that?

You were here?

Your name here.

I just signed it.

Bang yours against the table.

Let's hear how it sounds.

Well, I mean.

Yeah, no.

You know, not on this side.

Bang it on this side.

Oh, you got the hard copy.

Okay.

Yeah, I got a hard copy, man.

It still reads.

Yeah, same stuff.

Wait, so Melissa's saying that mine is showing up.

Is that showing up backwards?

She says it shows up backwards.

Yeah, it is.

Yeah.

That's why.

See, when you're turned around the other way, you look ugly, and then this way you look nice.

I wonder where that's happening at.

Neat.

Well, I didn't know that.

Let's see.

Let me try changing the camera.

See if advance.

It's not in here.

Okay, I'm going to have to figure out where that change occurred.

Yeah, that's weird.

So you go on with your question.

I'm going to play with the camera.

Okay.

All right.

Yeah.

So I noticed that there's different takes on what dispersion he's talking about.

Some people view it as metaphorically, as, you know, like we're pilgrims here on

earth going to our heavenly home.

Other people say that it's from the Roman dispersion.

And I heard you say that it's from the Jerusalem dispersion when

Paul was persecuting the church.

At least that's what I'm guessing.

Your take is when you said they were dispersed from Jerusalem.

I was wondering why you took that take.

Well, because it mentions where they're going.

So I don't think it's some spiritual, you know, figurative dispersion.

They were scattered.

It says they're scattered to Pontius, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia.

So we know exactly where they were scattered to.

So because of that, right off the bat, we have more information here

that leads us to believe that this was a physical scattering.

It wasn't spiritual.

Exactly.

Yeah.

And so the only scattering I really know of is the one out of Jerusalem that James would write.

That doesn't mean that it's an early writing.

James was, you know, I mean, years after Paul's persecution, but yet, you

know, he wrote to, and he made it really clear, he's writing to the Israelites that were scattered abroad in James 1 .1.

Yeah.

And if you think about it, it fits within the context of the persecution that's going

on, as Peter's talking about, you know, from Paul, from Saul,

and those that were vehemently going after and trying to kill as many Christians as they could.

And what was Saul doing?

He wasn't staying in Jerusalem.

He was chasing them down.

He was chasing them to every location he could find them, and he was dragging them back.

He was abusing them, and he was personally overseeing their murder in the name of

their religious zeal for God.

And, you know, they had abandoned the faith, according to them.

And so they're running off as Christians now, and Saul

is chasing after them.

I agree with Andrew completely on this, and that's why I've always seen this section as

this is, you know, the early life of the body of Christ being dispersed

as Christ told us it would happen.

You know, we're going to be scattered throughout the world with the gospel, and that's what it says here is according to the foreknowledge of

God.

This was the purpose of God.

Yeah, yeah, that was kind of my understanding as it's a literal dispersion,

but I also heard that maybe the dispersion it's talking about is from the

emperor that just dispersed the Christians, the Jewish Christians out of Rome,

because there's actually Roman colonies in those providences.

Yeah, and that would be,.

That would make it a much later book.

That's the case, that'd make it after, because those, I think, started after 70 AD.

So, I think that might make it too far.

Yeah, Peter's kind of.

Dead by then.

So, that's, well, I'm talking about the dispersion with

Priscilla and Aquila when they left Rome because of Christus, the

kicking them out for Christus, and so I was wondering if that might have been dispersion.

I know it's not really all that.

Important.

It's a little important.

Yeah, well, you also have to consider who's Peter talking to, where's Peter at,

and what's his position, and what's his job?

See, that actually makes an.

Important point is it gets to the question of who is he speaking to?

Is he speaking to a Gentile audience, a Roman audience, or a Jewish audience?

In last week's, okay, I don't know how KT managed to do this, but

she was able to put a comment upside down.

This is the way you see.

Andrew.

Is my book titles in backwards too or no?

No, I could read What Do We Believe on your.

Screen.

Just the camera.

So, it's got to be some with the camera.

Wow.

Okay.

Anyway, so, it makes a difference of who his audience is, whether it's Jewish or Gentile.

Now, one of the things I made the point of saying in the last class that is up on YouTube, it's not

a podcast at all.

So, you'd have to watch YouTube, but I make the point to point out that

Peter was the apostle to the Jewish people where Paul was the apostle to the Gentiles.

So, it would make more sense that Peter is writing to Jewish people, and therefore, again, it might make more sense

that he is writing to Jewish people that were scattered.

And so,.

Put it as an earlier scattering.

Well, there's two things you want to look at as well.

When people tell you this is allegorical, they try to spiritualize it, therefore, to make it more of an

allegory.

What's that?

Just run.

Yeah.

And the thing is, here's the issue.

When somebody tells you that there's allegory, they better have a really good reason for it, because we believe that, and

it doesn't matter what group that you are involved with, whether you're post -millennial,

amillennial, or whatever else you want to be, they would all claim that we believe in the literal hermeneutic

of the text.

We believe in its context, its fullest text, and we need to have justification for why we

would see a typology or an allegory or anything else.

There needs to be clear justification.

And what you don't see here is any indication that there's any type of spiritualizing

going on.

That's the first thing.

And then the second thing is...

And the reason you don't see it spiritualizing is because it's specific.

It's literal towns.

That are mentioned.

Exactly.

Literal people, literal towns, and it's giving a doctrinal reason for

a physical event.

The reason doctrinally is because of the foreknowledge of God the Father by the sanctifying work of the Holy

Spirit to obey Jesus Christ.

There's a Trinitarian doctrinal reason that all three of them are involved here.

And so I wouldn't want to make this just a spiritualized movement, because this is a very strong text for

Trinitarian truth.

And so I wouldn't want to say, oh, this is just whimsy and fancy, first of all.

And that's the first thing I wouldn't do.

I want to know who's Peter talking to.

And as Andrew said, he's the apostle to the Gentiles, was it?

No, the Jews.

And the reason that most people say, oh, well, he was probably in Rome is because the Roman Catholic

Church tried to say, oh, this is Peter.

He has the keys, and he has the keys.

He's the pope.

And so they try to stretch this thing out.

Peter, there's no indication that he ever left his geographical area,

but there is all kinds of indication that the apostle that was appointed to the Gentiles, Paul,

went to Rome, right?

Right.

So we have to make sure that we nail this down from what we see in the Scripture

and what we know from history.

And so that's where I'm going to go, based on those issues.

And I'm going to give this an earlier date than some of the others would,

because I think they're.

Trying to push more towards allegory.

Right.

I'm going to disagree with that.

Okay.

I can understand.

Yeah, I'm taking a literal approach, too.

That's so surprising.

I've read all your.

Books.

Since we're talking about your books, why don't we just play a commercial?

Here we go.

Proper biblical interpretation is the difference between truth and error,

life and death, heaven and hell.

This is created for your Sinnos.

That's your Christians in name only.

Readers will stop asking, what does this mean to me?

And start asking, what does it mean?

