November 1, 2022 Show with Ryan Weingard on “How a United Methodist Pastor Came to Embrace the Doctrines of Sovereign Grace Through His Own Preaching”

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

Carlisle, Pennsylvania.

It's iron sharpens iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors Christian scholars and theologians Address the burning issues facing

the church and the world today.

Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us.

Iron sharpens iron so one man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage We are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to

have in view in conversation To make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours.

And we hope to hear from you the listener with your own questions, and now here's your host Chris

Arnzen.

Good Afternoon.

Cumberland County, Pennsylvania.

Lake City, Florida.

And the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth.

Who are listening via live streaming at iron sharpens iron radio .com?

This is Chris Arnzen your host of iron sharpens iron radio wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this first

day of November 2022 and as Many of

you know who listen to iron sharpens iron radio regularly.

Twice a year I have the iron sharpens iron radio free pastors luncheon and

I invite Guest speakers the last one that I had featured dr. James R. White of

Alpha and Omega ministries who was actually my guest yesterday to discuss Reformation Day and

I love meeting Men of God that I have never met before at these

luncheons.

I of course love rekindling old friendships and sharing fellowship with

beloved friends that I've known for many years who Sometimes just travel locally

a short distance and some of them have traveled many hours from Long Island, New York and Georgia and

North Carolina and other places, but I do love meeting first -time

Folks or folks for the first time I should say.

As well and one of those folks that I knew that I had to get on iron sharpens iron radio is

Ryan Weingart.

Ryan is a former United Methodist pastor who converted to reform theology and is now

Involved in a reformed church plant in Pennsylvania today.

We are going to be addressing his fascinating story how a United Methodist pastor came to

embrace the doctrines of sovereign grace through his own preaching.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time ever to iron sharpens iron radio Ryan

Weingart.

Wait, it's great to be to have you on and you are such a gregarious

Gracious and humble man in addition to having a fascinating testimony that I

Was thrilled to hear your acceptance of my invitation and look forward to our

discussion.

We have a tradition here an iron sharpens iron radio whenever we have a first -time guest that that

guest gives a summary of their salvation testimony and Before we move on

to how you actually embrace the doctrines of sovereign grace.

I would love to hear from you.

How you actually first?

Became saved by the grace of God that story Would include what kind of

religious atmosphere if any in which you were raised and What kind of providential circumstances or a

sovereign Lord raised up in your life that drew you to himself and saved you?

So let's hear your story.

Well very well.

Many blessings there.

I considered myself a Christian and stayed away from all the party scenes and all that throughout

school.

I did attend public school.

But then as I entered adulthood and I went to college I

Strayed from the path and had some rebellious time there.

So the real fascinating part of my salvation story I would consider myself

actually being saved as an adult because I do not believe that.

I Really believed and so I had strayed so far at one point.

But I I was going through a rough patch and I actually picked up a

Bob Marley album on vinyl at a local record store one one day and I brought that

home and I didn't.

I'd listen to Bob Marley But didn't really know what he sang about and I was sitting there on my apartment floor listening

to this record I just bought and I hadn't read my Bible in two years or so.

I looked over and saw my Bible sticking out under a stack of papers.

I went over and I picked it up and I sat down and I just randomly opened it to a psalm and

As I looked down at the page I heard the lyrics that Bob was singing coming out of the

speaker as I read them on the page and That really threw me for a

loop.

I immediately closed the Bible Shoved it back under the papers and left.

So even Bob Marley a Rastafarian was preaching the gospel to you.

But the Sun shall not might be by day nor the

moon by night.

I believe it but yeah.

And then and I went to that same record store

and I bought a Peter Tosh album.

Now Peter Tosh was one of the whalers.

It was Bob Marley and the whalers.

This was a solo album.

He did and it was almost identical.

I threw this desk on the record player sat down saw the Bible grabbed it.

Randomly opened it to another psalm.

Completely random and as the words came out of the speaker, I read them.

Huh?

I did not just shove my Bible back under the papers.

I had to sit and think about this.

This is kind of like an Augustine story where he heard children playing and they were saying pick up and read

or take up and read and that was To

Augustine a sign from God to pick up the Bible and start reading it.

And how long did it take for your dreadlocks to grow out.

I.

Had no idea that was just a joke.

And if you don't mind and and let's not forget where you left off there back up a little bit because.

The United Methodist Church.

Is.

Of is not as monolithic as people may think.

It is not all leftist.

Not every congregation is apostate.

There are in fact especially since I began Conducting my pastor's luncheons

here in Pennsylvania after moving here from New York there have been a reasonable

number considerable number of United Methodist pastors who have come who are evangelical Bible -believing and.

So what was the kind of United Methodist congregation?

In which you were raised.

And also if you don't mind, I mean obviously this will in some way reveal how old you are, but

What years would this have been.

Because it's probably a lot harder these days

To find a United Methodist Church that is in any way faithful to the scripture and I know that there was

even a recent split where the more conservative

Members who believed in biblical inerrancy and so on and opposed The

atrocities and the abominations of homosexuality and abortion and so on Left the United

Methodist Church to enter into or to form the global Methodist Church.

