The Preacher’s Portrait

Welcome to No Content Radio. My name is Mike Gavendroth, your host today.

Welcome to No Content Radio.

Well, it's better than No Compost Radio, right? Way better. Right? But all three could be no-co, right? N-O-C-O. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

No Collaboration Radio. No... I mean, there's all sorts of no-co possibilities.

Steve, we're going to do part two today on the, oh no, oh yeah, on books. I was going to say on Baker's Dictionary of Theology, but that was our first book. We've got a stack of books here. We're talking about the books, and for 28 minutes we talked about Baker's Dictionary of Theology, and maybe we should have an Amazon Smile account set up for that, because they're probably going off the shelf like mad.

The Amazon Smile thing is, when's that going off? It's going off the shelf, speaking of the shelf. They're going to end that whole program.

I know. I know. I normally give... If someone calls me and says, we're raising money for muscular dystrophy, I usually say, I'm glad for what you're doing. Thank you. I hope there's a cure. I give the money that I would donate to the local church.

I'm a Christian. But I did pick the Amazon Smile for a cancer society, because my mom died of cancer, my dad died of cancer, and who knows how much was given? Probably 50 bucks or something, but that was my...

It turns out, Jeff Bezos needs the money.

Oh. Well, is he going to buy a football team or something?

Yeah. So, hey, thanks for all that Amazon Smile stuff, but now the money's really needed for important stuff.

Cultural Confusion, Transgender Sports, and Christian Compassion

Steve, I don't know when this show will air, some Tuesday in the future, but I read yesterday that Bethany Hamilton, the surfer who had her arm bitten off by the shark, a Christian lady who went on to get back into surfing, and kind of an interesting story with her and how her dad made a special handle on her first surfboards after the shark attack.

And she's competing professionally again. Now they want to have people that are transgender, their male bodies competing at the Women Pro Surf Contest. And she said, well, I'm just not going to surf then, because this is not right.

Forget the fair part. She could probably beat most of those so-called trans men, transgender men. She could probably do a better job than they could, and she's got one arm, but I'm glad she's standing up and saying, I'm just not going to do it.

It's so... I mean, this whole... You're either a guy or you're not, right? And so this sort of, well, I'm transitioning, and no, you're not. You're mutilating your body, you're doing a lot of things, but you're still a guy.

And deep down, Steve, after I am bugged at women's sports are going to be decimated and all that kind of stuff, I just think to myself, I feel sorry for people who are going through problems in life. I mean, as we all do, but some of these problems are really big problems, and there's a solution to be found.

And I know who the solution is, but they don't know the solution, and now you've got all kinds of people, even behind parents' backs, forcing issues, and that's not going to ultimately help them.

Right. The solution is not in hormone therapy. I know. I know.

So sad. So the books we have left here on my studio anxious bench, as Steve likes to call it.

If the listeners could see this bench, they'd go, yeah, I'm a little nervous too, you know? Hey, there's a Joel cube up there.

The Preacher as Steward, Herald, Witness, Father, and Servant

Here is a book that is priced at five shillings. Five shillings. That's not bad. That is a great price. And it's called The Preacher's Portrait, written by J .R .W. Stott, Rector, All Souls Church, London, and it's on Tyndale Press.

And here's the five chapters. A preacher is one, a steward, a herald, a witness, a father, and a servant. So the steward has, you know, who's my, what's my message? I don't have my own message, right?

I'm a steward. Herald, I proclaim it and give an appeal. Witness, it does something in me, and so they should see a preacher's humility and experience. Father, preacher's love and gentleness. Servant, a preacher's power and motive.

This is one of my favorite little books on preaching because it doesn't tell you how to preach. It just tells you what a preacher should look like.

Well, I think, you know, even from that brief introduction, it also gives you kind of an idea of how he should be thinking about himself, right? I mean, you know, if we've said this before, but if what I'm going to preach hasn't impacted me during the week, why would I expect it's going to impact anybody on Sunday morning?

Steve, I'm sure we've said it dozens of times. The sooner in the week or the earlier in the week where we have that, I don't want to call it encounter, but that just those moments before the Lord where we think, thank you, Lord, for this message.

I repent. I'm sorry. Please forgive me. I want to live this out better. Whatever those moments are based on the passage, if that happens on a Tuesday, it's better than on a Saturday night.

Well, even when you say that, you know, sometimes, because I want listeners to understand that when we're going, when we're prepping, it's not always negative, right? A lot of times we're just like, we're going, man, that's good.

