WWUTT 1875 Q&A The Chosen is Plausible, Spit You Out of My Mouth, Tomboys Revisited

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In what way does the show The Chosen contradict its own message? When Jesus told the church at Laodicea, I will spit you out of my mouth, what does that mean?

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The answers to these questions and others, when we understand the text. This is when we understand the text.

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A daily Bible study that we may follow the sound words of our Lord God in the faith and love that are in Christ Jesus.

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Tell your friends about our ministry at www .utt .com. Here once again is

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Pastor Gabe. Thank you, Becky. You're welcome. I was really, really hoping. Uh -huh. I was really hoping.

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Really hoping. This was going to be the week that we would get to record from home.

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Oh, so close. I was hoping. We're closer. We're closer.

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We're closer. Now this isn't the studio that I was working on that I made a video of.

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Nope. And posted on the Extra What channel. That project is still in the works, but it's going to take longer.

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I posted that video in October. Uh -huh. What happened just less than two weeks after that?

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Time change. Yeah. So it gets dark at like five around here. Yeah.

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In western Kansas, that wasn't the case. Darkness, even in the winter months, was like six, 630.

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Yeah. And, yeah, it just gets darker here in east Texas. I mean, maybe for a week it was like five. Yeah, something like that.

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Or 530. It was 530. It wasn't even five. Yeah. I don't think it was ever five o 'clock. But here in east

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Texas, it just gets dark earlier. So when the time change happened, and then it's also getting colder.

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I'm getting home from work. It's already dark. I can't work on the studio. Uh -huh. And let's see.

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Then, yeah, right after that was really cold. And then it was just like, man, I could not get a good weekend.

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It was either raining or I was sick. Or I was sick. Or you were sick. Yep. You know, so I'm watching the kids, especially our one -year -old.

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And on and on it went. It just has not worked out for me to be able to work on this project. So I finally got fed up, and I'm building a room in the garage.

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Yep. Putting up walls and everything. When I get done with the studio outside, this room that I'm making in the garage will become

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Becky's sewing room. Yeah. I'm looking forward to that. So there's still a good thing to have this room.

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Something else that we can apply that to. Mm -hmm. But I'm still working on the studio that's going to be outside.

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It's off the house, but it's under the deck. Yeah. We're enclosing under the deck is what

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I'm doing. So I still need to get that project done. Hopefully that will happen in April or May or something.

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I don't know. It's been raining an awful lot. Weather's better. Yeah. This is already shaping out to be another one of those really wet seasons.

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Yeah. Like we had a couple of years ago. Anyway, we appreciate your support and the donations that you've given to us.

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Definitely. To help get this project moving. Speaking of which, speaking of donations, we got this email from Michael who says,

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I'm sorry that I could not give more at this time. So we sent a gift. Thank you for your gift, Michael.

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Thank you. But in the future, I plan to give toward my local church in Rochester, New York. Awesome. Along with your ministry.

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I look forward to your broadcast every day. Truly, thank you, Pastor Gabe and Becky.

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You both keep me moving forward in the race of faith. I truly appreciate and need both of ya.

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Y -A -H. Both of ya. Ya. Thank you both. Please continue your blessed work. Great blessings to you and your family.

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Love with the heart of the Savior. I appreciate that very much, Michael. And thank you for your gift.

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Every little bit helps. Yes. Even if it's buying pizza for the kids. Yep. While I'm working on something else.

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That is so true. This is the Friday edition of the broadcast, and you can send your emails to us. We take emails from the listeners.

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Email address is whenweunderstandthetext at gmail .com. If you want to give to the ministry, like Mike did, you can go to wwutt .com,

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and there's the Give tab on there. Yeah, I think it just – you can either mail in a donation, like a check, the address is on there, or you can pay via PayPal.

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I know there's been issues with PayPal. I get it. But that's what we're still using.

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So if you feel safe with PayPal, we're still taking PayPal donations. Right. We're not a nonprofit.

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It's not a 501c3, so it's just kind of, yeah, scouts honor. Yeah. No, not scouts honor, but in the fear of the

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Lord. There you go. That we will handle whatever contribution you give rightly and put it toward ministry that we do.

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Definitely. Yes. Yeah. All right, let's get to a few other emails. Now, babe, I do have some audio today.

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Oh. The audio might irritate you. Oh, great. But I've come up with a solution to this. You have?

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I have. We're going to close the show with some audio that's uplifting and encouraging.

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Okay. So you don't get done with the program going, I can't believe you made me listen to Andy Stanley again. Oh, no, is it?

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Really? We do have something about Andy Stanley. I don't have audio of his. Grand.

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It's something else. But anyway. Okay. Yeah. But just so you're not walking away from the program going, your moods.

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You know what I mean? Yeah, I totally get it. I totally get it. It wasn't meant to be a dig. Uh -huh. Uh -huh.

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I get it. I get it. It's fine. It's good. We're good. You know, for the same reason we can't watch anything sad in the evening and you go to bed on that note.

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Oh, no. No, no, no, no. Right. Right. So we're not going to finish the show with audio that just makes you annoyed.

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I'm going to give you something a little more uplifting at the very end. Well, maybe that'll help our listeners, too.

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You know, you just kind of err. I've not had any complaints. Yeah, no. No. As far as I know.

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Yeah. Well, except for, you know, one or two that'll come in and go, I wish you would just focus on, you know, you don't have to be ripping on people all the time, which

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I don't. But most of this, most of the podcast is in the Word of God. That's Monday to Thursday.

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And this is literally a Q &A. Right. I'm answering questions. Yeah. I'm answering a question that comes to me.

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Speaking of which, let's get to this one here. This is from Vitas. V -I -T -A -S.

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Oh. Vitas. Hey, Pastor Gabe, I pray that you feel better this week. Yes, thank you.

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Yes. Thank you for that. Yes. Michelle Leslie had asked about that, too, on social media. She asked how my voice was doing.

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So, every morning this week that I woke up, I had no voice at the start of the day. And gradually going through the day, my voice would come back.

