First Ever Internet Stream Show Reviews a Letter from a Roman Catholic

Ready to give a defense for the hope that is within us yet to give that answer with gentleness and reverence. Your host is dr. James white director of Alpha and Omega ministries and an elder at the Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church.

This is a live program and we invite your participation. And now with today's topic.

A New Live Internet Broadcast and How to Participate

Here is James white and good evening and welcome to the dividing line. My name is James white and we are doing something brand new this evening. So everybody gets to be patient With us. Yes, indeed. We are live streaming this evening.

It's the first time we've done this so We're not sure how everything's gonna work. And in fact the possibilities of it working perfectly first time are about as good as the possibilities of getting an election taken care of in one day right now here in the United States, so we'll just do our best and Hope that you can participate and in fact, I would like to invite you to participate at 866 this is toll-free folks write it down.

It's in our chat room. It's on our web page, but the toll-free number 866 five five zero thirty nine fifteen eight six six five five zero Thirty nine fifteen now unlike some people who have Phone numbers that spell names like ask Hank ours is eight six six.

Good. You could see it. We're not sure what that means, but we're going to do some translation work on it and figure it out. Actually, we should have a little bit of a contest. Have people figure out what five five zero thirty nine fifteen could actually be translated into.

That would be sort of interesting to do now since we're live on the internet. That means that we can discuss with folks Straight out of our chat room and right now. There's already 20 people in our chat room.

You can go into the chat room. The instructions are on our website Aomin org and you can ask questions in there. I can't guarantee With all the stuff that's going along in the chat room right now that I'm going to see everything.

In fact, I suppose I should tell folks in the chat room if you want to ask a question maybe put it in red or or Purple or chartreuse or something so that it sort of stands out so I can see it as it goes along my screen.

But so we do want to be significantly more Interactive on this program than we can be when we were on Kpxq when we were on a radio station. We want to be able to interact with folks we want to be able to have folks all across the United States participate in the program and Really be able to do some some stuff that maybe we felt a little bit I don't know uncomfortable doing when When we were live on the air, you know.

Sometimes, you know, you sort of feel like the government's listening or something. I suppose they're listening now, too. I don't know but We can do a lot of things like tonight. I'm gonna be talking about something.

That'll probably blow a number of you away. But we would like to invite your questions if there's issues that you'd like to bring up questions. You'd like to ask we're gonna be here and our goal is to be here until 830 Mountain.

What is it standard time? I don't know. We don't play with our clocks here in Arizona, but that's a 90 minutes and why 90 minutes? 90 minutes because that allows us to put one program on a tape and So that'll give us more time.

We don't have to worry about all sorts of things like Commercials to worry about and There are also all sorts of other neat things we can do. And I don't want this to Scare anyone at all. I really don't but if you call in and you ask, you know, maybe just like Maybe you make a silly statement or something like that.

There are other things we can do like I now have Literally megabytes of wave files available to me and they're just sitting here right in front of me I'm actually sitting at the desk that I sit at most of the day writing books and articles and doing things like that and So I've got access to all of my computer my Bible programs my notes all the rest that kind of stuff and I can bring Those things up but like if you were to call in and say make a you know Silly statement and hang up on us or something like that.

See then I can do things more like this. Now you see now that was the first time we did that see and what happens is rich on the other side of the wall there has to figure out what my system is going to be doing to adjust the the volume there, but but fact that why don't we just That's much better I think that's good that's The phone number eight six six five five zero thirty nine fifteen.

In fact, I'd like to ask maybe some of you to just give us a ring. Let's we need to sort of Talk with one another test this thing out make sure how it's gonna work because I want to have folks on the program in the future in the sense of guests and That it's gonna get really hairy to figure out how to keep the guest up and and the levels and all the rest that neat Fun stuff, but we'd like to test out the toll-free number eight six six five five zero thirty nine fifteen.