But but tell us about this Methodist congregation in which you were raised.

Yeah

1991 early 90s in that area.

First female pastor.

So they send us the female and I'm sure you're familiar.

But if listeners are not familiar the United Methodist system is itinerant as they call it.

It follows an old tradition right.

Circuit writing preachers.

And so the conference assigned you pastors and you don't get a lot of choice so.

We we liked our pastor at the time.

But they decided it was time to make a change and we got our first woman pastor that I

recall.

That Kind of blew up the church.

In some ways people weren't accepting of that.

Now I Believe that that is a very serious violation of the scriptures.

I'm not an egalitarian by any means.

I am a firm believer in exclusively male headship in

the church and I believe the Husbands and fathers are to be leaders in their

Household, but having said that I do know that there are.

Women in.

Pastoral ministry out there who are amazingly in every other way

conservative and even evangelical.

Would that be the case with this woman or was she?

More of a

feminist and liberal

that I do believe that a

full -out

feminist with us.

I Do recall a couple of anti -gun sermons that she preached and were

people are very proud of you know.

They enjoy their guns and proud of their hunting and and those did not go over.

Well, so I believe that she was More liberal than I

knew at the time.

Yes, in fact.

Even being a conservative United Methodist pastor doesn't guarantee that you'll be a Christian.

I found that out the hard way.

When my show iron sharpens iron radio was being conducted out

of WNYG radio in Babylon, Long Island, New York and.

A.

Bible believing evangelical United Methodist pastor who is a friend of mine now retired

Dick Williamson.

Dr. Dick Williamson who was for many years The pastor of the Seaford United Methodist

Church on Long Island and he was able to remain there for decades.

Unlike the the story that you just told I think it was because the

The denomination knew that the congregation would not stand for a minute for

a liberal and Long Island, New York.

It's very very difficult to find a Conservative evangelical Bible -believing

Methodist pastor so they they just left him be but anyway, he told me

hey you should Give a call to the new pastor at Simpson United Methodist

Church in Amityville, Long Island.

I hear he's a conservative and and Dick did not know much else about him.

So I did a program on.

On A.

Conservative evangelical pastors in liberal denominations.

That was the theme and I had a Evangelical pastor in the PC USA

on and I had a pastor from It may

have been an Episcopal Church who was Bible -believing and evangelical and I had the United Methodist pastor on.

And.

We were having a conversation before we went on the air.

In the studio one of the pastors asked.

Hey guys, what's your favorite?

Bible translation and one said oh, I like love my old King James and the other one said I

Use the NASB in my pulpit and the United Methodist pastor said I prefer the New World

Translation.

I said what I said, excuse me.

That's the Jehovah's Witness Bible.

He said oh, yes I'm an Aryan and then The engineer said Chris you're going on the air

in 30 seconds and I I Had to scramble to know what to do.

I was in a panic and I changed the theme at the last second to

pastors in liberal denominations who are against abortion that way

kept the topic away from theological issues because There was no way I was going to

promote the idea that this guy is it was an Aryan so that that was a amazing

lesson because I didn't know that you could actually be an Aryan at that time and Be a United

Methodist, even though they allowed all kinds of liberal heresies in there.

I Did not know that even the deity of Christ was up for grabs as far as ordination.

Oh,

yeah.

I Do a lot more diligent vetting these days.

But pick up where we left off you were a dreadlock wearing guy who

Now now were you convinced that you actually became?

Regenerate became born again during these experiences or after these experiences Listening

to the reggae music, but it just so happened that the specific songs were quoting scripture.

Happen to have those words

from there.

You

want to

talk about what they

believe?

Oh, yeah.

Are you very familiar with them enough to discuss them in detail?

I think I could do a decent job.

Okay.

Yeah.

And interestingly enough some of them have fellowship with the black Hebrew Israelites, or

should I just say? Hebrew is it Israelites?

They don't use the word black in the description of themselves, but they happen to be all black

but they sometimes gather together at meetings as I was told by

Oscar Dunlap who I interviewed he's a deacon at Apologia Church in Mesa, Arizona and he

was a black or should I say a Hebrew Israelite and Came to

Christ Primarily after Seeing dr.

James R. White debate one of their leaders and he saw his leader just utterly annihilated

as far as the discussion went and He was he was convinced he needed to

further investigate The theology of dr. James R. White and he by the mercy of God gets

saved.

But anyway, I interrupted you there

Right.

I.

Anyway, I was at this concert and I I remember just feeling kind of overwhelmed and

I prayed a prayer.

I stood there and I said Lord I don't know who this Rastafari they're singing about is but

and this was literally my prayer.

I said, uh, but I do know from growing up in the church that Jesus Christ is

God and I just want to give my life to you now and Then I looked at the stage and I

added to the prayer and I'll grow dreadlocks like theirs as a sign of my commitment.

And that's that's what I consider Basically my salvation moment now

from that point forward.

I returned to my local Methodist Church.

To town villain.