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Tuesday was the hardest day, because I was teaching our women's group here at the church, which is in the morning.

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So, I had to get up earlier, knowing that I probably wasn't going to have a voice in the morning. I got up earlier and kind of worked on it a little bit.

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Took a really nice hot shower, so I'm breathing in that hot air. Right. The hot, moist air, you know. Getting cleared up and then was rehearsing it here in my office.

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I'm talking just to kind of get my voice going. I was still pretty congested when

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I started teaching. But by the end of the teaching, I had improved. Noticeably had improved.

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Good. So, I'm thankful for that. Thank you for your prayers. I wasn't able to record any of the other episodes Monday to Thursday, hence why

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I was airing some older sermons. Today was a much, much better day, so I think

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I'm on the back end of that. Yeah. Well, I know on Wednesday night, you were starting to lose.

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Oh, was I toward the end? A little bit, yeah. And having a clear throat and stuff. The end of the day is a struggle, too.

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Yeah. Yeah. So, Vetus goes on to say, however, while you played old sermons,

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I loved when you played the hymn at the end of the sermons. I would love if you could play a hymn after the sermons more.

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Just a suggestion, grace and peace to you. You used to do that a lot. Yeah, I used to do that a lot.

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And I haven't done it pretty much since we moved to Texas. I haven't been doing that, adding the sermon to the end, or song to the end.

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But I did this past Sunday. So, I preached on Sunday out of Romans 9, verses 24 to 32.

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And the hymn that I played at the end of that was a song that our worship leader,

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Pastor Andrew, led during the worship service. And I just loved the song, and I thought it went well, even with the way that the sermon concluded.

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So, I threw that song in at the end of the sermon. So, the sermon that was played on the broadcast this past Sunday, out of Romans 1, does have a song at the end.

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I haven't been regularly doing that. So, I appreciate the suggestion, Vetus. Yeah. You always got good feedback from those.

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Yeah. Oh, yeah. People loved the hymns. They asked who sang them, where did it come from. I would get emails about that.

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So, I'm glad you like that. I just needed that reminder. Yeah. Grab a song and throw it on there.

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Definitely. Yeah. But the one that was on there Sunday, that was actually our church. That was our choir and worship band and everything.

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Oh, really? Neat. If you listen to the sermons on the church website, fbclindale .com,

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either I'm preaching or Pastor Tom is preaching, but we've got the whole service on there now. Oh, wow.

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So, you're getting it from start to finish, the whole, what is it, 75 -minute service. Yeah, something like that. Yep. This next question comes from Kari, either

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Kari or Kari, K -A -R -I. It could be either way. Yeah. Dear Pastor Gabe, you said that you were disappointed with Allie Beth Stuckey's interview with Dallas Jenkins on her show

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Relatable. I like listening to Allie's stuff, too. Can you say exactly what it was that you didn't like about the interview or what

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Allie could have said better? Okay, so a recap here. Dallas Jenkins is the creator of The Chosen.

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Okay. And this was before I started doing my reviews of The Chosen episodes. I had mentioned that Dallas Jenkins was on with Allie Beth.

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This might have been the first week that I did this, in fact. And I was disappointed in Allie's interview because I really thought she softballed the whole thing.

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And this is a gal that I'm used to seeing. She's way more hard -hitting as an interviewer.

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There's that Scott Coley guy who, man, she just mopped the floor with. She ate his breakfast. He did not know how to answer any of her questions.

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He just... all the way through that interview. Okay. I was impressed that he actually stuck with it.

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I just thought that he would have gotten to a point and would have said... Excused himself. Never mind. Bye. But no, later he actually thought he did well with the interview, but it was terrible.

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She just totally discredited the guy completely. Well, first of all, he comes on and he says that he's a...

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how did he word it? He said, I am theologically conservative, but socially progressive.

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It's like, that's a double -minded man. Yeah. You can't be theologically conservative and socially progressive.

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You're double -minded. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, that was really funny. And I think she even pointed that out.

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She was like, how do you do that? But anyway, her questions with him, and she does it in her perky personality and with a smile and just totally trashed his worldview.

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But with Dallas Jenkins, the creator of The Chosen, she was not hard hitting at all. In fact, about the most pushback that she gave was with regards to things that he was saying about Mormonism.

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And even then, I still don't think she pushed it as far as she could have. Dallas was clearly trying to kind of own his answer in a way not to give enough break for her to be able to jump back in and argue with his points.

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Like, he was quickly trying to shift back to let's just talk about the show. Huh. But the interview on her program really just sounded like another plug for The Chosen.

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There wasn't anything negative said about the show itself. It was just his relationship with Mormonism and some of the

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Mormons behind the scenes that have executive produced the show and been president or showrunner behind the show or on the cast or anything like that.

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In fact, the location where they filmed this is owned by Mormons. Ah. So there's a lot of Mormon influence behind The Chosen.

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Yeah. And just not from Allie about that. One of the criticisms that I made is that she should have asked

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Dallas, what is the gospel? Hmm. Because as I said, yeah, as I said,

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I don't think he knows what it is. And as we've pointed out going through The Chosen and then through their stuff where they did like the, oh, what was it, the reaction video.

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Yeah. You know, watching people watch it and then interviewing them. Just by some of that interaction, answers that Jonathan Rumi, who plays

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Jesus in the show, answers that he's given. We can tell they don't know what the gospel is. Right. And they think they're sharing it with people.

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Mm -hmm. Yeah, definitely. It's crazy how they're so confused, yet they think that it's correct.

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Yeah. But let me play this snippet here from Dallas. So this is an answer that he gave to Allie.

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Mm -hmm. And I just kind of want to say here's what I wish that she would have pushed back on. Okay. With this clip.

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And you could have assumed questions that she could have asked in any number of places in the interview.

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I'm just playing this clip as an example. So here's Dallas Jenkins. I would say probably 95 % of the content of the show isn't directly from scripture.

