August 16, 2021 Show with Rev. Richard A. Lepage II on “What is a True Anglican?”

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues

facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27, verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens

another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to

have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with

your own questions.

And now here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on

the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Monday on this 16th day of

August 2021.

And after many attempts for a number of years, I am so delighted

to have for the very first time ever on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Reverend Richard A.

LaPage II.

He is pastor of Reformation Anglican Church of Gray, Maine.

And today we are going to be addressing, what is a true Anglican separating historic truth from the

falsehoods of those who have hijacked that term.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time ever to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Reverend

Richard A. LaPage II.

You can call me Rick, Chris.

That sounds a lot shorter.

Yes, absolutely.

It makes me think of my father when you say that.

And I'm calling in from Cumberland County, Maine, by the way.

Oh, wow.

Yes. Irony of ironies.

And I'm sure your father didn't call you though, Reverend Richard A. LaPage II.

No, he still doesn't.

All right.

Well, tell us about Reformation Anglican Church of Gray, Maine.

Sure.

So Reformation Anglican

Diocese of

Gray,

we've been planting for about nine years here in Gray.

Well, I'm gathering from the name itself, Reformation Anglican Church, that that

congregation is not an Anglo -Catholic church.

No, we're not.

We are very much a confessional, conforming Anglican church to the...

Yes, and those 39 articles are clearly Calvinistic.

Yes.

And in fact, I pretty much agree with the vast majority of them.

And I know that some of my listeners will be tired of hearing me repeat this, but

I have a hard time even disagreeing as a Reformed

Baptist with the article on baptism because it doesn't mention

infants.

It just says that children should not be forbidden baptism.

And as a Reformed Baptist, if a child repents and believes, I believe he should be baptized.

I know that the intention there was infants, but I'm just saying that in a bit of

lightheartedness.

Um, well, the 39 articles is one distinctive.

Is the church officially tied in any sense to the Common Book of

Prayer or the Book of Common Prayer?

I'm sorry.

And which, if so, which date do you use for the Book of Common Prayer?

Because I understand that that does make a big difference amongst Anglicans.

It does make a big difference.

Officially, throughout the Anglican Communion, it's remained unchanged.

The official standard for liturgy for Anglicanism is 1662, and that's not

only recognized by the Church of England, but it's also recognized by GAFCON.

As far as I know, most of all of the GAFCON members have had to sign on to the

formularies of the Church of England as they stand in their final form.

That would be the 1571 version of

the 39 homilies,

liturgies for the making of a liturgy

or ordination

format for making an insight to the theology

of how we see ministry.

And is Reformation Anglican Church of Greymane a high

church, a low church?

And after you tell us which one you are, why don't you describe the differences?

Well, definitely in the Anglican world, we'd be considered a low,

you know, probably according to much of the evangelical world today, they would consider us high church.

But we are definitely on the Anglican candle.

They rate your status by how high up on the candle you are.

We would definitely be low down on the candle.

I take very seriously, and I take very seriously, my ordination vows to the

theology of the 39 articles and the theology of the 16.

We use a moderate number of our liturgies,

but I take great pains to make sure that they conform to the theology of the 1662,

so I'm not violating my ordination oath.

Great.

Well, if anybody wants more information on Reformation Anglican Church of

Greymane, you can go to ReformationAnglicanChurch .org.

ReformationAnglicanChurch .org.

Now, for what we do as a tradition on I Am Terrapin Zion Radio, when we

have first -time guests on the program, we have them describe

their salvation testimony.

What kind of religious atmosphere, if any, they were raised in, and what kind of providential circumstances our

Sovereign Lord raised up in their lives that drew them to himself and saved them, and that would include you.

So why don't you give us a summary of your salvation testimony?

Sure.

You probably can tell from my last name that I don't come from English stock, per se.

I've got French -Canadian background, born originally in New Hampshire.

My family, like so many French -Canadians culturally,

I would regard as fairly devout when I was young.

The college that I graduated from was Benedictine College, St. Anselm College in Manchester, New Hampshire.

Great -uncle -who -litter -boy manual that

was written in Latin and English, even though by the time I was an altar boy, Vatican II had already happened.

So, you

know, as I

grew up,

I read the Bible, many of the

Bible stories from a young age, which, you know, I

did do that.

And making confirmation at that confirmation,

we were given a workbook, and we were given a Bible.

Remained in the cellophane wrappers on the desks.

I was rather eager Catholic

Church.

I had a friend that belonged to another denomination.

I think he was Methodist.

I remember him telling me about their confirmation class and that they were taken around

to be given an exposure to what different faiths believed.

So I assumed, without thinking, exactly what we would do,

because nobody would ask us to join a church that we didn't actually have an understanding of and also have

disappointed.

My mother puzzled me,

and I felt like I couldn't make a decision.

So I actually took an unusual...

You do as a formality of the Holy Communion.

You do it.

There's a little cake and party afterward, and then on you go.

A young lady in...

Very deep like with her, as many teenage boys do, and teenage ladies.

So she, you know, but she held firm to that, and she invited me over for dinner.

Her father, which is another testimony to the way she was raised.

He died tonight.