Get your copy of what does it mean to me at trackplanet .com or

on amazon .com today.

You want to get this before it's too late.

Another way that you can get that actually, and what we'll do is I'll just give this out now.

This is being the executive director.

Sometimes you get to make executive decisions, especially when Anthony's not here to say no.

So any orders at Striving Fraternity for any of the materials will include a

copy of what does it mean to me for not only the month of April, but including May.

So if you purchase anything from our site, we will ship to you whatever you

order, plus a free copy of what does it mean to me.

Is it going to be signed?

If Josiah doesn't mind me signing it.

Right.

I'll tell you what, I can send you more signed.

I can send you signed copies.

Justin wants signed copies.

He even signs his own.

I'm going to sign my own.

Give me your address later and I can send you

one.

All right.

So just so folks know, full belly bear says what's up everyone.

Just so we know he survived.

He's still alive after last week, but I

have heard rumor that full belly bear is planning something.

He's working supposedly on a video that we'll be able to show here that makes me nervous.

Oh no.

Yes, I'm sure.

So KT says perhaps Andrew wants to sign my pillows to throw at Anthony.

No, I want something harder to throw at Anthony.

Oh, that was good.

Simple as that.

All right.

So Pastor Josiah, I know you only had about 10 minutes.

Anything else.

That you have for us tonight?

Well, just stating that from what I understand from 1 Peter verses one

through two is that we have to understand that when we go through suffering and

trials, we need to understand God chose those who are in

Jesus Christ to have the eternal blessings.

He didn't choose the world.

So don't be going after the world and thinking, I need to

compromise to listen to them and to have a better life because

they're not promised eternal blessings.

You are because you are chosen by God according to his foreknowledge, which is his plan for all

eternity.

He chose you in Christ before the foundation of the world.

And you, if you are repenting and trusting in Jesus, you know that you're saved and you don't have to

compromise.

With this world.

Amen.

So Justin, you're going to not only give this long link to where to find,.

But you cover up the author's face.

I didn't mean to do that.

I couldn't find a short one.

I apologize.

I was trying to find a really short one, but it's on Amazon, by the way.

And, um, I don't know if you want me to say that or not.

What does it mean to me?

Actually,.

A better place to get it is, is track planet.

Yeah.

That way more money goes to planet and Josiah rather than Amazon.

So go to track planning.

So if we get people to buy a thousand,.

I can rent a thousand more.

So that'd be great.

All right.

Well, thanks.

Thanks for coming in.

And, uh, yeah, I'll put you in the backstage.

Let me just bring a clock commander in John.

I don't know if you were able to, to watch and listen to the beginning of the show.

They're the chickens that were mentioned.

Uh, Oh, really?

Yeah.

Did you listen to beginning.

Of the

show?

Did you watch the beginning of the show or listen to it?

I should say.

No, no, I didn't.

Okay.

Well then that's fine.

That's fine.

You gotta do it again.

You got to do it again.

He's just going to have to, and for folks that don't know, this is, well, we

call a clock commander.

You now saw his chickens, but this is why the person said, you know, the guy

with the chickens, she actually referred to you as a gentleman with the chickens first time, but then you were just the guy with the chickens.

So, but, uh, do you have anything.

For us tonight?

I asked him to come on.

Cause I thought that was just incredible.

Um, uh, John, actually we got an email about the conversation that we

had, um, on the, um, the biblical.

Counseling stuff.

So you'll have to go back and watch, but the short of it, short of it is, uh,.

Oh, Katie wants to know if John can sign a chicken, I think.

Can you sign a chicken for her?

Um, she wants a signed chicken.

Can you sign a chicken and send it to Katie?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Signings and things.

So, um, we, we had a list, uh, listened John to the counseling

episode, and she said, if you really listened to what you had to say about some of the

being on certain medications that affect your, your moods and when you've been on for a long time and, you know,

things, uh, you know, getting off and whatnot.

Um, and so the thing that, uh, she

mentioned was that you, you know, your, you had said, uh, really had an impact.

It, um, it basically could may have saved her marriage.

So, um, you know, it was, it was moving.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It, she had said that if, if she didn't hear what you, if she didn't listen to what you had said, uh, she

might have responded to her husband's moods, um, where he, you know, he

just got off of meds and, uh, she might've responded in pride and just dug her heels in,

but listening to you, it helped her realize exactly what he was going through.

And, uh, she was able to recognize all the signs that you had mentioned and knew exactly what was going on and,

and, and felt informed to be able to ask the right questions.

And, uh, you know, she had shared that her husband had moved out, uh, and they had a breakthrough

and, and he moved back in and, uh, she credited a lot of it to, uh, some of what you had said.

And then, you know, some of what, uh, Chris Tramita had said.

So, um, it's really quite neat to see how sometimes we do these shows, John, and we never know the

impact that it makes on other people.

And we just sit behind a microphone and a camera and it goes out and we don't even know

sometimes it's just very humbling to think about, uh, how this can help so many.

People that we don't think of or don't know about.

That's yeah.

Praise God.

Um, I, you know, it's funny how

I think you're, you're frozen up there in the great West Northwest.

Oh, it's really bad.

You know, I just felt like I'd just been, uh, you know, praise God that, you know, so yeah, this is,

oh, hold on.

I'm sorry.

This makes for a great, great TV right.

Here.

Yeah.

Frozen on the chickens.

We can't hear him at all.

He just, you know, so.

Well, I just,.

I just wanted to make sure that John heard that because I mean, it's, uh, uh, he's back.

So what were you going to say, John?

Oh, wow.

I'm so sorry.

My connection was, was horrible.

Um, so what I said was, you know, I'm praise God and I'm just, I'm so glad

that, you know, God can even use me, uh,

a, a chicken guy, a commander.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But, um, but what I was going to say is that it's funny cause lately I just been feel like, uh, I've been a fifth wheel with the

show and just haven't really been doing much or, uh, been able to, to be

much of an asset, uh, to it.

So it's good to know that.

Yeah.

Even, even those times where I think I'm just, you know, sharing my few cents

that, um, you know, even use me to, to help another couple.

So praise God.

Yeah.

Uh, Melissa's asking, what does your shirt say?

Uh, don't smoke.

No, I don't snore, but it says

I dream.

I'm on a tractor.

Okay.

So you're probably expecting.

Some gospel message.

You know, he's just talking about snoring and tractors.

This is my wife mocking me about my snoring.

You know, but one thing I wanted to just encourage with John is, is I have the same thing going on from time to time.

I just wonder if, if, um, you know, if we're making an, uh, causing a positive

benefit and effect, you know, and it's, it's every once in a while, you just feel like, okay, um, are we really reaching anybody

as people are hearing the message is the gospel going out?

Are we affecting people?

And sometimes you feel like in society, a third wheel or a fifth wheel, and then God shows up and he

says, I want you to hear this.

This is what, and he doesn't have to do it.