You may have some questions. You'd like to ask Why don't you go ahead and give us a ring and let's see how that works out and the first thing we're going to talk about today I'm telling you. I Got a letter.

Well, actually I didn't get a letter. Yes, it's toll-free. I Didn't get the letter the letter arrived at my home and It was addressed to my wife and There was no return address now. I guess in the future when I see letters arriving at my home my personal address and I don't see a You know a Return address on it that that's probably going to be indicative of me that I need to take a look at it but it was addressed to my wife and So I just left it for her to open a figure maybe as a friend, you know Who knows a wedding invitation?

I don't know and I came home. This was yesterday. I came home Actually, it's Tuesday. I came home and my wife said did you did you see that letter and I said no and she showed it to me and I was absolutely amazed about I don't know three and a half years ago.

Maybe somewhere around in there I was talking Actually was contacted by an individual by a woman who contacted the ministry and Requested certain information Information concerning the fact that her husband was converting to Roman Catholicism and and so on and so forth and so I Took the time since I saw that the address Of the place where these folks lived was right on one of the streets that I rode my bike on I was a cyclist at the time.

I I rode, you know about four times during the week and so I attempted to Save them some postage save them some time and I hand delivered the books that were ordered Put them in the mailbox didn't actually Get to meet anyone at the time.

In fact as I recall now as I pulled up into the driveway my cleat in my road bike Caught and I almost ended up in the middle of a cactus That was a I had forgotten about that until just now almost gave my life to try to administer these folks.

Well, anyways make long story short The woman's wife con a woman's wife woman's husband contacted me and Began to dialogue or attempt to dialogue with me Regarding the subjects of Roman Catholicism. And so what I did is He had the same kind of standard Objections that we run into all the time and that is well look, you know what you believe Wasn't known by the early church fathers and it was all made up in the 16th century and yada yada yada.

And so I spent quite some time. I sent a lengthy email to this gentleman who by the way is in the Air Force. He is a fighter Pilot flies f -16s. There may be one zeroing in on me right now for all I know and I Spent how probably in the first two email discussions hour and a half two hours minimally Sending patristic citations.

I sent him an entire list of patristic citations talking about sola scriptura well The response that I got from him It was basically None of these say sola scriptura since it doesn't use the exact words.

That doesn't say sola scriptura. That doesn't say sola scriptura and I'm sort of like well, well, you've got to read what the individual is saying. I mean from the Roman Catholic perspective you're gonna use all sorts of Patristic citations quotes from early church fathers it may not use the exact terminology, but you would say are actually teaching what the Roman Catholic Church teaches and So, you know How can you be consistent here?

Well very quickly the conversation broke down because the individual simply would not talk with me in a meaningful fashion just would not deal with what I was attempting to say and Eventually what happened is this individual this man?

Would keep sending emails and and he would keep going back over and back over and back over the same issues That had already been answered it and no answer could possibly satisfy this individual and we have had that happen many times in fact if you're involved in apologetic work if you're involved in an apologetic ministry in Attempting to share with folks.

You've just got to recognize that there are times when they're going to be individuals who will not listen. I mean when we look at the New Testament There were many times when Paul had to turn around and walk away from a group of people Because they would not hear what he had to say that that there is absolutely no promise in Scripture that if you do all of your homework if you Practice your presentation that everybody you present this to is just gonna hit their knees and repent.

It doesn't work that way. Well Eventually it just simply got bothersome. I mean this man would send me stuff and you know It was the same old thing over and over and over and over again. And so finally I said would you just you know would you just not contact me anymore?

And so he started sending emails to our church and To one of my fellow elders of the church, and he didn't realize that that particular fellow elder would be significantly less interested in What he had to say than I was.

I can guarantee you that but Eventually for a while it just it just sort of stopped and And I didn't hear from him for a while well until Tuesday. Because you may have probably figured out this letter this letter was from this F -16 fighter pilot and he decided to send it.