It was good in telling him everything that I did was bad, and he's God, and let him judge.

Sure.

Nope.

You know, today, I really shouldn't.

Yeah.

And afforded...

But that raised a whole host of questions for me.

The Holy Spirit really used that to challenge me.

Guidance Count was the senior

class president, class advisor.

I met this girl.

I wanted to ask her out to a dance, and she said no, and she said it's because I wasn't a Christian, and

yet I've been raised a Roman...

She'd come back to my office, and he did something that would definitely get you fired today.

Turned out he'd been in the Navigator.

Had his Navigator cards in the drawer of his desk, and so he pulled those out, and he shared some

of the gospel verses, repenting and having

faith, and she invited me to go and chat with his

Catholic, and had been in the same situation that I had been in.

And I

went down

and made an

appointment with him.

I just began to come under conviction of my sinfulness, of the corrupted nature of my heart, and

led me out of just

being bathed in

the love of Christ.

That's how I came to faith in Christ.

Tony was instrumental in youth by... to bring me to

the gospel.

Right after high school, and then when I got back,

got involved in the Varsity Christian Fellowship, and it was really there that I began...

Before then, I just thought that

no, your walk has to be in line with your

confession, and at

that

time,

St. Anselm

called

my...

And I wanted to be closer to home, and St. Anselm was closer to home, and I became interested...

I was also interested in philosophy, and they had a fantastic philosophy program that was done,

and I didn't know if I...

I love to tell people that the reason

that I became

at St. Anselm was we were

required to read...

It's interesting that the year that I was in, they had this core

prophet, and they gave

us two on prophetic, modern -day

prophets.

Were they prophetic in their exposition of the Christian faith?

And believe it or not, it was Martin Luther, Bondage of the Will.

So I began to read more and study more.

I got very involved in the Varsity Christian Fellowship.

Learned to

approach

for churches in the

PCAA.

I think you've interviewed before Dr. T. David Gordon.

Oh, yeah, I've interviewed him several times.

Yes, he was my pastor.

In fact, he married my wife and I.

I really made the final journey into the Reformed faith, a church where he was

pastor full -time New Testament,

a profound influence on my early development and understanding, and he was the one that encouraged

me.

I think I finished two years working on staff within a varsity, and he's one of the encouragement.

I went down to what I began to encounter.

It's interesting that Dr. Gordon was a Presbyterian pastor, but the last time I

spoke with him, he was a member of an Anglican church.

Not a pastor, but a member, as I think I am correctly remembering that.

Yes, he is.

He attends, him and his wife attend, as far as I know, I haven't talked to him in

a year or two.

He attends Grace Anglican Venue, which is pastoral.

I guess we're founding members of Grace Anglican.

And it's also interesting that the time that Dr. Gordon had

transferred to teach at Grove City

was also his journey, and I believe he's still a Presbyterian minister

in good standing, and I would encourage everybody out there, if they haven't heard of this yet, on Dr. Gordon's

website, he has a phenomenal on why he, as a

teaching elder, a Presbyterian teaching elder,

for anyone who knows Dr. Gordon, a very

insightful mind for determining

why he as a ordained Presbyterian.

But his journey to helping out at Grace Anglican was paramount.

We got the dream of a married

student in

Philadelphia.

It's

connected

with the 70s

or 80s, and they typically would hire

a seminary couple to come and live with on the property and basically do caretaking work around the

property, do grocery shopping, take out the garbage.

And this was

1999 to 2002, 2003 time frame,

and this was when the Episcopal Church in New

Hampshire, a number of

churches in the Philadelphia area that were basically of

rebellion, that was half church, that began the exodus out of

the

Episcopal Church, but they had a

confirmation service, Episcopal or

Anglican.

And if you know anything about the Anglican communion, we value our ties globally.

The global Anglican communion is not a small thing among

our unity and our connections with our brothers and sisters.

We were in difficulty.

Many brave African bishops that came over and began to preach,

many of them were losing their property.

One of the

denoted New

Testament, I

spent too much time reading, which was

Catholic and also my Reformed, and

always just

this Roman Catholic light.

I

began

to, as

the

theology of

English

Reformers,

and I was utterly floored by how Reformed

it was.

The marks of the day, I

forget,

made me begin to pay attention for a

number of classes.

And I always loved it.

Great man, one of my favorite preachers and authors.

Absolutely, I still am so indebted to him.

I still say,

I began to really become a student of studying prayer.

A number of years in evangelical church, so many of evangelical

prayers, extemporaneous prayer,

and creator of the universe, the most holy God.

And Dr. Ferguson,

so I began to read prayers.

I began to study.

Yes, I actually conducted an interview paying tribute

to the Valley of Vision, and my guest was Reformed Anglican Roger Salter.

Oh, Roger is wonderful, isn't he?

Oh yeah.

Yeah, Roger is a sheer delight.

Roger was one of the first gentlemen, first Reformed Anglican blogs that I began reading.

By the way, could you pick up where you left off there?

Because we have to go to our first break right now.

Sure, so long story short, Arthur Bennett, I was stunned when I found out he was an Anglican priest.