I can't wait to say that on Sunday morning or, you know, this is exciting, right? So, I mean, there are the moments of conviction, yes. There are moments of, I don't even, this is a positive moment where it's like, I don't even know if I can adequately express how much this motivates me, how exciting this is.

What a great Savior we have in Jesus Christ. You know, there are times where you just like, like you say, you want to get in your three-point stance. It's like, there aren't enough stances, you know, it's like...

Steve's going to do four-point stances now, he's a nose guard.

I mean, you're just so fired up, you're like, oh man, can we just skip all the opening songs and all that other stuff, and let's just get to the sermon, man, and I'm ready.

Christ's Triumph in Colossians 2 and the Preacher's Joy

When I felt that way a little bit on Sunday, Steve, in Colossians 2, I've been doing chapter by chapter, just big picture. And I really, I could probably slow down some, of course, but what I loved is, for instance, in chapter 2, verse 15, he disarmed the rulers and authorities and put them to open shame by triumphing over them in him.

And I've just taken in my study by, well, Jesus just destroyed them, and it was a triumph, it's this Roman triumph, but I didn't have to, I didn't have to go into a sermon, what about 1 Peter 3, and where'd he go, and what happened, and everything else, it just, no, what Paul is trying to say is, you're worshiping possible angel aeons, this, that, and the other.

No, no, Jesus is the one who did it all, and he's the one who, at the cross, and I just think, oh, man, I'm excited to talk about it, I just can't wait to get into it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, here's what you didn't know, Steve.

Okay. What didn't I know? I did not know it either. This book is an expansion of the 1961 series delivered at Fuller Theological Cemetery. Those were the days.

Those were the days, my friend. You know, if, when you think about it, alternate history, right? And if Fuller hadn't gone off the rails, you know, you and I could have gone there. I mean, right? Because maybe Master's Seminary never comes into existence.

John's just like, you know what, Fuller's a great seminary, everybody should just go there.

Steve, we could have had our degrees there at Fuller. I remember I was at Master's Seminary, and at the time, you know, you love your school and all that stuff, and you got to be true to your school. Master's was the best, I mean, why would I go to something that wasn't the best?

And I remember meeting a guy, maybe either personally or through my brother's conversation, well, what school do you think, you know, how did you pick Master's? You know, what went through your mind? Well, you know, I live in Southern California and I didn't know whether to go to Master's or Fuller, and I don't know, I just picked Master's, it was closer.

We couldn't believe this guy. Wow.

Wow. I mean, that was it, right? Yeah. It was kind of equidistant. You know, I sort of lived in, I don't know. What would that be? Burbank or something, right? Glendale. You know, and he's like, yeah, it could have been either way.

So funny. I was like, I was trying to figure out which way the traffic would be better.

The Holy Spirit's Role and the Limits of the Preacher

Gresham Machen wisely said, we must do our utmost to give people good reasons why they should believe, but it is the Holy Spirit who opens their minds to attend to the evidence. Talk about that a little bit.

I mean, what's our role as a pastor, as a preacher? What are our limitations?

What can't we do? But what must we do? Well, I think even what Machen's saying there, I think we talked about it maybe recently, but you know, this whole idea of, I want to make things in the text as explicit as I can.

But when it comes to how each person should have it applied to them, how it should, if I were to use another term, how it should afflict them, comfort them, encourage them, exhort them, whatever, however it's going to impact them in toto, that's not my job.

That's the Holy Spirit's job. My job is to present it accurately with enthusiasm, right, and to really press all the truths that I can, you know, muster with my meager faculties from the Word of God upon them.

And then it's up to the Holy Spirit after that. Amen.

Paul in the Hall of Tyrannus and the Scale of Gospel Preaching

Stott writes in the Herald chapter, after three months ministry in the synagogue, Paul withdrew and argued daily in the hall of Tyrannus, some manuscripts adding from the fifth hour to the 10th for two years, a daily five-hour lecture throughout two years.

That's a lot. That works out, Stott says, at over 25 ,000 hours of gospel preaching. No wonder we read in verse 10, that as a result, all the residents of Asia heard the word of the Lord, both Jews and Greeks.

10, 25 ,000 hours. How do we do that?

Can you imagine, you know, a Sunday school, have you done 25 ,000 hours of teaching an entire life, right?

Well, and I mean, you know, again, it gets all the more remarkable because, you know, what would Paul be arguing from? The Old Testament. Right, right. So, and you just go, hmm, well, maybe he was just sticking with a few texts, you know, Genesis 3 .15 and just a few other texts, precious few texts that definitely point to Jesus.

Only the ones that say types are types. Yeah.

I know. All right. Here's a good quote. In the father section, like the pastor is supposed to be fatherly, right? You want the people to learn and to grow, and this has nothing to do with don't call anybody father, you know.