He decided to send it to my wife at our home address. Without putting a return address on it and What does this what does this letter say? Well in essence I Thought I'll read to you. I've sent this for you to share with your wife.

But now it wasn't addressed to me as addressed my wife. You personally shared your book with my wife. Because she called and ordered it that is so I thought it was a good idea to present these Challenges to your wife so she can see if what she is believing or what you are saying is the one truth of Jesus Christ outside of your opinion of the truth that is.

Perhaps perhaps she will see the lack of substantiation in your modern opinions on scripture. For all you have to do to substantiate your arguments and the validity of Protestant doctrines is just that your modern opinion.

For no one before Luther seems to agree with you. Hmm. Well, what are these challenges that our our? Brave f -16 pilot has presented. Well, that's what we're going to be looking at here and I would very much like to invite you to participate hint hint hint.

Eight six six five five zero thirty nine. Fifteen eight six six five five zero thirty nine fifteen those of you in the chat room. It's up in the topic line right up at the top. You can go look at it for yourself.

Eight six six. Five five zero thirty nine fifteen is the phone number. We would invite you to participate this evening in the program so that we can make sure how everything's working and uh, hey. It's your one shot at fame.

There are some people we don't need to have. Uh on on the program, uh, you know people like mentor 92. They don't they don't need to call in but uh other people like that hey, uh, feel free to to call in now here is.

Someone just uh, it is toll free. Yes, that is exactly right. It is toll free. And if you were listening before we started the program you need to restart your stream. So you can listen to the entire thing because it is out there.

But uh, here are the three challenges that uh, this individual feels that that uh, no protestant theologian can possibly answer. And here they are. Challenge number one. The catholic faith has never countermanded its doctrines.

Find one it has. Uh, then it says status unanswered. And contrast this challenge with the constantly changing thousands and thousands of protestant doctrines. I think. What is being said there as well?

We've never changed our theology. And so that's the first challenge. Second challenge find one doctrine. The early church believed that the catholic faith no longer does status unanswered. And contrast this with the following challenge exemplifying protestant departure from the historical teachings of the apostles in the early church and the third challenge is uh.

Is protestantism apostolic? Is it the teachings of the apostles and the early church or is it invented renaissance theology? Those are the three challenges now. It was interesting that in the letter and i'm going to look at each one of these three unless of course those of you listening would like to Call in and ask your own question at eight six six five five zero thirty nine fifteen eight six six five five zero thirty nine.

Fifteen is the number. And yes, it is toll free. You know with some folks you have to remind them of that over And over again. Anyhow, it was interesting at the bottom of the uh, the letter. A quotation was provided by dan.

By the way, our fighter pilot's name is dan. To refuse to follow the fathers not holding their declaration of more authority than one's own opinion is conduct worthy of blame. As being brimful of self-sufficiency.

That's from basel the epistle to the kenneth say 52 one. And that sounds very impressive um. Till you look it up and discover That in point of fact the quotation Is from a letter that basel wrote. And he is writing it Right at the beginning of his episcopate.

And he's writing it to women. Enrolled in a list in the churches devoted to works of charity living apart from men. Though not under vows nor always in a community setting. And when you read it in context what he's referring to here is the statement of the fathers at nicaea regarding the deity of christ he's not talking as it is seemingly understood by dan our fighter pilot of listening to the fathers as a group.

And not rejecting what they have to say he's talking about the council of nicaea and when we go to the council of nicaea and when we listen to how Those at the council like athanasius defended the deity of christ and what they believed.

How did they do that? Did they do that by reference to the bishop of rome? Did they do that by reference to unwritten traditions? Or did they do that by reference to and defense from what athanasius described is that which was?

Self-sufficient for the preaching of the truth and that is the scriptures. Well, we know the answer to that they went to the scriptures for their defense of that particular belief but let's talk about this because this is very very important these three challenges and i'm wondering of course whether Uh dan will will convert upon hearing these three challenges answered.