And that made me run over to the Westminster bookstore and go and look

up, and I pulled down off the shelf, the 1662 Leatherbound

Cambridge, I found out that Arthur

Bennett got a

copy of that, and I began to read that.

In fact, we'll pick up right there when we come back.

There you go, wonderful.

When we come back from our first break, if anybody has a question, whether you agree with my guest,

Pastor Richard LaPage, or you vehemently disagree, even if you're not a Christian, we would love to hear

from you at chrisarnson at gmail .com with your own question, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N

-Z -E -N at gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least, your city and state, and your country of residence, if you live outside the USA.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Let's say you are in either a leftist Anglican

church or Episcopalian church, and you are considering leaving because of

the troublesome teachings and practice in those leftist and apostate churches, or perhaps

you're on the other wing outside of Reformed Anglicanism,

the Anglo -Catholic wing, also known as the Tractarians and the Puseyites and

all other kinds of labels.

Well, we understand things like that would compel you to remain anonymous, but if you're just asking a general question,

please give us your first name at least, your city and state, and your country of residence.

We'll be right back, right after these messages.

We'll wish you luck, one and other,.

As we're walking in the light.

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Arnzen.

If you just tuned us in, our guest for the entire program is Reverend Richard A. LaPage

II, pastor of Reformation Anglican Church of Gray, Maine.

And we are addressing the theme, what is a true Anglican separating historic truth from the falsehoods of

those who have hijacked that term?

If you have a question, email it to chrisarnzen at gmail .com, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N

-Z -E -N at gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least, city and state of residence, and country of residence.

And right before the break, Richard, you were, or Rick, as you requested I call you,

you said that Arthur Bennett, the compiler, editor of the Valley

of Vision, a classic book on Puritan prayers,

when you discovered that book, you also discovered that Arthur Bennett was an Anglican,

and you did some research, and you got yourself a copy of the Book of Common Prayer,

and that led you deeper into Anglicanism, and if you want to pick up right there.

Sure, yeah.

You know, and then it

came in, and it was very fascinating.

I began to discover, I know that T. David Gordon had also incorporated,

I know in my travels around other Presbyterian circles, I noticed that other Presbyterians had also

adopted several of the plagues.

By the way, I'd like to give a plug right here to a friend of mine who I've interviewed, Angelo Valley.

I don't know if you know Angelo.

Yes, I know Angelo.

He's a very delightful young man.

Yes, he is pastor of Christ Reformed Church of Alexandria, Pennsylvania.

He is a pastor in the Presbyterian Church in America denomination, and yet

he loves and utilizes the Book of Common Prayer, and I'm not sure how officially

it is involved in the worship of the church, but I know that he personally,

devotionally takes great advantage of it, and even posts

articles from it on the internet, and I'd like to give him a plug as far

as his website is concerned.

It is crcalexandria .org,

crcalexandria .org.

That's for Christ Reformed Church of Alexandria, Pennsylvania, but I

interrupted you, and you could continue.

Sorry about that.

Yeah.

Well, in my course of study at Westminster, that whole experience,

beginning to become an Anglican at that time, but it was the beginning of the process,

suddenly began to become more aware of how many Reformed authors, both

in terms of,

because they were Anglican, I mean, J .I. Packer,

before it's all that's confused, and it always made me wonder, how did these

guys end up there?

Then as I looked at so many commentaries, and so many theological discussions that were

written by standard

textbooks, I'm trying to, I've been scratching my head trying to remember the title.

I can see the cover of it, the standard textbook that would

have been written by an Anglican or biblical.

I just remember that in my head

of how many Anglicans had a great influence on the Reformed faith.

The theme at hand is, what is a true Anglican separating

historic truth from the falsehoods of those who have hijacked that term?

Now, the whole subject of Anglicanism is quite

fascinating.

First of all, let me very briefly explain to our listeners why I so frequently have

Anglicans on my program.

People have been wondering if I am an Anglican, or if I am becoming an Anglican.

The answer to both of those is no.

I'm a Reformed Baptist who has a very high regard for biblically faithful Reformed Anglicans.

And one of the reasons why the subject is so near and dear to my heart is that

my father, even though I was raised Roman Catholic before my

rebirth by the grace and mercy of God, my father was initially

Episcopalian, was raised Episcopalian himself.

He later converted to Catholicism when I was a teenager.

But I think the subject became more

deeply embedded in my mind and heart to discover and learn more about biblically

faithful Anglicans when my uncle, who is now deceased,

my uncle Don, who was an Episcopalian,

was so disgusted by the leftist apostasy in the Episcopal church

that he converted to Catholicism.

He did not become a Reformed Anglican.

He became a Roman Catholic.

And that saddened me because I know of the heresies

of Rome.

I know that Rome officially has a false gospel.

If they condemn, especially very clearly

at the Council of Trent, they condemned the gospel of the Reformers, and I believe

in the gospel of Reformers, obviously they must have a different gospel than I do.

If you, that is, are believing in the Roman Catholic dogmatic gospel,

the one that they define.

So that disturbed me, it saddened me, and I started to learn and discover more about biblically faithful

Anglicans, and that fascination continues to this day.