It's his attitude, it's not his office.

Preaching involves a personal relationship between preacher and congregation. The preacher is not like an actor who declaims from the stage while the audience remains spectators. Nor is he only a herald shouting his proclamation from the housetops while people remain unknown to him and he to them.

He is a father to his children. They belong to each other. And before, during, and after the sermon, the preacher is or should be conscientious of this relationship in which he's involved. Tell us a little bit about that, Steve, especially in light of some folks, maybe who even listen here on the radio.

It seemed like their favorite preacher is somebody they don't even know. Their favorite preacher is somebody online. Their favorite preacher isn't even their own preacher.

I want to just say this, that sometimes, I'm going to go a little far afield here. Sometimes are there times where I think, I don't like the laws here. I don't like the weather here. I don't like this, that, or the other thing.

In Massachusetts. Yeah. And then I just think, could I ever move? Well, first of all, we have seven grandkids here, but secondly, I just think, I love the people at this church, right? I don't want to leave them.

So I mean, I think there has to be that kind of, let's just say familial bond, right? I mean, you just have a genuine love. And I mean, so what does that, what does that include? Well, it includes the fact that when things are going poorly for them, or when they're hurting, or when they're struggling, I feel that burden, I feel that pain, and I share it with them.

And when things are going well, I mean, it's like, rejoice with those who rejoice, weep with those who weep, but it's like that on steroids.

So true. And I'm glad you brought the positive side to it. Things happen to people and for people that are good, and they are material blessings in their lives from the hand of God. We're happy for them.

Yes. It's like, wow, you got that raise, you got that promotion, you have that grandchild, you got to go on that vacation. You know, that's wonderful. Steve, I read this little quote in that same section by Stott.

He said, the Pharisees love to make the common people kowtow to them. Do you think maybe some seminaries at the risk of saying exegesis drives everything and don't exegete the congregation? I don't exegete the congregation, but at what point during your study time do you think, I'm really preaching to the people at BBC and they just lost their husband, they just got diagnosed with this.

In your own study, in preparation, in Acts, at what point do you start thinking that way if you do?

Well, I do, and I mean, sometimes it just hits you when you're up there preaching. See, that's what I was going to say. That's when that happens to me the most. And you're looking out of the congregation, you see a face and you just kind of, you know, you have a twinge either of excitement or pain, you know, or sympathy or whatever, because you know, it's just odd that the kind of things that go through your mind while you're preaching.

Sometimes you're like, how do I even stay on track, you know, with all the things that are kind of popping into my head? And that's even more for you because you have more neurons. Do I have more protons?

I just, you know, there are times where you just have to kind of remind yourself, I mean, sometimes I'll find myself almost like having my breath taken away by an emotion, you know, and then I just have to kind of remind myself, okay, I can't do that right now.

I can't feel that right now. I can't look at that. And sometimes I'll confess. There have been times where I've seen somebody and I just go, I can't look that way again during the sermon.

True, true. Yeah. And sometimes I say to myself, I've got a message from the scripture and it's something maybe like even Colossians 3 about sexual sin and put this away and, you know, die to this kind of thing.

And then I know somebody who's in sexual sin or who's been struggling with it or something like that. Sometimes I almost don't want to look at them because I just want the, I'm not like calling them out with my eyes.

And so I can't look at them for that reason because I just think, you know what, I'm just gonna let the word do its work. And if they think I'm looking at them, fine, but I'm not going to stare them down.

Yeah. It's not like, I'm just going to reach up and grab the spotlight and put it right on that person. So, you know, it'll be really subtle.

I don't want, you know, in light of Stott's comment, I don't want people to kowtow to me. I don't want people to think, okay, even here comes another sermon where he just gonna, it's just going to be an assault of just how could you and why don't you live up to this and conviction only.

Fine. Preach the law, preach conviction, talk about repentance, but there needs to be this comfort on the other side of the bruised reed stuff. Right?

And I think, you know, getting back to the kowtow thing, I think there's a sense in which, you know, sometimes, and you've, I know you've had this, but sometimes you just kind of, you feel the spirit attending you and you think that was a really good message and you get down and people are talking to you and they say, you know, that was a great message, you know, dah, dah, dah, dah.

I don't want, I mean, I don't, it's not that I object to people saying that was a great sermon or whatever, but I'm always like, I just keep in mind who I am. I think it's good to have that mindset. Right?

I don't want people kowtowing to me because the message was only, you know, that's not from me. It's from the Lord. And I just, I'm thankful that I'm able to do that. But I'm like, don't ever think that I'm some great anything because I just study and I do what I do and I don't do it as well as I should.