I don't know. Maybe maybe not but hey. We can only leave that up to the holy spirit of god, you know, there's 24 people in our chat room right now and not a one of them even those who Call themselves my friends.

Have picked up the phone to call. It's a tough life we live anyways, uh number number one. The catholic faith has never countermanded its doctrines. Find one it has well that assumes that. Of okay 23 people and one bot.

I wasn't expecting the bot to call in okay. Maybe the bot would be the most interesting caller we could get right now. But we would like to have some others at 8 6 6 5 5 0 39 15. Good grief. Anyways I assume That what is behind?

The Question or the behind the challenge first of all is the assumption that you can know for certainty exactly what? The teachings of the roman catholic church are. It also assumes that the roman catholic church has always existed now.

It also seems to assume that Dan our fighter pilot has some sort of knowledge as to exactly what The teachings of the catholic faith are today. For example It is well known very very well known That the roman catholic church taught say in the centuries prior to the reformation the doctrine of extra ecclesium nullus allos outside of The church there is no salvation.

And they took that very very seriously. Very seriously now. How seriously did they take that. Well, let me read you a quotation. That those of you who are joining us in the chat room are reading even as we speak The council of florence which was viewed as the 17th ecumenical council in roman catholicism said the following council of florence firmly believes Professes and proclaims That those not living within the catholic church not only pagans but also jews and heretics and schismatics Cannot become participants in eternal life.

But will depart into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. Matthew 25 41. Unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock. And that the unity of the ecclesiastical body is so strong that only to those remaining in it Are the sacraments of the church of benefit for salvation?

And do fastings almsgivings and other functions of piety and exercises of christian service produce eternal reward? And that no one whatever almsgiving he has practiced even if he has shed blood for the name of christ can be saved.

Unless he has remained in the bosom and unity of the catholic church end quote. That's denzinger 714. Now that really really is very clear and given the actions of the inquisition giving the use of physical torture of prison.

And in fact of the murder of quote unquote heretics so as to save their souls. It is very clear to any person any person at all. What's extra ecclesiam nulla salus outside the church there is no salvation meant at that time.

What does it mean today. What does it mean today? Well Is that What the roman catholic church teaches today? Well, I don't know. No one does I mean you can go to the documents of vatican 2. And you can read sections that seem to indicate to us that even muslims Are to be considered as heirs of eternal life.

And yet you can then go to the recent vatican encyclical. And there you will find A discussion of the fact that there is no religious plurality. There is no other way of salvation outside of jesus christ and so.

Which one's right? Well, no one knows. That's the problem. No one knows exactly what rome teaches on these subjects and you'll find people who will sign up uh on each side and they will promote each perspective and Uh, you know, that's that's all there is to it so.

How do we understand how are we to know? Which of these doctrines, uh are being taught officially today and hence answer the question. That is answer the question. Well rome has never countermanded one of its own doctrines.

Well when you make rome your ultimate authority. And say okay. We are dependent upon the Living church to tell us what the church in ancient times believed. Then of course you can't prove that because all you have to do is say hey, you know what the uh, The roman catholic church the church today defines what it's always taught.

And if the church says no, we never taught that before or we never taught that doctrine that we've changed all of a sudden. You don't have a contradiction anymore. And so when the question is is put in the way that it's put here the catholic church has never countermanded its doctrines.

Find one it has. I would say to you in point of fact Uh that the earliest teachings concerning the authority of scripture are such that they taught the scriptures own sufficiency. The later roman catholic doctrine contradicts that there would be one example aside from extraclesium nullus solus so on and so forth.

Well It is a great honor. It is truly a uh a great honor uh to have our first caller on the uh. That sounded good, uh have our first caller. Uh ready to go now. This is the first shot we've taken at this folks.

So I just want to give you a little background. We used to have a radio program many many years ago on um Oh khep. And We had the exact same phone system at the radio station that we now have here at our office.