And it's a very controversial issue because not only do you have the different extreme

wings of Episcopalian and Anglicanism, you have the far -left apostasy,

where you have clergy that deny some of the pillars of the faith, not all of them, obviously, but

you have clergy that deny the deity of Christ, the virgin birth of Christ.

Bishop Spong comes to mind?

Yes.

In fact, I was present at a debate that Bishop Spong had with my very dear friend, Dr. James R. White of Alpha and

Omega Ministries, and Dr. Spong was defending homosexual activity

as being something compatible with Christianity, which is

very interesting that somebody would be considering themselves an expert on something defining Christianity

when it's not even clear whether he believed in the existence of God.

But, but, but so you have that wing, and then you also have the other

extreme Romish Anglo -Catholic wing,

which one can very often, or even most often, barely

distinguish from the Roman Catholic Church, except for the primacy of the papacy.

And then even within those that identify themselves as Protestant and Reformed,

you have so many divisions.

Every time I do a program on Anglicanism, I have people contacting me

who are either thrilled and elated, or who are seriously

questioning the accuracy and truth of

whatever guest I may be interviewing, even though they might be themselves Reformed and Protestant.

And to be perfectly honest, at least two Reformed Anglicans have contacted me in the midst of this program,

saying that they believe that they will disagree with much of what you have to say.

So it's kind of an interesting phenomenon with Anglicans.

There are disagreements, even within the Reformed camp, disagreements over titles,

whether you should call yourself a pastor, a rector, father, reverend,

I could go on and on, vestment disagreements, collar disagreements,

and then, of course, the high church, low church disagreements, and whether or not to

view Anglo -Catholics and Roman -Catholics as brothers in Christ.

And of course, let me interrupt myself here.

I believe that I do have Anglo -Catholic and Roman -Catholic brothers in Christ who believe

in the biblical gospel.

I cannot be more kind than the Apostle Paul, who believed the Judaizers

were false Christians, and all they did was add circumcision.

From what we know, everything else the Judaizers did was in harmony with what Paul

believed and taught, with the exception of their insistence on circumcision.

And when the Church of Rome adds a lot more than that, how on earth could I say that they are my brothers in Christ?

Unless they are Catholic, or Roman -Catholic, I should say, in name only, and believing in a

biblical gospel.

But now that I've gotten my own voice out of the way,

we have to already go to our midway break.

We started our first break a little bit late, so we have to go to our midway break right now.

Not a problem.

And if anybody has any questions for Reverend Richard A. Lepage II

of Reformation Anglican Church of Gray, Maine, email them to chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

C -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com.

As always, give us your first name, city and state, and country of residence.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

And please be patient with us, folks, because the midway break is always a bit longer than the other breaks because

Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida, who airs this program, they are

compelled by the FCC to localize geographically this program and all of their programming

to Lake City, Florida, and they do so with their own public service announcements that they air in the middle of the show

while we simultaneously air our globally heard commercials.

So please use this time wisely.

Write down as much of the information as you possibly can provided by as many of our advertisers as you possibly can

so that you can more frequently and successfully respond to our advertisers.

And we hope that many of you will purchase their products, use their services, visit

their churches, support their parachurch organizations.

But when you cannot do any of that, please, I'm urging you, please at

least respond to our advertisers by thanking them for sponsoring this program.

That is, if indeed you love the show and you don't want it to disappear, please

contact them and say thank you so much for sponsoring Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Also use this time to write down questions for our guest, Reverend Richard A. LePage II,

and send them to chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Don't go away.

We'll be back after these messages with more of Rick LePage and what is a true

Anglican.

Welcome Justin Peters, Daryl Bernard Harrison, Virgil Walker and James White.

More than 20 other speakers will be joining us and the lineup this year includes my pastor, John MacArthur.

For details, visit g3conference .com.

That's g3conference .com.

Chris Arnson and I hope to see you September 30th through October 2nd at G3

2021.

This is Phil Johnson reminding you that Christ is supreme overall.

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This is Pastor Bill Sasso, Grace Church at Franklin, here in the beautiful state of Tennessee.

Our congregation is one of a growing number of churches who love and support Iron

Sharpens Iron Radio financially.

Grace Church at Franklin is an independent, autonomous body of believers which strives

to clearly declare the whole counsel of God as revealed in scripture through the person and work

of our Lord Jesus Christ.

And of course, the end for which we strive is the glory of God.

If you live near Franklin, Tennessee, and Franklin is just south of Nashville, maybe 10 minutes,

or you are visiting this area, or you have friends and loved ones nearby, we hope you will

join us some Lord's Day in worshiping our God and Savior.

Please feel free to contact me if you have more questions about Grace Church at Franklin.

Our website is gracechurchatfranklin .org.

That's gracechurchatfranklin .org.

This is Pastor Bill Sasso wishing you all the richest blessings of our Sovereign

Lord, God, Savior, and King Jesus Christ today and

always.

Chris Orenson, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, announcing a new website with an exciting offer from World

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Linbrook Baptist Church on 225 Earl Avenue in Linbrook, Long Island, is teaching God's timeless truths in

the 21st century.

Our church is far more than a Sunday worship service.

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We're a diverse family of all ages,.

Enthusiastically serving our Lord Jesus Christ.