We don't have to hear any good thing until we get to heaven now, because we won't know, you know, uh, we won't know what are,

what we've done for the glory of God, I think until we get to heaven.

Yeah.

But Joanne, he says, uh, that's going to.

Make me cry.

John Wilkinson.

So you're making her cry.

Why are you doing that?

Why are you making.

Her cry, John?

I think you're a great brother.

Yeah.

Thanks man.

I would consider him a great.

Brother if he was willing to give me his red leather Bible.

I want his red leather goat skin.

Bible.

That's in the house, but yeah, you already, you already took it a couple of times already.

So.

You know, yeah, I could have kept it at that point, man.

I had it hidden.

You had it hidden inside your, uh, little behind your desk there.

Yeah.

All right.

So let's go back to this video now.

I'm going to put John backstage and let's, let's keep going through and then we got, someone else is going to have another question

later.

Um, but, uh, here we go.

So let's play through this and, uh, you just, if you want me to stop.

At any point, just say stop and we will.

So are you saying it'll be obstruction if it does come down to that?

Yeah, no, we understand, but we're seeing the worship services started in your presence.

Isn't it an eruption of that worship service?

We're not going to go into the.

Pulpit.

Yeah.

No, even notice how they, the interaction, first off, the

guy who's speaking for Grace Life is respectfully explaining just you coming in

and, and folks, all of us that have been in church, we notice like when someone comes in late.

Okay.

I could tell you as, as a pastor, what happens because I'm usually at the pulpit and I see all the heads

when someone comes in late and everybody looks.

But I can tell you this, if a, if you had two police officers walk in with a guy with a

clipboard after they have just arrested their pastor,

kept him in jail for 35 days and let him loose and let him out of prison.

And that's the, like the first week back and you see two police officers with a guy with a

clipboard.

Do you think that's going to be disturbing to the congregation?

Yeah.

I mean, they're probably going to be going, oh, they're getting names and, and license plates and things, which I'm sure they probably already were

doing.

They probably already were going through the parking lot and license plates, but people in the congregation are not, it's going to be a

distraction because regardless, they don't know why the police

officers and this man with the clipboard are there.

They realize this.

I don't know who it is that's speaking on behalf of Grace Life, if he's an elder or not, but

he recognizes that the law says they're not to disturb and this will

be a distraction.

And they're going to try to explain that it's not because they're not going up to the pulpit.

But the law, as you're going to hear is quite clear that the police are, the law says you cannot disrupt

a worship service in progress.

And it's interesting because one of the things I actually, I'm sure many of you have been in church, you're going to

figure out this is toward the end of the service.

They may have been talking throughout the whole service because toward the end of this video, you're going to hear the music

playing.

I think that the preaching is going on and it's now the end of service.

And I think these guys ended up realizing whatever they were looking to do, they didn't get in there in, in, in

the time that they wanted.

Yeah.

Okay.

But but, but I also want you to see how respectful the man is.

And so, you know, humble, humble clay says, masks interfere with

the interaction, make it impersonal.

And that's true.

And so, KT saying that, you know, I'm friends with Devin, I am, he's, he is, I

don't think he, he wasn't in this video, but he is someone that's been posting a lot.

Online.

So let's keep going.

Like I said, you guys, it is a great intimidation to women and children, which isn't,

which is a disruption.

And again, that's your perception.

Are you telling us that the public health orders override criminal code 176?

I'm not here to debate that.

Okay.

I'm here to do a job under.

But you entering the building would determine that that is overwritten.

Now see, we're getting into a debate.

No, no, I'm asking a question.

I'm not here to debate those things.

Those are things that can be debated in court.

So, and I'll let the lawyers and the judges.

Okay.

So this is one of the things, especially for open air evangelists to recognize what the officer is saying here.

And I think the officer is being respectful.

He's, he's got a job to do.

This is something to remember.

I've seen a lot of open air evangelists get shut down because they handle the police the wrong way.

They, they dress things rudely.

Had this gentleman been rude to the officer, the officer would have just kind of shut him down.

But we see our friend Chris Han holds, and maybe, maybe he can come in and answer this as well.

Pastor Justin, you can answer this being two men in law enforcement, but I always remember someone telling me that,

you know, on the street, okay.

You may win your day in court, but you challenge the police officer and you will lose on the street.

You know, you, you know, when you, when it's push comes to shove and you try to make an argument with a

police officer, there's, there becomes an issue where, okay, we're not, we're not accepting this.

We're going to shut you down.

Okay.

Here, you see a gentleman just asking questions.

Now the officer says that that's your interpretation, that it's going to be disruptive.

I would say it, it's not really a question of interpretation because he's saying, does the one law

override the other?

The answer to that's no, it doesn't.

Yeah.

And so they, they, they can't go in and, and this is the thing of just sticking to,

you know, the law, keep it on your side, be respectful, asking questions.

All right.

So I just wanted to point that out.

One thing too, that you want to look at is, is second Peter.

We talked about this last time when we had this discussion is in second Peter, we find out that,

that God has ordained that these things are to happen.

He is ordained, you know, the good of our blessing and that we are going to suffer

persecution.

But I want to, as you were pointing out here, notice how respectful they're being.

This reminds me in acts four where, where Peter is, is proclaiming the gospel,

uh, you know, proclaiming truth.

He's, he's preaching, uh, in a, in a synagogue, in a church, if you will.

And it's not a church, but I understand the difference, but, um, but he's, he's proclaiming the truth and the

officials come and they say, what are you doing?

They, they go to forcibly drag him away.

And he says, um, he says, is it right for us to do what's in

your sight?

What's right.

Or what's right in God's sight.

And then he leaves it up to them.

It's between them and God.

He's not pulling out batons.

He's not fighting with them.

He's not getting physical because he's going to lose that battle, you know?

And the, and the ultimate point is, is if these officers had chosen to, what could they have done?

They could have walked right in and there's nothing they could have done to stop.

Yeah, that's true.

And, and, uh, you know, Chris says, uh, the officer on the right seems to be ignoring slash sidestepping the

question by the grace life rep questions about law and health order.

Uh, full bear is bringing up, says good tip, Andrew use the Socratic method.

And that's what you see him doing here.

It's just asking questions.

We're going to see more of it.

Let's,.

Let's go back to this though, by you guys going inside, you would be saying

that you're guilty of interrupting worship service.

No, but you're saying that you're that the public health orders override criminal code 176, but that's why we

can't let you in then because the code 176 makes it illegal for you to interrupt a worship service.

And our worship service has begun.

And we're stating that to you very clearly that your presence in this building will be interrupting our worship

service because your presence intimidates our people.

That's your perception.

Well, no, no.

Okay.

Notice, notice how he says again, well, that's you, that's your impression.

That's your interpretation, right?

Here's the thing.

If I'm in that service as one of these guys, if they were in that service, they would,

it would be a distraction.

It would be intimidating.

So it's not their interpretation for everyone else.

It's, it's the fact for them.

And if it is for them, then it's the law is covered.

That's, that's the thing though.