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People call it a Bible show. They'll call it a Jesus show. And I'm okay with that. But I'll say this is actually,

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I mean, the Bible is for sure the primary source of truth and inspiration for the show. But there's a ton of content that isn't actually directly from scripture.

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So to your question. Wait, what? He just contradicted himself in almost the same sentence.

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Exactly. Yeah. You know, remember when we were reviewing the interaction between Jesus and Nicodemus.

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I said, of course, what Jesus says is John 3, 16. So you couldn't say the gospel is not there.

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Right. But the way they do it. Yeah. It's not. I mean, inflection, all these other kinds of things.

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That's something that we as human beings are never going to get right. The sinless

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Holy son of God. We're never going to portray that.

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Yeah. Accurately. Right. We can't. It's impossible for us to. Right. When you read in the gospels about how awestruck people were around him.

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And he is fully man. Right. Right. He's fully God and fully man.

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He is a man. He's a human being. Right. And yet there was still something about him that just struck people.

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Hence the statement that you have at the end of Matthew seven, at the conclusion of the Sermon on the Mount, that people were amazed because he spoke with authority, unlike all their other teachers, unlike the scribes and the

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Pharisees. Right. He didn't teach as they did. He spoke with authority. So even the way that he speaks conveys and communicates something that's unlike, unlike the way anyone else teaches.

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But Jonathan Rumi does not do that. Like I'm not listening to Jonathan Rumi going, oh, wow, this, this must've been what it was like.

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No. To be in Jesus presence and to hear him talk. Not at all. I'm not remotely impressed with his performance.

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I'm really not. Yeah. I mean, he's a, he's a happy Jesus. He's another happy Jesus portrayal.

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Yeah. It's just, you know, we want to. Jesus is love and nothing else. Yeah. Right. Like it's just love. What's the most.

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Which he is. He is love, but he's also just, and he's also. Oh yeah. You know, I mean like, ah, just it drives me crazy.

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Can you think of a man from Galilee who's a carpenter and works with fishermen and yet speaks like a king.

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Not at all. I mean, you have to, you have to keep those things in mind when you're talking about who Jesus is and what his presence is.

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Yes. He's kind. Yes. He's loving. Yes. He, he cared for widows and orphans and the poor and everything else.

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Let the little children come to me. Children wanted to be around him. So yes, of course he is all of that, but he's

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God. Right. How do you portray that? It's not possible, which, which is why when

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I preach, the focus is on the words. I'm not trying to convey or speak it in such a way.

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That is exactly the way that Jesus said it. And I'm going to, I'm going to try to put the emphasis in the place where the emphasis needs to be, but it's the words that we're focusing on.

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Yeah. Lest anybody want to say, it wants to say that like, well, isn't, how different is the chosen from your preaching?

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Aren't you, you know, you're embellishing on the words that are in the Bible when you preach. I'm trying to draw your attention to the words in the

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Bible. When I preach the preaching is to put the focus on the text, not on the actor.

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Yeah. Not on me. Put, know what the text says. Here's what this says.

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Everything that I'm adding to this is commentary just to get you to see the text, to see what, to hear what

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God is saying through these words. And it doesn't have to be acted out in order for you to give that.

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I'm never going to give it. I'm not going to be able to give it the proper inflection. You have to think of the gospels,

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Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John as being written like letters. And pretty much everything after acts is a letter

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Romans to revelation. Even revelation is a letter because it's to the seven churches. Oh, right.

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And the argument could be made that Luke and acts are letters because Luke is writing to Theophilus, most excellent

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Theophilus. Oh yeah. With the gospel and with acts. So that leaves Matthew, Mark, and John, but you still have to think of them as being written like letters.

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It was written for the church to be able to have record of these things that the apostles were proclaiming in the gospel that they shared.

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So it's like a letter. It's not a, it's not written to be a play or a movie script.

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Right. The emphasis is on the words. When the apostles went out and they shared the gospel, they were proclaiming what

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Christ said, but they're not acting it out. And I'm sure that, you know, they would sit around with people and they would tell stories about like, you know, here's, here's what being with Jesus was like.

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Surely people are asking, what was he like? Yeah. The people who didn't know him or didn't meet him, you know, or whatever else, surely those questions were there and the disciples were answering those questions seen through those eyes, that that's certainly a lot different.

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And you're getting first person accounts from those who were actually with Christ. True. But, but the gospels aren't a script.

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So I'm not standing up in the pulpit and trying to recite the line the way that Jesus did.

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I'm trying to tell you what Jesus said, and it's the substance of what he said that your attention needs to be on with the chosen.

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The attention is like you said, it's on the actors. Yeah. It's entertaining. Yeah. Because I can tell you sitting there watching it.

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I'm even sitting there going, well, that was terrible. You know, that delivery was awful. Yeah.

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And that's what you're thinking about. You're not really thinking about exactly the substance of what's being said.

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Now I had, I heard a story just the other day. I think it was just yesterday of a husband and a wife who were watching the chosen and it caused the woman to go and read her

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Bible. The wife who was not a Bible reader at the time. Okay. So she's watching the chosen.

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She goes and reads her Bible and she quit watching the chosen. I figured. And just kept reading her

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Bible, which that's awesome. But that is God working against the show.

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Yes. Not with the show. Because she quit watching. Because she quit watching it. Yes. She recognized that what's in the show and what's in my

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Bible are two different things. This is the word that I trust. And praise God for that. I'm so glad to hear that.

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Oh, amen. Yeah. But that wasn't, that isn't the way that we should consider the show as a tool to try to evangelize people because I don't think it's really going to do that.

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I don't think the creators of the show are doing that. They think they are. This was a 60 second clip.

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I think we've been through 20 seconds of it. Okay. It's a dangerous proposition.

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You know, you're walking a fine line, especially as someone like myself who loves the Bible. And I know that people who watch it, the majority of people who watch it are going to be wanting us to be remain faithful to the scriptures as much as possible.

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We operate from the, this question. Is this plausible? Okay. My mistake.

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It's only a 30 second clip. Oh, there you go. But yeah. So the question he asked there at the end, is this plausible?