And to put people on the air. We literally had to put them on a speakerphone that had a microphone in front of it. That's how bad it was now. We're not doing that but There were many times we'd hit a button and for some reason.

These phone systems when they know there is a live radio broadcast going on anywhere nearby sense it. And start doing really really weird things. So if our first caller if we hit that button as rich is about to do in a moment.

If we hit that button. And we end up calling domino's pizza or something don't blame us. We have we're doing the best that we can possibly do. And I think we've tried to test and make sure that when you're on hold you can hear what i'm saying.

All the rest of that neat fun stuff, I I really honestly don't know but we will we will find out here in a minute because thankfully Thankfully we have someone who has shown the intestinal fortitude. To get on the toll-free line, even though there were people in the chat room who uh Who saw it was toll-free?

And yet complained about how much it cost and I saw these things as I was trying to be helpful to everybody but uh I ignored them, but now we have someone who has shown Shown the patience and shown the bravery to take the honored position of our first caller on our web broadcast.

Christine is available to us. Christine. Can you hear me? And I can I can just barely hear you so thank you very much. Thank you. Yes, it is. Thank you very much for calling and uh now, uh, I I I think before you you ask your question I should um, I honestly should tell you that uh what we told you.

About how how david absolutely rolled up into a fetal position. Uh prior to while you were gone, uh, and just was absolutely worthless was completely true. It was completely true. He is absolutely you he can't live without you and I think that's a wonderful thing.

Of course not. Yes. Well, I do the cooking. Yes I did hear something about the food he was eating and it was pretty disgusting, you know. Well, should I have this can of tuna fish? It was it was a really very sad thing.

But anyways, that's not what everywhere across the entire uh entire nation. Uh is uh.

Wanting to know. So anyways, go ahead. Well, my question is historical and does relate to the catholic faith. You know, you were mentioning the inquisition and I remember seeing on a on a television documentary once that the inquisition was actually not as expensive as many people believe and that it was.

It was not very well funded. It was one or two priests on a donkey traveling here and there talking to some folks and it really wasn't. You know.

Oops, I just for some reason I had you right up to the point of the two donkey donkeys. And then it faded out. So there you there you are. Okay. Okay. I'm not sure what that I tell you this phone system.

It knows. So go ahead from the point of of two donkeys. Two priests on a donkey going around from city to city.

Basically, the inquisition was not nearly as well funded expensive and did not involve the gruesome tortures and murders that we've all heard and come to. You know associate so much with the inquisition.

So I just wondered if he if he knew anything about that, right?

Well, yes, actually, I mean, uh, it would be expected Uh that in modern times, uh, there would be a rather concerted effort uh to in some way shape or form uh Minimize the actual impact of the inquisition and the use of inquisitorial powers.

But in reality, uh, it was a widely organized and in fact, believe it or not the the actual office of the inquisition Continues, uh to this very day. It's called the sacred congregation for doctrine or something along those lines cardinal Ratzinger is the head of it.

Uh, it still actually exists Uh, it was not a underfunded or small, uh small Work at all in point of fact. There are a number of historical works and many of them are written by non-christians individuals who really don't have any particular quote-unquote acts to grind as far as uh being catholic or or non-catholic or whatever Uh that go into this very issue one from a protestant perspective is george colton's work on the inquisition.

Which is very extensive and one of the reasons one of the easy ways of refuting that kind of allegation is the fact that we have Tremendous records from the inquisition. In fact, a lot of people are not Uh aware of this but in point of fact, uh a lot of the information that we have today About the quote-unquote heretics that existed Uh in the middle ages, uh, the waldensians and the churches in the piedmont valley and so on so forth.

Much of what we know about what they believed comes from the extensive records that the inquisitors themselves kept. And so the fact that we have this huge body of literature demonstrates that it wasn't two priests on a donkey Uh that produced this huge body of literature.