Now, you know, he's, he's making it about the women and the children and things like this.

But what you end up seeing is, you know, that again, I

want to point out just sticking to the law, you know, the law, it's on your side, stick to that.

He's being respectful.

Okay.

And you're going to see the officers end up being respectful to him, but they're going to try to push.

And I'll have some.

More comments in a moment.

Our people understand that you guys, again, we respect the work that you do in the community.

We respect you as police officers, but in our worship service right now, people are praying, people are singing, people are

listening to the word of God be preached, and they can't do that with your presence in the building.

And with all due respect, the law has now put our pastor in prison.

And so for the RCMP to come into the service, it is absolutely a disruption.

We have seen the arm of law enforcement come against us.

So to come in our building is absolutely intimidation at this point.

That's why we can't.

Let you in.

Okay.

So you notice that, so they're pointing out, it's not just it, the fact that they

just, that they had arrested their pastor, this looks like to the congregation intimidation.

Yeah, exactly.

Which is exactly how I think I'm interpreting it.

It's exactly what I interpret when they put fences all around the building, right?

It's intimidation.

Well, and that's the.

One thing you have to think about.

You know, we push our rights.

You know, I'm going to go back to Peter.

He says in Acts 4 .19, but Peter and John answered and said to them, whether it

is right in the sight of God to give heed to you rather than to God,

you be the judge for we cannot stop speaking about what we have seen and heard.

He's saying in here, okay, here's the standard.

Here's the truth.

You get to stand before almighty God and you get to be judged on your actions.

And what they're saying is, I know they're not saying God, but they're saying the law has given us this right.

And you be the judge.

Are you going to violate your own laws?

You know, the Socratic method, as you're talking about, they're putting out this

conversational discussion as far as they can.

And it wins the day.

It wins the day here as we'll see.

Right.

Once again, I'm sorry,.

You feel that way, but you have to understand that we also have a job to do.

Yeah, we do.

Okay.

So under that authority, that's why we're here.

We're not here to go up and down the aisles.

We're not here to drop the service.

You actually will be.

When you go inside, you will see that you will be.

Our people are sitting right there.

And our service has now, we are officially started.

Right now we have, because we've wasted time here.

We were started before that, but now he's in the pulpit.

We were already praying and singing.

Yeah, he's in the pulpit.

I haven't been in, but I don't know what it's like.

Like I said, it's not that we're here to interrupt

anything.

And it's not an interpretation.

You will be.

It's a fact.

You will be interrupted.

We are standing firm on the criminal code 176 that protects these rights.

What you do, I mean, again, if you guys are going to stand up over top of that.

Interruption is going to be defined in the courts and can be argued in the courts.

Okay.

Okay.

So he's, he's right there.

That when, when you have issues that happen on the streets, it does get argued in the courts.

Okay.

This is the thing, even for open air evangelists to remember when you, when you, you know, I've seen this countless

times where I'd see open air evangelists getting arrested and they're

arrested a lot of times just because they were rude to the officer.

And yeah, they win in court, but you, you know, I remember one, one guy who, you know, he knew

he was going to end up getting arrested.

He was, he wanted to, to challenge and some of it because he wanted to take it to court.

He wanted to challenge the back then it was the, the fact that the occupy wall street

was able to make a lot of noise and we couldn't preach the gospel unless we amplified in the Supreme

court allows for that to amplify to the same level as the noise around us in New York.

But that had to be challenged again.

And so he knew he was probably going to get arrested.

He just didn't realize it was a holiday weekend.

So he was there for like four days, but but you know, this is the thing that the

officers, they don't care.

They don't want to sit here and debate law with you.

That's not their job.

And so they'll, they'll, they'll be happy.

You know, if you're going to, if they're going to arrest you, it's like, okay, we'll arrest you and let the court settle it.

So that becomes an issue that you just have to remember.

They're, they're not there to interpret the law and they're not, they're not even going.

To bother with it.

Well, you have to think about this, these two officers, you know, I see people talking about, you know, they're tyrants and stuff like

that, but I want to point out to you this thing that I want everybody to think about.

They have a law to uphold and they have supervisors that are being told by other

supervisors that are being told by other law enforcement agency and governmental agencies that we

have to uphold a law.

And so you're going to go out there and you're going to uphold this thing, whatever it may be.

And and in this case, they were told to escort this, the guy in the

middle, I don't know what he is exactly.

They're going to bring him in health inspector, health inspector.

Okay.

So, so, so they're to protect him.

And I know that's insane.

Uh, the, those Christians aren't going to hurt this man.

We know it's dangerous.

It's.

Just like the pastor.

He had to be, you know, chained up with his legs and yet, you know,.

Child rapists are let free.

Yeah.

Well, but yeah, think about it.

These officers are just, are trying to do a job, you know, Chris, you know, if he was a jumper, he

would say the same thing.

They're trying to do a job to uphold justice and righteousness in some

form.

It may not be the Christian mindset, but it's in some form.

And they're trying to do what's before God that there's their, their mandate to do.

And, and so there has to be that respect as a group of people that recognize

that Christ is the one who is, uh, and in all authority, you know, so

we have to be careful about throwing out the effort of these guys are tyrants and everything else.

No, they're trying to do a job first.

Yeah.

They might be tyrants.

Chris says, thanks, Justin.

One of.

Those things I do wish we'd address more humbly.

I agree a hundred percent with the laws, uh, or edicts are wrong, but the officers just don't

have, uh, just have to do what they are ordered to do.

And that's the thing.

And this is the thing to remember.

So, you know, let's, let's.

Go on with this.

A number of different ways.

Again, we're not here for that purpose.

There's no intent for that.

So even if you feel that way, I'm sorry, you feel that way again, that is not our intent.

Okay.

And if there's no intent, well, I don't think intent comes down.

No, it doesn't come down to that.

Cause your moment you walk in the door, you're interrupting her answers.

And that's very clear in the criminal code.

What's also clear is intent.

So there has to be a reason for somebody to do something.

It's called mens rea.

Okay.

So if someone wants to cause property damage, they'd have to want to cause property damage for a reason.

If they do it by accident, what is your intent?

Like the inspector had stated, I'll let him say, he's here.

I don't want to speak for him.

We're only here on his behalf.

So what is the intent?

I'm here today service

compliance with the owners.

And what's your name, sir?

My name is my name's Rob.

Yeah.

Yeah.

No, but again, in that with that intent,.

It will interrupt our worship service.

Okay.

So you see what he, what he, you know, what.

Rob, I guess now I've picked up his name, but, uh, and by the way, dragon, okay.

Help me with.

This.

Who names their kid dragon, right?

Yeah.

His name's the dragon.

So yeah, I'm, I'm sure I'm thinking of the great red dragon, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

So Rob, Rob ended up now,.

Why don't you guys see what he did?

He's, he's working with what the officer saying, Hey, it's, it's down to intent.

It's what's intent.

Yeah.

What does he do?

Okay.

Can you explain your intent?