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Plausible. Not if it's faithful, but is it plausible? So everything that you're getting from the chosen is just plausible.

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Yeah. It's not grounded in truth. By his own admission.

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And all of that was in his words. And like I said a few weeks ago when talking about Dallas, he's a showman.

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Yeah. So he knows, he knows how to sell his product. He does. I'll give him that. He knows.

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And I mean, the t -shirts that you see, the interviews that you hear him do. I mean, if you type in the chosen or you type in Dallas Jenkins on YouTube, you get a lot of Dallas Jenkins.

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He is everywhere. This is not the silent director behind the scenes who just wants to put his art out front and let his art speak for itself.

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This is Dallas taking full use of the platform that he has available to him.

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There is a lot of Dallas Jenkins out there. I've listened to several other interviews that are just,

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I mean, in every one of them he gives, there's something like this. That you're just like, what? Why doesn't anybody push back on the guy?

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Yeah. Why doesn't anybody say that that's a problem? My question is why did he pick the title chosen?

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The chosen. Well, because. That just doesn't make sense to me with how they're portraying everything. Yeah. The concept of the show is supposed to be that you're seeing

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Jesus through the eyes of the people around him, those who were his chosen. Because as you go through the first season, from episode to episode, he's choosing his disciples, this one first.

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And, of course, the first disciple chosen was Mary Magdalene. According to the chosen, that's his first disciple.

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Well, that's. I mean, I'm not even making that up or trying to. He goes by the Bible, though. He loves his

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Bible. Yeah, right. Does he just carry it around with him closed the whole time? I don't understand.

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It's like a Donald Trump statement. Yeah. Where Donald was saying, you know, I love the Bible. Yes.

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It's my favorite book. That is true. I have many, many Bibles. Yes. And then he gets asked by an interviewer, well, what's your favorite part of the

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Bible? Can you give us one of your favorite verses? No, no, it's very personal to me. Yeah. So I don't like going around saying what my favorite verses are.

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You put it on the guy and he can't answer a question. Mm -hmm. And Dallas is the same way.

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This is an argument that I've made many, many times. A lot of the people that dislike Donald Trump were just like Donald Trump.

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This was how I knew he was going to be elected president of the United States, because he sounds just like the majority of evangelicals that I hear.

24:00

Yeah. I always go to church at Christmas and on Easter. I drink my little cup.

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I eat my little wafer. The Bible is my favorite book. There's not going to be any better book out there but the

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Bible. And I have lots of Bibles. I have them all over my house. That sounds like the average evangelical

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American, to be quite honest with you. Mm -hmm. And when I go out and do evangelism and I was encountering those people in the public, that was exactly the kind of answer

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I got. If I would ask them, are you a Christian? Are you saved? Oh, yeah. I got lots of Bibles. It's my favorite book.

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Same answers I got. And Dallas is that quintessential American Christian.

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He's selling everything. Yeah, right. That's why he's selling it, right. Easily. So the answer to that question was supposed to be, how could

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Allie have done that interview better? We just dissected part of it. Sorry. It's a bad show.

24:57

Just don't go near The Chosen. Don't use it as an evangelical tool. Certainly do not give them money.

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I think this coming Sunday is the season three finale. Okay. So I've got to get back to -

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Season two. Doing my reviews. I haven't even watched the first episode of season two yet. God willing, maybe we'll be back to doing that next week.

25:19

God willing? From a studio in our home. That'd be awesome. That's the God willing part. That's the

25:25

God willing part, yeah. Well, yes, God willing because I've been so busy with everything else.

25:30

Yes. That I haven't had the time to do that. So all that busyness, the busy season will be past - For a short while.

25:36

Yeah. Then we just jump back into busyness again. Yeah. All right. This next question is about a certain what video regarding what it means to be hot or cold.

25:46

Okay. And not lukewarm. Mm -hmm. So let me play the video and then we'll get to the question.

25:52

All right. In Revelation 3,

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Jesus rebuked the church at Laodicea for becoming complacent in their faith. I know your works, he said.

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You are neither hot nor cold. So because you're lukewarm, I will spit you out of my mouth. Now, it's often interpreted that being hot is having passion for God and cold is against God.

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If you have no passion, then you're lukewarm. Therefore, Jesus is saying, either be all in or all out.

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It's the ones in the middle that really make me sick. But how does that make sense? Jesus was not telling a church,

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I'd have more respect for you if you were just against me. Laodicea was abundant in riches and the church benefited from the wealth of the city.

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It got to the point where they thought they didn't need anything from God. But Jesus said, you are wretched, pitiable, poor, blind and naked.

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You have nothing apart from Christ. For all of Laodicea's luxuries, there's one resource they didn't have.

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Water. Nearby Colossae had refreshing cold water and Hierapolis had medicinal hot water. But what happens when you channel that water in?

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It becomes lukewarm. If you're expecting a cold drink and it's warm or hot water and it cools with all those mineral deposits in it, you're going to spit it out.

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What Jesus was saying to them was this. You are far from the source. You cannot refresh nor offer healing to anyone because you're far from me and my word.

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Many churches today have sought after wealth and prosperity and they've forgotten the word of Christ. Jesus says, those whom

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I love I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent. But if you cling to this world instead of Christ, he will spit your name out of his mouth on judgment day when we understand the text.

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When mineral deposits settle all down to the bottom and you get that one gag.

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You thought the nickel in your water tasted bad now. Just wait until you get those mineral deposits in the water there.

27:43

It's so gross. All right, so this is from Zach and he says, I've seen your videos on the Church of Laodicea regarding what it means to be lukewarm, but what does it mean when

27:52

Christ says, I will spit you out of my mouth? Not sure if I missed the explanation, but does he mean he will send them to hell or remove the church?

28:01

Any insight would be much appreciated. Well, let's look at this in context. So we're going to Revelation 3.

28:08

And remember that I mentioned earlier that Revelation itself is even a letter. It goes to the churches in Asia Minor.