That we can then utilize to reconstruct a lot of the beliefs of people who lived in the middle ages. And we also have to remember that there are well documented incidences of papal armies under the command of innocent the third.

Sacking entire cities that doesn't happen Uh without a tremendous number of people involved and so really when you uh, when you look closely at the historical information Uh, the inquisition grew out of the belief of the roman catholic church that it and it alone Was the only true church that there was no possible way That there could be any salvation outside the church.

And so the inquisitors themselves who were very powerful men very rich men. They had a wide sphere of influence Uh frequently had very powerful positions within society. Many of them say in their writings that they honestly believe they were doing god's work.

Because by torturing the body they could save the soul and to us that's almost frightening to think of that. But that was the mindset that they had and this extended literally over uh over over five and six centuries uh.

And and as I said the the congregation still exists today. Uh, it was more intense in some areas there may have been some areas in say northern europe. Where it never amounted to more than two priests on a donkey.

Uh, but don't tell that to the folks in spain and don't tell that to the folks in uh, italy. And don't that tell that to savonarola? Uh, the the great catholic, uh, Reformer, uh who was caused to go through the trial by fire, uh for his uh running, uh, Basically up against the inquisition.

So really there's there's just a tremendous amount of documentation on that particular subject and fascinating reading though, it's. It's scary. It quite honestly is uh is scary reading as well I'm sure it is.

Oh. Well, thank and thank you for uh for two things. A for being our first caller. You will always be the first caller on the live web broadcast someday when we're satellite. You will always be able to say you were first and then secondly, thank you for loaning david to us.

You know, he's he's our he's our techie guy and we just we just love him. Thank you very much. All right. Bye. Bye. Five eight six six eight six six five. Hi benny. Benny diaz just walked in and sitting back there behind me five see I can do that because we're on a live web broadcast.

And we don't have to worry about the fcc or anything like that eight six six five five zero three nine fifteen. See how that works. See how that works like that. That was easy everybody. Uh, you know eric neilson you could have been the first one man.

But no, no you lost the chance now it's you know, it's always just second third fourth, huh? It's uh. Well, anyways, you know we tried we really did uh did try and we're very very thankful for for christine for doing that.

We do have another caller online though. And let's go ahead and uh, let's go ahead and take michael in. Okay, i'm uh Michael you there? Yes. I am. I well i'm deaf now. So could you sign your question to me?

No, I never learned the american sign language yet. Oh, okay.

Well, could you send me some dimpled chads or something like that that I could. Oh my goodness. Sorry about that. Anyways, what's uh. Aside from your being uh, very kind to help us test this out all out.

Uh, do you actually have a question this evening? Yes, I do. Uh, well first I would like to say.

That i'm enjoying the program and i'm looking forward to more programs. Uh for the live web broadcast version of the.

Well, you know and we don't even have to always just do it on saturday. I mean we're going to do the saturday thing regularly, but we can you know, sometimes folks like uh, well I'll tell i'll announce everybody right now.

I I plan I don't have a specific date yet. But I plan on having steve camp on with me and the nice thing is if I couldn't get Uh steve on on a saturday then we can just simply put on the website. Hey, we're going to do a special uh.

A special web broadcast with uh with steve camp and you know. Tell people where it's going to be and just do it that way. So that's great. That's a neat way to do it.

We're looking forward. Uh, and you know, it is also a privilege to be the second caller I guess.

Well, you're the first guy you can all think of it that way. Okay, and also, uh, I guess you could say the first live phone.

Uh, but uh, my question uh this evening is what pronouncements did pope gregory the seventh make during his pontificate In the 11th century to advance papal authority.

Well, actually there were a number uh during that whole entire period and you probably have pop-ups on some of this that I don't Even have of course you've stolen all of mine, but yeah. You are very good at stealing pop-ups, yes, you even get the color right.