And, you know, I mean, the Lord knows. The Lord knows, Steve. And he's like, you know, I mean, it would be very interesting if the Lord Jesus was standing next to me and he could just go, well, you know, it wasn't really that good.

That would probably help me a lot.

Preaching Before Christ's Presence and Avoiding the Scold Mentality

Pete Steve, isn't it interesting to think with Sinclair Ferguson when he said, you know, sing like you're holding a hymn with Jesus. Now let's flip it around. How should pastors preach if they know Jesus is in the front row?

Steve. Oh, man. Pete. Right? Okay. Jesus is sitting there. And so we're going to get up and just talk about, you know, oh, the congregation just wants more practical application and five easy steps and seven ways and three how to's.

And you think there's Jesus sitting there.

Steve I skimmed through this sermon the other day because this guy, I won't give too many details, but I just know him vaguely. And I thought, oh, here's a sermon by him. And so I sort of skimmed through it and I just thought, if you're preaching for an hour on one verse, A, it better be a great verse.

B, you better be a great preacher.

Pete And it was a great verse. Steve Yeah. Pete It was a great amount of time. Steve Yes, it was.

Yeah. And it was a great scold. And I just thought, that's kind of a shame.

Pete. It took a lot to get the scold mentality out of my brain. Part of it was the book of Hebrews and part of it was, you know, having somebody say you have prostate cancer. And I realized, you know, what do I need just to be scolded more?

Well, then why would I scold the people? Isn't this a means of grace? Aren't you trying to lift up the Lord Jesus? And doesn't that help with both conviction because you're out of gratitude, wanting to obey one that would love you so?

I just think, you know what? I'm not doing that anymore. I'm not scolding people like that. Maybe it comes across that way. Oh, I know what I was going to say, Steve. I was preaching on Sunday and I did almost have kind of one of those out-of-body experiences where I just thought, I was almost like watching myself and I could see the spit fly out of my mouth.

Steve. Stop that, Mike. Pete. And it was like, I was a foot behind me and I'm like, what am I doing? And of course, you know me better than most. And I'm just a regular person and I've got big problems, but it's like when you step up there and I had studied, I knew what I wanted to say, I knew it was going to be Christ centered.

And it's like, remember Mark MacArthur used to say to his dad, John, you know, John, you're just kind of a regular person. You can't even hardly fix a car, but when you get up in the pulpit, something happens.

And it's because it's the word of God and the spirit of God through a man of God. Right, right.

And, you know, even talking about the scolding thing, you know, we were talking about earlier about how the Bible affects you as you're studying and you're preparing and everything. And sometimes it kind of does beat you down a little bit, right?

Because you realize all the ways you fall short, but what do you wind up doing? You think, ultimately you think, yes, I am a sinner. I'm a great sinner, but thankfully I have a great savior. And that is the right then mindset to step into the pulpit and say, you know, basically we all fall short of the glory of God.

Yeah, so true. But thanks be to God that we have a great savior.

Thankfulness, Simplicity, and Preaching to Ordinary People

Steve, I was reading Colossians 3 this morning, and I think three times it talks about being thankful, showing thankfulness, whatever you do, word or deed, give thanks to God the Father through Christ, et cetera.

Of course, you could preach that. Are you a thankful people? Well, you know, why aren't you thankful about this, that, and the other? And then probably shouldn't you at the end say, well, let me give you some reasons to be thankful?

Yeah, that's not a bad idea. I was like, what are we doing? Luther is quoted in the preacher's portrait in the Father section. Luther said, no one can be a good preacher to the people who is not willing to preach in a manner that seems childish and vulgar to some.

It's almost like you don't have to preach to the academy. It's not a seminary class. You've got eighth grade young people there. You've got five-year-olds.

Yeah, but you can't leave out all the Greek phrases and what they actually mean in the original Latin.

Okay, Jerome. Steve, I tweeted the other day, preaching should not sound like a commentary. Yes. Then the little gif that I put in there was when Shaq dunked on a guy and then pushed him down on the ground afterwards.

Yeah, you know what we call that Thursday. I mean, that was just in the day, right? I know. Oh, for Shaq, I know. Yeah, the running commentary stuff, I was asked by the class here, the preaching class, how do I know what to cut out?

Yeah. And basically, I said to them, cut out more than you think you should.

I mean, what I would say is, we talk about this all the time. How does it preach? And, you know, if people are honest with themselves, they go, well, yeah, it doesn't really kind of preach. It doesn't really fit into what I'm talking about anyway.