28:14

And in Revelation 3 .14, we have the last of those seven churches addressed by Christ through the

28:21

Apostle John. And he's talking to the church at Laodicea, which is right near Heropolis and Colossae, as talked about in the video.

28:31

And a very, very wealthy city on top of that. It used to be that Colossae was the wealthy city.

28:37

Hence why it's called Colossae. Right. Because it was huge. And it was on the major highway, the

28:44

Roman highway that would go through there. And it used to be the place where all the riches that you find in Laodicea, you used to be able to find in Colossae.

28:53

Like the purple fabric that they would sell, the salve for the eyes, which was medicinal.

29:00

That was another thing that Laodicea was known for. It used to be sold in Colossae. But then what ended up happening was the

29:07

Romans rerouted the road. Right. And it didn't go through Colossae anymore. It went through Laodicea.

29:12

So all of that wealth and trade and everything else that Colossae was known for got moved to Laodicea, which became one of the wealthiest cities in the

29:23

Roman Empire. So much that when there was an earthquake that devastated the city,

29:28

Rome sent money to them to rebuild, and Laodicea sent it back. They didn't even need it.

29:35

Wow. So they sent all that back to Rome. Could have used the money in Colossae.

29:40

Yeah. But the Colossians were kind of forgotten. It was like a forgotten group of people. And think of that whenever you read the

29:47

Book of Colossians, because when you hear Paul talking about how included they are in the work of ministry, that meant a lot to them since it was kind of thought of Colossae as being a forgotten city by that point.

29:59

Interesting. Even the Roman Empire didn't really care for them. So anyway. So we get to Laodicea here with Jesus addressing

30:05

Laodicea in Revelation 3, starting in verse 14. To the angel of the church in Laodicea.

30:11

Right. Angel of the church is basically speaking as if the spirit of Laodicea, or the spirit of the church, not the

30:19

Holy Spirit, of course, because the Holy Spirit is with whoever believes in Christ.

30:25

You have the Holy Spirit. But I'm talking about spirit like lowercase s. So you think about the spirit of the church, the people that are there.

30:33

To the angel of the church in Laodicea write, This is what the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God says.

30:44

I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish that you were cold or hot.

30:52

Let me stop there for a moment. Remember, this does not mean I wish you were all in or all out.

30:58

Right. There's that song. There was a contemporary

31:05

Christian song from back in the 80s and 90s that was, I don't want to be a casual Christian.

31:10

I was about to say, I don't want to be a lukewarm Christian. That's not the lyric, not at the beginning.

31:16

It's the next part where it says, I don't want to live a lukewarm life. That's what it is. But it just means the whole lukewarmness about this passage just means that you're far from the source.

31:28

If you were hot, you would be near the source. If you were cold, you would be near the source. Right. The source being Christ. But because you're lukewarm, you're far from the source.

31:36

So that's the reference. Something that, of course, the Laodiceans would have connected with and understood right away.

31:44

So because you are lukewarm, Jesus says in verse 16, and neither hot nor cold,

31:49

I will spit you out of my mouth. Because you say, I am rich and I have become wealthy and have need of nothing.

31:57

And you do not know that you are wretched and pitiable and poor and blind and naked.

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I advise you to buy from me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich and white garments so that you may clothe yourself.

32:16

And that the shame of your nakedness will not be manifested. And I salve to anoint your eyes so that you may see.

32:24

Because once again, that was a medicine that Laodicea was known for. People would come there to get healing for their eyes.

32:33

Jesus says in verse 19, those whom I love, I reprove and discipline.

32:38

Therefore, be zealous and repent. Now, here's another verse you're surely familiar with.

32:45

Behold, I stand at the door and knock. Oh, boy. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door,

32:52

I will come into him and will dine with him and he with me. I've got another video that explains that.

32:59

That's taken out of context so often. Yes, often, that's right. Verse 21, he who overcomes,

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I will grant to him to sit down with me on my throne. As I also overcame and sat down with my father on his throne.

33:13

He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit, capital S, says to the churches.

33:22

Now then, do we get anything from that that would indicate that Jesus would send them to hell?

33:32

Yeah, really we do in the statement, I will spit you out of my mouth. I mean, that statement, I will spit you out of my mouth.

33:38

I was taking that more as like he's reproving. Surely, yeah. But if they are lukewarm,

33:46

I will spit you out of my mouth. And so, verse 19, therefore be zealous and repent.

33:55

Oh, okay. If they don't repent. Okay, okay. Yeah. So he's so disgusted by their behavior because they're self -dependent.

34:03

And we don't need anybody. We got everything that we need. So they look like Christians on the outside, but on the inside, really they're full of dead men's bones.

34:12

Just like Jesus gave the rebuke of the Pharisees. Now, in that particular case, he's giving them woes.

34:18

In this case, he is calling this church to repentance. And he loves them. Clearly, he loves them.

34:24

Yeah. Because those whom I love, I reprove and I discipline. Right.

34:30

And so he's calling them to repentance. But if they were to continue in the state in which they are in, and they were to continue in that way, they would go to hell.

34:38

I will spit you out of my mouth is pretty out there. I mean, this is not just a sort of a thing of like, you know,

34:47

I'm not going to give you a crown. This is your name will not be in my mouth.

34:53

This is like Jesus saying in Matthew 7. I never knew you.

34:58

Depart from me, you workers of lawlessness. Okay. That makes sense. So there's a relational aspect to that, where you're not with Christ, you're against him.

35:09

And it makes you want to spit him out. Spit him out is also, you know, the visual there.

35:16

Don't think about it too hard. But it's to be ejected. It's to be thrown out.

35:21

Okay. So they would not be included in the kingdom. They would be bound and thrown out with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

35:29

Now, in earlier portions of Revelation 2 and 3, some of the warnings that are given to the churches is that if you don't repent,

35:38

I will remove your lampstand. So removing your lampstand is indicative of the spirit.

35:45

The Holy Spirit is no longer with you. So it's now a false church. The Holy Spirit is not there.

35:51

The gospel is not being proclaimed there anymore. The lampstand has been removed. And so, you know, that's a false church at that point.