In fellowship, play, and together.

Hi, I'm Pastor Bob Walderman and I invite you to come and join us here at Linbrook Baptist Church and see all that a church can

be.

Call Linbrook Baptist at 516 -599 -9402.

That's 516 -599 -9402 or visit linbrookbaptist .org.

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When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the New American

Standard Bible were among my very first sponsors.

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As a mother, I was looking for a magazine that would include devotionals that I

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My name is Anthony Uvino and I'm one of the pastors at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Quorum, New York and also the

host of the reformrookie .com website.

I want you to know that if you enjoy listening to the Iron Sharpens Iron radio show like I do, you can now find it on the

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You no longer have to worry about missing a show or a special guest because you're in your car.

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Please be sure to also give it a good review and pass it along to anyone who would benefit from the teaching and the many

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Truth is so hard to come by these days so don't waste your time with fluff or fake news.

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And finally, if you're looking to worship in a reformed church that holds to the 1689 London Baptist Confession

of Faith, please join us at Hope Reformed Baptist Church in Coram, New York.

Again, I'm Pastor Anthony Avinio and thanks for listening.

As host of Iron Sharpens Iron radio, I frequently get requests from listeners for church recommendations.

A church I've been strongly recommending as far back as the 1980s is Grace Covenant Baptist Church in

Flemington, New Jersey, pastored by Alan Dunn.

Grace Covenant Baptist Church believes it's God's prerogative to determine how he shall be worshiped and how he

shall be represented in the world.

They believe churches need to turn to the Bible to discover what to include in worship and how to worship

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Grace Covenant Baptist Church endeavors to maintain a God -centered focus.

Reading, preaching, and hearing the Word of God, singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs,

baptism, and communion are the scriptural elements of their corporate worship, performed with faith, joy,

and sobriety.

Discover more about Grace Covenant Baptist Church in Flemington, New Jersey at

GCBCNJ .squarespace .com.

That's GCBCNJ .squarespace .com or

call them at 908 -996 -7654.

That's 908 -996 -7654.

Tell Pastor Dunn that you heard about Grace Covenant Baptist Church on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Every day at thousands of community centers, high schools, middle schools, juvenile institutions,

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Charles Haddon Spurgeon.

Once said, Give yourself unto reading.

The man who never reads will never be read.

He who never quotes will never be quoted.

He who will not use the thoughts of other men's brains proves that he has no brains of his own.

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can unearth from Solid Ground.

Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

And my Anglican listeners may be very interested to know that solid -ground -books

.com has brought back into print and even published

contemporary authors that are Anglicans and deal with Anglican subjects

or promote great Anglican minds of history.

I would strongly recommend that you go to solid -ground -books .com for instance,

and one of the authors that they publish who I absolutely love

is Stephen H. Ting and he spells his first name with a PH. A 19th century

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He has a book published or brought back into print by Solid Ground Christian Books.

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One year during my Iron Sharpens Iron Radio pastor's luncheons which I have twice a year,

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Also by Stephen H. Ting published by Solid -Ground -Books

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Highly recommend that book.

That's a much larger book.

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They are a vital sponsor of this program.

We could not exist without their financial support.

Please visit them frequently and purchase generously.

Always mentioning that you heard about them from Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Before I return to my discussion with my guest today, Reverend

Richard A. LePage II, pastor of Reformation Anglican Church of Gray, Maine,

on our subject of what is a true Anglican, I just have a couple of other announcements to make.

If you are a man in ministry leadership, I emphasize the word man,

you are invited to the next Iron Sharpens Iron Radio pastor's luncheon, which is being held Monday,

September 27th, 11 a .m. to 2 p .m. It will be held right here

in Carlisle, Pennsylvania at the Bongiorno Conference Center.

And it is absolutely free of charge.

Not only is it free, but there is nothing that will be sold there.

There is no ulterior motive or hidden agenda.

My late wife, Julie, in the 1990s, urged me to start treating

pastors that I know to a Christmas lunch is how it began.

And she insisted, I want this to be free of charge.

I don't want there to be any Amway products being

sold or membership in Amway or anything like that going on.

I don't want any ulterior motives.

I don't want any hidden agenda.

I want this just to be a blessing to pastors that you know, a time of refreshment,

relaxation, fellowship, feasting on good food and being fed

spiritually by the word of God by a very gifted guest speaker and free

books from major Christian publishers all over the United States and the United Kingdom.

Well, I have been doing this every year since the 1990s and even when

my wife went home to glory, I still continue to do these in her memory.

So if you would like to attend, as long as you can make it to Carlisle, Pennsylvania, and we have people coming from very

far distances every year to these events, just send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com

chrisarnson at gmail .com and put pastor's luncheon in the subject line.

Our speaker this year is Dr. Conrad M. Bayway and I am not exaggerating when I say

I believe he is the most powerful preacher of the gospel alive on the planet Earth today.

I am not exaggerating.

He is pastor of Kibwata Baptist Church in Lusaka, Zambia, Africa.

He's a reformed Baptist and he is absolutely extraordinary.

He is our guest speaker and we will also have the free books to give away that I've personally

selected from major Christian publishers all over the United States and the United Kingdom, all absolutely free.