I'm not sure how you do that but. Uh anyways, uh that that entire period was a period of tremendous growth in papal authority. And it's in fact, it's interesting it. It is was preceded by the lowest period of time in papal authority and then comes back up to the heights of papal authority.

Under. Under innocent the third but you may be making reference to and I and I don't have in front of me the information but uh, you may be making reference to. The assertions of the popes concerning their absolute temporal power utilizing the illustration of the two swords or also the illustration of the sun and the moon where the Temporal power of the of the king for example is likened to that of the moon.

Which is simply reflective of the power of the sun, which is the power of the papacy. And each of these uh, gregory and innocent the third and others just made greater and greater claims for themselves.

Up until the point where you encounter someone like a boniface who while he continues to make great claims for himself. Uh, he actually ends up uh collapsing under. Uh his own weight in the sense that he did not have the strength of personality.

Or shall we say the strength of the politics of the day? To be able to substantiate what he was asserting. And so you have this tremendous growth at that time that then the power then led to tremendous corruption over the next number of Centuries and of course leading eventually to the reformation.

Did you have a specific one that you wanted to make reference to?

Uh, well that pretty much did answer my question, of course. Also, if you look at his pontificate approximately around 1074 Uh, you know the well the eastern church, uh, or the western church they called Uh, many of their priests and bishops, uh pope.

Uh, and he was the first gentleman if i'm not mistaken to uh, pronounce And declare that only he has the right to be called pope and if i'm not mistaken He also declared that he is the first Uh canonized living saint, uh, gregory the seventh.

Oh, well that I was unaware of that would that would cause a major problem with the the the sin of pride I would think. Uh to uh to canonize yourself before you die is uh, you know I can think of some politicians who might do that.

Uh today, but we won't mention any names.

Dr. White don't you know that uh, rome has infallible authority in defining what the sin of pride is?

That's that's true when you're when you're the infallible definer of the sin of pride is you can just say no. That wasn't pride. I didn't I didn't do that. That's an easy way to go. Well, hey, thanks a lot Michael appreciate your calling from.

You know, whenever I see ogden, new york, I figure ogden, utah. Okay, you know i'm expecting some mormon question or something like that, but I didn't even know there where. Where is ogden, new york?

Ogden is right outside of uh right now. Snow and fester, rochester. Rochester uh mormon territory also, uh right outside of rochester, uh, joseph smith Uh founded mormonism approximately at well 1830 when he trans so-called translated the uh, nephi plate april 6 1830.

Action. Yes, and uh, you know just about two counties over for me is the brand new mormon temple. They built to Uh right on the hill camora site and you know, we're swamped with mormons up here. Uh, you know, uh, we we'd like to have you up here to do battle on Uh their hill camora pageant and yeah.

I'd like I'd like to do that sometime haven't been to the hill camora pageant haven't been to the manti pageants and probably need to to get to both of them, but this the you know, I just keep writing these silly books and uh, It just takes a tremendous amount of uh, amount of time.

So well anyways, okay. Thanks for calling michael. Thank you for the opportunity. Uh toll free folks five five zero, i'm, sorry eight six six five five zero three nine fifteen. No one's come up with yet with an acronym for five five zero thirty nine fifteen I mean, I really think there's some techie people in the channel would be able to figure five five zero three nine fifteen.

It's got it. It's got to be able to spell something, you know some sort of acronym I mean, especially people from microsoft should be able to figure something like that out. At least I would think so Eight six six five five zero thirty nine fifteen.

The Historicity of the Inquisition and the Scope of Its Power

Hey before I get back to to uh f16 dano's, uh challenges here. And I hope i'm potted up hint to those in control uh I had uh, I mentioned briefly on the air A few weeks ago, and i'm not sure how many of you Uh heard that but uh, I had the opportunity a few weeks ago while I was in florida to uh Well debate roberts and jennis and by the way, we're still waiting on the tapes for the syngenis debate.