35:58

But what is being said here about the Laodiceans is with regard to their individual souls and where they are going to be at the judgment.

36:07

Will they be with Christ sitting with him on his throne? And there's no middle ground. You're either sitting with Christ on his throne or you're outside the kingdom.

36:16

So will you be the one who overcomes and will sit with Christ on his throne? Or will you be those that he will spit out of his mouth and throw out with the hypocrites into the outer darkness or even into hell that was prepared for the devil and his angels?

36:32

So there's no middle territory. It's either in or out. And that's what we get from the context of that statement there in Revelation 3.

36:40

Makes sense. All right. Let's see. Where am I at on time? We got some time here.

36:46

This next one comes from – oh, I know what I wanted to do. I'm going to save this one. I'm going to wait until another time to do this one.

36:52

Okay. Not even going to tell you what it is. Okay. We'll save it to another week. It'll be a surprise for all of us.

36:57

I'm going to come back to a question that I asked last week or I answered last week by myself. Okay.

37:04

And I'm going to answer this again this week but with you. Okay. Because I want to see what kind of insight you can provide here.

37:10

All right. Okay? I'll do my best. This is from Kat. Okay. Now, Kat, when she first sent me this email, there was a cute little picture there in the avatar, but she since changed it to a picture of David Spade.

37:23

I don't know why she did that. Okay. The actor. Yeah. Anyway, so it wasn't nearly as adorable.

37:31

But Kat says, I want to say that I love your ministry. Your videos and your podcast are very helpful to me.

37:37

I have a question about gender roles. Is it wrong for a woman to be a tomboy?

37:43

I know that the culture makes it seem that all girls with that kind of personality are either lesbians or feminists.

37:50

But what about someone who honestly just has a boyish personality, like sports and video games, wears men's clothes, who is strong -willed, et cetera?

38:00

Should they strive to be more feminine? And what about with men? Is it okay for them to be more sensitive and be interested in typically feminine things?

38:10

What does the Bible say about these things? Thank you for taking the time to read this. So in the answer that I gave last week,

38:16

I said there are clearly indications in Scripture that these things are feminine and these things are masculine.

38:23

And women should be doing these things, like instructions you get in Titus 2 for older women to instruct younger women how to care for their home and their children and submit to their husband and love their household.

38:36

You also have instructions like in Deuteronomy, in 1 Corinthians, about how women should dress, what kind of attire they should have on, 1

38:44

Timothy 2, that women should dress modestly and that they should adorn themselves with good works.

38:50

There is the instruction even in 1 Peter 3 that a wife be submissive to her husband, just as Sarah was submissive to Abraham.

38:59

And you are her children if you submit to your husband and do what is pleasing to the

39:06

Lord according to the instructions that he's given, specifically to a wife in the role that she's supposed to fill and what she's supposed to follow.

39:13

Now, Cat doesn't give any indication that she's married, but all of that just to say that there are clearly things that a woman is supposed to do that we would even regard as feminine.

39:23

Even in her attire, she looks like a woman. And there are things that men are supposed to do.

39:29

And in their attire, they look like men because a man is not supposed to wear what a woman wears, and a woman is not supposed to wear what a man wears so to make herself look masculine.

39:39

Now, some of that is subjective because we do think of clothing choices in our culture as being influenced by, you know, what would you say?

39:50

What's popular? What's common among people? The new fads.

39:55

Yeah, the fads, stuff like that, which changes. So there's some subjectivity in that, but there are things that clearly are feminine.

40:02

When you see somebody wearing that, you're like, that's what a woman would wear. When a man wears something, that's what a man should wear.

40:09

A woman shouldn't wear a suit and tie. Right. That's masculine clothing. That's fit for a man.

40:15

Right. Because women do have suits with ties. Yeah, and I don't think they should. But they look feminine.

40:21

Yeah. They fit different. Right. I just still don't think the whole suit and tie thing, that should be for men.

40:28

Okay. Yeah, there are women pantsuits. I'm not necessarily speaking against that, although maybe that's not good either, some of them.

40:36

But it's still like when you see that attire, you know that's form -fitting for a woman. It's for her figure.

40:41

Right. She should not be wearing clothes that make her look masculine. Like, oh, who's the actress?

40:48

Ellen Page, who now thinks of herself as a man. Okay. You know, that's, yeah, totally against what scripture says.

40:55

Not only being sexually immoral, but anyway, all of that. So, what would be your thoughts? Because something that I said last week is that my wife has worked in an occupation that you don't typically think of women working in.

41:11

You worked at a rock quarry. You drove a 60 -ton haul truck. Did I get that right? Yeah.

41:16

Because I said last week, when I get the weight of the truck wrong, my wife tells me. No, no, no, babe. It was 60 tons.

41:23

It was 60 tons. That's right. Yep. Seven -foot tall tires. Yep. Anything to add to that?

41:31

I mean, I grew up as a tomboy. I liked to get dirty in the mud and in the exhaust pipes from the time

41:40

I was just a wee little one. Yeah. And I don't know. I never feared anything and liked to play with the boys rather than the girls.

41:50

But, I mean, I still had my favorite stuffies. Like dolls and things like that.

41:56

Yeah. And I still had a love for things that you would think that that's a girly thing.

42:07

I don't know. I just have a hard time with this because I wasn't saved then either.

42:13

And the household that we grew up in was

42:18

Catholic. And so, it wasn't like holding fast to scripture and stuff like that. It was just morally good, if you will.

42:26

And so, I don't see it as being bad.

42:33

I just… Being a tomboy. Right. Yeah, right. Being a tomboy, it's not wrong.

42:40

But I don't think that… You just have that rough -and -tumble attitude. Yeah. That's not typical of most women.

42:46

No. Which is why I didn't get along with a lot of them. Yeah, right. I got along with the guys.

42:52

You couldn't wrestle with the girls. Yeah, that's right. They didn't climb trees with me, okay?