Well, my intent is to come in and observe your service.

So now what can you do?

Well, okay.

You want to come in and observe the service that will disturb the service.

So what did he do?

He's, he's saying that, okay, this is, this is now you, you officer, you wanted to talk about

intent.

We now have verified that his intent is to disturb the service.

I want to point out two things you can argue on the same, on the same.

So what does he do?

He doesn't, he didn't try to fight the guy, the officer.

He just said, okay, give me your, give me, let me have your understanding.

Okay.

Let me work with that.

Let me, let me point out.

Two things before we go any further.

I think it's very important to, to say, KT, I love you and respect you.

And I, but I want to disagree with this statement that you made here.

Yet their consciousness should uphold true justice rather than this abuse of power.

Perhaps they should quit.

These gentlemen are interacting with the law that they have.

They're arguing, they're discussing their, you know, point counterpoint.

What's going on here is if these gentlemen who are willing to have a conversation,

quit other officers that will not have a conversation with you are going to step up because

when you get rid of good officers, bad officers always take their places.

Trust me.

It's definitely a, a given that it's going to happen that way.

That's one point.

But I also want to point out this, what are the pastors or elders?

What are they actually doing?

Did you, have you guys caught it yet?

What are they actually doing?

They are stalling with the conversation as long as they can so that the other

Christians can have a worship service for as long as possible.

And that's the reason they didn't call for a watch commander, Chris.

That's why they didn't say, Oh, you get your supervisor out here because when the higher ups, the escalate, they come up, you got to

refer to it.

So read what Chris said.

Okay.

Chris, you asked a question.

He says, I know in my own street street evangelism training to ask for a watch commander, if there are any

disputes of law with the officers on the scene.

And that's true, but you want to be respectful and slow and keep things on a low keel and

take your time.

And I learned this doing street evangelism as a,

as an overseer.

We had about 20 or so with us in Richmond, Virginia, up at the racetrack.

Remember, we got to get through the rest of this.

Oh, okay.

Give me, give me 30 seconds.

Yeah.

So we had a bunch of officers were trying to stop everybody.

And they kept saying, you can't hand out these NASCAR trivia tracks.

And I said, Oh, we can't handle any more of those.

They said, no, no more of those at all.

And I said, okay, we won't walk away and start handing out million dollar bills.

So you, you, you just try to keep it on a low keel.

You have the conversation and then, and let it, let it play out without confrontation as best.

You can.

Yeah.

And I've, I've done this at church where sort of what you said, we, I remember a couple of times we'd have people that were

cultic groups that come into our church.

They want to try to pull people from our church to their group and they, they visit churches like that.

And I'd always, it's a waste of my time, but not really because what I would do is I would just talk to them the entire

time after service and everyone's gone.

Yes.

And there's no one to talk to.

And I just keep correcting them and I wouldn't let them go talk to anyone else.

I'd see they, they'd want to like the, you know, they usually come in a group and one of them would want to pay.

I go, no, wait, wait, come here.

I want to finish talking to you.

I'd pull them back in.

I, I,.

Why, what is that?

That's protecting the flock.

Yeah.

You know?

And that's their job.

Yeah.

And,.

And, and so you're right.

They are, they are doing some of that.

So let's continue on.

I think there's nothing inside that you're going to see that you can't see clearly from out here

with the amount of cars in the parking lot.

So again, I would ask, why do you need to be in the building versus what you've seen with the amount of people that have come into our building

from outside?

I think you can put out just by counting the cars, you can

tell we're not compliant.

So.

I want you to notice that right there.

And, uh, you know, he's, he's, he's acknowledging

so welcome Justin, the other Justin.

Um, but I do want you to notice what he, what he did.

There is maybe a subtle thing, but notice Rob did not deny that they're not in compliance.

They, he's fully accepting that we're not in compliance.

You can count the cars and know we're not in.

Compliance.

Yeah.

And he's admitting, look, we know that you can do anything you want to do because you're the law.

And he's saying, you guys can do anything you want to.

And that's fine.

Do whatever you're going to do.

I keep going back to Peter guys.

Peter says, we have, we have God.

This is what we're supposed to be doing.

You judge what's right.

And if even when they got beat, what do they do?

They praise God and they went ahead and did what God would do.

And that's what these guys are doing.

They're not fighting what the law, what the, those in law enforcement are doing

their, their knowledge.

I mean, I, and, and you're going to see him explain this a bit.

And so let me play a little bit more.

And, and, uh, Justin Peters at any point you want me to stop just a stop and all, unless you want to

add to right now.

Okay.

No, I'll go ahead.

Good.

Good to be with you.

Okay.

So I'll hit play.

We'll play more of this.

Just say stop when you guys.

Want it.

And again, I would say with people that are, you know, that have stand outside and people over there, you can

witness without coming into the building.

That same thing.

Well, no, you're not assuming cause you can see there's people, not social distancing and you can count the cars.

There's no assumptions there.

And with your own testimony and they're witnessing that you don't need to come inside.

Okay.

So do you notice what he's doing there?

He's trying to keep the, the officers from coming in and disrupting the worship service.

So he's, he's giving, he's actually giving him ways of identifying the fact that

you're out of there.

They're not in compliance.

Yeah.

I love what Greg Gregory Owens said there.

He said the, the, the best thing that you can do is to ask many questions.

A good question would be to ask is, uh, what will you do if we don't allow you into our

service?

So, yeah, yeah.

I think Justin Peters, are you,.

Do you have a, uh, you have this, uh, show up on a different tab on your screen?

I did.

I figured it out.

I stopped it.

So, so we're still getting an echo from you though.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think that's, uh, I think now.

Okay.

There's a little dog behind you.

That's not a dog.

Yeah, he is.

There's me.

That's me or the rat.

That's not a dog.

All right.

I think we're still getting an echo from you though, Justin, just so you know.

You are?

I don't know why.

Yeah.

Under the health act, but not under the criminal code.

Yeah.

Which doesn't override.

So like I said, just to be clear, we are standing on criminal code 176.

You're standing on the health act.

You're standing on the health act.

So now we're at an impasse.

Well, at the end of the day, um, again, this guy, this guy has to be intent for

what you're relying on.

But I think we've given you a reasonable option where you don't have to interrupt the service.

You can still observe by being out here and counting the cars.

So we've been reasonable.

And so I think based on that, it would actually see, we have a duty to report

accurate information.

We can give you our actual head count is inside the building.

614 people.

Okay.

So you notice that they have, they, they've already done it, right?

They're providing the head count and it's, they're saying, Oh, we need to make it.

Like they need, they want to go in and count every individual.

How are you going to count?

Think about any church service, right?

How are you going to count every individual?

You've got to go up and down those aisles.

That's going to be disruptive.

But you notice that they're, they're even giving up the information to prove that

they're guilty, right?

They're, they're not denying that at all.

So Chris Han holds is saying, uh, believe me in no way supportive of what the officers are

doing.

I believe governing officials are abusing their authority by doing this.