Well, then cut it loose, you know?

And I mean, why are we preaching? We want to extol Christ and so what if people don't think we're smart because we didn't give them, you know, this is a word study and it's a hot box and it's only used one time and this, that, and the other.

And I'm like, okay, am I trying to tell you that I'm smart? Is that my main goal?

I want you to know that I'm smart. Yeah, this has to do with the ancient practice of hydroponic gardening. And you're just like, what? They did that when, you know, it's very impressive.

Probably because I'm just a goofball half the time, but I really have tried to think, Steve, to myself now. I'm seeing the Ferrara kids sitting there. I'm seeing the Koran's children sitting there. And I look at them.

This is getting back to... Because that's half of our church. That's a whole section. They don't sit in the overflow room because they wouldn't all fit, right? And so, just kidding. And I didn't, maybe I didn't think about them when I was preparing, but then standing up looking, right?

That's why I think preaching to people is a lot better than to a camera during the whole COVID deal. And all of a sudden you go, oh. And I want to try to explain things to children. I remember my kids when they were younger, they'd say, Dad, you know, you were talking about 1 Corinthians 15 about Paul is mocking death.

Where's your victory? Where's your sting? And then I said something like, you know, if you're playing baseball and you say to the person who's up to bat, hey, better, hey, better, hey, better swing or on the playground.

Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah. They're like, Dad, what were you doing that for? That was kind of... And I said, because I'm trying to preach to the children too.

And everybody needs to hear it, right? Everybody needs to be able to understand something, right? I mean, if you... Could we, maybe, I don't know, you could, some people could, you know, preach at such a high level where everybody in the classroom needs to have advanced degrees.

Great, super. But then again, not so super because why are you doing that? It's so true.

The Central Themes of the Gospel and the Limits of Speculation

Okay. Last comment on this book, in the Father section, Stott says this, and then I want your comments, please, Steve. We shall need to spend most of our time expounding the central themes of the gospel.

The more abstruse matters of prophecy, questions of a controversial or speculative character, we can well afford to leave on one side.

I mean, people get interested in or fascinated really, shall we say, by things that are of secondary, tertiary, I don't even know what quad, what the fourth level, fifth level. I mean, and the reality is we need to hear the gospel.

We need to be reminded of the things that are of primary importance, first importance. That's what Paul talked about, right? And when we study the New Testament, the Old Testament, all of it, what's it mostly about?

Loving God, loving neighbor, right? Understanding who we genuinely are, that we're fallen creatures. You know, it's all the things that are really ultimately contained in the gospel and then fruits of the gospel.

So, yeah, I think we need to focus on those things.

Steve, some people, when you've been to the Bible studies before back in Los Angeles, every lesson is End Times. Oh, yeah. By the way, that packs out conferences, End Times stuff. Oh, yeah. I get requests from people a lot of times, could we do an End Times conference?

We do prophecy conference. People at NOCO write and say, Mike, what are your views on eschatology? Because you don't really say. The Lord's return. Just look at 1689, that's what I believe and teach. People at church, you know, what do you really believe about these End Time things?

They don't know really where I stand. Well, I want to know if they understand where we stand as a church and where I stand as a preacher and you as an elder,. Steve, when it comes to law gospel distinction, who Jesus is gospel, what God commands, third use of the law, duplex gratia, Christ-centered preaching.

I don't want anybody at the church to go, where do they stand on that? And I think Stott would be happy.

Extremely happy. And I mean, when you look at, if you pick up eschatology books, even people who say that they agree on eschatology, they pretty quickly, you know, veer away from each other because everybody has a slightly different take on this, that, or the other thing.

And ultimately, all those things are going to, I'm not going to say pan out, they're going to shake out, right? I mean, we don't know what the, I don't think anybody really knows what the eschatology, how it's all, oh, yes, we do, Steve.

It's all in that. Okay. Well, maybe you do. I'm not that smart. I can't figure those things out.

Should you study eschatology? Sure. Should you read books on it? Fine. But we're just talking. A couple of men here in front of our little anxious bench.

If I go to most people's homes, they probably have six books on eschatology for every book on the gospel. And that's wrong.

Oh, okay. Very interesting. Well, today we talked about preachers and what they should do. Pray for your pastors, pray for your preachers. If you teach your children the Bible, this would be insightful.

Like, if you're a father, shouldn't you preach to them with fatherly care? Absolutely.

How could you? Well, I mean, model these things. I, yeah, I think most people could benefit greatly from that book.

Amen. Mike Abendroth here with Pastor Steve Cooley at The Tuesday Guy. And this is No Compromise Radio. Thanks for listening today.