Most Methodist churches are arranged in what they call a charge so you have multiple churches in the charge and

this particular charge had Townville and a church called Troy Center and At

that time I moved out of Meadville where?

Where the zipper was invented by the way a little fun historical fact.

But I moved out of Meadville and over to Troy Center, which is about 20 miles east

In the middle of nowhere and There's Troy Center right at the bottom of the hill about a half mile

from my house.

So I Played guitar and I started

playing some of this reggae music of Bob's that I was enjoying and my dad was lay

pastor at the time so they Lay speaker I should say The layman who could

preach sermons and was licensed to by the church.

And he was going to preach that week and wanted me to play a song so I played with him at Townville.

I went down to Troy Center where I'd never been.

I played with him there and I Looked around and I went this is where I need to be at the

pastor and they already had a piano player.

But she invited me in and I started playing hymns for them on the guitar.

Now right at that time we started get it we got another pastor who Took

a lot of money out of the church and People weren't happy with him and the church started to kind of

split over this this pastor.

So he wasn't very biblically solid so what I walked into as I as I sought to

Reinforce this faith.

I'd recommitted myself to I walked into a Pastoral leader who looked

me straight in the eye and said because I had a question about the Old Testament.

He said it doesn't matter.

It's Old Testament.

We use the New Testament here and That kind of upset me

because I had the whole Bible in my hand.

As every Christian should not that that's not that they should never have the compact New Testament's

but That's not to be the sole basis of their faith.

It's the entire the whole Council of God.

You don't even understand new to the New Testament rightly unless you understand the Old Testament.

But

you

mean her

tenure

as a

pastor not her life.

You don't need the Old Testament.

Out of all of that what I'm trying to get out here is that I

I did not receive the training that I needed in order to understand the Christianity I was pursuing

and because of that it left me Astray in a way and I

don't know if you've heard of Steve Vanguard's or Josh Packer some people.

But I I decided that maybe I didn't understand the Bible

I didn't see healings happening these these miracles didn't happen anymore.

I had no Leadership to help me understand why I was

given a New interpreters study Bible and I don't know if you're familiar with that group.

No, it is very liberal and out of all of

that I I kind of Started practicing a syncretism.

I embraced the New Age and Christianity and was some way trying to meld them

together.

And I had to climb out of that on my own.

So.

In.

Fact, let's pick up right where you left off there because we have to go to our first station break and.

If anybody has a question for Ryan Weingart about his journey from

a United Methodist pastor into the Reformed faith and that was done by the grace and

mercy of God and the power of the Holy Spirit Using his own

preaching and if you have a question, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com

chrisarnsen at gmail .com as.

Always give us your first name at least your city and state and your country of residence.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back with Ryan Weingart right after these messages.

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Royal Diadem calm and we are not back with Ryan Weingart if you just tuned us in he's a former United Methodist

pastor.

Who converted to reformed theology and is now?

Involved in a reformed church plant in Pennsylvania.

And we are addressing how a United Methodist pastor came to embrace the doctrines of sovereign grace through his own preaching.

Our email address is Chris Arnzen at gmail .com.

Chris Arn z e and gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least your city and state and your country of residence.

And before the break Ryan you were talking about How you became unfortunately

involved in syncretism you were trying to meld The New Age movement together with Christianity

which seems to be something very common when people are involved in

the New Age or the occult or any other kind of aberrant religion.

They they try very often to import elements of Christianity into

what they Teach.

There are very few people and very few religions that outright condemn

Jesus Christ.

And want nothing to do with him.

Obviously they in reality want nothing to do with the true Christ of the scriptures but they will very

often include him in some way in their rhetoric in their propaganda and their false teaching and.

So you were in this process if you could pick up where you left off.

So these people are not the people that you're mentioning are now they're now evangelical Christian.

Yeah, okay, cool.

You know I.

Not to interrupt you again.

But I have found.

For the first time ever.

Now there may be folks that disagree with him, but my dear friend Roger Salter.

He.

He has been on my program.

He is a reformed Anglican.

He's a five -point Calvinist and He said that Prevenient grace on

my show not long ago.

Prevenient grace is a title that was robbed by

Both Roman Catholics and Armenians.

That has a reformed meaning and.

I.

Believe he was referring to the effectual call and calling it prevenient grace which

I've never heard any other reformed person do but I just thought I'd throw that out there because apparently there

are reformed people who are truly reformed who use that term, but have a different understanding of it than obviously Rome and

The Arminians would.

He

brought up a

book called the

Franklin

cover -up

a

book written by a senator John de Kamp in the early

90s.

Just real quick.

It was about a satanic ritual abuse Scandal that they uncovered

while doing investigation into the savings and loans scandals of the 80s.

Those who are alive remember that I'm sure they're investigating the Franklin Credit Union in

Omaha, Nebraska and they uncovered a ritual abuse ring and this all got covered up

and the senator at the time felt like it was such a An important story that at least he had to get it out.

So he wrote a book about it.

So this was an actual proven satanic ritual abuse Story

because there were especially in the 80s a lot of fraudulent stories

that charlatans posing as Christian evangelists, especially in the charismatic realm

were peddling these things that turned out to be totally false.