And he's right, but the officers still have to enforce it.

Now for officers, this creates a dilemma.

And the one gentleman, and you heard him laugh, right?

That lightens up the conversation.

You can't see, unfortunately with the masks, you can't see people's faces.

You can't see a smile, you know?

And so you don't see that it makes it more impersonal, but what did he do there?

He were at an impasse and he laughed at that and to lighten up the, you know,

things.

And so what you end up seeing is this is, this is what ends up happening.

You know, he's, he's trying to point out, look, this is the law we're resting on.

This is the law you're, and officers, what are you going to do?

This is a dilemma for an officer, right?

His job is to, you know, and this is typically the thing, his job is really going to be to protect

both parties and their rights.

Yeah.

And typically just, you know, a police officer typically will default to protecting the

person who called on them.

Okay.

In this case, it's the health, it's, it's the dragon who called them to protect them.

You know, when you're on the street evangelizing, the person who calls the police is usually the one who,

you know, that they're going to try to side with by default.

You know, so maybe we should call the police right away and say, Hey, someone's, someone's, you know, heckling us, you know,

but probably wouldn't be, you know, but the thing is, this is the dilemma for the officers, but there's been plenty of times that I've been on the

street and I've given the same type of dilemma to this, to an officer.

And the, the, what that does is it helps the officer to realize he has to make a decision now on the

street.

And, and I'll even usually say, officer, your job is to protect my rights as well

as his rights.

Correct.

And what does that do?

It puts the officer to say like, Hey, you can't don't violate my rights either.

Like we have to have a, you know, they're providing a way of count the cars.

I mean, they're going to get into this more.

So I'm going to play it just so we can see they're going to, they're going to explain how they come up with a reasonable

number to know they're over the 15%.

They already gave him the exact number.

Yeah.

Funny thing is they are going to mention in a bit, which will be funny as they tell them that if you guys come in, they're over

capacity and that would be, that would be illegal.

They're not allowed.

And so you guys can't come in because we're already at capacity.

So that'll be funny, but let's listen.

Yeah.

And I'm telling you inside the building right now is 614.

Yeah.

So that way you don't have to come in and you can count, you know, the cards.

If you'd like in the parking lot, go ahead and find us.

Yeah.

Cause one person per car, 10 people per car.

Do you understand that?

10 people in a car is not going to fit.

We get that.

But I mean,.

If the assumption is one per car, we can't assume, see the courts don't work on assumptions.

They work on.

One person has to be driving a vehicle per car.

And there's more than more than 94 cars here.

I get that.

So that's why I'm trying to be reasonable about those.

So what he's saying there is if there's 94 cars, there's, if there's 94 cars, clearly there's,

there's a, you know, there's, there's more than 94 people in the building and

there's obviously not 10 people per car.

I mean, you can look at some of those cars.

You've got to pick up truck.

That's why, why are you doing that?

Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry.

I had to put brother out.

Well, I mean, he's jumping around this.

I didn't want to have him there.

Hey brother.

He's trying to put you backstage.

He blew you up.

He blew you up like.

This.

He wanted to put you backstage.

So people didn't see you trying to sit down and he blew.

It up.

So everyone saw you.

I just got up to shut the door to make it a little more quiet.

Oh, I thought that was that the black doesn't come in.

So, all right.

So there's, there's 94 cars.

There's at least 94 people.

They're going to make this point.

Like 94 cars didn't get here without a driver.

94 people put them over the 15 % right off the bat.

So they've given a way that they can know they're not in compliance.

That's what the guy said.

He needs.

He wants to know if they're under compliance.

No, we're not.

Here's how you could tell.

He gives the proof.

He gave the proof to for different ways.

They already counted, gave the number by their own testimony.

They're not in compliance, right?

So let's hear it all.

It comes down to this, right?

And he has a job to do.

We have a job.

We are bound by the courts to report accurate information.

So I can't sit there and go, well, there's 300 cars out here.

So there must be 300 people or because that is just a guess.

It's not accurate.

So is it, so is it the health that has to observe or the RCPD?

It's the health that has to observe.

I'm here for his protection.

Okay.

So, so then we don't worry about you counting.

It's your observations that matter, right?

Yes.

So now what?

They're going to give another solution now.

Being reasonable, you can observe everything you need to outside the building.

And that way you don't interrupt our service and you still get your observations.

And I think that's still factual because like I said, any amount of, if there's more than 93 vehicles in this parking lot, the

vehicles will drive themselves.

So therefore it's reasonable to assume that there's 93 people minimum.

Again, again, we can't assume.

It has to be direct.

Okay.

So then it's a fact that there's minimum 93 people here because there's 93 vehicles.

Again, they could all be somewhere else.

We have to show the courts unequivocally.

Based on his personal information.

And that's it.

Have you submitted affidavits in the court that talked about parking lot counts?

Because I think some of, I think some of Janine's earlier observations had parking.

Lot counts.

Okay.

So here's, here's, you want to say something, Justin?

I just, it's kind of amusing.

I mean, I'm glad this was very cordial and okay, but it's kind of amusing.

And you said, well, you know, talking about the 93 cars as well, they could be somewhere else.

What do you drive to park your car and then walk seven miles miles down Mary Queen?

I mean, I mean.

Yeah.

I mean, it, it isn't because he's going to hit, the officer's going to say that a couple of times with that, but, but

no, no notice the, I mean, Rob is prepared, right?

He knows that they already had in court affidavits used parking lot counting

to, to prove that how many people were, that one was not in compliance.

So now he's using that to say, well, look, you've already done this in the past.

You can't say you need to count every person because you've already counted in other affidavits, the

parking lots.

So now, so because he was informed and, and this is the thing, don't, don't try to

lie and, and, you know, fool your way around with an officer just to make up data, but be,

be informed before things happen.

All right.

So yeah, I guess, I guess people come to church, they drive, they leave their cars at church and they disappear.

We're going to, we're going to see that mentioned again.

That may be, but maybe, but again, it doesn't come down to actual occupancy

within the facility.

And it doesn't matter if it's here or another place.

It makes no difference.

I mean, there could be a thousand cars here, but they could all be busted shut off somewhere else.

Assumption to make.

Based on that, and I think based on what you've seen and what you're seeing here,

you have to go inside.

You understand that I need to see that.

So another reason.

Okay.

I want you to, I want you to notice right there.

Do you hear the singing has now begun?

Okay.

So you know that the pastor's preaching has now done as completed.

They've they've, they did what they've wanted to do is to not disrupt the service.

Now that you hear singing going on.

And so now the guys can wrap it up.

Yeah.

This is for you to wait until the end of the service.

And then you can watch the people coming out of the doors because then you can tell that they haven't just materialized in the building

from these vehicles into the building.

Watch. That's great.

These things materialize in the building.

Yeah.

You can count them coming out and know that they didn't just materialize in the building because what is that?

That that's using humor with what the other officer said that, well, they could have left the car here, but they were somewhere else.