42:58

So… Yeah. So, I don't know. I just…

43:05

I remember having the time of my life, though. Just playing. Yeah, being a kid.

43:10

Yeah. Getting outside and playing. Getting dirty. Yes. Whenever we'd go out to the lake, we'd always play in the clay part of the mud.

43:19

It was awesome. And I'd make mud pies and mud tea.

43:24

Like, I even made teapots out of mud. Wow. And teacups. You know, because… Just out of the casual dirt in the ground with water.

43:31

Yeah. Because in Southwest Kansas, everything dries in like 10 seconds. Sure. Right. So, in the summertime…

43:37

Well, yeah. There was a lot of clay in some parts of that, in some parts of Southwest Kansas. Yeah. Had clay. Yeah. So, I made my own tea.

43:43

I mean, it's a girly thing, sure, but I made it out of mud. So, it wasn't really a girly thing, but it kind of was.

43:50

I don't know. So, I was a big mix of everything. I don't know. I think culturally…

43:56

I mean, it kind of depends on the culture, but I could see women being the ones that are making the pots and the plates and all that other kind of thing.

44:04

Fair enough. Yeah. So, you're taking care of the household. You're establishing the home. You're cooking the meals, and you're making all the stuff that you need for that.

44:10

Right. Yeah. Okay. Sure. Fair enough. Now, I don't really think of cooking as being specifically feminine.

44:17

No. Because, I mean, I can tell you, there are meals I've had that have been made by men that are like the best version of that meal

44:24

I've ever had. You know popular chefs, amazing chefs out there and things like that, and that's not considered effeminate.

44:30

And that used to be a guy job. Yeah, typically. It used to be just men. Yeah. So, that's kind of new that it was, you know…

44:39

That women now run the kitchens in restaurants and… Right. Or like, yeah, like when a wealthy man hired a kitchen staff, the person who heads the kitchen was a man almost always.

44:55

Yeah. Then you have the maids that do their thing, too. But the head cook, the head chef, was typically a man.

45:01

Yeah. I don't know where that came from, this idea that the cooking is typically a feminine thing. I don't… I don't know.

45:06

I don't buy that at all. Fifties? Yeah. All of the commercials that we see, you know?

45:13

Oh, no. The wife making food at home, I guess. Becky and I kind of split that in half.

45:18

Yeah. Well, you do more cooking nowadays than I do because I'm trying to keep the kids involved in that, get them cooking.

45:27

Oh, yeah. So, you're making meals, but not necessarily cooking meals, right? What do you mean? Like, making sandwiches for lunch.

45:34

You're not cooking something. I make the kids do it. Oh, yeah. That's right. Okay. Yeah. Because we've got a 14 -year -old who's about to be 15 next week.

45:41

Well, my philosophy… Yeah, she is. My philosophy is at nine…

45:46

Now, this might depress some of you guys, okay? So, hold on. At nine, they are halfway done living at home, typically speaking.

45:54

Right. So, at nine years old is when I'm going to flip the switch of, okay, now

45:59

I've coddled you enough and I've taught you everything that I'm going to start backing off.

46:04

So, that way, whenever you get to where you're able to move out of the house, you are able to do all of this on your own.

46:12

Yeah. Or at least a lot of it. Laundry and cooking and everything. Yes. Cleaning up after yourselves, cleaning up after other people.

46:21

I mean, yeah, the whole thing. Well, we're going to have to teach… Yeah. Oh, okay.

46:26

Yeah. Well, good, because I've got… I think I have a jacket that needs a button repaired. I'll give it to Anna. She's been doing really, really well at sewing things.

46:35

Good. Good deal. Yeah. Well, like with Zeej, our 11 -year -old, we're going to have to teach this kid to make something more than corn dogs.

46:42

I know. He knows how to use a microwave. And the oven.

46:47

He does know how to use the oven. He can use the oven. He just doesn't like it. He likes the microwave. Well, I… I don't want him to be eating irradiated food, like, all through his life before he hits puberty, so…

47:01

But what did you eat when you were a bachelor? Fast food. Fast food, yeah.

47:07

Not microwave food, but… Nope, fast food. Even though a lot of that stuff is microwave. Probably. Yeah, I was not cooking for myself at all.

47:15

I did not… I did not start learning to cook for myself until I got married. Right. And then you got pregnant right away.

47:21

Uh -huh. And so it was like… And it was all yours. And it was, yeah. Jumping two feet. It was one of those… One of those pregnancies where she was sleeping 20 hours a day.

47:29

Oh, and I could not help it. Yeah, it just wiped you out. I just… I was like, what, narcoleptic?

47:35

Isn't that what that's called? Yeah, where you just sleep. Where you just fall asleep. And then… And then I woke up, I'm like, wait, did

47:41

I just fall asleep? Yeah. I had no idea. And she would. She would sleep… Fall asleep right in the middle of a conversation.

47:46

I would. So… A sentence, even. I know. It's true. Anyway, back to the question.

47:53

Yes, right. So still on the tomboy question. So, I mean, we're raising our girls.

47:58

We've got three girls. Uh -huh. We're raising them in feminine things. Yes. They can't help but be girly.

48:04

They want to be girly. They really do want to be girly. Now, there's our youngest girl.

48:11

She's more of an athletic… Athletic, yeah. …girl. And so she likes to run and…

48:17

Run and run. Run and run. And, I mean, you give her a ball in front of her, she's already kicking it.

48:25

And, I mean, stuff like that. So she's just a natural as far as athleticism goes. But she still wants to be girly.

48:33

Yeah. So none of the kids took after me. The boys took after you.

48:38

Yes. And the girls… The boys are just like me. The girls, I'm like, I don't even know what to do with you because I didn't play like this.

48:46

Oh, no. But you look fantastic in dresses. Thank you.

48:52

The girls are adorable in dresses. Yes. You know. Yes, they are. I see that I have pretty feminine girls in my family.

48:59

I don't know what… Yeah. And it just kind of… They love to dress up. Right. It naturally happened.

49:05

I haven't had to teach them to do that. So I would probably struggle with Kat on the tomboy question if we had one.