So you're saying this was an actual true account.

And that's where Jerry Sandusky was working at the time.

So the idea might be that he continued the same Practices that they were

doing and moved it to Penn State.

So this is as legitimate as you can get when it comes to a book now.

The reason the book was written is because the grand jury investigation ended up convicting the witness

the victim witnesses instead of Going after the perpetrators.

So senator to camp wrote the book trying to get it out and give all his info.

So that being said I Read that Learned all about the

satanic ritual abuse the real stuff in it and it.

Yeah, I am familiar with the satanic panic and I did watch the Geraldo episode that he had

and There was some shadiness and there were some false stories peddled about but in this

case Another interest of mine popped up and that was in the Nephilim which I

enjoyed talking to.

Your former co -host there at your pastor's luncheon about because I listened to your episode on that.

Oh buzz Taylor you mean.

Buzz Taylor my former co -host on the line.

Okay.

Yeah.

That's who I talked about.

I was interested in it

and this all came together in one random occurrence while I was at work.

Um, I found out about a conference in Newark, Ohio called Nephilim Mounds conference

about the Nephilim.

I went.

Well, that's that.

Sounds fun.

You know and I saw there is this la martini was speaking who I'd heard talk about giant

and then.

Man named Russ Dizdar.

I'd never heard of him.

He he passed away this year.

I.

Consider him a friend and a brother.

So his passing was sad but he was speaking and I didn't know who he was and I

Saw he had a podcast and I'm I work in Meadville PA and I turned this his last

Podcast on and I'm sitting there listening to a long work and then he starts talking about Satanic

ritual abuse, of course, the first thought was what in the world does this have to do with the Nephilim?

I was a little confused but.

The.

Providential moment came when I'm listening at work and he goes I was dealing with a victim

and and then he hesitated when I was in Meadville PA and I just

oh my goodness here and He had this horrible story.

He told and I just about fell off my chair and I went home and said Kelly We have to go.

What I gained from this conference that has to do with our story is He

convinced me that Satanism was real that it was pervasive and that it was

extremely damaging and he also convinced me that the Old and New Testament did in

fact fit together and that the Bible should be our sole

authority that we need to believe it's true and That's something that was being.

That was not being enforced in the church.

I was and at the time so.

I.

Became convinced that if we have the Bible we need to understand it and we need to believe it out of this this

whole story.

I don't want to lead you down these rabbit trails too far, you know.

We need to get to me preaching and converting that right?

We do.

We do have about an hour left.

So that's fine.

We got a new

pastor and he was Korean and just so you're aware.

So everyone is the church.

The Methodist Church was applying both critical gender theory and critical race theory.

Okay, the application of it was happening.

So the reason we got a Korean pastor and we were basically I was told this at one point.

Was to because our denomination was too uniform.

That our denominations should represent the diversity of God's kingdom and therefore we

should have white and black Asians and Latinas all these should be

represented.

And if your church doesn't represent it well enough if they're too uniform then what they would do

is take a woman pastor for instance.

Critical gender theory.

Placed her in your pulpit force you to deal with her.

Or.

In this case they took a Korean from Korea with a thick accent and placed him in our

church.

And according to the current rhetoric of critical race theory, he's a white man because he's not

black and Asians seem to be on a Peer

level with Caucasians as far as being inherently

bigoted and racist and they are not to receive

Preferential treatment as Blacks are.

That's what I've been hearing from the The people who are keeping up to date on these heresies of

critical race theory and so on.

Right.

I

believe

conservative Bible believing pastor and I came back from this conference that I

just told you about where I met This rust is dar and became convinced that scripture was true and I needed to

understand it and he Helped me on that path and

He said oh, yeah.

Well, I I came to the conclusion that I need to believe the Bible when I read it and

He reinforced that for me.

He also Looked at my new interpreters study Bible and he goes.

Oh he goes that that Bible no good.

He said no good.

I said really because they don't believe in miracles.

He said they they don't believe that.

You know the people who wrote the Bible wrote the Bible and he gave me a whole list of things.

He goes I used to own one.

He goes, you know what I did with it.

He goes I threw it in the trash.

Well, it sounds like a good man yeah, and in fact, let's pick up where we you left

off because we have to go to our midway break right now and.

Please be patient folks.

The midway break is always a little longer than the other breaks because grace life radio 90 .1 FM in

Lake City, Florida needs to localize iron Sherpins iron radio geographically

to Lake City, Florida in order to fulfill FCC requirements so they do so by using by airing

their own public service announcements and other local things during the midway break.

We on the other hand simultaneously air our globally heard commercials, please use this time wisely.

Respond to our advertisers so that they know that you're listening and when you can't purchase

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Ryan Weingart.

Chris Arnson at gmail .com.

Chris Arnson at gmail .com.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back after these messages.

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Wow, that's some compliment.

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Before I return to my guest Ryan Weingart who is a former United Methodist pastor

who came to embrace the doctrines of sovereign grace Through his own preaching.

Before I return to that story We just have a couple of very important announcements to make.