He's like, you can see they're getting out of the building and going into the car.

So Melissa says, maybe they were all raptured.

Maybe this is reverse rapture.

They were raptured into the building.

I mean, builders are, are, are trying to dispel it at form.

Like, I mean, what do they, what do they need to write it and did and finger painted that?

Okay.

We're over the limit.

We are over the 15 % limit.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Still getting some echo for you.

Just, I don't know why.

I don't want everything.

I'm sorry.

Do you need me to, I got out cause I know it's annoying.

No, even hearing you twice is still worth it.

We love you that much.

I'll tell you what, just wave.

I'll mute you in this wave.

And if you have anything to say, we'll put you back on.

Is that okay?

Okay.

So, so now notice one of the things I want you to notice with it though, too, is the use of humor.

Okay.

You're seeing Rob and the other gentlemen, they're not getting all defensive.

They're not getting where they're yelling at them.

They are having conversation.

They're lighthearted.

They're keeping it lighthearted.

You're seeing now, I want you to notice, and this has something to do with, if you're on the street evangelizing, notice things going on

around you.

I want you to notice right now, the officer that was doing most of the talking, the one that has the mask that makes him look

like a duck.

I'm sorry.

It's just how I see it, but he's lost interest now.

Okay.

Now he has been the one defending the health worker the whole time he's been speaking for him.

And, you know, he's saying, well, we have to get an account, right?

Well, the health guy has to do that.

And, but now what has just changed in this conversation?

Rob is talking directly with dragon, the health guy, health inspector.

Now the officer has lost interest.

This is key because they're handling of this.

That officer now wants to go do something else.

Yep.

You know, by the way, Chris is saying, well, well, Andrew, you're not wrong.

Chris probably is speaking from experience, but, but I want you to notice this because this, this notice the behavior

that the body language of the officers and who you're speaking to in this case, what you end up seeing is

the body language of the officer now is like, I want to go catch bad guys.

Okay.

You know, look, it's really simple.

Here's a simple thing to understand with police officers.

There's two things that they want to do.

And, and Justin, you can tell me if you dare say donuts.

Well, you obviously had plenty of that when you were an officer, but I'm going to say there's two things an

officer wants to do.

One, they want to get home to their family.

Yep.

A second thing is they want to catch bad guys.

Yeah.

And, and quite frankly, when you're on the street doing evangelism, you're, you just represent

paperwork and police don't like paperwork.

Okay.

You represent paperwork.

They don't want to deal with you.

They just want you to go away and see what these guys are doing is, is not going away.

They're standing firm on the law, but they're being respectful.

And, and now the officer has lost interest and that's key.

Okay.

Anyone else have anything to say before you hit play?

Well,.

Go ahead, Justin.

Go ahead, brother.

Okay.

All right.

How's the echo echo?

It sounds good.

Good.

It sounds good.

Okay.

Yeah, it's good.

Good.

This is a quite stark contrast between elders at great life handled this

situation and how that other pastor can't remember his name, but was yelling and police

officer Nazis.

I mean, this is, this is a stark contrast.

The elders, it was a great handled this wisely biblically.

It reflects well in Christ.

So kudos, kudos tip of the hat.

They, they, they will, I think they did very, very well in this.

Full belly bear says, Justin Peters only preaches on mountain tops.

That's why.

I go.

I'm impressed.

No, I, in case, in case you don't know, Justin, who full belly bear is, you

went to see Jonathan Edwards with him.

So that'll help you.

Okay.

Well, yeah, we, his tomb, but yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I got an anointing off of the, of the.

I was going to say, if, if he came back out of the ground and started preaching to you guys,.

I missed it.

I didn't hear about it.

Yeah.

I got, I did some grave soaking on Jonathan Edwards.

Well, you admitted it.

I know that I'm not allowed to show pictures, but I got the,.

I got the photo evidence.

What's going to have to happen is Christie's going to find us and he's going to splice out that three

seconds and accuse me of grave soaking.

All right.

Let me play.

We got about seven more minutes of this.

Well, you will see them not masking because they're going to be coming out most likely without masks.

Yeah.

Well, you can see them not physical distancing as they come out of the building.

It's like everything you need to, we're not in compliance, asking physical distancing and count you can do from outside the

building.

You will even move a vehicle if you want.

To sit and watch.

Now notice, notice how compliant they're, I mean, they're, they're, they're saying, look, we're, we're not in

compliance.

We're, we're over capacity.

You could count the cars are over capacity.

You could count the people coming out.

They're either even saying, well, move a car so you could sit right in front of the door so you can count people coming out.

I mean,.

We'll make you some popcorn.

I mean, how helpful can they be to say, Hey, we're,.

We're helping, you know, that we're not in compliance.

Right.

You know, the thing is, is the gentleman in front, in front of us with the, the mask there, the duck mask thing.

I don't know if you guys caught it or not, but he's a supervisor.

Okay.

He's at least a corporal, if not a little bit higher.

He's got the, he's got the bars on his shoulders and he's been

the main guy talking, but you're right.

He doesn't want to be there guys.

He wants to be out of this situation.

And it just shows the fact that, and there are a lot of officers that, that, uh, that are there trying

to do the right thing.

And they're trying to uphold the law and do what's right within the context of what they're told to do.

And they're willing to talk to you.

And as long as you're respectful and you're kind and you're not, you know, some jerk, like, you know, Justin, you

were just talking about the other guy screaming and yelling.

I cannot believe that that went the way it went.

Most, most of the time, those officers are not going to put up with.

That.

I thought they were going to just arrest him.

I did too.

I thought they would arrest him,.

But, but these gentlemen were prepared to be godly.

They were, you know, long suffering and they recognize that the purpose was for them to be

Christian brothers, you know, willing to be,.

You know, engaged in righteous conversation.

And the reason that the officer now is disengaged is because Rob is talking directly

to the health worker, Dragon.

And that's the thing is that, you know, the police are, they're saying, Hey, we're just here for

him, for his protection.

Right.

So, okay, then let's talk directly to him.

And that's what they're, they're doing.

Hey, I'll put this up here for you.

Someone you, you may know says, hi guys.

Nora says, hello.

Yeah.

So someone, you know, but all right, let's play.

That's not practical.

It's very practical.

You're not going in the building and interrupting which isn't practical.

And again, it's one seven, six.

Yeah.

We can sit you at a table.

We can let you sit there and watch and bring you a coffee.

Yeah. We'll bring you the fire capacity for you guys.

We're not there to occupy the building.

We're here to inspect.

We come in cause it's over capacity.

But did you hear that response?

We're not here to occupy the building, but we come in and count and leave.

Next time you go to a store and they say, Oh, we have, we're at capacity.

I'm not actually occupying.

I'm just going to come in here and count the, whatever.

I'm just, I'm just coming into my son and leave.

They're already, so he's just going to make it worse.

Yeah.

That's a very reasonable option.

That way, you're meeting what you need to do.

You're not interrupting our worship service, which allows us to do what we need to do.