Send me that email to chrisarnson at gmail .com and put pastor's luncheon in the subject line.

Also, thank you folks for praying for my oldest brother, John.

As you know, he received a very grim prognosis from his doctor of having only six months to live,

sadly.

Obviously, only God knows for certain when he is going to take my brother from this Earth,

but he very often gifts human beings who are physicians with enough

skill that they can accurately predict very often

the length of time someone has left on this planet just because of their

experience.

But please pray that our sovereign Lord, our great physician, heals my brother, gives him more

years of life on this Earth, and especially that I know without question

that he is truly a child of God and heading to be with Christ the Savior for eternity.

He has made some very promising and encouraging professions about his faith in Christ.

Please pray that he continues to bear fruit in that way, and so much so to the point where any

doubt or fear that I have in his regard is erased.

His wife also now has COVID pneumonia, so pray for his wife, Jan,

as well.

And pray for Pastor Mac Tomlinson, a Reformed Baptist pastor near my brother in Denton, Texas, who

has been visiting him and giving the gospel to him.

Also, folks, if you love this show and you do not want it to disappear from the airwaves, please, I'm

urging you, go to irontreppanzionradio .com, click support, then click, click to donate now.

You can donate instantly with a debit or credit card.

In that fashion, if you prefer snail mail, you will also see a

physical address where you can mail checks via your local postal service

made out to Iron Treppanzion Radio.

That will appear on the screen when you click support at irontreppanzionradio .com as well.

Please remember that I never want anybody siphoning money away from their regular giving that they're accustomed to to their own

local church where they are a member in order to give to Iron Treppanzion Radio.

One of the main reasons I founded this show in 2005 was to be a friend, a

platform, a helping hand and an outreach from the local pastor in the local

church to my audience.

I never wanted to be a hindrance or a harm in any way to the local pastor in the local church

and that includes financially.

So don't take money away from your regular giving to them in order to give to Iron Treppanzion Radio.

Please don't do that.

And also, don't plunge your family into further financial peril by giving to

Iron Treppanzion Radio if you're really struggling to survive.

Those two things are commands of God in Scripture, providing for your church and your family.

Providing for my radio show is obviously not a command of God in Scripture.

But if you are financially blessed above and beyond your ability to obey those two

commands, you have money in the bank collecting interest, you have extra money for recreational

purposes and trivial purposes, please share some of that money with us so that we can

continue to exist if you love the show and you listen to it often.

You download the free mp3s often.

We are in urgent need of your help financially.

The coronavirus pandemic hysteria has really harmed us financially greatly.

Our giving has gone down radically.

People in our audience are hurting financially and have cut down on their giving or cut out entirely their

giving to Iron Trip and Zion Radio.

Please help us replenish that which has been lost if you want us to continue airing this program.

Go to irontripandzionradio .com, click support, then click click to donate now.

Last but not least, if you are not a member of a biblically faithful, theologically and

doctrinally sound church, no matter where you live on the planet Earth, I have extensive lists

of biblically faithful churches, including Reformation Anglican Church of Gray, Maine,

and so therefore, wherever you live in any place on the planet Earth, I may be able to

help you find a church, even sometimes within minutes from where you live, as

has happened with many listeners in our audience from all over the globe.

Send me an email today if you are in that predicament of not having a biblically faithful church of your own.

Send it to chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com, and put I need a church in the subject line.

And that also goes for those who are visiting areas on vacation, and they want to go to a biblically faithful church,

or if they have family, friends, and loved ones who don't have a church home.

I may be able to help.

Chrisarnson at gmail .com, but I need a church in the subject line.

That's also the email address where you could send in a question to Reverend Richard A. LaPage,

chrisarnson at gmail .com.

We are discussing what is a true Anglican.

And right before the break, I was saying there are so many divisions, even amongst Reformed Anglicans, even those that

strongly identify as Protestants.

So tell us from here how you would identify as an Anglican,

and what are the, in your opinion, the necessary requirements to accurately and

honestly wear that title?

Sure.

I think you raise a really good question.

It's a question I get asked quite a bit, particularly from folks that are trying that

are thinking about making the journey into Anglicanism.

It's a question that's been raised, speaking

of J .C. Ryle.

I've actually looked up the course.

So many Evangelicals and Reformed folks truly admire his writings.

He wrote in the late 1800s, who is the true, that is the question,

which is shaking the established Church of England to the very center.

Men complain with good reason that they feel puzzled, perplexed, embarrassed, bewildered, posed and

mystified by the question.

Rationalists, ritualists, and Evangelicals.

And to cut to the quick, the answer that J .C. Ryle settles on is that

the Church of England has provided a test to the one that is recognized by the

one found in the 39 articles of religion.

And it was a question, the question that you've asked is a question that I had to wrestle through as I made my journey into

Anglicanism.

And I think that one of the things that we need to do is we have to

that or standards that we begin to and one of the

first ones is folks who are looking at Anglicanism

and we have to be totally honest about that.

There is a

day so much so that even Anglicans will say

that we are

most and that needs to be arrested.