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Last but not least if you are not a member of a Christ honoring biblically faithful Theologically solid doctrinally sound

church no matter where on the planet earth you live I may be able to help you find a church.

Sometimes even right around the corner from where You live as I have done with many people throughout the

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So if that describes you you do not have a Christ honoring biblically faithful home.

Please send me an email to Chris Arnson at gmail .com and put on a search in the subject line.

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That's also the email address where you could send in a question for Ryan Weingart on his journey out of the United

Methodist Church after discovering and embracing the doctrines of Sovereign Grace

That he was led to believe through his own preaching as a United Methodist minister.

If you have a question send it to Chris Arnson at gmail .com and Give us your first name at least your

city and state and country of residence.

So Ryan if you want to pick up where you left off in your journey and

We will hopefully very soon get to the point in your life where you began to

preach as a pastor and as I said already these things that you were preaching from the Word

of God began to trouble your heart and mind and soul and led you to.

Abandon formerly held beliefs, but if you could

study Bible,

I had Pastor Jay the Korean pastor encouraging me to Pursue my scriptural

understanding.

I decided scripture

at

this point.

I was

playing

music

there.

I was their lay leader.

So I led the liturgies in the service.

I would stand in for the pastor when he was unavailable and preached sermons

and Was leading the adult Sunday school class and God was equipping me in that way,

but So I pursued that.

And they have a path in the ministry called a local licensed pastor and the way that works is

you you apply Do an interview or two a few sessions and then you go to what they call

licensing school, which is the Kind of an intensive program where they go over all the aspects

of ministry and Then they give you a license and a pulpit so you can marry people.

You can serve communion.

But then you have to take course of study So seminary courses on your own and complete it

within a certain amount of time.

So I pursued that course Went to the licensing school.

I was already Convinced enough of the Bible and Christianity that when Bishop Tom

Bickerton came and taught us about sacrament and Told us that he doesn't use

the word father in liturgy.

And by the way, Bishop Bickerton is now the bishop of I forget his name, but the conference

that Encompasses New York City.

He's the bishop of their conference.

No, but he said he refuses to use the name father in the liturgy because people might have

had bad experiences with Fathers and that might drive them away from believing in Jesus

and I Went well, that's absolutely horrible.

Yeah, I guess he I guess he knew or knows more than Jesus because Jesus didn't stop using the term

father.

Somebody said well, we're gonna have a meal with somebody like to bless it and I shot my hand up.

Right after he said it and I said, I'll pray and I raised I said bow your heads and I said father

in heaven.

Please bless this. Amen.

Problems and it was also in that licensing school where I received my first critical

race theory training and I mean Michael O 'Fallon did a

conference in 2016 or a Jordan Peterson come to speak.

Jordan Peterson talked about it and Jordan put the slides on the screen that I was handed out and my

training for critical race theory.

So this is the milieu in which I entered ministry.

I became a pastor of Brown Hill United Methodist Church a rural congregation and

I I knew Chris.

I just knew I I had these sermons.

They needed to hear this word and I had about six of them and when I finished those six

sermons I went, uh -oh This is a long haul.

Really start understanding the Bible better because I don't.

And so I started.

I followed the lectionary the revised common lectionary and I started preaching The scriptures

as I read them and I I was Wesleyan, you know, I did believe the Westland

theology.

Freewill, you know, the whole Arminian concept was was strong in my Understanding

but I kept encountering scriptures as I preached that seemed to contradict it.

So what I did is I would preach them as I read them and let them lie.

Say well, this is what it says and we have to get around that.

So it was at that time where.

I.

Found this Documentary on YouTube by this guy named Stephen Anderson called New World Order

Bible Translation.

I thought looked at my wife.

They said Really think the New World Order is messing with the Bibles.

I don't know.

We better watch it.

So we watched this and and he's presenting this whole King James argument and I'm like, well

Okay, and suddenly he interviewed this guy named.

Dr. James White.

I.

Looked at my wife and I said, well, that was kind of interesting.

I don't know about Steven Anderson's Argument here, but that dr. White really made sense.

Another Romans 828 moment.

Before and I found out that this whole like two -hour interview with Steven Anderson was on the internet.

So I watched the entirety of it when I was done with that I was confronted with

a sola scriptura Reformed argument a Calvinist argument from him

and I went, okay.

This seems to make sense.

I need to figure this out.

And that's when I started I found every debate He ever did on Calvinism versus

Arminianism.

I Think you hosted some of them if I remember correctly.

Yes, I did.

Okay, I watched everyone I could find on YouTube

Chris angry and I was upset and I didn't agree with him.

Yet I went well the scripture says that I have to deal with it so I would go to the scripture passages

and I distinctly remember doing a Bible study in my church.

And I remember I wanted to go through first Timothy because I thought the church could use some

Church building scripture like how to be a church because they were struggling and I got to first

Timothy 2 and I went well, who is everyone

in this text because it reads first of all then I urge that petitions prayers intercessions and Thanksgiving's

be made for everyone for kings and all those in authority and then Below

that it indicates that Christ who gave himself as a

ransom for all the testimony at the proper time.