49:11

Like, okay, what do I do with this child who's a tomboy? And I'd be like, it's fine. It's good.

49:16

Yeah. You would know what to do. I would. Yeah. I would totally know. You're ready to go play in the mud again.

49:22

Yep. Exactly. So, yeah, like we said, there are some things in Scripture that are very clearly feminine.

49:30

And so you do need to pay attention to those things and submit to those things. Right. Because you're submitting to the

49:35

Lord in those things. And I would say that it's a time and place. Like, there's a time and place when that is acceptable.

49:44

And then, like everybody, we need to grow up at a certain point. Yeah. And to make sure that you are pointing them in the right direction.

49:54

Because with society nowadays versus when I was a kid, now it is coddling them into let's take that a step further and a step further and a step further until I probably would have thought

50:10

I was a boy at one point. Yeah. If I was growing up in today's society. Yeah, right. If you were a tomboy in the, like, let's say early 90s for you and growing up in the public school system the way it is today, yeah, you might have some people who are telling you, well, maybe you're a boy.

50:30

Right. And maybe you need to be thinking about that. Right. So, I mean, today is a lot different than how

50:36

I grew up. But just know that it's okay to gear that in the right direction.

50:44

It's like being a strong -willed person. That is excellent to have if you're using it correctly.

50:51

Yeah. If you're training them. And I mean training over and over and over and over and over.

50:57

Because trust me, I know. Yeah, the strong will still has to be in submission to everything the

51:05

Lord says. Mm -hmm. Yeah. That, it's, yeah. Mm -hmm. So, Kat, it sounds like you're already tuned in to the lies of the culture.

51:14

Mm -hmm. You're aware of that. Right. So, you're not going to listen to anybody who tells you, well, maybe you're a guy. Right. You know, understanding

51:21

Genesis 127 that God made us in his image male and female.

51:26

Mm -hmm. And there are certain things men can do, certain things that women can do according to the roles that God has assigned.

51:32

Right. So, being a tomboy is not inherently sinful. But just be careful that in those tomboyish things that you do, that you're not also, what would it be, shirking on the responsibilities.

51:47

Okay. Yeah. The things that you also should be doing as a woman. Mm -hmm. And not everybody is cookie cutter.

51:56

Everybody's different. Yeah. And that's the way God made us, is everybody being different. So, we all work together as a body.

52:04

And so, we fill all those gaps. Right. So. So, along with that, concluding with the advice that I gave last week, talk to your pastor.

52:11

Right. And take the counsel of some older women in your church. Definitely. And see what they have to say as well. And they're so fun to talk to anyway.

52:17

Find that older lady who used to be a tomboy. Yeah. They're so fun. Yeah. And probably even grew up in like the 50s or 60s as a tomboy.

52:26

Yeah. When it wasn't. Yeah. Back when there was not the kind of technology. Yeah. That we have today.

52:32

All right. Well, that's everything. Oh, yeah. I said I was going to conclude with something positive. Okay. Some positive audio for you here.

52:39

Okay. Let's do it. So, here is a word from Alistair Begg. Yay! The truth of God should inform all of our lives.

52:49

I'm not sure that everybody has that as an understanding of how the truth of God actually does impact our view of everything.

53:00

Our view of science, of technology, of ecology, of life, of marriage and everything else.

53:06

And how it does it is simply through the constraining influence of the

53:12

Bible itself. That we know that all truth is God's truth. And yet, the way in which we get to an understanding of both its essence and its application is as the scriptures are brought to bear upon all of these things.

53:30

Not in terms of like proof texts or trying to find a verse that fits an idea. But rather the comprehensive understanding of the way that God has revealed himself.

53:40

The way he has created. The way he sustains the universe. That all of these things then are part and parcel of his truth influencing both who we are and what we do.

53:52

And that's a great conclusion to the question we just answered. Yeah, definitely. So, there you go.

53:58

Even when it comes to being a tomboy, we submit to what scripture has to say in every area of our lives.

54:06

So, as the Apostle Paul said in 1 Corinthians 10 .31, whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all to the glory of God.

54:18

Yes. All in submission to Christ and his word. Let's pray. Yes, let's. Heavenly Father, we thank you for this time that we have together to ponder and consider your word.

54:28

And find the answers that we need for life in what you have given to us in the

54:33

Bible. May we cherish this. There's a lot of people out there who want to say that this word is a house of cards.

54:40

And if we find some part of the Bible that, oh, it looks like something in the culture disproves this, then, well, there goes our faith.

54:47

But the culture changes. The science changes. People's opinion change. The word of God does not change.

54:55

Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words never pass away, as Jesus said in Mark 13 .31.

55:01

And we understand that Jesus is the same yesterday and today and forever as said in Hebrews.

55:07

And so we entrust ourselves to you and we trust your word. May it fill our hearts, govern our thinking, and in all that we say and do, may it be to the honor and glory of your great name.

55:20

It's in Jesus' name that we pray. Amen. Amen. Go for it.

55:35

Oh, yeah, I don't even have you on. There you go. Kind of helps. Yeah, I've got to turn your mic on.

55:40

I mean, I can imagine some people don't mind. Turn her mic off.

55:48

My mic being muted. That is not true. Listenership always goes up when you're on.

55:55

It's because you're having a conversation rather than talking to the wall, so. Well, that is true.

56:03

I'm not looking at the wall. People like your voice. They like your personality.

56:09

Okay. They like Becky. Well, thanks. Yes. We've been to the conferences.

56:15

We've heard, you know, you've heard the compliments from people. I like having coffee with people in their kitchens.

56:21

Yeah, right, exactly. We're not literally with you in your kitchen, but. Nope. Here you go.

56:27

You're having coffee with us today. Yay. It's not right now, though. It's actually evening for us, so.

56:33

I need coffee, though. I'm tired. You got to perk up. Should I have gotten you that Dr.

56:38

Pepper shake? Yes. Do you want to go? Do you want to, let's go get the Dr. Pepper shake?