We got to recognize that any difference in

denominations or churches that came a

great

number of different

Presbyterian denominations do you identify

what is the true belief or definition of a particular church.

You certainly would not go to Church USA to define

Presbyterianism.

They have the OPC or the

PCA.

You would not go to perhaps the CRC to define what are

continental reforms.

Certainly the URC.

So you have to ask how do you define what makes an Anglicanism

of the faith and piety of Anglicanism.

And to answer that question we have to take the Reformation principle of ad fontes.

You have to go back to the sources.

In the contemporary American scene you have lots of different people

writing about there

are

many reforms.

One of the so there are many

but one of the strengths

that

people

have recognized

found on C2 Book

of Common Prayer which

is by the Church of England.

C2 Book of Common Prayer is the ordinal itself.

And those

we know that they have liberal

bishops churches that are

have not had the ability to change

the definition

to take a look at the

Church of England even today

that

is

legally

binding

as it doesn't

matter

whether they're connected to the those

definitions

and theology.

It's very early

to liturgies

today.

I like to use the illustration

people begin to realize it's

one who's

actually

still says it's just

enforcing the legal speed on this

road

because we have revisionist

representations

or

does

that make sense?

Yes, it makes a lot of sense and let me squeeze in a question from an

anonymous listener.

My father is a member of an Episcopalian church and he

calls his minister Father and his minister calls himself Father.

I've noticed that when Chris Arnson has guests on his program from the Anglican background

there is a difference between guests that he interviews.

Some have called themselves Father but Chris has refused to

identify him in that manner respectfully because he does not believe that any

clergyman should be identified with that title and some call themselves pastors and

some call themselves rectors.

Can you help me figure out the confusion over this?

Certainly, that's a modern innovation that came to us through the Anglo -Catholic movement.

It's a practice that was adopted by

the Church of England and a collection of them

when I look at it.

It's particularly popular in North America.

It's not something that it is happening elsewhere but

quite as much historically in

tradition

this practice of using the Roman

rather a modern read the older literature you won't find

Anglican priests typically being referred.

One of the reasons why it's

so popular is Anglo

-Catholicism in the late 1800s

looked white and yet many of the practices have

been adopted you know Roman Catholic.

Even the architecture that many churches

are adopting has been

gained supremacy.

There's no altar mentioned for example in either of the

tables

celebrated.

You know Father is I don't get to.

I have some folks that came out of more Anglo -Catholic or Episcopal churches in our

church plant they will refer to me as Father.

I don't make a big deal out of it but then it

took off in North America.

Yes the listener the anonymous listener was correct that I and I

mean no disrespect to an occasional guest that identifies himself

with that title Father but I refuse to call a person who is a minister

Father.

But one of the other differences that most reformed folk have with Anglicans

even if we agree on 99 of other theological and doctrinal issues is the whole

concept of a minister being identified as a priest.

We believe that there is a priesthood of believers that is all Christians are priests

not in the sense of the Old Testament or in the sense of the Roman Catholic.

Understanding.

And we do not accept the explanation that it is a abbreviation

of Presbytos where Presbyterian comes from but if you could respond to that.

Well historically when you look at the development

of the term priest in English it comes

they basically took the

word began to develop it widely

developed into the term priest.

It has nothing to do with the idea of a sacrifice

that is used and you can

see this very clearly in the Ordinal.

The Ordinal is very clear to identify that we are being ordained as Presbyters.

That term is used many.

Diarmuid McCulloch has explained this.

J .C. Ross

Roman Catholic

and I am a Presbyter.

And you will see that in our Ordinal service we are

really emphasized

to ordain.

They were given a chasurdotal

office

and he begins to develop the various editions of you will see that in the

Ordination service

a chalice and pass

the final official

patent.

But they give him the word of

New England in their understanding of ministry that it is moved from a

separate part of God.

See

that by.

It's right there in the back.

Don't take my.

Susan Margaret of Dauphin County, Pennsylvania says you mentioned earlier that the Church of

England still exists isn't that.

Really.

She says.

Isn't that really in name.

Only.

I am quite confident that both the Anglo -Catholic and the Protestant Anglicans of

centuries ago would call for the execution of most in leadership in the Church of England

today and would not even recognize them in the way that they teach and live.

Well certainly she.

Yeah she's probably right.

Thomas Cranmer.

If he was in his grave and ignored I think he'd be.

However we're talking about what defines and

Presbyterian Church or

the Isa is that how do you define Presbyterian when you

go to the Westminster Standards.

Right.

And you know if you're a Baptist is it the 1689 London Confession.

You go to that if you want to determine what's a Continental Reformed Church

do you go to its current expression in CRC as apostasy you know as

apostate as they are becoming or have become.

Or do you go to the three forms of unity as they were originally written.

Okay and established that if you want to understand

or leaders in definition find our

faith and our piety.

And those are the 1571 39 articles.

And when we.

When we come back.

From that.

You can pick up where you left off when we come back from our final break and if anybody else wants to join

us our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

C h r i s a r n z e n gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least city and state and country of residence.

Don't go away we'll be right back with a page right after these messages from our sponsors.

I'm james white of alphanomega ministries.

My friend chris arnson host of iron sharpens iron radio and i are headed down to atlanta georgia once

again for the g3 conference.