And I remember looking up and going you guys might not like this but I don't think all means everyone in

the world here and I indicated that I believed it

indicated in The context Kings those in authority

all types of people and that was that stands out in my mind.

Chris is one of the moments where I went.

Okay.

I I think I'm becoming a Calvinist now.

And I I encountered some texts and preaching like Ephesians 1

Ephesians 2 That seemed to indicate predestination.

Of course we get to Romans 9 John 6 these texts I had to deal with as I was

working through my sermon and as I dealt with them, I

Dedicated myself to solar scripture.

I thought this is the only authority I must follow it.

I have to deal with these texts and that is when I started embracing the

doctrine of sovereign grace to get us through this long process to the point where

you wanted to Have your show about.

Now When I came to believe in these things, it was a

lot more of a brief Episode in my life.

I Was joining a reformed Baptist Church

and I was Interviewed for baptism and

I said to the Elders love you guys.

I want you to be my pastors.

I trust you I love the people here, but I don't think I'm ever going to become a Calvinist.

I just don't believe in that stuff that part of your whole message.

I just Don't believe it at all and don't think I ever will and they said to me Well,

as long as you believe in the gospel We will not

enforce upon you a an immediate a Decision to believe in the doctrines

of grace when you're not there yet.

We're going to be patient with the Holy Spirit with your Sanctification with

your growing and grace and the knowledge of the Lord.

So you will still be permitted into membership as long as you agree not to undermine these teachings

and and in other words to not to bad -mouth them to other members not to try to

Overturn sermons in the minds of fellow congregation members

not to start a mutiny of Arminians so I agreed and within

months a very short period of time a British brother who is now in the

with the Lord for eternity he Approached me and said I understand you having trouble with

doctrines of sovereign grace read this booklet and he gave me George Whitfield's letter to John

Wesley an election.

I read it and My and my first reaction after finish finishing reading it was

oh, no This is true, but I still hate it.

And.

But it so it was even it was more infuriating because I recognized it was true, and I still did

not surrender to it, but It was a very brief period of time

after that That I bowed the knee rejoicing in These truths and fell

in love with these truths now.

What was the case with you you you came to these?

Under you came to an understanding of these truths that are exclusively reformed.

And.

You came to embrace them.

Were you doing not saying you were doing this in the Worship service, but were you doing at least in your

mind and heart cartwheels.

Or were you?

Were you pounding your chest and Knocking your head against the wall even if it's allegorical.

Because you didn't like these things even though you acknowledged.

They were true.

Even after you came to embrace them as fact.

Amen.

Greatest

comfort in my

faith, and

I became convinced that

if you Perceptual understanding and you promoted Christ first and

foremost.

That God would turn over every situation.

Even with people you might be witnessing to or preaching to that weren't believing.

Even though I had people leave that church while I was there.

Not necessarily over these specific doctrinal issues, but kind of peripheral to them I

was convinced that God was doing this to glorify himself and

that It was okay.

So that's what it did to me.

It instilled that assurance of my salvation my faith and of God's sovereignty over every

Situation.

But yes, I wrestled a lot.

It took me at least a year of working through this to really decide.

This must be the truth.

Now.

While you're coming to embrace these things during sermons that you're preaching yourself.

Yeah, did you start to have a red light going on in your mind saying oh?

This also means I'm going to have to leave the United Methodist Church.

Did that ever?

Enter into your mind while you were preaching or when did that come about?

Certainly gay.

Bishop and

the

Rocky Mountain Conference and my church.

Immediately they wanted to leave Methodism.

They did not want to be a part of this at all.

Praise God.

Praise God and To their credit they wanted to do that and I was like no no no

we should fight this from within I'm not going to lead you out.

So I think they were more right than me as I look back on it, but so do I.

I went to the annual conferences, and I made it on to one of their little.

You know they were doing some legislation, and I was able to deliver I I stood up in a meadow on a

post in their legislation and utilized scripture and convinced them the Scripture is correct, and they changed a

little bit, and I said see you can do this work.

But.

Then a situation broke out in our church that involved my my

family and it wasn't a good situation and the whole situation will remain Anonymous,

but I it forced me into a position where I felt like I just couldn't continue ministry there.

And so I left the pulpit for other reasons but once I left that pulpit

Chris I Could not with a good conscience return to Methodism.

I knew I had to find a reformed church.

Just out of curiosity.

Knowing that the United Methodist Church.

I'm not sure How strict the standards are with the new global

Methodists?

I knew that they must be in some significant way a lot more strict than the United Methodists.

Because it's a conservative group but since the United Methodist Church seemed to

allow a Host of all kinds of things including as you said the

ordinate the ordination of an openly homosexual bishop.

Would they allow somebody to be a Calvinist as a minister or bishop a five -point Calvinist etc.

What really?

Yes, and I don't know I don't know it's the first time I heard about it.

I don't know if the man is doing this out of Or in a state of rebellion

against the denomination or if they have Allowed him to maintain that teaching there

and remain there as a pastor.