And I would extend that to you as an offer to please consider that.

If they use that, but that's being reasonable.

Once again, there's no intent.

You will be walking in the aisles.

You will be the moment you walk in the door where you will be looking.

So you're not going to count over occupancy if you just stand in the front door.

So you're either going to not get everything you need or you're going to be walking down aisles and interrupting.

If you want to gather what he's saying he needs, you will have to, because you have to go up to our balcony, which

takes you by aisles and takes you by people.

Okay.

So now I want you to notice what just happened.

Okay.

I'm just going to mute Justin.

Just raise your hand, Justin, when you want to talk.

Notice the other officer has just come in.

I've actually been in the exact boat that Robert is in right now, where you were talking to a

supervisor who maybe it's the first time in my case, we're at Princeton University,

dealing with the captain.

Captain came out, was giving a friend of ours, Mike Stockwell, told one of the officers, give him a ticket.

The officer, and he didn't even know what he got a ticket for.

But the officer goes to do that.

But I'm talking with the person in charge.

And it was a similar type conversation as we're seeing here.

Just a lot of back and forth, respectful, but it gets to an impasse.

And then I had a case like this where another officer comes in and he's like, look, I've known this person.

I've dealt with him in the past and he's reasonable.

And you end up seeing that it's like, okay, let's start to work on this and bring a conclusion.

This officer is going to look to do that.

Now you're going to see that the officer in charge is going to allow this officer to bring it to a conclusion.

Why?

Because Robert has given plenty of, and he said it over and over, we're trying to be reasonable.

We're trying to work with you.

We've given lots of different ways for you to get your job done.

We get our job done, right?

That's what the officers are.

They're trying to just work out a good solution so that there's no paperwork.

There's no nonsense.

That's what they want.

This officer is now going to come in and provide the solution that's needed.

Have access to go in the building.

If you don't want us to go in the building, that's fine.

But you're accepting the fact you're denying us access to the building.

Okay.

So if you deny access to the building, there's potential for criminal charges or potential for additional charges.

So that being said, we're going to respect the fact that you guys don't want us to go to church.

We're not going to go into the church.

We're going to stay outside.

Okay, thank you.

Okay, so there's no further interaction.

Yeah, thank you.

Are you satisfied with that?

Very much so, yeah.

If you can observe from outside, that would be...

Sorry, can you say that one more time?

So just so I'm clear, we're subject to...

So denying us access under the Public Health Act, there's potential charges that could come, additional charges that could come

under the Public Health Act or whatever.

That'll be for them to sort out because that's an AHS sort of thing.

That's not an RCMP thing.

So we're here in support of him.

If you don't want us to go in there because you're basically disrupting a church service, sorry.

No, that's okay.

Like you see how tight this is?

So that's fine.

I want to respect boundaries, right?

Okay, so the officer doesn't like wearing the mask either, all right?

Just for the record.

This is why masks...

Stop wearing the mask, all right?

I was just in Texas.

Boy, I loved it.

I mean, I walked around everywhere as normal and didn't have to wear the mask.

Justin.

I just got a quick comment about the mask.

I watched a doctor on a video and a great illustration of the

efficacy or lack thereof of masks.

Do masks stop some particular particles in the air?

He said, yeah, sure they do.

But when it comes to a virus, he said, a

mask is a virus.

He said, give it this way.

It's like taking a full of sand and throwing it through a chain link fence.

Will particles bounce off?

Yeah.

Yeah, a few, but 99 .99 are going to going straight

and that's about it.

Yeah, that's what it comes down to.

That's right.

All right, let's hit play.

And so now we're going to get this on where I'm just going to end up pointing some out and then letting it play in a few minutes.

But I'm going to let him talk about now.

What they're doing now is just let's get clarification on this stuff.

What's going to happen next?

And the officer is saying, hey, it's for your health department to decide.

I guess health department decided they needed to fence in the building.

That's what they decided after this.

Yeah, I want to get into a debate.

Yeah, exactly.

And you know, we've been working.

We've dealt with you guys.

That's right.

We're more than you see the respect.

We've been working together.

It's always been typically that comes here.

It's already started.

We'll respect that.

So we'll do an observation from outside.

The nurse, because they were respectful before that respect was already built.

This officer has already dealt with them.

And he understands that, hey, we've dealt with this before.

We understand you've been respectful.

That is important.

When you do that, I've done that at Princeton University, where I've gone back multiple times and we've get the police called on us.

And I've dealt with the same officers multiple times.

And because of that, we don't have problems.

I've done it at Seaside Heights, New Jersey, where we still evangelize regularly.

Same officers week in and week out.

You get to know them.

You respectfully speak to them.

They were respectful back.

That's why you see this officer stepping in right now.

This officer is stepping in because of the respect that had been built by being respectful

previously and not being a jerk and go, I have my rights.

Give me my rights.

You know, get out of here.

You know, would they say Gestapo?

You know, think about first Peter.

I posted on there, you know, Christ didn't try to push his rights as king.

Right.

What did he do?

He was quiet.

He didn't revile.

You know, he could have sent down legions of angels and he didn't do any of those things.

He took what was not his, what didn't belong to him.

And that was the punishment and the wrath and the hate and all that.

And by the way, first Peter 221 tells us this is our example.

Yeah.

The church.

Yes.

If the guys come back next Sunday, we'll make sure that if that's the case, that they come in prior to service start.

They're going to seek clarification on the criminal code.

Because when you look at the criminal code, there's actually case study, case law.

It's not just, this is a chargeable offense.

Any person that does this will, there's a whole bunch of synapses.

There's a whole bunch of other things that have definitions of reasonable.

We just have to be very clear that we're not infringing on something and you're not just taking that text

as.

Yeah.

There are rules that go into exceptions or caveats.

We'll make sure that that's explored fully.

We don't put ourselves in a debating position.

I guess I would also like running a stop sign.

I guess I would also make clear just for your information.

Okay.

So now here's, I'm going to end up just hitting play on this and letting it go.

But I want you to notice now, um, and, and Pauline is saying, why is this serpent as gentle as

doves?

That's right.

Pauline, what we're seeing now we're going to see now is this is the

emphasis.

Now, now this is going to be where we, the three of us here today would disagree with

Dr. Silvestro.

He'll come back and he'll bring some other people to disagree with us, but we have the floor and he's in Florida

suffering in that weather there.

But since he doesn't have internet, he can't come on.

And so, oh, well for him.

But I'm going to just, I'm going to mute Justin.

I'm telling you you're muting it just so you know to wave to, but here's the thing I want you to see.

I want to play this.

I'm going to, I'm not going to stop it at this point.

This is the difference.

Why have they been respectful?

Why have they, they've, they've admitted they're not in compliance, whatever consequences are the consequences.

And they do it for this purpose that we hear now.

And so, so I understand, I understand where the, where the dynamic has changed because yes, I respect that.

And I want to be very clear too, like where, when we say no welcome, it's the interruption of AHS interrupting our service.