This year's g3 will be held thursday september 30th through saturday october 2nd on the theme

christ is supreme.

Over all.

I'll be joined by over 20 other speakers and musicians to lead in the worship of god through preaching teaching and

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This is james white reminding you that christ is supreme over all.

When iron sharpens iron radio first launched in 2005 the publishers of the new american

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Hi.

This is john sampson pastor of king's church in peoria arizona taking a moment of your day

to talk about chris arnson and the iron sharpens iron podcast.

I consider chris a true friend and a man of high integrity.

He's a skilled interviewer who's not afraid to ask the big penetrating questions while always defending the key

doctrines of the christian faith.

I've always been happy to point people to this podcast knowing it's one of the very few safe places on the internet

where folk won't be led astray.

I believe this podcast needs to be heard far and wide.

This is a day of great spiritual compromise and yet god has raised chris up for just such a time.

And knowing this it's up to us as members of the body of christ to stand with such a ministry in prayer

and in finances.

I'm pleased to do so and would like to ask you to prayerfully consider joining me in supporting iron

sharpens iron financially.

Would you consider sending either a one -time gift or even becoming a regular monthly partner with this ministry.

I know it would be a huge encouragement to chris if you would.

All the details can be found at iron sharpens iron radio dot com where you can click support.

That's iron sharpens iron radio dot com.

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One such faithful advertiser who really believes in what chris arnton is doing is

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Thanks for helping to keep iron sharpens iron radio on the air.

Welcome back.

We have mike from monroe new york who says please have your guest describe

what he meant.

Oh let's see here i lost my place but oh here.

What was meant by the term high churchmen.

Two of my favorite anglicans are charles simeon and of course jc ryle who are

usually called evangelical anglicans.

What would be the difference between evangelical versus high churchmen.

And i think they could be both if i'm not mistaken.

Go ahead.

Uh that's a good question chris.

I i it would possibly be a.

It's a big discussion though and it would be one something

that we

probably can't but

in briefly i'll give a brief answer to his.

Within anglicism particularly within there is a breadth that

you might not find say

in two ends

of the

system.

But yes he actually has people who are clergy who are both.

I don't mean the same clergy i mean he has clergymen who are high church and clergymen who are low church.

Right but the term high that term high church in nowadays usually means anglo

-catholic and that's not historically what it meant.

Okay within confessional protestant anglicanism.

Okay there there were two factions and they the one of them is the old

high churchmen and then the low evangelical church and sort

of a really rough rule of thumb is they provided a kind of a healthy

what i would regard as a healthy low church.

Evangelical churchmen would tend to push uh the articles

or or push our understanding of the articles in a more reformed direction.

The old high churchmen would never have of

the imagination.

They tended to be more influenced by the lutheran side of things and they they would tend to push.

Old

high

churchmen

has come to really almost be the equivalency of of an anglo -catholic today which is not historical.

Yes and i've interviewed a a minister in the denomination

where peter robinson is a bishop or the bishop.

Yes he's a presiding bishop.

Yes i've interviewed uh frank castellano who is certainly very outspoken about

being i'm sorry paul castellano yes who is.

I know of him.

Who has even written a book defending his understanding of high

churchmanship even though he is a five -point calvinist and thoroughly protestant

and i have conducted an interview with him on that book.

But um.

Right.

And this can this could dovetail into finishing the

things that you conformity

now

this

it is very important.

We do have this concept.

A conforming anglicanism is going to be very

scrupulous about his adherence to the

as well as the explanations that you find in the homilies and

do not

confate

as expressed in the formularies of the church find anglicanism

or do not reflect the theology found in in the anglican formularies.

And of course you would distinguish between them and the non -conformists of the

16th century who were persecuted by the church of england or fled

england because of their non -conformist understanding who were truly protestant.

Right but yeah right.

And i think lee gaddis of the church society does very good expositions on this but the

differences between

look

at it i mean basically many of the things that they objected to was the use of robes

the use of uh uh but the normative

use of of the of the prayer book.

Orthodox anglo -lutheran groups that identify factions that identify still call themselves anglican.

You have the introduction of doctrines and beliefs and liturgies which are at odds

with.

I

would

go back to the find

out who the

trade today is.

Behave

compare the various usa to see which

one of those bought in

today

laid out in

order

to make sense of it.

Yes helpful.

We have yes and we have time for one more question that requires a quick answer because we're almost out of time.

We have bobby in hartsdale new york who says isn't asking the question.

What is a true anglican.

Really a moot point since anglicanism was never a monolith.

I would

historically

of anglicanism when you go back to historic anglicanism and you can go back as far

as tensions and diversities of opinion.

Okay we're out of time and i want to make sure.

Yep i announce your website again reformation reformation anglican church .org

reformation anglican church .org and i urge everybody listening to tune in tomorrow

as we have what i'm sure will be a fascinating discussion with historian bill potter on exposing the

lies of the 1619 project fraud.

That's tomorrow on iron trip and zion radio.

Thank you so much rick lepage for being such a superior guest.

I want to thank everybody who listened and i want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that jesus christ is a far greater

savior than you are a sinner.