I knew Folks in Pentecostal denominations that were permitted

to remain where they were as Calvinists even though that was not the position of.

The.

Denominations that these men were in.

But I just don't I don't know enough about the denomination to Know if they are you

know fully aware that he is a Calvinist and if they are.

Saying that's okay.

Things could be worse.

Our tent can

encompass all sorts of

United Methodist United

Methodist pastor

in a church right now and your church is not

complaining about you and You're not just running out of money and dying

they seem to be content to leave you where you are at the moment.

Besides your theology.

Yeah, and you know what I've also witnessed With some of the liberal denominations the

denominations very often will leave alone Churches

that are predominantly In leadership and in the congregation ethnic minorities if

they are theologically conservative They won't say a word.

They're just like let them alone.

Let them do whatever they want.

Because they don't want to appear to be racist or bigoted so they just leave

those in let's say a predominantly black congregation or predominantly Hispanic or

Asian congregation if they're preaching a very conservative biblically faithful word in a liberal

Denomination very often.

I have seen that not all the time.

But I've very often seen that they have been left alone by the authorities of the denomination.

Even if the authorities are as left -wing as you can get.

Yeah, that's another thing that I've noticed over the years is that sometimes when you have an evangelical

pastor elders and congregation in a liberal denomination sometimes those

congregations don't do any church discipline because They think it's enough that

they're surviving there in a liberal denomination while preaching an antithetical message to

the liberal denominations positions.

And they are preaching the Bible and they are basically saying well, we're going to let God

Separate the wheat from the tares, and we're not going to do anything and I'm against that.

I think a church to function biblically needs to have church discipline, but that's just something that I've noticed

That very often.

I'm not saying in every case.

I'm just saying very often.

I've noticed when I've gotten to know Conservative Bible believing evangelical pastors in liberal

denominations that they don't conduct church discipline.

I don't know if

you've

seen that.

So he was

defrocked

by

a liberal.

The the liberal hierarchy of the United Methodist Church.

He was yeah Wow.

Okay, and.

We're going to go to our final break.

It's going to be a lot shorter than the other breaks and we do have a number of people waiting patiently.

Well, I hope they're waiting patiently to have their questions asked and answered by you Ryan

so if you'd like to get in line, please send in your email immediately to Chris Arnson at gmail

.com.

Chris Arnson at gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least your city and state and your country of residence.

Don't go away.

We're gonna be right back after these messages.

Here at iron sharpens iron radio praise God for the generous monthly financial support

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iron radio.

Dr. Joseph Piper President emeritus and professor of systematic and applied theology

at Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary.

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As host of iron sharpens iron radio I frequently get requests from listeners for church recommendations.

A church I've been strongly recommending as far back as the 1980s is Grace Covenant Baptist Church in

Flemington, New Jersey pastored by Alan Dunn.

Grace Covenant Baptist Church believes It's God's prerogative to determine how he shall be worshipped and how he

shall be represented in the world.

They believe churches need to turn to the Bible to discover what to include in worship and how to worship

God in spirit and truth.

Grace Covenant Baptist Church endeavors to maintain a God -centered focus.

Reading preaching and hearing the Word of God singing psalms hymns and spiritual songs.

Baptism and communion are the scriptural elements of their corporate worship performed with faith joy

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Discover more about Grace Covenant Baptist Church in Flemington, New Jersey at GC

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That's GC BCNJ dot Squarespace .com or

call them at nine zero eight nine nine six seven six five four.

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Tell pastor Dunn that you heard about Grace Covenant Baptist Church on iron sharpens iron radio.

This is pastor Bill Sasso Grace Church at Franklin here in the beautiful state of Tennessee.

Our congregation is one of a growing number of churches who love and support iron

sharpens iron radio financially.

Grace Church at Franklin is an independent Autonomous body of believers Which strives

to clearly declare the whole counsel of God as revealed in scripture through the person and work

of our Lord Jesus Christ and of course the end of which we strive is the glory

of God.

If you live near Franklin, Tennessee and Franklin is just south of Nashville, maybe ten minutes.

Are you are visiting this area or you have friends and loved ones nearby?

We hope you will join us some Lord's Day in worshiping our God and Savior.

Please feel free to contact me if you have more questions about Grace Church.

Our website is Grace Church at Franklin org.

That's Grace Church at Franklin.

Dot o -r -g.

This is pastor Bill Sasso wishing you all the richest blessings of our Sovereign

Lord God Savior and King Jesus Christ today and

always.

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Welcome back and Ryan.

We have some questions from our listeners that I want to get to before we run out of time.

We have an anonymous listener who says I am remaining anonymous because I am dreading The fact

that I have to confront a dear brother in Christ.

Who is a ordained minister in the United Methodist Church?

He is a Bible believer.

He is an evangelical, but he believes that other United Methodists should stay put

where they are and fight the good fight.

I cannot condone this Ideology of his because it is a

clear example of people being unevenly yoked with unbelievers especially

since the United Methodist Church has reached the depth of depravity that is

currently teaching and practicing including in the area of homosexuality and other

nightmarish sins.

My question to you is do you think that it is legitimate for a Bible believing

Christian?

To remain in the United Methodist Church, and I have a follow -up question on the global

Methodist, and I will wait Until you finish answering that question before I go to his global Methodist

question.

That being said I have Family.

My own father and mother still tend to United Methodist Church.

They have a different view than me and I'll give it to you accurately my

father says.

These churches exist in these communities.

We have over 85 United Methodist Churches just in The two counties.

Here in my conference alone the majority of churches were Methodist for a long time.

Yeah, Cumberland County is filled with them even on the same street in Mechanicsburg.

There's like four United Methodist Church within like a hundred yards of each other.

Genuine Christian

contend that

You need

to

the spiritual

meat that a good solid Christian Church can provide or If you have a

family a wife and children and they need that meat then I think the only

responsible thing to do is to find a faithful church and.

As a pastor Boy, I would I struggled myself and would would struggle I would

be dreading the confrontation just as the listener is and But I would encourage him to try to

have that conversation with this pastor and at least Find out where his pastor said.

All right.

The second part is what do you know about the newly formed global Methodist Church

the conservative?

Split from the United Methodist Church even conservatives can sometimes adopt heretical

views and.

Even.

Oral Roberts the notorious charlatan faith healer From what I understand

remained a member of the United Methodist Church until he died.

If that is not the case I know that he was a member of the United Methodist Church for decades nonetheless.

But there is seems to be a toleration a very aberrant word of faith

Pentecostal views even amongst the conservative United Methodists and Also the

ordination of women and some other things they may not be aware of.

What is your understanding of The global Methodists and are they a safe place for a Bible

-believing Christian to enter?

Then they should be allowed to preach.

I have a big problem with that.

I think that's probably going to be a linchpin and the future of

The global Methodist that'll cause problem.

They still uphold I'm sure they uphold what they would call the Wesleyan quadrilateral that scripture is

primary and not sola and You can also use tradition

reason and experience to exegete scripture.

So I see some issues in it.

And they aren't they aren't going to change that theology.

They're going to keep it.

They're going to continue having women pastors and as for the

Keeping heretical teachers in as you mentioned, I don't know.

I don't know how they're going to handle it I don't know when they'll be able to identify a heresy or how they will

If they'll go through an excommunication or not.

Okay, thank you anonymous if you have never Entered a question or submitted a question before your

first -time questioner.

You have won a New American Standard Bible compliments of cvbbs .com and compliments of the

publishers of the NASB.

So give us your full name and mailing address and we'll have it shipped out to you.

Obviously your identity will remain.

Anonymous.

Friend of mine.

Local Orthodox Presbyterian pastor here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania.

Pastor Jeremy Brandenburg of Redeemer Presbyterian Church here in Carlisle has a question.

Hello, sir.

What is one area for growth that you identified in the Reformed Church since

you joined it?

One area for growth.

That you have identified in the reformed area for

the church to grow.

I don't know.

It might be your own spiritual growth.

In fact, Pastor Jeremy if you want to clarify that question send in another email.

But I don't know what she meant.

Okay.

Well a Providence

Reformed Church a church plant.

So when I left Methodism, I guess I'll answer this way I found a

Reformed Church in Meadville Attending at 2019.

Pastor Brian, they're very blessed

but over

time I came to Realize that especially when covet and all that started

that the church probably needed to be taking some stands that a lot of churches weren't

taking and Proclaimed a minion over the community in certain ways

and I wasn't necessarily finding that there.

So I pursued this church plan.

So for me, I would contend that the areas of growth that the Reformed Church has before it is

taking dominion over its communities.

You could I know Christ Church and Canon Press is really pushing this

Christian nationalism book that's coming out and they're talking a lot about it.

You could I would I would be looking in that area for our growth.

To.

Take that dominion to start businesses to grow your families to Participate on school

boards if you feel so.

Led to join your local township councils things like that.

And bring that Christian worldview into those areas and let Christ do his work there.

Thank you, Pastor Jeremy, and I want you now to.

Well, first of all, I want to just quickly plug Pastor Jeremy's church.

It's such a good church.

The website is Redeemer OPC org.

Redeemer OPC for Orthodox Presbyterian Church org and that's here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania.

I would like you to now in about a minute or 90 seconds Summarize what

you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners today.

Great.

Do you want our listeners if they have further questions to contact me and I'll pass on their emails.

Or do you want to provide Contact information.

Why don't I just have them send them to me because I don't we don't have time for a long complicated email.

Send it to Chris Arnzen at gmail .com chris Arnzen at gmail .com and I

will pass on any emails that you may have that you would like to begin a

correspondence with Brian today.

I want to thank you so much Ryan for doing such an excellent job.

And it's amazing that this was your first interview.

You certainly sounded very relaxed and There was no anxiety or fear that

came through in your speech.

You did a great job.

I look forward to having you back on the show and I look forward to sharing fellowship with you again in the near future.

I want to thank everybody who listened today, especially those who took the time to write in questions.

I apologize to those of you who wrote in questions that we didn't have time to ask.

I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior

Than you are a sinner.